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View Full Version : Fed Up Losing To Hearts? Want A Better Team Next Season?



Mikey
18-03-2012, 03:41 PM
Here, this will help.........

http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/news/20120306/season-ticket-membership-201213_2262950_2635420

Sammy7nil
18-03-2012, 03:44 PM
:rolleyes:

Tried that for the last 30 years other than a couple of blips it failed to work, suppose you never know though it might change next year.

:rolleyes:

Hibercelona
18-03-2012, 03:46 PM
Here, this will help.........

http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/news/20120306/season-ticket-membership-201213_2262950_2635420

They can stick their ST deal up their arse!

God Petrie
18-03-2012, 03:47 PM
"They"?

MSK
18-03-2012, 03:48 PM
They can stick their ST deal up their arse!Thats the spirit ..seperate the wheat fi the chaf ...

Twa Cairpets
18-03-2012, 03:50 PM
They can stick their ST deal up their arse!

That's the spirit. Don't go, don't provide funds, rant on the Internet and it'll all come good.

Great post:rolleyes

Baldy Foghorn
18-03-2012, 03:57 PM
That's the spirit. Don't go, don't provide funds, rant on the Internet and it'll all come good.

Great post:rolleyes

:agree::agree::agree:

It beggars belief why so many moan about lack of quality, but they wont back the club financially

Sammy7nil
18-03-2012, 04:00 PM
:agree::agree::agree:

It beggars belief why so many moan about lack of quality, but they wont back the club financially

It beggars belief how poor we have been for nearly 3 years, with very little improvement.
It beggars belief our record in the debry not just recent form but for 135 years bar a few blips.

bingo70
18-03-2012, 04:01 PM
:agree::agree::agree:

It beggars belief why so many moan about lack of quality, but they wont back the club financially

I've had a season ticket for years but i'm not renewing next year as it'll work out cheaper for me to pay at the gate every game i go to, i'll still moan about the lack of quality though.

Clubs on a smaller budget than we've got find better quality players so if Fenlon can improve us next season then i might sign up the next again year, it's a two way thing though, relying on blind faith isn't going to get the punters back.

CMac1988
18-03-2012, 04:02 PM
:agree::agree::agree:

It beggars belief why so many moan about lack of quality, but they wont back the club financially

You could argue that the club are backed more in terms of finance and support than atleast 7 or so of the other SPL clubs and have been for years... yet here we are with a horrible record against our rivals and sitting 2nd bottom of the league.

Edit*

May have mis-read your post. Anyhoo onwards and upwards, will be paying for my season ticket next week.

Baldy Foghorn
18-03-2012, 04:12 PM
What I was saying is we need fans to bite the bullet and renew season tickets, or lapsed fans to buy one, so that Pat Fenlon has a budget to bring "quality" in.......Would be great if even a third of the additional semi final or final fans were to give the Club their money, but hey ho....

Sas_The_Hibby
18-03-2012, 04:13 PM
:agree::agree::agree:

It beggars belief why so many moan about lack of quality, but they wont back the club financially

Personally, I wouldn't go criticising people who may have backed the club financially for years or decades, who haven't seen any return whatsoever for their money, but are expected, yet again, to stump up £400, in difficult times, on the basis of some half-baked possibility that THIS TIME it will make a difference.

Big Frank
18-03-2012, 04:14 PM
What I was saying is we need fans to bite the bullet and renew season tickets, or lapsed fans to buy one, so that Pat Fenlon has a budget to bring "quality" in.......Would be great if even a third of the additional semi final or final fans were to give the Club their money, but hey ho....

Agreed Baldy. But just as much, we need Sir Tom Farmer to lengthen his arms and shorten his pockets.

bingo70
18-03-2012, 04:15 PM
What I was saying is we need fans to bite the bullet and renew season tickets, or lapsed fans to buy one, so that Pat Fenlon has a budget to bring "quality" in.......Would be great if even a third of the additional semi final or final fans were to give the Club their money, but hey ho....

Aye, i know what you mean but i'd like Fenlon to improve the squad by finding better players on the lower budget like other clubs do and then when he's done that the team will be better so more people will come back and he'll earn a bigger budget.

I'm confident he will do that.

Sir David Gray
18-03-2012, 04:19 PM
Aye it's done wonders so far, over the past couple of years, to help us finish ahead of Aberdeen, Dundee Utd, Inverness, Kilmarnock, Motherwell, St Johnstone and St Mirren, when all these teams have much less resources than we have and about half the fanbase as well but yet they consistently outplay us on the pitch. :rolleyes:

matty_f
18-03-2012, 04:19 PM
What I was saying is we need fans to bite the bullet and renew season tickets, or lapsed fans to buy one, so that Pat Fenlon has a budget to bring "quality" in.......Would be great if even a third of the additional semi final or final fans were to give the Club their money, but hey ho....

100% spot on.

Sas_The_Hibby
18-03-2012, 04:19 PM
What I was saying is we need fans to bite the bullet and renew season tickets, or lapsed fans to buy one, so that Pat Fenlon has a budget to bring "quality" in.......Would be great if even a third of the additional semi final or final fans were to give the Club their money, but hey ho....

I've 'bitten the bullet' for the last four seasons. Won't be doing it for a fifth.

You could just as well argue that if everyone renews their season ticket again, the club won't see any reason to change the way it's gone about things on the managerial / playing side in recent years. And no this isn't a pop at Fenlon, who, IMO, is doing the best he can in extremely trying circumstances. Nor is it a call for a boycott. It is, however, a pop at the way the club has been run for at least the last five years.

Sas_The_Hibby
18-03-2012, 04:22 PM
100% spot on.

100% spot on if we all have money to burn: not if we have to choose what to spend money on IMO.

Sas_The_Hibby
18-03-2012, 04:24 PM
Aye it's done wonders so far, over the past couple of years, to help us finish ahead of Aberdeen, Dundee Utd, Inverness, Kilmarnock, Motherwell, St Johnstone and St Mirren, when all these teams have much less resources than we have and about half the fanbase as well but yet they consistently outplay us on the pitch. :rolleyes:

:agree: THIS is the real issue.

blackpoolhibs
18-03-2012, 04:24 PM
I've had a season ticket for years but i'm not renewing next year as it'll work out cheaper for me to pay at the gate every game i go to, i'll still moan about the lack of quality though.

Clubs on a smaller budget than we've got find better quality players so if Fenlon can improve us next season then i might sign up the next again year, it's a two way thing though, relying on blind faith isn't going to get the punters back.


Personally, I wouldn't go criticising people who may have backed the club financially for years or decades, who haven't seen any return whatsoever for their money, but are expected, yet again, to stump up £400, in difficult times, on the basis of some half-baked possibility that THIS TIME it will make a difference.


Aye, i know what you mean but i'd like Fenlon to improve the squad by finding better players on the lower budget like other clubs do and then when he's done that the team will be better so more people will come back and he'll earn a bigger budget.

I'm confident he will do that.

:agree:

Beefster
18-03-2012, 04:25 PM
Folk are going to have to start questioning the club rather than continually trying to guilt-trip the fans. Aside from the fact that we've been mince for a few years, this year's ST offer is less valuable than a £20 membership and choosing games to a lot of supporters.

Baldy Foghorn
18-03-2012, 04:25 PM
To quote Pat Fenlon

"Season ticket members are the bread and butter of the football club. They are what the club is about. They allow the football club to be able to look forward to next season and plan what I can spend on the team. Season ticket members are how the club goes from day to day and that should never be forgotten by anyone. They are the people that actually put their hands in their pockets early no matter what happens and are willing to stand up at the start of the season and back their club, and I know why - because that's what it means to them. Most supporters will understand when times are tough, and will stick at it through thick and thin. They are the people I want to do well for, because they are the people that suffer. Thet are the people that celebrate. I want to thank them for standing up for their club in recent times. I know it's a difficult time, and I know it's their football club. At the end of the day, they will dictate how much we move forward as a club. I understand it is difficult and times are harder for everybody. But right now, it really is about the supporters of this football club and their great affinity with Hibernian."

Fair summation from Pat Fenlon...........

The_Todd
18-03-2012, 04:26 PM
Nice attempt, Mikey but after yet another derby let down with our SPL status next year still in so much doubt I doubt many will choose to purchase an ST based on that!

Keith_M
18-03-2012, 04:27 PM
I realise the club need money to replace the players that have been dumped but if only it were as easy as a lot of people buying Season Tickets.

If we buy 10,000 Season Tickets and the club are STILL cr*p, does everybody get their money back?

Westie1875
18-03-2012, 04:30 PM
Folk are going to have to start questioning the club rather than continually trying to guilt-trip the fans. Aside from the fact that we've been mince for a few years, this year's ST offer is less valuable than a £20 membership and choosing games to a lot of supporters.

The other issue is that we are by no means guaranteed spl football next season, 4 pts is not a big gap and we no longer have a game in hand. Season tickets are being marketed as if there is no danger of us going down, what happens if we get relegated? Do I get a refund on my £405 as the first division certainly isn't worth that for a season ticket (neither is the spl mind you)?

Sammy7nil
18-03-2012, 04:33 PM
To quote Pat Fenlon

"Season ticket members are the bread and butter of the football club. They are what the club is about. They allow the football club to be able to look forward to next season and plan what I can spend on the team. Season ticket members are how the club goes from day to day and that should never be forgotten by anyone. They are the people that actually put their hands in their pockets early no matter what happens and are willing to stand up at the start of the season and back their club, and I know why - because that's what it means to them. Most supporters will understand when times are tough, and will stick at it through thick and thin. They are the people I want to do well for, because they are the people that suffer. Thet are the people that celebrate. I want to thank them for standing up for their club in recent times. I know it's a difficult time, and I know it's their football club. At the end of the day, they will dictate how much we move forward as a club. I understand it is difficult and times are harder for everybody. But right now, it really is about the supporters of this football club and their great affinity with Hibernian."

Fair summation from Par Fenlon...........

The manager has to source "quality" players on the budget he has. For examples look at Motherwell and St John. The players recruited have to show effort, organisation, skill, commitment and will to win.
If the manager and players do this the fans will turnout, Fair summation

Fantic
18-03-2012, 04:33 PM
Went to the game today, and the strange thing is am not really that bothered about getting beat. Im usually raging after a derby defeat but don't think I'll go back for ages now, I've another interest and will spend the cash on that.

Call it turning your back on the club or whatever you want, but I've not got money to burn on something that am not enjoying anymore.

Sir David Gray
18-03-2012, 04:37 PM
The other issue is that we are by no means guaranteed spl football next season, 4 pts is not a big gap and we no longer have a game in hand. Season tickets are being marketed as if there is no danger of us going down, what happens if we get relegated? Do I get a refund on my £405 as the first division certainly isn't worth that for a season ticket (neither is the spl mind you)?

That's the thing that I'm wondering about.

They cannot possibly sell season tickets for the same price if we end up in the first division next season. It's still highly possible that we'll be relegated, Dunfermline are only 4 points behind, still need to play us again, which if they win will mean that they'll only need to make up 2 points on us to overtake us.

When you think that there's still 8 games left to play, it's still far too close to call.

Sas_The_Hibby
18-03-2012, 04:39 PM
Went to the game today, and the strange thing is am not really that bothered about getting beat. Im usually raging after a derby defeat but don't think I'll go back for ages now, I've another interest and will spend the cash on that.

Call it turning your back on the club or whatever you want, but I've not got money to burn on something that am not enjoying anymore.

Is it legal? :greengrin:wink:

Judas Iscariot
18-03-2012, 04:41 PM
Trolling?!

matty_f
18-03-2012, 04:41 PM
Aye, i know what you mean but i'd like Fenlon to improve the squad by finding better players on the lower budget like other clubs do and then when he's done that the team will be better so more people will come back and he'll earn a bigger budget.

I'm confident he will do that.

He (and previous managers) would have found that easier if they weren't having to make so many wholesale changes. Fenlon's going to have to bring in more players than Motherwell and St Johnstone will, I reckon.


Aye it's done wonders so far, over the past couple of years, to help us finish ahead of Aberdeen, Dundee Utd, Inverness, Kilmarnock, Motherwell, St Johnstone and St Mirren, when all these teams have much less resources than we have and about half the fanbase as well but yet they consistently outplay us on the pitch. :rolleyes:

See above, if we were making one or two signings like Motherwell and St Johnstone then fair enough, but we need to sign more than that. Without the money from season ticket sales we're watching more of the same next year.


100% spot on if we all have money to burn: not if we have to choose what to spend money on IMO.

It's 100% spot on regardless. If you can't afford it or want to spend on something else then fair enough, but it doesn't make his post any less accurate.


The manager has to source "quality" players on the budget he has. For examples look at Motherwell and St John. The players recruited have to show effort, organisation, skill, commitment and will to win.
If the manager and players do this the fans will turnout, Fair summation

See points above.

Sammy7nil
18-03-2012, 04:43 PM
Trolling?!

Dear oh Dear not allowed to make a sensible comment now :rolleyes:

Steve20
18-03-2012, 04:44 PM
Here, this will help.........

http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/news/20120306/season-ticket-membership-201213_2262950_2635420

I've done that for years and it's made no difference. No thanks.

Fantic
18-03-2012, 04:46 PM
Is it legal? :greengrin:wink:

:greengrin aye, its got a lot to do with two wheels and mountains.

Sammy7nil
18-03-2012, 04:48 PM
:greengrin aye, its got a lot to do with two wheels and mountains.

Sheep worrying ! :wink:

Judas Iscariot
18-03-2012, 04:51 PM
Dear oh Dear not allowed to make a sensible comment now :rolleyes:

FFS, not you :doh:

Sammy7nil
18-03-2012, 04:54 PM
FFS, not you :doh:

LOL who pished on your cornflakes

Guy says he has other interests and he is a Troll LOL

Ozyhibby
18-03-2012, 05:13 PM
I'm afraid the club are going to have to show some improvement before I buy another season ticket.
For the last four years they have just been taking the fans for granted.
Enough is enough.

Twa Cairpets
18-03-2012, 05:15 PM
I've 'bitten the bullet' for the last four seasons. Won't be doing it for a fifth.

You could just as well argue that if everyone renews their season ticket again, the club won't see any reason to change the way it's gone about things on the managerial / playing side in recent years. And no this isn't a pop at Fenlon, who, IMO, is doing the best he can in extremely trying circumstances. Nor is it a call for a boycott. It is, however, a pop at the way the club has been run for at least the last five years.

