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fatbloke
02-01-2012, 02:03 PM
Not up to the task. Clueless from start to finish. Worst Hibs side ever. That's all.

Devonhibs
02-01-2012, 02:03 PM
Behave yourself, thats not his dross on the pitch.

scott7_0(Prague)
02-01-2012, 02:05 PM
Not up to the task. Clueless from start to finish. Worst Hibs side ever. That's all.

Drama Queen.

fatbloke
02-01-2012, 02:08 PM
Drama Queen.

The Drama Queens are all wearing Hibs jerseys today.

fatbloke
02-01-2012, 02:08 PM
Behave yourself, thats not his dross on the pitch.

Of course it is he continues to select that *******.

HH81
02-01-2012, 02:08 PM
The Drama Queens are all wearing Hibs jerseys today.

Is fenlon wearing one?

ScottB
02-01-2012, 02:09 PM
Yup, lets blame the manager again, couldn't possibly be the useless dross he inherited at the clubs fault could it?

MSK
02-01-2012, 02:09 PM
Of course it is he continues to select that *******.Bollox ..does he have a choice ..?

East Coast Hibe
02-01-2012, 02:10 PM
Fenlon has not started well. His tactics today were at best inept

Captain Trips
02-01-2012, 02:11 PM
Behave yourself, thats not his dross on the pitch.

Yes it is when he bacame manager they became his dross, he has to prove he is better than CC and have his dross improve on what has gone before.

CC got away with it wasnt his players for way to long, these are now Pat's players and he has to improve on what has been happening, still to early imo to judge but I expect to see improvement if he is a better manager. What I am dissapointed in is our first striker we have signed in our rebuild can sign a contract with another club in 1yr.

fatbloke
02-01-2012, 02:11 PM
Fenlon has not started well. His tactics today were at best inept


:agree:

NorthNorfolkHFC
02-01-2012, 02:12 PM
This thread is a nonsense!!!! I feel sorry for him, we have some dross the now!!!

Wilson
02-01-2012, 02:13 PM
What I am dissapointed in is our first striker we have signed in our rebuild can sign a contract with another club in 1yr.

He'll be here longer than Fenlon with a contract that long...

SouthamptonHibs
02-01-2012, 02:13 PM
the whole club is a disgrace!

Board no investment and keep picking crap managers!

Fenlon picks some strange teams! Why no players on the posts at corners?

Every Hibs player, total gash, ubber rubbish! Runners with football boots, these clowns will take us down..

Delighted i didn't waste £300 coming up

Anyway roll on 2012....we will no by 31st Jan which league we'll be in next year..no creative signings = 1st division

The Tubs
02-01-2012, 02:13 PM
Fenlon has not started well. His tactics today were at best inept

I think he set it up no bad the day, taking into consideration the lack of confidence in the squad. My main complaint would have been not making a sub in midfield a wee bit earlier, as you could tell the game was getting stretched and the fresh legs hearts had were making a difference.

Pretty Boy
02-01-2012, 02:14 PM
I feel for Fenlon as he has inherited absolute rubbish.

However his team selection and Alex Milleresque tactics hoping for a point from a Derby today aren't.doing him any favours.

HFC 0-7
02-01-2012, 02:14 PM
Yup, lets blame the manager again, couldn't possibly be the useless dross he inherited at the clubs fault could it?

Fenlons tactics were pretty bad today. Griffiths up front on his own was never going to put them under pressure. Fenlon looked happy with a point as he was going to bring wotherspoon on until they scored the second. We didnt have a shot on target all game. We never threatened all game and IMO the formation and team selection was bad today. Fenlon should have changed things on about 70 mins. Hibs are a shambles and we dont look any more organised than under calderwood. I do hope its ALL down to the players, but Fenlon made a few mistakes today.

skyehibee
02-01-2012, 02:15 PM
I think he set it up no bad the day, taking into consideration the lack of confidence in the squad. My main complaint would have been not making a sub in midfield a wee bit earlier, as you could tell the game was getting stretched and the fresh legs hearts had were making a difference.

Why he didn't take Scott off earlier than he did i will never know?

HFC 0-7
02-01-2012, 02:16 PM
I think he set it up no bad the day, taking into consideration the lack of confidence in the squad. My main complaint would have been not making a sub in midfield a wee bit earlier, as you could tell the game was getting stretched and the fresh legs hearts had were making a difference.

IMO, the way that he set it up meant we wouldnt hold onto the ball for any amount of time and would probably invite pressure, to me that doesnt help players low on confidence as they get no time.

Greenblood70
02-01-2012, 02:17 PM
I feel for Fenlon as he has inherited absolute rubbish.

However his team selection and Alex Milleresque tactics hoping for a point from a Derby today aren't.doing him any favours.

Agree with this, we need to start winning games. We at no point today looked dangerous going forward. There was no attempt to try and win that game wtih any change of tactics or personnel. It was Hertz we were playing not Barcelona ffs. Did we even have a shot on target?

SneakersO'Toole
02-01-2012, 02:17 PM
To not make subs until 85mins today was unforgiveable. Players like scott and sproule were blowing out their erchies. Ultimately, it was Sproule not tracking McGowan that led to their 2nd.

East Coast Hibe
02-01-2012, 02:18 PM
Fenlons tactics were pretty bad today. Griffiths up front on his own was never going to put them under pressure. Fenlon looked happy with a point as he was going to bring wotherspoon on until they scored the second. We didnt have a shot on target all game. We never threatened all game and IMO the formation and team selection was bad today. Fenlon should have changed things on about 70 mins. Hibs are a shambles and we dont look any more organised than under calderwood. I do hope its ALL down to the players, but Fenlon made a few mistakes today.
Correct
He waited far too long to freshen things up. Hibs had a wee spell on the front foot in the second half and he should have done it then. I know he has inherited a bunch of dross, but his tactics and decision making were poor.

hibiedude
02-01-2012, 02:18 PM
Our two main strikers rumoured to be moving on GO to Rangers and Lee,s lone deal now over the future looking very bleak.

Minder
02-01-2012, 02:19 PM
I feel for Fenlon as he has inherited absolute rubbish.

However his team selection and Alex Milleresque tactics hoping for a point from a Derby today aren't.doing him any favours.

Sums up position exactly.

Del Boy
02-01-2012, 02:19 PM
Absolute joke that we never put subs on til last 5 mins, so negative its unreal.

number9dream
02-01-2012, 02:19 PM
Fenlon = Bertie Auld, without the personality...

Hibs are in HUGE trouble.

Saorsa
02-01-2012, 02:20 PM
I feel for Fenlon as he has inherited absolute rubbish.

However his team selection and Alex Milleresque tactics hoping for a point from a Derby today aren't.doing him any favours.I agree, seems like we set out for a point. 1 up front, change of sub after 2nd goal and thus too late tae make any difference.

muzzhfc
02-01-2012, 02:20 PM
i remember a thread asking what is wrong at our club. its the fans getting on the back of the manager/players. they are indeed now "his" players, however i doubt the great fergie could do anything with this bunch. i think there has been an improvement in our players. when its 0-0 or 1-0 we are doing ok, not amazing, but ok. then as soon as we concede, the flood gates open. CC pretty much just had the flood gates open from the start of the match. some of the players arent up to standard, but what are we going to do during a CLOSED transfer window, sign a bunch of journeymen? didnt we slate CC for signing journey men?? the result was disapointing, but to lay the blame at Pat Fenlons door is a disgrace. SUPPORT the team and manager

The Tubs
02-01-2012, 02:21 PM
Until we can get a bit of composure in the team and around the stadium it will continue to be like that.

I remember when all the bairns came through under Williamson - they were all afraid of the ball. It was only when Mowbray signed Boozy that they started to learn to enjoy it - especially Thomson, Brown and above all Whittaker.

We had something like 5 under 21's on the pitch and they'll never become footballers it we don't get the culture right - the older guys we've got around the place aren't going to help with that.

hibee_kane96
02-01-2012, 02:22 PM
Is everyone completely mental? Hibs don't have the quality to go out and take control of a game and expect to get anything out of it. Fenlon played it tactically well. Playing counter attack and using pace up front to nick it! He was not playing for a draw that was clear as day. Individual errors cost us that game. Anyone blaming the manager is clueless.

Westie1875
02-01-2012, 02:22 PM
They may not be his players but they were his tactics, one upfront for 85 mins against them at home was pathetic, and no subs til that point either, awful. Everyone else could see what was going to happen.

chrisski33
02-01-2012, 02:22 PM
Sorry but fenlon has to.take part blame for today. He picked the team and tactics. Why have oconnor and doyle on sub bench for.so long? Doyle is Fenlons player so he not start?
Surely oconnor not coming on sooner in game suggests he is offski or injury worse than thought?

Aldo
02-01-2012, 02:23 PM
Not up to the task. Clueless from start to finish. Worst Hibs side ever. That's all.

Get a ****ing grip. This defeat is down to lack of quality in the team/squad. PF can only pish with the cock he has. Damage limitation and rightly so.

He sets out the team as best he can but the pish on the park cannae even do the basics.

Punt the ****ing lot. He gets me support ENDOF.

Hughes and Coco the ****ing clown to be blamed for the pish bought to the club.

Saorsa
02-01-2012, 02:25 PM
Get a ****ing grip. This defeat is down to lack of quality in the team/squad. PF can only pish with the cock he has. Damage limitation and rightly so.

He sets out the team as best he can but the pish on the park cannae even do the basics.

Punt the ****ing lot. He gets me support ENDOF.

Hughes and Coco the ****ing clown to be blamed for the pish bought to the club.And who brought them tae the club (and kept them there far too long) the clear out needs tae start right at the top

Part/Time Supporter
02-01-2012, 02:27 PM
Fenlon could have gone for it with 15-20 to go by sticking on a second striker, but that would most likely have caused a gap in that weak defence to open up. I don't really see what else he could have done. The players worked hard enough. The biggest problem is they cannot defend, particularly in the air. He needs to sign a dominant centre half or they will get relegated.

SouthamptonHibs
02-01-2012, 02:27 PM
players need to take the blame but Pat has to take a bit today! Getting beat from Hearts 3v1 a Hearts team that hadn't scored in over 7 hours away from home and they score 3!

Negative tactics, 4-5-1 at home, how good is our new signing if he can't get a game from the start?

No players on the posts at corners! 85mins before making subs, a team that never had a shot on goal

Pat's gothis work cut out but he's not helping himself playing this way

Franck Stanton
02-01-2012, 02:29 PM
Is everyone completely mental? Hibs don't have the quality to go out and take control of a game and expect to get anything out of it. Fenlon played it tactically well. Playing counter attack and using pace up front to nick it! He was not playing for a draw that was clear as day. Individual errors cost us that game. Anyone blaming the manager is clueless.


Correct, after all, he can only wee-wee with the tinkle he has

Makaveli
02-01-2012, 02:29 PM
GOC and Doyle weren't fully fit though. I thought Griffiths did alright with a hard task against those brutes.

Today isn't fenlon's fault.

Face it and accept it: Hearts are much, much better than us. Both clubs are in a false position right now: Hughes/CC have us where we are and they've been consistently beating us for 7 years with a side full of players they can't and could never afford.

We'll recover and they'll pay for it soon enough.

PapillonVert
02-01-2012, 02:31 PM
Not up to the task. Clueless from start to finish. Worst Hibs side ever. That's all.

To paraphrase previous comments on Managers over the past few seasons:

Mixu - "inept", "tactically clueless", "useless team selection", "crap substitutions" etc. etc.

Yogi - "inept", "tactically clueless", "useless team selection", "crap substitutions" etc. etc.

Caldo - "inept", "tactically clueless", "useless team selection, "crap substitutions" etc. etc.

Maybe, just maybe, it's not the Manager's tactics, team selection, coaching etc. but the fact that the collective dross the Club has been paying good money to is just totally incompetent, inept, out of its depth and just not "fit for purpose" (in more ways than one)?

At this rate, we will have exhausted the available pool of Managers but I doubt the standard of play on the pitch would be any better. The players are simply not up to the job. Full stop.

Over to you, Mr. Petrie.

FitbaFolkKen
02-01-2012, 02:31 PM
You can't blame him yet.... look at the first goal, Elliot offside right in front of Stack, but more importantly Hanlon totally lost Mcgowan who bundled it over the line. Schoolboy errors is being too kind!

The squad is a mess and with the way the support is just now this january window could be make or break for Fenlon aso early in his hibs career.

Mikey_1875
02-01-2012, 02:33 PM
He has inherited a dreadful team but too not put on subs till 82 minutes in that game is slightly concerning imp, might reflect fenlons confidence in the current crop if he feels we should play for a point today

stubru59
02-01-2012, 02:34 PM
Shorn of confidence, guile and basic technique, Fenlon has a major job on his hands with this lot.

down the slope
02-01-2012, 02:34 PM
Fenlon will know that he will be lucky to get a point a game with this lot of players, play two up front and we are short in midfield cue we were overrun in midfield today moaners. We are short of class all over and unless we spend big we are for the drop , the standard of player we have at the moment is reflected in our league position, nobody could get that lot to play better .

magpie1892
02-01-2012, 02:42 PM
Fenlon's just been in the press room. He says that 'there will be players leaving the club in the next two to three weeks'. Was quite adamant about that.

He also said that there's two players looking likely to come in and that players out isn't a condition of players in anyhow.

Saorsa
02-01-2012, 02:47 PM
Fenlon's just been in the press room. He says that 'there will be players leaving the club in the next two to three weeks'. Was quite adamant about that.

He also said that there's two players looking likely to come in and that players out isn't a condition of players in anyhow.that's probably just as well.

Pretty Boy
02-01-2012, 02:50 PM
Fenlon's just been in the press room. He says that 'there will be players leaving the club in the next two to three weeks'. Was quite adamant about that.

He also said that there's two players looking likely to come in and that players out isn't a condition of players in anyhow.

Thank **** for that.

Dominating centre back and creative midfielder as the first 2 in please.

Take your pick from the entire squad as the ones to leave.

Bobo
02-01-2012, 02:50 PM
Any manager who hasn't the conviction of his own mind and has to listen to the advice of an ex-hearts ******* for Putting out a sub-standard starting line up, with no attacking threat, seriously has to be questioned!

Playing one up front, at home, in any game never mind a Derby is a disgrace! Giving Sproule and Galbraith jerseys is a disgrace and to concede every third of the park by surrendering possession is a disgrace!

We're in serious trouble and the man at the helm appears to be as clueless as his 3 previous predecessors. To play 85 minutes in a Derby, at home, without any attacking threat is criminal, he needs to learn a harsh lesson and make changes quickly and can start with getting rid of his assistant manager.

Who was the biggest hearts ******* today .... Calum Murray or Billy Brown?

Ray_
02-01-2012, 02:50 PM
Is everyone completely mental? Hibs don't have the quality to go out and take control of a game and expect to get anything out of it. Fenlon played it tactically well. Playing counter attack and using pace up front to nick it! He was not playing for a draw that was clear as day. Individual errors cost us that game. Anyone blaming the manager is clueless.

