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View Full Version : Question If a newcoRangers are reinstated back into the SPL are you "Done" with scottish fitba



Green&White
08-03-2012, 09:39 AM
As it says on the tin. if they go Bye Bye and come back as a new team then are voted straight back into the SPL will you give up your filthy habbit and quit scottish football for good?

for me its a yes. as much as it would pain me to walk away from hibs what would be the point in going to see any team in such a slimey, fixed, out of date, pash poor league that are only interested in two teams. (suppose it wont have changed then eh :greengrin)

blackpoolhibs
08-03-2012, 09:48 AM
I cant vote yes as i would go to some games, but i'd certainly go less. My enthusiasm is at an all time low, and this would be another kick in the knackers.

If this was any other club bar the bigots or the smellies, they'd be in the 3rd division before you could say pop.

Pretty Boy
08-03-2012, 09:50 AM
Yes because it would prove once and for all that there is absolutely no real desire amongst clubs and organisations to change the status quo in Scottish football.

Andy74
08-03-2012, 09:52 AM
I'm ultimatley a Hibs fan and go to watch them whatever the opposition or league set up, so no, this wouldn't stop me going.

nonshinyfinish
08-03-2012, 09:53 AM
I'm ultimatley a Hibs fan and go to watch them whatever the opposition or league set up, so no, this wouldn't stop me going.

:agree:

I'd be incandescent with rage, but it wouldn't stop me watching Hibs.

johnrebus
08-03-2012, 09:56 AM
My first reaction is to say no , I won't be be back. But I'll qualify that by wanting to know exactly what the Hibernian position is. (not Petrie's opinion - ref. a couple of nights ago). If the club makes it clear they should not be immediately allowed back into the SPL, I'll back them 100%.


If Hibs want them back, I'm done.



:paranoid:

calumhibee1
08-03-2012, 09:56 AM
Nope. Nothing that happens at any other football club could ever stop me going to watch Hibs. I couldn't give two hoots about anyone else in Scottish football, what happens elsewhere is irrelevant. (I would of course like to see the Huns go bust but if they don't, so be it.)

blackpoolhibs
08-03-2012, 09:57 AM
My first reaction is to say no , I won't be be back. But I'll qualify that by wanting to know exactly what the Hibernian position is. (not Petrie's opinion - ref. a couple of nights ago). If the club makes it clear they should not be immediately allowed back into the SPL, I'll back them 100%.


If Hibs want them back, I'm done.



:paranoid:

:agree:

konte's one-two
08-03-2012, 09:59 AM
I'd still always support Hibs,
But I'm afraid my financial backing of them will no longer continue.


I would only ever ever ever, consider allowing a Newco back in on some pretty serious conditions

all money split fairly,
strict financial fair play (spend what you earn)
ongoing points penatly to Newco for minimum of 3 season

Twa Cairpets
08-03-2012, 10:00 AM
I would be done with senior football I think, for a while anyway. It would depends on Hibs stance to an extent, but I couldn't be done with fitba in total, so I voted no.

I'd go an watch juniors, get involved with amateurs, spend more time in kids football, something because football is fundamentally a magnificent sport.

Green Man
08-03-2012, 10:54 AM
I've pretty much given up on Scottish football already. This season and last I've been to Easter Road once all season. I never watch Sportscene and only occasionally watch live games. I've been getting more and more disillusioned with the whole game up here for a few years. At the moment there's always the chance that I'll return at some point, but if Rangers effectively get away with cheating that chance will become a lot more remote.

HUTCHYHIBBY
08-03-2012, 10:58 AM
I go a lot less than I used to, but, this would probably be the final straw.

Onion
08-03-2012, 11:02 AM
In a word, yes.That would be the final straw for me an a lot of others. Then Sky TV and the media would have their dream with the only two left in the SPL being the Old Twins. They could play and kill each other every week

Onion
08-03-2012, 11:10 AM
I'm ultimatley a Hibs fan and go to watch them whatever the opposition or league set up, so no, this wouldn't stop me going.

Andy, if you knew for sure that'll all the refs were bent or receiving payments from the Old Firm would you STILL support Hibs and go to matches? The level of cheating that the Huns are being found guilty is in that order of magnitude.

kennyh
08-03-2012, 11:15 AM
This would not stop me watching Hibs BUT I would never watch any football involving NEWCO RFC even at home. This would cost Hibs of course but the message it would send out to the SPL / SFA media would be mind blowing if all stadiums were empty apart from the travelling fans.

Beefster
08-03-2012, 11:17 AM
My first reaction is to say no , I won't be be back. But I'll qualify that by wanting to know exactly what the Hibernian position is. (not Petrie's opinion - ref. a couple of nights ago). If the club makes it clear they should not be immediately allowed back into the SPL, I'll back them 100%.


If Hibs want them back, I'm done.



:paranoid:

Hibs don't benefit in any way by giving an opinion on a hypothetical situation. I'd imagine that Hibs wouldn't release any statement on their position until Rangers were to go into liquidation (if they do).

Andy74
08-03-2012, 11:23 AM
Andy, if you knew for sure that'll all the refs were bent or receiving payments from the Old Firm would you STILL support Hibs and go to matches? The level of cheating that the Huns are being found guilty is in that order of magnitude.

If Hibs are still there and playing then yes, anything else is cutting off your nose to spite your face. Hibs will still require support whatever happens.

Gatecrasher
08-03-2012, 11:26 AM
Its a no but not a hard no as i would have to at least think about where the league is heading. I certinaly wouldn't be happy about it thats for sure.

SurferRosa
08-03-2012, 11:45 AM
Yes because it would prove once and for all that there is absolutely no real desire amongst clubs and organisations to change the status quo in Scottish football.

