Back to the drawing board

[andy1875]

9 goals in 180 minutes of football. Not hard to see where our problems still are, not just these two games, all season we've defended like schoolkids.

Get the lads into training and teach these guys how to defend as a flipping unit. Just can't believe this is the same squad that defended so well in the two games a few weeks back, particularly Killie game. That has already been knocked out the new guys, coincedence? Maybe there is more to the East Mains being to much of a "good thing" after all. Something is wrong beyond belief at ER.

Mourinho/Ferguson & Guardiola couldnt sort it me thinks. This season is destined for relegation in my opinion now. I had faith a few weeks back. I now don't.

Cheers lads

[Elephant Stone]

We had 2 consecutive clean sheets prior to this. Losing 5 to Celtic who have been scoring for fun and are on an unbelievable run of form is not a massive setback. We only lost a goal more than Hearts did against Motherwell last week and managed to score three more than they did. They've been the two hardest games we could possibly have played in the league. It's pretty depressing but I'm not too worried, we definitely have enough to stay in the league.

[HIBERNIAN-0762]

Sorry I was going to comment and support this post but I thought it read "sack the board"

:rolleyes:

[andy1875]

I disagree about it not being a huge deal re the Celtic game mate, the confidence getting smashed out everything Hibs for a start. Losing 4 goals in 25 minutes again tonight, regardless of Motherwell being 3rd is quite simply, pathetic.

I keep hearing this, "we're too good to go down" and we'll stay in the league. Who exactly are we taking points of between now and week 38?

[Elephant Stone]

I disagree about it not being a huge deal re the Celtic game mate, the confidence getting smashed out everything Hibs for a start. Losing 4 goals in 25 minutes again tonight, regardless of Motherwell being 3rd is quite simply, pathetic.

I keep hearing this, "we're too good to go down" and we'll stay in the league. Who exactly are we taking points of between now and week 38?

The games coming up are far from easy but we will pick up points somewhere. As has been said, we're lucky Dunfermline are as bad as they are. We'll do enough to stay in the league and we can build properly over the summer. The time for a manager to come in and build a team is not half way through as season fighting relegation, hopefully over the summer we can sort ourselves out properly, for now it's just a case of scraping enough to get by and I think we will.

[beensaidbefore]

9 goals in 180 minutes of football. Not hard to see where our problems still are, not just these two games, all season we've defended like schoolkids.

Get the lads into training and teach these guys how to defend as a flipping unit. Just can't believe this is the same squad that defended so well in the two games a few weeks back, particularly Killie game. That has already been knocked out the new guys, coincedence? Maybe there is more to the East Mains being to much of a "good thing" after all. Something is wrong beyond belief at ER.

Mourinho/Ferguson & Guardiola couldnt sort it me thinks. This season is destined for relegation in my opinion now. I had faith a few weeks back. I now don't.

Cheers lads

I tend to completely disagree with the myth that having a training facility befitting a professional football team, as opposed to training on public parks, can have an adverse affect on the ability to practice effective training techniques.

However, what I completely agree with you about is something is wrong beyond belief at ER. Lets be fair, Rod aint training the team so its not his fault here. PF should be judged starting from next season if we manage to stay up. If we dont stay up then he should be judged as hes brought in the players he thought could do the job short term. In my opinion the buck has to stop with the players, and there seems to be a lack of communication between the team which is akin to the Scotland rugby try scoring fiasco!!

Surely we must get a break soon. But wheres it gonna come from?:rolleyes:

[beensaidbefore]

Sorry I was going to comment and support this post but I thought it read "sack the board"

:rolleyes:


kidding yeah?

[Northernhibee]

We had 2 consecutive clean sheets prior to this. Losing 5 to Celtic who have been scoring for fun and are on an unbelievable run of form is not a massive setback. We only lost a goal more than Hearts did against Motherwell last week and managed to score three more than they did. They've been the two hardest games we could possibly have played in the league. It's pretty depressing but I'm not too worried, we definitely have enough to stay in the league.