The quality Hearts have compared to Hibs is like night & day, however, that doesn't mean mistakes weren't made, subs should have been introduced much earlier & that part is the managers fault.

TrinityHibs
02-01-2012, 02:52 PM
Why he didn't take Scott off earlier than he did i will never know?

Thought he was one our better players today

Davy Mac
02-01-2012, 02:52 PM
GOC and Doyle weren't fully fit though. I thought Griffiths did alright with a hard task against those brutes.

Today isn't fenlon's fault.

Face it and accept it: Hearts are much, much better than us. Both clubs are in a false position right now: Hughes/CC have us where we are and they've been consistently beating us for 7 years with a side full of players they can't and could never afford.

We'll recover and they'll pay for it soon enough.

One of these brutes scored from a hapless effort to win the ball, a goalkeeper who doesn't command his box, a useless defender who allowed the player to hold and release the ball within our box and not one Hibs player marked this brut allowing him to shoot.

Recovery will long and painful but I think Hertz will squirm out of it.

cabbageandribs1875
02-01-2012, 02:52 PM
Who was the biggest hearts ******* today .... Calum Murray or Billy Brown?


him, without a doubt

truehibernian
02-01-2012, 02:52 PM
He set up 4-5-1, just like the previous manager....that shows the faith in the squad. We were lucky to escape 3-1....the players should be ashamed, and I 100% guarantee most will be out tonight for beer.....time to name, shame and get really into them.....they are a collective disgrace. Those that said they wouldn't take Ian Black....the boy was tremendous today, ran the show.....those that don't want him, dont know football.....he ran the show.

Ray_
02-01-2012, 02:53 PM
Any manager who hasn't the conviction of his own mind and has to listen to the advice of an ex-hearts for Putting out a sub-standard starting line up, with no attacking threat, seriously has to be questioned!

Playing one up front, at home, in any game never mind a Derby is a disgrace! Giving Sproule and Galbraith jerseys is a disgrace and to concede every third of the park by surrendering possession is a disgrace!

We're in serious trouble and the man at the helm appears to be as clueless as his 3 previous predecessors. To play 85 minutes in a Derby, at home, without any attacking threat is criminal, he needs to learn a harsh lesson and make changes quickly and can start with getting rid of his assistant manager.

Who was the biggest hearts today .... Calum Murray or Billy Brown?

Total rubbish, Billy Brown is a professional coach & there was only one team he wanted to win today & it wasn't hearts.

Cropley10
02-01-2012, 02:54 PM
Fenlon has not started well. His tactics today were at best inept

It was either Calderdud or Fenlon to take us down. Hasn't made one scrap of difference. Out of his depth.

Thecat23
02-01-2012, 02:56 PM
Look it's simple. Fenlon did get it wrong because if he didn't we would have won the game. No shots on target means HE got it wrong. Doesn't mean he's a bad manager he just needs to learn. 4-5-1 isn't the way to play at home. It makes the crowd go quiet when you only have a lone striker running about like a headless chicken. Sproule and Galbraith were far to deep as well and just not good enough. Move them both on Pat and get players in who can cross and pass players like wingers are meant to do.

Cropley10
02-01-2012, 02:57 PM
He set up 4-5-1, just like the previous manager....that shows the faith in the squad. We were lucky to escape 3-1....the players should be ashamed, and I 100% guarantee most will be out tonight for beer.....time to name, shame and get really into them.....they are a collective disgrace. Those that said they wouldn't take Ian Black....the boy was tremendous today, ran the show.....those that don't want him, dont know football.....he ran the show.

Ian Black: comfortable on the ball and doesn't give it away. Oh to have a player like him in the green.

Thecat23
02-01-2012, 02:58 PM
He set up 4-5-1, just like the previous manager....that shows the faith in the squad. We were lucky to escape 3-1....the players should be ashamed, and I 100% guarantee most will be out tonight for beer.....time to name, shame and get really into them.....they are a collective disgrace. Those that said they wouldn't take Ian Black....the boy was tremendous today, ran the show.....those that don't want him, dont know football.....he ran the show.

I've booked a table tonight in Lulu and if i see any of them i'm going through them. I'd never have done this before but ffs they shouldn't be near the town after a derby loss.

Gatecrasher
02-01-2012, 02:58 PM
A lot of the tIme I feel Hibs fans get the team we deserve, some of
The posts on here are dire. He's had 5 games get a grip of yourselves FFS

weonlywon6-2
02-01-2012, 02:59 PM
Pat Fenlon will turn hibs around,however not with the players we have at the moment.

we have too many average players

weecounty hibby
02-01-2012, 03:00 PM
I feel sorry for him. What manager in their right mind would want to manage that bunch of over paid underachievers. I'm willing to bet he had no idea just how bad we were before he took over. I think in time and with investment he may do a decent job for us. Right now I would accept staying up but we really need to invest big time to move on.

Cropley10
02-01-2012, 03:00 PM
A lot of the tIme I feel Hibs fans get the team we deserve, some of
The posts on here are dire. He's had 5 games get a grip of yourselves FFS

Not made a scrap of difference. He's out of his depth.

Dan Sarf
02-01-2012, 03:01 PM
Until we can get a bit of composure in the team and around the stadium it will continue to be like that.

I remember when all the bairns came through under Williamson - they were all afraid of the ball. It was only when Mowbray signed Boozy that they started to learn to enjoy it - especially Thomson, Brown and above all Whittaker.

We had something like 5 under 21's on the pitch and they'll never become footballers it we don't get the culture right - the older guys we've got around the place aren't going to help with that.

Spot on. We need a playmaker.

Beefster
02-01-2012, 03:02 PM
Fenlon can only pish with the cock he has but **** me, his tactics are woeful. Billy Brown is proving himself to be as helpful as a fart on a first date too.

Septimus
02-01-2012, 03:02 PM
Hibs today contrived to make Ian Black look like a really good midfielder. Bringing two strikers on with minutes to go just shows the desparation which is now the norm in the Hibs dug-out.

The plain fact is that there was not one Hibs player today who you would chose over his Tynecastle counterpart.

EasterRoad4Ever
02-01-2012, 03:02 PM
I feel for Fenlon as he has inherited absolute rubbish.

However his team selection and Alex Milleresque tactics hoping for a point from a Derby today aren't.doing him any favours.

We should have been 3 down by HT so lucky to still be in the game. Definite improvement in the second half which could have been different had Scott not missed an open goal at 1-1.

Nevertheless, everyone could see we were crying out for a subs with 10 mins to go, and a chance to win the match. Fenlon procrastinates and holds 4 way conferences on the touchline while the Yams regroup, bring on their own subs and gear up to win the match. Fenlon then brings on the 2 subs when we go 2-1 down - too late by far :roll eyes: Don't think Doyle even touched the ball on his debut.

Overall, very disappointed in Fenlon's decision making when we had a chance to win the match. Seemed as scared as the Hibs players - lack of believe, ambition and drive. Not good !

BroxburnHibee
02-01-2012, 03:04 PM
A lot of the tIme I feel Hibs fans get the team we deserve, some of
The posts on here are dire. He's had 5 games get a grip of yourselves FFS

:agree: :top marks

Fans are hurting - no doubt about it (although anyone watching Hibs in the last few weeks can't honestly be surprised at todays result/performance)

Blaming Fenlon is just ridiculous.

Its his job to keep us up and with 8 minutes to go he had a point in the bag (which most fans would definitely have took before kick-off)

Hibs squad is shocking - Fenlon can't possibly be blamed for that.

Saorsa
02-01-2012, 03:04 PM
A lot of the tIme I feel Hibs fans get the team we deserve, some of
The posts on here are dire. He's had 5 games get a grip of yourselves FFSWe certainly dinnae get the one we pay for anyway.

Elephant Stone
02-01-2012, 03:05 PM
I'll wait til he's signed a midfield before pissing the bed. We need new players, that's not Fenlon's fault.

Gatecrasher
02-01-2012, 03:06 PM
Not made a scrap of difference. He's out of his depth.
Ok let's sack him and start over again that'll save us :rolleyes:

PeeJay
02-01-2012, 03:06 PM
Seems to me that putting the subs on any earlier wouldn't have made any difference - we had our chances, but we were too inept to take them: they had their chances, they took them.

The manager always has to take a share of the blame - but the players we have are the reason why we are where we are. Not fit enough, not concentrated enough, not enough talent, no motivation, poor decision making - we have some truly awful players at the club - our league standing reflects their level of talent.

BroxburnHibee
02-01-2012, 03:07 PM
Not made a scrap of difference. He's out of his depth.

Rubbish - this squad is out of its depth - that isn't Fenlon's fault.

Gatecrasher
02-01-2012, 03:07 PM
We certainly dinnae get the one we pay for anyway.
I can't disagree with that

cabbageandribs1875
02-01-2012, 03:07 PM
We should have been 3 down by HT so lucky to still be in the game. Definite improvement in the second half which could have been different had Scott not missed an open goal at 1-1.

!


i think the ball actually deflected off of the hertz player and it went behind scott , well it looked like that from the replay anyway :(

Dinkydoo
02-01-2012, 03:07 PM
Those that said they wouldn't take Ian Black....the boy was tremendous today, ran the show.....those that don't want him, dont know football.....he ran the show.

I would never take Ian Black, the little ****.

If their first was chalked off for offside, if Scott scored that sitter at 1-1, which if their first had been rightly called, would have made it 2-0; if we hadn't fallen asleep at the back and conceded a cheap goal from a corner........

The game could have been very different.

Hearts took advantage of their chances and were the better of the two **** teams on the park.

I'm hurting, fed up, and slightly drunk; but let's not overreact here. The team, management and playing staff, need support.

GGTTH.

**** the hearts!

Bobo
02-01-2012, 03:08 PM
Total rubbish, Billy Brown is a professional coach & there was only one team he wanted to win today & it wasn't hearts.

Brown heavily influenced the team selection and formation today, not the manager, we were set up to give the tramps every advantage and he knew it !!

jdships
02-01-2012, 03:10 PM
Fenlon will know that he will be lucky to get a point a game with this lot of players, play two up front and we are short in midfield cue we were overrun in midfield today moaners. We are short of class all over and unless we spend big we are for the drop , the standard of player we have at the moment is reflected in our league position, nobody could get that lot to play better .

Have to admit I watched the game on TV which is completely different to being there !!
Agree TOTALLY with what you say :top marks
I would only add " a complete lack of confidence throughout the side " . That creates a situation where players are almost frightened to attempt anything different.

I remember in October 1960 when Hibs were in an almost similar situation ( lost eight games on the trot) Hugh Shaw signed 30 year old Sammy Baird from Rangers .
1960–1962 Hibernian played 39 games - 5 goals .
He almost single handedly lifted that side from the depths
We need someone of that calibre NOW to improve things.

PF must be given the chance/funds to at least secure our place in SPL for next season

Beefster
02-01-2012, 03:11 PM
If their first was chalked off for offside, if Scott scored that sitter at 1-1, which if their first had been rightly called, would have made it 2-0; if we hadn't fallen asleep at the back and conceded a cheap goal from a corner........

The game could have been very different.

If...they hadn't missed their penalty. If...Stack hadn't made a decent save in the second half from Black.

If...if...if.

Beefster
02-01-2012, 03:12 PM
Brown heavily influenced the team selection and formation today, not the manager, we were set up to give the tramps every advantage and he knew it !!

Utter pish.

Dinkydoo
02-01-2012, 03:14 PM
If...they hadn't missed their penalty. If...Stack hadn't made a decent save in the second half from Black.

If...if...if.

Yea, that was my point.

The game could have been different. Hearts simply took their chances and we didn't.

Absolutely no need to start calling for the manager's head already.

GreenCastle
02-01-2012, 03:16 PM
We should have been 3 down by HT so lucky to still be in the game. Definite improvement in the second half which could have been different had Scott not missed an open goal at 1-1.

Nevertheless, everyone could see we were crying out for a subs with 10 mins to go, and a chance to win the match. Fenlon procrastinates and holds 4 way conferences on the touchline while the Yams regroup, bring on their own subs and gear up to win the match. Fenlon then brings on the 2 subs when we go 2-1 down - too late by far :roll eyes: Don't think Doyle even touched the ball on his debut.

Overall, very disappointed in Fenlon's decision making when we had a chance to win the match. Seemed as scared as the Hibs players - lack of believe, ambition and drive. Not good !

That's the way I saw it - I would have taken 1v1 - but we started to go on top and a couple of subs would have pushed us on I think - a striker and possibly a midfielder.

We also can't defend crosses - which is a MAJOR issue - corners and crosses / long throws...too often not good enough :rolleyes:

The team did perform better than previous weeks today - Thought Ian Murray did very well considering he's been out injured for a while.

Fenlon will make us better over time - but we have to survive this season - simple.

Next season would be better to judge him on his own team

Bobo
02-01-2012, 03:18 PM
Utter pish.

Any Hibs minded individual would never have put out the pish personnel or formation we saw today, especially one who is supposed to be more well informed about their squad and style of play than many.

What has Brown actually brought to the table since joining the backroom team, can't see any improvement that justifies keeping him on board.

woodyloon
02-01-2012, 03:18 PM
Totally agree he can only work with what he has got, but do we really nned to set up as if we are going for a nil nil. If we are going to go down then I would rather we were at least a bit more positive, we need wins to boost confidence so playing one up front with the midfield sitting in front of their own defence is not the answer.we should be playing with at least two with the wide midfielder playing off any knock downs and getting behind defences.

O'Hanlon needs to start defending and Pallsson needs to start tracking the player he is marking runs instead of standing with his hands on hips ball watching.

Malthibby
02-01-2012, 03:18 PM
As already said, five games in. We need to wait for him to bring in some players & see what happens then.
Thought Giffiths & Murray were okay today but the loss of confidence displayed by Hanlon, Booth, Griffiths etc etc
is just painful to watch. Fenlon shoud have made the substitions earlier but hopefully he willl learn from that.
Gutted to have to sit & listen to that shower lording it up at ER again but I would still rather be in our position rather
than theirs.
Managed to miss the St. Johnstone win which means I haven't seen us win at ER in the League since last February
but it will change, if only to fit the law of averages. We need to hang on in there.
GG

davidw
02-01-2012, 03:19 PM
A lot of the tIme I feel Hibs fans get the team we deserve, some of
The posts on here are dire. He's had 5 games get a grip of yourselves FFS

Well said. This whole thread is embarrassing. Presumably one up front was influenced by the circumstances i.e. neither O'Connor or Doyle is fully fit.

Fenlon has inherited a dire squad of players, and he's just said he needs to bring in new players and get rid of some others. Once he's done that and had more than a few weeks as manager, then judge him. But for now, catch a grip for Christ's sake.

Jeeeeeeeeeeeeeesus.

Beefster
02-01-2012, 03:21 PM
Any Hibs minded individual would never have put out the pish personnel or formation we saw today, especially one who is supposed to be more well informed about their squad and style of play than many.

What has Brown actually brought to the table since joining the backroom team, can't see any improvement that justifies keeping him on board.

I think that Brown is showing himself to be as clueless as everyone else but he didn't help put out a team today hoping that it would lead to a Hearts win.

Saorsa
02-01-2012, 03:22 PM
Well said. This whole thread is embarrassing. Presumably one up front was influenced by the circumstances i.e. neither O'Connor or Doyle is fully fit.

Fenlon has inherited a dire squad of players, and he's just said he needs to bring in new players and get rid of some others. Once he's done that and had more than a few weeks as manager, then judge him. But for now, catch a grip for Christ's sake.

Jeeeeeeeeeeeeeesus.Why is he unfit? He's no long finished his season. I reckon PF will do a job eventually given the tools but one up front today was wrong and a big mistake IMO.

Cropley10
02-01-2012, 03:24 PM
Ok let's sack him and start over again that'll save us :rolleyes:

Stephen Kenny. Got Dunfy relegated. We've got a very, very poor team and a Manager who knows nothing about this League. Got relegation written all over it.

Postman
02-01-2012, 03:24 PM
Made some huge mistakes today with his selection and tactics today. The ones that concerned me the most were setting up with Paul Hanlon at right back and continuing with Sproule and Galbraith in the 11. Sproule in particular is offering absolutely nothing now and the blistering pace he had before is no longer there, he was no faster than the Hearts full back today. Without the pace Sproule is at best poor!

bigwheel
02-01-2012, 03:27 PM
Any Hibs minded individual would never have put out the pish personnel or formation we saw today, especially one who is supposed to be more well informed about their squad and style of play than many.

What has Brown actually brought to the table since joining the backroom team, can't see any improvement that justifies keeping him on board.
To suggest that Brown influenced team shape and selection to help Hearts is emotional nonsense - get a grip - he would want to win as much as anyone ...

Part/Time Supporter
02-01-2012, 03:28 PM
Well said. This whole thread is embarrassing. Presumably one up front was influenced by the circumstances i.e. neither O'Connor or Doyle is fully fit.

Fenlon has inherited a dire squad of players, and he's just said he needs to bring in new players and get rid of some others. Once he's done that and had more than a few weeks as manager, then judge him. But for now, catch a grip for Christ's sake.

Jeeeeeeeeeeeeeesus.

The biggest factor that influences that decision is Hibs are crap defensively. They don't have anyone who can reliably defend 1 v 1. The only way to mask that basic deficiency is to play more defensive players (one up front, three diggers in the middle) and to play them deeper (hence why the fullbacks and wingers were hardly ever pushed up). If he doesn't sign a good centre half I can't see how Hibs can get enough wins / points to stay up.

Postman
02-01-2012, 03:29 PM
I think that Brown is showing himself to be as clueless as everyone else but he didn't help put out a team today hoping that it would lead to a Hearts win.
Its nonsense to suggest that BB wants to see us getting beaten! I do however think he should be binned, he's made absolutely no difference to the results since he's been here

Bobo
02-01-2012, 03:29 PM
I think that Brown is showing himself to be as clueless as everyone else but he didn't help put out a team today hoping that it would lead to a Hearts win.

Maybe not but he certainly adds nothing to our chances of beating anyone and is far too negative for my liking .... he still a hearts ******* :greengrin

steakbake
02-01-2012, 03:29 PM
Some folk should sit down, have a cup of tea and perhaps a wee nap before coming on here.

Fenlon has inherited a team of whom I would say at least 4 of those he HAS to pick (because there is no other depth in the squad) are simply not good enough to play for an SPL team.

Give him time. While I wish Petrie had listened to the boo boys a lot earlier about Calderwood, it would be completely insane to question Fenlon's position now, after such a short period of time.

We need a clear-out in this window. There are some complete imposters in the team and they have to be moved on.

I Love Lamp
02-01-2012, 03:30 PM
Aye, another change of manager; that'll work just as it has so well in the past. Pathetic.

Cropley10
02-01-2012, 03:31 PM
Made some huge mistakes today with his selection and tactics today. The ones that concerned me the most were setting up with Paul Hanlon at right back and continuing with Sproule and Galbraith in the 11. Sproule in particular is offering absolutely nothing now and the blistering pace he had before is no longer there, he was no faster than the Hearts full back today. Without the pace Sproule is at best poor!

Sproule is like playing with 10 men, looks like a Sunday League player now.

EasterRoad4Ever
02-01-2012, 03:31 PM
Well said. This whole thread is embarrassing. Presumably one up front was influenced by the circumstances i.e. neither O'Connor or Doyle is fully fit.

Fenlon has inherited a dire squad of players, and he's just said he needs to bring in new players and get rid of some others. Once he's done that and had more than a few weeks as manager, then judge him. But for now, catch a grip for Christ's sake.

Jeeeeeeeeeeeeeesus.

Under normal circumstances, I would agree 100% with you. To judge any manager after 5 games is ridiculous. However, you can hardly criticise Hibs fans for reacting to the situation - this is Hibs and Petrie were talking about. The last manager went 14 games without a win - questions were asked. The team collapsed at the end of last season - questions were asked. CC's sweetie bag episode and behaviour and Petrie's reluctance to get shot of him when he had the chance - questions were asked. In each case, Hibs told the fans to have faith... only for them to sack the guy a few months into the new season - WTF ?

Why all of a sudden should Hibs fans be expected to show BLIND FAITH in a new manager we know little about, when the same selection process was employed to recruit him and the same "failures" at the club making the decisions. Little has changed since Fenlon came in, including the results.

Beefster
02-01-2012, 03:32 PM
Some folk should sit down, have a cup of tea and perhaps a wee nap before coming on here.

Fenlon has inherited a team of whom I would say at least 4 of those he HAS to pick (because there is no other depth in the squad) are simply not good enough to play for an SPL team.

Give him time. While I wish Petrie had listened to the boo boys a lot earlier about Calderwood, it would be completely insane to question Fenlon's position now, after such a short period of time.

We need a clear-out in this window. There are some complete imposters in the team and they have to be moved on.

The problem with trying to sign the right players now, rather than in the summer past when we needed (and the fans all wanted) it done is that it's now doubly difficult to attract quality seeing as we look 50/50 to go down.

Cropley10
02-01-2012, 03:32 PM
Aye, another change of manager; that'll work just as it has so well in the past. Pathetic.

No, there's no point changing him, but he's shown and done ABSOLUTELY nothing, so far. Not a scrap of improvement.

Beefster
02-01-2012, 03:34 PM
Aye, another change of manager; that'll work just as it has so well in the past. Pathetic.

Can you quote the post that said Fenlon should be moved on? I can't find it.

Thanks in advance.

Postman
02-01-2012, 03:34 PM
We need a clear-out in this window. There are some complete imposters in the team and they have to be moved on.

Of course we need a clear out but surely someone has to want them? How do you get rid of the players we have? Its a young team but very few of the players on show have a bright future in the game

h1bs4life
02-01-2012, 03:36 PM
Not much he can do with the players he has inherited but tactically got in wrong big time. No subs for 85 mins and they only reacting to them scoring unforgivable. A home game against a pretty poor yam team not to bring on another forward to try and win it and give everyone a lift is unbelievable. TIme he stopped listening to Brown slavering in his ear for 90 mins and took some decisions himself.

silverhibee
02-01-2012, 03:39 PM
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/scotland/16385297.stm

Postman
02-01-2012, 03:40 PM
Not much he can do with the players he has inherited but tactically got in wrong big time. No subs for 85 mins and they only reacting to them scoring unforgivable. A home game against a pretty poor yam team not to bring on another forward to try and win it and give everyone a lift is unbelievable. TIme he stopped listening to Brown slavering in his ear for 90 mins and took some decisions himself.

Agree 100%. Can't believe all he seemed to want was a point from today! To have a striker who's on double figures this season and his 25 goal new signing from Ireland on the bench till we go behind is quite simply unbelievable!!

Judas Iscariot
02-01-2012, 03:41 PM
Team selection was very strange, so much negativity and lack of subs ended our chances..

That's down to Fenlon IMO, the players though aren't his doing..

silverhibee
02-01-2012, 03:41 PM
Yea, that was my point.

The game could have been different. Hearts simply took their chances and we didn't.

Absolutely no need to start calling for the manager's head already.



Apart from Scott's chance what other chances did we have.

SteveHFC
02-01-2012, 03:42 PM
It isn't Fenlon's fault for today's terrible disgraceful performance. It was the players. Thanks to Yogi and Mr Calderwood we are *****.

I Love Lamp
02-01-2012, 03:45 PM
No, there's no point changing him, but he's shown and done ABSOLUTELY nothing, so far. Not a scrap of improvement.

Aye sorry man, went a bit far. It hurts losing a derby. I don't disagree with that but the constant chopping and changing has made things worse. Fenlon needs to be allowed to bring in players on the strict proviso that it's quality not quantity. The priority this season is to focus on taking points from the teams around us to pull out of trouble. Admittedly we scarcely looked able against Inverness but there needs to be total focus on becoming harder to beat and emerging from games with the minimum of a point - hopefully, with a bit of quality up front, 1 point can become 3. But the style of football is going to be murder for the rest of the season until a proper rebuilding process can begin.

Beefster
02-01-2012, 03:45 PM
Team selection was very strange, so much negativity and lack of subs ended our chances..

That's down to Fenlon IMO, the players though aren't his doing..

You could feel the atmosphere deflate in BTG when the team started being circulated.

steakbake
02-01-2012, 03:48 PM
Sorry, maybe I know nothing about Hibs but where are all these magical players that Fenlon didn't pick? I didn't realise we put out a second string squad. We put out what I think is the only team we really have. Several of them need moved on because no matter who Fenlon picks, it will involve some of the same faces that have no business pulling on a Hibs jersey.

silverhibee
02-01-2012, 03:48 PM
Agree 100%. Can't believe all he seemed to want was a point from today! To have a striker who's on double figures this season and his 25 goal new signing from Ireland on the bench till we go behind is quite simply unbelievable!!


And 3 right backs on the bench. :confused:

Judas Iscariot
02-01-2012, 03:56 PM
You could feel the atmosphere deflate in BTG when the team started being circulated.

:agree:

I had to re-read it like 5/6 times before I could take it in!

The team didn't do too badly but between 60-80 mins when we were "on top" that's when we needed to take the game right to them and bring a striker on..

Look at their subs -

Driver - Major part in 2nd goal, should've scored a 3rd before satchel

Satchel - Scored 3rd goal

Sutton - Set up 3rd goal

Once again we were out fought, out thought and outclassed

We had the chance during the period we were on top but were too ****ing scared to step up a gear, **** me it's hertz no ****ing Barcelona..

Man up Hibs, ****ing letting the fans down again in a Derby..

Happy ****ing New Year again eh :rolleyes:

AgentDaleCooper
02-01-2012, 03:57 PM
the whole club is a disgrace!

Board no investment and keep picking crap managers!

Fenlon picks some strange teams! Why no players on the posts at corners?

Every Hibs player, total gash, ubber rubbish! Runners with football boots, these clowns will take us down..

Delighted i didn't waste £300 coming up

Anyway roll on 2012....we will no by 31st Jan which league we'll be in next year..no creative signings = 1st division

the support should be included in this - jumping on the back of a manger who's not been here a month, booing players etc...we're not exactly helping, are we :dunno:

AgentDaleCooper
02-01-2012, 04:03 PM
And 3 right backs on the bench. :confused:

"three players who can play at right back" would be fairer...

Billy McKirdy
02-01-2012, 04:04 PM
All I can say is thank f*** Dunfermline are below us in the league!! whether we manage to get anything off them next week is beyond my comprehesion!! time will tell.

I actually thought we could have got something from todays game but as soon as we conceded the second goal it was groundhog day again!

Fenlon needs time to bring in his own players, (Doyle wasn't given enough time to show us what he's about!), however I do think he should have made changes much earlier than he did. that said, todays result is not that much of a surprise to me.

The next month is absolutley crucial to our season and whether Fenlon is able to make his mark on the team...I live in hope.

GGTTH :flag:

Judas Iscariot
02-01-2012, 04:05 PM
"three players who have played at right back" would be fairer...

Even better...

HFC 0-7
02-01-2012, 04:07 PM
:agree: :top marks

Fans are hurting - no doubt about it (although anyone watching Hibs in the last few weeks can't honestly be surprised at todays result/performance)

Blaming Fenlon is just ridiculous.

Its his job to keep us up and with 8 minutes to go he had a point in the bag (which most fans would definitely have took before kick-off)

Hibs squad is shocking - Fenlon can't possibly be blamed for that.

To be fair though after we equalised we could have, and should have attempted to go for the 3 points, we have shown over the past few games we struggle to defend a lead as it invites pressure and the team do not cope with it. yes the squad is mince and you can only pee with the boaby you have got but the tactic invited pressure and didnt lend well to us keeping possession to take the pressure off. Not one shot on target in 90 minutes says it all IMO.

I dont think anyone should be calling for Fenlons head but people can, rightly on this occasion, question Fenlons tactics. Everyone is calling for the fans to be positive but surely that must start with the team on the pitch, we are anything but positive, one up front at home against an average hearts side, not going for the win at 1-1 and settling for a point is negative IMO and this is why Fenlon is getting criticised.

Dinkydoo
02-01-2012, 04:14 PM
Apart from Scott's chance what other chances did we have.

Galbraith had two which he wasted......

hibiedude
02-01-2012, 04:15 PM
Brown heavily influenced the team selection and formation today, not the manager, we were set up to give the tramps every advantage and he knew it !!

It Fenlon was heavily influenced by brown today as you suggest then Fenlon needs shot because it's his decisions that will keep him in his job and I heard Fenlon say when interviewed he was happy with the first performance.

The team selection and formation was rank rotten please don't tell us Fenlon had no part in picking the team as for the subs coming on with 6 minutes to go that was a joke.

It's easy to blame Billy Brown.

Sir David Gray
02-01-2012, 04:17 PM
I think people are underestimating just how bad we are right now.

There is nothing that Pat Fenlon can do until he is allowed to bring in his own players and that will take time. I've said it before and I will say it again, he needs at least 2 years and that's what I'll be giving him.

Almost every single player in our squad is not good enough to play for Hibs. Maybe he could have done a few things differently today but, in the grand scheme of things, I don't think it would made a blind bit of difference.

We are absolute garbage and need a complete overhaul.

It remains to be seen if Fenlon will be the man to deliver those changes and to improve our fortunes but he certainly cannot be judged at the moment.

It would have been a miracle if he had been able to turn things around after a month, with the current set of players. That's not happened but I definitely won't be judging him just now.

Sudds_1
02-01-2012, 04:22 PM
Of course it is he continues to select that *******.

.................and his options are???

Dear god, give the man a chance to use his FIRST transfer window to bring in his own picks and continue to empty out the dross.

Some people should think before they start to type..............!!

PeeJay
02-01-2012, 04:24 PM
I think people are underestimating just how bad we are right now.

There is nothing that Pat Fenlon can do until he is allowed to bring in his own players and that will take time. I've said it before and I will say it again, he needs at least 2 years and that's what I'll be giving him.

Almost every single player in our squad is not good enough to play for Hibs. Maybe he could have done a few things differently today but, in the grand scheme of things, I don't think it would made a blind bit of difference.

We are absolute garbage and need a complete overhaul.

It remains to be seen if Fenlon will be the man to deliver those changes and to improve our fortunes but he certainly cannot be judged at the moment.

It would have been a miracle if he had been able to turn things around after a month, with the current set of players. That's not happened but I definitely won't be judging him just now.

Agree 100% - with one or two breaks today we might not have been beat, which would have been an excellent result - but, as it is, Fenlon needs time and new players - neither of which he really has, so we are in for a tough ride - we really are at the mercy of Dunfermline Athletic, it seems

King Paddy
02-01-2012, 04:35 PM
Another dud is mr. Fenlon, He is clueless with team selection. Hanlon RB he is left sided,
Griffiths loan stricker to light coud'nt hold the ball up for the midfield to support. Booth
is to easily brushed aside, and Palson and Scott are a waste of space. IMO the worst Hibs
team i have laid eyes on. Well done Rod this manager wll get us relegated.

I Love Lamp
02-01-2012, 04:35 PM
Can you quote the post that said Fenlon should be moved on? I can't find it.

Thanks in advance.

Erm pretty sure the first post on the thread was headed up 'Fenlon' and said 'Not up to the task'. If anyone already thinks he's definitely not up to the task (rather than just fearing he might not or being unimpressed but still undecided) then they must be asking for his removal. Wasn't such a hard search, was it? Otherwise, it's just idle whinging.

What's clearly going on here is people getting their complaints in early so that if and when this manager gets the sack, the headless chickens who made those complaints can act as sages with 20-20 foresight. Because the turnover of managers since Collins have improved the club no-end.

Alfred E Newman
02-01-2012, 04:36 PM
Not up to the task. Clueless from start to finish. Worst Hibs side ever. That's all.

You should change your user name to fat head. I suppose you will feel quite proud of youself sitting in the house and starting a ridiculous post like this.

ancient hibee
02-01-2012, 04:39 PM
Another dud is mr. Fenlon, He is clueless with team selection. Hanlon RB he is left sided,
Griffiths loan stricker to light coud'nt hold the ball up for the midfield to support. Booth
is to easily brushed aside, and Palson and Scott are a waste of space. IMO the worst Hibs
team i have laid eyes on. Well done Rod this manager wll get us relegated.

And how many of these players did Fenlon sign again and who are the alternatives?Get a grip.

I Love Lamp
02-01-2012, 04:40 PM
I think people are underestimating just how bad we are right now.

There is nothing that Pat Fenlon can do until he is allowed to bring in his own players and that will take time. I've said it before and I will say it again, he needs at least 2 years and that's what I'll be giving him.

Almost every single player in our squad is not good enough to play for Hibs. Maybe he could have done a few things differently today but, in the grand scheme of things, I don't think it would made a blind bit of difference.

We are absolute garbage and need a complete overhaul.

It remains to be seen if Fenlon will be the man to deliver those changes and to improve our fortunes but he certainly cannot be judged at the moment.

It would have been a miracle if he had been able to turn things around after a month, with the current set of players. That's not happened but I definitely won't be judging him just now.

Got it in one. I keep reading 'we have good players' - where? I haven't seen them. All I see is a team that can't make simple passes, doesn't challenge or work off the ball, gets frequently out-muscled and doesn't look fit. None of the other SPL teams I've seen this season, including Dunfermline, have looked so inept. How any manager is supposed to make a good team out of the dregs of two previous managers' is beyond me.

truehibernian
02-01-2012, 04:45 PM
He is right. Wee Lewis put his foot on the ball....the ONLY one......we were poor back to front....they could have scored 6 ! Hibs really need to face facts...investment has been shocking in the team.....for 5 years......unless there is a distinct change in the top table, we will be bottom 6......director heavy, with no football guile..........we are technically terrible. Hearts, for all their woes, completely strolled today....a major worry. Mr Petrie.....step aside.....i for one, and I have a wee bit cash, am sorely tempted to ask why we don't (those that have) buy him out.....it's 10%.....I am in !

Billy McKirdy
02-01-2012, 04:47 PM
I think people are underestimating just how bad we are right now.

There is nothing that Pat Fenlon can do until he is allowed to bring in his own players and that will take time. I've said it before and I will say it again, he needs at least 2 years and that's what I'll be giving him.

Almost every single player in our squad is not good enough to play for Hibs. Maybe he could have done a few things differently today but, in the grand scheme of things, I don't think it would made a blind bit of difference.

We are absolute garbage and need a complete overhaul.

It remains to be seen if Fenlon will be the man to deliver those changes and to improve our fortunes but he certainly cannot be judged at the moment.

It would have been a miracle if he had been able to turn things around after a month, with the current set of players. That's not happened but I definitely won't be judging him just now.


Totally totally totally agree with you here!!

"Pat Fenion", "Billy Fenlon" whatever he has been called in the past :greengrin deserves every chance to make his mark on this shower of unconfident lightweights! (the truth hurts), ( like it or not, our idols (!!) read the forums and the result is that they take on board the criticism and....you know the rest), give the guy a chance (and not just in this transfer window but at least until one year from now), Rome wasn't built....blah blah blah!! (thank f*** the pars are below us lol), IMHO, We!!! (us Hibbys btw) are much too fickle and quick to judge!!! Give the man a chance to get things right!! that is all!!! :flag:

lucky
02-01-2012, 04:59 PM
Hibs were poor today. We played for the draw. Pat will not get to the end of the season with tactics like that. He should have changed it around 70 mins and went for it but appears he has the same bottle as the ****bags that wear our shirts

nortonhibby
02-01-2012, 05:08 PM
Under normal circumstances, I would agree 100% with you. To judge any manager after 5 games is ridiculous. However, you can hardly criticise Hibs fans for reacting to the situation - this is Hibs and Petrie were talking about. The last manager went 14 games without a win - questions were asked. The team collapsed at the end of last season - questions were asked. CC's sweetie bag episode and behaviour and Petrie's reluctance to get shot of him when he had the chance - questions were asked. In each case, Hibs told the fans to have faith... only for them to sack the guy a few months into the new season - WTF ?

Why all of a sudden should Hibs fans be expected to show BLIND FAITH in a new manager we know little about, when the same selection process was employed to recruit him and the same "failures" at the club making the decisions. Little has changed since Fenlon came in, including the results.

We were told RP Had no input id the selection of our new Manager so the same selection process was not the case.

However it probably would have been wiser to appoint a Manager with experience and knowledge of the Scottish game, yes we know BB Was the man who was supposed to advise PF But its possible BB Took the cream puff when he never got the main Gig.

Its early days and as you say it took CC 14 Games before he got his first win our next game in The League is the big one god forbid if we loose it we would be cut adrift at the bottom we could do with a few players in before that game.

Over to you RP.

hibee_kane96
02-01-2012, 05:26 PM
Hanlon played right back to stop templeton cutting in on his right foot all be it he did a crap job of it when templeton hit the post!

Unbelieveable that some people are blaming a manager who's not only stated that he wants to bring his own players in and ship out the pish but he's only been in the job 1 MONTH! Some of the 'fans' are ****ing ridiculous.

Beefster
02-01-2012, 05:28 PM
We were told RP Had no input id the selection of our new Manager so the same selection process was not the case.

However it probably would have been wiser to appoint a Manager with experience and knowledge of the Scottish game, yes we know BB Was the man who was supposed to advise PF But its possible BB Took the cream puff when he never got the main Gig.

Its early days and as you say it took CC 14 Games before he got his first win our next game in The League is the big one god forbid if we loose it we would be cut adrift at the bottom we could do with a few players in before that game.

Over to you RP.

No, it didn't.

hibsbollah
02-01-2012, 05:32 PM
I've no problem with Fenlon so far at all.

First half he was charging about the touchline telling the front five to push up and press, which was spot on, and much better than watching Calderwood, who spent whole games in an apparent daydream.

He's playing a conservative formation and tactics with holding midfielders and one up front so we dont get relegated. He was playing for the point today, as he was vs ICT, and considering the ****ing terrible state we're in I have to agree with him. Hopefully in May we survive, regroup and we can change things his way in the summer.

Its the players.

21.05.2016
02-01-2012, 05:34 PM
Not his fault he's been left with absolute *****, give the guy a chance to get rid of the garbage and bring in his own players. However I was quite concerned with his decisions today, left it far far to late to make changes and it cost us. Everyone in the stadium was screaming for change but it didnt come till 80+ mins, by which time hearts had already taken the lead again.

Hiber-nation
02-01-2012, 05:38 PM
Hanlon played right back to stop templeton cutting in on his right foot all be it he did a crap job of it when templeton hit the post!

Unbelieveable that some people are blaming a manager who's not only stated that he wants to bring his own players in and ship out the pish but he's only been in the job 1 MONTH! Some of the 'fans' are ****ing ridiculous.

:agree:

Spot on. All these "experts" on here basically saying that if we go into the game with an attacking formation we'll win no problem. With that lot? You're having a laugh.

Has no-one actually noticed that no matter who plays and no matter what formation they play in, this group of players are nowhere near good enough.

Nameless
02-01-2012, 05:42 PM
Not up to the task. Clueless from start to finish. Worst Hibs side ever. That's all.

Not read any replys to this thread, but hope the majority are getting tore into you for being a huddy!! Not his team, grow up!!

Aldo
02-01-2012, 05:43 PM
Not read any replys to this thread, but hope the majority are getting tore into you for being a huddy!! Not his team, grow up!!

Consider it already done

EVENTUALLY
02-01-2012, 05:49 PM
Where PF has to be questioned is HIS selection of our 2 latest right backs. Ian Murray as a sub against Inverness and Paul Hanlon today. Both of them are extremely left footed and have average passing ability at best. It smacks of desperation. He also chose O'hanlon over Stephens who had arguably his best game against Inverness. I do think that the job of managing in general can be difficult and to lead a squad of footballers whose confidence is shot to hell is a big task but I would be worried if PF believes he is on the right road with decisions like this.

Sammy7nil
02-01-2012, 05:57 PM
Hibs were poor today. We played for the draw. Pat will not get to the end of the season with tactics like that. He should have changed it around 70 mins and went for it but appears he has the same bottle as the ****bags that wear our shirts

That for me is the problem.

Okay Fenlon can only pish with the kock he has but he must make better use of his appendage.

It looked like we tried for a 0 - 0 today and that is not good enough. In a derby we failed to have one shot on target. I do not rate Sodje but if he can't put himself about in a derby then he should not be playing football that was an option Pat did not use. Pat sent out 3 light weight guys against a defence that had not conceded in 3 games. We Never looked like scoring and Pat did nowt to change that for me that is what was wrong today.

Pat has no confidence in his squad and if he continues to set them up like today it won't be long before the squad have no confidence in him.

We are better losing 2 and winning 1 than drawing 2 and losing 1 we have to have some balls and go for wins yes we will be humped on occasion but we may just snatch the odd win.

yekimevol
02-01-2012, 05:59 PM
Not up to the task. Clueless from start to finish. Worst Hibs side ever. That's all.

:top marks

the man was unbelievable today. at tanadice he got shown that the team could not function with his 4141 or his 4411 system with Leigh up top by himself he will run himself into the ground but the guy needs help to pressure the ball and to hold it up. But all that it did was let the opposition attack at us again and again. when fenlon must have learned by now that we cannot defend and we must attack, attempting to out score our opponents instead of trying to counter the opposition. then his inability to make a sub was criminal jimmy scott was nackered after about the 70 mins as were a few of the lads and hearts were dominating the game so subs we need subs to attempt to change the balance of the game.

silverhibee
02-01-2012, 06:00 PM
He is right. Wee Lewis put his foot on the ball....the ONLY one......we were poor back to front....they could have scored 6 ! Hibs really need to face facts...investment has been shocking in the team.....for 5 years......unless there is a distinct change in the top table, we will be bottom 6......director heavy, with no football guile..........we are technically terrible. Hearts, for all their woes, completely strolled today....a major worry. Mr Petrie.....step aside.....i for one, and I have a wee bit cash, am sorely tempted to ask why we don't (those that have) buy him out.....it's 10%.....I am in !



How much roughly would each fan have to put in, not good with maths, but a 1000 fans putting a grand in each, would that get near..

fatbloke
02-01-2012, 06:02 PM
You should change your user name to fat head. I suppose you will feel quite proud of youself sitting in the house and starting a ridiculous post like this.

These days i am unable to attend matches. But hey you were not to know that. My op were my opinions and I stand/sit:wink: by them.

At The Edge
02-01-2012, 06:11 PM
Fenlon is the man for the job, in recent weeks i have seen a vast improvement in Hibs, maybe not in results but in formation and general awarness of the game by players......however today i think he got it wrong.
When i saw that Sparky was upfront on his own against 2 battle hardened CH's i feared the worst.
Add to that the hoofball tactic to a pretty small lightweight guy wasn't really going to work
If that was his tactics, Sodje would have been a better option, not the greatest striker but can hold his own weight wise and won't get shoved off the ball.
This is in no way a slight on Sparky he did the job he was asked to do,

The subs was a bit of a disaster, as mentioned by loads of other folk, we needed change around 70 mins, the game was open, Hibs looked to be pressing the game, Sproule off for Gaz or Doyle would have been my option, going to a straight 4 4 2

However hopefully Pat will learn and next week we'll take on the blue Brazil and smash them 1-0 :wink:

JimBHibees
02-01-2012, 06:14 PM
Fenlon could have gone for it with 15-20 to go by sticking on a second striker, but that would most likely have caused a gap in that weak defence to open up. I don't really see what else he could have done. The players worked hard enough. The biggest problem is they cannot defend, particularly in the air. He needs to sign a dominant centre half or they will get relegated.

Very good post compared to some of the reactionary nonsense and no doubt Yam wind up merchants. We cant defend balls into the box looked like Palsson lost Webster for the offside goal and also needed to be stronger in the air and also react to the second ball for the second. 2 awful goals and adding in how easy SOH was beaten for the third means we need at least one commanding centre half.

I think his tactics were ok and he was obviously nervous about putting another striker on when 1-1. It is very easy to say the second goal was coming personally didnt at all. If he had put on a second striker then lost a goal he would have been slaughtered also. Just got to hope he is able to bring in 3 or 4 soon.

Feed McGraw
02-01-2012, 06:14 PM
Apart from Scott's chance what other chances did we have.

Galbraith had 2 reasonable chances and sclaffed them both, getting nowhere near the target.

Sammy7nil
02-01-2012, 06:17 PM
Galbraith had 2 reasonable chances and sclaffed them both, getting nowhere near the target.

One was from outside the box !!! we are clutching at straws if they are to be classed as "chances"

silverhibee
02-01-2012, 06:18 PM
One was from outside the box !!! we are clutching at straws if they are to be classed as "chances"


:agree:

eastmainsmsh
02-01-2012, 06:20 PM
no shape at all to the team .....HOOFING balls rying to reach a lone striker that sparky will never win .....pish service from the flanks when they did have the ball ... defending at times abysmyl ball watching ...no one picking up runs ....feel we are doomed

Sammy7nil
02-01-2012, 06:21 PM
Very good post compared to some of the reactionary nonsense and no doubt Yam wind up merchants. We cant defend balls into the box looked like Palsson lost Webster for the offside goal and also needed to be stronger in the air and also react to the second ball for the second. 2 awful goals and adding in how easy SOH was beaten for the third means we need at least one commanding centre half.

I think his tactics were ok and he was obviously nervous about putting another striker on when 1-1. It is very easy to say the second goal was coming personally didnt at all. If he had put on a second striker then lost a goal he would have been slaughtered also. Just got to hope he is able to bring in 3 or 4 soon.

And if he had put on a 2nd striker and we had scored to go 2 - 1 he could have been a hero we will never know.

What we do know is it was a VERY negative set up and designed to get a 0 - 0 or snatch a goal on the break as it happens we had NO shots on target.

Matty_Jack04
02-01-2012, 06:27 PM
Alex ferguson with Jose mourinho as assistant couldnt get that lot to play football, 5 years of poor investment and managerial choices have led us to where we are now, certainly not pat fenlon!

Folk moaning about him setting up for the draw we're 2nd bottom of the league won 3 games out of 20 and scored 18 goals (12 of them by the same player) its damage limitation time we're no getting top 6 and every points a prisoner wake the fluck up we're *****e and survivals the name of the game

Feed McGraw
02-01-2012, 06:27 PM
One was from outside the box !!! we are clutching at straws if they are to be classed as "chances"

I did say" reasonable " and he should have hit the target. And yes, I AM most definitely clutching at straws. :greengrin

Sammy7nil
02-01-2012, 06:30 PM
Alex ferguson with Jose mourinho as assistant couldnt get that lot to play football, 5 years of poor investment and managerial choices have led us to where we are now, certainly not pat fenlon!

Folk moaning about him setting up for the draw we're 2nd bottom of the league won 3 games out of 20 and scored 18 goals (12 of them by the same player) its damage limitation time we're no getting top 6 and every points a prisoner wake the fluck up we're *****e and survivals the name of the game

I agree but when you try for draws I know you will get more defeats the odd win is better and we have to try ro Win games.

JohnScott
02-01-2012, 06:36 PM
Love you guys! Beefster, with his "utter ****" replies and truehibernian with his "buy-out" plan. As for criticism of Fenlons tactics? What do expect him to do with players you lot say arnt fit to wear the shirt?

Come on now be honest. Deep down you expected worse than 3 1 didn't you. If you expected us to win today you were pissed surely. Read your own posts, I mean how could we win with "that team"?

We'll know within a month if Pats "got it" and the board knows they'll have no more excuses. Till then you guys need to do your bit by encouraging any new players AND our NEW manager.

JohnScott
02-01-2012, 06:37 PM
Love you guys! Beefster, with his "utter ****" replies and truehibernian with his "buy-out" plan. As for criticism of Fenlons tactics? What do expect him to do with players you lot say arnt fit to wear the shirt?

Come on now be honest. Deep down you expected worse than 3 one didn't you. If you expected us to win today you were pissed surely. Read your own posts, I mean how could we win with "that team"?

We'll know within a month if Pats "got it" and the board knows they'll have no more excuses. Till then you guys need to do your bit by encouraging any new players AND our NEW manager.

Utter ****. Hope I got that in before Beefster

Beefster
02-01-2012, 06:39 PM
Love you guys! Beefster, with his "utter ****" replies and truehibernian with his "buy-out" plan. As for criticism of Fenlons tactics? What do expect him to do with players you lot say arnt fit to wear the shirt?

Come on now be honest. Deep down you expected worse than 3 nil didn't you. If you expected us to win today you were pissed surely. Read your own posts, I mean how could we win with "that team"?

We'll know within a month if Pats "got it" and the board knows they'll have no more excuses. Till then you guys need to do your bit by encouraging any new players AND our NEW manager.

Excellent points.

Albion Hibs
02-01-2012, 06:41 PM
Fenlon/our manager needs to be given time, not the usual hibs academic 12 callendar months, but this season and a season of his own players.

Our board being sh"t scared of our fans is in part to blame, consistantly removing managers has played a big a part as any in the mess we are neck deep in.

I dont agree with Fenlon's team, playing a CH, at LB then moving him to RB when we have two RB on the bench. Dropping O'Connor our top goal scorer and again sitting in with two defensive midfielders. Giving a striker and a boy his first game with 5 mins to go is a little pointless. We needed changes sooner, and it was apparent that a draw was what he was aiming for.

I did not expect Fenlon to shake his magic wand and get us to start winning games, but I see no signs of improvement, no impact or reaction. He is very good at saying what the fans want to hear and is clearly being well informed as to what lines those in the stands want to hear, but we do need more, much more.

JohnScott
02-01-2012, 06:49 PM
Excellent points.

Utter ****!

Sioux
02-01-2012, 06:52 PM
That for me is the problem.

Okay Fenlon can only pish with the kock he has but he must make better use of his appendage.

It looked like we tried for a 0 - 0 today and that is not good enough. In a derby we failed to have one shot on target. I do not rate Sodje but if he can't put himself about in a derby then he should not be playing football that was an option Pat did not use. Pat sent out 3 light weight guys against a defence that had not conceded in 3 games. We Never looked like scoring and Pat did nowt to change that for me that is what was wrong today.

Pat has no confidence in his squad and if he continues to set them up like today it won't be long before the squad have no confidence in him.

We are better losing 2 and winning 1 than drawing 2 and losing 1 we have to have some balls and go for wins yes we will be humped on occasion but we may just snatch the odd win.

So, your solution is that playing Sodje would have made all the difference. That is a longer shot than a very long shot. Yet another uber manager.

Sumner
02-01-2012, 06:55 PM
sub·sti·tute noun

Definition of SUBSTITUTE:
a person or thing that takes the place
or function of another

substitute adjective

Example .. Get the strikers ON QUICKER !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

R'Albin
02-01-2012, 06:56 PM
sub·sti·tute noun

Definition of SUBSTITUTE:
a person or thing that takes the place
or function of another

substitute adjective

Example .. Get the strikers ON QUICKER !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:hilarious

truehibernian
02-01-2012, 06:57 PM
Utter ****. Hope I got that in before Beefster

I love my club John, I was merely offering an option. For me Rod has had his day, a fine stewardship, but he has had his day. I have money, thankfully, and was merely putting it out there.....I would put in £30,000 to start......how many would join in......we need fresh investment and reinvigorated......that was my point mate.

Matty_Jack04
02-01-2012, 07:00 PM
I agree but when you try for draws I know you will get more defeats the odd win is better and we have to try ro Win games.

I know what your saying but anyone of us would have sold there mother for a draw today it's teams around us we have to go out and beat we could have got a right going over today going out for the win plus we don't have the players to go out for a win it's scrappy points from here on in every point counts

Sammy7nil
02-01-2012, 07:00 PM
So, your solution is that playing Sodje would have made all the difference. That is a longer shot than a very long shot. Yet another uber manager.

Not an uber manager but I could have told pat that 3 wee guys against a defence that had kept 3 clean sheets was not going to work. If GOC was fit for the bench he should have started. Playing for 0 - 0 has never worked longterm for any team I can think of. To not have a shot on target at home in a derby and not consider making a change until 83rd min is criminal new manager with shiyyte squad or not.

bingo70
02-01-2012, 07:03 PM
Less than impressed so far, awful substitutions so far, either been far too slow or been shutting up shop accepting defeat...lot o pish

Sioux
02-01-2012, 07:04 PM
sub·sti·tute noun

Definition of SUBSTITUTE:
a person or thing that takes the place
or function of another

substitute adjective

Example .. Get the strikers ON QUICKER !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

FFS if you replace manure with manure you still get manure. This myth that subs change games is exactly that - a myth. But armchair managers will always say the subs were too late, too light, too heavy, the wrong ones, the wrong positions...............and on and on. What people like you fail to grasp is that fitba folk ken whats gaun oan. You dinnae.

Sammy7nil
02-01-2012, 07:11 PM
FFS if you replace manure with manure you still get manure. This myth that subs change games is exactly that - a myth. But armchair managers will always say the subs were too late, too light, too heavy, the wrong ones, the wrong positions...............and on and on. What people like you fail to grasp is that fitba folk ken whats gaun oan. You dinnae.

Sutton comes off the bench sets up their 2nd and 3rd goals
Sckacel comes of the bench and scored.

Is that a myth or did it happen :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

We had GOC on the bench our top goalscorer and the top goalscorer in the LOI but hey what could they have done different from prolific scorers Galbraith Sproule Scott Palsson :confused:

Sas_The_Hibby
02-01-2012, 07:12 PM
FFS if you replace manure with manure you still get manure. This myth that subs change games is exactly that - a myth. But armchair managers will always say the subs were too late, too light, too heavy, the wrong ones, the wrong positions...............and on and on. What people like you fail to grasp is that fitba folk ken whats gaun oan. You dinnae.

Just putting on subs isn't going to automatically change things, right enough, but if you ARE going to put on subs, particularly two strikers, what is the point of waiting until 83 minutes?

matty_f
02-01-2012, 07:14 PM
I think people are underestimating just how bad we are right now.

There is nothing that Pat Fenlon can do until he is allowed to bring in his own players and that will take time. I've said it before and I will say it again, he needs at least 2 years and that's what I'll be giving him.

Almost every single player in our squad is not good enough to play for Hibs. Maybe he could have done a few things differently today but, in the grand scheme of things, I don't think it would made a blind bit of difference.

We are absolute garbage and need a complete overhaul.

It remains to be seen if Fenlon will be the man to deliver those changes and to improve our fortunes but he certainly cannot be judged at the moment.

It would have been a miracle if he had been able to turn things around after a month, with the current set of players. That's not happened but I definitely won't be judging him just now.


Kind of agree with that. I was struggling to think of a line-up for today that wouldn't have given me the heebie-jeebies, but we just don't have the quality there.

What's mad is that even after (on the face of it) making us harder to play against, we are still shipping goals at an alarming rate and creating nothing at the other end.

We need to bring in 3-4 quality players in this window. Bargain basement players won't do this time.

euro Hibby
02-01-2012, 07:27 PM
Fenlon is working with what he found when he came. You could shuffle his pack a 1000 times and still struggle to get a winning team. nevertheless the games are also sometimes won and lost on incidents. Hearts goal was offside and we let in another two goals when pushing for an equaliser. Alos fair to say that Hearts full - back should have been binned for violent conduct ! Ivan made a meal of it but the intent was there and also not good for the kids watching !! Hearts losing the Moraccan was good for Hibs but we are a team which huffs and puffs but sadly short of technique and ability ..........far from the template we are used to !

IWasThere2016
02-01-2012, 07:30 PM
Kind of agree with that. I was struggling to think of a line-up for today that wouldn't have given me the heebie-jeebies, but we just don't have the quality there.

What's mad is that even after (on the face of it) making us harder to play against, we are still shipping goals at an alarming rate and creating nothing at the other end.

We need to bring in 3-4 quality players in this window. Bargain basement players won't do this time.

I'm sensing you're getting a bit peed aff with the direction of our club M. That's a few posts now asking for spending of cash we don't have.

Jones28
02-01-2012, 07:34 PM
I love my club John, I was merely offering an option. For me Rod has had his day, a fine stewardship, but he has had his day. I have money, thankfully, and was merely putting it out there.....I would put in £30,000 to start......how many would join in......we need fresh investment and reinvigorated......that was my point mate.

Right, £30,000

Anyone else feel up to putting in £30,000?

FFS. Hibs aren't Barcalona! Do they not rely on the hundreds of thousands of fans they have in Spain alone to keep them afloat with the same principle? We sure as hell dont have enough fans to a) buy out Petrie or b) sustain that over a long period of time

Newhaven
02-01-2012, 07:44 PM
So he tried for a point and failed.

Remind me how the past couple of managers have fared in derby games in getting draws or vicitories?

Sammy7nil
02-01-2012, 07:48 PM
So he tried for a point and failed.

Remind me how the past couple of managers have fared in derby games in getting draws or vicitories?

remind me what the other managers tried to do different :confused:

Nothing they all tried the same negative pish and got humped too perhaps playing at home it is not unreasonable to think we may try to win the game at some point. We never tried to win the game at any point we were always settling for a point.

truehibernian
02-01-2012, 07:50 PM
Right, £30,000

Anyone else feel up to putting in £30,000?

FFS. Hibs aren't Barcalona! Do they not rely on the hundreds of thousands of fans they have in Spain alone to keep them afloat with the same principle? We sure as hell dont have enough fans to a) buy out Petrie or b) sustain that over a long period of time

I wasn't trying to be arrogant or full of it mate, trust me...my point was, I am willing to invest and am in a position where I can, albeit in a small way....i am lucky as I say....I will put in £30,000......who else would ?

Sammy7nil
02-01-2012, 07:57 PM
I wasn't trying to be arrogant or full of it mate, trust me...my point was, I am willing to invest and am in a position where I can, albeit in a small way....i am lucky as I say....I will put in £30,000......who else would ?

Just invest your £30k maybe get a box for you and your mates. I am sure others will do whatthey can but may not want to discuss figures on here.

Newhaven
02-01-2012, 07:59 PM
remind me what the other managers tried to do different :confused:

Nothing they all tried the same negative pish and got humped too perhaps playing at home it is not unreasonable to think we may try to win the game at some point. We never tried to win the game at any point we were always settling for a point.

Given our current record and performances in derby matches I would be ecstatic at a point. Remind me the last time we won a new years game at the piggery or ER :confused:

matty_f
02-01-2012, 08:05 PM
I'm sensing you're getting a bit peed aff with the direction of our club M. That's a few posts now asking for spending of cash we don't have.

I think it's a no-brainer at the moment TQM. You look at the quality of player that we had on show today, or this season, and it's abysmal when you think what other teams are bringing in.

I don't have a problem with what the board have spent so far - a £900k loss last year shows that they've gone over and above to try and back managers. However, CC's failed to improve the team (in fact, I think it's actually worse than Yogi's and God alone knows how he's managed to do that!) with his signings. He used his budget poorly. Now, we can't 'un-spend' that money, so the board have to find more to fix it. It's not an ideal situation to be in as we could easily be chucking good money after bad, however without significant spend in January - which it needs to be to get the players you want and not just those that are available - then we're not coming back from this situation, IMHO.

The way I see it, is that this week and next gives the board an opportunity to spend and put us in a position to not have to spend anywhere near as much in the summer and beyond, by getting in a few very good players. I don't know what Doyle's going to be like, but that's one in already. We need another 3-4 minimum who are all capable of changing a game on their own.

If we spend now and build on it, we can recoup the loss and secure our place as a top 6 side. If we don't spend, we're bottom 6 this season (at best), will struggle to attract sponsors/new players/increased revenue/season tickets etc going into next year. That's a downward spiral we cannot be allowed to carry on into.

The Board rightly built the infrastructure and made sure the club is one of the top clubs in Scotland, they now need to prove their worth by giving us a team that lives up to that status. We need to have players that are seen as some of the top players in Scotland. If we don't, then we carry on as we are, and that prospect is completely unacceptable.

Sammy7nil
02-01-2012, 08:07 PM
Given our current record and performances in derby matches I would be ecstatic at a point. Remind me the last time we won a new years game at the piggery or ER :confused:

Sorry cant remember the last win and funnily enough I cant recall the last time we went in to a New year derby with a positive can do attitude. Our teams are always negative and hope for the best.

Just remembered 0 - 3 Lehman Suazee Miller funnily enough one of the last times we were positive.

truehibernian
02-01-2012, 08:07 PM
Just invest your £30k maybe get a box for you and your mates. I am sure others will do whatthey can but may not want to discuss figures on here.

Why ? I openly say now, I will invest money into Hibs
, a modest sum....I am asking how many people on this messageboard would ? Fair point, fair question (for all we criticise).....I will openly invest what I said, more if need be.....how many guys would do the same.....as I say, I can.....those that could also....step forward

Newhaven
02-01-2012, 08:10 PM
Sorry cant remember the last win and funnily enough I cant recall the last time we went in to a New year derby with a positive can do attitude. Our teams are always negative and hope for the best.

Just remembered 0 - 3 Lehman Suazee Miller funnily enough one of the last times we were positive.

:agree:

I think it was the 99 derby, how ******* sad is that :rolleyes:

1875HFC
02-01-2012, 08:23 PM
classic Hibs, wait until its too late to make a substitution, is this some clause in the managerial contract or something?no strength up front and continual long balls from back to front towards the end, we were embarassed today by an average bunch

NAE NOOKIE
02-01-2012, 08:30 PM
Didnt even bother to read rest of thread .............. we have ****, clueless playear who at their best would be pushed to beat Gala Fairydean .... Sorry, but its true .......... 3 managers cant all be rubbish !!!

Postman
02-01-2012, 08:38 PM
Didnt even bother to read rest of thread .............. we have ****, clueless playear who at their best would be pushed to beat Gala Fairydean .... Sorry, but its true .......... 3 managers cant all be rubbish !!!
True but they are the ones responsible for bringing them to the club, PF excluded

scuttle
02-01-2012, 08:39 PM
One up front just doesnt work. you win matches by yes scoring goals and creating chances. In the space of a week [inverness, Hearts] we have created five chances if were lucky scored one own goal and one freekick, no wonder crowds are falling Fenlon already looks like the new Alex Millar to me

stanton10
02-01-2012, 08:51 PM
My, reasons for worry of pf is tactics are negative defensive errors can be made at any game in any league but to keep making them with the same players is scaring me ,what is he thinking playing hanlon at right back ,sure it is to stop tempelton coming in on his good side but he is more concerned about what they will do rather than what we could do and this one forward at home no matter who you are playing is imo wrong, what happened to the hibees of old and having a go at all times and having a injured forward on the bench is also wrong.

Sumner
02-01-2012, 11:29 PM
FFS if you replace manure with manure you still get manure. This myth that subs change games is exactly that - a myth. But armchair managers will always say the subs were too late, too light, too heavy, the wrong ones, the wrong positions...............and on and on. What people like you fail to grasp is that fitba folk ken whats gaun oan. You dinnae.

The opposition put their subs on with time
to change the match.. Hibs management team didn't..
The Yams saw the difference that made, unfortunately
we all did - but the LACK of action from the Hibs bench
suggests Hibs didnae ken what was gaun oan,
likesay you didnae ken either.

Subs shoulda been made earlier like ken, whit's gaun oan?..

Northernhibee
02-01-2012, 11:38 PM
My, reasons for worry of pf is tactics are negative defensive errors can be made at any game in any league but to keep making them with the same players is scaring me ,what is he thinking playing hanlon at right back ,sure it is to stop tempelton coming in on his good side but he is more concerned about what they will do rather than what we could do and this one forward at home no matter who you are playing is imo wrong, what happened to the hibees of old and having a go at all times and having a injured forward on the bench is also wrong.

Fourth time I've posted this tonight - we get the team we deserve.

If we're incredibly negative and focus on everything that went wrong during a match, the team will be negative and rather than being focused on winning and giving a positive performance, they'll be **** scared of losing.

I have full confidence that Pat Fenlon can, in time, turn this around.

GGTTH

Sammy7nil
02-01-2012, 11:42 PM
Fourth time I've posted this tonight - we get the team we deserve.

If we're incredibly negative and focus on everything that went wrong during a match, the team will be negative and rather than being focused on winning and giving a positive performance, they'll be **** scared of losing.

I have full confidence that Pat Fenlon can, in time, turn this around.

GGTTH

This to has been posted before - The team get the support they deserve.

The fans were onside today they were still pish.

Northernhibee
02-01-2012, 11:54 PM
This to has been posted before - The team get the support they deserve.

The fans were onside today they were still pish.

Not everything has an instant reaction :yawn:

You know, we have a really ****ty, fickle, negative support. It's my least favourite thing about the football club I love.

SteveHFC
03-01-2012, 12:39 AM
Not up to the task. Clueless from start to finish. Worst Hibs side ever. That's all.

Get a grip :rolleyes:

Dinkydoo
03-01-2012, 12:46 AM
One was from outside the box !!! we are clutching at straws if they are to be classed as "chances"

The attacking moves resulted in shots, reasonably close to the target; that's a chance in my book.

Galbraith should have cut in both times since he had plenty of room to set himself up.

We lost the game, so pretty much everyone posting on here afterwards about what we did and didn't do (and could have/should have done) is clutching at straws :greengrin:

fatbloke
03-01-2012, 01:17 AM
.

I have followed Hibernian Football Club for 51 years man and boy. I purchased 1000 shares back in 1990, shares I still have today. I ran a supporters club for 5 years - which cost me hundreds and hundreds of pounds and also almost cost me my marriage. I believe that this gives me the right to an opinion which I expressed. Same as you did.:greengrin

fatbloke
03-01-2012, 01:18 AM
Get a grip :rolleyes:


I have followed Hibernian Football Club for 51 years man and boy. I purchased 1000 shares back in 1990, shares I still have today. I ran a supporters club for 5 years - which cost me hundreds and hundreds of pounds and also almost cost me my marriage. I believe that this gives me the right to an opinion which I expressed. Same as you did.

basehibby
03-01-2012, 01:55 AM
Not up to the task. Clueless from start to finish. Worst Hibs side ever. That's all.

Fatbloke? Fat Fud more like - give him a chance FFS :rolleyes:

Burgh Hibby
03-01-2012, 08:52 AM
Behave yourself, thats not his dross on the pitch.

No but his team selection , tactics and lack of subs were a joke and a major concern.

Andy74
03-01-2012, 09:51 AM
No but his team selection , tactics and lack of subs were a joke and a major concern.

Here we go again.

When people suggest the fans might be part of the problem well here it is. We are already starting to ignore what Fenlon has to work with and we are chipping away at him. A few posters already have a full campaign of making sure he can be blamed for everything.

So, we will hound this guy out and a few months down the line wonder why we never achieve anything. Its pathetic.

Lets give him a few months and some players eh?

Beefster
03-01-2012, 09:57 AM
Here we go again.

When people suggest the fans might be part of the problem well here it is. We are already starting to ignore what Fenlon has to work with and we are chipping away at him. A few posters already have a full campaign of making sure he can be blamed for everything.

So, we will hound this guy out and a few months down the line wonder why we never achieve anything. Its pathetic.

Lets give him a few months and some players eh?

I love Internet amnesia. You spent about 9 months moaning about Calderwood.

Vontz
03-01-2012, 09:58 AM
Fatbloke? Fat Fud more like - give him a chance FFS :rolleyes:

Fenlon will need to be given time, however as Fatbloke says this is the worst Hibs team I have ever seen. There has been some poor Hibs teams over the years but even they had players worth watching. Can you honestly say that about this lot?

Andy74
03-01-2012, 10:02 AM
I love Internet amnesia. You spent about 9 months moaning about Calderwood.

After a number of months and several of his players. He also had a very rare opportunity with so many players out of contract.

He was a bit of a special case making un undeperforming team even worse.

My concerns with him grew over time and on failings that could be quire rightly pinned on him.

What we are already seeing now with Fenon is pathetic and if he isn't going to get support right now then we don't deserve to get any success.

Beefster
03-01-2012, 10:03 AM
After a number of months and several of his players. He also had a very rare opportunity with so many players out of contract.

He was a bit of a special case making un undeperforming team even worse.

My concerns with him grew over time and on failings that could be quire rightly pinned on him.

What we are already seeing now with Fenon is pathetic and if he isn't going to get support right now then we don't deserve to get any success.

No questioning his decisions until when?

Westie1875
03-01-2012, 10:08 AM
After a number of months and several of his players. He also had a very rare opportunity with so many players out of contract.


He was a bit of a special case making un undeperforming team even worse.

My concerns with him grew over time and on failings that could be quire rightly pinned on him.

What we are already seeing now with Fenon is pathetic and if he isn't going to get support right now then we don't deserve to get any success.

I don't see anyone suggesting we get rid of Fenlon, are we not allowed to criticise tactics now? Yes, he doesn't have a great squad to choose from but he and BB should know that our defence is not good enough to play out a draw against anyone, and that is never an acceptable tactic at home in a derby match IMO.

I'm not saying he is an awful manager, just that he got it wrong yesterday so needs to take his share of the blame and learn from this fast.

Brizo
03-01-2012, 10:22 AM
Thought we were set up with damage limitation the order of the day and tbh given the absolute [email protected] on our books I think that was a fair tactic given that imho (tin helmet on ) the Hertz have far better players than us. And of course most Hertz would be mainly motivated by using the live TV appearance to get a move.

I was dissapointed that we waited so long to make subs and think PF would have been happy with the draw working on the basis we inch our away away from relegation. If that was his tactic it backfired big time. After the game we were debating whether the current squad is better or worse than the squads that got relegated twice in our lifetimes. General consensus was as bad if not worse so PF has a huge job on his hands.

We are in desparate need of players with decent technical ability, players with leadership qualities and players with a real physical presence to get us out of this mess. Whether PF is given the funds to get them or has the ability to find them and mould them into a team will determine how long he stays at ER.

Aldo
03-01-2012, 10:29 AM
FFS PF is totally slated on here again. He know the players capabilities and sets the team out knowing this. The only thing we could of expected yesterday was the draw.

We were woeful barring a 10 min spell. Too many players not up to scratch and as PF said at the post match interview there will be 5 or so leaving in the coming weeks.

The man gets my full backing and needs at least 18 months to dirt out the ***** left by the previous 2.

I expect the following to be punted

Hart, Scott, Sodje, Aggogo, Thornhill, GOC (sold to highest bidder. Hope not but needs to get his finger out) Sproule Galbraith (both no where near good enough and yesterday proved this) possibly Brown?? (hope not). There may even be a few surprises???

We shall see

Cropley10
03-01-2012, 10:30 AM
Thought we were set up with damage limitation the order of the day and tbh given the absolute [email protected] on our books I think that was a fair tactic given that imho (tin helmet on ) the Hertz have far better players than us. And of course most Hertz would be mainly motivated by using the live TV appearance to get a move.

I was dissapointed that we waited so long to make subs and think PF would have been happy with the draw working on the basis we inch our away away from relegation. If that was his tactic it backfired big time. After the game we were debating whether the current squad is better or worse than the squads that got relegated twice in our lifetimes. General consensus was as bad if not worse so PF has a huge job on his hands.

We are in desparate need of players with decent technical ability, players with leadership qualities and players with a real physical presence to get us out of this mess. Whether PF is given the funds to get them or has the ability to find them and mould them into a team will determine how long he stays at ER.

All true. Our former League of Ireland manager certainly has his work cut out. A steep learning curve for him whilst he simultaneously tries to win valuable points.

thebausburst
03-01-2012, 10:41 AM
I expect the following to be punted

Hart, Scott, Sodje, Aggogo, Thornhill, GOC (sold to highest bidder. Hope not but needs to get his finger out) Sproule Galbraith (both no where near good enough and yesterday proved this) possibly Brown?? (hope not). There may even be a few surprises???

We shall see

I hope Scott is not punted, only one who matched Hearts in terms of fight, I was at the game and thought he played really well.

Hibernia Na Eir
03-01-2012, 10:44 AM
30 to 40 god awful players brought to hibs by last two managers....ALL of them extremely poor.
massive job Pat. Good luck.

basehibby
03-01-2012, 03:33 PM
Fenlon will need to be given time, however as Fatbloke says this is the worst Hibs team I have ever seen. There has been some poor Hibs teams over the years but even they had players worth watching. Can you honestly say that about this lot?


The thread is not criticising the team (and a fat lot that would contribute anyway - same team we've been watching for the last 4 months) - it's criticising the manager who's barely in the door and the criticism is very very far from objective - as such it totally deserves to be ridiculed.

allezsauzee
03-01-2012, 03:38 PM
2012 is going to be our year :wink:

Sunny1875
03-01-2012, 06:01 PM
Is everyone completely mental? Hibs don't have the quality to go out and take control of a game and expect to get anything out of it. Fenlon played it tactically well. Playing counter attack and using pace up front to nick it! He was not playing for a draw that was clear as day. Individual errors cost us that game. Anyone blaming the manager is clueless.


:agree:

Cropley10
03-01-2012, 06:36 PM
Is everyone completely mental? Hibs don't have the quality to go out and take control of a game and expect to get anything out of it. Fenlon played it tactically well. Playing counter attack and using pace up front to nick it! He was not playing for a draw that was clear as day. Individual errors cost us that game. Anyone blaming the manager is clueless.

Ah the good old Individual Mistakes excuse. How many goals aren't scored by someone making one of these "individual mistakes"?

FWIW I think Pat couldn't believe his good fortune that a) they couldn't score in the first half, including a missed penalty b) a flukey cross meant we scored from an OG. Rather than change anything he did nothing until it was too late. We were definitely playing for our second point under Pat.

FYI we had no, none, zero shots on target.

Cropley10
03-01-2012, 06:39 PM
The thread is not criticising the team (and a fat lot that would contribute anyway - same team we've been watching for the last 4 months) - it's criticising the manager who's barely in the door and the criticism is very very far from objective - as such it totally deserves to be ridiculed.

This thread is merely pointing out that it feels like Groundhog Day. Caldo came in and got EXACTLY the same reaction 14 months ago. Pats record is worse than Caldos. But what we're told is that it will be better once he gets his own players in. Of course this is precisely what we were told after Caldo got off to the same start.

weonlywon6-2
03-01-2012, 06:51 PM
I've no problem with Fenlon so far at all.

First half he was charging about the touchline telling the front five to push up and press, which was spot on, and much better than watching Calderwood, who spent whole games in an apparent daydream.

He's playing a conservative formation and tactics with holding midfielders and one up front so we dont get relegated. He was playing for the point today, as he was vs ICT, and considering the ****ing terrible state we're in I have to agree with him. Hopefully in May we survive, regroup and we can change things his way in the summer.

Its the players.

for me this sums it all up.:aok:

eastmainsmsh
03-01-2012, 07:02 PM
playing the lone striker it has to come from the flanks or the midfield which was overlooked yesterday however with Sparkys pace a defence splitting pass which TBF no one in midfield looked capable of making id put money on Sparky beating the defenders and goalkeeper just not happening for Nutsy hopefully soon tho......Id maybe have Galbraith on the right flank and Ivan on left both cutting inside hopefully leaving Full Backs on backfoot In the 4-5-1

nortonhibby
03-01-2012, 07:34 PM
This thread is merely pointing out that it feels like Groundhog Day. Caldo came in and got EXACTLY the same reaction 14 months ago. Pats record is worse than Caldos. But what we're told is that it will be better once he gets his own players in. Of course this is precisely what we were told after Caldo got off to the same start.

No one at Sunderland is complaining after 5 games Martin Oneal with the same players as Steve Bruce look at the remarkable turn around in there fortunes.

Cropley10
03-01-2012, 07:37 PM
No one at Sunderland is complaining after 5 games Martin Oneal with the same players as Steve Bruce look at the remarkable turn around in there fortunes.

And your point is? :confused:

EVENTUALLY
03-01-2012, 07:49 PM
I think people are underestimating just how bad we are right now.

There is nothing that Pat Fenlon can do until he is allowed to bring in his own players and that will take time. I've said it before and I will say it again, he needs at least 2 years and that's what I'll be giving him.

Almost every single player in our squad is not good enough to play for Hibs. Maybe he could have done a few things differently today but, in the grand scheme of things, I don't think it would made a blind bit of difference.

We are absolute garbage and need a complete overhaul.

It remains to be seen if Fenlon will be the man to deliver those changes and to improve our fortunes but he certainly cannot be judged at the moment.

It would have been a miracle if he had been able to turn things around after a month, with the current set of players. That's not happened but I definitely won't be judging him just now.

There is a lot he can do.

Start playing players in their most effective positions for one. Hanlon and Murray at right back is desperate.

He's already suggested they are not fit enough, so get them fitter because they're still losing late goals and consequently games.

Sproule and Galbraith were both poor against Hearts but looked more comfortable on the right and left respectively, our goal against Hearts was delivered by Galbraith from the left who picked up the cross from the right from Sproule. This modern idea to play players, especially wingers on the opposite side of their stronger side is fine if the actual delivery when they cut in/back is accomplished but Sproule and Galbraith crossing and shooting on their weaker side is very poor. Play them to their strengths and cover up their weaknesses.

Drill the defence again and again and again to deal with corner kicks and free kicks around the box, adapt a strategy for instance similar to when Rob Jones picked up no opposition player and simply attacked the ball. O'Hanlon is very hesitant but he is equipped to deal with this type of situation and so is Stephens if all they have to deal with is attacking the ball.

Appoint a specialist free kick taker, instead of the huddle gathering around the ball before someone bullies the rest of them out of the way to take it. The other players should all be automatically taking up positions to take up a second ball.

It's clear he's worked on throw-ins with better movement and Martin Scott as his preferred receiver, but the defence of shys is woeful. He must improve this.

If he is going to keep Griffiths he must be given support with a partner playing alongside him. O'connor is capable of playing on his own however the best they have played was as a duo in the 1st half at Motherwell. Griffiths toils on his own up front.

There are players there to work with and I do not believe that Wotherspoon and Booth have lost ability, only confidence. He has lifted Lewis Stevenson who has produced decent performances since he came in and he has to get a hold of these young guys and lift them as well.

New players are needed, no doubt about it but PF needs to play his part, by managing this dreadful situation right now.

Cropley10
03-01-2012, 08:33 PM
There is a lot he can do.

Start playing players in their most effective positions for one. Hanlon and Murray at right back is desperate.

He's already suggested they are not fit enough, so get them fitter because they're still losing late goals and consequently games.

Sproule and Galbraith were both poor against Hearts but looked more comfortable on the right and left respectively, our goal against Hearts was delivered by Galbraith from the left who picked up the cross from the right from Sproule. This modern idea to play players, especially wingers on the opposite side of their stronger side is fine if the actual delivery when they cut in/back is accomplished but Sproule and Galbraith crossing and shooting on their weaker side is very poor. Play them to their strengths and cover up their weaknesses.

Drill the defence again and again and again to deal with corner kicks and free kicks around the box, adapt a strategy for instance similar to when Rob Jones picked up no opposition player and simply attacked the ball. O'Hanlon is very hesitant but he is equipped to deal with this type of situation and so is Stephens if all they have to deal with is attacking the ball.

Appoint a specialist free kick taker, instead of the huddle gathering around the ball before someone bullies the rest of them out of the way to take it. The other players should all be automatically taking up positions to take up a second ball.

It's clear he's worked on throw-ins with better movement and Martin Scott as his preferred receiver, but the defence of shys is woeful. He must improve this.

If he is going to keep Griffiths he must be given support with a partner playing alongside him. O'connor is capable of playing on his own however the best they have played was as a duo in the 1st half at Motherwell. Griffiths toils on his own up front.

There are players there to work with and I do not believe that Wotherspoon and Booth have lost ability, only confidence. He has lifted Lewis Stevenson who has produced decent performances since he came in and he has to get a hold of these young guys and lift them as well.

New players are needed, no doubt about it but PF needs to play his part, by managing this dreadful situation right now.

Great post. Constantly saying wait til he's got his own players can't be right. No doubt we need better but this lot can and must achieve more.

Alfred E Newman
03-01-2012, 09:00 PM
There is a lot he can do.

Start playing players in their most effective positions for one. Hanlon and Murray at right back is desperate.

He's already suggested they are not fit enough, so get them fitter because they're still losing late goals and consequently games.

Sproule and Galbraith were both poor against Hearts but looked more comfortable on the right and left respectively, our goal against Hearts was delivered by Galbraith from the left who picked up the cross from the right from Sproule. This modern idea to play players, especially wingers on the opposite side of their stronger side is fine if the actual delivery when they cut in/back is accomplished but Sproule and Galbraith crossing and shooting on their weaker side is very poor. Play them to their strengths and cover up their weaknesses.

Drill the defence again and again and again to deal with corner kicks and free kicks around the box, adapt a strategy for instance similar to when Rob Jones picked up no opposition player and simply attacked the ball. O'Hanlon is very hesitant but he is equipped to deal with this type of situation and so is Stephens if all they have to deal with is attacking the ball.

Appoint a specialist free kick taker, instead of the huddle gathering around the ball before someone bullies the rest of them out of the way to take it. The other players should all be automatically taking up positions to take up a second ball.

It's clear he's worked on throw-ins with better movement and Martin Scott as his preferred receiver, but the defence of shys is woeful. He must improve this.

If he is going to keep Griffiths he must be given support with a partner playing alongside him. O'connor is capable of playing on his own however the best they have played was as a duo in the 1st half at Motherwell. Griffiths toils on his own up front.

There are players there to work with and I do not believe that Wotherspoon and Booth have lost ability, only confidence. He has lifted Lewis Stevenson who has produced decent performances since he came in and he has to get a hold of these young guys and lift them as well.

New players are needed, no doubt about it but PF needs to play his part, by managing this dreadful situation right now.

At least we know who to call on when Fenlon gets his jotters.

Sir David Gray
03-01-2012, 09:02 PM
There is a lot he can do.

Start playing players in their most effective positions for one. Hanlon and Murray at right back is desperate.

He's already suggested they are not fit enough, so get them fitter because they're still losing late goals and consequently games.

Sproule and Galbraith were both poor against Hearts but looked more comfortable on the right and left respectively, our goal against Hearts was delivered by Galbraith from the left who picked up the cross from the right from Sproule. This modern idea to play players, especially wingers on the opposite side of their stronger side is fine if the actual delivery when they cut in/back is accomplished but Sproule and Galbraith crossing and shooting on their weaker side is very poor. Play them to their strengths and cover up their weaknesses.

Drill the defence again and again and again to deal with corner kicks and free kicks around the box, adapt a strategy for instance similar to when Rob Jones picked up no opposition player and simply attacked the ball. O'Hanlon is very hesitant but he is equipped to deal with this type of situation and so is Stephens if all they have to deal with is attacking the ball.

Appoint a specialist free kick taker, instead of the huddle gathering around the ball before someone bullies the rest of them out of the way to take it. The other players should all be automatically taking up positions to take up a second ball.

It's clear he's worked on throw-ins with better movement and Martin Scott as his preferred receiver, but the defence of shys is woeful. He must improve this.

If he is going to keep Griffiths he must be given support with a partner playing alongside him. O'connor is capable of playing on his own however the best they have played was as a duo in the 1st half at Motherwell. Griffiths toils on his own up front.

There are players there to work with and I do not believe that Wotherspoon and Booth have lost ability, only confidence. He has lifted Lewis Stevenson who has produced decent performances since he came in and he has to get a hold of these young guys and lift them as well.

New players are needed, no doubt about it but PF needs to play his part, by managing this dreadful situation right now.

First point: If the players are as unfit as he's suggesting, it's physically impossible to improve fitness levels by any significant margin after a month.

He'll need another couple of months before we see any kind of improvement in that area.

Second point: Danny Galbraith is not a good enough football player for Hibs and we need better.

Third point: As a collective unit, our defence is garbage and I don't see any decent combination out of any of the players.

Fourth point: Our main problem has been scoring goals. 19 goals from 21 matches this season is abysmal and the main reason for that is our midfield is rotten and has zero creativity. As someone said yesterday, a midfield of Galbraith, Scott, Stevenson and Palsson is always likely to struggle and there is no sign of any creative play coming from that combination.

I agree with you about Griffiths, he can't play on his own but O'Connor was clearly not 100% fit and I don't think Doyle was ever going to start the game yesterday. I don't know that he had any option but to put Griffiths on his own.

I completely stand by what I said earlier. He cannot be judged at the moment and needs a minimum of 2 years to sort it out.

Cropley10
03-01-2012, 09:09 PM
First point: If the players are as unfit as he's suggesting, it's physically impossible to improve fitness levels by any significant margin after a month.

He'll need another couple of months before we see any kind of improvement in that area.

Second point: Danny Galbraith is not a good enough football player for Hibs and we need better.

Third point: As a collective unit, our defence is garbage and I don't see any decent combination out of any of the players.

Fourth point: Our main problem has been scoring goals. 19 goals from 21 matches this season is abysmal and the main reason for that is our midfield is rotten and has zero creativity. As someone said yesterday, a midfield of Galbraith, Scott, Stevenson and Palsson is always likely to struggle and there is no sign of any creative play coming from that combination.

I agree with you about Griffiths, he can't play on his own but O'Connor was clearly not 100% fit and I don't think Doyle was ever going to start the game yesterday. I don't know that he had any option but to put Griffiths on his own.

I completely stand by what I said earlier. He cannot be judged at the moment and needs a minimum of 2 years to sort it out.

I'd hope we'd see some signs of improvement inside that 2 year window you describe.

It must just be me but this has all the feel of Caldo MkII.

jdships
03-01-2012, 09:10 PM
At least we know who to call on when Fenlon gets his jotters.

Do you reckon he applied for the job and didn't get it and is really Gordon Strachan in disguise ? :greengrin :wink:

Whoever he is would seem to have a great future :greengrin:greengrin:wink:

:na na:

BoltonHibee
03-01-2012, 09:14 PM
I'd hope we'd see some signs of improvement inside that 2 year window you describe.

It must just be me but this has all the feel of Caldo MkII.

I'd have hoped we would have seen some sort of improvement to date, to me I've seen **** all. Even teaching them how to set up and take throw ins would be a start.

I'm worried on what I've seen thus far. No signs at all of improvement.

EVENTUALLY
03-01-2012, 09:26 PM
First point: If the players are as unfit as he's suggesting, it's physically impossible to improve fitness levels by any significant margin after a month.

He'll need another couple of months before we see any kind of improvement in that area.

Second point: Danny Galbraith is not a good enough football player for Hibs and we need better.

Third point: As a collective unit, our defence is garbage and I don't see any decent combination out of any of the players.

Fourth point: Our main problem has been scoring goals. 19 goals from 21 matches this season is abysmal and the main reason for that is our midfield is rotten and has zero creativity. As someone said yesterday, a midfield of Galbraith, Scott, Stevenson and Palsson is always likely to struggle and there is no sign of any creative play coming from that combination.

I agree with you about Griffiths, he can't play on his own but O'Connor was clearly not 100% fit and I don't think Doyle was ever going to start the game yesterday. I don't know that he had any option but to put Griffiths on his own.

I completely stand by what I said earlier. He cannot be judged at the moment and needs a minimum of 2 years to sort it out.

But to say he can do nothing at the moment is nonsense. He has got to get more out of these players and simple decisions to play people in their best positions would be a start. Martin O'Neill has done it at Sunderland, I know it's a different league but the same relative problems existed there a few weeks ago. Sunderland made ten signings in the summer and were completely under achieving but with some re-organisation, game awareness, timely substitutions and management of low confidence players they've done very well. PF has got to give them confidence to play now.

Sir David Gray
03-01-2012, 09:30 PM
I'd hope we'd see some signs of improvement inside that 2 year window you describe.

It must just be me but this has all the feel of Caldo MkII.

Of course we should see signs of improvement as the months go by but I don't think we'll see any serious improvement or be in a position that is appropriate for a club the size of Hibs before then.

Given the state that the club is in, on the pitch, I wouldn't expect to either.

Two years from his appointment date would take us to around a third of the way through the 2013/14 season and would allow Fenlon to have;

January 2012 window.
Summer 2012 window.
January 2013 window.
Summer 2013 window.

4 transfer windows sounds about right to sort the club out.

Cropley10
03-01-2012, 09:38 PM
Of course we should see signs of improvement as the months go by but I don't think we'll see any serious improvement or be in a position that is appropriate for a club the size of Hibs before then.

Given the state that the club is in, on the pitch, I wouldn't expect to either.

Two years from his appointment date would take us to around a third of the way through the 2013/14 season and would allow Fenlon to have;

January 2012 window.
Summer 2012 window.
January 2013 window.
Summer 2013 window.

4 transfer windows sounds about right to sort the club out.

What League will we be in by Summer 13?

Is it impossible for a little of what Sunderland have achieved in a few short weeks to happen here?

Sure give him time. That's what we said about Calderwood. I see no difference to their starts. He knew the score, he's a Pro manager, and it's just 1 point so far. A tricky away tie in the Cup and a relegation 6 pointer coming up.

No one gets 2 years to sort anything unless they show signs it's worth giving someone that time, based on what they're achieving week to week, month to month.

silverhibee
03-01-2012, 09:40 PM
FFS PF is totally slated on here again. He know the players capabilities and sets the team out knowing this. The only thing we could of expected yesterday was the draw.

We were woeful barring a 10 min spell. Too many players not up to scratch and as PF said at the post match interview there will be 5 or so leaving in the coming weeks.

The man gets my full backing and needs at least 18 months to dirt out the ***** left by the previous 2.

I expect the following to be punted

Hart, Scott, Sodje, Aggogo, Thornhill, GOC (sold to highest bidder. Hope not but needs to get his finger out) Sproule Galbraith (both no where near good enough and yesterday proved this) possibly Brown?? (hope not). There may even be a few surprises???

We shall see


My worry with that Aldo is that we will probaly have to pay them off as i cant see many clubs banging at the door to sign any of our players, apart from GOC, and where does the money come from to pay these players of, maybe Januarys budget, which wont leave much left in the kitty to bring in quality players that the team badly needs, i said after last season when Hibs had there clearout of players and the big earners left the club that the club introduced a wage cap and i still stand by that, and i will go further and say this season the wage cap has been lowered again by the board.

The fans have had enough and are not willing to come along to ER to watch the dross on the pitch anymore and pay the kind of price's that Hibs ask to watch them nowadays, even STH cant be bothered turning up anymore and they have paid for it, that has an effect on the managers budget if the crowds are poor, which means bringing in poor quality players and you know where we will end up if that happens.

There is only one answer, the board/owner have to find more money to fund the squad this month, how they do it i dont know but it has to be done or relagation beckons for our club and that would be a disaster for us.

Hibernia Na Eir
03-01-2012, 09:40 PM
Not up to the task. Clueless from start to finish. Worst Hibs side ever. That's all.

yeah, but all thanks to COLIN CALDERWOOD. Let Paddy do his stuff and give him time with HIS men, ffs!

Sir David Gray
03-01-2012, 09:51 PM
What League will we be in by Summer 13?

Is it impossible for a little of what Sunderland have achieved in a few short weeks to happen here?

Sure give him time. That's what we said about Calderwood. I see no difference to their starts. He knew the score, he's a Pro manager, and it's just 1 point so far. A tricky away tie in the Cup and a relegation 6 pointer coming up.

No one gets 2 years to sort anything unless they show signs it's worth giving someone that time, based on what they're achieving week to week, month to month.

I think Sunderland genuinely were underachieving at the beginning of the season though. You only need to look through their squad to realise that they were in a false position. I think they are now starting to play to their full potential.

Two years of almost constant bad results and awful performances suggests to me that we are where we are because we have a squad that lacks quality and we are one of the weakest teams in the SPL.

I don't expect that to change until he's been able to significantly overhaul the squad and that takes time. It won't be done in one transfer window, I'm not even certain that it'll be done in two transfer windows, such is the state that we find ourselves in at the moment.

If we're getting to the end of next season and we're still struggling at the bottom of the league or (God forbid) struggling to get promotion, then questions should maybe be asked of Pat Fenlon but not at the moment.

I'm not saying Fenlon will definitely be the answer, by the way, I've no feelings towards the guy either way. But he needs the time and the space to try and sort out our many problems.

I certainly don't envy his task.

silverhibee
03-01-2012, 09:54 PM
But to say he can do nothing at the moment is nonsense. He has got to get more out of these players and simple decisions to play people in their best positions would be a start. Martin O'Neill has done it at Sunderland, I know it's a different league but the same relative problems existed there a few weeks ago. Sunderland made ten signings in the summer and were completely under achieving but with some re-organisation, game awareness, timely substitutions and management of low confidence players they've done very well. PF has got to give them confidence to play now.


Sunderland win 4-1 tonight, maybe Martin O'neil has some of that majic gold dust. :greengrin

Baldy Foghorn
03-01-2012, 09:55 PM
This thread is merely pointing out that it feels like Groundhog Day. Caldo came in and got EXACTLY the same reaction 14 months ago. Pats record is worse than Caldos. But what we're told is that it will be better once he gets his own players in. Of course this is precisely what we were told after Caldo got off to the same start.

You have to question the players.....They seem to have a couldn't care less attitude, and dont seem to perform for ANY manager.....

Cropley10
03-01-2012, 09:59 PM
Sunderland win 4-1 tonight, maybe Martin O'neil has some of that majic gold dust. :greengrin

Apparently the Sunderland Chairman was nervous about MON thinking he was a cheque book manager. MON said he wasn't. Imagine "when he gets his own players in" !

Cropley10
03-01-2012, 10:02 PM
I think Sunderland genuinely were underachieving at the beginning of the season though. You only need to look through their squad to realise that they were in a false position. I think they are now starting to play to their full potential.

Two years of almost constant bad results and awful performances suggests to me that we are where we are because we have a squad that lacks quality and we are one of the weakest teams in the SPL.

I don't expect that to change until he's been able to significantly overhaul the squad and that takes time. It won't be done in one transfer window, I'm not even certain that it'll be done in two transfer windows, such is the state that we find ourselves in at the moment.

If we're getting to the end of next season and we're still struggling at the bottom of the league or (God forbid) struggling to get promotion, then questions should maybe be asked of Pat Fenlon but not at the moment.

I'm not saying Fenlon will definitely be the answer, by the way, I've no feelings towards the guy either way. But he needs the time and the space to try and sort out our many problems.

I certainly don't envy his task.

And you are right. Of course Pat needs time.

I've actually decided to go EEP on the 14th, taking the wee man and his pal. Looking forward to a better atmosphere and a battling point;-)

nortonhibby
03-01-2012, 10:03 PM
Sunderland win 4-1 tonight, maybe Martin O'neil has some of that majic gold dust. :greengrin

can he throw some over our way please PF Looks like him and talks the talk:pfgwa

Andy74
03-01-2012, 10:04 PM
This has the feeling of two or three people on a Fenlon witch hunt already. Not sure it's sunk in just how bad our players currently are.

nortonhibby
03-01-2012, 10:08 PM
And your point is? :confused:



well you figure it out mate oh Sunderland won tonight hmmm with the same players:confused: i wonder why :confused:

Dirkster23
03-01-2012, 10:10 PM
I'd have hoped we would have seen some sort of improvement to date, to me I've seen **** all. Even teaching them how to set up and take throw ins would be a start.

I'm worried on what I've seen thus far. No signs at all of improvement.

It's maybe not much, but we kept a lot more possession from throw ins yesterday thanks to Jimmy Scott's willingness to make himself available.

Baldy Foghorn
03-01-2012, 10:11 PM
This has the feeling of two or three people on a Fenlon witch hunt already. Not sure it's sunk in just how bad our players currently are.

We have a very weak squad, I really hope genuine quality is brought in....I also hope PF can get these players working harder on every aspect of their game.........

nortonhibby
03-01-2012, 10:13 PM
It's maybe not much, but we kept a lot more possession from throw ins yesterday thanks to Jimmy Scott's willingness to make himself available.

good post knowing that we keep possession at throw in better gives me confidence we can beat Dunfy.:flag:

Eyrie
03-01-2012, 11:32 PM
well you figure it out mate oh Sunderland won tonight hmmm with the same players:confused: i wonder why :confused:
Because they had some decent players that were underperforming before O'Neill came in and they were playing a struggling Wigan team?

Fenlon has been landed with the Calderduds and it will take him time to get the necessary quality into the squad. Ideally I'd like five new faces this month as a starter.

BoltonHibee
03-01-2012, 11:48 PM
It's maybe not much, but we kept a lot more possession from throw ins yesterday thanks to Jimmy Scott's willingness to make himself available.

I'm not sure about that. Granted Scott got the majority of the flick ons from the throw, but generally after that possession was conceded. There is still no movement and he has the wrong players taking the throws.

The Green Goblin
03-01-2012, 11:54 PM
:agree:
Has no-one actually noticed that no matter who plays and no matter what formation they play in, this group of players are nowhere near good enough.

Indeed, that's right, although apparently Fenlon was expected by a good few folk on here to pull the rabbit out of the hat and somehow win games with them. It would be funny if it wasn't so desperate and absurd. I agree he should have made the subs earlier, but I would also be kidding myself if I really thought that would have changed the final outcome of the game. 5 games with the worst squad in living memory and he is the one taking stick for it. The guy has an utterly thankless, near-impossible task ahead of him, he seems to me to be a big improvement in terms of his attitude towards the job than his predecessors and there's already folks saying he is not up to the job. My God, who would be Pat Fenlon right now?

Beefster
04-01-2012, 08:11 AM
This has the feeling of two or three people on a Fenlon witch hunt already. Not sure it's sunk in just how bad our players currently are.


Indeed, that's right, although apparently Fenlon was expected by a good few folk on here to pull the rabbit out of the hat and somehow win games with them. It would be funny if it wasn't so desperate and absurd. I agree he should have made the subs earlier, but I would also be kidding myself if I really thought that would have changed the final outcome of the game. 5 games with the worst squad in living memory and he is the one taking stick for it. The guy has an utterly thankless, near-impossible task ahead of him, he seems to me to be a big improvement in terms of his attitude towards the job than his predecessors and there's already folks saying he is not up to the job. My God, who would be Pat Fenlon right now?

As usual, everything on Hibs.net is black and white with no shades of grey.

It's possible to question any manager's decisions without calling for his head. It's possible to expect signs of improvement without expecting wins.

Fenlon made tactical mistakes on Monday.
He made his subs at the wrong time.
He's got us playing defensively with a woeful defence.

You can still set the team up right, even with mince players.

Aldo
04-01-2012, 08:45 AM
FFS I am sorry but PF has got them playing slightly better. 1st 45 at well, not too bad 1st half at UTD.

Players are *****. CC could nae pick his own arse and tell you what was the worst manager I have seen at ER since I started going in 1978.

Not 1 player of any stature or quality. For me we need a leader/organiser someone to be respected. Build a sound of a team and then add players here and there.

For me PF will get time. This is a massive job. SAF and Jose couldn't get us out this mess.

I am glad he is ditching players. That's his job. Get guys in to keep us up then take it from there.

Priority is for me anyway

NOT TO GET RELEGATED.

woodyloon
04-01-2012, 11:22 AM
I think PF has shown already the team has more shape about it. It does look like that for a long time now the work ethics from previous manager/s was pretty poor and PF is having go right back to basics, by the sound of things he is having to waste time on the training ground coaching a team how to defend properly. It is a real eye opener that a bunch of professional don't understand how to defend as a team.

It is Now PF job to get them playing as a team, and he has targeted increasing the work rate during games, and defending, as the first things that required improvement. It is a real possibility, as gut wrenching as it that we might have far to much work too do with the time left this season, and there is a real possibilty that any rebuild might end up being done in a lower division.
As hard as it, especially the past few seasons, but we need to try and be more positive, it wasn't PF that the fans lost confidence in, it was CC who as we all know should of been punted in the summer, but it didn't happen so we are here now with a young manager who has built more than one team capable of winning trophies, albeit in the LOI, but is there really much difference in the standard of football when you compare it to the SPL.

The Green Goblin
04-01-2012, 12:26 PM
As usual, everything on Hibs.net is black and white with no shades of grey.

It's possible to question any manager's decisions without calling for his head. It's possible to expect signs of improvement without expecting wins.

Fenlon made tactical mistakes on Monday.
He made his subs at the wrong time.
He's got us playing defensively with a woeful defence.

You can still set the team up right, even with mince players.


I definitely do not think that PF is above criticism - I criticised him in the post you quoted and have done so elsewhere, at least for his failure to make substitutions earlier, but again, I am far from convinced it would have made any difference to the final outcome of the game.

What we will have to agree to disagree on though, is the bit in bold, and the expectation that he should be performing better than he is with the dross he has at his disposal left there from the last several managers who got us into this position in the first place.

As the man who is currently trying his best to get us out of the situation they left us in, who has got the players working a lot harder, who has had 5 games in a congested month (against Rangers, Hearts, Motherwell - all top end of the table - and that penalty that never was against Aberdeen) and who has not even had a single transfer window yet, I really don't think it's too much to ask for some folks to be a bit more patient with him and the things he is trying. Clearly though, it is too much to ask for a lot of fans on here.

GG

cad
04-01-2012, 12:40 PM
From what I saw in recent weeks hes doing what he can ,Utd ,game and Hearts although not pretty hes playing to what strengths he thinks we have ,I saw more effort in the Hearts game than Ive seen for a long time by some of our players it was also pretty obvious which players were unfit ,
the other thing is it was also very obvious how bad the standard of player we have at the minute at ER .

Get on with it Pat early days

Cropley10
04-01-2012, 12:44 PM
From what I saw in recent weeks hes doing what he can ,Utd ,game and Hearts although not pretty hes playing to what strengths he thinks we have ,I saw more effort in the Hearts game than Ive seen for a long time by some of our players it was also pretty obvious which players were unfit ,
the other thing is it was also very obvious how bad the standard of player we have at the minute at ER .

Get on with it Pat early days

Which players would you say looked unfit?

cad
04-01-2012, 01:21 PM
Im maybe confusing fitness with pace Scott looked tired after an hour , Sproule , Hanlon , , O Hanlon all looked jaded to me after 75 , 80 mins
just my opinion mate

Cropley10
04-01-2012, 01:26 PM
Im maybe confusing fitness with pace Scott looked tired after an hour , Sproule , Hanlon , , O Hanlon all looked jaded to me after 75 , 80 mins
just my opinion mate

Dont disagree with Scott - that's a hard shift in there, playing in the middle with one up top. I don't think the others you mention can have the same excuse...

Jones28
04-01-2012, 01:34 PM
Fenlon has already got the team playing with more shape and they are more organised.

Also seeing a lot more commitment from some players.


He obviously see's something with Stevenson, which is IMHO a great decision as he has been playing very well recently. In the derby his early booking really muted his game, he couldn't play effectively as a defensive midfielder and break the play up properly. I think Osbourne coming back into the team will be great, with him and Lewis in the middle.



Stack
Hanlon O'Hanlon Murray Booth
Wotherspoon Osbourne Stevenson Sproule
Sodje/O'Connor Griffiths