There will be thousands of supporters from across the board who feel exactly the same but i`ll wager the SPL/SFA will take the gamble that most wont follow through with it.
The bottom line, i fear, is that Der Hun and SKY TV are so much more important to them than 10 football clubs, their supporters and the quality of Scottish Football....:no way:

Jim44
08-03-2012, 11:49 AM
My first reaction is to say no , I won't be be back. But I'll qualify that by wanting to know exactly what the Hibernian position is. (not Petrie's opinion - ref. a couple of nights ago). If the club makes it clear they should not be immediately allowed back into the SPL, I'll back them 100%.


If Hibs want them back, I'm done.



:paranoid:

Hibs' position on this if far from clear. What Petrie said a few nights ago seemed to be taken by most on here that Hibs were against Rangers return to the SPL should it come to that. Certainly Petrie made noises that alluded to that but I think he was really paying lip service to principles and attitudes which, in an ideal world, should apply. In reality I wouldn't be surprised if he wanted to retain the 'advantages of having a strong Old Firm.'

johnrebus
08-03-2012, 11:54 AM
Hibs don't benefit in any way by giving an opinion on a hypothetical situation. I'd imagine that Hibs wouldn't release any statement on their position until Rangers were to go into liquidation (if they do).


Thats exactly what I said. I wouldn't base any decision on Petrie's opinion, but will wait till it happens and I know which way Hibs have voted.


For the purpose of 'Clarity'. (or Clarty in Rangers case). If, when the time comes, Hibs support a direct return by a club called Rangers to the SPL, I will not be back.


:aok:

Hibercelona
08-03-2012, 12:27 PM
I really can't see them being voted straight back into the SPL. Theres a fair few clubs who don't "need" them in the league to stay safely afloat.

If we did vote to keep them in though, i'd be outraged.

Brummie_Hibs
08-03-2012, 12:30 PM
Voted YES, but I would still follow Scotland.

CraigK
08-03-2012, 12:33 PM
Voted no as i would continue to support Hibs, however, would maybe boycott games against rangers.

Killiehibbie
08-03-2012, 12:40 PM
Thats exactly what I said. I wouldn't base any decision on Petrie's opinion, but will wait till it happens and I know which way Hibs have voted.


For the purpose of 'Clarity'. (or Clarty in Rangers case). If, when the time comes, Hibs support a direct return by a club called Rangers to the SPL, I will not be back.


:aok: My sentiments exactly.

Wakeyhibee
08-03-2012, 12:43 PM
If they do go into liquidation & get demoted then no doubt all clubs bar a couple will vote for 1 league of 44 with everyone playing each other once

MCameron
08-03-2012, 01:01 PM
There will be thousands of supporters from across the board who feel exactly the same but i`ll wager the SPL/SFA will take the gamble that most wont follow through with it.
The bottom line, i fear, is that Der Hun and SKY TV are so much more important to them than 10 football clubs, their supporters and the quality of Scottish Football....:no way:

I suspect, unfortunately, that you might be right Ross but surely there must be so means by which fans of other teams can let the SPL/SFA know how strongly they feel about this ridiculaous situation (as it sure as **** isn't being represented that way in the media).

Ritchie
08-03-2012, 01:25 PM
i'm done regardless.

SPL is a joke.

PeeJay
08-03-2012, 01:26 PM
The answer has to be yes. A team that blatantly flouts the laws of the governing bodies to the extent that this club has done - a club that also has a huge tax evasion matter hanging over its head cannot simply have a few points deducted and return to business as usual.

What would this indicate?

a) the laws of the governing bodies mean nothing
b) the non OF clubs in the SPL, in particular, and Scotland in general mean nothing
c) the fans of all the clubs outwith the RFC mean nothing

Non OF fans and clubs would then practically condone a situation in which they are nothing but "extras" in the money-making sham for the TV companies and the OF...

How the other clubs in Scotland or any self-respecting fan could simply accept that state of affairs would be beyond me ... surely this is the time to stand up and be counted?

Phil MaGlass
08-03-2012, 01:35 PM
Fans need to start demonstrating at grounds,

Cheshire Hibee
08-03-2012, 01:44 PM
As it says on the tin. if they go Bye Bye and come back as a new team then are voted straight back into the SPL will you give up your filthy habbit and quit scottish football for good?

for me its a yes. as much as it would pain me to walk away from hibs what would be the point in going to see any team in such a slimey, fixed, out of date, pash poor league that are only interested in two teams. (suppose it wont have changed then eh :greengrin)

See the thread I started yesterday regarding a website my son is doing regarding this so that fans from all clubs can have their say

If you go to the thread it will give you an idea of the specific questions we are going to ask supporters to give feedback on then if the response id big enough the intention is to email a link to every SPL/SFL club as well as mainstream broadcasters to show the depth of felling from supporters across Scotland.

http://www.hibs.net/showthread.php?230172-Fans-survey-website-Re-Rangers-liquidation

PeeKay
08-03-2012, 02:13 PM
For the past few seasons there has been a huge effort by the Board at Hibs to live within our means. I have supported this fully, because I never want to a return to the Mercer days when Hibs were on their knees financially, but it cannot be denied that this financial stability has come at the cost of a serious lack of quality on the pitch. If Rangers are allowed to come out of all of this debacle debt free, and continue with business as usual, then the stand taken by Hibs for all of these years will be rendered worthless and I will feel that we, as long suffers supporters, have been sold a lie. So, although the mess that the SPL might degenerate into is not the fault of Hibs, I will feel quite sore at all the suffering that we have endured for no purpose.
That said I don't think that when the chips were down I could boycott Hibs - so I voted "no".

cad
08-03-2012, 02:19 PM
If a no vote means a few things change and they carry on in some way shape or form , sad ****** sad ,follow the Hibs but for **** sake dont allow generations in the future to look back and say that we had them there why didnt we do something .