Common sense prevails!

[andy1875]

I tend to completely disagree with the myth that having a training facility befitting a professional football team, as opposed to training on public parks, can have an adverse affect on the ability to practice effective training techniques.

However, what I completely agree with you about is something is wrong beyond belief at ER. Lets be fair, Rod aint training the team so its not his fault here. PF should be judged starting from next season if we manage to stay up. If we dont stay up then he should be judged as hes brought in the players he thought could do the job short term. In my opinion the buck has to stop with the players, and there seems to be a lack of communication between the team which is akin to the Scotland rugby try scoring fiasco!!

Surely we must get a break soon. But wheres it gonna come from?:rolleyes:

My views on East Mains is the same as you, it can surely only be of benefit to us? It certainly hasn't been of any assistance so far though. Get them back down to Porty beach and public parks. It certainly did the Latapys/Mixus etc no harm.

I'm lost trying to work out what the issue is. My hunch is now our fate to go down this season. I really hope im wrong.

[scuttle]

I tend to completely disagree with the myth that having a training facility befitting a professional football team, as opposed to training on public parks, can have an adverse affect on the ability to practice effective training techniques.

However, what I completely agree with you about is something is wrong beyond belief at ER. Lets be fair, Rod aint training the team so its not his fault here. PF should be judged starting from next season if we manage to stay up. If we dont stay up then he should be judged as hes brought in the players he thought could do the job short term. In my opinion the buck has to stop with the players, and there seems to be a lack of communication between the team which is akin to the Scotland rugby try scoring fiasco!!

Surely we must get a break soon. But wheres it gonna come from?:rolleyes:


Why should he be judged from next season he has had enough time so far to get it sorted. Its his training, his tactics and his signings and nothing has changed Imho. Just look at Martin Oneil at Sunderland instant results. Another cheap option from the board I am seriously worried for this club

[Since1875]

We had 2 consecutive clean sheets prior to this. Losing 5 to Celtic who have been scoring for fun and are on an unbelievable run of form is not a massive setback. We only lost a goal more than Hearts did against Motherwell last week and managed to score three more than they did. They've been the two hardest games we could possibly have played in the league. It's pretty depressing but I'm not too worried, we definitely have enough to stay in the league.

Sorry but this is the kind of blind faith that we dont need!! you are almost saying its acceptible to score 3 goals and still get beat!!! I really dont care what hearts done here!!!! They have tucked us away enough over the last few derbys, however because we scored 3 at a ground they scored 0 at that means we should win the next derby does it?? Come on mate. :rolleyes:

We have a massive problem on our hands and cannot keep making silly excuses like this.

The bottom line is we should NOT be losing 5 goals to celtic at ER and we should NOT be getting beat when we have scored 3 goals away from home. Simple as that im afraid.

[iain nolan]

whats changed in the league tonight nothing .

so lets put it to bed and look forward to killie game .

and see where we are come the end off the weekend .

All we can do is get behind the team win ,lose or drew
:pfgwa

[beensaidbefore]

My views on East Mains is the same as you, it can surely only be of benefit to us? It certainly hasn't been of any assistance so far though. Get them back down to Porty beach and public parks. It certainly did the Latapys/Mixus etc no harm.

I'm lost trying to work out what the issue is. My hunch is now our fate to go down this season. I really hope im wrong.

Personally, id be dropping them off at Gullane, and letting them make their way back to EM, via the dunes. Think one of the main differences with the mixu/latapy era, we had a team with experienced player (Jack, Laursen, Arpinon, o'neill, latapy, hughes, mixu), who had experienced other training methods etc, and running along the beach would have been a nice change for some, but they would have been able to instruct the younger players. Lacking that just now I think.

