Generic Sevco / Rangers meltdown thread

[Is It On....]

As far as i'm concerned I, or the other admins, have no mandate to speak on behalf of the site. We differ from a group such as the HSA, for example, who have elections.

I'm here because I love Hibs and like talking about them at any opportunity, I also like the other discussion on the forum and I don't mind giving up a bit of my own time to keep something I enjoy ticking over. I have never felt Hibs.net speaks for, or hadsthe right to speak for or on behalf of either Hibs fans as a whole or the users of the forum. I'd go as far as to say that if that was a route others wanted to go down it would be time for me to call it a day.

This is a place for people to come and express their opinions about Hibs and football (primarily), it's not our remit to try to influence opinion or voice a collective opinion that not everyone may agree with.

A thankless task so thank you to all the admins. There is a reason that fans other than Hibees read .net and it's because it's policed properly with some insightful stuff on Sevco. Hearts fans I know are embarrassed about alot of the posting on Kickback and as for The The Bears Den...there is alot of pure bigotry on it, appalling language and some nasty fan vs fan stuff, some of it even coming from admins (or Moderators as they call them). I think it must be impossible to be banned which says alot.
So to the all admins and everyone else, keep up the (generally good natured) banter for the season ahead starting tomorrow. GGTTH

(As for Sevco, they seem to have had a policy of deliberately not declaring tje contractual side letters. This was/is in breach of the authorities regulations so I think they deserve everything that happens to them which will hopefully include tiles/trophies being voided and HMRC initiating cases to get the tax and any late penalties paid to UK PLC)

[Ozyhibby]

Another Aberdeen fans group (Fanzine this time) come out in favour of sporting integrity.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170715/b33aa51a0d46e901f23386426295bfe9.jpg


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[Ozyhibby]

Disgusted if this is the case.
http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/rangers/spfl-s-ralph-topping-stands-firm-amid-title-stripping-calls-1-4504809
Looks like Hibs were stalling us with the board meeting on the 30th chat if the decision has already been made.


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[Fuzzywuzzy]

Sad state of affairs but not unexpected. Solicitors in Arbroath must be a bit irked by his comment

[southern hibby]

What gets me is now the courts have ruled it's illegal (EBT's), yet SFA saying they've taken best legal advise. Well my understanding is Rangers thought that EBT's were legal ( yes we all know that's a lie) but took it to court and lost.

So my question would be why should fans go to games knowing our footballing ruling body are corrupt and only interested in protecting the Glasgow gold fish and not the whole aquarium? Would we be better just walking away from the corruption now and taking up another sport?

I go to every Hibs game home and away some development games too but what is the point if there is no sporting chance for teams to compete on a level playing field?
The way it would force the SFA's hand to act if every fan who wants a fair inquiry into title stripping and the court rulings now being finalised would be to stop going to the National games, extreme but hit the SFA where it hurts in the pocket and numbers in the seats at Hampden.

Will this happen probably not.

GGTTH

[Nutmegged]

What gets me is now the courts have ruled it's illegal (EBT's), yet SFA saying they've taken best legal advise. Well my understanding is Rangers thought that EBT's were legal ( yes we all know that's a lie) but took it to court and lost.

So my question would be why should fans go to games knowing our footballing ruling body are corrupt and only interested in protecting the Glasgow gold fish and not the whole aquarium? Would we be better just walking away from the corruption now and taking up another sport?

I go to every Hibs game home and away some development games too but what is the point if there is no sporting chance for teams to compete on a level playing field?
The way it would force the SFA's hand to act if every fan who wants a fair inquiry into title stripping and the court rulings now being finalised would be to stop going to the National games, extreme but hit the SFA where it hurts in the pocket and numbers in the seats at Hampden.

Will this happen probably not.

GGTTH

EBT's were legal until around 2010, that's never been the problem, the problem is with how Rangers used them, the hidden side letters alone should've been enough to void everyhing thy won as if meant players were improperly registered however LNS in 2013 ruled that they didn't give Rangers a Sporting Advantage on the assumption Rangers behaved in a lawful manner, he really had to come to that decision at the time as you're innocent until proven guilty but HMRC won the appeal with a pretty damning verdict and with the Supreme Court upholding that decision it's beyond all logic that the case cannot be re-opened, it must be.

They cheated and it's been proven they intentionally did so.

[DaveSo]

[QUOTE=Ozyhibby;5102256]Disgusted if this is the case.
http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/rangers/spfl-s-ralph-topping-stands-firm-amid-title-stripping-calls-1-4504809
Looks like Hibs were stalling us with the board meeting on the 30th chat if the decision has already been made

Reading that interview with Topping closely and if you are being optimistic you could interpret it that the SFPL have decided to take action and have taken legal advice on what would happen to a challenge from Sevco which would surely follow.
Topping gave no indication there one way or the other which way they are going.
Let's hope they apply their own rules " without fear or favour".

[lapsedhibee]

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/rangers/spfl-s-ralph-topping-stands-firm-amid-title-stripping-calls-1-4504809

Reading that interview with Topping closely and if you are being optimistic you could interpret it that the SFPL have decided to take action and have taken legal advice on what would happen to a challenge from Sevco which would surely follow.
Topping gave no indication there one way or the other which way they are going.
Let's hope they apply their own rules " without fear or favour".

"We have not gone to a solicitor in Arbroath. We have gone to the finest solicitor in the land"
What a prick.
And by the finest solicitor in the land, he will no doubt be referring to some 'weegian.

[Ozyhibby]

"We have not gone to a solicitor in Arbroath. We have gone to the finest solicitor in the land"
What a prick.
And by the finest solicitor in the land, he will no doubt be referring to some 'weegian.

50% of the lawyers in every case lose. If it come to a judicial review I'm pretty sure there will be good lawyers on both sides. Then it will come down to who has the best case.


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[lapsedhibee]

50% of the lawyers in every case lose. If it come to a judicial review I'm pretty sure there will be good lawyers on both sides. Then it will come down to who has the best case.


SFA and SPFL both seem to have adopted the mantra 'justice system says no' as a way of fobbing off demands for the old Thes to be fairly dealt with. I guess the SPFL only said they'd need time to consider the thing to make it look as if they weren't acting in concert with the SFA. Up to fans now, since Turnbull Hutton ain't around no more.

[Ozyhibby]

http://www.celticquicknews.co.uk/open-letter-to-ralph-topping-from-another-non-arbroath-lawyer/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter


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[Deansy]

Disgusted if this is the case.
http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/rangers/spfl-s-ralph-topping-stands-firm-amid-title-stripping-calls-1-4504809
Looks like Hibs were stalling us with the board meeting on the 30th chat if the decision has already been made.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

'We have gone to the finest solicitor in the land and taken his view ................'

And his view is that no court in the land will punish proven CHEATING ???

Just another example of a large % of people who are in a 'Position of power' in Scottish Football, circling the wagons, as they get ready to protect their club !. The remaining % are those who DON'T favour the Hun but don't want to risk the well-being of their closest family & friends !

[ancient hibee]

You seem to think there would be a court case.Who would take who to court?

[Badge]

http://www.celticquicknews.co.uk/open-letter-to-ralph-topping-from-another-non-arbroath-lawyer/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter


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Enjoy the game today?

[Ozyhibby]

You seem to think there would be a court case.Who would take who to court?

Because the SFA and SPFL are both public bodies it's possible for shareholders to pursue a judicial review. This is very expensive but I would think that crowd funding would be able to come up with the £100k required in a morning.


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[ancient hibee]

Because the SFA and SPFL are both public bodies it's possible for shareholders to pursue a judicial review. This is very expensive but I would think that crowd funding would be able to come up with the £100k required in a morning.


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Sorry which shareholders.A judicial review of what?

[Ozyhibby]

Enjoy the game today?

I did, thought we played well enough although difficult to judge as Montrose were very poor.


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[Ozyhibby]

You seem to think there would be a court case.Who would take who to court?

http://onfieldsofgreen.com/the-sfa-is-terrified-of-a-shareholders-judicial-review/


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[Iggy Pope]

Because the SFA and SPFL are both public bodies it's possible for shareholders to pursue a judicial review. This is very expensive but I would think that crowd funding would be able to come up with the £100k required in a morning.


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Crowd funding amongst folk on here would be better spent on the Hibs but you seem to have quelled your HSL trumpeting lately.

[Badge]

I did, thought we played well enough although difficult to judge as Montrose were very poor.


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Still of the opinion that we were nowhere near ready for today's game

[greenlex]

Still of the opinion that we were nowhere near ready for today's game
:confused:

[Ozyhibby]

Sorry to ask the question on this thread but ozy doesn't reply to questions on other threads when it doesn't suit him. He ignored my question on the match day thread and I see he had also ignored another question on the Stoksey thread. Apologies.

I was at the match today so I've not been on the match day thread? I'll check stokes thread and see if I can find your question there, I doubt I ignored you. Mostly likely just never saw it. I'll check the match thread for you as well even though it's likely to take me ages.


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[greenlex]

Sorry to ask the question on this thread but ozy doesn't reply to questions on other threads when it doesn't suit him. He ignored my question on the match day thread and I see he had also ignored another question on the Stoksey thread. Apologies.
The confusion was I thought it was you who thought we were nowhere near ready. Ozzy I could understand. :greengrin:greengrin

[Iggy Pope]

:confused:

To be fair there was a suggestion from the poster in question that Hibs were nowhere near ready to meet Montrose. It is buried in the quagmire of several transfer threads. Scoobyboy I think it was, suggested he might shut up.
And I agree with Badge. Yer man Ozy plagued every thread on transfers last year with his HSL soap boxing and has said nowt this year. Maybe he took Scoopys advice and has shut up after all.

[jacomo]

Sorry to ask the question on this thread but ozy doesn't reply to questions on other threads when it doesn't suit him. He ignored my question on the match day thread and I see he had also ignored another question on the Stoksey thread. Apologies.


Not surprised if you are trolling him like this.

As far as I can tell, you disagree with his opinion on Hibs readiness for the season ahead. Fine. No need to bang on and on about it, especially on this thread.

[Ozyhibby]

To be fair there was a suggestion from the poster in question that Hibs were nowhere near ready to meet Montrose. It is buried in the quagmire of several transfer threads. Scoobyboy I think it was, suggested he might shut up.
And I agree with Badge. Yer man Ozy plagued every thread on transfers last year with his HSL soap boxing and has said nowt this year. Maybe he took Scoopys advice and has shut up after all.

I'd like to see where I said we were not ready for Montrose. I'm pretty sure I said we were not ready for the new season. Still aren't.
HSL decided not to push the scheme as much and I'm going along with that. I'm not on the board of HSL, I did that of my own back. I still think it's a great scheme.
It's nice that you both missed me though.


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[Ozyhibby]

Back to Sevco business.
Our hero is back. [emoji23]
http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/15413651.Craig_Whyte_in_line_for___5m_liquidation_ payout_as_HMRC_is_set_to_lose_out_on_Rangers_tax_c ase_payback/


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[Ozyhibby]

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/craig-whyte-sells-rangers-book-and-film-rights-1-2898764

Sevco the movie [emoji23]
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[HoboHarry]

He's had to be patient but he's going to make some cash now. The Sevco neanderthals are going to be spewing.....👍

[Is It On....]

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/craig-whyte-sells-rangers-book-and-film-rights-1-2898764

Sevco the movie [emoji23]
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Plenty of villains, but who will play our hero? 😂😂

[Ozyhibby]

Plenty of villains, but who will play our hero? [emoji23][emoji23]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170716/a256f1b01e740ab5d1576c242b2db97c.jpg
Swiss Toni?



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[Eyrie]

Plenty of villains, but who will play our hero? 😂😂

Rik Mayall would have been perfect, but sadly he's no longer available.

[BSEJVT]

I'd be interested to know what our fans reps thought of this issue. It would be nice if they could come on the board and tell us the club's thoughts on the issue.


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If our fans reps express anything other than the clubs line they won't last long on that board neither should they, whether that's through their resigning or being dismissed.

There is a doctrine of corporate responsibility that they either need to adopt or resign if they cant support.

[matty_f]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170716/a256f1b01e740ab5d1576c242b2db97c.jpg
Swiss Toni?



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"Killing a football club is a lot like making love to a beautiful woman..."