As I see it, we keep hearing and putting up with the *****, the songs, theyre fans etc ,Sky 11.30 kick offs on a Sunday ,and the pishy TV deal we`ve got for ourselves but the teams not very good now ,
Thats seems a deal right enough , after all the sacrifice that we have went through cant believe you want these cants anywhere near Scottish football .:no way:

Vini1875
08-03-2012, 02:19 PM
My first reaction is to say no , I won't be be back. But I'll qualify that by wanting to know exactly what the Hibernian position is. (not Petrie's opinion - ref. a couple of nights ago). If the club makes it clear they should not be immediately allowed back into the SPL, I'll back them 100%.


If Hibs want them back, I'm done.



:paranoid:

I want ibs to vote against letting them back in. I expect they will get back in, but I really hope ibs vote against them doing so. We don't need them. The only way we are going to see a fairer league is to have the voting system over haled and that won't happen while celtc and the huns stand together.

Hibercelona
08-03-2012, 02:19 PM
The answer has to be yes. A team that blatantly flouts the laws of the governing bodies to the extent that this club has done - a club that also has a huge tax evasion matter hanging over its head cannot simply have a few points deducted and return to business as usual.

What would this indicate?

a) the laws of the governing bodies mean nothing
b) the non OF clubs in the SPL, in particular, and Scotland in general mean nothing
c) the fans of all the clubs outwith the RFC mean nothing

Non OF fans and clubs would then practically condone a situation in which they are nothing but "extras" in the money-making sham for the TV companies and the OF...

How the other clubs in Scotland or any self-respecting fan could simply accept that state of affairs would be beyond me ... surely this is the time to stand up and be counted?



:top marks

Unfortunately theres nothing we can do. Its well noted that everybody outwith the OF hates them with a passion, yet the media makes it out that we're somewhat "terrified" over the current situation and that we all want them to walk straight back into the SPL again.

The only alternative would be for clubs to tell the SPL to "shove it" and to agree upon a new fairplay league, but i'm not sure how this would work.

Hibernia&Alba
08-03-2012, 02:22 PM
I voted no. If the SPL rules are applied to Rangers as they would any other liquidated club, and tough punishment follows, then I'm not giving up the game for the sake of the Huns. If the rules were changed for the benefit of the newco, then that's another matter.

Green&White
08-03-2012, 02:28 PM
I voted no. If the SPL rules are applied to Rangers as they would any other liquidated club, and tough punishment follows, then I'm not giving up the game for the sake of the Huns. If the rules were changed for the benefit of the newco, then that's another matter.

that is the matter of the poll tho :confused:

Saorsa
08-03-2012, 02:33 PM
If they get back in, I'm out, done, finished. It will be the final straw for me with those who run Scottish fitba. That dispicable club have cheated their way tae titles, cups, Euro qualification and they've done it by stealing other peoples money. It will make a complete mockery of the game in this country and it's bad enough already. It will also make a mockery of those clubs (and their fans) that try tae live within their means and suffer for it.

Dashing Bob S
08-03-2012, 02:39 PM
Yes because it would prove once and for all that there is absolutely no real desire amongst clubs and organisations to change the status quo in Scottish football.

This is the crux of it for me. The administrators of Scottish football have to demonstrate that they are in favor of an open, competitive football league, without clubs getting a leg-up through sectarianism or financial corruption, and that they are prepared not to be dictated to by multinational TV companies who don't give a toss about the impact on Scottish football or society in general.

There will always be bigoted huns and a football club to service them, and the hard-done-by professional victims who have the symbiotic relationship with them. All we can hope is that the football authorities have the balls to put them in their proper place. Unfortunately, the media campaign of pro-hun pomp and circumstance suggests that they will need to show a bigger set than they've hitherto displayed.

So yes, i'll have emotionally given up. I'll still go and see Hibs on occasion, but mainly to keep in touch with the dwindling band of friends who will attend. It's no fun when the authorities publicly announce that your club (all except two) are hamstrung and just there to make up the numbers. I'll probably fly out half-a-dozen times a season to watch Barca.

I think a lot of people will look to European football, or, as in Ireland, the English game, and we'll be left with a league of two clubs playing each other in a vile pantomime of hatred around eight or ten times a year, perhaps with half-a-dozen part-time clubs making up the numbers on a fixture card. Of course, the Rantic crowds will then eventually drift to 10,000 bigots on each side screaming at each other when everybody else gets excited about Man City and Real Madrid. The future of Scottish football as delivered to us on a plate by those responsible for looking after it.

DH1875
08-03-2012, 02:44 PM
I've no voted as I honestly don't know. Look I'll always love Hibs and be a Hibby but depending on our stance and any sanctions put in place I might give in. Put it this way, if we welcome them back open armed and they get off scot free with NO debt and NO points deductions and the lions share of the TV money I doubt I'll be back.

Hibernia&Alba
08-03-2012, 02:55 PM
that is the matter of the poll tho :confused:

Perhaps I've misunderstood the question C&W. As I understand it, the SPL rules say the newco of a club post-liquidation club can be re-admitted to the SPL if agreed by the SPL board. This applies to all clubs. If a Hun newco was re-admitted by that process, I'm ok with it, provided there are sanctions for their conduct. Their re-emergence as if nothing had happened would be totally unacceptable. I understand some people are opposed to re-admittance on principle, but if that's the rule, I'll go with it, on condition there is no special exception made to any rules for Rangers.

Phil MaGlass
08-03-2012, 03:07 PM
This is the crux of it for me. The administrators of Scottish football have to demonstrate that they are in favor of an open, competitive football league, without clubs getting a leg-up through sectarianism or financial corruption, and that they are prepared not to be dictated to by multinational TV companies who don't give a toss about the impact on Scottish football or society in general.

There will always be bigoted huns and a football club to service them, and the hard-done-by professional victims who have the symbiotic relationship with them. All we can hope is that the football authorities have the balls to put them in their proper place. Unfortunately, the media campaign of pro-hun pomp and circumstance suggests that they will need to show a bigger set than they've hitherto displayed.

So yes, i'll have emotionally given up. I'll still go and see Hibs on occasion, but mainly to keep in touch with the dwindling band of friends who will attend. It's no fun when the authorities publicly announce that your club (all except two) are hamstrung and just there to make up the numbers. I'll probably fly out half-a-dozen times a season to watch Barca.