[Ferryhibby]

Dont know what to think now....why cant we defend? its a different defence from the one that started the season......my view its the keeper...if the defence dont have faith that the guy behind is going to command his box, come for crosses, be able to save a basic shot etc then they immediately put themselves under pressure trying hard to stop the ball getting near him because they know its almost certainly a goal, also the guys in the midfield dont seem to be holding onto the ball long enough, stevenson apart,...need to drop claros am afraid and put ossie and stevenson back together, they were understanding each other better, now theyv got a guy in between them that cant speak english and doesnt know their game yet, so drop him from first team untill a few more training sessions behind him, dont think wel get anything from sat either so hope that st J do something for us again, then its St Mirren.....a huge game that we really need to win.

[HFC 0-7]

Why should he be judged from next season he has had enough time so far to get it sorted. Its his training, his tactics and his signings and nothing has changed Imho. Just look at Martin Oneil at Sunderland instant results. Another cheap option from the board I am seriously worried for this club

Big difference though, sunderland had decent players that were not playing to their full ability. We had rubbish players when felon came in, and still have them!

[scuttle]

Big difference though, sunderland had decent players that were not playing to their full ability. We had rubbish players when felon came in, and still have them!


They were not that good ,they couldnae beat us pre season must be crap

[essexhibee]

On we roll to saturday. Yet another huge game. This win needs to come bloody fast. It's disgusting that our club has been allowed to get into this situation and decline for years.

Still. Love this club to bits. Roll on saturday let's go again boys. Just hope confidence can be salvaged.

UP THE ALAMO!!!

[Nakedmanoncrack]

Big difference though, sunderland had decent players that were not playing to their full ability. We had rubbish players when felon came in, and still have them!

Plus all the new players that Fenlon signed.

[Albion Hibs]

Fact of the matter is if we need to score three or four goals to win a game it will be a long time before we pick up 3 points. The balance in the team has been wrong pretty much all season. We need to get the back four sorted out and we need to do it sharpish.

[beensaidbefore]

Why should he be judged from next season he has had enough time so far to get it sorted. Its his training, his tactics and his signings and nothing has changed Imho. Just look at Martin Oneil at Sunderland instant results. Another cheap option from the board I am seriously worried for this club

He should be given space and time to plod away and keep us up with the loans and others he has brought in. If we stay up he can then have a summer with the team, and whatever players he manages to keep/aquire and get them playing the way he really want rather than playing for our lives.

If he fails to keep us up with his signings, then i think he will have failed in his task as he, imo, has brought in players he felt could do the job, and therefore he would be open to criticism.

Martin o'neil is a completely different ball game as Bruce spent about 40M on players in the summer, really talking about a different class of player altogether.

[HFC 0-7]

They were not that good ,they couldnae beat us pre season must be crap

What, so mon has just waived a wand and gave players ability? Fenlon has got better performances out of some players since coming in.

[Spike Mandela]

Dont know what to think now....why cant we defend? its a different defence from the one that started the season......my view its the keeper...if the defence dont have faith that the guy behind is going to command his box, come for crosses, be able to save a basic shot etc then they immediately put themselves under pressure trying hard to stop the ball getting near him because they know its almost certainly a goal, also the guys in the midfield dont seem to be holding onto the ball long enough, stevenson apart,...need to drop claros am afraid and put ossie and stevenson back together, they were understanding each other better, now theyv got a guy in between them that cant speak english and doesnt know their game yet, so drop him from first team untill a few more training sessions behind him, dont think wel get anything from sat either so hope that st J do something for us again, then its St Mirren.....a huge game that we really need to win.

I think the midfield is the big problem and has been all season. We start brightly for 10-15 mins of games then they just disappear.

We have surrendered the midfield in EVERY game this season and watched some really average sides pass it around like Barca while our midfield chase shadows. This puts a huge strain on our defence and even the new improved defence have to battle like **** against the constant wave of opposition midfield attacks.

