Scotland loses out in TV deal [Archive]

down-the-slope

25-05-2012, 07:04 PM

greenginger

25-05-2012, 07:21 PM

And thats just the EPL. There is more cash for the English League,the Championship etc, English U/21's, English Ladies Football, and nearly all England's qualifiers for tournaments all paid for in part by Scottish T V license payers while the same Beeb offers buttons for highlights of the SPL on a take it or leave basis.

If the SPL got an equitable payment for the SPL highlights it would make up for any shortfall in a Sky deal without der Hun and we could get back to watching most of our football at 3 PM on a Saturday.

Come on Mr Salmon, here is a cause that could win you support in Scotland and embarrass the hell out of the Westminster politicos.

lyonhibs

25-05-2012, 08:14 PM

You miss the key point that the quality of Scottish football is so guff that it is an incredibly unappealing prospect for any broadcaster to spend any real money on.

ScottB

25-05-2012, 08:26 PM

I'd imagine Match of the Day probably gets more viewers in Scotland than Sportscene does...

Frazerbob

25-05-2012, 08:30 PM

I'd imagine Match of the Day probably gets more viewers in Scotland than Sportscene does...

I'd imagine re-runs of Last of the Summer Wine gets more viewers in Scotland than Sportscene does! :wink:

Hibercelona

25-05-2012, 08:30 PM

I'd imagine Match of the Day probably gets more viewers in Scotland than Sportscene does...

I think you're probably right.

Sportscene is a joke and I haven't even watched it once this year, but always make sure I catch MOTD.

whereswallace?

25-05-2012, 09:09 PM

I'd imagine re-runs of Last of the Summer Wine gets more viewers in Scotland than Sportscene does! :wink::faf: :thumbsup:

keep the faith

25-05-2012, 09:16 PM

If sportscene was on a saturday night and presented professionally (i.e not in a broom cupboard with rob mclean and the worlds dullest guests) then i think the audience would be large. I honestly do.

RoxburghHibs

25-05-2012, 09:22 PM

You miss the key point that the quality of Scottish football is so guff that it is an incredibly unappealing prospect for any broadcaster to spend any real money on.

Isn't it you that is missing the key point? This is a BBC production using public money not an English TV production.

So Scottish football should get it's fair share of the pot that we all contribute towards.

Scottish football is guff - agreed. However this is largely because there is a lack of investment in our game - even from within.

NAE NOOKIE

25-05-2012, 09:24 PM

Sportscene is pants I'm sorry to say ..... but not in a comparison to Match of the day. Thats a bit like talking down the corner shop because it has less to offer than TESCO's. Sportscene is pants because the programme just isnt very good,

The BBC could do worse than show the "as live" ALBA match on BBC2 at the same time as its on ALBA but with english commentary and bung the SPL highlights on at the end ... find a way to tart up its tired format, for instance by presenting the whole show from that days live ground, and perhaps it would look a bit better.

But I agree ... the money the BBC spend in England is out of proportion compared to what is spent in Scotland ... even though per head of population more people in Scotland go to watch football than in England.

Jonnyboy

25-05-2012, 09:25 PM

Isn't it you that is missing the key point? This is a BBC production using public money not an English TV production.

So Scottish football should get it's fair share of the pot that we all contribute towards.

Scottish football is guff - agreed. However this is largley because there is a lack of investment in our game - even from within.

:agree:

Also, it could be argued that Scottish football is no more guff than say League Two and probably the majority of League One

One Day Soon

25-05-2012, 09:35 PM

Isn't it you that is missing the key point? This is a BBC production using public money not an English TV production.

So Scottish football should get it's fair share of the pot that we all contribute towards.

Scottish football is guff - agreed. However this is largely because there is a lack of investment in our game - even from within.

No, I think he was right - its you that's missing the point. The EPL has an appeal way beyond England.

No-one outside of Scotland wants to watch the SPL, probably not many inside Scotland want to watch it. Plenty of us in Scotland want to watch the EPL however.

jabis

25-05-2012, 09:36 PM

:agree:

Also, it could be argued that Scottish football is no more guff than say League Two and probably the majority of League One

totaly agree

lyonhibs

25-05-2012, 09:56 PM

No, I think he was right - its you that's missing the point. The EPL has an appeal way beyond England.

No-one outside of Scotland wants to watch the SPL, probably not many inside Scotland want to watch it. Plenty of us in Scotland want to watch the EPL however.

Exactly.