Pop psychology meets warped logic meets self justification for non renewal.

Bonkers.

joe breezy
18-03-2012, 05:16 PM
Nae season ticket purchase by me till Hibs join a British league and I don't that will ever happen, till then it will be 4 or 5 times a season...

matty_f
18-03-2012, 05:19 PM
As improvement, the clue was in the statement, I'm afraid the club are going to have to show some improvement before I buy another season ticket.)

Good stuff, 3 points next week and we can count on the season ticket money! :thumbsup:

Gatecrasher
18-03-2012, 05:34 PM
It's too easy to give up, I see the light at the end of the tunnel now and pat is leading the way, renewal form and cash handed over next week GGTTH

down the slope
18-03-2012, 05:36 PM
Hibs have had plenty off me down the years, they can go first and put a team on the park that plays football . I reckon we will have the spending power of the likes of St Johnstone and Motherwell or if they are lucky maybe Dundee United , that should do nicely !.

Ozyhibby
18-03-2012, 05:39 PM
No point getting humpty with each other. It's the club that needs to improve not the fans.

hibsbollah
18-03-2012, 05:43 PM
No point getting humpty with each other. It's the club that needs to improve not the fans.

The fans were rank too. Did you see the 'corteo'? PETRIE :grr:

Fantic
18-03-2012, 05:58 PM
Trolling?!

How much money does that cost you mate.

Spike Mandela
19-03-2012, 10:59 AM
The manager has to source "quality" players on the budget he has. For examples look at Motherwell and St John. The players recruited have to show effort, organisation, skill, commitment and will to win.
If the manager and players do this the fans will turnout, Fair summation

Correct.

The board need the season ticket money just to keep us ticking over and providing the loan deals and bargain basement players we buy just now. It certainly won't be used to buy 'quality' players:rolleyes:

StevieC
19-03-2012, 12:06 PM
"Season ticket members are the bread and butter of the football club. They are what the club is about. They allow the football club to be able to look forward to next season and plan what I can spend on the team. Season ticket members are how the club goes from day to day and that should never be forgotten by anyone. They are the people that actually put their hands in their pockets early no matter what happens and are willing to stand up at the start of the season and back their club, and I know why - because that's what it means to them. Most supporters will understand when times are tough, and will stick at it through thick and thin. They are the people I want to do well for, because they are the people that suffer. Thet are the people that celebrate. I want to thank them for standing up for their club in recent times. I know it's a difficult time, and I know it's their football club. At the end of the day, they will dictate how much we move forward as a club. I understand it is difficult and times are harder for everybody. But right now, it really is about the supporters of this football club and their great affinity with Hibernian."

If season ticket holders are so important and the life blood of the club, why doesn't the club offer a season ticket deal to reflect that?

I've had a season ticket for the last 12 years but I wont be renewing next season.

SneakersO'Toole
19-03-2012, 12:38 PM
I think I'll wait until we know what division we are playing in next year before making a decision.

If we were relegated I would still consider renewing but not at £405 I won't.

Baldy Foghorn
19-03-2012, 12:56 PM
If season ticket holders are so important and the life blood of the club, why doesn't the club offer a season ticket deal to reflect that?

I've had a season ticket for the last 12 years but I wont be renewing next season.

They froze prices though. If you are paying by DD, surely interest must be applied, I pay DD for my golf membership, to save forking out money at once, and interest is applied for that privilege, does not mean I wont renew my golf though.

blackpoolhibs
19-03-2012, 12:58 PM
Is it true we have the 3rd highest prices for season tickets, If so why? On a side note, my renewal forms popped through the door this morning, great timing. :rolleyes:

Big Frank
19-03-2012, 12:59 PM
They froze prices though. If you are paying by DD, surely interest must be applied, I pay DD for my golf membership, to save forking out money at once, and interest is applied for that privilege, does not mean I wont renew my golf though.


The gesture should have been a reduction bro...... sometimes, just sometimes mind, the fan should come before the balance sheet :wink:

allezsauzee
19-03-2012, 01:12 PM
It seems to me that an awful lot of people on here want our players to show some grit and determination but don't seem to willing to do the same themselves. If you want to have a stress free Saturday afternoon, watch soccer saturday, if you want to 'support' a team that wins all the time, go support Barcelona. If you really want to get behind Hibs, stick by them, go to watch them whenever you can and cheer them on rather than give them pelters. I think we have a manager that is determined to get us challenging at the top of the league and if we give him financial and vocal support then he will turn this around. It ain't going to happen overnight though.

StevieC
19-03-2012, 01:33 PM
They froze prices though

I am paying more this year, the same method as last, so it's not a price freeze.

I have compared the season ticket cost to the "walk-up" cost for me over the season and in my case I am not making a saving with a season ticket.

I'm not turning my back on the club though (which seems to be the wrong conclusion some have reached on this thread about those not renewing) and will make the same number of games I would if I'd had a season ticket.

If you see a product in a shop that you like but can get it £40 cheaper online then the chances are that you'll buy it online. Same product, cheaper cost. It's what we all do.

Hibs have been losing season ticket holders over the last 3 years, I can't see the benefit of keeping the product cost the same as it's clearly not working.

The point being that if the club held season ticket holders in such high esteem then when they see that they are not renewing you might have expected some market research to try and reverse the trend. IMO, by keeping the product cost the same (although most will be paying more) for an inferior product they are forcing consumers into re-evaluating the purchase.

yeezus.
19-03-2012, 01:43 PM
I've been going to Stair Park all my life and I've seen far better football than what I watched at the PBS yesterday. It's getting embarrassing

Speedway
19-03-2012, 01:55 PM
The rhetoric reminds me of Scotland's 1990 World Cup song 'Say It With Pride'

We'll say it with pride
We're gonna walk tall in the sun
We'll answer the call
Our hearts will be beating as one

Meanwhile back in realityworld - Costa Rica 1 Pishland 0

I don't believe that economic hard times are an issue, we can all find cash from somewhere when we want something enough. Desire is the issue.

If the club want to be truly innovative, here's the offer they should be making.

'Right boys and girls it's like this, give us yer freakin' cash because we're brassic. Buy an 18 game ST and we'll give you a guarantee of 50% home wins over the period. Anything less than that and you'll get your money back which will come directly out of the player's wages. Now give us yer money.'

That would focus the team on results and I'd buy a few on that basis.

steakbake
19-03-2012, 02:06 PM
Got my forms this weekend. I'm going to hang fire until I know what division we are in. Even then, it's a thought.

I didn't even follow the derby this weekend because for me it seemed a foregone conclusion. When I did check the score late last night, I wasn't at all surprised. It's too bad.

alexedwards
19-03-2012, 05:30 PM
Here, this will help.........

http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/news/20120306/season-ticket-membership-201213_2262950_2635420


Nope. Doesn't help...next! :rolleyes:

Golden Bear
19-03-2012, 05:32 PM
I've been going to Stair Park all my life and I've seen far better football than what I watched at the PBS yesterday. It's getting embarrassing

:agree:

And all very predictable.

TornadoHibby
19-03-2012, 05:55 PM
What I was saying is we need fans to bite the bullet and renew season tickets, or lapsed fans to buy one, so that Pat Fenlon has a budget to bring "quality" in.......Would be great if even a third of the additional semi final or final fans were to give the Club their money, but hey ho....

Since we sold (and didn't replace with decent quality) some of the best youngsters we had produced at the club for years a few years ago, long serving ST holders like myself and many others have been investing in what amounts to "hope value" at ST renewal time and, once again, we are being asked to do that again for next season at a time when it is not yet clear which League we will be playing in! :confused:

I understand why the club feels that promoting the ST's for next season now is a good thing in that some people may subscribe now whereas if they wait to see what the opposition might be if in Div 1 and look at how long it might take to get back up from that position they might not do so as readily then! :dunno:

However, and despite having worked my way into very nice seats virtually on the half way line over a long period of time, I find myself rather disappointingly being currently minded to wait and, if necessary, pay at the gate for selected matches rather than subscribe now for another season full of awful and uninteresting "more of the same" which I have not enjoyed since the second half of Mr Hughes' tenure as Manager! :rolleyes:

I'm just not confident that the Scottish football economic climate is going to allow us supporters of the non OF teams (controversial perhaps) from enjoying football of the kind of quality that perhaps we would like to see at our teams. I'm not comparing us to the EPL or anything like before anyone jumps on that point! :confused: :rolleyes:

justlikebrazil
19-03-2012, 06:32 PM
Here, this will help.........

http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/news/20120306/season-ticket-membership-201213_2262950_2635420
Is that you Rod :wink:

Baldy Foghorn
19-03-2012, 06:36 PM
I am paying more this year, the same method as last, so it's not a price freeze.

I have compared the season ticket cost to the "walk-up" cost for me over the season and in my case I am not making a saving with a season ticket.

I'm not turning my back on the club though (which seems to be the wrong conclusion some have reached on this thread about those not renewing) and will make the same number of games I would if I'd had a season ticket.

If you see a product in a shop that you like but can get it £40 cheaper online then the chances are that you'll buy it online. Same product, cheaper cost. It's what we all do.

Hibs have been losing season ticket holders over the last 3 years, I can't see the benefit of keeping the product cost the same as it's clearly not working.

The point being that if the club held season ticket holders in such high esteem then when they see that they are not renewing you might have expected some market research to try and reverse the trend. IMO, by keeping the product cost the same (although most will be paying more) for an inferior product they are forcing consumers into re-evaluating the purchase.

Fair enough.

Out of interest, is the direct debit monthly or quarterly, and what does the interest charge applied amount to?

Billy Whizz
19-03-2012, 06:42 PM
I'm going into renew my family's 4 season tickets tomorrow👍

Tyler Durden
19-03-2012, 06:50 PM
I think the interest is about £35 making 11 monthly payments of roughly £40.

I completely agree with Stevie C. I've had a season ticket for 20 years, since I was 10 and I'm seriously doubting renewing. At the moment I think I'll still go to every home game, which won't work out much more expensive. But... and it's a big one, if Hibs continue to be p*sh and it's there's little enjoyment to be had, without a ST it will be so much easier to just not bother going at all. A slippery slope.

Reduced revenue for Hibs when a goodwill gesture of say a 10% reduction in ST price would probably have got them some goodwill and increased retention of fans. As it stands, I resent the nonsense that the board have replied to several other posters. They're totally out of touch with reality IMO.

I think there are loads of fans in same boat as myself. Sad times.

Baldy Foghorn
19-03-2012, 06:57 PM
I think the interest is about £35 making 11 monthly payments of roughly £40.

I completely agree with Stevie C. I've had a season ticket for 20 years, since I was 10 and I'm seriously doubting renewing. At the moment I think I'll still go to every home game, which won't work out much more expensive. But... and it's a big one, if Hibs continue to be p*sh and it's there's little enjoyment to be had, without a ST it will be so much easier to just not bother going at all. A slippery slope.

Reduced revenue for Hibs when a goodwill gesture of say a 10% reduction in ST price would probably have got them some goodwill and increased retention of fans. As it stands, I resent the nonsense that the board have replied to several other posters. They're totally out of touch with reality IMO.

I think there are loads of fans in same boat as myself. Sad times.

If the interest is £35 over 11 months, are people really not going because of a £3.18 per month increase:confused:

The_Todd
19-03-2012, 07:05 PM
Hearts cheapest ST is £240. Our cheapest is £380 - the same as Hearts most expensive.

Now, sorry - for that Hearts fans will probably witness a higher level of football and likely another couple of derby wins. How can Hibs justify these prices?

And edit: yes, I'm talking about full price adults only here.

blackpoolhibs
19-03-2012, 07:09 PM
If the interest is £35 over 11 months, are people really not going because of a £3.18 per month increase:confused:

It all adds up brockie, and especially if you happen to miss a game or two. I'm planning on still making as many games as i normally do next season, without a season ticket i'm quids in. I read on here not sure if its true, but it said we have the 3rd highest season ticket price.

I think results and poor displays are a big factor in folk deserting, but price will be another factor too, and if this 3rd highest price is right, some folk will have reached their limit i suppose.

Baldy Foghorn
19-03-2012, 07:14 PM
It all adds up brockie, and especially if you happen to miss a game or two. I'm planning on still making as many games as i normally do next season, without a season ticket i'm quids in. I read on here not sure if its true, but it said we have the 3rd highest season ticket price.

I think results and poor displays are a big factor in folk deserting, but price will be another factor too, and if this 3rd highest price is right, some folk will have reached their limit i suppose.

I have no idea what other clubs charge for season tickets, but it would be interesting to see where Hibs are in relation to cost versus the others....

blackpoolhibs
19-03-2012, 07:16 PM
I have no idea what other clubs charge for season tickets, but it would be interesting to see where Hibs are in relation to cost versus the others....

:agree:

Gatecrasher
19-03-2012, 07:17 PM
Hearts cheapest ST is £240. Our cheapest is £380 - the same as Hearts most expensive.

Now, sorry - for that Hearts fans will probably witness a higher level of football and likely another couple of derby wins. How can Hibs justify these prices?

And edit: yes, I'm talking about full price adults only here.

So Hibs should take financial advice from Hearts? Who cant even afford to pay their players!

TornadoHibby
19-03-2012, 07:21 PM
If the interest is £35 over 11 months, are people really not going because of a £3.18 per month increase:confused:

No I think the principal reason might just have something to do with the quality of the performances and results on the park over a long period of time with no significant effective management activity in changing that for more successful performances on the park! :confused:

This is not something that's just materialised as you well know but after a lengthy period of time, our underperformance as a team in the SPL in comparison to others perceived by many to be considerably worse off than Hibs in terms of funding and facilities is becoming to much to contemplate taking more of it by some people IMO! :confused:

The club has had cash from ST holders over the last few years and haven't spent it wisely it appears to many based on the current threads and posts! :confused:

It's not unreasonable for people to stop and take stock before deciding to go ahead and support something that doesn't seem to have the necessary wheels or power to succeed perhaps! :dunno:

blackpoolhibs
19-03-2012, 07:21 PM
First one i looked at was Motherwell, and these are last seasons figures. How do folk think these compare?