Our forwards are starved of service from the least creative midfield in the league and end up looking very frustrated figures. Had high hopes for Claros but beginning to worry these hopes were misplaced.

If we survive in this league the midfield needs some massive improvement for next season especially finding people who can put their foot on the ball and dominate a midfield, something we haven't done for a few seasons.

[scuttle]

What, so mon has just waived a wand and gave players ability? Fenlon has got better performances out of some players since coming in.

No majic wand, he is obviously a good man manager and tactician and is now getting more from the players and he has also introduced a bit of youth into the side

[glenberviehibee]

The games coming up are far from easy but we will pick up points somewhere. As has been said, we're lucky Dunfermline are as bad as they are. We'll do enough to stay in the league and we can build properly over the summer. The time for a manager to come in and build a team is not half way through as season fighting relegation, hopefully over the summer we can sort ourselves out properly, for now it's just a case of scraping enough to get by and I think we will.


We keep hearing this we will pick up points nonsense well simply WHEN our defence sadly couldnt keep hens out a close 4 goals tonight in 25 minutes and do you really expect anything at Kilmarnock i dont and if we are lucky we might scrape a draw against STMirren simply not good enough and i cant see any win coming soon.

Dunfermline could have 6 and look more capable of winning a game than us sadly

[Ferryhibby]

I think the midfield is the big problem and has been all season. We start brightly for 10-15 mins of games then they just disappear.

We have surrendered the midfield in EVERY game this season and watched some really average sides pass it around like Barca while our midfield chase shadows. This puts a huge strain on our defence and even the new improved defence have to battle like **** against the constant wave of opposition midfield attacks.

Our forwards are starved of service from the least creative midfield in the league and end up looking very frustrated figures. Had high hopes for Claros but beginning to worry these hopes were misplaced.

If we survive in this league the midfield needs some massive improvement for next season especially finding people who can put their foot on the ball and dominate a midfield, something we haven't done for a few seasons.

ok but the goalies a little to blame then :greengrin

[glenberviehibee]

whats changed in the league tonight nothing .

so lets put it to bed and look forward to killie game .

and see where we are come the end off the weekend .

All we can do is get behind the team win ,lose or drew
:pfgwa

Iain youre having a laugh

weve played another game ,lost 4 goals in 25 minutes threw away another lead and ony 11 games to go and i wish my optimsim was a high as yours but its not and i fully expect to lose again at kilmarnock sorry never depressed as much as i am at the moment and ive seen more than a 1 relegation sadly

[Big Frank]

We keep hearing this we will pick up points nonsense well simply WHEN our defence sadly couldnt keep hens out a close 4 goals tonight in 25 minutes and do you really expect anything at Kilmarnock i dont and if we are lucky we might scrape a draw against STMirren simply not good enough and i cant see any win coming soon.

Dunfermline could have 6 and look more capable of winning a game than us sadly


:giruy:

[HFC 0-7]

No majic wand, he is obviously a good man manager and tactician and is now getting more from the players and he has also introduced a bit of youth into the side

My point is that oneill clearly had the players there that were just under achieving. Felon had crap players, doesn't matter how good a manager you are, you cant make crap players good!

[Hibees07]

What, so mon has just waived a wand and gave players ability? Fenlon has got better performances out of some players since coming in.

Who?.

Stevenson is becoming the best player in the team but he didn't play under CC.

Wotherspoon has been crap, Hanlon is crap, Stack is crap, O'Connor is Crap.

There is no difference in the performance of Osbourne.

So who exactly has improved?.

[Hibees07]

Fenlon and his coaching team haven't improved a single player from the squad he inherited. That fact is quite incredible to be honest. It beggars belief what goes on at East Mains. Although I have heard training is schoolboy quality.

The only improvement if any is from the new players brought in.

P.S. Forgot to add Sproule is also crap to my previous post.

[scuttle]

My point is that oneill clearly had the players there that were just under achieving. Felon had crap players, doesn't matter how good a manager you are, you cant make crap players good!