Does anyone honestly, HONESTLY want to watch the highlights of St Mirren vs ICT, even if they were available in glorious techni-colour? Especially with Hibs being this rotten, 5-6 minutes of online "highlights" is more than sufficient for me.

Even if there was money thrown at it, who would appear on a Scottish football highlights program? Jim DelaHUNt?? Richard Gordon? Any of the usual suspects from the cosy world of appallingly poor Scottish sports journalism?

Maybe it's partly because it's such an institution, but I always try to tune in to MoTD. There's a fundamental reason why the Beeb was willing to invest £180 million for 3 years of EPL highlights, and it's not some blinkered bias against the "product" on offer up here.

greenginger

25-05-2012, 10:38 PM

You miss the key point that the quality of Scottish football is so guff that it is an incredibly unappealing prospect for any broadcaster to spend any real money on.

Yeah, but some REAL money might just bring in some Real footballers and stop what decent ones we have sloping off to the Blue Square Conference because they are better funded than most of the SPl. clubs.

Also a decent production of our football programs on TV might help a little to remove the impression of amateur hour productions that we have to suffer.

Iain G

25-05-2012, 11:08 PM

Do you recall the latter days of Scotsport, with the Inverness bloke and Sarah O and Delahunt trying to make it look modern and interesting with the audience fanzone bit and stuff, truely awful guff probably makes Sportscene look professional.

They need to keep it simple and show it at a decent time. Scottish football coverage (BBC & ITV) always feels like it is appologising for showing the games and seems to be after a gimmick to make it more interesting! Decent presenter, some interesting enough guests and decent length of highlights coverage and discussion shouldn't be that hard to do!

Geo_1875

25-05-2012, 11:40 PM

ScottB

25-05-2012, 11:42 PM

BBC don't have to show Scottish football, indeed they don't have to show any football whatsoever. The highlights for the EPL are hard fought for, no doubt ITV at least would want them back if they could get them, it gets good ratings and is a solid centrepiece for BBC Sports offerings.

Highlights for the SPL are the reverse, low viewers, not even worth showing outside of Scotland, would STV have even bothered to bid last time? Who knows.

So if the Beeb shells out £60million for EPL highlights, it doesn't mean that the SPL deserves £6million. The EPL doesn't need BBC, it could easily sell their rights to somebody else. The SPL needs every penny it can get and broadcasters know it.

As for it coming from the licence fee, so what? I don't watch almost everything the BBC makes, doesn't make it wrong. They make stuff that attracts viewers and the things they are forced to do, like regional news.

jgl07

25-05-2012, 11:52 PM

Yeah, but some REAL money might just bring in some Real footballers and stop what decent ones we have sloping off to the Blue Square Conference because they are better funded than most of the SPl. clubs.

Also a decent production of our football programs on TV might help a little to remove the impression of amateur hour productions that we have to suffer.

At least the Championship, League One and League Two (and even the Conference) have some credibility. The SPL has proved by its incompetant pussy-footing around dealing with Rangers why there is so little interest from any broadcasters.

If extra cash had been made available, the lion's share would have gone to the gruesome twosome so that it could be used to further unbalance the League.

Ther problem isn't much to do with presentation but the standard of the product. Poor football often played in near empty stadiums between teams over-familiar with each other.

muzzhfc

25-05-2012, 11:56 PM

sportscene is shlt for 2 main reasons - 1) quality of football 2) quality of show. incredibly boring guests. yeah its nice to hear the views of a player, but why not do a match analysis with an "expert". id even take chick young. just something to make it more interesting than watching boring football. also, get rid of that boring blue back ground. its boring and depressing

VickMackie

26-05-2012, 12:03 AM

I think some people are missing the point here. I'll say this up front but I'm going to argue against my own argument in a minute!

Sportscene is utter *****.

However, the broom cupboard(brilliant!), dull atmosphere, poke me in the eye whilst listening to some non entity whom no one has even seen, never mind heard of, presents the show with the charisma of a sloth on Valium, then of course no one wants to watch it.

Motd, whilst having Lineker, is much smoother, slicker and has more humour is a lot more entertaining.

Now, back to my argument against myself, I don't know how you can polish a turd with the SPL but they could at least try. Or roll it in glitter!

