Bottom of the league, any thoughts?

[heretoday]

We are effectively bottom of the league. Any thoughts?

[Sir David Gray]

We are where we deserve to be, based on how we have played and the results we have picked up since the start of the season.

It's up to the players to get us out of this position and get us up the table.

[HH81]

Yes, its almost December 14. Season ends May......

Relax. Have a nice Xmas.

[Westie1875]

We are effectively bottom of the league. Any thoughts?

We MUST win on Saturday

[Spike Mandela]

I am worried we do not have the mental toughness in the team to get us out of this position.:worried:

[Dunbar Hibee]

****ting it tbh. Must win on saturday.

[iwasthere1972]

We MUST win on Saturday

Come on relax. 21 games to go doesn't say to me that we must win. It would be good to win but even a draw would be satisfactory.

[matty_f]

Yes, its almost December 14. Season ends May......

Relax. Have a nice Xmas.

:top marks Exactly.

[Geo_1875]

I think we are effectively 2nd bottom so I'm not yet ready to wet the bed.

[heretoday]

Come on relax. 21 games to go doesn't say to me that we must win. It would be good to win but even a draw would be satisfactory.

That's the spirit - well almost. I trust in PF to get us out of this pickle.

[lyonhibs]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UtKADQnjQmc :agree:

[Baldy Foghorn]

The next couple of weeks are very very important, and I hope we can take points from the next 4 games......Big ask, we really need to start winning and quickly........

[hibee92]

Can't say I'm at all worried atm. Like some have said, there's still a long way to go, and we've all seen teams who have had a spectacular first half of the season slip up dramatically as we have all seen teams to the opposite. Long, long way to go yet and I won't be feeling worried unless we're still in this position come march or we slip behind without a trace in the next 2 months.

Not a cause for mass panic yet IMO.

:pfgwa

[SteveHFC]

If we are bottom by the start of March. I will start to get worried :aok:

[hibee92]

If we are bottom by the start of March. I will start to get worried :aok:

:agree:

[Mikeystewart]

If the first half of Motherwell and the 90 mins against Rangers is anything to go by, I think we will be fine, Paddy has a few bob to spend in Jan as far as I am aware and the teams around us are in a much worse state.

I agree with previous posts the way we have been playing up until the last 2 games is reflected in our league position, shocking run of form.

[Dinkydoo]

We won't be for long.

[bingo70]

That's why we changed manager.

Saturday isn't a must win, what happens if we don't? Still ages left in the season to pick up points and improve.

Not a great place to be but I'm a long way off panic stations

[hibiedude]

If were bottom of the league at the end of January then panic.

[Gatecrasher]

Theres plenty of time for Pat Fenlon to take a look at the squad and make changes next month. No panic from me

[Craig_in_Prague]

The fact is this is the 2nd year in a row around this time that it looked quite possible we can be relegated.
I don't see where any of the arrogance comes from or only we should worry in Jan, or March etc......

I am worried and until we're many points away from bottom, then I will continue to worry, because we have the worse defence in the league. I am also not so sure there's anyone as bad as Hamilton that we could regard as a safety net.

4 points in the next 2 games will raise spirits going into the new year derby.

[smurf]

I'm concerned. However, too early to panic. At the same time there's a lot of complacency....

Sir Alex would find it difficult with this squad...

[lucky]

FFS we are not bottom. If the league stopped now we would safe. I have no doubt that Hibs will improve under Paddy Fenlon.

[blackpoolhibs]

My thoughts on this are, its all down to calderclown. He alone brought the apathy the players and certainly the crowd have shown over the last 15 or so months.

How can you demand commitment, when you show none yourself?

The only thing that gives me hope is calderclown is no longer manager. Fenlon has a huge job on his hands, i have no idea if he is good enough to do it, but surely he cant be as bad as the last clown? :worried:

[IWasThere2016]

FFS we are not bottom. If the league stopped now we would safe. I have no doubt that Hibs will improve under Paddy Fenlon.