[matty_f]

If our fans reps express anything other than the clubs line they won't last long on that board neither should they, whether that's through their resigning or being dismissed.

There is a doctrine of corporate responsibility that they either need to adopt or resign if they cant support.
The fans' reps take the support's views to the board, no?

[BSEJVT]

The fans' reps take the support's views to the board, no?

Yes they should.

Then as a board they decide what the consensus view is.

They then need either to support that consensus view publicly or keep schtum or if they cant and it becomes a matter of principle for them that they cannot do so, their only avenue is to resign.

Failing that if they speak out against the board stance, the board should remove them.

I would if they sat on my board.

I am confident it wont come to that.

[Billy Whizz]

Yes they should.

Then as a board they decide what the consensus view is.

They then need either to support that consensus view publicly or keep schtum or if they cant and it becomes a matter of principle for them that they cannot do so, their only avenue is to resign.

Failing that the board should remove them.

I am confident it wont come to that.

I agree with most of what you say, but not everything we query, needs to go to the board. At the end of the day Frank and Tracey were elected to support the supporters, whether that is simple queries or major issues
I'm the type who would rather air my personal issues with ether on a one to one basis, but there are other generic things I'd rather post on here

[Ozyhibby]

https://stripthetitles.wordpress.com/2017/07/17/dear-mcdonalds-were-not-loving-it/


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[Ozyhibby]

http://www.thecsa.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=1950&p=6141


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[Deansy]

Disgusted if this is the case.
http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/rangers/spfl-s-ralph-topping-stands-firm-amid-title-stripping-calls-1-4504809
Looks like Hibs were stalling us with the board meeting on the 30th chat if the decision has already been made.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

There's a nice piece (NOT) in today's 'Daily Rectum' on Topping's leaving and to be honest, a more honest and accurate appraisal of him and his 'achievements' !


Departing SPFL chairman Ralph Topping has been an armchair general and will not be missed - Gannon

Michael says Topping has witnessed Scotland's football reputation plummet during the the most bonkers period in Scottish football history.



http://i4.dailyrecord.co.uk/incoming/article5711106.ece/ALTERNATES/s615/JS18965863.jpgRalph Topping (Image: Craig Williamson/SNS Group)


Ralph Topping’s SPFL long goodbye is finally upon us and it’s clear his replacement Murdoch MacLennan 
has big shoes to fill. Yeah, like the ones worn by Coco the Clown.

Harsh? Perhaps. But it says a lot about the footprint Topping has 
left on Scottish football that the 
news he was for the off at the end of the month was met by a collective shrug of the shoulders by many and a swift flick of the vickies by a few.
The outgoing chairman is a fairly inoffensive character. On the rare occasions he has spoken he has come across as a decent fellow.


http://i3.dailyrecord.co.uk/incoming/article10777340.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/SPFL-New-Chairman-July-2017.jpg

Murdoch MacLennan is the new chief (Image: Telegraph Media Group Ltd) But he has been the seldom seen kid of the Scottish scene for eight years. This has arguably been the most bonkers period in Scottish football history yet the chairman of the entire organisation has 
been hiding under the duvet.
Topping has been an armchair general but we can only hope the 
new man is prepared to get down and dirty on the front line.
As for the soon-to-be-departed’s legacy, it makes pretty grisly reading.

Neil Doncaster and some friendly
 chairmen trot out the party line, 
saying Ralph steered the league through a very challenging period. Really? He might have been steering but 
the league has been 
a buckled trolley 
rolling down a hill.

Go back to when he replaced Lex Gold in 2009. The game was far from perfect but the Scottish league was ranked inside the top 15 in Europe, we had two teams in the Champions League – one straight into 
the groups – and six in European action.


http://i2.dailyrecord.co.uk/incoming/article5705052.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/JS18965877.jpg

SPL chairman Ralph Topping (Image: SNS) We’re 23rd now 
and God knows where we’re headed after this year’s disasters.
We’ve seen five clubs go into administration, including three of the biggest clubs in the land, and one which went all the way to liquidation.
Speaking of which, the chairman’s pitiful role in the Rangers fiasco is another line on the CV that needs a black marker through it.
Topping is credited for his part in the SPL merger with the SPFL. It was Ralph who got the clubs together, some say. Very good. But while he was twisting the arms of the Brechin City chairman, he managed to kick off the rebranded league without a sponsor.

That alone was a gallows offence. A shiny new product ready to launch and not a bean on board for two years. The same in the League Cup. That was the first job to do, not the last.

Now we’re meant to be grateful he managed to get his pals at Ladbrokes to sink a few quid in? Do us a favour.
If it’s a decent leader’s job to leave behind a stronger product than he inherited then Topping has had a stinker. The new man is going to have to call in the decorators on day one.

http://i2.dailyrecord.co.uk/incoming/article10393909.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/JS69673572.jpg

Some of Scotland's biggest clubs have been in financial difficulty (Image: SNS Group) A lot of folk will think, ‘Murdoch who? Ach, he’ll be another faceless suit like the man on his way out.’
But he might just surprise. This is a man who spent decades in papers and even managed to make money out of the internet. Folk say the newspaper business – whether print or online – is doomed. But almost two million in Scotland will read something produced by our papers every day.
Use it. Sell Scottish 
football. Get the clubs to open their doors, slash ticket prices and engage with supporters. Find out what fans want and work out a way to deliver it.
There’s more to do. MacLennan has been left holding the stinky nappy of the Rangers tax case.
Meet it head on and stop all the dithering. Go back to Lord Nimmo and see if he wants another look in the wake of the Supreme Court 
decision. If so, get on with it.











Try to tackle the brutal lack of youngsters playing in our top division.

Sort out the unfair play-off system that leaves Championship clubs clapped out by the final.
Knock the bickering chairmen 
into shape and find a structure and calendar that helps not hinders clubs.
Drive a hard bargain when it comes to TV deal negotiations rather than holding up the begging bowl.
The SPFL chairman doesn’t have to be just a referee among the arguing factions. He can be a leader.
Ralph can take the clown shoes with him. Let’s hope to God that 
Murdoch will come in wearing 
steel-toe-capped tackety boots.



The 'Coco the Clown' line is superb !!

[Ozyhibby]

https://thecelticblog.com/2017/07/blogs/the-spfl-and-the-sfa-will-not-punish-cheating-until-clubs-and-fans-force-them-to-and-they-will/


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[greenlex]

There's a nice piece (NOT) in today's 'Daily Rectum' on Topping's leaving and to be honest, a more honest and accurate appraisal of him and his 'achievements' !


Departing SPFL chairman Ralph Topping has been an armchair general and will not be missed - Gannon

Michael says Topping has witnessed Scotland's football reputation plummet during the the most bonkers period in Scottish football history.



http://i4.dailyrecord.co.uk/incoming/article5711106.ece/ALTERNATES/s615/JS18965863.jpgRalph Topping (Image: Craig Williamson/SNS Group)


Ralph Topping’s SPFL long goodbye is finally upon us and it’s clear his replacement Murdoch MacLennan 
has big shoes to fill. Yeah, like the ones worn by Coco the Clown.

Harsh? Perhaps. But it says a lot about the footprint Topping has 
left on Scottish football that the 
news he was for the off at the end of the month was met by a collective shrug of the shoulders by many and a swift flick of the vickies by a few.
The outgoing chairman is a fairly inoffensive character. On the rare occasions he has spoken he has come across as a decent fellow.


http://i3.dailyrecord.co.uk/incoming/article10777340.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/SPFL-New-Chairman-July-2017.jpg

Murdoch MacLennan is the new chief (Image: Telegraph Media Group Ltd) But he has been the seldom seen kid of the Scottish scene for eight years. This has arguably been the most bonkers period in Scottish football history yet the chairman of the entire organisation has 
been hiding under the duvet.
Topping has been an armchair general but we can only hope the 
new man is prepared to get down and dirty on the front line.
As for the soon-to-be-departed’s legacy, it makes pretty grisly reading.

Neil Doncaster and some friendly
 chairmen trot out the party line, 
saying Ralph steered the league through a very challenging period. Really? He might have been steering but 
the league has been 
a buckled trolley 
rolling down a hill.

Go back to when he replaced Lex Gold in 2009. The game was far from perfect but the Scottish league was ranked inside the top 15 in Europe, we had two teams in the Champions League – one straight into 
the groups – and six in European action.


http://i2.dailyrecord.co.uk/incoming/article5705052.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/JS18965877.jpg

SPL chairman Ralph Topping (Image: SNS) We’re 23rd now 
and God knows where we’re headed after this year’s disasters.
We’ve seen five clubs go into administration, including three of the biggest clubs in the land, and one which went all the way to liquidation.
Speaking of which, the chairman’s pitiful role in the Rangers fiasco is another line on the CV that needs a black marker through it.
Topping is credited for his part in the SPL merger with the SPFL. It was Ralph who got the clubs together, some say. Very good. But while he was twisting the arms of the Brechin City chairman, he managed to kick off the rebranded league without a sponsor.

That alone was a gallows offence. A shiny new product ready to launch and not a bean on board for two years. The same in the League Cup. That was the first job to do, not the last.

Now we’re meant to be grateful he managed to get his pals at Ladbrokes to sink a few quid in? Do us a favour.
If it’s a decent leader’s job to leave behind a stronger product than he inherited then Topping has had a stinker. The new man is going to have to call in the decorators on day one.

http://i2.dailyrecord.co.uk/incoming/article10393909.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/JS69673572.jpg

Some of Scotland's biggest clubs have been in financial difficulty (Image: SNS Group) A lot of folk will think, ‘Murdoch who? Ach, he’ll be another faceless suit like the man on his way out.’
But he might just surprise. This is a man who spent decades in papers and even managed to make money out of the internet. Folk say the newspaper business – whether print or online – is doomed. But almost two million in Scotland will read something produced by our papers every day.
Use it. Sell Scottish 
football. Get the clubs to open their doors, slash ticket prices and engage with supporters. Find out what fans want and work out a way to deliver it.
There’s more to do. MacLennan has been left holding the stinky nappy of the Rangers tax case.
Meet it head on and stop all the dithering. Go back to Lord Nimmo and see if he wants another look in the wake of the Supreme Court 
decision. If so, get on with it.











Try to tackle the brutal lack of youngsters playing in our top division.

Sort out the unfair play-off system that leaves Championship clubs clapped out by the final.
Knock the bickering chairmen 
into shape and find a structure and calendar that helps not hinders clubs.
Drive a hard bargain when it comes to TV deal negotiations rather than holding up the begging bowl.
The SPFL chairman doesn’t have to be just a referee among the arguing factions. He can be a leader.
Ralph can take the clown shoes with him. Let’s hope to God that 
Murdoch will come in wearing 
steel-toe-capped tackety boots.



The 'Coco the Clown' line is superb !!
Is the new guy not an ex SMG director? Indont think he's the one to shake up the old firm for the good of Scottish Football in fact we will possibly be bending further over.

[ancient hibee]

Wonder if they'd write about Topping like that if he supported one of the ugly sisters and not Hibs.

[Jack Hackett]

Is the new guy not an ex SMG director? Indont think he's the one to shake up the old firm for the good of Scottish Football in fact we will possibly be bending further over.

:agree:

Toppings successor will have been very carefully selected.

Corrupt to the core

[Bostonhibby]

:agree:

Toppings successor will have been very carefully selected.

Corrupt to the corePrivate eye write about him a lot. He sounds like a business as usual appointment sadly.

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[ancient hibee]

:agree:

Toppings successor will have been very carefully selected.

Corrupt to the core

Do you think they should have picked a name out of a hat?

[Ozyhibby]

Wonder if they'd write about Topping like that if he supported one of the ugly sisters and not Hibs.

Isn't Topping a former season ticket holder at Ibrox?


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[greenlex]

Do you think they should have picked a name out of a hat?

They might have at least selected someone who was fresh and had not been part of the Circus.

[ancient hibee]

Isn't Topping a former season ticket holder at Ibrox?


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No.

[HoboHarry]

They might have at least selected someone who was fresh and had not been part of the Circus.
That was their last intention (sadly)

[Jack Hackett]

Do you think they should have picked a name out of a hat?

Wtf does how they do it affect what we're saddled with? At least if they picked a name from a hat, we'd have a chance of getting something other than a rubber stamp

[Is It On....]

Rik Mayall would have been perfect, but sadly he's no longer available.