Booker5time

26-05-2012, 03:02 AM

Sportscene went downhill imo when the decided to split the highlights up from the English highlights. Until we got the piss what they turned into now. Still I remember they used to have a preview show on the Friday night which i though was pretty good.

btw anyone wanna own up to being this guy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZNlo_px1Ow&feature=fvsr (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZNlo_px1Ow&feature=fvsr)
:wink::thumbsup:

Beefster

26-05-2012, 06:24 AM

I'd imagine Match of the Day probably gets more viewers in Scotland than Sportscene does...

Easily. I haven't seen Sportscene for years but watch MOTD every weekend.

Isn't it you that is missing the key point? This is a BBC production using public money not an English TV production.

So Scottish football should get it's fair share of the pot that we all contribute towards.

Scottish football is guff - agreed. However this is largely because there is a lack of investment in our game - even from within.

The BBC buys the SPL highlights but isn't a charity. They pay what it takes to get the highlights. It would be madness (and a complete waste of licence fee money) for the BBC to start paying well over the odds for a product, just to make sure that everyone got £1 per head of population.

Stevo1875

26-05-2012, 07:43 AM

i watch the highlights of scottish football online at my convenience. as long as i can do that i'm happy. i'd probably make myself suffer sportscene if that was not an option. cant believe how bad that show has become.

as for the epl on bbc goes, i would guess there are more viewers in scotland watch it than watch sportscene in scotland. whether thats because of the online thing for scottish football i dont know.

what i do know is many more kids these days tell you they support barca/real/milan/man u/man city etc before they think about their local team. better than kids glory hunting the 2 weegie teams! cant blame them, going to watch a team play poor pass after pass, listening to fans do nothing but complain (myself included) really does not sell our game to youngsters these days.

what i am really annoyed about is not being able to watch every scotland game on the bbc. now that gets my goat!

:saltireflag

greenginger

26-05-2012, 08:25 AM

Easily. I haven't seen Sportscene for years but watch MOTD every weekend.

The BBC buys the SPL highlights but isn't a charity. They pay what it takes to get the highlights. It would be madness (and a complete waste of licence fee money) for the BBC to start paying well over the odds for a product, just to make sure that everyone got £1 per head of population.

Who said anything about playing fair ? This is a political argument and Salmon and Co have an opportunity and the ammo to wring a better deal for Scottish Football.

Stevo1875

26-05-2012, 08:57 AM

Who said anything about playing fair ? This is a political argument and Salmon and Co have an opportunity and the ammo to wring a better deal for Scottish Football.

you mean act like vultures... no thanks, we won't get any pride back doing that. I'd rather we focused on developing the game instead of being scabs and using politics to get money we have not earned and do not deserve because we don't deserve a multi milion pound deal. who plays in our league that you look forward to watching? we need to develop young players properly and then re-build our reputation. aye, this will take investment but not hand outs based on politics and how good another league is. that's part of the problem - the lazy and greedy ethos that has infected the scottish game. kids are still taught how to win games instead of being taught how to play the game, which is again that same lazy and short sighted approach that is the reason we are so bad. people think we have a right to be respected as a top footballing nation because of our history, absolutely not. our league set up is a joke and i cant blame CL for picking less and less players playing in our leagues for the national team. WE ARE JUST NOT GOOD ENOUGH.

Hibbyradge

26-05-2012, 09:05 AM

If we can't get the BBC to broadcast the SPL with the Old Firm in the league,what chances of a deal if they leave, taking most of Scotland's audience with them?

Hibbyradge

26-05-2012, 09:13 AM

So the Beeb has just paid £60 million per year for next 3 years EPL highlights...

so if they had a £1 per year for every man woman and child to spend on football what about the Scottish £5 million actually getting spent on scottish football - since they are a public broadcaster

Fair enough SKY chasing what ever advertising money wants...Sportscene is total guff...Alba has been an improvement...but would rather have the bigger bit of the pie

Isn't it you that is missing the key point? This is a BBC production using public money not an English TV production.

So Scottish football should get it's fair share of the pot that we all contribute towards.

Scottish football is guff - agreed. However this is largely because there is a lack of investment in our game - even from within.

:agree:

Also, it could be argued that Scottish football is no more guff than say League Two and probably the majority of League One

Fair play to you and anybody else that wants to watch the EPL. **** off down to England and watch it. Just don't expect me and other non-interested licence payers to subsidise it.

Who said anything about playing fair ? This is a political argument and Salmon and Co have an opportunity and the ammo to wring a better deal for Scottish Football.

This is not a political argument, it's pure economics and value for money.

BBC Scotland is given a budget to spend on whatever it chooses.

The decision not to broadcast SPL highlights was made in Scotland.