PHIL O’DONNELL STAND Until 31st May 2011 From 1st June 2011
Adult £370 £380
Concessions* £207 £217
Young Adult (13 – 16) £70 £80
Juvenile (12 and under) £70 £80

DAVIE COOPER STAND Until 31st May 2011 From 1st June 2011
Adult £290 £300
Concessions* £175 £185
Young Adult (13 – 16) £70 £80
Juvenile (12 and under) £70 £80

EAST STAND Until 31st May 2011 From 1st June 2011
Adult £270 £280
Concessions* £150 £160
Young Adult (13 – 16) £70 £80
Juvenile (12 and under) £70 £80

The_Todd
19-03-2012, 07:23 PM
I have no idea what other clubs charge for season tickets, but it would be interesting to see where Hibs are in relation to cost versus the others....

Us:

http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/javaImages/b5/4b/0,,10290%7E10570677,00.gif

Hearts:

http://www.heartsfc.co.uk/javaImages/9b/e1/0,,10289%7E10609051,00.jpg

Aberdeen:

http://www.afc.co.uk/javaImages/d9/ad/0,,10284%7E9678297,00.jpg

The_Todd
19-03-2012, 07:24 PM
So Hibs should take financial advice from Hearts? Who cant even afford to pay their players!

Hearts are a basket case, they don't have wage difficulties because of their ST prices.

blackpoolhibs
19-03-2012, 07:26 PM
St Johnstone.



Before 30 June 2011 After 30 June 2011 You could save compared to walk in price
MAIN STAND
Executive Padded £360 £385 N/A
Adult £330 £350 £88
Senior Citizen* £195 £215 £52
Under 16 £185 £185 £43
East Stand
Adult £295 £325 £104
Senior Citizen* £160 £180 £49
16-18 years £170 £170 £20
Under 16 £75 £75 £58
Parent & Child £335 £335 £197
Each Additional Child £50 £50 £83

BroxburnHibee
19-03-2012, 07:30 PM
If the interest is £35 over 11 months, are people really not going because of a £3.18 per month increase:confused:

Yeah but how much is too much?

For some people's budgets it is a step too far and to be dismissive of that is disrespectful.

I didn't bother with the ST this season and haven't regretted it at all - thats not to say I'm not saddened by whats gone on - its just for me, what I was watching wasn't worth the fee.

I've seen nothing to suggest thats gonna change anytime soon and no amount of guilt tripping will change that.

Having looked at the offers there is nothing in there to entice me back and I know of people who have ST's at the moment who feel exactly the same.

If the club cant see that then they are not doing their job properly IMO.

Baldy Foghorn
19-03-2012, 07:36 PM
Yeah but how much is too much?

For some people's budgets it is a step too far and to be dismissive of that is disrespectful.

I didn't bother with the ST this season and haven't regretted it at all - thats not to say I'm not saddened by whats gone on - its just for me, what I was watching wasn't worth the fee.

I've seen nothing to suggest thats gonna change anytime soon and no amount of guilt tripping will change that.

Having looked at the offers there is nothing in there to entice me back and I know of people who have ST's at the moment who feel exactly the same.

If the club cant see that then they are not doing their job properly IMO.

Didn't think I was being disrespectful, its £3.18, less than a pint depending where you go....Is that really too much to tip your budget over the edge. We have some cases on here, of people wanting a better standard of player, along with a price reduction. We can't have that both ways.

The_Todd
19-03-2012, 07:39 PM
Didn't think I was being disrespectful, its £3.18, less than a pint depending where you go....Is that really too much to tip your budget over the edge. We have some cases on here, of people wanting a better standard of player, along with a price reduction. We can't have that both ways.

Every club outside the OF has cheaper STs and the table doesn't lie - they all have better players too.

blackpoolhibs
19-03-2012, 07:47 PM
Didn't think I was being disrespectful, its £3.18, less than a pint depending where you go....Is that really too much to tip your budget over the edge. We have some cases on here, of people wanting a better standard of player, along with a price reduction. We can't have that both ways.

We certainly cant, but Motherwell St Mirren St Johnstone Kilmarnock and virtually every other club in the SPL can. Been looking at the other clubs, and my season ticket is dear compared to the rest bar the dons.

It seems these clubs can put a better team together with quite a bit less income, and even their crowds are nothing to write home about.

Football broken in Scotland, there's a number of reason, and price is right up there in the reasons.

£3 a month is not a lot i'd agree, but when its added onto all the rest its starting to look like the straw thats broke the camel back for some.

I'd love to have seen us adopt the Hartlepool United method, where the season ticket started off high, but got cheaper the more folk bought them. They sold out their ground apparently, with a record amount of season ticket sales.

Baldy Foghorn
19-03-2012, 07:54 PM
We certainly cant, but Motherwell St Mirren St Johnstone Kilmarnock and virtually every other club in the SPL can. Been looking at the other clubs, and my season ticket is dear compared to the rest bar the dons.

It seems these clubs can put a better team together with quite a bit less income, and even their crowds are nothing to write home about.

Football broken in Scotland, there's a number of reason, and price is right up there in the reasons.

£3 a month is not a lot i'd agree, but when its added onto all the rest its starting to look like the straw thats broke the camel back for some.

I'd love to have seen us adopt the Hartlepool United method, where the season ticket started off high, but got cheaper the more folk bought them. They sold out their ground apparently, with a record amount of season ticket sales.

I really am surprised how dear Hibs are compared to the others. Maybe someone should write to the Board, asking why the price is dearer than the others, and why teams with lower crowds and less income manage to out perform us....I would do it, but I am not flavour of the Month with the Director's:rolleyes:

BroxburnHibee
19-03-2012, 07:54 PM
Didn't think I was being disrespectful, its £3.18, less than a pint depending where you go....Is that really too much to tip your budget over the edge. We have some cases on here, of people wanting a better standard of player, along with a price reduction. We can't have that both ways.

It may not sound much I agree but some people may have already pushed their budgets already and at some point there will be a tipping point.

The interest free deal was a great way of getting the season ticket now the club have took it away - hardly an incentive.

On top of that there is the dire 2 and a half seasons we have had to endure and this disgusting run against our local rivals.

Everyone has there own reasons for getting or not getting a Season Ticket - I just dont think supporters need to be demonised or made to feel like its there fault we wont have a good team next season.

Baldy Foghorn
19-03-2012, 07:58 PM
It may not sound much I agree but some people may have already pushed their budgets already and at some point there will be a tipping point.

The interest free deal was a great way of getting the season ticket now the club have took it away - hardly an incentive.

On top of that there is the dire 2 and a half seasons we have had to endure and this disgusting run against our local rivals.

Everyone has there own reasons for getting or not getting a Season Ticket - I just dont think supporters need to be demonised or made to feel like its there fault we wont have a good team next season.

Fair enough. Will be interesting to see how many season ticket holders we have next season compared to this season.

Tyler Durden
19-03-2012, 08:05 PM
Didn't think I was being disrespectful, its £3.18, less than a pint depending where you go....Is that really too much to tip your budget over the edge. We have some cases on here, of people wanting a better standard of player, along with a price reduction. We can't have that both ways.

It's not about budget for me personally.

You're equating more revenue with a greater standard of player and therefore a better team. Hibs have shown in recent years it's not that simple.

I'm quite confident that Fenlon is the man to take us forward but in the past few years our ST money has been grossly mismanaged. The example that jumps out is allegedly turning down compensation for Calderwood only to sack him a few months later. Petrie's position should have been untenable at that stage IMO. Believe what you will, I'm not seeking to reopen that debate.

The board have failed to really take ownership of these recent failures though and their engagement with the support is patronising with us basically treated like mugs who will turn up no matter what. After this season, the strategy should have been a back to basics type approach. The price freeze will only serve to lose more ST holders and the argument that reduced prices does not equate to a greater uptake/revenue is irrelevant as far as I'm concerned. There had to be some type of concession (however small) to retain a higher share of their existing base, never mind attract lapsed supporters. Their strategy has only served to leave more people disillusioned and ready to walk away.

blackpoolhibs
19-03-2012, 08:05 PM
I really am surprised how dear Hibs are compared to the others. Maybe someone should write to the Board, asking why the price is dearer than the others, and why teams with lower crowds and less income manage to out perform us....I would do it, but I am not flavour of the Month with the Director's:rolleyes:

:greengrin I suspect the answer would be but its £12 on average to watch football at easter road, well it aint for the majority imo.

This is one reason i'm against the club asking for more each season, i'd like our manager to actually manage what we have much better than they are.

I actually think Fenlon will, yesterday was poor and more of the usual, but i have seen improvement and i'm confident he will keep us up.

Not really the kind of statement we should be proud of, but that was his job when we appointed him.

His job in the summer is to match and better clubs above us, with better funds than they have.
How ****** difficult can this be, others seem to manage it?

Baldy Foghorn
19-03-2012, 08:13 PM
It's not about budget for me personally.

You're equating more revenue with a greater standard of player and therefore a better team. Hibs have shown in recent years it's not that simple.

I'm quite confident that Fenlon is the man to take us forward but in the past few years our ST money has been grossly mismanaged. The example that jumps out is allegedly turning down compensation for Calderwood only to sack him a few months later. Petrie's position should have been untenable at that stage IMO. Believe what you will, I'm not seeking to reopen that debate.

The board have failed to really take ownership of these recent failures though and their engagement with the support is patronising with us basically treated like mugs who will turn up no matter what. After this season, the strategy should have been a back to basics type approach. The price freeze will only serve to lose more ST holders and the argument that reduced prices does not equate to a greater uptake/revenue is irrelevant as far as I'm concerned. There had to be some type of concession (however small) to retain a higher share of their existing base, never mind attract lapsed supporters. Their strategy has only served to leave more people disillusioned and ready to walk away.

Fair post Tyler

Westie1875
19-03-2012, 08:38 PM
They've made the deadline far too early IMO, a lot of people won't sign up to those prices until they know which league we will be playing in and that won't be clear until after the deadline for the deals.

Paying full whack and not getting the cup top up and free OF tickets really isn't worth it financially if you will miss as much as one game (as most people will in a season), hard to believe the club haven't thought about this and based the timelines accordingly.

steakbake
19-03-2012, 08:49 PM
Fair post Tyler

I think Tyler hits upon a good point. The Calderwood money. 300k plus squandered. Now the board are cap in hand offering freebies with a short deadline to take up the offer.

StevieC
19-03-2012, 09:58 PM
Didn't think I was being disrespectful, its £3.18, less than a pint depending where you go....Is that really too much to tip your budget over the edge.

Yes, when you include all options into the equation.

The walk-up costs for 19 home games (based on current prices) is £442.
The season ticket cost (spread out over the season, as with walk-up) is £440.

I will usually end up missing 2 or 3 games a season, so walk-up is now a much cheaper option for me.

The other season ticket incentives on offer are not really any use to me.


We have some cases on here, of people wanting a better standard of player, along with a price reduction. We can't have that both ways.

Why not? Every team (bar one) is playing better than us, and most of them have smaller player budgets.

:dunno:

StevieC
19-03-2012, 10:06 PM
Fair enough. Will be interesting to see how many season ticket holders we have next season compared to this season.

Whatever the figure is, it is guaranteed to be less.

There is very little incentive to attract new/lapsed season ticket holders and to hold on to disillusioned ones.

To be fair to the club, they have tried to offer incentives that aren't really going to cost them anything but I'm not convinced they've properly gauged the overall feelings of current ST holders.

IWasThere2016
19-03-2012, 10:26 PM
They've made the deadline far too early IMO, a lot of people won't sign up to those prices until they know which league we will be playing in and that won't be clear until after the deadline for the deals.

Paying full whack and not getting the cup top up and free OF tickets really isn't worth it financially if you will miss as much as one game (as most people will in a season), hard to believe the club haven't thought about this and based the timelines accordingly.

I read the title and thought someone was offering a ticket to St Midden, 'Well, Saintees etc ..

Seriously - the tickets are too expensive for the 'product' on offer (pricing is a Board decision)

More so also with an uneccessary capacity we have. The tickets are priced as we have an inflated cost base - debt, EM, board etc (more poor Boardroom decisions)- n

Not to mention frequent pay-offs of managers/players (guess what - more poor Board decisions with appointments)

The blame for the mess lies firmly within the Boardroom, and in one custodian in particular. Still if we'd another 99 of him I'm sure we'd be on the up :wink: Wonder what STF will say this AGM when Holding Co has to plough more cash in to cover this year's losses and smooth the cash-flow from poor ST sales ..

There's a hell of a lot riding on SPL survival AND the SC. RP's nerves for one and STF's cash for example.

Newhaven
19-03-2012, 10:29 PM
Whatever the figure is, it is guaranteed to be less.

There is very little incentive to attract new/lapsed season ticket holders and to hold on to disillusioned ones.

To be fair to the club, they have tried to offer incentives that aren't really going to cost them anything but I'm not convinced they've properly gauged the overall feelings of current ST holders.

The reality will settle in when we kick off the 2012-13 season (Im assuming in the SPL) with about 7000 fans UNLESS we win the cup.

Bishop Hibee
19-03-2012, 10:31 PM
I'll be signing up regardless along with 5 others :scarf:

IWasThere2016
19-03-2012, 10:35 PM
The reality will settle in when we kick off the 2012-13 season (Im assuming in the SPL) with about 7000 fans UNLESS we win the cup.

Arabs' STs fell by 18% AFTER SC win! The SPL form and some entertainment are key. It is clear too many seen not enough for too long to continue paying via blind faith.

IberianHibernian
19-03-2012, 11:00 PM
As next year`s season ticket prices seem to be much the same as this year`s I suppose club is planning to charge same or more for walk up fans as this year . In the old days (70s and before ) we always had a small number of STHs compared with say Hearts even when our crowds were similar or better ( Tornadoes years ) since our Main Stand was marginally smaller than theirs ( still there ! ) and having a season ticket was never an issue . I appreciate that things have changed ( transfer windows making it more important to have cash available for signings in August for example ) but wonder if club should spend less time on promoting season tickets and more time on actually getting more fans at games and supporting club in other ways ( overseas fans being one example where club have decided that it`s not worth dedicating any time or money , mistakenly in my view ) . More things like campaign to attract immigrants ( praiseworthy but something folk have been mentioning for at least 10 years here ) , tourists , students ,families , unemployed etc etc . If Police allow it , have areas without numbered seats so groups can sit together or STHs can go to games with non STHs . Have mixed areas ( home and away fans ) at some category B games . We`re back to days of huge terraces ( now stands ) and small crowds so should look to filling seats and improving atmosphere ( pre match atmosphere shouldn`t be limited to selling sponsors` products in club bar ) rather than just trying to rely on faith of present STHs. Obviously it`s not easy trying to sell STs when we don`t know what league we`ll be in next season but that`s going to be a possibility every 5 or 6 years anyway . If we make cup final , club will no doubt try to sell final tickets to 12/13 STHs understandable but obviously not a business tactic for most years . So more has to be done to increase walk up numbers starting now and more thought put into 2013/14 ST pricing .