Just thinking that Repo-man by Iggy Pop could be the title tune to Sevco, The Movie (part 1) 😂😂 (for those that don't know it, it's a fantastic song)

[Ozyhibby]

https://stripthetitles.wordpress.com/2017/07/18/poll-which-team-do-you-support/


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[Ozyhibby]

From Rangerstaxcase blog
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170718/4a611222f984daa38834fceee1199564.jpg


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[Ozyhibby]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170718/975e04d7b43896903a546843321a9005.jpg

A handy guide of companies to avoid while they support the corruption in Scottish football.
Some of them are real easy for me to avoid anyway but I need new specs and I will no longer be going to specsavers.


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[lapsedhibee]

https://stripthetitles.wordpress.com/2017/07/18/poll-which-team-do-you-support/


That's looking like a fenian conspiracy at the moment.

[Ozyhibby]

That's looking like a fenian conspiracy at the moment.

It only went up last night and it was posted up here sharpish. I expect by the end of the day to see the yams and Aberdeen catch us up.
Does show that it's an issue important to Hibs fans though. Hopefully the club start to think the same way.


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[Smartie]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170718/975e04d7b43896903a546843321a9005.jpg

A handy guide of companies to avoid while they support the corruption in Scottish football.
Some of them are real easy for me to avoid anyway but I need new specs and I will no longer be going to specsavers.


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I don't know if I agree with this approach at all.

I always think that Sevco look like a bunch of ignorant clowns when they threaten to take their business elsewhere.

Scottish football has struggled enough to find sponsorship in the past. If there are publicised boycotts by about half of the population every time there was a contentious period in Scottish football (and if it wasn't this, it would be the latest dodgy refereeing decision) then we'd never get any sponsors to put money into our game.

[Ozyhibby]

I don't know if I agree with this approach at all.

I always think that Sevco look like a bunch of ignorant clowns when they threaten to take their business elsewhere.

Scottish football has struggled enough to find sponsorship in the past. If there are publicised boycotts by about half of the population every time there was a contentious period in Scottish football (and if it wasn't this, it would be the latest dodgy refereeing decision) then we'd never get any sponsors to put money into our game.

The money makes no difference anyway while the current regime is in charge. The SFA is failing in every single area it operates. The performance of the national team has been woeful for a generation now, our clubs are regularly embarrassed in Europe, the standard of players we are producing is falling, their oversight of corporate governance is failing, there has been no financial fair play rules implemented even though we have had 6/7 clubs in administration and they won't even uphold their own rules.
When it's as bad as that then it's for the best that they don't get more money. They need starved out.


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[Smartie]

The money makes no difference anyway while the current regime is in charge. The SFA is failing in every single area it operates. The performance of the national team has been woeful for a generation now, our clubs are regularly embarrassed in Europe, the standard of players we are producing is falling, their oversight of corporate governance is failing, there has been no financial fair play rules implemented even though we have had 6/7 clubs in administration and they won't even uphold their own rules.
When it's as bad as that then it's for the best that they don't get more money. They need starved out.


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Fair points.

It all smacked a bit of "let's see how they cope without the blue pound" to me, something I am uncomfortable with.

[Ozyhibby]

Fair points.

It all smacked a bit of "let's see how they cope without the blue pound" to me, something I am uncomfortable with.

It's def not a revenge thing, this is about forcing change. The fans have more power than they know.


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[Ozyhibby]

https://stripthetitles.wordpress.com/2017/07/18/poll-which-team-do-you-support/
Hibs still leading Hearts and Aberdeen.[emoji3]


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[Hibs Class]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170718/975e04d7b43896903a546843321a9005.jpg

A handy guide of companies to avoid while they support the corruption in Scottish football.
Some of them are real easy for me to avoid anyway but I need new specs and I will no longer be going to specsavers.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Not really into boycotts very much. Even not buying the DR is more of a quality decision than a boycott. It wouldn't really be a boycott unless you avoided them all though, and as I think G4S do Easter Road security it would quite difficult for Hibs supporters to go all-in!

[Keith_M]

... and as I think G4S do Easter Road security it would quite difficult for Hibs supporters to go all-in!


We could always just ignore the stewards as part of the boycott.

[Seveno]

https://stripthetitles.wordpress.com/2017/07/18/poll-which-team-do-you-support/
Hibs still leading Hearts and Aberdeen.[emoji3]


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85 Jambo voters that fail to see the irony.

[Ozyhibby]

85 Jambo voters that fail to see the irony.

I suspect your average yam is worried the enquiry got widened as I'm sure the Sevconians would push for.


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[PatHead]

Nice to see the new club getting a fine on their only ever European tie.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/40642808

[Jack]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170718/975e04d7b43896903a546843321a9005.jpg

A handy guide of companies to avoid while they support the corruption in Scottish football.
Some of them are real easy for me to avoid anyway but I need new specs and I will no longer be going to specsavers.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Rather than target these companies hit the source.

A boycott of the national team games would, in my opinion, be a more direct demonstration by Scottish football fans while at the same time having no effect on our respective clubs.

[jacomo]

I suspect your average yam is worried the enquiry got widened as I'm sure the Sevconians would push for.


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That would be awful of course.

But an acceptable price to pay in the name of fairness.

:devil:

[Ozyhibby]

JJ claiming to have confidential emails.
https://johnjamessite.com/


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[Ozyhibby]

Sevco 0-1 St. Johnstone
Pedro just needs more time [emoji22]
Sevco have now only scored only 2 goals in 5 games against St. Johnstone, Kilmarnock and Progres.

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[Jack Hackett]

Sevco 0-1 St. Johnstone
Pedro just needs more time [emoji22]
Sevco have now only scored only 2 goals in 5 games against St. Johnstone, Kilmarnock and Progres.

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Ach! They'll improve once they get a few European games under their belt :greengrin

[Smartie]

Kenny Miller is rumoured to have fallen out with Pedro and been told to find another club.......

[HoboHarry]

Kenny Miller is rumoured to have fallen out with Pedro and been told to find another club.......
Didn't he just sign a new contract? They will have to pay that off if it's true - where else will he get big money at his age?

[Deansy]

85 Jambo voters that fail to see the irony.

Can't believe the other 399,915 of them did - someone must've told the 'Windae-lickers' !

[greenlex]

Kenny Miller is rumoured to have fallen out with Pedro and been told to find another club.......
Yes please.

[Ozyhibby]

Article about JJ's email find.
https://thecelticblog.com/2017/07/blogs/the-evidence-mounts-up-that-the-lns-inquiry-was-a-sham-scottish-football-needs-a-new-one/


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[Ozyhibby]

http://m.bbc.co.uk/sport/athletics/40650500
Sad day when Athletics deals better with cheating than Scottish football.


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[GlesgaeHibby]

Sevco 0-1 St. Johnstone
Pedro just needs more time [emoji22]
Sevco have now only scored only 2 goals in 5 games against St. Johnstone, Kilmarnock and Progres.

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Reckon it'll be a tight race between Pedro and Cathro for the first sacking of the year.

[wallmack]

Reckon it'll be a tight race between Pedro and Cathro for the first sacking of the year.


My money is on Pedro getting his jotters first

[Bostonhibby]

My money is on Pedro getting his jotters firstAgree, wait till they find out he's a kafflik[emoji6]

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[SouthsideHarp_Bhoy]

Rather than target these companies hit the source.

A boycott of the national team games would, in my opinion, be a more direct demonstration by Scottish football fans while at the same time having no effect on our respective clubs.

Agree that this would be a good way to go - tartan army would have a lot of power - but it will never happen.

[Keith_M]

My money is on Pedro getting his jotters first



Pedro and Cathro must stay!

[Ozyhibby]

Scottish Football Supporters Association had a launch event at Holyrood this morning. Henry McLeish speaking just now.
https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/1308051/scottish-football-supporters-association-hilarious-video/



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[Ozyhibby]

https://thecelticblog.com/2017/07/blogs/lawwell-and-celtic-make-the-first-move-the-chess-match-for-power-at-the-sfa-begins/


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[gerry70]

Scottish Football Supporters Association had a launch event at Holyrood this morning. Henry McLeish speaking just now.
https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/1308051/scottish-football-supporters-association-hilarious-video/



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Survey of fans at https://www.surveymonkey.co.uk/r/sfsa-benchmark-2017

More info at.

http://scottishfsa.org/first-independent-evaluation-scottish-football/

[Ozyhibby]

Good letter from a yam to Ann Budge.
https://www.sfm.scot/launch-of-sfsa-fans-survey/?cid=159557



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[Geo_1875]

Good letter from a yam to Ann Budge.
https://www.sfm.scot/launch-of-sfsa-fans-survey/?cid=159557



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Quite a rant from a supporter of the team who delayed announcing their insolvency to avoid relegation.

[Keith_M]

Quite a rant from a supporter of the team who delayed announcing their insolvency to avoid relegation.


But in a Cathroesque world...

If you take away the people they didn't pay their debts to... they paid off all their debts.

And if you ignore all the improperly registered players... they didn't have any improperly registered players.

[Jack Hackett]

Quite a rant from a supporter of the team who delayed announcing their insolvency to avoid relegation.

They don't do irony... Oh!... and a big boy did it and ran away anyway

[Stonewall]

Quite a rant from a supporter of the team who delayed announcing their insolvency to avoid relegation.

Leaving all that aside he's right though.

Let's not let petty points scoring get in the way of what is right.

If you want this whole matter with Rangers resolved we can't afford to resort to petty bickering. That results in divide and rule and those in power able to deflect and avoid the real questions.

We need to focus on the real issues and not trivial points scoring against our neighbours. It's a bigger issue.

[Ozyhibby]

Leaving all that aside he's right though.

Let's not let petty points scoring get in the way of what is right.

If you want this whole matter with Rangers resolved we can't afford to resort to petty bickering. That results in divide and rule and those in power able to deflect and avoid the real questions.

We need to focus on the real issues and not trivial points scoring against our neighbours. It's a bigger issue.

100% correct


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[hhibs]

Leaving all that aside he's right though.

Let's not let petty points scoring get n the way of what is right.

If you want this whole matter with Rangers resolved we can't afford to resort to petty bickering. That results in divide and rule and those in power able to deflect and avoid the real questions.

We need to focus on the real issues and not trivial points scoring against our neighbours. It's a bigger issue.

Yep,it's as you say,the bigger issue..................by the largest of margins.

[Ozyhibby]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170721/04999ff94a406824992ea04be688d3b4.jpg
Aberdeen bottle it. As they always do.


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[connerg]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170721/04999ff94a406824992ea04be688d3b4.jpg
Aberdeen bottle it. As they always do.


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If his company(s) lost money through dubious practices he'd be taking the culprits to court and screwing every penny in compensation out of them.

Two faced hypocrit and a horrible man.

[Ozyhibby]

https://thecelticblog.com/2017/07/blogs/stewart-move-on-milne-has-betrayed-his-fans-and-the-whole-of-scottish-football-today/


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[southsider]

I hope to God our club shows more balls than Aberdeen. Sporting integrity anyone ?

[Smartie]

I hope to God our club shows more balls than Aberdeen. Sporting integrity anyone ?

I wouldn't hold your breath.

Milne may be more compromised than our board. He has houses to sell, and if he was prominent in the title-stripping demands, he wouldn't be selling any houses to Sevconians any time soon.

Whether or not he sells houses to the fans of any other club......

And what of the damage he may have done to his relationship with his own fans, who have been consistent and clear about what they want to see done?

[Ozyhibby]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170722/b4dd02dd21a87589b7a0384274bad8cc.jpg


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[660]

I think Hibs will make a statement re sporting integrity without mentioning the titles directly.

Re hearts, my cringe reflex is getting quite the workout from watching their fans go baw deep in criticising the Huns.

[Ozyhibby]

I think Hibs will make a statement re sporting integrity without mentioning the titles directly.

Re hearts, my cringe reflex is getting quite the workout from watching their fans go baw deep in criticising the Huns.

We need a full enquiry into what happened. The game won't be able to move on without it.


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[Stonewall]

We need a full enquiry into what happened. The game won't be able to move on without it.


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Exactly.

[Deansy]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170721/04999ff94a406824992ea04be688d3b4.jpg
Aberdeen bottle it. As they always do.


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Milne is a disgusting, odious, little creature ! Hasn't he got form for this - issuing a statement that completely contradicts the views and opinions of his own supporters ??