I think a lot of people will look to European football, or, as in Ireland, the English game, and we'll be left with a league of two clubs playing each other in a vile pantomime of hatred around eight or ten times a year, perhaps with half-a-dozen part-time clubs making up the numbers on a fixture card. Of course, the Rantic crowds will then eventually drift to 10,000 bigots on each side screaming at each other when everybody else gets excited about Man City and Real Madrid. The future of Scottish football as delivered to us on a plate by those responsible for looking after it.


cant do anything but agree with all of this, especially about only going to Hibs games on occasion, its coming to crunch time in Scottish fitba, supporters of all clubs have to stand up and be counted and let their owners/ chairmen know that letting the hun back into the game is not on, the structure has to be changed the voting structure has to be changed and what is left over from any tv revenue is EQUALLY split among the other clubs.
NOW, HONESTLY IS THE TIME FOR CHANGE AND PROTEST we may never have this opportunity again.

Keith_M
08-03-2012, 04:51 PM
Can you add a "Not sure, it depends on the sanctions invoked" option? I wouldn't vore for it but it should maybe be there.


What I'd like to see is two new clubs forming in their place.

One that announces it wants nothing to do with sectarianism and will eject and ban any fan involved in such behaviour and, in fact, if the number of people doing so is too large to eject, they will stop the game and allow a 3-0 win to the other side. They'll actively discourage anything that even hints at sectarianism, such as KB flags, Orange Scarves, etc, and will refuse to pander to promotion of a Unionist, divisive, "Land of Hope and Glory" attitude. They will be proud to be nothing more than an all-inclusive football club.

The other will just be "New Rangers", and let people do and sing what they like.

That way, we'll find out just how many "decent, ordinary, non-bigoted, just-like-you-and-me" Rangers fans there actually are.

cad
08-03-2012, 04:55 PM
If they get back in, I'm out, done, finished. It will be the final straw for me with those who run Scottish fitba. That dispicable club have cheated their way tae titles, cups, Euro qualification and they've done it by stealing other peoples money. It will make a complete mockery of the game in this country and it's bad enough already. It will also make a mockery of those clubs (and their fans) that try tae live within their means and suffer for it.




:agree::agree::agree::agree::agree::agree:

Green&White
08-03-2012, 05:14 PM
Can you add a "Not sure, it depends on the sanctions invoked" option? I wouldn't vore for it but it should maybe be there.


yeh that would have been a better idea. i didnt think about it untill every started mentioning it and im not sure how to change the poll if you even can tbh.

Hibrandenburg
08-03-2012, 06:45 PM
Rangers have had a massive financial advantage for decades now. Yet this was not enough for them, they had to go even further and increase this massive advantage by making illegal payments to their players paid by with money from dodgy sources.

Together with Celtic they've insured that they get the lions share of the TV money and thus denying the other teams valuable resources to strengthen their clubs and indeed using this superior buying power to lure players away from those other clubs and in doing so weakening them further. To cap all this off they then have the nerve to blame the lack of competition in Scotland for their continued failure in Europe.

Add to this their vile followers who spread their bigoted hatred throughout Scotland and even far beyond our borders bringing international shame on our national sport.

If the punishment dealt out to Rangers by the SPL,SFA,SFL is then inadequate, then our game is not only dominated by cheats and bigots but also governed by corruption and I will want nothing more to do with it never mind help finance it.

Eyrie
08-03-2012, 06:46 PM
I'll be a Hibs fan for as long as there is a Hibs, so whilst I'll be seriously hacked off if the Huns get straight back in, and even more so if Hibs vote to let it happen, I'll still follow us.

NAE NOOKIE
08-03-2012, 06:54 PM
I cant see myself ever giving up on Hibs as a result of new rangers or whatever getting back into the SPL but I would be happy to boycott any visit by them to ER.

The Italians were brave enough to demote a couple of huge clubs a few years back and we should do the same with the current buns. Chick young can go on all he likes about the rules not allowing a team from the SPL to be demoted to the SFL. But the two bodies are linked by promotion and relegation, so the rules can and should be changed to allow this IMO.

Or ...... A compromise could be to bring in SPL 1 and SPL 2, that way you could demote the new current buns to SPL2 with a big enough points deduction to ensure that they have no chance of promotion in their first season.

What cant happen is nothing .... I dont go on to other clubs boards, but I am willing to bet that the strength of feeling on Aberdeen or Dundee Utd or Killie boards is the same as it is on this one and if the SPL / SFA / SFL choose to ignore that over fear of losing a flawed TV deal or revenue from away fans they are more blinkered and incredibly stupid than even I give them credit for.

As many people are saying ..... this is not about money, its about integrity.

Neil Doncaster I think it was, was on about losing £20,000,000 from the game if we change certain things that the fans want. Without giving any clue as to where that figure came from of course.

If every SPL club bar rangers loses 1,000 fans over this ( rangers not being demoted ) then going by the adult ST price at Hibs ( £400 ) that would come to £4,400,000 every season .... for ever.

SloopJB
08-03-2012, 06:59 PM
I voted yes.
I'd buy a season ticket for knockhill and forget football altogether.

snooky
08-03-2012, 07:20 PM
If RFC come through this fiasco via Loophole Lane then the gemme's a bogie for me.

NAE NOOKIE
08-03-2012, 07:20 PM
Just had a thought.

If nothing is done would it be fair to say that not all of Mad Vlad Romanov's utterings about mafia's and the like in Scottish football were wide of the mark.


:greengrin

Stonewall
08-03-2012, 07:22 PM
Rangers have had a massive financial advantage for decades now. Yet this was not enough for them, they had to go even further and increase this massive advantage by making illegal payments to their players paid by with money from dodgy sources.