That's the price of devolution. You lose the opportunity to blame everything on the English.

Hibbyradge

26-05-2012, 09:49 AM

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/2011/10/06/bbc-scotland-set-to-slash-120-jobs-amid-budget-cuts-86908-23471413/

"We do have to take some tough decisions on our spend on services and content for audiences in Scotland, and there will be some reduction, but we will safeguard the output which is most valued by our audiences and which best fulfils our role as Scotland's national public service broadcaster."

Beefster

26-05-2012, 11:26 AM

Who said anything about playing fair ? This is a political argument and Salmon and Co have an opportunity and the ammo to wring a better deal for Scottish Football.

Why's it a political argument? What's it to do with Salmond? Are you in favour of the BBC subsidising all sports to the detriment of other programming/online /radio or just the ones we like?

lucky

26-05-2012, 11:36 AM

Cant see how Scotland loses our. We get the MOTD shown up here. FFS its like saying we should only get River City instead of Eastenders. The reality is the EPL is by far better quality than the the SPL. How many of us actually watch Sportscence. I watch the highlights on line. The SPL will demand a greater TV price when the products exciting and no biased towards two clubs.

Holmesdale Hibs

26-05-2012, 12:47 PM

Sportscene is rubbish. I watched it a couple of times but what's the point when all I want is the Hibs highlights, which are on the bbc website. Why suffer Sandy Clark and the likes with their cliche-ridden, piss poor analysis of the old firm? Its a weejie-dominated, brutal program. End of. Simples. Fact.

As for the EPL, its a premier product so can demand a far higher cost. Comparing the Premiership with the SPL is like comparing Eastenders with River City (although I'd like to add that I watch neither).

Dashing Bob S

26-05-2012, 01:01 PM

You miss the key point that the quality of Scottish football is so guff that it is an incredibly unappealing prospect for any broadcaster to spend any real money on.

The key point is that the quality English football isn't guff (mostly) only because it has broadcast money lavished on it. As has been said, Sky, fair enough, if you don't like it, don't buy it. BBC however is public money, and should be spent equally across all areas of the UK.

blackpoolhibs

26-05-2012, 01:11 PM

jdships

26-05-2012, 01:14 PM

Eyrie

26-05-2012, 01:27 PM

It can equally be argued that the BBC should not spend so much money on one particular sport and as a public service broadcaster has a responsibility to show more than just football. I'm sure fans of rugby or cricket (just two examples) would like to see more of their sport on the BBC.

I'm another who watches the online highlights of our games and never watches Sportscene.

jgl07

26-05-2012, 01:55 PM

The key point is that the quality English football isn't guff (mostly) only because it has broadcast money lavished on it. As has been said, Sky, fair enough, if you don't like it, don't buy it. BBC however is public money, and should be spent equally across all areas of the UK.

On that basis, the BBC should be paying £4 million a year to cover the League of Wales and £2 million to cover the Irish League.

Scottish Football has had decent TV income in the past and allowed the OF to pish most of it up against the wall.

Until the authorities come up with a League that is worth watching the TV income will be small.

greenginger

26-05-2012, 02:09 PM

On that basis, the BBC should be paying £4 million a year to cover the League of Wales and £2 million to cover the Irish League.

Scottish Football has had decent TV income in the past and allowed the OF to pish most of it up against the wall.

Until the authorities come up with a League that is worth watching the TV income will be small.

Welsh Football Clubs already get a share of EPL and English League revenues. Welsh clubs probably get more revenue from the BBC than the whole of Scottish Football.

ctrl_alt_del

26-05-2012, 02:50 PM

This is not a political argument, it's pure economics and value for money.

BBC Scotland is given a budget to spend on whatever it chooses.

The decision not to broadcast SPL highlights was made in Scotland.

That's the price of devolution. You lose the opportunity to blame everything on the English.

The BBC Scotland budget for Scottish-only programming is £102.1 million. In 2016/17 it will drop to £86 million - a cut of 16%. Coverage of Scottish sport comes out of that budget, and yet the BBC can still afford to pay 4.5% more for EPL highlights than they did last time round.

That's the price of non-devolution of broadcasting.

One Day Soon

26-05-2012, 02:58 PM

The BBC Scotland budget for Scottish-only programming is £102.1 million. In 2016/17 it will drop to £86 million - a cut of 16%. Coverage of Scottish sport comes out of that budget, and yet the BBC can still afford to pay 4.5% more for EPL highlights than they did last time round.

That's the price of non-devolution of broadcasting.