Col2
19-03-2012, 11:37 PM
As next year`s season ticket prices seem to be much the same as this year`s I suppose club is planning to charge same or more for walk up fans as this year . In the old days (70s and before ) we always had a small number of STHs compared with say Hearts even when our crowds were similar or better ( Tornadoes years ) since our Main Stand was marginally smaller than theirs ( still there ! ) and having a season ticket was never an issue . I appreciate that things have changed ( transfer windows making it more important to have cash available for signings in August for example ) but wonder if club should spend less time on promoting season tickets and more time on actually getting more fans at games and supporting club in other ways ( overseas fans being one example where club have decided that it`s not worth dedicating any time or money , mistakenly in my view ) . More things like campaign to attract immigrants ( praiseworthy but something folk have been mentioning for at least 10 years here ) , tourists , students ,families , unemployed etc etc . If Police allow it , have areas without numbered seats so groups can sit together or STHs can go to games with non STHs . Have mixed areas ( home and away fans ) at some category B games . We`re back to days of huge terraces ( now stands ) and small crowds so should look to filling seats and improving atmosphere ( pre match atmosphere shouldn`t be limited to selling sponsors` products in club bar ) rather than just trying to rely on faith of present STHs. Obviously it`s not easy trying to sell STs when we don`t know what league we`ll be in next season but that`s going to be a possibility every 5 or 6 years anyway . If we make cup final , club will no doubt try to sell final tickets to 12/13 STHs understandable but obviously not a business tactic for most years . So more has to be done to increase walk up numbers starting now and more thought put into 2013/14 ST pricing .

Great post:flag:

The obsession with season tickets and them becoming available FIVE months before next season starts is wearing thin now. Appreciate it helps with budgeting but there appears to be no Plan B if sales are low.

smurf
20-03-2012, 12:16 AM
Here, this will help.........

http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/news/20120306/season-ticket-membership-201213_2262950_2635420

Didn't help this season. Or last...

Hibercelona
20-03-2012, 01:21 AM
Thats the spirit ..seperate the wheat fi the chaf ...

That's the spirit. Don't go, don't provide funds, rant on the Internet and it'll all come good.

Great post:rolleyes

I couldn't care less what either of you think.

How about I show some spirit when the team on the park actually begin to show any?

I know you're answers are going to "Well the club needs investment".

The club has had plenty investment and has done nothing with it to keep the fans coming back.

It's the clubs fault. End of.

Hibercelona
20-03-2012, 01:25 AM
Didn't help this season. Or last...

:agree:

I think some of the posters on here have bigger connections with the club than simply being a supporter.

Mikey
20-03-2012, 08:16 AM
:agree:

I think some of the posters on here have bigger connections with the club than simply being a supporter.

Go on then :greengrin

Ozyhibby
20-03-2012, 08:29 AM
The only way the club will listen is if fans stop going.
If I owned a business and my customers were saying the will still purchase my product no matter how bad it gets then I would have no incentive to improve it. It is only the thought of losing customer that will force a company to improve it's product.
All you fans who are saying they will go regardless are responsible for the rubbish we are now watching.

Mikey
20-03-2012, 08:31 AM
All you fans who are saying they will go regardless are responsible for the rubbish we are now watching.

Careful, I got a whole lot of grief when I said that it's the fans fault.

Well, I didn't. But that's what some folk wanted to read :wink:

Steve-O
20-03-2012, 08:43 AM
The East Stand should be cheaper, absolutely no doubt about it. £405 is unbelievable. If any football or rugby ticket over here was that price I guarantee they'd sell zero season tickets and laughed out of town.

Want to fill the stadium, or even just the East Stand? Lower those scandalous prices would be a good start.

I also don't get the benefit of paying a fortune so someone else you know can get a free ticket v Celtic/Rangers? Good for them, but you don't really gain much?!

Cup games for 'free' is decent I suppose and a free top is good although you have to buy the away top which could quite feasibly be minging based on some recent efforts!

marinello59
20-03-2012, 09:40 AM
All you fans who are saying they will go regardless are responsible for the rubbish we are now watching.

Sorry, I would like to apologise to each and every Hibs supporter for continuing to attend Easter Road. Shamefully I will be there next season as well. I need help.

blackpoolhibs
20-03-2012, 09:58 AM
The only way the club will listen is if fans stop going.
If I owned a business and my customers were saying the will still purchase my product no matter how bad it gets then I would have no incentive to improve it. It is only the thought of losing customer that will force a company to improve it's product.
All you fans who are saying they will go regardless are responsible for the rubbish we are now watching.

I dont think they are listening to the fans, i understand costs are rising but there's not a cat in hells chance our season tickets are value for money. Now people can say thats not an argument, you cant guarantee value when buying a season ticket, its more of a passion that drives you to buy a season ticket.

Well that might be the case with some, less and less in my opinion. Now though, because of how much a season ticket costs, people ARE judging just why they are spending so much to watch us, they are deciding A, its not value for money, and B, they just cant warrant it now.

The 3rd Highest season ticket price does not guarantee success, but it does guarantee lower crowds if the team are poor.

I await the response from those who always seem to say we dont need those passing fans, those floaters who dont have Hibs first in their thoughts when spending their hard earned.

Well its clear to me, a season ticket holder of many years we do, we need them back more than ever, but this new season ticket offer has absolutely no chance of achieving this.

At The Edge
20-03-2012, 10:27 AM
Going against the grain here.
i have renewed, i am a uberfan in the hated S43 section, although i don't sing about kiddy fiddlers or Mercer which gives me even more Hibs uberfan points :giruy:

:greengrin

TornadoHibby
20-03-2012, 10:44 AM
I dont think they are listening to the fans, i understand costs are rising but there's not a cat in hells chance our season tickets are value for money. Now people can say thats not an argument, you cant guarantee value when buying a season ticket, its more of a passion that drives you to buy a season ticket.

Well that might be the case with some, less and less in my opinion. Now though, because of how much a season ticket costs, people ARE judging just why they are spending so much to watch us, they are deciding A, its not value for money, and B, they just cant warrant it now.

The 3rd Highest season ticket price does not guarantee success, but it does guarantee lower crowds if the team are poor.

I await the response from those who always seem to say we dont need those passing fans, those floaters who dont have Hibs first in their thoughts when spending their hard earned.

Well its clear to me, a season ticket holder of many years we do, we need them back more than ever, but this new season ticket offer has absolutely no chance of achieving this.

Well said BH! :agree:

As I've already said on this thread, loyal (often) long standing ST holders have been trusting the Board with their cash year after year in the anticipation that it will be effectively spent for the benefit of them, the "hard core" of the fan base or customers! Without satisfied and returning customers, any business will struggle and that is IMO what is happening increasingly to Hibs! The product on the park has been exceptionally poor for so long now that people are turning off to it and stopping going to watch games even when they have paid up ST's for those games they are choosing not to go to! :confused:

Since the sale of our (possibly) best group of "home grown" youngsters for excellent money a few years ago we have never replaced that level of ability or potential ability in the playing pool and our Board's choice of Manager since Mowbray has been less than effective since then for reasons not actually known by the customers! We have an excellent stadium and training facilities (apparently as I haven't personally seen the TC) but the former (at least) is going to be under-used by regularly attending customers if the on field product does not improve quickly and soon enough to ensure SPL football at least for next season at ER! :agree:

To expect the fans to fund the effect of the Board's mismanagement of ST cash from previous seasons is quite unrealistic IMO! It is time for STF to invest enough into the Club NOW to get us back to a performance position that most fans will find acceptable enough to part with ST cash without much thought AND to ensure that the FOOTBALLING/SQUAD COMPOSITION/COACHING STAFF appointment and management decisions at the Club are made by people experienced themselves in that area to make consistently good decisions for the benefit of the Club! :agree:

The current deadline for "early bird" ST's should be extended until such times as fans know what they are likely to be watching next season following several seasons of subscribing in hope! :confused:

Beefster
20-03-2012, 10:57 AM
The current deadline for "early bird" ST's should be extended until such times as fans know what they are likely to be watching next season following several seasons of subscribing in hope! :confused:

I'm probably not going to renew and definitely won't be doing so before the early bird deadline but I don't get the argument that it should be extended. The early bird scheme is a reward for those supporters who renew early and without condition. The fact that some folk want to wait until they know where we will be playing next season, as is their right, means that they forfeit any right to those rewards IMHO.

TornadoHibby
20-03-2012, 11:13 AM
I'm probably not going to renew and definitely won't be doing so before the early bird deadline but I don't get the argument that it should be extended. The early bird scheme is a reward for those supporters who renew early and without condition. The fact that some folk want to wait until they know where we will be playing next season, as is their right, means that they forfeit any right to those rewards IMHO.

I believe that it is morally wrong to expect existing loyal customers to be persuaded to possibly perpetuate a repeat of previous season's mismanagement of ST cash by the Board forcing renewal decisions from people after they (in effect) wrap a blindfold around the eyes and put ear plugs in the ears of those loyal customers first! :confused:

Recurring customers are usually recurring because they are happy with the prospect of renewing as they have a decent impression of getting value for money for their "investment" not an uncertain product (Div 1 or continued lack of investment by the shareholders in the playing and football coaching and management aspect of the Club) which may not satisfy their expectations! :agree:

Some years ago, I was involved with a business involved in a luxury franchise driven range of products (capital and service) and the franchisor discovered on a large scale survey of customers that for every one customer who "forgives" an expectation failure and stays with the business TEN others move onto another business.

Now, football customers won't move from team to team like that but there is a message there for the Hibs Board that a sizeable element of negative feeling towards the Club could easily arise if we are in Div 1 or the necessary and, well overdue IMO, shareholder cash and business product quality management is not forthcoming at the required levels to allow significant (at least regular top 4 SPL finishes and decent Cup runs each season) performance improvement and improved customer satisfaction levels resulting in high non renewal levels! :confused:

GreenCastle
20-03-2012, 11:33 AM
I dont think they are listening to the fans, i understand costs are rising but there's not a cat in hells chance our season tickets are value for money. Now people can say thats not an argument, you cant guarantee value when buying a season ticket, its more of a passion that drives you to buy a season ticket.

Well that might be the case with some, less and less in my opinion. Now though, because of how much a season ticket costs, people ARE judging just why they are spending so much to watch us, they are deciding A, its not value for money, and B, they just cant warrant it now.

The 3rd Highest season ticket price does not guarantee success, but it does guarantee lower crowds if the team are poor.

I await the response from those who always seem to say we dont need those passing fans, those floaters who dont have Hibs first in their thoughts when spending their hard earned.

Well its clear to me, a season ticket holder of many years we do, we need them back more than ever, but this new season ticket offer has absolutely no chance of achieving this.

:agree:

I think some people are looking to in depth about tickets when really the crunch question - "is it value for money" ?

Supporting Hibs we don't except to win every game BUT at least at a minimum expect effort and a consistency and signs of improvement. With Fenlon I think we are improving and I still think given this summer will turn us around.

However the quality on show and the games being played just aren't value for what is on offer - Hibs do have prices but it's not just us it's the league - crazy prices like those at Tynie at the weekend - it's just not on.

Fans have stood up and been counted but we haven't seen much back except a Training facility and complete stadium - all paid for by the fans and players sales - no outside income from anyone else. The problem is fans want to see quality on the park and even though our infrastructure is one of the best in Scotland - we are at the other end as the league table shows on the pitch - the balance needs to be addressed.

Baldy Foghorn
20-03-2012, 11:57 AM
Sorry, I would like to apologise to each and every Hibs supporter for continuing to attend Easter Road. Shamefully I will be there next season as well. I need help.

I need help too M59.....

I have read some drivel on here (some of it even posted by me:wink:), but to say that the fans who go week in week out, are to blame for the team being not very good is right up there with the most absurd posts......

Baldy Foghorn
20-03-2012, 11:58 AM
The only way the club will listen is if fans stop going.
If I owned a business and my customers were saying the will still purchase my product no matter how bad it gets then I would have no incentive to improve it. It is only the thought of losing customer that will force a company to improve it's product.
All you fans who are saying they will go regardless are responsible for the rubbish we are now watching.

Are you for real????? Do you know the definition of "supporter".

Baldy Foghorn
20-03-2012, 12:00 PM
Ach to hell with it, why don't we all stop going, and see if that improves the team:greengrin

TornadoHibby
20-03-2012, 12:04 PM
I need help too M59.....

I have read some drivel on here (some of it even posted by me:wink:), but to say that the fans who go week in week out, are to blame for the team being not very good is right up there with the most absurd posts......

At the risk of upsetting you as I can't see many such posts along the lines you guys suggest other than perhaps this one although I haven't trawled through the entire thread tbh! :confused:


The only way the club will listen is if fans stop going.
If I owned a business and my customers were saying the will still purchase my product no matter how bad it gets then I would have no incentive to improve it. It is only the thought of losing customer that will force a company to improve it's product.
All you fans who are saying they will go regardless are responsible for the rubbish we are now watching.

Are there more like this one then? :dunno:

TornadoHibby
20-03-2012, 12:08 PM
Ach to hell with it, why don't we all stop going, and see if that improves the team:greengrin

Aye very good BF! :faf:

However, maybe not so far away from being helpful if it made the shareholder(s) and Board realise that they are culpable for the position that the Club and team are in, as it is they that have mismanaged the ST cash and expectations of many loyal and reasonable Hibs ST holding fans for a number of years now, and they should put that situation right as I have suggested in earlier posts if they want people to be inclined to start attending matches more regularly, in greater numbers and with a financial commitment to the Club by way of ST! :agree:

Baldy Foghorn
20-03-2012, 12:10 PM
At the risk of upsetting you as I can't see many such posts along the lines you guys suggest other than perhaps this one although I haven't trawled through the entire thread tbh! :confused:



Are there more like this one then? :dunno:

I highlighted the "offending" quote, and answered that. When I say I have read some drivel, I meant on the Board as opposed to this thread, where some pertinent points are made for and against getting season tickets. Hope that clears up any misunderstandings.