Together with Celtic they've insured that they get the lions share of the TV money and thus denying the other teams valuable resources to strengthen their clubs and indeed using this superior buying power to lure players away from those other clubs and in doing so weakening them further. To cap all this off they then have the nerve to blame the lack of competition in Scotland for their continued failure in Europe.

Add to this their vile followers who spread their bigoted hatred throughout Scotland and even far beyond our borders bringing international shame on our national sport.

If the punishment dealt out to Rangers by the SPL,SFA,SFL is then inadequate, then our game is not only dominated by cheats and bigots but also governed by corruption and I will want nothing more to do with it never mind help finance it.

Can I just add that they have consistantly expressed their desire to move to the EPL. Showing no loyalty to the other Scottish clubs they will expect automatic re-admission.

I would say I would find it hard to go back, unless the SPL clubs who are meeting tonight manage to screw enough concessions out of the OF to help level the playing field to make me reconsider.

Hibernia&Alba
08-03-2012, 07:27 PM
Rangers have had a massive financial advantage for decades now. Yet this was not enough for them, they had to go even further and increase this massive advantage by making illegal payments to their players paid by with money from dodgy sources.

Together with Celtic they've insured that they get the lions share of the TV money and thus denying the other teams valuable resources to strengthen their clubs and indeed using this superior buying power to lure players away from those other clubs and in doing so weakening them further. To cap all this off they then have the nerve to blame the lack of competition in Scotland for their continued failure in Europe.

Add to this their vile followers who spread their bigoted hatred throughout Scotland and even far beyond our borders bringing international shame on our national sport.

If the punishment dealt out to Rangers by the SPL,SFA,SFL is then inadequate, then our game is not only dominated by cheats and bigots but also governed by corruption and I will want nothing more to do with it never mind help finance it.

A very well argued post. If the SPL board vote does allow them back them back into the SPL, there must then be tough consequences as a deterrent to future mismanagement and cheating. And of course, the voting rules don't prevent every fan in the country letting their own club and the SPL know which way they believe the vote should go.

kaimendhibs
08-03-2012, 07:35 PM
I think it would be the final straw for me. I love hibs but cant see me paying 400 quid a year to watch football in a corrupt and utterley biased league. (yes, i know its always been like that but this would be rubbing our noses in it)

snooky
08-03-2012, 07:40 PM
Rangers have had a massive financial advantage for decades now. Yet this was not enough for them, they had to go even further and increase this massive advantage by making illegal payments to their players paid by with money from dodgy sources.

Together with Celtic they've insured that they get the lions share of the TV money and thus denying the other teams valuable resources to strengthen their clubs and indeed using this superior buying power to lure players away from those other clubs and in doing so weakening them further. To cap all this off they then have the nerve to blame the lack of competition in Scotland for their continued failure in Europe.

Add to this their vile followers who spread their bigoted hatred throughout Scotland and even far beyond our borders bringing international shame on our national sport.

If the punishment dealt out to Rangers by the SPL,SFA,SFL is then inadequate, then our game is not only dominated by cheats and bigots but also governed by corruption and I will want nothing more to do with it never mind help finance it.

This post should be display on every Sports Page in the Scottish Press as well as pinned on the doors SPL & SFA offices.
Spot on, Hiberlin. Well done :aok:

Saorsa
08-03-2012, 07:50 PM
Rangers have had a massive financial advantage for decades now. Yet this was not enough for them, they had to go even further and increase this massive advantage by making illegal payments to their players paid by with money from dodgy sources.

Together with Celtic they've insured that they get the lions share of the TV money and thus denying the other teams valuable resources to strengthen their clubs and indeed using this superior buying power to lure players away from those other clubs and in doing so weakening them further. To cap all this off they then have the nerve to blame the lack of competition in Scotland for their continued failure in Europe.

Add to this their vile followers who spread their bigoted hatred throughout Scotland and even far beyond our borders bringing international shame on our national sport.

If the punishment dealt out to Rangers by the SPL,SFA,SFL is then inadequate, then our game is not only dominated by cheats and bigots but also governed by corruption and I will want nothing more to do with it never mind help finance it.:top marks

PeterboroHibee
08-03-2012, 08:07 PM
Not as easy as a yes or no imo.

I would never turn my back on Hibs, but a reformed Rangers coming straight back into the SPL is a horrible thought. Scottish football is awful, we desperately need a change and this would be the perfect opportunity for those in charge to do so. But their motivation is questionable and we all know that there are only ever 2 clubs in Scotland who are considered. Too long have we suffered because of them, and we all know that if it was any of the non-OF clubs who went bust, we would have to start in the lower leagues.

What really annoys me is all this talk about how much we need them. Maybe they generate some cash but the negatives of Rangers far outweigh the positives imo, and I would be more than happy to see them gone. Being allowed back in would be nothing short of corruption in our game.

Paisley Hibby
08-03-2012, 08:08 PM
Rangers have had a massive financial advantage for decades now. Yet this was not enough for them, they had to go even further and increase this massive advantage by making illegal payments to their players paid by with money from dodgy sources.

Together with Celtic they've insured that they get the lions share of the TV money and thus denying the other teams valuable resources to strengthen their clubs and indeed using this superior buying power to lure players away from those other clubs and in doing so weakening them further. To cap all this off they then have the nerve to blame the lack of competition in Scotland for their continued failure in Europe.

Add to this their vile followers who spread their bigoted hatred throughout Scotland and even far beyond our borders bringing international shame on our national sport.

If the punishment dealt out to Rangers by the SPL,SFA,SFL is then inadequate, then our game is not only dominated by cheats and bigots but also governed by corruption and I will want nothing more to do with it never mind help finance it.

Brilliant post. However, we know how this will play out. No Rangers v Celtic will mean no TV deal. So, to paraphrase Burns, we will be bought and sold for Murdoch's gold.

hibsbollah
08-03-2012, 08:08 PM
I'll be a Hibs fan for as long as there is a Hibs, so whilst I'll be seriously hacked off if the Huns get straight back in, and even more so if Hibs vote to let it happen, I'll still follow us.

Me too.

easty
08-03-2012, 08:11 PM
Brilliant post. However, we know how this will play out. No Rangers v Celtic will mean no TV deal. So, to paraphrase Burns, we will be bought and sold for Murdoch's gold.

Celtic bang on about how many fans they have all over the world, so surely there will still be interest (though lesser) in showing the SPL on Sky?

Albion Hibs
08-03-2012, 08:15 PM
No it would not mean I am done with Scottish football. Most significantly as a hibs fan i wont stop supporting my team because of rangers. As for do I want to see them disappear, I am undecided to be honest. Losing them would mean losing potentially two games with a decent atmosphere at easter road with a sell out away end, replacing it with 500 fans from Falkirk etc tops. I would miss the away trip where one visit in 10 we get a result, but the three nil midweek win is not that distant in my memory, I cant see me getting as excited about beating a falkirk 3 nil.

Rangers will be paying for this for sometime, and at a heavy heavy price. I hope they do there time and they suffer. But I dont want to see them disappear.

As for what the board does I think anyone on here that thinks they want rid of them is mad. Rod can afford to miss out on 2 sell out away crowds in a season, no chance.

As for what we should be doing as a league, I think we should be binning off sky and taking back control of the fixtures, rather than being the EPL stop gap for something to show between fixtures. Celtic and Rangers are the only ones that benefit from the TV money, and celtic only take it because rangers do. A guy at my work said Celtic only get 2m a year from sky, for that all clubs in the league should tell them to do on. Getting so much football off tv and back to a saturday afternoon is the only way to get people back at the games, money into the clubs which will result in better players and a better standard on the pitch.

Kill off sky and kill off the EPL love and i see no reason why clubs in the country as a whole cant improve. I would get gutted if we did not use this chance to achieve something.

DCI Gene Hunt
08-03-2012, 08:18 PM
I shall count myself as "done" with the Scottish game if Rangers, in whatever form, are immediately allowed back into the SPL post-liquidity.

Firstly, I would consider such a move grossly unfair to all other clubs not just in the SPL but in the other leagues also who have been forced to work their way up the leagues from the bottom up, but for some failed club to merely waltz back in to the top flight would be a massive, massive slap in the coupon for all other clubs throughout the leagues.

Secondly, Rangers' mess is of their own doing, and they should 1) be punished accordingly as per the rules, 2) learn their lesson from it and 3) serve as an example to all others who might be tempted to go down the same path.

Thirdly, I want to explode this myth perpetrated by the Scottish media that we are all so concerned about Rangers. Let me say not as a Hibs fan but as a Scottish football fan, that I hold the same view as 85% of other people I know who support a wide variety of different clubs within the SPL; I am sick to death of the Old Firm. I hate the bias towards the OF in all areas of the game. I hate the cheating. I hate the bigotry. I hate the embarrassment they heap upon our game through the bigotry and the fact the game is so obviously biased. I hate the fact that due to such bias the same two teams have won the league every year since before I was born - not a sign of success, but a sign of severe malaise in our game. I also hate the constant fawning over the whole Rangers saga by the media as if it is some sort of major life-threatening disaster affecting us all.

As far as I am concerned the only negative so far to come out of the whole Rangers saga is that Celtic are not also in the same position.

What a sorry state our game is in.

poolman
08-03-2012, 08:31 PM
I really can't see them being voted straight back into the SPL. Theres a fair few clubs who don't "need" them in the league to stay safely afloat.

If we did vote to keep them in though, i'd be outraged.


:agree: IMO there will be a Rangers club at some point after all this debacle

But, there will have to be severe, and I mean severe penaltys given out to this club the way that they have been running ( probably illegal in so many ways ) the club

When I mean severe, I mean severe, they cant just come back to the SPL, I dont give a **** about Sky money and that they must be guaranteed 4 old firm games a season.

Rangers MUST be severly punished, I have absolutely no sympathy for them, their fans, their players or anybody connected to this vile bunch of bigoted morons

Big House my erchy

http://i44.tinypic.com/2j61yfl.jpg

O'Rourke3
08-03-2012, 08:37 PM
No vote from me.

Albion Hibs has the post closest to the things I think might happen.

SPL rules currenly allow a veto if the vote isn't 11-1. Rangers oot for a short spell makes changing the rules to a simple majority very simple. Then there's no threat of a Celtic Rangers cabal picking up the ball and leaving. This has to be a good thing.
Celtic without Rangers will dominate but cannot control the SPL so share of whatever sponsorship going will be better. Rejection of a TV deal possible. Rules changes like wage caps, income over expenditure etc far more possible. The Hearts and Rangers situation demands more finacial oversight. Again, no bad thing. The ones that complain generally have something to hide.

Now my controversial bit. I think they'll end up back in the SPL because there is nowhere else to put them if they continue in Scotland. 3rd 2nd and 1st divisions can't cope with their crowds or the cost of policing them. Some of these grounds are deperate so there is crowd safety to consider - home team not the manks that follow Rangers - So unfortunatly there may be nowhere else. That will be construed as bending over and pandering, but it's actually a grown up decision. One I'm not happy with but the thought that the once dominant force of wills that was R & C brought to heel will feel good especially with our foot held firmly in their throats.

Meanwhile I want to see dawn raids and arrests and people in jail. I want missing taxes paid and their smaller suppliers compensated properly. I want to see old fashioned punishment......

calmac12000
08-03-2012, 09:03 PM
I've got to say if that scenario came to pass, whilst not stopping to support my team it would be a case of fundamentally undermining what little sporting integrity the SPL has left. They've been cheating not just in Murray's reign, but for donkeys years. if the Rangers glee club that is the Scottish media win the day it'll be a long time before I go to another Scottish game. If the SFL/SFA choose to blatantly disregard the views of most non-Rangers supporters in this country does that not say something about where their loyalties lie.

MCameron
08-03-2012, 09:20 PM
Not seen a thread in a while from the EEN where they're looking for our views on a current topic.

Surely if there was ever something they should be picking up on and reporting it's the feeling of the significant majority of fans on here on the huns situation, no?

Jack
08-03-2012, 09:22 PM
I think to be part of anything you have to believe in the honesty and integrity of what you follow, the ethos that guides it.

I know the OF have been at the top for a long time. I've always accepted that this has been on the back of bigger crowds buying better players, swaying referees, the lions share of the media going with the bigger numbers. They are big of that there is no doubt.

The current bun situation is cheating on a massive scale though. If our football authority brushed all this to the side I would see this as corrupt and unfair competition being condoned at the highest level of our sport and for that reason I would no longer be prepared to contribute as I do now even if it's to the only gentleman in the club.

Two or three times a year maybe and obviously Hampden.

Onion
08-03-2012, 09:28 PM
A very well argued post. If the SPL board vote does allow them back them back into the SPL, there must then be tough consequences as a deterrent to future mismanagement and cheating. And of course, the voting rules don't prevent every fan in the country letting their own club and the SPL know which way they believe the vote should go.

This sorry mess is a damning indictment of the football authorities in Scotland. Not only have they failed to uphold their own rules, but they actually appointed one of the main perpetraitors to Chair of the SFA (allegedly). They FAILED to run proper due diligence on Whyte, and NOW stating he is not fit and proper to run a club WTF ???? The Huns have bee running double contracts on players for YEARS yet no one at the SFA/SPL knew anything about it ??? Yeh right !!!

The SFA & SPL need to WAKE up and toe the line, to the tune of the majority 10 in the SPL. My advice to the 10 is, if they have no confidence in the SFA and/or SPl to do the right and proper thing for the game and majority of clubs in Scotland THEN KICK THEM OUT ! Simple as that.

I agree that ensuring clubs toe the line in future is important. However, justice also dictates that those who have systematically abused their position in the way the Huns have must be severely PUNISHED - punitive damages. If that means that the Huns can never recover and their fans dwindle away back under the rocks that they came from, so be it. We're all better off without them.

erskine-hibby
08-03-2012, 09:35 PM
I voted no because I ultimately support Hibs.
I would, though, expect Hibs to fight for them to be at least relegated, if not start from div 3. If that were not the case then it would show me that Hibs were not acting upon the fans wishes and then I would have to re-evaluate the situation then.

Hibs Class
08-03-2012, 09:38 PM
Thats exactly what I said. I wouldn't base any decision on Petrie's opinion, but will wait till it happens and I know which way Hibs have voted.


For the purpose of 'Clarity'. (or Clarty in Rangers case). If, when the time comes, Hibs support a direct return by a club called Rangers to the SPL, I will not be back.


:aok:


Sums it up for me.

The_Todd
08-03-2012, 10:05 PM
Words will fail to describe just how angry I would be with Scottish football if Rangers are returned to the SPL next season unscathed. Spitting feathers doesn't even come close. It's bad enough that every title and cup they've won in the last 20 years or so is tainted has been won under false pretenses it'll mean they can continue to dominate so still profiting from years of cheating. Let's face it, the fanbase they've built up during and after the Souness era is thanks largely to the unmatched successes they've had. If they'd spent what they could actually afford and won what they could afford to win then there would be no 50,000 in Ibrox every week.

Sorry, but if Rangers are allowed to cheat their way to the top and are then given the tacit approval by our spineless governing bodies then I'm out. What's the point in following a club like Hibs if the SPL more or less announce "yes, but as long as Rangers get their way who cares about you?".

I'd probably find my way to Meadowbank to watch some East of Scotland league, or switch entirely to ice hockey.

DH1875
08-03-2012, 11:43 PM
Brilliant post. However, we know how this will play out. No Rangers v Celtic will mean no TV deal. So, to paraphrase Burns, we will be bought and sold for Murdoch's gold.

See I don't get this arguement. What happens if they get back in but finish bottom 6? Would we just scrap it all so sky could get their 4 games.

CFC
09-03-2012, 08:29 AM
This is a great post peejay. What would be the point in watching a sporting competition where the dice are so heaviy loaded in favour of two teams over all the others? The SPL would have the authenticity of American professional wrestling (WWE).

No point in watching a farce.


The answer has to be yes. A team that blatantly flouts the laws of the governing bodies to the extent that this club has done - a club that also has a huge tax evasion matter hanging over its head cannot simply have a few points deducted and return to business as usual.
What would this indicate?
a) the laws of the governing bodies mean nothing
b) the non OF clubs in the SPL, in particular, and Scotland in general mean nothing
c) the fans of all the clubs outwith the RFC mean nothing
Non OF fans and clubs would then practically condone a situation in which they are nothing but "extras" in the money-making sham for the TV companies and the OF...
How the other clubs in Scotland or any self-respecting fan could simply accept that state of affairs would be beyond me ... surely this is

the time to stand up and be counted?

Kato
09-03-2012, 09:06 AM
Just had a thought.

If nothing is done would it be fair to say that not all of Mad Vlad Romanov's utterings about mafia's and the like in Scottish football were wide of the mark.


:greengrin

Never thought they were ever wide of the mark. The way he puts the message accross may be crazy but the message has always been on the button.

Kato
09-03-2012, 09:11 AM
Me too.

Me three. Got fed up with Scottish Football 30 years ago but have always supported my club. Wouldn't stop now.

jgl07
09-03-2012, 10:55 AM
I am now coming around to the view that if there is a Rangers in the SPL next season, I will not be there. If this arises through CVA. Liquidation and reformation or any other means. If the SPL do not at least dock Rangers sufficient points to relegate them I will have had enough.

They have lied and cheated for years. Their investors have been conned, they have fiddled taxes to pay for players they could not afford to win numerous championships and cups over the past twenty years. They have blackened the image of Scottish Football throughout Europe.