So you seriously imagine that if broadcasting was devolved then BBC Scotland would spend £5 million on the SPL? Baws they would. If they did they would deserve to be locked up.

The only price we are paying is the price of having a 5hite product.

jgl07

26-05-2012, 03:01 PM

The BBC Scotland budget for Scottish-only programming is £102.1 million. In 2016/17 it will drop to £86 million - a cut of 16%. Coverage of Scottish sport comes out of that budget, and yet the BBC can still afford to pay 4.5% more for EPL highlights than they did last time round.

That's the price of non-devolution of broadcasting.

Regardless of anything else, cash will follow the ratings.

Scottish football is getting the cash it deserves. Why is there no competition from STV to cover SPL matches?

Sky and ESPN similarly pay very little for SPL coverage.

ctrl_alt_del

26-05-2012, 03:14 PM

So you seriously imagine that if broadcasting was devolved then BBC Scotland would spend £5 million on the SPL?

Now where did I say that? What I object to is the 4.5% increase for EPL highlights when the budgets elsewhere (see: Scotland) are being slashed across the board.

One Day Soon

26-05-2012, 03:20 PM

Fair play to you and anybody else that wants to watch the EPL. **** off down to England and watch it. Just don't expect me and other non-interested licence payers to subsidise it.

Why not? You subsidise a whole bunch of other crap that I'm sure you never watch - unless you spend your whole life watching television.

Or maybe you are a Gaelic speaking farmer with a close interest in First Minister's questions, who spends his spare time collecting antiques, doing up homes to sell on for profit, are an active christian on a sunday evening, run a fishing boat for support income and have children needing their own dedicated tv channel. Just to name a few.

And why should I **** off to England to watch the EPL? This is still Britain after all.

Of course I realise now why this thread emerged yesterday - the same day as the launch in a Dundee Street cinema of the independence campaign. Zzzzzzzzzz

One Day Soon

26-05-2012, 03:22 PM

Now where did I say that? What I object to is the 4.5% increase for EPL highlights when the budgets elsewhere (see: Scotland) are being slashed across the board.

So your view is that the BBC should have bid an amount dictated by wider budget reductions - regardless of whether that would have win the rights? (because is isn't just BBC Scotland that faces a reduced budget)

ctrl_alt_del

26-05-2012, 03:31 PM

So your view is that the BBC should have bid an amount dictated by wider budget reductions - regardless of whether that would have win the rights? (because is isn't just BBC Scotland that faces a reduced budget)

Yes.

One Day Soon

26-05-2012, 03:36 PM

Yes.

I don't agree, but fair enough.

down-the-slope

26-05-2012, 04:01 PM

Whooooooooooosh....thats for all those missing the point in this thread....yes I might have used hyperbole in making the point

But to say 'why spend on a poor product' (not that i think its as bad as others) when the point is that it would not be so poor if it had received a fair share of BBC monies over past 20 years

(and yes the other countries in UK deserve a fair share for their licence fees)

jdships

26-05-2012, 04:09 PM

The key point is that the quality English football isn't guff (mostly) only because it has broadcast money lavished on it. As has been said, Sky, fair enough, if you don't like it, don't buy it. BBC however is public money, and should be spent equally across all areas of the UK.

Sorry your argument doesn't really hold up - what about other sports ?
I would like to see more rugby and some cricket on the BBC , others would like to see speedway and grey hound racing etc etc
Are you saying we should have an equal number of days racing from Musselburgh / Towcester etc as from Aintree and Newmarket ?.
BBC like any broadcaster telivises what gives them best " return on capital investement " . Call it " Market Forces " or whatever !!
Never watch Sportsound "live" use the on line version - don't have to listen to you know who. !!!

Jonnyboy

27-05-2012, 09:04 PM

Why not? You subsidise a whole bunch of other crap that I'm sure you never watch - unless you spend your whole life watching television.

Or maybe you are a Gaelic speaking farmer with a close interest in First Minister's questions, who spends his spare time collecting antiques, doing up homes to sell on for profit, are an active christian on a sunday evening, run a fishing boat for support income and have children needing their own dedicated tv channel. Just to name a few.

And why should I **** off to England to watch the EPL? This is still Britain after all.

Of course I realise now why this thread emerged yesterday - the same day as the launch in a Dundee Street cinema of the independence campaign. Zzzzzzzzzz

He's bound to exist somewhere that fella :greengrin

Winston Ingram

28-05-2012, 04:28 PM