[lord bunberry]

Milne is a disgusting, odious, little creature ! Hasn't he got form for this - issuing a statement that completely contradicts the views and opinions of his own supporters ??
It was him that voted against changing the voting structure away from the 11-1 system in order to get his team a few quid while rangers were out of the top division. He's a snake.

[Ozyhibby]

Milne is a disgusting, odious, little creature ! Hasn't he got form for this - issuing a statement that completely contradicts the views and opinions of his own supporters ??

I'd like to hear from Hibs on this soon. Obviously they have stalled us till the board meeting on the 31st but I expect to hear shortly afterwards.
Last 3 years have been a decent repair job with the Hibs board and the fans. I'd hate to see it all undone.


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[gerry70]

I'd like to hear from Hibs on this soon. Obviously they have stalled us till the board meeting on the 31st but I expect to hear shortly afterwards.
Last 3 years have been a decent repair job with the Hibs board and the fans. I'd hate to see it all undone.


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It would be good if that happened. But Petrie is fatally compromised having been part of the shady deals that got us here. Hibs will say nothing about the biggest scandal in Scottish sport. We have record season ticket sales and Petrie, Milne etc just want us all to "move on". Maybe I'm in a small minority that actually feels cheated, and Petrie is right to think if they all stay quiet long enough it will blow over.

[Keith_M]

I think anybody expecting an official statement from Hibs encouraging titles to be stripped is going to be sorely dissapointed.

The only club that has a genuine interest in that happening is Celtc.

[Drewster]

I think anybody expecting an official statement from Hibs encouraging titles to be stripped is going to be sorely dissapointed.

The only club that has a genuine interest in that happening is Celtc.

Rubbish - anyone with an interest in sport has a genuine interest in this happening!!? If cheating is ok, we may as well not bother!

[Ozyhibby]

Rubbish - anyone with an interest in sport has a genuine interest in this happening!!? If cheating is ok, we may as well not bother!

That's just it. If the rules only apply to some clubs, then why bother? It's because they think they got away with it before that the new club is currently deliberately spending beyond their means.
After everything that has happened in Scottish football, for us still not to have proper FFP rules in place domestically is a disgrace.
This season there is a chance we could be pipped for a European place by a club still spending far beyond their means.
If Petrie is happy for this to continue then we are as well just watching the EPL on the tele.


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[Smartie]

I don't expect any club other than Celtic to come out publicly in favour of title-stripping. At this stage I think it is just the fans who want this (fans of ALL clubs other than Rangers) although the fans could sway the clubs over time.

There are too many people within Scottish football clubs who are compromised or who have vested interests. There are also a few too many idiots and cowards both within clubs and within the authorities.

Self-preservation will be what is keeping most quiet. Most figures will have been up to their necks in it up to the 5-way-agreement being signed and they'll all know that an e-mail trail incriminating them in some way will exist. They will be keen to see that this doesn't come out.

As it stands, there is little incentive for the chairmen of clubs to be interested. They've got our season ticket money for the coming season and all they'll want to do is to give it time hoping it will all blow over.

I don't think this is right, I think it is the way it is.

It will be interesting to see what comes of fan power over the next few months and years though.

Would be sign up in such large numbers next year if there is more fudging along the way?

[660]

That's just it. If the rules only apply to some clubs, then why bother? It's because they think they got away with it before that the new club is currently deliberately spending beyond their means.
After everything that has happened in Scottish football, for us still not to have proper FFP rules in place domestically is a disgrace.
This season there is a chance we could be pipped for a European place by a club still spending far beyond their means.
If Petrie is happy for this to continue then we are as well just watching the EPL on the tele.


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Yeah the EPL is a great example of financially prudent clubs.....

[Ozyhibby]

Yeah the EPL is a great example of financially prudent clubs.....

I know, that's my point.


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[southern hibby]

Problem we have for the Hibs board ( if they are not interested in title stripping ) is how the fans will re-act to their Stance.

Will we except their Apathy towards this or will we genuinely make a stand?
I think the support will be gutted with the outcome from our board if there is no proper stance and may seriously backfire towards board /fan relationships.

What is the point of having sporting integrarty if it's not implemented or upheld within the rules? If we don't act we are sending a message to the SFA/SPFL and any other clubs that you don't need to Operate within the rules, so feel free to cheat at your own leisure.

I would never stop buying a season ticket for Hibs but I would never have confidence again that the games not rigged, so to this end why would I want to actually go to games knowing there may be cheating?
Before anyone things people who do this are turning their back on their cub I'd say they aren't but the clubs stance is turning their backs on the supporters.

Now I'm not saying Hibs stance will be like this but I'm begging the board for the sake of our game please don't do an Aberdeen Board and turn your back on the fans wishes but be ruthless and lead the fight to these teams/ chairmen/ directors and make us proud to say we fought for sporting integrarty.

GGTTH

[Ozyhibby]

Problem we have for the Hibs board ( if they are not interested in title stripping ) is how the fans will re-act to their Stance.

Will we except their Apathy towards this or will we genuinely make a stand?
I think the support will be gutted with the outcome from our board if there is no proper stance and may seriously backfire towards board /fan relationships.

What is the point of having sporting integrarty if it's not implemented or upheld within the rules? If we don't act we are sending a message to the SFA/SPFL and any other clubs that you don't need to Operate within the rules, so feel free to cheat at your own leisure.

I would never stop buying a season ticket for Hibs but I would never have confidence again that the games not rigged, so to this end why would I want to actually go to games knowing there may be cheating?
Before anyone things people who do this are turning their back on their cub I'd say they aren't but the clubs stance is turning their backs on the supporters.

Now I'm not saying Hibs stance will be like this but I'm begging the board for the sake of our game please don't do an Aberdeen Board and turn your back on the fans wishes but be ruthless and lead the fight to these teams/ chairmen/ directors and make us proud to say we fought for sporting integrarty.

GGTTH

Great post.


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[cabbageandribs1875]

It would be good if that happened. But Petrie is fatally compromised having been part of the shady deals that got us here. Hibs will say nothing about the biggest scandal in Scottish sport. We have record season ticket sales and Petrie, Milne etc just want us all to "move on". Maybe I'm in a small minority that actually feels cheated, and Petrie is right to think if they all stay quiet long enough it will blow over.


which is exactly what WILL happen, i'd put my last vButton on it

[lapsedhibee]

What is the point of having sporting integrarty if it's not implemented or upheld within the rules? If we don't act we are sending a message to the SFA/SPFL and any other clubs that you don't need to Operate within the rules, so feel free to cheat at your own leisure.
Disagree. The message is that The Thes can do anything they want, not that everyone else can.

[greenlex]

I'd be surprised if Hibs make any statement till after the second league game of the season and for good reason as it will be poisonous enough without throwing petrol on the fire.

[Kato]

We need a full enquiry into what happened.


Enquiry - expensive version {2 years of lawyers fees and spraff from roasters in the pockets of the huns}

Enquiry - cheap version {Produces example of side-contract. GUILTY!, enquiry closes}

[Keith_M]

Rubbish - anyone with an interest in sport has a genuine interest in this happening!!? If cheating is ok, we may as well not bother!


THE SFA/SPL/SPFL have already decided that cheating is OK (for certain clubs).

I genuinely don't think Hibs will do anything to rock the boat, as they'll consider the grief would outweigh any benefit.

It's not a matter of principle... it's just business.

[Hibs Class]

I'd be surprised if Hibs make any statement till after the second league game of the season and for good reason as it will be poisonous enough without throwing petrol on the fire.

A statement sooner rather than later would best. It's never wrong to do the right thing.

[Bostonhibby]

I hope to God our club shows more balls than Aberdeen. Sporting integrity anyone ?Aberdeen. The the huns of the North. The the's fans from there must be creaming themselves. Wonder what the actual Aberdeen fans think.

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[greenlex]

A statement sooner rather than later would best. It's never wrong to do the right thing.
yiu are right it's never wrong to do the right thing. It may be a mistake doing it before that game tho. As long as the right thing is done.

[theonlywayisup]

Aberdeen. The the huns of the North. The the's fans from there must be creaming themselves. Wonder what the actual Aberdeen fans think.

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What a load of rubbish! Not someone again re-cycling this garbage! Say it enough times, someone will believe it.

[Bostonhibby]

What a load of rubbish! Not someone again re-cycling this garbage! Say it enough times, someone will believe it.Pertinent to the way milne is playing it.

You obviously never worked out why I wondered what the actual aberdeen football fans might think?

Very comfortable with my analogy as far as the latest headline goes.

Opinions eh. I'm less interested in / emotional about anyone believing what I feel here than you seem to be about your analysis of my motive for posting.

PS - never given an opinion vis a vis Aberdeen fans and their clubs recent apparent support for the the's so haven't ever recycled whatever you might feel has been recycled here.

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[Crazyhorse]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170721/04999ff94a406824992ea04be688d3b4.jpg
Aberdeen bottle it. As they always do.


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What a disgusting Wormtongue piece of orcshiote that Milne is. Dons support must feel like they have been stabbed in the back. **** off out of Scottish football you gutless worthless bald toad.

[Radium]

Boards across the country will just be chuffed with the timing.
The Rangers debacle came to a head before season tickets were being sold and the prospect of boycotts was real

The court decision has arrived well into the ST sales period and so there is little to worry about for many clubs

Expect the statements to reflect this level of comfort.

A question, does anyone know if there are any rules in place now that could lead to the stripping of titles?


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[Ozyhibby]

Boards across the country will just be chuffed with the timing.
The Rangers debacle came to a head before season tickets were being sold and the prospect of boycotts was real

The court decision has arrived well into the ST sales period and so there is little to worry about for many clubs

Expect the statements to reflect this level of comfort.

A question, does anyone know if there are any rules in place now that could lead to the stripping of titles?


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They just have to apply the rules that were in place at the time.


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[pacorosssco]

What a disgusting Wormtongue piece of orcshiote that Milne is. Dons support must feel like they have been stabbed in the back. **** off out of Scottish football you gutless worthless bald toad.

Watch this space he will soon get gig board of sfa or spl. He is proving worth

[connerg]

Boards across the country will just be chuffed with the timing.
The Rangers debacle came to a head before season tickets were being sold and the prospect of boycotts was real

The court decision has arrived well into the ST sales period and so there is little to worry about for many clubs

Expect the statements to reflect this level of comfort.

A question, does anyone know if there are any rules in place now that could lead to the stripping of titles?


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Mis-registration of players may be a start, plenty clubs around the country have an arguement if the SFA apply the rules equally!

[Ozyhibby]

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/15428043.Rangers___39_oldcos__39__stalk_the_club/?ref=twtrec


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[Spike Mandela]

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/15428043.Rangers___39_oldcos__39__stalk_the_club/?ref=twtrec


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The gift that keeps on giving.:cb

[fat freddy]

The gift that keeps on giving.:cb

Begbie's Traynor...a new addition to the soap opera, it conjures so many images

[jacomo]

Boards across the country will just be chuffed with the timing.
The Rangers debacle came to a head before season tickets were being sold and the prospect of boycotts was real

The court decision has arrived well into the ST sales period and so there is little to worry about for many clubs

Expect the statements to reflect this level of comfort.

But A question, does anyone know if there are any rules in place now that could lead to the stripping of titles?


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I've read this before but still don't understand it:

https://scotslawthoughts.wordpress.com/2013/02/28/rangers-oldco-not-guilty-of-fielding-ineligible-players-why/amp/

It seems that Rangers did field ineligible players but as they weren't rumbled at the time it's all fine?

The LNS Commission seems one big fudge from beginning to end.

[Pedantic_Hibee]

I care little for Rangers/Sevco. Our board should adopt the same approach. Their threats and intimidations are empty, Scottish football thrived without them and we will do so again. Strip the titles for the sake of Scottish football or we may as well just padlock the metaphorical gates.

[MrSmith]

Justice must be done! Anything else weakens and criminalises our game. Those who run Scottish Football are supposed to be beyond reproach however, what rangers and their crooked cronies did invcluding those in the football
Association (5 way agreement?) require to be investigated and stripped of every title and office bearing position they have.

[Ozyhibby]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170723/d697c65df2c1e7fdf4118e0d54a20ae1.jpg


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[makaveli1875]

The huns cheating almost ruined scottish football , the titles should be stripped .

[21.05.2016]

I care little for Rangers/Sevco. Our board should adopt the same approach. Their threats and intimidations are empty, Scottish football thrived without them and we will do so again. Strip the titles for the sake of Scottish football or we may as well just padlock the metaphorical gates.

This 100%.

[Nutmegged]

Saw this on Twitter yesterday, it's a rough estimate of what fans of each individual club paid to attend SPL games during the EBT years or the decade of deception as that twitter account called it18932

[Jack Hackett]

I care little for Rangers/Sevco. Our board should adopt the same approach. Their threats and intimidations are empty, Scottish football thrived without them and we will do so again. Strip the titles for the sake of Scottish football or we may as well just padlock the metaphorical gates.

Yeah, but... Armageddon, civil unrest, turkeys voting for xmas doncha know

[Ozyhibby]

http://onfieldsofgreen.com/history-will-not-forget-those-who-do-nothing-as-the-stink-of-scandal-pollutes-our-game/

Good article.


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[21.05.2016]

Make all the threats they want, we've heard them all before. Rangers cannot hold everyone to ransom.

[marinello59]

http://onfieldsofgreen.com/history-will-not-forget-those-who-do-nothing-as-the-stink-of-scandal-pollutes-our-game/

Good article.


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It reads like a parody. What a load of pompous tosh.

[greenlex]

http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/news/15428411.Rangers_saga_in_new_twist_as__oldcos__sta lk_the_club/ the sister papers blurb

[jacomo]

http://onfieldsofgreen.com/history-will-not-forget-those-who-do-nothing-as-the-stink-of-scandal-pollutes-our-game/

Good article.


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I got 10 paras in and gave up. Does the article have any relevance to the subject at hand?

As I've said before, a focus on brevity and relevance would really help these people make their case. As it is they are failing to take people with them due to their long winded, self satisfied and obtuse prose.

[21.05.2016]

Would Ragers have won those titles anyway? Maybe, maybe not, we will never actually know but surely the benefit of the doubt has to go against the party who did the wrongdoings i.e Rangers. They wouldn't have had to use seedy deals and underhand tactics and risk punishment if caught if the players in question were going to sign for them anyway.

[Hibs07p]

Make all the threats they want, we've heard them all before. Rangers cannot hold everyone to ransom.

They don't have to hold everyone to ransom, only the people who make the important decisions, and that is really not that many unfortunately.

GGTTH
scottish Cup Winners 2016

[brog]

I got 10 paras in and gave up. Does the article have any relevance to the subject at hand?

As I've said before, a focus on brevity and relevance would really help these people make their case. As it is they are failing to take people with them due to their long winded, self satisfied and obtuse prose.

It's a blog, not a comment on a Fans' Forum. If you'd stuck with it you would have found it had plenty relevance to the subject at hand. Personally I enjoyed the historical & literary allusions & found it an interesting & different perspective on a well worn story. Each to their own.

[Ozyhibby]

http://forums.scottishfootballforums.co.uk/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_id=2781


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[Ozyhibby]

https://www.aidanearley.org/news/
It looks very much like Craig Whyte and Aiden Earley want their club back. [emoji23]


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[Sergey]

https://www.aidanearley.org/news/
It looks very much like Craig Whyte and Aiden Earley want their club back. [emoji23]


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Aiden is bent to his marrow - as was his late brother, Brendan who was a company accountant at a dodgy publishing outfit I worked at around 25 years ago. Not one ounce of honesty to be found in the whole family.

He does know tax law and is probably getting advice from the ex-owner of said publishing company.

[Ozyhibby]

Aiden is bent to his marrow - as was his late brother, Brendan who was a company accountant at a dodgy publishing outfit I worked at around 25 years ago. Not one ounce of honesty to be found in the whole family.

He does know tax law and is probably getting advice from the ex-owner of said publishing company.

So not as bad as all the other chancers involved in all this? [emoji23]


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[Ozyhibby]

The letter before action above is probably this one referred to here:-
https://www.channel4.com/news/by/alex-thomson/blogs/craig-whytes-lawyers-send-letter-action


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[CropleyWasGod]

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/15428043.Rangers___39_oldcos__39__stalk_the_club/?ref=twtrec


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This bit seems to have gone without comment:-

BDO will now also pursue more than 80 former players and staff, like Murray and former club captain Barry Ferguson, who benefited from an elaborate tax avoidance scheme – Employee Benefit Trusts, which the Supreme Court ruled were disguised salary payments. The recipients will be forced to pay back millions of pounds to the HMRC through BDO or face bankruptcy. It is believed that the Revenue has recovered more than £1bn from other of those schemes.

I'm not so sure that BDO can do this, or even if the Herald are just speculating. If BDO do take action, though, it's going to prolong the liquidation by years whilst the various legal battles play out. If they're successful, it may be game on again for a decent payout to creditors.

[oneone73]

This bit seems to have gone without comment:-

BDO will now also pursue more than 80 former players and staff, like Murray and former club captain Barry Ferguson, who benefited from an elaborate tax avoidance scheme – Employee Benefit Trusts, which the Supreme Court ruled were disguised salary payments. The recipients will be forced to pay back millions of pounds to the HMRC through BDO or face bankruptcy. It is believed that the Revenue has recovered more than £1bn from other of those schemes.

I'm not so sure that BDO can do this, or even if the Herald are just speculating. If BDO do take action, though, it's going to prolong the liquidation by years whilst the various legal battles play out. If they're successful, it may be game on again for a decent payout to creditors.

Would Whittaker be affected?

[Ozyhibby]

Would Whittaker be affected?

Don't remember ever seeing him or Thomson on the list.


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[Ozyhibby]

Don't remember ever seeing him or Thomson on the list.


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Latapy might have had one though?


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[Spike Mandela]

Would Whittaker be affected?

Ian Murray only Hibby I can see....


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-34118126

[Ozyhibby]

Today is the SPFL AGM which makes Hibs decision to only get round to discuss this at next Monday's board meeting baffling. There will be a decision made today on this and we don't know how Hibs are going to vote? Has an executive decision been made without the approval of the board?
Can you provide any info please Tracey?


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[CropleyWasGod]

[QUOTE=Ozyhibby;5112292]Today is the SPFL AGM which makes Hibs decision to only get round to discuss this at next Monday's board meeting baffling. There will be a decision made today on this and we don't know how Hibs are going to vote? Has an executive decision been made without the approval of the board?
Can you provide any info please Tracey?


Is it on the agenda? I'd be surprised if this was part of the business of an AGM.

[Ozyhibby]

[QUOTE=Ozyhibby;5112292]Today is the SPFL AGM which makes Hibs decision to only get round to discuss this at next Monday's board meeting baffling. There will be a decision made today on this and we don't know how Hibs are going to vote? Has an executive decision been made without the approval of the board?
Can you provide any info please Tracey?


Is it on the agenda? I'd be surprised if this was part of the business of an AGM.

I'd be shocked if it was not discussed today seen as all the chairmen/women will be there.
Be good if Tracey can clarify though.


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[CropleyWasGod]

[QUOTE=CropleyWasGod;5112299]

I'd be shocked if it was not discussed today seen as all the chairmen/women will be there.
Be good if Tracey can clarify though.


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That's not what an AGM is usually for, though.

Have you seen the agenda?

[Ozyhibby]

[QUOTE=Ozyhibby;5112310]

That's not what an AGM is usually for, though.

Have you seen the agenda?

No. Do you not think they will announce something today from Hampden?


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[CropleyWasGod]

[QUOTE=CropleyWasGod;5112320]

No. Do you not think they will announce something today from Hampden?


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I don't know. I'd be surprised, though, if they used the AGM to discuss ongoing company business.

[worcesterhibby]

[QUOTE=Ozyhibby;5112337]

I don't know. I'd be surprised, though, if they used the AGM to discuss ongoing company business.

I'd agree..AGM's tend to be a report on the previous year (with an emphasis on finance). Shareholders with voting rights vote on current issues, such as appointments to the company's board of directors, executive compensation, dividend payments (although I don't believe this is relevant in this case ?). I'm sure they will do everything they can to avoid talking about Rangers EBT's

[Hibs07p]

according to this https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/1324457/barry-ferguson-bankrupt-taxman-bills-rangers/
Barry Fergusson has been declared bankrupt.


BARRY BANKRUPT Rangers hero Barry Ferguson bankrupt with debts of over £1.4 million after failing to settle tax bills


The ex-Scotland captain was declared insolvent after failing to settle large bills thought to be owed to the taxman



By Stuart MacDonald


24th July 2017, 11:29 am
Updated: 24th July 2017, 11:38 am


FORMER Rangers star Barry Ferguson has been made bankrupt with debts of more than £1.4 million.

The ex-Scotland captain was declared insolvent after failing to settle large bills thought to be owed to the taxman.
He is one of a number of former Ibrox stars who faced paying back money they had received in Employee Benefit Trusts (EBTs) after Rangers lost a battle with HMRC at the Supreme Court earlier this month.

Ferguson, 39, who recently stepped down as manager of Clyde, received £2.5 million in EBT payments.

He also invested in a film production partnership called Eclipse which has targeted by HMRC after being ruled to be a tax avoidance scheme.

Ferguson had a glittering career which included captaining Rangers to a host of honours. He also had spells in the English Premier League with Blackburn Rovers and Birmingham City.
He applied for his own bankruptcy after running up debts of £1,425,633 and it was approved by the Accountant In Bankruptcy, Scotland’s insolvency service, earlier this month.

A bankruptcy trustee, Maureen Leslie of Glasgow-based insolvency specialists MLM Solutions, has been appointed to take control of his assets and try to recover money owed to creditors.

Ferguson, who lives in a gated mansion near Larkhall, Lanarkshire, has declared that he has only £3,000 worth of assets available to help pay off his creditors.

The so-called Rangers ‘big tax case’ centred on the use of EBTs. More than £47million was paid to players, managers and directors between 2001 and 2010 in tax-free loans.

Earlier this month judges found that ‘loans’ paid to players and staff were in fact taxable earnings, in a decision that brought to a close legal proceedings that have dragged on for years.

HMRC said the ruling proved the EBT scheme was ‘contrived’ in that it presented payments as ‘loans’ rather than earnings, amounting to ‘tax avoidance’.
Ferguson was previously listed as a director with Eclipse Film Partners No.9, a scheme which allowed investors the opportunity to claim tax relief through investing in the production of movies.

In April last year, the Supreme Court upheld a judgement that one of the biggest partnerships, Eclipse 35, was a tax-avoidance scheme.

HMRC has used that judgement to issue demands to investors, who include several footballers and managers, in the other 38 similar partnerships.

Midfielder Ferguson was capped 45 times for his country and was widely regarded as one of the most gifted players of his generation.

He won the Scottish Premier League, Scottish Cup and Scottish League Cup five times each during his two spells at Rangers.

He was transferred to Blackburn in a £7.5 million deal in 2003 but returned to Ibrox two years later.

After retiring from the game he was appointed manager of Scottish League Two Club Clyde in 2014 but stepped down in February this year. He has recently been working as a football pundit.

Ferguson joins a list of former Old Firm stars who have gone bust in recent years including Chris Sutton, Craig Beattie, Colin Hendry, Rab Douglas, Kevin Drinkell and Bobby Petta.

Former Rangers star Gordon Durie was also declared bankrupt last year with debts of more than £200,000 after investing in a film production scheme.

GGTTH

[ian cruise]

Saw this on Twitter yesterday, it's a rough estimate of what fans of each individual club paid to attend SPL games during the EBT years or the decade of deception as that twitter account called it18932

And 5 of those clubs also signed players they couldn't afford and used administration to cover their bad management, some more than once. I'm not sticking up for Rangers but they weren't the only ones who were winning trophies with players they couldn't afford. Do we retrospectively take those trophies away too?

[Ozyhibby]

And 5 of those clubs also signed players they couldn't afford and used administration to cover their bad management, some more than once. I'm not sticking up for Rangers but they weren't the only ones who were winning trophies with players they couldn't afford. Do we retrospectively take those trophies away too?

They weren't paying their players outside of their declared contracts as lodged with the SFA. Although I suspect Hearts were, there is no proof.
Rangers were committing fraud and have been caught. All the evidence is there. It's a slam dunk. I wish it were the same for the yams but it's not unfortunately.


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[Keith_M]

And 5 of those clubs also signed players they couldn't afford and used administration to cover their bad management, some more than once. I'm not sticking up for Rangers but they weren't the only ones who were winning trophies with players they couldn't afford. Do we retrospectively take those trophies away too?


If they broke any SFA rules regarding the registration of players/contracts, then yes, why not.

[Is It On....]

according to this https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/1324457/barry-ferguson-bankrupt-taxman-bills-rangers/
Barry Fergusson has been declared bankrupt.


BARRY BANKRUPT Rangers hero Barry Ferguson bankrupt with debts of over £1.4 million after failing to settle tax bills


The ex-Scotland captain was declared insolvent after failing to settle large bills thought to be owed to the taxman



By Stuart MacDonald


24th July 2017, 11:29 am
Updated: 24th July 2017, 11:38 am


FORMER Rangers star Barry Ferguson has been made bankrupt with debts of more than £1.4 million.

The ex-Scotland captain was declared insolvent after failing to settle large bills thought to be owed to the taxman.
He is one of a number of former Ibrox stars who faced paying back money they had received in Employee Benefit Trusts (EBTs) after Rangers lost a battle with HMRC at the Supreme Court earlier this month.

Ferguson, 39, who recently stepped down as manager of Clyde, received £2.5 million in EBT payments.

He also invested in a film production partnership called Eclipse which has targeted by HMRC after being ruled to be a tax avoidance scheme.

Ferguson had a glittering career which included captaining Rangers to a host of honours. He also had spells in the English Premier League with Blackburn Rovers and Birmingham City.
He applied for his own bankruptcy after running up debts of £1,425,633 and it was approved by the Accountant In Bankruptcy, Scotland’s insolvency service, earlier this month.

A bankruptcy trustee, Maureen Leslie of Glasgow-based insolvency specialists MLM Solutions, has been appointed to take control of his assets and try to recover money owed to creditors.

Ferguson, who lives in a gated mansion near Larkhall, Lanarkshire, has declared that he has only £3,000 worth of assets available to help pay off his creditors.

The so-called Rangers ‘big tax case’ centred on the use of EBTs. More than £47million was paid to players, managers and directors between 2001 and 2010 in tax-free loans.

Earlier this month judges found that ‘loans’ paid to players and staff were in fact taxable earnings, in a decision that brought to a close legal proceedings that have dragged on for years.

HMRC said the ruling proved the EBT scheme was ‘contrived’ in that it presented payments as ‘loans’ rather than earnings, amounting to ‘tax avoidance’.
Ferguson was previously listed as a director with Eclipse Film Partners No.9, a scheme which allowed investors the opportunity to claim tax relief through investing in the production of movies.

In April last year, the Supreme Court upheld a judgement that one of the biggest partnerships, Eclipse 35, was a tax-avoidance scheme.

HMRC has used that judgement to issue demands to investors, who include several footballers and managers, in the other 38 similar partnerships.

Midfielder Ferguson was capped 45 times for his country and was widely regarded as one of the most gifted players of his generation.

He won the Scottish Premier League, Scottish Cup and Scottish League Cup five times each during his two spells at Rangers.

He was transferred to Blackburn in a £7.5 million deal in 2003 but returned to Ibrox two years later.

After retiring from the game he was appointed manager of Scottish League Two Club Clyde in 2014 but stepped down in February this year. He has recently been working as a football pundit.

Ferguson joins a list of former Old Firm stars who have gone bust in recent years including Chris Sutton, Craig Beattie, Colin Hendry, Rab Douglas, Kevin Drinkell and Bobby Petta.

Former Rangers star Gordon Durie was also declared bankrupt last year with debts of more than £200,000 after investing in a film production scheme.

GGTTH

How can you be declared bankrupt whilst living in a "gated mansion"? I assume that this will be either the major part of his assets to be realised or the "hoose" and other assets are in his wife's name and he will be able to carry on as if nothing has happened.

[CropleyWasGod]

How can you be declared bankrupt whilst living in a "gated mansion"? I assume that this will be either the major part of his assets to be realised or the "hoose" and other assets are in his wife's name and he will be able to carry on as if nothing has happened.

This is what will happen.

The Trustee takes possession of all of his assets, realises them, and distributes the proceeds amongst his creditors. In time, BF will have to move out.

If the house is in his wife's name, the timing of doing that is crucial. If he did it years ago, ie before the film-investment tax thing started, she may be able to hang on to it. Any time after that, and his share is up for grabs.

[Is It On....]

[QUOTE=Ozyhibby;5112337]

I don't know. I'd be surprised, though, if they used the AGM to discuss ongoing company business.

Can HMRC go after Barry Ferguson for unpaid tax relating to the EBT after his bankruptcy?

[CropleyWasGod]

[QUOTE=CropleyWasGod;5112356]

Can HMRC go after Barry Ferguson for unpaid tax relating to the EBT after his bankruptcy?

If they have already, they'll stand in line with the other creditors.

If they haven't yet, then they can't.

There isn't much to go on in the Sun's report, but I suspect that HMRC have forced the bankruptcy over his investment in the film schemes that have caught so many out (Darren Jackson, IIRC).

[Ozyhibby]

I would imagine this is more about the film tax evasion.
It's prob too early for HMRC to has started chasing players for EBT debts yet.


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[CropleyWasGod]

I would imagine this is more about the film tax evasion.
It's prob to early for HMRC to has started chasing players for EBT debts yet.


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:agree:

BF will have had his assessment some time (probably a few years) ago, and had the chance to pay it. The likelihood is that HMRC have already taken him to Court to force payment, and obtained a Court order. His inability to pay will have forced the latest step.

[AndyM_1875]

[QUOTE=CropleyWasGod;5112356]

Can HMRC go after Barry Ferguson for unpaid tax relating to the EBT after his bankruptcy?


If the tax owed is included in the Bankruptcy order then HMRC cannot take anything.
This happened to a friend of mine's business.

If HMRC are chasing additional tax debts incurred pre-dating a Bankruptcy then doubtful they'll get anything.

[JeMeSouviens]

Chris McLaughlin‏ @BBCchrismclaug

#Hibs chairman Rod Petrie emerges from #SPFL AGM and confirms new board will review Rangers' use of EBTs following Supreme Court verdict

[Bostonhibby]

Chris McLaughlin‏ @BBCchrismclaug

#Hibs chairman Rod Petrie emerges from #SPFL AGM and confirms new board will review Rangers' use of EBTs following Supreme Court verdictSome significant changes to the Board executive today? A the rangers man replacing Lawell and Mrs Budge still there. Two turkeys that might fancy deferring the festive season as far as trophies gained unfairly go?



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[FilipinoHibs]

[QUOTE=Is It On....;5112402]


If the tax owed is included in the Bankruptcy order then HMRC cannot take anything.
This happened to a friend of mine's business.

If HMRC are chasing additional tax debts incurred pre-dating a Bankruptcy then doubtful they'll get anything.

Barry declared bankrupt according to Herald.

[snooky]

[QUOTE=AndyM_1875;5112482]

Barry declared bankrupt according to Herald.

"Former Rangers and Scotland captain Barry Ferguson has been declared bankrupt after owing tax debts of over £1.4million. The midfielder was made insolvent after he did not settle large bills believed to be owed to the taxman. The 39-year-old, who was paid £2.5million in Employee Benefit Trusts (EBTs) at Rangers, filed for his own bankruptcy after racking up debts of £1,425,633." - Dundee Evening Telegraph

[AndyM_1875]

Some significant changes to the Board executive today? A the rangers man replacing Lawell and Mrs Budge still there. Two turkeys that might fancy deferring the festive season as far as trophies gained unfairly go?



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Lawell's move is tactical so the bams can't point the finger at him whilst this goes down. He'll probably come back next year.

Cue a "strongly worded statement" from the SPFL slating David Murray/Rangers/Sevco and then some platitudes about "moving on for the good of the game" before business as usual.

[Hibs07p]

Some significant changes to the Board executive today? A the rangers man replacing Lawell and Mrs Budge still there. Two turkeys that might fancy deferring the festive season as far as trophies gained unfairly go?



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If you read the first paragraph, and the last two JJ may have hit the nail on the head, I don't know.

https://johnjamessite.com/2017/07/20/lawwells-long-game/


GGTTH

[Bostonhibby]

Lawell's move is tactical so the bams can't point the finger at him whilst this goes down. He'll probably come back next year.

Cue a "strongly worded statement" from the SPFL slating David Murray/Rangers/Sevco and then some platitudes about "moving on for the good of the game" before business as usual.

Wouldn't be at all surprised if you're right.

[Bostonhibby]

If you read the first paragraph, and the last two JJ may have hit the nail on the head, I don't know.

https://johnjamessite.com/2017/07/20/lawwells-long-game/


GGTTH

Certainly another interesting take on it, C'mon the Appeal board.:greengrin

[BegbieHSC]

It's joyful to watch the hun implosion over Petrie. They're all over twitter/forums warning us about coming near Ibrox in two weeks time :greengrin:greengrin:greengrin

[Bostonhibby]

It's joyful to watch the hun implosion over Petrie. They're all over twitter/forums warning us about coming near Ibrox in two weeks time :greengrin:greengrin:greengrin

And yet (if I understand the SPFL Hierarchy correctly) if the titles are stripped it won't be as a result of a vote by Our Rod(?)

Are the the huns as stupid as the huns who used to follow the now defunct Glasgow rangers ?

[BegbieHSC]

And yet (if I understand the SPFL Hierarchy correctly) if the titles are stripped it won't be as a result of a vote by Our Rod(?)

Are the the huns as stupid as the huns who used to follow the now defunct Glasgow rangers ?

They are indeed. If you want a real laugh on a Monday afternoon, take a wee gander onto follow follow, and have a swatch at their thread on Petrie...

[Jack]

How can you be declared bankrupt whilst living in a "gated mansion"? I assume that this will be either the major part of his assets to be realised or the "hoose" and other assets are in his wife's name and he will be able to carry on as if nothing has happened.

I've no idea where he lives but it's not beyond the realms of possibility that Barry the crab lives in one of many flats in the [developed] gated mansion.

[Spike Mandela]

Conversely, I fully expect Petrie to advise the new SPFL board on a strategy for avoiding doing anything regarding the worst sporting scandal in British football, as he and his fellow SFA lickspittles have done.

[Ozyhibby]

Just catching up, been at the cinema all afternoon watching Captain Underpants.
Well done Rod Petrie, although I'm waiting to see what the scope of any review is before forgiving him his sins. Surely they can't try the same old trick they did with LNS?
Anyway, hopefully more detail later today.


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[Radium]

What is Petrie's role on the SPFL board? or was it a full meeting.
Thought he was on the Professional Game board (or whatever it's called) and SFA blazer.




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[JeMeSouviens]

Conversely, I fully expect Petrie to advise the new SPFL board on a strategy for avoiding doing anything regarding the worst sporting scandal in British football, as he and his fellow SFA lickspittles have done.

Think you're right but at least it's winding up the Huns. :wink:

The only way the SFA/SPFL will do anything is if there is sustained, organised fan pressure. The mentality is sweep it under the rug* whenever possible.

* Ironic given Wiggy Milne finally gave up on his.

[JeMeSouviens]

what is petrie's role on the spfl board? or was it a full meeting.
thought he was on the professional game board (or whatever it's called) and sfa blazer.




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spfl agm.

[Bostonhibby]

They are indeed. If you want a real laugh on a Monday afternoon, take a wee gander onto follow follow, and have a swatch at their thread on Petrie...Jeez, suddenly kickback looks rationale and full of intellectuals. If only I could get back in[emoji1]



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[Ozyhibby]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170724/1cbc8291f6c92542dbfd20a525d03ebe.png


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[SirDavidsNapper]

I'm feeling rather exuberant this afternoon

[Fuzzywuzzy]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170724/1cbc8291f6c92542dbfd20a525d03ebe.png


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Not unexpected. Weak and spineless. How can that wreck of a club hold so much sway over the governing body. There must be a lot of bodies at the bottom of the pond.