If they are allowed to get away with paying 10 pence in the pound and come away unscathed it is an indictment on the whole corrupt sideshow that Scottish Football has become.

Hibrandenburg
09-03-2012, 03:22 PM
This is a great post peejay. What would be the point in watching a sporting competition where the dice are so heaviy loaded in favour of two teams over all the others? The SPL would have the authenticity of American professional wrestling (WWE).

No point in watching a farce.
I really do like that comparison with American Wrestling, it summarises my feelings on this situation quite well.

Spike Mandela
09-03-2012, 04:01 PM
In truth I fell out of love with football many years ago but continued with season ticket, supporters bus etc because "that is what I do on a Saturday"

However, supporting a club which lives, relatively, within it's means I have watched some absolutely dreadful stuff culminating in this year where I feel I haven't seen one single decent game at ER.

I was already considering not renewing season ticket and just taking in the occasional game but as Rangers wriggle out of debt after debt and it becomes almost inevitable that Rangers will come out of this situation stronger than ever my disillusionment has hit new heights.

What is the point in supporting a team that does business in a sensible fashion? The OF already have all the chips stacked in their favour but should their financial gambles go wrong everything is done for them to limit any damage and all financial loopholes are sanctioned.

It is an absolutely futile hobby supporting a non OF team in the SPL and with every fresh announcement Scottish football dies a little bit more. The game is over, at least for me.

WhileTheChief..
09-03-2012, 06:15 PM
Give up on Hibs because of something Rangers have done?? Nah, not for me.

It looks like there will be a lot less Hibs fans next season though as Rangers (in some form) will be in the SPL next year despite all our hopes.

Really, if you think about it, it will be no change to this year and yet we all still go and support Hibs so what will have changed? Yes, we can confirm that they are cheatin' bassas etc but folk have been saying that for years and it hasn't stopped us going to games.

Roll on next season to a Rangers team spending approx the same as us on players, losing week after week and watching their fans disapear in droves will make up for any feeling of disappointment at their survival!

fat freddy
09-03-2012, 06:22 PM
hibs til i die....rangers have always cheated, its just a bigger cheat they're doing this time....just makes it sweeter when we beat them.

SloopJB
09-03-2012, 06:26 PM
Give up on Hibs because of something Rangers have done?? Nah, not for me.

It looks like there will be a lot less Hibs fans next season though as Rangers (in some form) will be in the SPL next year despite all our hopes.

Really, if you think about it, it will be no change to this year and yet we all still go and support Hibs so what will have changed? Yes, we can confirm that they are cheatin' bassas etc but folk have been saying that for years and it hasn't stopped us going to games.

Roll on next season to a Rangers team spending approx the same as us on players, losing week after week and watching their fans disapear in droves will make up for any feeling of disappointment at their survival!

No, it'd be turning my back on Scottish football because of what the SPL had done.
'IF' Rangers were liquidated and no sanctions were taken it would confirm there is no SPL, merely a vehicle for Rangers and Celtic to access european football.

The_Todd
09-03-2012, 06:44 PM
Really, if you think about it, it will be no change to this year and yet we all still go and support Hibs so what will have changed? Yes, we can confirm that they are cheatin' bassas etc but folk have been saying that for years and it hasn't stopped us going to games.



I disagree. There's a difference between thinking Rangers get lenient treatment to Rangers outright cheating be it not paying PAYE, using SPL banned "secret contracts", the use of potentially disallowed EBTs. It's a disgrace, and if they are returned to the SPL next season there will be no diminished Rangers, they'll go right on as they are with no debt at all.

Put it this way, would you join a game of poker in a casino if at the start of the game the dealer announced that one of the players will be allowed to cheat and will almost certainly win with no comeback at all? That casino would go out of business pretty quick sharpish.

allezsauzee
09-03-2012, 06:45 PM
I'll never give up watching the cabbage but i rarely watch any Scottish game that doesn't involve Hibs nowadays because the standard is dismal.

Matty_Jack04
09-03-2012, 06:56 PM
I'm already picking and choosing games this would defo be the end for me.

Hibs Class
09-03-2012, 08:59 PM
hibs til i die....rangers have always cheated, its just a bigger cheat they're doing this time....just makes it sweeter when we beat them.


But on the majority of occasions it will stick in the throat even more when they beat us and their filthy hordes get it right up us. No thanks.

Bishop Hibee
09-03-2012, 10:18 PM
I'd still always support Hibs,
But I'm afraid my financial backing of them will no longer continue.


I would only ever ever ever, consider allowing a Newco back in on some pretty serious conditions

all money split fairly,
strict financial fair play (spend what you earn)
ongoing points penatly to Newco for minimum of 3 season

Something along these lines. If they get back in scot free then I'll stick to Scotland and the odd Sunderland game at least in the short term. Don't forget, Rantic would ditch the SPL in an instant if the EPL or a Euro league came calling.

Stand firm Petrie :agree:

Winston Ingram
09-03-2012, 10:23 PM
absolutely done. I sent an email to the board today asking if I was to take an early bird season ticket and the Huns would be liquidated and re-admitted to the SPL would I get a refund if I handed my ST back.

Not heard back yet..

Keith_M
10-03-2012, 05:43 PM
absolutely done. I sent an email to the board today asking if I was to take an early bird season ticket and the Huns would be liquidated and re-admitted to the SPL would I get a refund if I handed my ST back.

Not heard back yet..

I believe that's Category C Seasons.

marleyhib
10-03-2012, 06:02 PM
No, I love Hibs and I always will. It's never been a level playing field, nothing would surprise me.

GGTTH

Hibercelona
11-03-2012, 03:05 AM
But on the majority of occasions it will stick in the throat even more when they beat us and their filthy hordes get it right up us. No thanks.

This.

Same with the maroon manks.

PaulC
11-03-2012, 08:35 AM
Scottish Football would cease to be a sport if they were allowed straight back in and I would turn my back for good.

CentreLine
11-03-2012, 05:12 PM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17329133