McPake (merged)

[Ray_]

How does it? The team had the most successful cup campaigns in the history of the club which generated the extra income, not to mention record player sales. Even then though we could not match the wages that were on offer elsewhere.

Really, I was taking about before 2007, that is when the records were being made & did we not get to the Scottish cup final in 2001, which would have also generated money?

The Facts regarding money generated during TM's era, when the board and support were one, blows your supposition about Sauzee & Latapy's era out of the water, rather than making further irrelevant comments, lets agree to differ and move on.

Edit, I never mentioned player sales because the area's I mentioned, admission, hospitably & merchandising, all generated, individually, as well as collectively, record amounts of income in those area's of the business and that & not player sales, is usually the bread and butter to any football club.

[Billie Jo]

James McPake playing for N I tonight.

[Scooter]

James McPake playing for N I tonight.

Sky sports has his current team as Hibernian

[hopefulhibby]

If "inability to cash in" was unique to Hibs then you would have a valid point. If every other club was making lots of money and we werent then, again , your point would be valid. But they're not. Every club is losing a lot of money so are they all useless? Or is it something else perhaps?

Some of the most successful businessmen in Scotland cant make football work, sometimes at great personal cost, yet folk on this message board are telling them what a piece of piss it is. That the "most successful club in the world" are hanging on to their existence by their fingernails should tell us there is something fundamentaly wrong with the set up of the game in Scotland.
How do you become a millionaire by owning a football club..... Answer you start off a billionaire

[HiBremian]

Sky sports has his current team as Hibernian

Playing pretty well, and upping the cost of this becoming reality :cb

[MSK]

Sky sports has his current team as HibernianNeeds updated then ..:agree:

[Hibernia Na Eir]

Playing pretty well, and upping the cost of this becoming reality :cb

thought he started ok, then pulled all over the shot.

[fatbloke]

And who's fault was that?

The inability to cash in on this team spoke volumes about the capability of a board that ran up 18M debt. A bulk of the cash wasn't being spent on Sauzee & Latapy and the rest of the first team, but the other forty odd also ran's who were also on the pay role.

The board were too busy alienating themselves from the fan base, with distrust at epidemic levels, to cash in like they did during TM's couple of years.

Your right, a total wasted opportunity and yet another example where this board cost the club bundles plus the alienation which carried on and ultimately saw "outside consultants" brought in to repair the fractions. It is totally incomprehensible that any company could alienate their customer base to that sort of level & they are in grave danger of repeating it.

IMO Hibernian FC could run Open University Degree courses in alienating people.

[HiBremian]

thought he started ok, then pulled all over the shot.

Looks like being man of the match for NI in a very poor team.

So very nearly not quite Hibs class, then. :wink:

[AlbertK86]

Looks like being man of the match for NI in a very poor team.

So very nearly not quite Hibs class, then. :wink:

Familiar story for James .... In green and white MOM in a team where he is surrounded by dross !!!

Let's hope he comes to us and we get another 10 like minded players

[Kaiser1962]

Really, I was taking about before 2007, that is when the records were being made & did we not get to the Scottish cup final in 2001, which would have also generated money?

The Facts regarding money generated during TM's era, when the board and support were one, blows your supposition about Sauzee & Latapy's era out of the water, rather than making further irrelevant comments, lets agree to differ and move on.

Edit, I never mentioned player sales because the area's I mentioned, admission, hospitably & merchandising, all generated, individually, as well as collectively, record amounts of income in those area's of the business and that & not player sales, is usually the bread and butter to any football club.

We have traded profitably, excluding player sales, for only three seasons 2005,2006,2007. Up until we posted a profit in 2005 no SPL club had traded profitably, and retained its SPL status. The same season (04-05) Motherwell (exiting administration) and Rangers also posted profits, and we know how Rangers ended up. That is a fact. In 2001 we still lost £2m and paid wages well above what we are paying today. Hence the loss. In 05,06,07 we reached the SF of the Scottish Cup in each season and you have to go back prior to 1950 to find when we last achieved this. Over the same period we reached the QF of the League Cup twice before winning it in 2007, and you have to back to the Turnbull era for similar in that competition. I dont think it is coincidence that this relative cup success from decent cup runs contributed to us being profitable.


None of this is either supposition or irrelevant, IMO.

As you say, we are not going to agree, so lets move on.