[The_Sauz]

They weren't paying their players outside of their declared contracts as lodged with the SFA. Although I suspect Hearts were, there is no proof.
Rangers were committing fraud and have been caught. All the evidence is there. It's a slam dunk. I wish it were the same for the yams but it's not unfortunately.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Now I could be wrong, but I'm sure Vlad was trying to get Hearts players to sign new contracts under Kaunas FC and then loan them back to Hearts! That way they would be taxed in Lithuania at a reduced tax level than here in the UK :agree:
Craig Gordon was one player who refused to sign a new contract at Hearts (he was going to do so before he found it was a Kaunas contract) and that was the start of the player rebellion against Mad Vlad.

[Spike Mandela]

Not unexpected. Weak and spineless. How can that wreck of a club hold so much sway over the governing body. There must be a lot of bodies at the bottom of the pond.

All of them including Dempster and Petrie complicit if this is the case. Their silence is deafening as they already have our season ticket money.and couldn't give a **** about sporting integrity or all the things that were so important to them when they needed our money in 2012.

[Is It On....]

I've no idea where he lives but it's not beyond the realms of possibility that Barry the crab lives in one of many flats in the [developed] gated mansion.

After allegedly breaking the law and evading tax, maybe he is readying himself to a move to a different type of "gated mansion" in the next few years...

[Ozyhibby]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170724/7da2590b1054e90306fba05cc30f7516.png
Definitely looks like they are preparing to ask us all to move on.


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[green day]

All of them including Dempster and Petrie complicit if this is the case. Their silence is deafening as they already have our season ticket money.and couldn't give a **** about sporting integrity or all the things that were so important to them when they needed our money in 2012.

I think the phrase "legal advice being sought" is the important one before you throw LD and RP under any buses.

I am unclear what people want done here?

Results changed?

Any ideas on who "won" the tours de france that Lance had ceremonially removed? Me neither, as nobody really gives a toss as its such a mess.

Or is it just to remove their wins from the record books? What difference will it actually make in the real world???

Serious questions, by the way, not trying to be controversial.

[Ozyhibby]

I think the phrase "legal advice being sought" is the important one before you throw LD and RP under any buses.

I am unclear what people want done here?

Results changed?

Any ideas on who "won" the tours de france that Lance had ceremonially removed? Me neither, as nobody really gives a toss as its such a mess.

Or is it just to remove their wins from the record books? What difference will it actually make in the real world???

Serious questions, by the way, not trying to be controversial.

Just apply the rules. Teams who play players who are not registered properly forfeit the match.
Their wins should be removed from the record books.
When Spartans failed to register a player properly for a Scottish cup game they were disqualified, why should it be different for Rangers?



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[Ozyhibby]

https://thecelticblog.com/2017/07/blogs/the-bbc-understands-that-the-new-inquiry-is-a-sham-just-pile-more-fuel-on-the-fire-then/


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[JeMeSouviens]

I think the phrase "legal advice being sought" is the important one before you throw LD and RP under any buses.

I am unclear what people want done here?

Results changed?

Any ideas on who "won" the tours de france that Lance had ceremonially removed? Me neither, as nobody really gives a toss as its such a mess.

Or is it just to remove their wins from the record books? What difference will it actually make in the real world???

Serious questions, by the way, not trying to be controversial.

It sends a signal (albeit about a million years too late) that cheating won't be tolerated and the rules will (eventually) be applied. I want Regan sacked as well tbh. Then I want someoe appointed who actually gives a **** about running a sport.

Ask yourself this: if the New Huns come up with a new dodgy way to bend the rules (and let's face it, with their "glib and shameless liar" at the helm, that's hardly a stretch), do you trust Scottish football's authorities to be right on top of it and robustly stamp it out?

[green day]

Just apply the rules. Teams who play players who are not registered properly forfeit the match.
Their wins should be removed from the record books.
When Spartans failed to register a player properly for a Scottish cup game they were disqualified, why should it be different for Rangers?
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I get that and I am all for ramming anything right up the Rangers, but..........

What I am asking is - in a practical sense - what does disqualifying them from a tournament XYZ years ago mean?

If you played the Huns in a semi final do you get to replay the final (ridiculous of course), but you get my drift now?

[Spike Mandela]

I think the phrase "legal advice being sought" is the important one before you throw LD and RP under any buses.

I am unclear what people want done here?

Results changed?

Any ideas on who "won" the tours de france that Lance had ceremonially removed? Me neither, as nobody really gives a toss as its such a mess.

Or is it just to remove their wins from the record books? What difference will it actually make in the real world???

Serious questions, by the way, not trying to be controversial.

Legal advice being sought can be tailored to suit any agenda they so wish as was seen in the restricted framework and lack of information given to the LNS commission.

The legal advice sought will be on how to fudge this whole issue and will not be open and transparent to the public.

It's a crock of ****!

[Ozyhibby]

It sends a signal (albeit about a million years too late) that cheating won't be tolerated and the rules will (eventually) be applied. I want Regan sacked as well tbh. Then I want someoe appointed who actually gives a **** about running a sport.

Ask yourself this: if the New Huns come up with a new dodgy way to bend the rules (and let's face it, with their "glib and shameless liar" at the helm, that's hardly a stretch), do you trust Scottish football's authorities to be right on top of it and robustly stamp it out?

Exactly. We still do not have a proper FFP rule in place and a robust way of monitoring clubs spending.


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[green day]

Exactly. We still do not have a proper FFP rule in place and a robust way of monitoring clubs spending.


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I thought there were Eufa rules on financial fair play?

[Ozyhibby]

I thought there were Eufa rules on financial fair play?

They only apply if you qualify for Europe.


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[Ozyhibby]

They only apply if you qualify for Europe.


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And appear not to be enforced, as Sevco clearly breached them this season but were allowed to play anyway.


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[Smartie]

Just apply the rules. Teams who play players who are not registered properly forfeit the match.
Their wins should be removed from the record books.
When Spartans failed to register a player properly for a Scottish cup game they were disqualified, why should it be different for Rangers?



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Maybe that is not what the rules actually state?

I don't think this is as as simple as many people would like it to be. Dempster, Budge and all the other chairpeople (?) are answerable to their own fans and given the depth of feeling over this, I'm sure they'll want to represent the feelings of the fans.

Maybe there isn't actually a bulletproof legal process they can go through to strip titles? There certainly isn't a precedent. I see what you mean about Spartans being kicked out of a competition, but that happened at the time. Is there a rule that suggests titles can be stripped years after the event if a team has been found to field ineligible players?

I agree that titles should be stripped, but I say that with no knowledge of how the rules actually work. Might it be that proper legal advice HAS been sought and that there is genuinely nowhere for the authorities to go?

Throughout this whole Rangers fiasco, lots of people have suddenly become experts on everything from tax and company law to TUPE regulations and now onto the rules of football. I struggle to understand enough about my professional field of expertise without really knowing anything about any of this, although I know what I would like to be the case.

(I'm mainly trying to be devil's advocate btw).

[GreenNWhiteArmy]

I get that and I am all for ramming anything right up the Rangers, but..........

What I am asking is - in a practical sense - what does disqualifying them from a tournament XYZ years ago mean?

If you played the Huns in a semi final do you get to replay the final (ridiculous of course), but you get my drift now?

I'm of the exact same position Green Day. In theory yeah it sounds great but it goes deeper than making said trophies null and void imo. Teams that lost semi finals, teams that potentially got relegated due to losses again the rangers.

Honestly I don't know the answers and wonder if we would be so persistent if it was Dundee, or a club further down the pyramid.

[marinello59]

Maybe that is not what the rules actually state?

I don't think this is as as simple as many people would like it to be. Dempster, Budge and all the other chairpeople (?) are answerable to their own fans and given the depth of feeling over this, I'm sure they'll want to represent the feelings of the fans.

Maybe there isn't actually a bulletproof legal process they can go through to strip titles? There certainly isn't a precedent. I see what you mean about Spartans being kicked out of a competition, but that happened at the time. Is there a rule that suggests titles can be stripped years after the event if a team has been found to field ineligible players?

I agree that titles should be stripped, but I say that with no knowledge of how the rules actually work. Might it be that proper legal advice HAS been sought and that there is genuinely nowhere for the authorities to go?

Throughout this whole Rangers fiasco, lots of people have suddenly become experts on everything from tax and company law to TUPE regulations and now onto the rules of football. I struggle to understand enough about my professional field of expertise without really knowing anything about any of this, although I know what I would like to be the case.

(I'm mainly trying to be devil's advocate btw).

If people are being honest the real driving force behind seing titles stripped is not sporting integrity but the desire to see Sevco given another good kicking. I have no problem with that, I'd love to see their titles removed :greengrin
If sporting integrity really mattered so much to fitba fans there would have been a massive clamour to see Hearts face further punishment for their financial doping. Apart from Hibs fans it did not happen, nobody else really cared. The authorities have to apply the rules and if none exist saying that title stripping ws a potential punishment then it makes it hard to do so.

[Ozyhibby]

I'm of the exact same position Green Day. In theory yeah it sounds great but it goes deeper than making said trophies null and void imo. Teams that lost semi finals, teams that potentially got relegated due to losses again the rangers.

Honestly I don't know the answers and wonder if we would be so persistent if it was Dundee, or a club further down the pyramid.

If it was Dundee it would have happened by now.
You can't repair all the damage caused by this, all you can do is send a message that it will not be rewarded.
Lance Armstrong got guys thrown of his team who would not dope, ending their careers. There is nothing that can be done to help them but at least cycling done the right thing and voided all his results.
It is within the SPFL's power to void any title it awarded. That is a standard rule in all sports admin.


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[Spike Mandela]

Throughout this whole Rangers fiasco, lots of people have suddenly become experts on everything from tax and company law to TUPE regulations and now onto the rules of football. I struggle to understand enough about my professional field of expertise without really knowing anything about any of this, although I know what I would like to be the case.

(I'm mainly trying to be devil's advocate btw).

Yeah, we are all simpletons because we don't know the legalese.

Cheats are cheats and it really isn't that difficult to see this for heaven's sake.

What we have become expert on is the corrupt/incompetent arse covering of our so called governing authorities whose agenda from day 1 has been to sweep all this under the carpet, protecting Rangers from every available sanction and treating ordinary punters like us as as if we were ****ing idiots.

As you may gather it makes my ****ing blood boil.:greengrin

[Keith_M]

To answer the earlier question about what would be achieved.


As a Football Fan, I want to know the competitions my team takes part in have the same rules for all participating clubs. For example if one club can be ejected from a Cup Competition for having one improperly registered player, then all clubs should be subject to the same rules, otherwise the whole thing is unfair. In the case of Rangers, they had multiple improperly registered players over a number of years (side-letter contracts).

Even if you consider the current Rangers to be a new club, then retrospective stripping of titles is still necessary, to send out a message that when the rules are broken, the punishment will be meted out, regadless of who the club is.


If there are rules for some clubs and different rules for others, then we might as well just give up the whole thing.

[Ozyhibby]

If people are being honest the real driving force behind seing titles stripped is not sporting integrity but the desire to see Sevco given another good kicking. I have no problem with that, I'd love to see their titles removed :greengrin
If sporting integrity really mattered so much to fitba fans there would have been a massive clamour to see Hearts face further punishment for their financial doping. Apart from Hibs fans it did not happen, nobody else really cared. The authorities have to apply the rules and if none exist saying that title stripping ws a potential punishment then it makes it hard to do so.

There are rules that allow title stripping. Happy to go after the yams as well but there is no evidence against them out in the public domain.


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[Ozyhibby]

Maybe that is not what the rules actually state?

I don't think this is as as simple as many people would like it to be. Dempster, Budge and all the other chairpeople (?) are answerable to their own fans and given the depth of feeling over this, I'm sure they'll want to represent the feelings of the fans.

Maybe there isn't actually a bulletproof legal process they can go through to strip titles? There certainly isn't a precedent. I see what you mean about Spartans being kicked out of a competition, but that happened at the time. Is there a rule that suggests titles can be stripped years after the event if a team has been found to field ineligible players?

I agree that titles should be stripped, but I say that with no knowledge of how the rules actually work. Might it be that proper legal advice HAS been sought and that there is genuinely nowhere for the authorities to go?

Throughout this whole Rangers fiasco, lots of people have suddenly become experts on everything from tax and company law to TUPE regulations and now onto the rules of football. I struggle to understand enough about my professional field of expertise without really knowing anything about any of this, although I know what I would like to be the case.

(I'm mainly trying to be devil's advocate btw).

If they have received such legal advice then surely they would have no problem publishing it?
I really think we are heading for another cover up here.