My point is ,Fenlon has now brought in seven or eight players and I cant see much improvement. The defending is still shambolic, the midfield are all similar types with no real creativity or pace, Yes Sunderlamd have better and more expensive players than we have but are playing in a league considered the best in Europe and since MON came in they have improved greatly while we have stayed the same in a vastly poorer league. I dont want this turning into a MON appreciation thread my concerns are with us and i cant see any improvement under PF at the moment

[BEEJ]

Fenlon and his coaching team haven't improved a single player from the squad he inherited. That fact is quite incredible to be honest. It beggars belief what goes on at East Mains. Although I have heard training is schoolboy quality.

The only improvement if any is from the new players brought in.

P.S. Forgot to add Sproule is also crap to my previous post.
Aye, make sure you don't miss anyone out.

:rolleyes:

[HFC 0-7]

Who?.

Stevenson is becoming the best player in the team but he didn't play under CC.

Wotherspoon has been crap, Hanlon is crap, Stack is crap, O'Connor is Crap.

There is no difference in the performance of Osbourne.

So who exactly has improved?.

Stevenson has been playing very well something calderwood couldn't do, otherwise he would have been playing under him. I would say that Witherspoon has been playing better as well apart from the last couple of games. Hanlon is looking better with a different defence around him.

[S.sct]

Who?.

Stevenson is becoming the best player in the team but he didn't play under CC.

Wotherspoon has been crap, Hanlon is crap, Stack is crap, O'Connor is Crap.

There is no difference in the performance of Osbourne.

So who exactly has improved?.

Maybe that's just it, they are crap and not going to get any better. TBH I've probably now given up on Spooney and Hanlon, both TBF have broken through into a very poor team with very little leadership on the park. Neither of them show that they have what it takes to make it. Stack has probably gone backwards but not sure that would be down to PF. O'Connor obviously has other things on his mind and as for Osbourne.......I've never seen him having a good game. So no change in anyone except wee Lewis. Is that not a success (and he did play under CC)?

[Eaststand]

9 goals in 180 minutes of football. Not hard to see where our problems still are, not just these two games, all season we've defended like schoolkids.

Get the lads into training and teach these guys how to defend as a flipping unit. Just can't believe this is the same squad that defended so well in the two games a few weeks back, particularly Killie game. That has already been knocked out the new guys, coincedence? Maybe there is more to the East Mains being to much of a "good thing" after all. Something is wrong beyond belief at ER.

Mourinho/Ferguson & Guardiola couldnt sort it me thinks. This season is destined for relegation in my opinion now. I had faith a few weeks back. I now don't.

Cheers lads

Good post that Andy and you've hit the nail on the heid ....unless we can quickly begin to defend as a unit, (and that includes everyone defending from the front back when needed), we're doomed as Fraser in Dad's Army would say.

I'm as hacked off as everyone else about the 9 goals we've conceded in the last 4 days, but I reckon our season was always going to be decided by the results after the split.
My hunch is that we'll have the same points as Dunfy at the split, and 4 or 5 points will then keep us up, as long as 3 of those points come from the game againt them.

GGTTH

[andy1875]

Good post that Andy and you've hit the nail on the heid ....unless we can quickly begin to defend as a unit, (and that includes everyone defending from the front back when needed), we're doomed as Fraser in Dad's Army would say.

I'm as hacked off as everyone else about the 9 goals we've conceded in the last 4 days, but I reckon our season was always going to be decided by the results after the split.
My hunch is that we'll have the same points as Dunfy at the split, and 4 or 5 points will then keep us up, as long as 3 of those points come from the game againt them.

GGTTH

I hope your right Eaststand about points after the split. I'd bite your hand of for that 11th place now!
Here's hoping Fenlon and the rest of the coaching team can work on the defence in the coming weeks. We may just have a chance if we stop conceding goals for fun.

Time will tell eh :aok: