The Unworkable Legacy

[Keith_M]

This was a term that Rod Petrie used to describe the state that Hibs were in after Hughes left. He then appointed Calderwood, who left us with this!?!?!


I'd really be interested to hear Petries's views on the legacy left by the guy he appointed to replace Hughes.


IMHO, this (Calderwood's) squad are just not good enough and we need a root and branch clear out. I'd be surprised if ANY manager could make a football team from this lot.

What's the saying again about a Silk Purse and a Sows Ear?

[blackpoolhibs]

This was a term that Rod Petrie used to describe the state that Hibs were in after Hughes left. He then appointed Calderwood, who left us with this!?!?!


I'd really be interested to hear Petries's views on the legacy left by the guy he appointed to replace Hughes.


IMHO, this (Calderwood's) squad are just not good enough and we need a root and branch clear out. I'd be surprised if ANY manager could make a football team from this lot.

What's the saying again about a Silk Purse and a Sows Ear?

Petries an erse, i'd kill (am i allowed to say that?) for Hughes side now.

[Aldo]

Unworkable Yes Hughes was blamed for it last season and he has to play a part in the demise of our club but I will say this

Coco the ****ing clown has well and truely Bollocked our team up with the utter pish he has bought to this club.

He had his time and was backed by the club. The man was a total and utter arse.

We won't get relegated but watch this space. At least 4 in during the next window players PF knows I would think?

[matty_f]

Unworkable Yes Hughes was blamed for it last season and he has to play a part in the demise of our club but I will say this

Coco the ****ing clown has well and truely Bollocked our team up with the utter pish he has bought to this club.

He had his time and was backed by the club. The man was a total and utter arse.

We won't get relegated but watch this space. At least 4 in during the next window players PF knows I would think?

It's a pretty damning indication of the quality of Calderwood's signings when you consider that only O'Hanlon, Sproule, Scott, and O'Connor started today and he pretty much revamped the squad. Osbourne would have played today, but that would have been at the expense of Scott, so still - four players from however many that he signed. Pretty poor success rate.

In saying that, only Stack, Hart, Stephens and Galbraith (who was already coming to the club IIRC) were Hughes' signings from just over a year ago, so it doesn't say much for his success rate either.

[Kammy1875]

Colin Calderwoods appointment, then his backing and then not letting him go in the summer is a trilogy of disasters that has us in the position we are in now.

Sacking John Hughes and bringing in that clown was ludicrous.

[RIP]

No manager can save us we need more fundamental change

[heretoday]

I hope Fenlon's got a decent shopping list (and a large skip out the back).

[Seveno]

PF has brought out the best in Lewis Stevenson. HE has broughtt organisation to our side.

I have faith in him

[Feed McGraw]

Colin Calderwoods appointment, then his backing and then not letting him go in the summer is a trilogy of disasters that has us in the position we are in now.

Sacking John Hughes and bringing in that clown was ludicrous.

They should have sacked John Hughes long before they actually did and got in somebody who knew how to sort the mess out - Calderwood didn`t, that`s for sure.

[matty_f]

PF has brought out the best in Lewis Stevenson. HE has broughtt organisation to our side.

I have faith in him

:agree: Wotherspoon has looked a better player as well, amongst others.

Crucially though, Fenlon's had two games to turn it around, working in some of the pishest conditions weather-wise that he possibly could have done.

The shape, organisation, work-rate, commitment etc is night and day to Calderwood's team.

[Kaiser1962]

No manager can save us we need more fundamental change


Pretty confident statement that.

[Kammy1875]

They should have sacked John Hughes long before they actually did and got in somebody who knew how to sort the mess out - Calderwood didn`t, that`s for sure.

Yep, I agree. But sacking him and brining in someone 100x worse was tragic, not letting him leave in the summer was criminal.

Do the board, instead of blaming Hughes in a statement man the fk up and admit they were hopeless, appointed bad managers on behalf of us, the club? Nope. They don't.

[Feed McGraw]

Yep, I agree. But sacking him and brining in someone 100x worse was tragic, not letting him leave in the summer was criminal.

Do the board, instead of blaming Hughes in a statement man the fk up and admit they were hopeless, appointed bad managers on behalf of us, the club? Nope. They don't.

The board do have a lot to answer for and yes, you`re right, the biggest mistake was holding on to Calderwood in the summer. Most Hibs supporters knew it wasn`t working and it was a "get out jail free card". Unfortunately our board didn`t understand that. Poor, poor decision - but they excel at poor decisions.

[Ray_]

:agree: Wotherspoon has looked a better player as well, amongst others.

Crucially though, Fenlon's had two games to turn it around, working in some of the pishest conditions weather-wise that he possibly could have done.

The shape, organisation, work-rate, commitment etc is night and day to Calderwood's team.

The two games is fine enought Matt & I really believe what I've seen & heard from him, Pat Fenlon will turn it around, the acid test will be when it comes to outing the ones not deemed good enough & who he gets in. As for the weather, its the same for both sides & it is Scotland we are talking about here.

[Kammy1875]

The board do have a lot to answer for and yes, you`re right, the biggest mistake was holding on to Calderwood in the summer. Most Hibs supporters knew it wasn`t working and it was a "get out jail free card". Unfortunately our board didn`t understand that. Poor, poor decision - but they excel at poor decisions.

It wasn't the majority decision on here though. But you did say Hibs supporters so I'll let you off :wink:

[matty_f]

The two games is fine enought Matt & I really believe what I've seen & heard from him, Pat Fenlon will turn it around, the acid test will be when it comes to outing the ones not deemed good enough & who he gets in. As for the weather, its the same for both sides & it is Scotland we are talking about here.

The difference is Pa Broon has had a year and a bit to get Aberdeen in that state, Fenlon took Hibs over in a worse nick and hasn't really had the opportunity to do as much as he'd liked to have done because of the weather. That's a fair statement, IMHO.

[Aldo]

PF had brought. Organisation and to an extent some tactics. For me he is trying to balance the team, and for me that's the most important part... Playing players to their strengths ie in their proper positions.

Like I have said the biggest problem is the majority of the players are crap so PF is only pissing with the Cock he's got.

I have seen and heard enough of PF that given the correct time and backing will see us moving in the right direction.

[Feed McGraw]

It wasn't the majority decision on here though. But you did say Hibs supporters so I'll let you off :wink:

Well thanks Kammy, after 30 years married I don`t get let off with much ! :greengrin

[jacomo]

It wasn't the majority decision on here though. But you did say Hibs supporters so I'll let you off :wink:

The supporters didn't have the advantage of being able to demand a meeting with CC over the summer and ask him WTF was going on.

This is what I still don't understand about the situation... why did Petrie throw all his weight behind a manager who clearly didn't want to be here?

[Cropley10]

This is what I still don't understand about the situation... why did Petrie throw all his weight behind a manager who clearly didn't want to be here?

Good question. Perhaps because it might have a looked a little hasty to let him leave, or he saw something in him that no-one else did. Or more likely, it would call firmly into question bringing someone here who actually wanted to get away so quickly and so that he could become an Assistant Manager to someone else!

Whatever your views I think appointing CC and his tenure at the Club will be seen as one of the real low points of the past 10 years.

[nortonhibby]

This was a term that Rod Petrie used to describe the state that Hibs were in after Hughes left. He then appointed Calderwood, who left us with this!?!?!


I'd really be interested to hear Petries's views on the legacy left by the guy he appointed to replace Hughes.


IMHO, this (Calderwood's) squad are just not good enough and we need a root and branch clear out. I'd be surprised if ANY manager could make a football team from this lot.

What's the saying again about a Silk Purse and a Sows Ear?

PF Would have been aware what he had to work with before he accepted the job 2 games in 2 defeats and nil goals scored is not great but there has been improvement in organisation work rate and fitness.

for what its worth yes RP Did get it wrong by sticking with co co for way to long.

[silverhibee]

Petries an erse, i'd kill (am i allowed to say that?) for Hughes side now.


He sure is for sticking by CC in the summer, and made a bigger one of his self by backing him with his made up stats in his statement defending him.

[RiseAbove]

it's about time that Rod 'the teflon don' Petrie came out and actually told the fans why he didnt let Calerdwood go in the summer, was there a clause in Calderwood's contract that Petrie did'nt want to trigger?

[SneakersO'Toole]

Why are people still talking about CC? He has gone thankfully, never to return.

Yes the board have made multiple mistakes however they apologised for his appointment at the AGM. Doesn't make it ok or any less galling however the board aren't going anywhere either so to scrutinise them also is pretty pointless.

We have a new manager. All supporters should be concentrating on getting behind Fenlon and getting Hibs out of the mess we are in.

[johnrebus]

it's about time that Rod 'the teflon don' Petrie came out and actually told the fans why he didnt let Calerdwood go in the summer, was there a clause in Calderwood's contract that Petrie did'nt want to trigger?

We will hear nothing more from Petrie till the next AGM



:clown:

[Big Frank]

Why are people still talking about CC? He has gone thankfully, never to return.

Yes the board have made multiple mistakes however they apologised for his appointment at the AGM. Doesn't make it ok or any less galling however the board aren't going anywhere either so to scrutinise them also is pretty pointless.

We have a new manager. All supporters should be concentrating on getting behind Fenlon and getting Hibs out of the mess we are in.


Excellent post Sneakers.

CC casts a long shadow. (i really dislike him, what a shambles he's left my club in), but he's gone (thank ****).

Its all about Paddy and Hibernian now

[SneakersO'Toole]

it's about time that Rod 'the teflon don' Petrie came out and actually told the fans why he didnt let Calerdwood go in the summer, was there a clause in Calderwood's contract that Petrie did'nt want to trigger?

He already has.

[JimBHibees]

Good question. Perhaps because it might have a looked a little hasty to let him leave, or he saw something in him that no-one else did. Or more likely, it would call firmly into question bringing someone here who actually wanted to get away so quickly and so that he could become an Assistant Manager to someone else!

Whatever your views I think appointing CC and his tenure at the Club will be seen as one of the real low points of the past 10 years.

Bottom line is he only wanted to go to Birmingham who were in a mess at the time and it sounds like they didnt offer anything banking on CC losing his job in the not too distant future, hey presto.

[EasterRoad4Ever]

Colin Calderwoods appointment, then his backing and then not letting him go in the summer is a trilogy of disasters that has us in the position we are in now.

Sacking John Hughes and bringing in that clown was ludicrous.


The common denominator of the farce that is Hibernoian FC is Petrie. Yet he manages to squirm off the line by appointing new managers every 12 months, buying the odd trophy player (i.e. Riordan and Oconnor) and blaming them all for the horrific legacy they leave behind. If this was a plc STF and Petrie would have been binned long ago as "simply not good enough".

[snooky]

:agree: Wotherspoon has looked a better player as well, amongst others.

Crucially though, Fenlon's had two games to turn it around, working in some of the pishest conditions weather-wise that he possibly could have done.

The shape, organisation, work-rate, commitment etc is night and day to Calderwood's team.

:agree:

[Spike Mandela]

The unworkable legacy isn't working. FACT!:rolleyes:

[Cropley10]

Bottom line is he only wanted to go to Birmingham who were in a mess at the time and it sounds like they didnt offer anything banking on CC losing his job in the not too distant future, hey presto.

He told someone I ken, off-the-record, in May that he was 'desperate to get away'. Had we reacted at the time I'm sure RP could have negotiated an exit WITH compo but alas it wasn't to be.

[Dinkydoo]

I don't think CC's team is any worse than Yogi's - in fact, I'd say that we have a better quality of player now than when JH was in charge.

Are we performing at the same level, or even worse than we were 12 months ago, yes, definitely.

[Captain Trips]

Signing Billy Big Boots types for 6 months so they can put themselves in transfer window usually to our expense as they are not as good as they thought on top of signing other loans etc whom are not that great.

Identify players to play for Hibs for more than 10 games and belive you have the knowledge and confidence in players to get them on board for longer.

Changing team so much at each window is half the reason we are here.

[Andy74]

I don't think CC's team is any worse than Yogi's - in fact, I'd say that we have a better quality of player now than when JH was in charge.

Are we performing at the same level, or even worse than we were 12 months ago, yes, definitely.
It's worse. It's gone from under performing to pretty much being here on merit.


A team of this lot would bear our current team no problem:

Stack

Wotherspoon
Bamba
Dickoh
Murray

Zemmama
McBride
Miller
Riordan

Stokes
Nish

[blackpoolhibs]

I don't think CC's team is any worse than Yogi's - in fact, I'd say that we have a better quality of player now than when JH was in charge.

Are we performing at the same level, or even worse than we were 12 months ago, yes, definitely.

I watch a different game to you.:confused:

[Keith_M]

.... I'd say that we have a better quality of player now than when JH was in charge......


I watch a different game to you.:confused:

:agree:



My point wasn't that I thought we shouldn't have got rid of Yogi but that the replacement has us in a much worse state than we were in before. My reasoning behind this is obvious, CC has made the squad worse, not better. So what was the point in replacing Hughes with him?

[blackpoolhibs]

:agree:



My point wasn't that I thought we shouldn't have got rid of Yogi but that the replacement has us in a much worse state than we were in before. My reasoning behind this is obvious, CC has made the squad worse, not better. So what was the point in replacing Hughes with him?

I dont think that is really the question that needs answered? Hughes time was up, and he needed replaced.

What Petrie saw in clueless god only knows, and to stick with him in the summer when we all knew he wanted to be somewhere else was just so wrong and unforgivable.

He better have got this one right as there will be no hiding place if he's not.

[Captain Trips]

I dont think that is really the question that needs answered? Hughes time was up, and he needed replaced.

What Petrie saw in clueless god only knows, and to stick with him in the summer when we all knew he wanted to be somewhere else was just so wrong and unforgivable.

He better have got this one right as there will be no hiding place if he's not.

Fool me once shame on you fool me twice shame on me with CC, 2 disastorous decisions over this clown, getting him in first place than after seeing for 8mths he was about as much use as an ashtray on a motorbike he knocks back money for him only to be out of pocket a few moths later. I think his time has been.

[Dinkydoo]

It's worse. It's gone from under performing to pretty much being here on merit.


A team of this lot would bear our current team no problem:

Stack

Wotherspoon
Bamba
Dickoh
Murray

Zemmama
McBride
Miller
Riordan

Stokes
Nish

Are we not referring to 'unworkable legacies' though?

At the time of Yogi's departure Stokes was already away and Zemmama, if not already away (I honestly can't remember), certainly wasn't playing regularly (or at all...).

Dickoh was a lot worse than Stephens or O'Hanlon, Murray, Stack and Wotherspoon are still here and Nish was way worse than GOC and Griffths.

So that leaves Miller, Riordan and Bamba.

Bamba is probably the only one who was performing consistently well out of that three.

[blackpoolhibs]

Are we not referring to 'unworkable legacies' though?

At the time of Yogi's departure Stokes was already away and Zemmama, if not already away (I honestly can't remember), certainly wasn't playing regularly (or at all...).

Dickoh was a lot worse than Stephens or O'Hanlon, Murray, Stack and Wotherspoon are still here and Nish was way worse than GOC and Griffths.

So that leaves Miller, Riordan and Bamba.

Bamba is probably the only one who was performing consistently well out of that three.

I did not realise we had to pick an exact date and team when comparing teams, sorry. :wink:

[Captain Trips]

In general or on average comparing both managers best 11s over their tenure Yogi had the better team.

[BEEJ]

It's worse. It's gone from under performing to pretty much being here on merit.

A team of this lot would bear our current team no problem:

Stack

Wotherspoon
Bamba
Dickoh
Murray

Zemmama
McBride
Miller
Riordan

Stokes
Nish
Wot? No Hart or de Graaf???? Two of our highest paid players after Stokes moved on. :greengrin No Duffy or Trakys?

And Stokes departure means he can't be regarded as part of Yogi's 'legacy' (i.e. that which he handed on to his successor).

[Andy74]

Wot? No Hart or de Graaf???? Two of our highest paid players after Stokes moved on. :greengrin No Duffy or Trakys?

And Stokes departure means he can't be regarded as part of Yogi's 'legacy' (i.e. that which he handed on to his successor).

I can't recall the exact players that were here when CC took over but I think the following were here:

Stack

Wotherspoon
Bamba
Dickoh
Murray

Miller
McBride
Zemmama
De Graaf

Nish
Riordan


That team is still better than what CC left us. Anyway, not wishing to get dragged into this any further! He was mince and he is gone :greengrin

[RIP]

Petrie must be accountable for all of the following


Lack of squad building strategy following on from player sales
Failing to invest some of this windfall back into the squad
Losing John Collins as a result of this failure
Making Collins's replacements the fall guys for the lack of change management in the squad
Authorising unworkable annual squad rebuilds instead of implementing a more structured approach
Failure to appoint a genuine football director when it was clear that Rod wasn't up to the task

[Captain Trips]

Petrie must be accountable for all of the following


Lack of squad building strategy following on from player sales
Failing to invest some of this windfall back into the squad
Losing John Collins as a result of this failure
Making Collins's replacements the fall guys for the lack of change management in the squad
Authorising unworkable annual squad rebuilds instead of implementing a more structured approach
Failure to appoint a genuine football director when it was clear that Rod wasn't up to the task


I agree with all of that. :top marks

[jacomo]

I did not realise we had to pick an exact date and team when comparing teams, sorry. :wink:

I think this was a valid point BH. Yogi benefitted from bringing in Stokes and Miller in his first summer, but it was becoming clear before he left that the wheels were coming off and the squad was weaker.

[Dinkydoo]

I did not realise we had to pick an exact date and team when comparing teams, sorry. :wink:

We're comparing teams carried forward to the successive manager, it does usually help to use comparable points in time (ie: when the manager left) :wink:

Unfortunately both squads were/are not performing well anyway, regardless of quality.

[Dinkydoo]

I can't recall the exact players that were here when CC took over but I think the following were here:

Stack

Wotherspoon
Bamba
Dickoh
Murray

Miller
McBride
Zemmama
De Graaf

Nish
Riordan


That team is still better than what CC left us. Anyway, not wishing to get dragged into this any further! He was mince and he is gone :greengrin

Meh.

The midfield is better, but the defence is made up of most players still here and the attack..... Nish has to count as a minus for me. :greengrin

[nortonhibby]

Petrie must be accountable for all of the following

Lack of squad building strategy following on from player sales
Failing to invest some of this windfall back into the squad
Losing John Collins as a result of this failure
Making Collins's replacements the fall guys for the lack of change management in the squad
Authorising unworkable annual squad rebuilds instead of implementing a more structured approach
Failure to appoint a genuine football director when it was clear that Rod wasn't up to the task


It would not matter if there were 100 points of failures mentioned Don Teflon is un touchable