[The Green Goblin]

James McPake playing for N I tonight.

Does Levein know?

If McPake had been loaned to Hearts or Dundee Utd last season, I wonder if he would have been in the Scotland squad against the US? Hmmmmm

[Ray_]

We have traded profitably, excluding player sales, for only three seasons 2005,2006,2007. Up until we posted a profit in 2005 no SPL club had traded profitably, and retained its SPL status. The same season (04-05) Motherwell (exiting administration) and Rangers also posted profits, and we know how Rangers ended up. That is a fact. In 2001 we still lost £2m and paid wages well above what we are paying today. Hence the loss. In 05,06,07 we reached the SF of the Scottish Cup in each season and you have to go back prior to 1950 to find when we last achieved this. Over the same period we reached the QF of the League Cup twice before winning it in 2007, and you have to back to the Turnbull era for similar in that competition. I dont think it is coincidence that this relative cup success from decent cup runs contributed to us being profitable.


None of this is either supposition or irrelevant, IMO.

As you say, we are not going to agree, so lets move on.

:confused:

So we did agree after all!

We agreed that we made a profit during TM's era, [when we had a good team and the support onside] But we didn't pull in anywhere near the same amount of money in McLeish's era [when we had a good team and the support and board were at odds].

Which was the point I made in the begining, our efforts [if there were any] to take make financial gain from McLeish's fine team was a miserable failure .

[matty_f]

:confused:

So we did agree after all!

We agreed that we made a profit during TM's era, [when we had a good team and the support onside] But we didn't pull in anywhere near the same amount of money in McLeish's era [when we had a good team and the support and board were at odds].

Which was the point I made in the begining, our efforts [if there were any] to take make financial gain from McLeish's fine team was a miserable failure .

We were in the first under McLeish and we also knocked down the old main stand to build the West. Would this have hampered income?

[chrisski33]

wow theres alot of chat on here thats NOT to do with McPake!:confused:

[Baker9]

The Board's mismanagement has made us desperate, so only ourselves to blame. Hibs are not in s strong bargaining position with anyone at the mo, and we can only hope that Petrie's ego doesn't get in the way. Changed days to when he could call all the shots with a rich vein of young, valuable players on the books and a decent balance sheet. Now he just has to suck it up, pay the inflated prices and be done with it.

I can't see him ever paying inflated prices. His whole being is based around fiscal control and to think out that box is too big a leap for him. I am wary about it myself but desperate to get a team on the park. We have questioned the influence of Sir Tom Farmer on this board and he does seem detached from involvement. The one thing I am certain is that he is all about fiscal control as well and his only instruction to Rod will have been, 'You run it the way you think fit but stay in profit'.

We have been gloating prematurely on this board for years about the demise of Hearts (tick tock my erse). We may now be gloating prematurely about the demise of Rangers. I'm beginning to think that surely now they will both come back to nearer our standard of player / money, but I am not holding my breath.

[Ray_]

We were in the first under McLeish and we also knocked down the old main stand to build the West. Would this have hampered income?


Yes it would have made a difference, but still didn't come anywhere matching relevent income.

[joe breezy]

I hope we sign McPake

Scottish football is Donald Ducked though, in fact football in the UK is, it probably is everywhere else.

The problem we have is that there's a country almost within commuting distance where players will get paid much, much more for doing the same job.

Even in England where they have the TV deals the majority of clubs in the Premier League are running at a huge loss, and it just gets worse as you go down the leagues.

The bottom line is footballers are paid too much, it's unsustainable and is too much for practicing a sport and generally failing academically.

The one good thing about the wages is that at least plenty kids still want to be footballers but hopefully that ambition can remain without players being rewarded an amount of money that doesn't add up to the financial situation in the businesses they work for.

Scottish football will be a bit more skint without Rangers, it will of course be a better place but we need to run as a business that survives first and foremost.

I want Hibs to be successful but without a mad man with too much money to burn putting money into the club we have to do it on a budget.

I would still like a bit of speculate to accumulate but our record in Europe suggests that accumulating is something that can't be relied on.

[Kaiser1962]

We were in the first under McLeish and we also knocked down the old main stand to build the West. Would this have hampered income?





Yes it would have made a difference, but still didn't come anywhere matching relevent income.


Even with a reduced capacity we still didnt sell out near enough to justify the outlay.

What is interesting is that had McLeish's wage bill been applicable to Mowbray's team then, despite everything, we would still have lost money (excluding player sales) even in 05,06,07. That is how fine a line we are treading.

[VickMackie]

I hope we sign McPake

Scottish football is Donald Ducked though, in fact football in the UK is, it probably is everywhere else.

The problem we have is that there's a country almost within commuting distance where players will get paid much, much more for doing the same job.

Even in England where they have the TV deals the majority of clubs in the Premier League are running at a huge loss, and it just gets worse as you go down the leagues.

The bottom line is footballers are paid too much, it's unsustainable and is too much for practicing a sport and generally failing academically.

The one good thing about the wages is that at least plenty kids still want to be footballers but hopefully that ambition can remain without players being rewarded an amount of money that doesn't add up to the financial situation in the businesses they work for.

Scottish football will be a bit more skint without Rangers, it will of course be a better place but we need to run as a business that survives first and foremost.

I want Hibs to be successful but without a mad man with too much money to burn putting money into the club we have to do it on a budget.

I would still like a bit of speculate to accumulate but our record in Europe suggests that accumulating is something that can't be relied on.

The football league put in new financial measures to combat the huge losses towards the end of last season. I think the debt in the three divisions reached a billion. They are trying to stop the debts growing but Scottiah football will still be outbid for players.

[Andy74]

Well that totally contradicts the fact that record amounts of income was being acquired by the club through admission [season ticket & walk up], merchandising & hospitality, in TM's era, when the board and fans were together [SUABC].

Shows you all this chat about boards doing this and that is a waste of time. People will pay to watch a good team and a winning team. That team was put together on a shoe string. Good manager gets some good players to play well. End of story.

[chrisski33]

Getting back to mcpake, whys it taking so long to get him signed up!?

[fatbloke]

Getting back to mcpake, whys it taking so long to get him signed up!?

If HOMOFC sell Sally Lucas they are going to go for McPake, so naturally he is in no rush to sign for Hibs.

[SouthMoroccoStu]

If HOMOFC sell Sally Lucas they are going to go for McPake, so naturally he is in no rush to sign for Hibs.

Scary times ahead, let's hope Hibs just get he business done.

[The Falcon]

Shows you all this chat about boards doing this and that is a waste of time. People will pay to watch a good team and a winning team. That team was put together on a shoe string. Good manager gets some good players to play well. End of story.

Thats all very true Andy but what the board of any club, not just Hibs, have to be alert to is that success on the field and full stadiums do not neccessarily mean that the finances are in order. Rangers and Hearts spring to mind immediately.

If the club is not self financing then someone, somewhere will have to pay.


I have doubts about the fitness of McPake but that is tempered by the leadership qualities he brings. I am hopeful, but not confident, that this deal will be done.

[Cabbage East]

If HOMOFC sell Sally Lucas they are going to go for McPake, so naturally he is in no rush to sign for Hibs.


That is just speculation, not a fact.

[Ray_]

Shows you all this chat about boards doing this and that is a waste of time. People will pay to watch a good team and a winning team. That team was put together on a shoe string. Good manager gets some good players to play well. End of story.

That's a large part of it Andy, however, far from being the whole of it. We only have to go back to McLeish's team to see that. The board and fans then were at odds with each other, where as, under TM, they were together & it was while the partnership was strong, that's when the greater cash difference was felt.

We won't always get the level of the TT's, or McLeish & TM's teams, however, it is more than apparent, if there is faith that the board was doing their job properly, people are far more inclined to thrust them with their hard earned cash.

[CRAZYHIBBY]

Is mcpake signing or what......

[Dinkydoo]

On holiday until July 1st now according to the EEN article....

[HibbyKeith]

On holiday until July 1st now according to the EEN article....

Flew back home yesterday following international duty, he doesnt go away again until Friday for a week long stag do. ..Source : James McPake's twitter.

[Dinkydoo]

Flew back home yesterday following international duty, he doesnt go away again until Friday for a week long stag do. ..Source : James McPake's twitter.

Hopefully means that we will get some sort of announcement this week then. :pray:

[Pretty Boy]

Flew back home yesterday following international duty, he doesnt go away again until Friday for a week long stag do. ..Source : James McPake's twitter.

Also said he was gutted to be missing a night out, down south until Wednesday but he really had to sort out some stuff at his place down there.

Hopefully packing stuff ready for the removal vans.