Baldy Foghorn
20-03-2012, 12:16 PM
Aye very good BF! :faf:

However, maybe not so far away from being helpful if it made the shareholder(s) and Board realise that they are culpable for the position that the Club and team are in, as it is they that have mismanaged the ST cash and expectations of many loyal and reasonable Hibs ST holding fans for a number of years now, and they should put that situation right as I have suggested in earlier posts if they want people to be inclined to start attending matches more regularly, in greater numbers and with a financial commitment to the Club by way of ST! :agree:

I made some comments at the last AGM, about STF and customer dissatisfaction, and we got some rant about if only we had 10 Rod Petrie's. I am sure even our Director's will get a nasty wake up call, when they see how much uptake there is with Season Tickets next season. They are culpable for many things, but to ignore the final numbers of renewals etc, ans not try to address that the following season, would be totally foolhardy. Time will tell with this.

TornadoHibby
20-03-2012, 12:26 PM
I highlighted the "offending" quote, and answered that. When I say I have read some drivel, I meant on the Board as opposed to this thread, where some pertinent points are made for and against getting season tickets. Hope that clears up any misunderstandings.

Aye, fair enough! I don't read most threads beyond the first two or three posts hence my lack of awareness of what is getting posted elsewhere on the mb!

I have never bought into social media for personal use in a significant way and probably don't get the nuances (incl smilies often) on here that those that take it (social media) a bit more intensely might do by applying those skills on here! :wink: :greengrin

IWasThere2016
20-03-2012, 12:38 PM
I made some comments at the last AGM, about STF and customer dissatisfaction, and we got some rant about if only we had 10 Rod Petrie's. I am sure even our Director's will get a nasty wake up call, when they see how much uptake there is with Season Tickets next season. They are culpable for many things, but to ignore the final numbers of renewals etc, ans not try to address that the following season, would be totally foolhardy. Time will tell with this.

Was it no 100??? Surely 10 would never be enough!

Baldy Foghorn
20-03-2012, 12:41 PM
Was it no 100??? Surely 10 would never be enough!

Cannae mind TQM, his rant still irks me:wink:

IWasThere2016
20-03-2012, 12:47 PM
Cannae mind TQM, his rant still irks me:wink:

Nae wonder - it was a very stupid thing to say.

StevieC
20-03-2012, 12:48 PM
They are culpable for many things, but to ignore the final numbers of renewals etc, ans not try to address that the following season, would be totally foolhardy. Time will tell with this.

The culpability lies with not properly engaging the supporters to gauge the feeling regarding season ticket renewal prior to releasing the season ticket deal.

If they had simply carried out some market research on a cross section of supporters they would have known that the season ticket deal they released was doomed to failure and more season ticket holders were going to be lost.

At the moment I don't think that the fans themselves will be lost, but if the season ticket income is high up in their business plan for the coming season then they have failed.

Baldy Foghorn
20-03-2012, 12:56 PM
The culpability lies with not properly engaging the supporters to gauge the feeling regarding season ticket renewal prior to releasing the season ticket deal.

If they had simply carried out some market research on a cross section of supporters they would have known that the season ticket deal they released was doomed to failure and more season ticket holders were going to be lost.

At the moment I don't think that the fans themselves will be lost, but if the season ticket income is high up in their business plan for the coming season then they have failed.

Stevie, I believe a number have written to the Board with regard to fans apathy, cost etc, as I have done so myself. The part about market research, I sometimes think the Board are really incredibly naive, I probably think or thought same numbers would renew regardless. That can only be my rationale, assuming they have not taken into cognisance we are still in deep relegation trouble, and no SFL pricing was attached, to their marketing documentation.

I have said elsewhere I stated at AGM, that I had no confidence in the Board, I still share that same opinion Today, they seem to bungle from one season to the next.

H18sry
20-03-2012, 01:01 PM
Stevie, I believe a number have written to the Board with regard to fans apathy, cost etc, as I have done so myself. The part about market research, I sometimes think the Board are really incredibly naive, I probably think or thought same numbers would renew regardless. That can only be my rationale, assuming they have not taken into cognisance we are still in deep relegation trouble, and no SFL pricing was attached, to their marketing documentation.

I have said elsewhere I stated at AGM, that I had no confidence in the Board, I still share that same opinion Today, they seem to bungle from one season to the next.

I also wrote to the board and after the bog standard reply,I wrote again asking for my questions to be addressed I received a short reply from MR Hyland

Thanks for your follow up email and additional questions which I’m acknowledging receipt of. I’m sure even you can appreciate that with my workload, especially this week, I cannot always respond directly to individuals hence the wider email I sent earlier today. I will get back to your email as soon as I can.

Thanks for your patience and understanding.
Fife

That was 10 day's ago and I am still waiting. :rolleyes:

Baldy Foghorn
20-03-2012, 01:11 PM
I also wrote to the board and after the bog standard reply,I wrote again asking for my questions to be addressed I received a short reply from MR Hyland

Thanks for your follow up email and additional questions which I’m acknowledging receipt of. I’m sure even you can appreciate that with my workload, especially this week, I cannot always respond directly to individuals hence the wider email I sent earlier today. I will get back to your email as soon as I can.

Thanks for your patience and understanding.
Fife

That was 10 day's ago and I am still waiting. :rolleyes:

Poor stuff to have heard nothing back, one can only assume your points of concern, won't be getting addressed?

Keith_M
20-03-2012, 01:14 PM
If it's part of the clubs business plan that they need the ST money up front, instead of budgeting for an average attendance (ST and Walk Ups), they need to do one of two things:


1) Give a good reason for fans to actually by a ST.

Deals that have lots of strings attached and only apply to a small part of the supporter base are obviously not cutting it, neither is meaningless pap like "we're all in this together" or whatever the latest marketing phrase is. Nearly all ST holders miss at least one or two games per season. Financially, this makes it more worthwhile to just do walk up. Add to the fact we have 16,000 seats in the home end and your guaranteed a ticket no matter what.

There are two reasons that fans will buy Season Tickets ahead of being walkups: Loyalty to the club, which has now been sorely stretched and the prospect that over the season, a Season Ticket saves them money, which it currently doesn't.

Leaving customer loyalty aside, that means the only option available to the board is reducing the price of a ST to make it more attractive than just doing walk-up.


2) Get a new business plan.

H18sry
20-03-2012, 01:21 PM
Poor stuff to have heard nothing back, one can only assume your points of concern, won't be getting addressed?

These are the points that I asked to be answered.


Your reply never answered my question's, any chance you could do so now?

Why no "cat B" season ticket?

Why was the proposed KIT changed from a kit to a shirt if you buy one first?

What benefit do I get from an Old firm ticket? what if we are relegated and there is no old firm games?

Prizes frozen ? not true last season a new pricing band was brought in for futures and disabled fan's thats not freezing prices.

Booking fee's ? Season ticket holders have had to pay for them all season yet members get them free, is that fair?

One question that I forgot to add in my original e-mail, if we are relegated will the prices remain at SPL level or is there a season ticket plan B?

I await a personal reply instead of a bog standard spin loaded one

Nothing too taxing in there that the chairman would struggle to find an answer to.

Gatecrasher
20-03-2012, 01:24 PM
Whether people renew or not is their own personal choice and i have no problem with that what so ever. I do think the board need to take note of the peoples opinion when it comes to their concerns. Its very dangerous for a company to ignore these issues. Pricing IMO is a big one as we all know we arent getting value for money. i am getting more concerned with the apathy amognst the support and i feel its going to take a very long time to get back to where we really should be looking to be (top 6 on a regular basis) as a club and support. I feel Fenlon is going take us forward as a club but unless something big happens in the next year or 2 we could stagnate further and drop a level in terms of club, reputation and support which will be very difficult to rectify.

Thecat23
20-03-2012, 01:46 PM
First off I am going to renew my season ticket. But one question I'd like to ask is.. Does selling more season tickets mean we will have a better team than Killie, Aberdeen, Utd, Motherwell, St Johnstone. Because we sure as hell have better attendances than all them, yet they have produced a better quality squad than us.

Players are out there, its the scouts that need to pick them up. Nothing at all to do with how many tickets are sold. We have had god knows how many players who have been on better wages than a lot of other teams yet we can't seem to compete at their level in the league. Maybe we need to find players who just want to play football and not live a high life?

Mikey I see what you're trying here but it doesn't work this way.

Mikey
20-03-2012, 01:49 PM
First off I am going to renew my season ticket. But one question I'd like to ask is.. Does selling more season tickets mean we will have a better team than Killie, Aberdeen, Utd, Motherwell, St Johnstone. Because we sure as hell have better attendances than all them, yet they have produced a better quality squad than us.

Players are out there, its the scouts that need to pick them up. Nothing at all to do with how many tickets are sold. We have had god knows how many players who have been on better wages than a lot of other teams yet we can't seem to compete at their level in the league. Maybe we need to find players who just want to play football and not live a high life?

Mikey I see what you're trying here but it doesn't work this way.

If it's nothing to do with money, how come Celtic and Rangers are always way ahead of the pack?

Do you think Hibs would still be second bottom if we were getting 14,000+ through the gates every home game?

Beefster
20-03-2012, 01:55 PM
If it's nothing to do with money, how come Celtic and Rangers are always way ahead of the pack?

Do you think Hibs would still be second bottom if we were getting 14,000+ through the gates every home game?

The attendances are a symptom of being pish/second bottom - not the other way about.

Mikey
20-03-2012, 01:59 PM
The attendances are a symptom of being pish/second bottom - not the other way about.

Yes, I know. It's been mentioned before :greengrin

Have I ever mentioned that if folk sucked it up and just stuck their cash in regardless (assuming they can afford it of course), we'd be in a much better place than we are now?

Maybe I have :greengrin

Thecat23
20-03-2012, 02:01 PM
If it's nothing to do with money, how come Celtic and Rangers are always way ahead of the pack?

Do you think Hibs would still be second bottom if we were getting 14,000+ through the gates every home game?

You never answered my question though? How come the likes of Utd, Motherwell are streets ahead of us with a far lower attendance gates? if we had 14,000 coming into ER I honestly have no idea where Hibs would be? Maybe 3 maybe still sitting where we are.

But you're saying If we all go out and buy a season ticket it will mean we will beat Hearts next year. Nothing at all has shown this to be true. Be great if folk did but makes no odds at all if you ask me to the players playing. We need fighters and players who don't think Hibs are just small step in their career so don't bother putting that extra graft in.

Mikey
20-03-2012, 02:03 PM
You never answered my question though? How come the likes of Utd, Motherwell are streets ahead of us with a far lower attendance gates?



A settled manager and better players obviously.

Mikey
20-03-2012, 02:04 PM
But you're saying If we all go out and buy a season ticket it will mean we will beat Hearts next year.

No I didn't. That's what you want to read.

Thecat23
20-03-2012, 02:05 PM
No I didn't. That's what you want to read.

Really? Ok my mistake.

TornadoHibby
20-03-2012, 02:11 PM
If it's nothing to do with money, how come Celtic and Rangers are always way ahead of the pack?


Do you think Hibs would still be second bottom if we were getting 14,000+ through the gates every home game?


If Hibs were getting 14,000+ through the gates (regularly) for every home game then they most most certainly would not be second bottom of the SPL as they are right now as Beefster rightly posted here!



The attendances are a symptom of being pish/second bottom - not the other way about.


There are reasons why we are not playing well and these must be addressed too and as soon as possible as I offered up earlier as follows.



I believe that it is morally wrong to expect existing loyal customers to be persuaded to possibly perpetuate a repeat of previous season's mismanagement of ST cash by the Board forcing renewal decisions from people after they (in effect) wrap a blindfold around the eyes and put ear plugs in the ears of those loyal customers first! :confused:

Recurring customers are usually recurring because they are happy with the prospect of renewing as they have a decent impression of getting value for money for their "investment" not an uncertain product (Div 1 or continued lack of investment by the shareholders in the playing and football coaching and management aspect of the Club) which may not satisfy their expectations! :agree:

Some years ago, I was involved with a business involved in a luxury franchise driven range of products (capital and service) and the franchisor discovered on a large scale survey of customers that for every one customer who "forgives" an expectation failure and stays with the business TEN others move onto another business.

Now, football customers won't move from team to team like that but there is a message there for the Hibs Board that a sizeable element of negative feeling towards the Club could easily arise if we are in Div 1 or the necessary and, well overdue IMO, shareholder cash and business product quality management is not forthcoming at the required levels to allow significant (at least regular top 4 SPL finishes and decent Cup runs each season) performance improvement and improved customer satisfaction levels resulting in high non renewal levels! :confused:

Bill Milne
20-03-2012, 02:17 PM
Agreed Baldy. But just as much, we need Sir Tom Farmer to lengthen his arms and shorten his pockets.

Sorry, Frank, may already have been said in later posts, but Sir TF won't get involved, as you well know. Time for the loyal fans to step up to the mark and get the funds to Fenlon pre-season.

Mikey
20-03-2012, 02:20 PM
There's been a lot of talk of "business" in this thread and in others.

Hibs aren't a business to us though, they're our football team. You wouldn't get someone giving up on Hibs and going to support Hearts. It just wouldn't happen. Other businesses will lose customers to competitors but it doesn't happen in football.

The bottom line here is (and I may have mentioned this before!!), the more money we put in the better the chance there is of a successful team. There's no doubt that if we end up with a fanbase of 5-7000, that many people are predicting, it will be catastrophic for the club.

It doesn't matter who's fault that would be, the board, the manager, the players, whoever. We can stop that happening by backing the club through season ticket sales.

TornadoHibby
20-03-2012, 02:27 PM
Sorry, Frank, may already have been said in later posts, but Sir TF won't get involved, as you well know. Time for the loyal fans to step up to the mark and get the funds to Fenlon pre-season.

Do you think that is likely to happen bearing in mind last few years of "under/very poor-performance" and the current uncertainty as to whether that situation can be reversed relatively quickly and our current "which League will be playing in next season?" uncertainty! :rolleyes:

STF and the Board need to act decisively and produce adequate funding to get the Club into a position where it can compete successfully and regularly at the top end of the SPL and have decent Cup runs on top if they want to increase the regular match day attendances and numbers of ST holders IMO! :agree:

The last few years has seen the Board mismanage the ST cash quite abysmally in terms of quality of playing squad and coaching and management staff IMO so why should they expect people to keep throwing money in for them to continue to do that? :confused:

TornadoHibby
20-03-2012, 02:32 PM
There's been a lot of talk of "business" in this thread and in others.