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[Smartie]

I'm of the exact same position Green Day. In theory yeah it sounds great but it goes deeper than making said trophies null and void imo. Teams that lost semi finals, teams that potentially got relegated due to losses again the rangers.

Honestly I don't know the answers and wonder if we would be so persistent if it was Dundee, or a club further down the pyramid.

I used to be of that opinion but I've changed my mind and now think that titles should be stripped.

We are customers, the lifeblood of the game. We need to know for sure that we are watching a fair fight. Do we have confidence that any competition involving Rangers, Sevco, Dave King, Charles Green, Neil Doncaster, Stewart Regan, Campbell Ogilvie and all of the people that were part of the 5 way agreement can put on a fair competition?

I can take Hibs losing, I've sen enough of it over the years. I resent shelling out £400 or so per year to watch a rigged competition. Next year I don't think I'd do it if one establishment club are consistently allowed to piss all over what rules might exist.

Football needs strict rules and strict enforcement so that the Dave Kings, David Murrays and Vladimir Romanovs of this world cannot just do as they choose. Rules must be rules, punishments must be enforced. If you lose you lose and you lick your wounds, but if you win then you know you've done it fairly and can justifiably celebrate.


My concern re the stripping of titles is that it is hard to know where to stop, and you need to consider the spirit of competition. My main 3 concerns about title stripping are

1/ Where do you stop? Half of the league were financial doping in some way. Jambos with their 5-1 this and that, getting on their high horse demanding titles be stripped, just because of a player registration technicality. IMO Hearts' financial transgressions were every bit as bad as Rangers'. Their tainted trophies, their scandalous unfair advantage in more than a decade of derbies yet because of side letters they think they have some moral high ground? How did they ever get away with having players registered with Kaunas and loaned to Hearts? In terms of the spirit of competition, half of Scottish football was bent. Even if titles aren't stripped, the whole episode was shameful for Scottish football and any decent fan (including those of Rangers) will not view any of the competitions won during that period as being valid, even if they remain on the records.

2/ I actually agree that at some point we do need to move on, and soon. It can happen as soon as we have confidence in those running our game. They could help by stripping titles, by sacking some of the figures tainted by corruption, by demonstrating that going forward all clubs INCLUDING RANGERS will play by the same rules, be punished by the same punishments etc etc.

3/ As I said above, there may not actually be a real, legal way for it to be done. Rules are rules - if rules don't exist dictating that titles can be stripped for this misdeed, can they really be stripped?

[Keith_M]

If they have received such legal advice then surely they would have no problem publishing it?
I really think we are heading for another cover up here.


That's been my view all along of what would happen, and the statements coming out now are leading toward that.

[JeMeSouviens]

To answer the earlier question about what would be achieved.


As a Football Fan, I want to know the competitions my team takes part in have the same rules for all participating clubs. For example if one club can be ejected from a Cup Competition for having one improperly registered player, then all clubs should be subject to the same rules, otherwise the whole thing is unfair. In the case of Rangers, they had multiple improperly registered players over a number of years (side-letter contracts).

Even if you consider the current Rangers to be a new club, then retrospective stripping of titles is still necessary, to send out a message that when the rules are broken, the punishment will be meted out, regadless of who the club is.


If there are rules for some clubs and different rules for others, then we might as well just give up the whole thing.

tbh, the fact that there were different rules (and in fact new rules had to be made up on the hoof) for the New Rangers as compared to Gretna 2008 and Airdrie United, pretty much makes that the rational conclusion already.

[green day]

To answer the earlier question about what would be achieved.


As a Football Fan, I want to know the competitions my team takes part in have the same rules for all participating clubs. For example if one club can be ejected from a Cup Competition for having one improperly registered player, then all clubs should be subject to the same rules, otherwise the whole thing is unfair. In the case of Rangers, they had multiple improperly registered players over a number of years (side-letter contracts).

Even if you consider the current Rangers to be a new club, then retrospective stripping of titles is still necessary, to send out a message that when the rules are broken, the punishment will be meted out, regadless of who the club is.


If there are rules for some clubs and different rules for others, then we might as well just give up the whole thing.

Did the Spartans ejection not happen during the tournament though?

And can it be done years after - ie does that rule exist?

I suspect those are the questions being posed - as much as "is it the right thing to do".

[marinello59]

There are rules that allow title stripping. Happy to go after the yams as well but there is no evidence against them out in the public domain.


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I'll take your word for that, I really have no idea. What did the SPL rules say at the time?
You may be happy to go after the Yams as most Hibs fans would be but the fans of other clubs generally couldn't care less about their cheating.

[Keith_M]

Did the Spartans ejection not happen during the tournament though?

And can it be done years after - ie does that rule exist?

I suspect those are the questions being posed - as much as "is it the right thing to do".


What does it matter when it was discovered?

If a crime is covered up well by the perpetrator and the police find out years after, do they just shrug their shoulders and say "oh well, we didn't know about it"?

A crime has still been comitted and they can still arrest and prosecute the people that did wrong.

The alternative is to assume that those covering up their crimes or misdemeanours should just be forgiven, for being clever enough to hide it well at the time.

[greenginger]

There are rules that allow title stripping. Happy to go after the yams as well but there is no evidence against them out in the public domain.


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I think wee Rudi's private deal with Vlad is a stick on if the payments were made by Heart's parent company UBIG but not included on Skacel's contract.

Call first witness , self-sufficient Southern , now of Dundee United.

[lord bunberry]

Budge saying that there's going to be a statement on Wednesday and in her words "that will hopefully be an end to it" doesn't suggest to me that any further action will be taken.

[Ozyhibby]

I think wee Rudi's private deal with Vlad is a stick on if the payments were made by Heart's parent company UBIG but not included on Skacel's contract.

Call first witness , self-sufficient Southern , now of Dundee United.

If we go after Rangers, then a bit of whataboutery might bring this into play.


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[green day]

What does it matter when it was discovered?

If a crime is covered up well by the perpetrator and the police find out years after, do they just shrug their shoulders and say "oh well, we didn't know about it"?

A crime has still been comitted and they can still arrest and prosecute the people that did wrong.

The alternative is to assume that those covering up their crimes or misdemeanours should just be forgiven, for being clever enough to hide it well at the time.

There is a difference between criminalnlaw and the rules of a sporting competition, and I doubt (would put my house on it) that they are remotely close.

Just because plod can go after criminals years after doesn't mean Scottish fitba has a rule saying titles can be stripped.

I will be delighted to be proved wrong.

[Ozyhibby]

There is a difference between criminalnlaw and the rules of a sporting competition, and I doubt (would put my house on it) that they are remotely close.

Just because plod can go after criminals years after doesn't mean Scottish fitba has a rule saying titles can be stripped.

I will be delighted to be proved wrong.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170724/60a4fb582d87a38ce14d0e3b1aa5b510.png



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[brog]

There is one great irony in all of this in that Sevco fans for years have claimed they were robbed of winning the 1st Champions League because Marseille cheated by bribing the opposition. Although this was never proved it was confirmed that Marseille had bribed to win a French league match & they were retroactively stripped of the title, see, it can be done! Incidentally, the league title was offered to PSG but they turned it down. All this stuff about who should benefit if Sevco lose their titles is a red herring. No one needs to benefit but teams who cheat should not be rewarded for their skullduggery.

[Malthibby]

They cheated for years & it has been proven that they cheated for years.
We are well used to institutional bias in Scottish Football, but I was stupid enough to think
that things were improving. If Sevco walk away from this it reinforces all that's wrong with
our football institutions, and it will reinforce the reality of a system which has completely
different rules for certain clubs.
I love watching Hibs, the cup win was one of the best days of my life, but what is the point if
we collude with a corrupt, self-serving system which is designed to multiply the advantages
of a team like Sevco?
Cycling removed the Tour de France titles Armstrong cheated to win, &
it's so much the better for it. Removing old Rangers titles would say that cheating will be
punished, not rewarded. What are we telling the kids otherwise?

[ancient hibee]

If we go after Rangers, then a bit of whataboutery might bring this into play.


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In that case I hope nobody remembers about Gordon Smith taking delivery of the first Porsche sportscar in Scotland (he didn't pay for it)or the difficulty so many of the players had in getting their shoes on after training because of the wads of folding stuff in them.It would be a shame to have those titles taken away.

[green day]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170724/60a4fb582d87a38ce14d0e3b1aa5b510.png



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Those are SPFL rules, are they enforceable pre 2012? I don't know.

Remember when the Huns waved similar rules at us after the cup final and said it would be stripped?

Thats why they will be asking lawyers.

[GreenPJ]

Purge the SFA and SPFL and I could live with that as the outcome.

[ancient hibee]

Purge the SFA and SPFL and I could live with that as the outcome.


You mean close down all the clubs in Scotland.A bit drastic surely?

[lucky]

Rangers gained a financial edge over other clubs but then so has every team who overspent and then entered administration. As for stripping titles what is that going to achieve? Our game needs to move on and try talking it up rather than revisit old issues. We all believe they got an unfair advantage and love reminding them of it.

[Ozyhibby]

Those are SPFL rules, are they enforceable pre 2012? I don't know.

Remember when the Huns waved similar rules at us after the cup final and said it would be stripped?

Thats why they will be asking lawyers.

I was just showing that disqualification even after the fact is always an option in any sports comp rules. Even kids swimming galas have removal of titles in their rules. It would have been in the SPL's rules as well or they would have been shouting from the rooftops that here was nothing they could do.


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[Ozyhibby]

Not convincing at all from Petrie.[emoji35]
http://m.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/40710728?ns_mchannel=social&ns_campaign=bbc_sportsound&ns_source=twitter&ns_linkname=scotland


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[Ozyhibby]

https://stv.tv/sport/football/1394219-spfl-will-not-re-open-inquiry-into-rangers-use-of-ebt-scheme/?utm_content=buffer90e55&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer


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[HoboHarry]

https://stv.tv/sport/football/1394219-spfl-will-not-re-open-inquiry-into-rangers-use-of-ebt-scheme/?utm_content=buffer90e55&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer


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The whole of Scottish football is turning a blind eye to the cheats. Unreal, and I wonder what skeletons are in the closet that are clearly scaring them sh**less.

[snooky]

Not convincing at all from Petrie.[emoji35]
http://m.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/40710728?ns_mchannel=social&ns_campaign=bbc_sportsound&ns_source=twitter&ns_linkname=scotland


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Quick body swerve there, Rod. Barry John would have been proud of that one. Mind you, Barry"s windies wurny at stake.

To be fair, he's saying it"s time to stop poking the cat and move on. Up to a point I agree. (Tin hat firmly on).

[Ozyhibby]

Pretty clear the decision has been taken and Hibs are at the centre of it. Disgusting.


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[DarlingtonHibee]

Quick body swerve there, Rod. Barry John would have been proud of that one. Mind you, Barry"s windies wurny at stake.

To be fair, he's saying it"s time to stop poking the cat and move on. Up to a point I agree. (Tin hat firmly on).
I'm a big RP advocate, but sorry that was poor. They were cheats and should be punished. Don't think I would have got sympathy from HMRC if I hadn't paid my Paye.

[Onion]

https://stv.tv/sport/football/1394219-spfl-will-not-re-open-inquiry-into-rangers-use-of-ebt-scheme/?utm_content=buffer90e55&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer


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SPFL are simply pretending to review the Rangers case, hiding behind "legal advice" in hope of silencing Celtic, club fans and some journos. Much safer outcome for the individuals on the SPFL Board to leave the titles with the Huns than to strip them ! They'll hope that Wednesday's confirmation will put the issue to bed for good.

[ancient hibee]

So when the legal advice says it's a dead duck do you think members of the various boards should ignore it and go ahead with some form of legal action?

[HoboHarry]

So when the legal advice says it's a dead duck do you think members of the various boards should ignore it and go ahead with some form of legal action?
What was the legal advice?

[ancient hibee]

Haven't the faintest idea but perhaps you can tell me.

[green day]

Pretty clear the decision has been taken and Hibs are at the centre of it. Disgusting.


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Aye, Hibs have always been in cahoots with the Hun, I tell ye it's a ****** masonic / Fenian conspiracy.......

[HoboHarry]

Haven't the faintest idea but perhaps you can tell me.
No I can't, I assumed from your question that you actually knew something.