Hibs aren't a business to us though, they're our football team. You wouldn't get someone giving up on Hibs and going to support Hearts. It just wouldn't happen. Other businesses will lose customers to competitors but it doesn't happen in football.

The bottom line here is (and I may have mentioned this before!!), the more money we put in the better the chance there is of a successful team. There's no doubt that if we end up with a fanbase of 5-7000, that many people are predicting, it will be catastrophic for the club.

It doesn't matter who's fault that would be, the board, the manager, the players, whoever. We can stop that happening by backing the club through season ticket sales.

I think that it does matter who's fault it is where they actually control what happens and don't understand why others seem unable to grasp that nettle! :confused:

And why would turning the current situation around not be the responsibility of the shareholders and Board who control how the Club is operated whereas the ST holders have no say in the matter EXCEPT to do something else on a match day with their cash which they have seen hopelessly mis-managed by the Board for a few years now!? :confused:

Mikey
20-03-2012, 02:34 PM
I think that it does matter who's fault it is where they actually control what happens and don't understand why others seem unable to grasp that nettle! :confused:

And why would turning the current situation around not be the responsibility of the shareholders and Board who control how the Club is operated whereas the ST holders have no say in the matter EXCEPT to do something else on a match day with their cash which they have seen hopelessly mis-managed by the Board for a few years now!? :confused:

You know, I reckon we're not going to agree on this.

I'll give my money to the club and trust them to give as much of that money as they can to the manager. You won't.

Let's leave it at that :greengrin

H18sry
20-03-2012, 02:35 PM
There's been a lot of talk of "business" in this thread and in others.

Hibs aren't a business to us though, they're our football team. You wouldn't get someone giving up on Hibs and going to support Hearts. It just wouldn't happen. Other businesses will lose customers to competitors but it doesn't happen in football.

The bottom line here is (and I may have mentioned this before!!), the more money we put in the better the chance there is of a successful team. There's no doubt that if we end up with a fanbase of 5-7000, that many people are predicting, it will be catastrophic for the club.

It doesn't matter who's fault that would be, the board, the manager, the players, whoever. We can stop that happening by backing the club through season ticket sales.

Are you being worked by the board? You seem to be trolling, on this thread every thing seems to be the same old answer to anybody's question, buy a season ticket,but why should I buy a season ticket when there is no guarantees that anything will change, we were told the same last season and we are in a worse position now than we were 12 months ago, [with the exception of the semi]. I have a disabled son who cannot make all the games, so if I miss one game with my season ticket I will be out of pocket, so am I not better off just buying a ticket on a game by game basis?

Bill Milne
20-03-2012, 02:36 PM
Do you think that is likely to happen bearing in mind last few years of "under/very poor-performance" and the current uncertainty as to whether that situation can be reversed relatively quickly and our current "which League will be playing in next season?" uncertainty! :rolleyes:

STF and the Board need to act decisively and produce adequate funding to get the Club into a position where it can compete successfully and regularly at the top end of the SPL and have decent Cup runs on top if they want to increase the regular match day attendances and numbers of ST holders IMO! :agree:

The last few years has seen the Board mismanage the ST cash quite abysmally in terms of quality of playing squad and coaching and management staff IMO so why should they expect people to keep throwing money in for them to continue to do that? :confused:

Yes, you're right, the Board have to take responsibilty for the mess we are in. I set that against the obvious need to replace a decrepit old dump and provide decent training facilities, which I imagine we are still paying for. In other words, we are lagging the Board for running the club on as level a keel as possible and trying to compete. Obviously, Petrie's inability to recognize a football manage when he sees one doesn't help (Mowbray got pretty luck with the youth squad coming through at the time), but I( also accept their fiscal responsibilities to the club. A more pertinent question should be why other teams, notably Dunfermline, Hertz, Kilmarnock & Motherwell were allowed to run up huge debts without any brakes being applied by the SPL.

Mikey
20-03-2012, 02:37 PM
Are you being worked by the board?

:hilarious

Only on hibs.net is it a crime to support Hibs :greengrin

H18sry
20-03-2012, 02:39 PM
:hilarious

Only on hibs.net is it a crime to support Hibs :greengrin

Not a crime far from it but you seem to be very pro-board,you defend them at all costs.

Mikey
20-03-2012, 02:44 PM
Not a crime far from it but you seem to be very pro-board,you defend them at all costs.

Are you sure you're not mistaking the club for the board? You'll have to look long and hard to find a post where I defend any individual board members or the board as a whole.

I'm quite happy to defend the club at all costs though.

hibs0666
20-03-2012, 02:46 PM
Are you being worked by the board? You seem to be trolling, on this thread every thing seems to be the same old answer to anybody's question, buy a season ticket,but why should I buy a season ticket when there is no guarantees that anything will change,

It's sport - there can be no guarantees that things will change - nature of the beast.

TornadoHibby
20-03-2012, 02:46 PM
You know, I reckon we're not going to agree on this.

I'll give my money to the club and trust them to give as much of that money as they can to the manager. You won't.

Let's leave it at that :greengrin

Aye but why choose to ignore the realities of what the Club faces in terms of getting bums on seats again Rod, sorry Mikey! :greengrin

Seriously, people are just hacked off in huge numbers amongst the ST holders and I know that many around me don't turn up for matches on a regular basis currently despite having paid for them last Spring! :agree:

The likelihood of them coming back without something happening at shareholder and Board level re necessary funding and quality, skills and experience of management must be incredibly remote! :agree:

The thing is, by STF investing (or lending) the necessary funds to allow management change and a decent playing squad to be secured and gelled, the likelihood is that regular attendances would increase considerably from where we currently are on match days which might just allow him to get that cash back over time. Additionally, he would be protecting the value of his existing investment IMO! :dunno:

Mikey
20-03-2012, 02:52 PM
Aye but why choose to ignore the realities of what the Club faces in terms of getting bums on seats again Rod, sorry Mikey! :greengrin

Seriously, people are just hacked off in huge numbers amongst the ST holders and I know that many around me don't turn up for matches on a regular bases currently despite having paid for them last Spring! :agree:

The likelihood of them coming back without something happening at shareholder and Board level re necessary funding must be incredibly remote! :agree:

The thing is, by STF investing (or lending) the necessary funds to allow management change and a decent playing squad to be secured and gelled, the likelihood is that regular attendances would increase considerably from where we currently are on match days which might just allow him to get that cash back over time. Additionally, he would be protecting the value of his existing investment IMO! :dunno:

I posted regularly in December that the board should approach STF for a loan to get us out of this mess. I don't know if they did, and they won't publicise it if they did, but there was enough activity on 31st January to suggest that something happened. Maybe the next set of accounts will tell us more.

Regardless of who's running the club, I'm still of the opinion that if it's affordable then fans should back the team by buying a season ticket.

You're not going to talk me out of it :greengrin

Beefster
20-03-2012, 02:53 PM
Yes, I know. It's been mentioned before :greengrin

Have I ever mentioned that if folk sucked it up and just stuck their cash in regardless (assuming they can afford it of course), we'd be in a much better place than we are now?

Maybe I have :greengrin

Aye, you've mentioned it once or twice! The problem is the folk are not going to continue to stick their cash in regardless, even if they can afford it, if they're no longer getting much enjoyment out of it. Football is competing against family time and other attractions. I can go and consume overpriced beer, food, drink and football or I could spend the five hours with Mrs and mini-Beefster.


There's been a lot of talk of "business" in this thread and in others.

Hibs aren't a business to us though, they're our football team.

Again, we've been told for years by Hibs about how they are a business, have a budget to balance etc etc. I think that more and more people acting like a normal customer is a symptom of the messages coming out of the club.

c31
20-03-2012, 02:55 PM
Fed Up Losing To Hearts? Want A Better Team Next Season?
answer is -- buy a season ticket....is it?

I tried this for the last 35 years and it hasn't really worked, so Rod, whats plan B?

I'm afraid that next season there are going to be very few season ticket holders at ER so maybe the board will have to heavily invest to drag some of us back.

totally fed up after that performance on Sunday

Mikey
20-03-2012, 02:56 PM
Aye, you've mentioned it once or twice! The problem is the folk are not going to continue to stick their cash in regardless, even if they can afford it, if they're no longer getting much enjoyment out of it.

I'm sure I've seen that mentioned before too :greengrin

TornadoHibby
20-03-2012, 03:12 PM
I posted regularly in December that the board should approach STF for a loan to get us out of this mess. I don't know if they did, and they won't publicise it if they did, but there was enough activity on 31st January to suggest that something happened. Maybe the next set of accounts will tell us more.

Regardless of who's running the club, I'm still of the opinion that if it's affordable then fans should back the team by buying a season ticket.

You're not going to talk me out of it :greengrin

I wouldn't even try Mikey! :greengrin

I just don't get why you seem to think that is an option that would appeal to other people too bearing in mind the current circumstances and uncertainty surrounding the product on offer at ER to those people?! :dunno:

Mikey
20-03-2012, 03:14 PM
I wouldn't even try Mikey! :greengrin

I just don't get why you seem to think that is an option that would appeal to other people too bearing in mind the current circumstances and uncertainty surrounding the product on offer at ER to those people?! :dunno:

That's ok. I don't understand people walking away from the club for whatever reason, regardless of the circumstances.

TornadoHibby
20-03-2012, 03:40 PM
That's ok. I don't understand people walking away from the club for whatever reason, regardless of the circumstances.

:hmmm:

I think the scope for rational discussion just disappeared then Mikey! :confused:

People have choices and want value for money, nothing more and nothing less. Disappointed to find that you think that is an unreasonable expectation for any football supporter to want from his team and that you believe that even deprived of that expectation, supporters should still feel obliged to buy a ST months in advance of the next season starting when there is so much uncertainty surrounding the clubs immediate footballing future, particulary which League it will be playing in next season and whether the quality of the playing suqad will have improved sufficiently to provide "value for money"! :rolleyes:

Just don't get it but I'm done now I think on this one! :confused:

StevieC
20-03-2012, 03:48 PM
We can stop that happening by backing the club through season ticket sales.

And the club can stop it happening by coming up with a season ticket deal that reflects the quality on offer and the cost effectiveness when compared to walk up prices.

They haven't, why should we?

H18sry
20-03-2012, 03:51 PM
That's ok. I don't understand people walking away from the club for whatever reason, regardless of the circumstances.

So not buying a season ticket is walking away from the club,despite the fact that I will attend 99% of games :confused: Have a word. :rolleyes:

Keith_M
20-03-2012, 03:55 PM
Just tried to buy two STs (for other people) online and my card got refused, because I'm abroad. The system now refuses to allow me to buy tickets, even with another card.

I called the 0844... number (from our official website) to buy them that way but they said they haven't heard from the club whether or not the STs are for sale, and it's not possible through their system, only matchday tickets :confused:


The other alternative, apparently, is to go in to the Ticket Office (long walk) or download a form and send all my financial details by post.

Beefster
20-03-2012, 03:59 PM
I don't understand people walking away from the club for whatever reason, regardless of the circumstances.

The club appears to have the same mindset.

Mikey
20-03-2012, 03:59 PM
So not buying a season ticket is walking away from the club,despite the fact that I will attend 99% of games :confused: Have a word. :rolleyes:

Nope, didn't say that. Again.

Judas Iscariot
20-03-2012, 04:07 PM
That's ok. I don't understand people walking away from the club for whatever reason, regardless of the circumstances.

So not being able to afford to attend games, the price of ST's going up from last year, continually getting pumped from the yams, & everyone else for that matter, having the 3rd most expensive tickets in the league, most expensive catering, piss poor k/o times, games getting moved to Sundays, piss poor football on offer to list a few..

None of these would/should factor into people's decision not to attend according to you?

Mikey
20-03-2012, 04:08 PM
So not being able to afford to attend games, the price of ST's going up from last year, continually getting pumped from the yams, & everyone else for that matter, having the 3rd most expensive tickets in the league, most expensive catering, piss poor k/o times, games getting moved to Sundays, piss poor football on offer to list a few..

None of these would/should factor into people's decision not to attend according to you?

Selective reading again eh :greengrin

H18sry
20-03-2012, 04:34 PM
Nope, didn't say that. Again.

That's ok. I don't understand people walking away from the club for whatever reason, regardless of the circumstances. so can you explain this statement :confused:

Kaiser1962
20-03-2012, 04:38 PM
Fed Up Losing To Hearts? Want A Better Team Next Season?
answer is -- buy a season ticket....is it?

I tried this for the last 35 years and it hasn't really worked, so Rod, whats plan B?

I'm afraid that next season there are going to be very few season ticket holders at ER so maybe the board will have to heavily invest to drag some of us back.

totally fed up after that performance on Sunday


Not even TQM would try to lay the blame for the last 35 years at Rod's door. :wink:


Second point is that we already heavily overspend. You can accuse us of being rubbish but I dont think the charge of lack of investment sticks.

Mikey
20-03-2012, 04:39 PM
That's ok. I don't understand people walking away from the club for whatever reason, regardless of the circumstances. so can you explain this statement :confused:

I honestly don't know what you don't understand about it.

Sammy7nil
20-03-2012, 04:45 PM
I honestly don't know what you don't understand about it.

for whatever reason, regardless of the circumstances.

This is the bit I don't understand ! The tash must love you. :greengrin

TornadoHibby
20-03-2012, 04:47 PM
I honestly don't know what you don't understand about it.

I understand the words but cannot for the life of me appreciate why you would believe that any supporter of Hibs in the current circumstances would follow your "guidance" or "advice"! I was done but the chance of possibly finding out the thinking behind your words drew me in again! :wink: :greengrin

H18sry
20-03-2012, 04:48 PM
I honestly don't know what you don't understand about it.


for whatever reason, regardless of the circumstances.

This is the bit I don't understand ! The tash must love you. :greengrin

Ditto

Mikey
20-03-2012, 04:48 PM
for whatever reason, regardless of the circumstances.

This is the bit I don't understand ! The tash must love you. :greengrin

The tash wouldn't know me if I passed him in the street :wink:

Let's try it again then............ I don't understand why people who can afford to go to the games (and I've said "afford" plenty of times) won't go, thereby denying the club money to invest in players. Regardless of whether we're winning, losing or drawing.

Does that cover it? :greengrin

Mikey
20-03-2012, 04:49 PM
I understand the words but cannot for the life of me appreciate why you would believe that any supporter of Hibs in the current circumstances would follow your "guidance" or "advice"! I was done but the chance of possibly finding out the thinking behind your words drew me in again! :wink: :greengrin

Hopefully answered in post 169 :wink:

Sammy7nil
20-03-2012, 04:54 PM
The tash wouldn't know me if I passed him in the street :wink:

Let's try it again then............ I don't understand why people who can afford to go to the games (and I've said "afford" plenty of times) won't go, thereby denying the club money to invest in players. Regardless of whether we're winning, losing or drawing.

Does that cover it? :greengrin

much better :aok:

The Modfather
20-03-2012, 04:54 PM
Selective reading again eh :greengrin

Mickey, not sure if your stubbornness to stick to your guns on this thread is admirable, or foolhardy :greengrin

I'm a fairly classic example of one of the lost masses. Season ticket for 8 years, travelled away as much as my budget allowed etc etc. I stopped going around the time the East was demolished, despite having a season ticket. It wasn't the results that necessarily forced me away, but the general lack of organisation, shape, and especially the lack of fitness - which is sacrilegious to me as a basic pre-requisite for a professional footballer.

At first I felt guilty not renewing, then I gradually realised I had nothing to feel guilty about. If I don't consider it value for money, or even remotely enjoyable, I have no obligation to continue to renew. A call I had with Fyfe re a well constructed letter (see the Response From The Board Thread) I sent them. To say his call was a case of "going through the motions", to get a reply out of the way was an understatement, but that's for another thread. Anyway, from that call, upon being asked about the fitness of the team in relation to Collins' team and the fitness coach he brought in, to be effectively told, "meh, that's not true. We use East Mains etc etc". Only for Fenlon to come in and say, half way through a season the squad wasn't fit enough, well that was a p*sstake too far for me.

Now, I'm only willing to pay up to £15 for Scottish football, as that is what I class as value for money. An example being, I went up to Tannadice on xmas eve to see yet another shocker, by a bunch of unfit bevvy merchants. The difference being, I was comfortable at having paid £10 for it.

Along with a fellow lapsed Hibee, and two lapsed Edinburgh sheep friends, we have agreed to get Spartans season tickets next season. £65odd, no one there simply to fund the George St coffers, feed the Saturday afternoon Football fix, and a few beers before/after. That will do me.

Mickey (simply as you are very vocal from your side of the fence), I'd be interested to hear what your take on all that is? Fair enough, or, given I can afford a season ticket, is there no excuse for me drifting away?

Cheers

blackpoolhibs
20-03-2012, 04:56 PM
The tash wouldn't know me if I passed him in the street :wink:

Let's try it again then............ I don't understand why people who can afford to go to the games (and I've said "afford" plenty of times) won't go, thereby denying the club money to invest in players. Regardless of whether we're winning, losing or drawing.

Does that cover it? :greengrin

Mikey i know a few who can afford to go 10 times over, but dont. The reason is they cant be bothered anymore. The team/club/managers/chairmen whatever combination you care to mention, has drained any commitment they had out of them.

Some folk are like them, others are being priced out, but a combination of both are hurting the club.

I have no idea what the club are doing to address this, but the new price structure wont help, and failure to get a winning side on the park wont bring the others back either.

Its a chicken and egg situation.

BT58
20-03-2012, 05:01 PM
Can they ( the board) not come out with a season ticket minus the shirt & auld firm tickets at say £300
then maybe there would be more interest,,, or is that too hard
Bt
Ps ive had 2 letters in the matter of days asking me to renew,,

TornadoHibby
20-03-2012, 05:03 PM
Hopefully answered in post 169 :wink:

Ok, I think that you are stretching a point Mikey when many people amongst the population we are talking about here are not in that position! Additionally, the idea that anyone should put themselves through prolonged agony in watching a team struggle for several years due to Board mismanagement and ineffective use of ST cash in previous years with largely the same people still controlling the management and direction of the club and then continue to subscribe for further ST's just because "that's what a football supporter does" is too much IMO! :confused:

Evidence of progress including new management should preclude continuing requests for further ST funding - a poorly performing public company would struggle to raise cash from shareholders unless clear evidence of positive business change leading to healthy future prospects was exhibited and supported by proper due diligence! :confused:

Mikey
20-03-2012, 05:03 PM
Mickey (simply as you are very vocal from your side of the fence), I'd be interested to hear what your take on all that is? Fair enough, or, given I can afford a season ticket, is there no excuse for me drifting away?

Cheers

I'd say you're gone already, wouldn't you? All that pish I came out with about not losing folk to other teams seems to have been........... a load of pish :greengrin

Hopefully you'll be back though. But you'll surely recognise that your absence doesn't help things get better.



Mikey i know a few who can afford to go 10 times over, but dont. The reason is they cant be bothered anymore. The team/club/managers/chairmen whatever combination you care to mention, has drained any commitment they had out of them.

Some folk are like them, others are being priced out, but a combination of both are hurting the club.

I have no idea what the club are doing to address this, but the new price structure wont help, and failure to get a winning side on the park wont bring the others back either.

Its a chicken and egg situation.

Oh bloody hell, it's the cavalry :greengrin

The Modfather
20-03-2012, 05:12 PM
I'd say you're gone already, wouldn't you? All that pish I came out with about not losing folk to other teams seems to have been........... a load of pish :greengrin

Hopefully you'll be back though. But you'll surely recognise that your absence doesn't help things get better.

It doesn't particularly matter when I went though, what is your take on the reasons why I left? Aren't they fair enough, it wasn't necessarily the results that forced me away - hell I sat through the Williamson years! :greengrin Or do you still not agree?

As far as I'm concerned. I stood up the last time they asked me to, so my conscience is clear. That's not to say I don't still love Hibs, but I no longer have the same blind loyalty towards them anymore. Like a scorned ex lover, I blame the board for that.

Mikey
20-03-2012, 05:17 PM
Mickey, not sure if your stubbornness to stick to your guns on this thread is admirable, or foolhardy :greengrin

I'm a fairly classic example of one of the lost masses. Season ticket for 8 years, travelled away as much as my budget allowed etc etc. I stopped going around the time the East was demolished, despite having a season ticket. It wasn't the results that necessarily forced me away, but the general lack of organisation, shape, and especially the lack of fitness - which is sacrilegious to me as a basic pre-requisite for a professional footballer.

At first I felt guilty not renewing, then I gradually realised I had nothing to feel guilty about. If I don't consider it value for money, or even remotely enjoyable, I have no obligation to continue to renew. A call I had with Fyfe re a well constructed letter (see the Response From The Board Thread) I sent them. To say his call was a case of "going through the motions", to get a reply out of the way was an understatement, but that's for another thread. Anyway, from that call, upon being asked about the fitness of the team in relation to Collins' team and the fitness coach he brought in, to be effectively told, "meh, that's not true. We use East Mains etc etc". Only for Fenlon to come in and say, half way through a season the squad wasn't fit enough, well that was a p*sstake too far for me.

Now, I'm only willing to pay up to £15 for Scottish football, as that is what I class as value for money. An example being, I went up to Tannadice on xmas eve to see yet another shocker, by a bunch of unfit bevvy merchants. The difference being, I was comfortable at having paid £10 for it.

Along with a fellow lapsed Hibee, and two lapsed Edinburgh sheep friends, we have agreed to get Spartans season tickets next season. £65odd, no one there simply to fund the George St coffers, feed the Saturday afternoon Football fix, and a few beers before/after. That will do me.

Mickey (simply as you are very vocal from your side of the fence), I'd be interested to hear what your take on all that is? Fair enough, or, given I can afford a season ticket, is there no excuse for me drifting away?

Cheers


It doesn't particularly matter when I went though, what is your take on the reasons why I left? Aren't they fair enough, it wasn't necessarily the results that forced me away - hell I sat through the Williamson years! :greengrin Or do you still not agree?

As far as I'm concerned. I stood up the last time they asked me to, so my conscience is clear. That's not to say I don't still love Hibs, but I no longer have the same blind loyalty towards them anymore. Like a scorned ex lover, I blame the board for that.

Yep, you've clearly got your reasons and you're sticking with them. Any number of your points are valid reasons for packing it in. I don't play the blame game though so you won't get me pointing the finger at you.

I still maintain that those who can should do their bit and go to home games at least.

Mikey
20-03-2012, 05:29 PM
So in summary.........

The board are charlatans

The players are unfit and lazy

Kick off times are rubbish

We always lose to Hearts

The fans should buy a season ticket anyway


Have I missed anything? :greengrin

Andy74
20-03-2012, 05:33 PM
It doesn't particularly matter when I went though, what is your take on the reasons why I left? Aren't they fair enough, it wasn't necessarily the results that forced me away - hell I sat through the Williamson years! :greengrin Or do you still not agree?

As far as I'm concerned. I stood up the last time they asked me to, so my conscience is clear. That's not to say I don't still love Hibs, but I no longer have the same blind loyalty towards them anymore. Like a scorned ex lover, I blame the board for that.

I don't get this thing about a blind loyalty to 'them'. It's us, we are Hbs, not a board or a set of players. And isn't blind loyalty what following a football team is about? It's not a thing to change like your favourite beer. It's what you are.

Regardless of how bad the football gets the thought of doing something like getting a season ticket at Spartans wouldn't cross my mind.

I might not be always be able to buy a ST or even feel that it's value for money but walking away and doing something else? No, can't see that happening.

I guess there really are only about 7 or 8,000 people who think that way though.

Mikey
20-03-2012, 05:34 PM
I don't get this thing about a blind loyalty to 'them'. It's us, we are Hbs............

Post of the year sir.

Shame it's only March :greengrin

GreenCastle
20-03-2012, 05:42 PM
I don't get this thing about a blind loyalty to 'them'. It's us, we are Hbs, not a board or a set of players. And isn't blind loyalty what following a football team is about? It's not a thing to change like your favourite beer. It's what you are.

Regardless of how bad the football gets the thought of doing something like getting a season ticket at Spartans wouldn't cross my mind.

I might not be always be able to buy a ST or even feel that it's value for money but walking away and doing something else? No, can't see that happening.

I guess there really are only about 7 or 8,000 people who think that way though.

It could be many more if people thought it was worth the price to go to the game and enjoy the matchday experience - that's the problem!

We have the potential and people/the board are just happy to get by as a hardcore group will just keep paying (we call the yams deluded!).

Capital city club with a great stadium going to have 7,000 plus empty seats and counting every game doesn't make sense - but what's been made to fill them ? The quality on the pitch isn't currently there.

Don't get me started on the rip off prices for food and the lack of quality - when were these last improved ?!

Andy74
20-03-2012, 05:47 PM
It could be many more if people thought it was worth the price to go to the game and enjoy the matchday experience - that's the problem!

We have the potential and people/the board are just happy to get by as a hardcore group will just keep paying.

Capital city club with a great stadium going to have 7,000 plus empty seats and counting every game doesn't make sense - but what's been made to fill them ? The quality on the pitch isn't currently there.

Don't get me started on the rip off prices for food and the lack of quality - when were these last improved ?!

It couldn't be many more though if we only have 7 or 8,000 people who think that way. the rest will need persuaded by better football. Pricing has been shown to not actually have that much of an impact.

I can get why people have vanished but I admit I'm disappointed that more couldn't give the new manager a new start and turn up without it all having to be turned around first. There's much more chance of a change in fortune if we have the backing to begin with.

Only 7 to 8,000 will do that regardless.

blackpoolhibs
20-03-2012, 06:13 PM
I don't get this thing about a blind loyalty to 'them'. It's us, we are Hbs, not a board or a set of players. And isn't blind loyalty what following a football team is about? It's not a thing to change like your favourite beer. It's what you are.

Regardless of how bad the football gets the thought of doing something like getting a season ticket at Spartans wouldn't cross my mind.

I might not be always be able to buy a ST or even feel that it's value for money but walking away and doing something else? No, can't see that happening.

I guess there really are only about 7 or 8,000 people who think that way though.

:agree: And how good would it be if we had double that, but thats not happening any time soon, and more and more people ARE walking away, how long before its 5-6k as not everyone thinks the same as you or the other 7 or 8k?

I have no idea how the club are going to attract more fans to the ground, i think we all agree prices are too high for a lot of folk, as i said earlier its the straw thats broken the camels back for some. There can be no justification on our prices being more than everyone else bar the 2 old firm sides, especially when you see what its paying for.

People are finding better things to do with their money, Hibs have a huge problem winning them back.

Sammy7nil
20-03-2012, 06:38 PM
How many ST did we sell last year?
Of that No how many paid full price?

Guys get older what was life or death when they were 15 - 25yrs is no longer important at 35 - 50yrs.
You cant get kids to go and watch dross week after week there are too many other competing interests.

Guys who drop out are not being replaced.

Unless there is a Massive improvement in playing staff ST numbers will be savaged again next year. I think on the current cycle ST will level off at around 3000 - 4000 with under 50% of these buyers paying full price.

The board need to be innovative in FILLING the stdium and there is NO sign of that happening soon.

This looks like a very slippery slope.

snooky
20-03-2012, 07:12 PM
How many ST did we sell last year?
Of that No how many paid full price?

Guys get older what was life or death when they were 15 - 25yrs is no longer important at 35 - 50yrs.
You cant get kids to go and watch dross week after week there are too many other competing interests.

Guys who drop out are not being replaced.

Unless there is a Massive improvement in playing staff ST numbers will be savaged again next year. I think on the current cycle ST will level off at around 3000 - 4000 with under 50% of these buyers paying full price.

The board need to be innovative in FILLING the stdium and there is NO sign of that happening soon.

This looks like a very slippery slope.

Good point S7N, and you can see it in all walks of life. The social clubs, pubs, etc.

However, Hibs would be pulling them in if they had the likes of the Tornados/F5 on the park
There's ups and downs in football and fans, in general, expect and accept that.
Alas, the trough at ER in the past 2-3 years feels like the Grand Canyon.
We need a lift - and a big one. Now!

TornadoHibby
20-03-2012, 07:23 PM
So in summary.........

The board are charlatans

The players are unfit and lazy

Kick off times are rubbish

We always lose to Hearts

The fans should buy a season ticket anyway


Have I missed anything? :greengrin

Only the most obvious very real and serious points which concern a great number of fans Mikey and which may result in many of them not renewing ST's or attending as many matches next season as they may have done previously!? :rolleyes:

No point in repeating them as they have already been repeated several times yet you continue to treat them as if they are invisible or irrelevant! :confused:

If people aren't enjoying the product on show, which has been consistently poor for several years now, why do you think they should force themselves to pay for the priviledge to do so and then to sit through it week after week? :rolleyes:

Thoughtful and sensible answers only please! :confused:

Mikey
20-03-2012, 07:28 PM
The most obvious very real and serious points which concern a great number of fans Mikey and which may result in many of them not renewing ST's or attending as many matches next season as they may have done previously!? :rolleyes:

No point in repeating them as they have already been repeated several times yet you continue to treat them as if they are invisible! :confused:

It was a light hearted post.

What can I do to fix these "invisible" problems?

TornadoHibby
20-03-2012, 07:34 PM
It was a light hearted post.

What can I do to fix these "invisible" problems?

You must be sitting with gun in hand ready to respond immediately as I immediately edited my post to clarify a couple of things and you've missed those! :rolleyes:

Maybe you could help me by responding to the edited post I made in so far as you haven't so far?

The_Todd
20-03-2012, 07:35 PM
Plain and simple, and I know this is only me and not everyone's view, but if I could get a season ticket for under £300 like an adult can at Tynecastle then I'd sign up. As it is I think £400+ is frankly pie in the sky prices for what we get served up. And that, boys and girls, is why I'm not buying a season ticket. I could probably afford it, but at what expense? A better summer holiday? Less money in my "saving for a house deposit" fund?

For me to part with in excess of £400 I'd want the board to guarantee solid investment in the team and a proper push for a Top 4 finish. If Virgin Media pulled all the channels off my XL package and told me they'd only come back if more people signed up in the future but kept hiking the price you can guarantee I'd tell where Richard Branson to stuff his fibre optics as well. Football does have the emotional attachment but there's a point where the price is no longer reasonable for what you get, and this is it.

Mikey
20-03-2012, 07:36 PM
If people aren't enjoying the product on show, which has been consistently poor for several years now, why do you think they should force themselves to pay for the priviledge to do so and then to sit through it week after week? :rolleyes:

Thoughtful and sensible answers only please! :confused:

Because denying the club money is counter productive.

We're not going to agree on this. You think people should stay away if things are bad, I think people should muck in and help.

H18sry
20-03-2012, 07:40 PM
Because denying the club money is counter productive.

We're not going to agree on this. You think people should stay away if things are bad, I think people should muck in and help.

We have been mucking in for the last 5 years, and where has that got us? We have went backwards with the board's shocking decision making, that has made us a laughing stock. The buck has got to stop somewhere and for me it is now.

matty_f
20-03-2012, 07:52 PM
It's f****** heartbreaking that on a hibs fans' forum the dissenting voice is the one asking folk to back the club by getting a season ticket.

For the most part, we get the team we deserve. Take away the hardcore who undoubtedly deserve better and we're left with thousands who want better but are actively arguing against giving Fenlon the funds to improve the team.

Look forward to this time next year when we sit in a sparsely populated stadium watching another hapless performance in another relegation battle and everyone can tell us how right they were to not get a season ticket.

We'll support you evermore. Aye, f****** right.

Mikey
20-03-2012, 07:57 PM
Hurrah. It's the nightshift :greengrin

PaulSmith
20-03-2012, 08:02 PM
Problem again next season is that 'they' seem to have taken on some new attractive ideas to maintain or maybe even increase their ST base.
An introduction of x amount of seats at £240, then another batch at £x amount and so on.
Clubs must realise that they need to give either tangible benefits to renew and renew early or as I've said before just do away with this renewal crap every season and make it a monthly DD with a membership card.

matty_f
20-03-2012, 08:05 PM
Problem again next season is that 'they' seem to have taken on some new attractive ideas to maintain or maybe even increase their ST base.
An introduction of x amount of seats at £240, then another batch at £x amount and so on.
Clubs must realise that they need to give either tangible benefits to renew and renew early or as I've said before just do away with this renewal crap every season and make it a monthly DD with a membership card.

I agree with that as well. The club's proposition has been poorly thought through and the prices are out of line with other, better performing teams.

The 12 month idea is brilliant, i'd sign up to that in a heartbeat.

BT58
20-03-2012, 08:15 PM
So whats wrong with asking for a reduction to say £300
Jeez if my and probably a lot of others could afford the £400
we would buy seasons!!!!
Jeezo,,,,, supported this mob for nigh on 40 years
Certainly no glory hunter,,,
And aye matty,, i will support them for evermore
Just that i will be going to games that i can afford to go to

Gatecrasher
20-03-2012, 08:29 PM
It's f****** heartbreaking that on a hibs fans' forum the dissenting voice is the one asking folk to back the club by getting a season ticket.

For the most part, we get the team we deserve. Take away the hardcore who undoubtedly deserve better and we're left with thousands who want better but are actively arguing against giving Fenlon the funds to improve the team.

Look forward to this time next year when we sit in a sparsely populated stadium watching another hapless performance in another relegation battle and everyone can tell us how right they were to not get a season ticket.

We'll support you evermore. Aye, f****** right.

100% spot on matty

The_Todd
20-03-2012, 09:00 PM
For the most part, we get the team we deserve. Take away the hardcore who undoubtedly deserve better and we're left with thousands who want better but are actively arguing against giving Fenlon the funds to improve the team.


I just cannot agree. If you can say "Aye, £400 is a smashing deal and I can afford it no questions asked" then fair enough and good luck to anyone who can. I cannot. Money doesn't grow on trees (though I accept notes are made of trees :wink:) and I'd dearly love to just stump up that cash. But we get the team we deserve? It skips the part where Motherwell, St Johnstone, Hearts, Dundee Utd, Kilmarnock have lower ST prices and (except Hearts) less ST holders but each of them have better teams.

I'd dearly love a ST next season, no matter how crap we are. I just can't equate £405 for one as a good use of money, and in such turbulent financial times nor can many people.

In summary, nobody's saying "My aim is to give PF less cash", I think they're saying "OK, he needs cash - but let's be realistic here - how can these other, mostly smaller clubs, make less go further?"

GreenCastle
20-03-2012, 09:07 PM
It's f****** heartbreaking that on a hibs fans' forum the dissenting voice is the one asking folk to back the club by getting a season ticket.

For the most part, we get the team we deserve. Take away the hardcore who undoubtedly deserve better and we're left with thousands who want better but are actively arguing against giving Fenlon the funds to improve the team.

Look forward to this time next year when we sit in a sparsely populated stadium watching another hapless performance in another relegation battle and everyone can tell us how right they were to not get a season ticket.

We'll support you evermore. Aye, f****** right.

I think that statement about we get the team we deserve is wrong - the fans deserve better simple :agree: Many other clubs in our position wouldn't get the fans through the gate.

Many have given the funds over the last few years and stood up and been counted but with not much back.

A few things can be taken from this thread


300 pounds would have got more fans buying season tickets - maybe they could have done 300 for an unreserved seat (so might be a different place each game, but same stand). 350 for the same seat each game.
A direct debit mentioned - like a gym - paying monthly is a great idea - you can stop any time you want if your circumstances change.
The club should have consulted the fans before prices were advertised to gauge opinion - what harm would a bit of market research done?
The club need to work really hard in future to get season ticket holders and walk up fans back in the ground and give them a better match day experience - I've still heard nothing about the awful food and rip off prices people are expected to pay every week.

We were in the same situation this time last year - trying to avoid relegation and playing poor - what has the club done since then to change things ? - the stadium was still half empty then also.

TornadoHibby
20-03-2012, 09:10 PM
Because denying the club money is counter productive.

We're not going to agree on this. You think people should stay away if things are bad, I think people should muck in and help.

I never said that at any time! What I have said is that the fans need to see that the Club is taking full responsibility for the poor decision making on the part of its Board which has brought us to where we currently are! So far that has not happened! :confused:

Sorry if I'm repeating myself Mikey but I don't think that it's appropriate for those that received, and then mis-managed, the last few years ST cash and sold our best talent without replacing the quality or potential quality sold should not dip their hands into the corporate cash to rectify their mistakes! It's great that we have a new completed stadium with a larger capacity than Hibs needs and, by all accounts, a superb training centre but what are these worth if we can't put on a show each match day to warrant that expenditure!? :confused:

Making wrong managerial and coaching appointments and reducing the quality of our playing squad has ultimately put us into a downward spiral in terms of performances and results and this has generated the poor match environment that has prevailed at ER for the last 2 or 3 years at least! :agree:

A corporate vehicle with an ability to raise cash from shareholders or capital markets but a "questionable" operating record over the previous few years would find it difficult to raise meaningful cash without demonstrable appropriate business and management change and favourable future prospects supported by proper due diligence! :agree:

Tyler Durden
20-03-2012, 09:16 PM
It's f****** heartbreaking that on a hibs fans' forum the dissenting voice is the one asking folk to back the club by getting a season ticket.

For the most part, we get the team we deserve. Take away the hardcore who undoubtedly deserve better and we're left with thousands who want better but are actively arguing against giving Fenlon the funds to improve the team.

Look forward to this time next year when we sit in a sparsely populated stadium watching another hapless performance in another relegation battle and everyone can tell us how right they were to not get a season ticket.

We'll support you evermore. Aye, f****** right.

I can't really see the logic in the "we get the team we deserve". Does that mean Celtic and Rangers fans are more deserving than us? To quote Unforgiven/The Wire "deserve ain't got nothin to with it".

I haven't really seen too many actively arguing against giving Fenlon funds either. Several people, including myself are saying we won't buy a season ticket but plan to attend as many games as we can. If we join the number who have drifted away, then Petrie and co have no-one to blame but themselves. Their ill thought out strategy in retaining ST holders will be the root cause of reduced upfront revenue. Have the board actually done any analysis to support this strategy? Their weak responses (or lack thereof) to perfectly simple questions don't reflect very well.

There has to be some kind of strategy to get more out of our budget in any case as this board have proved on a regular basis that there's not a direct correlation between budget and league position/performance. If they bothered to properly engage with fans and share something genuine to invest cash/support in then they'd get more response. Instead we get trite platitudes such as "together we're stronger" etc.

Andy74 has said we've only got 7 or 8,000 hardcore. So in a few years if it's 5 or 6,000 will that be because, actually those other few thousand didn't care either. Only 5 or 6,000 are really hardcore? There comes a time when you have to question the leadership of an organisation and exert what little control we as individuals have.

It's not exactly Viva le revolution from me mind, all I'm saying is I'll PATG and save myself £50 over paying for a ST up front.

StevieC
20-03-2012, 09:34 PM
Pricing has been shown to not actually have that much of an impact.

I disagree, certainly from my perspective. I've seen 2 "price freezes" and both times the cost of my season tickets has increased!

This seasons "price freeze", that saw my laddies season ticket cost increase, had me swithering about renewing. I was swayed in the end by the free top up and the interest free payments.

Next season's "price freeze", that will cost me more again, just isn't enough for me to consider paying up front.

Beefster
20-03-2012, 09:35 PM
I agree with that as well. The club's proposition has been poorly thought through and the prices are out of line with other, better performing teams.

The 12 month idea is brilliant, i'd sign up to that in a heartbeat.

So, the ST proposition is mince and over-priced but everyone should renew regardless?

Baldy Foghorn
20-03-2012, 09:47 PM
It's f****** heartbreaking that on a hibs fans' forum the dissenting voice is the one asking folk to back the club by getting a season ticket.

For the most part, we get the team we deserve. Take away the hardcore who undoubtedly deserve better and we're left with thousands who want better but are actively arguing against giving Fenlon the funds to improve the team.

Look forward to this time next year when we sit in a sparsely populated stadium watching another hapless performance in another relegation battle and everyone can tell us how right they were to not get a season ticket.

We'll support you evermore. Aye, f****** right.

Have to agree, whilst I fully understand the cost impact for many, I have never understood people staying away because in their eyes we are "crap".....

Fergos
20-03-2012, 09:50 PM
Because denying the club money is counter productive.

We're not going to agree on this. You think people should stay away if things are bad, I think people should muck in and help.


100%.

Hibernian Forever.

down the slope
20-03-2012, 10:11 PM
Why spend all that money on a new stand if the board don't want you to walk up ?, if our ST numbers are down then we will be at the level of Motherwell and St johnstone, their level next year from a similar income will do nicely thank you !, so get on with it manager/board.

smurf
20-03-2012, 10:31 PM
If it's nothing to do with money, how come Celtic and Rangers are always way ahead of the pack?

Do you think Hibs would still be second bottom if we were getting 14,000+ through the gates every home game?

If your point of view stacked up with a season ticket base more than double that of Killie, St Mirren and St Johnstone then we wouldn't be behind them in the SPL table again...

smurf
20-03-2012, 10:40 PM
I agree with that as well. The club's proposition has been poorly thought through and the prices are out of line with other, better performing teams.

The 12 month idea is brilliant, i'd sign up to that in a heartbeat.

Agreed.

matty_f
20-03-2012, 11:04 PM
I think that statement about we get the team we deserve is wrong - the fans deserve better simple :agree: Many other clubs in our position wouldn't get the fans through the gate.

Many have given the funds over the last few years and stood up and been counted but with not much back.

A few things can be taken from this thread

300 pounds would have got more fans buying season tickets - maybe they could have done 300 for an unreserved seat (so might be a different place each game, but same stand). 350 for the same seat each game.
A direct debit mentioned - like a gym - paying monthly is a great idea - you can stop any time you want if your circumstances change.
The club should have consulted the fans before prices were advertised to gauge opinion - what harm would a bit of market research done?
The club need to work really hard in future to get season ticket holders and walk up fans back in the ground and give them a better match day experience - I've still heard nothing about the awful food and rip off prices people are expected to pay every week.
We were in the same situation this time last year - trying to avoid relegation and playing poor - what has the club done since then to change things ? - the stadium was still half empty then also.

Replace the manager and help Fenlon bring in a lot of new players.

Steve-O
21-03-2012, 10:16 AM
Replace the manager and help Fenlon bring in a lot of new players.

Just like they've done with every other failure over the last 10 years or so. Clearly, its not enough.

GreenCastle
21-03-2012, 02:41 PM
Replace the manager and help Fenlon bring in a lot of new players.

Did they have any choice ?

Getting back on topic - the general matchday experience needs to be improved and the basics like prices and food quality should be sorted ASAP. Prices won't be until over a years time if we are lucky...food - who knows ? But I don't know one person who think it's value for money and decent quality.