Me too. Imagine where we'd be without CC leading us to wins in St Midden and the first ever at ICT :devil:

[BEEJ]

My thoughts on this are, its all down to calderclown. He alone brought the apathy the players and certainly the crowd have shown over the last 15 or so months.
Which is a neat achievement given that he arrived at ER just less than 14 months ago. :greengrin

[Spike Mandela]

FFS we are not bottom. If the league stopped now we would safe. I have no doubt that Hibs will improve under Paddy Fenlon.

What, you have absolutely no fears at all? Totally inconceivable that this squad of players could get rooted to bottom of league?

We are all hopeful that PF can do the necessary but we are putting a lot of faith in someone learning the SPL ropes.

We appear to be pinning our hopes on a Jan transfer window where it is notoriously difficult to pick up bargains and, on the back of recent losses and dwindling crowds, we probably have less money than ever to spend.

You may be right in all your assertions but I just don't understand the feeling of absolute certainty that others seem to have about our safety.:confused:

[down the slope]

I am as worried as Rod is !.

[blackpoolhibs]

Which is a neat achievement given that he arrived at ER just less than 14 months ago. :greengrin

Just the thought of him coming put some folk over the edge. :wink:


To be fair it did seem a lot longer. :greengrin

[steakbake]

I think we'll pick up from here. The Motherwell game was unfortunate as we could have gone on to get 3 points. The Rangers game, even though I aspire for better for the team I support, I tend to write off 3 points against them and any points picked up are a bonus. Our season will be defined - for good or bad - by our next 6 games against teams which we could reasonably be expected to win against.

[bingo70]

What, you have absolutely no fears at all? Totally inconceivable that this squad of players could get rooted to bottom of league?

We are all hopeful that PF can do the necessary but we are putting a lot of faith in someone learning the SPL ropes.

We appear to be pinning our hopes on a Jan transfer window where it is notoriously difficult to pick up bargains and, on the back of recent losses and dwindling crowds, we probably have less money than ever to spend.

You may be right in all your assertions but I just don't understand the feeling of absolute certainty that others seem to have about our safety.:confused:

I'm honestly not worried at all, maybe i should be but i don't think any dunfermline player would get their game for us so i don't think we're the worst squad in the league and they're not exactly over performing, i also think we've got better players than some other clubs so with a bit improvement that i think will come with the new manager i'm sure we'll be fine.

I'm not pinning my hopes on the january transfer window, if it was up to me i'd probably only give him money to get a new right back, i'm pinning my hopes on the new manager organising us, motivating the players and getting the most out of them then in the summer we can re-asses the players we've got and improve the squad to be more competitive at the top end of the league, january is no time to be making whole sale changes to the squad and IMO part of our problems recently has been the ridiculous turnover of playing staff, we need a manager to start improving what we've got instead of just changing players all the time.

[jonty]

3 games, 0 points. Almost 4 weeks and nothing to show for it.
time to get a new manager.







:duck:

[offshorehibby]

I am not overly worried at the moment. I think we've seen a marked improvement in the couple of weeks PF has been here and hopefully that will continue. we play 3 off the teams near us in the next 5 games 2 away 1 home, and we then have an other 2 rounds of games against our nearest rivals. so our destiny is in our own hands.
I am not a fan of bringing in lots of new players in January. Any decent player is not usually up for grabs then and you end up with dross.

[Spike Mandela]

i don't think we're the worst squad in the league.



Our most experienced defender is Micheal Hart, one of our goalies never comes off his line , the other can't kick, we have no creative midfielder certainly nothing resembling a goalscoring midfielder, our young players are showing signs of burnout, our only real goalscoring threat has a court case over his head and our MOTM(deservedly)on Saturday was Lewis Stevenson!

We must be close bingo?:wink::greengrin

[alfie]

I'm not pinning my hopes on the january transfer window, if it was up to me i'd probably only give him money to get a new right back,

Yep a decent RB and get either Sparky or a replacement for the rest of the season. Pat Fenlon can motivate the rest of them to keep us safe until the end of the season.

Let's not forget that the Yam situation should also remove the threat of relegation for every other team in the league.

[Stevie Reid]

I am worried, but I am also optimistic that we can start to climb the league soon.

[Pretty Boy]

What comforts me is that since Fenlon has come in the noises coming from the dressing room have changed. There is now an acknowledgement that we are where we deserve to be and we have to work hard to get out of such a position.

This is a change from the previous manager who described his squad as 'perfect' and Ian Murray telling anyone who would listen we are in a false position.

Now we are acknowledging there is a problem we can and will address it and hopefully we can get things sorted ASAP.

[bingo70]

Our most experienced defender is Micheal Hart, one of our goalies never comes off his line , the other can't kick, we have no creative midfielder certainly nothing resembling a goalscoring midfielder, our young players are showing signs of burnout, our only real goalscoring threat has a court case over his head and our MOTM(deservedly)on Saturday was Lewis Stevenson!

We must be close bingo?:wink::greengrin

Michael hart needs to be replaced i agree but we won't be relegated because of a poor right back

the fact our reserve keeper can't kick is neither here nor there, I'd play Brown but both keepers are good enough for us to finish 2nd bottom at least. (not saying thats our ambition btw)

I think Osbourne and a confident Wotherspoon are capable of being creative if Fenlon can get the most out of them, i'm also expecting Osbourne to start pitching in with goals.

Sproule, GoC and Sodje have shown they're capable of scoring goals and Griffiths is a threat going forward, he's shown he can score goals in the past despite his miss on saturday and if he keeps getting in the right areas he'll definately score goals for us.

and finally i totally agree we're pish just now, but we're not up against barca, other teams are in the league are pish too and there's not a lot between us so i think an organised and motivated side will do well and i'm confident Fenlon will get us both of these.

[matty_f]

I think if the gap between the bottom 3 clubs and the top 6 was much wider, I'd be concerned. As it is we're only a couple of results away from pulling away, and with the January window looming I think we'll see players come into the club that will make the difference, as happened last year.

Not an ideal situation, but certainly not one to start wetting the bed over just yet.

[Aldo]

I think if the gap between the bottom 3 clubs and the top 6 was much wider, I'd be concerned. As it is we're only a couple of results away from pulling away, and with the January window looming I think we'll see players come into the club that will make the difference, as happened last year.

Not an ideal situation, but certainly not one to start wetting the bed over just yet.

Have to agree with you in this one Matty And we have a much stronger squad... On paper and in theory than a lot of others. Some St Mirren fans think we are the worst team in the league... Our position says yes but I think that PF will get us moving in the right direction and with a few signings in Jan I am confident (more than under CC) that we will be safe with plenty to spare.

[Spike Mandela]

Have to agree with you in this one Matty And we have a much stronger squad... On paper and in theory than a lot of others. Some St Mirren fans think we are the worst team in the league... Our position says yes but I think that PF will get us moving in the right direction and with a few signings in Jan I am confident (more than under CC) that we will be safe with plenty to spare.

Ehhhhhhhh? On what basis Aldo?:confused:

[Beefster]

My thoughts on this are, its all down to calderclown. He alone brought the apathy the players and certainly the crowd have shown over the last 15 or so months.

How can you demand commitment, when you show none yourself?

The only thing that gives me hope is calderclown is no longer manager. Fenlon has a huge job on his hands, i have no idea if he is good enough to do it, but surely he cant be as bad as the last clown? :worried:

The rot started a fair time before Calderwood took over. Our performances over the last (almost) four years are, in part, a consequence of decisions made even before that.


i also think we've got better players than some other clubs

We've been hearing that for years now. We have one of the worst defences in the SPL and have scored less goals than anyone else in the SPL, all shown by the league table. We have mediocrity throughout the squad. O'Connor of early season aside there's not a single player who has shown that he deserves to be considered better than his performances.

The squad is, in general, ***** and the sooner everyone faces up to that fact, the better IMHO.

[bingo70]

I never said we weren't *****, I just think other teams are also ***** if not *****r

[joe breezy]

http://youtu.be/PeyOnNple4M

[BEEJ]

3 games, 0 points. Almost 4 weeks and nothing to show for it.
time to get a new manager.

:duck:
Fenlon has been in charge of the team for 1.5 games.

I'd give him another couple of weeks yet. :cb

[IWasThere2016]

3 games, 0 points. Almost 4 weeks and nothing to show for it.
time to get a new manager.

:duck:

:greengrin


The rot started a fair time before Calderwood took over. Our performances over the last (almost) four years are, in part, a consequence of decisions made even before that.

:boo hoo:

[ancient hibee]

I'm sure Fenlon will improve performances but we are where we deserve to be because we are comfortably the worst team I have seen this season.

[Aldo]

Ehhhhhhhh? On what basis Aldo?:confused:

Confused Spike. Sorry being a fud. In certain areas we seem stronger on paper however individuals don't make a good team. I still think we have some very good players and if they play to their potential we should be ok!

[francobaresi]

Fenlon has been in charge of the team for 1.5 games.

I'd give him another couple of weeks yet. :cb

Or at least until the Hearts game... Seriously though,I expect PF to get us out of this position. We deserve to be where we are undoubtedly but will settle for 2nd or 3rd bottom if we can build on these very unstable foundations... Foundations as in standard of players available... But I'm not holding my breath...

[--------]

If this doesn't motivate the players, I don't think anything will.

No time to panic yet, but I SO wish St Johnstone had won last night.

[alexedwards]

Yep a decent RB and get either Sparky or a replacement for the rest of the season. Pat Fenlon can motivate the rest of them to keep us safe until the end of the season.

Let's not forget that the Yam situation should also remove the threat of relegation for every other team in the league.


:rolleyes:

[silverhibee]

What comforts me is that since Fenlon has come in the noises coming from the dressing room have changed. There is now an acknowledgement that we are where we deserve to be and we have to work hard to get out of such a position.

This is a change from the previous manager who described his squad as 'perfect' and Ian Murray telling anyone who would listen we are in a false position.

Now we are acknowledging there is a problem we can and will address it and hopefully we can get things sorted ASAP.

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/european/o_hanlon_backs_hart_to_bounce_back_1_2007665


What worries me about that story is that it looks like Hart will be starting against Aberdeen, it also worries me that O'Hanlon thinks Hart will get better with game's, the guy is gash and should be no where near RB for Hibs on Saturday.

[Aldo]

On a positive note.... Considine was sent off against Perth Saints thus he misses game on Sat.

[silverhibee]

If this doesn't motivate the players, I don't think anything will.

No time to panic yet, but I SO wish St Johnstone had won last night.


:agree:

Betting Scandal this week allegedley, :cb get your money on Dunfermline to get three points of the yams this weekend. :cb


Three points for Hibs against the Dons is a must this weekend, hopefully Rangers will beat ICT.

[Jim44]

If we can successfully lose our matches by only one goal the odd draw or win might be enough to save our skins. I'm glad the embarrassing nonsense about us eventually challenging for a top six place has dried up a bit.

[jonty]

Fenlon has been in charge of the team for 1.5 games.

I'd give him another couple of weeks yet. :cb
He was manager at St J - just in the stands
The Motherwell game was a game he was in charge of - albeit a game of one half
:gun:

Time to get rid :greengrin

Teams are quite tight at the moment. It's not going to take much of a run to get up the table. Fenlon has been making the right noises but more importantly - changes have been made behind the scenes. Wether these are the right ones remains to be seen but so far there appears to have been an improvement.

[JustSimplyHibs]

For a start the Pars are bottom as we are 2 goals better off than them.

Can not seeing Hibs being there come end of the season, we are 12 points behind 4th place, we need to win every game at most from here on in.

Seriously reckon Hibs will be top 6 come the end of the season, Hearts will and are in the middle of free fall as are St Mirren, injuries will hit other teams such as the Pars, St Johnstone, ICT as for Kilmarnock, Aberdeen, Utd pretty much inconsistant.

The points in the bag must start this weekend.

[Beefster]

For a start the Pars are bottom as we are 2 goals better off than them.

Can not seeing Hibs being there come end of the season, we are 12 points behind 4th place, we need to win every game at most from here on in.

Seriously reckon Hibs will be top 6 come the end of the season, Hearts will and are in the middle of free fall as are St Mirren, injuries will hit other teams such as the Pars, St Johnstone, ICT as for Kilmarnock, Aberdeen, Utd pretty much inconsistant.

The points in the bag must start this weekend.

Might happen.

[JustSimplyHibs]

Might happen.

Pick up maximum points against, ICT, Dunfermline, St Mirren, St Johnstone, Kilmarnock, Hearts, Aberdeen and Utd we will be safe and top 6

[Aldo]

Pick up maximum points against, ICT, Dunfermline, St Mirren, St Johnstone, Kilmarnock, Hearts, Aberdeen and Utd we will be safe and top 6

Max points from the above.... Mmmm

Nae chance.

Dons - 1 (if were lucky)
Utd - nowt
Pars- Gonnae stick ma neck oot 3
Yams - 1 (again if we're lucky)
ICT -1
St Mudden - 1
Perth - 1

I make that 8 points out of 24. Really really hope I am wrong but being honest.

[Beefster]

Pick up maximum points against, ICT, Dunfermline, St Mirren, St Johnstone, Kilmarnock, Hearts, Aberdeen and Utd we will be safe and top 6

Absolutely. And if we won every game next season, we'd be champions.

[down the slope]

Just got that feeling that lady luck is not on our side, we need a rapid turnaround in results and lets hope that Pat can instill a fighting spirit in the team or we are donald ducked.

[basehibby]

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/european/o_hanlon_backs_hart_to_bounce_back_1_2007665


What worries me about that story is that it looks like Hart will be starting against Aberdeen, it also worries me that O'Hanlon thinks Hart will get better with game's, the guy is gash and should be no where near RB for Hibs on Saturday.


Why does this worry you? Don't you think he could turn out to be right?

On the occasions I've seen Hart play for Hibs I agree with you that he has been gash more often than not - but those occasions have been few and far between and that is the point which O'Hanlon is making here.

Hart looked short of fitness when he first arrived at ER and has been unlucky with injuries since then. During pre-season if you recall, he was praised for looking a much improved player - until he got injured for 3 months that is.

He is now fighting his way back to full fitness and, as the ONLY full back at the club with any degree of SPL and Championship experience, Fenlon is giving him a chance to prove himself and so he should! The alternative is to keep playing youngsters and midfielders in there or to fork out part of his budget on another gamble when the solution to the RB connundrum could be sitting on his doorstep.

[GreenCastle]

Obviously not happy where we are and also in a league full with some very average teams - that includes Rangers and Celtic.

I believe we have the right man i charge now to improve the club - but it will take a good few weeks before that happens.

Around about this time last year I remember many threads on here talking about relegation - some ignored it - some were more serious about it. I felt it was pretty serious at the time as we were in freefall with others battling around us.

CC bought in a few players last January that gave us a boost and as a result we got a few important results and remember a few games at ER where I thought the atmosphere was improving and we would carry on improving. But since we pretty much became safe last season and ended up bottom 6 the players didn't look interested.

That carried on into this season and has made us bottom. This time of year is always tough and with so many games so quick a bit of momentum would help - we are due a run of positive results but nothing comes without standards improving.

Having watched Aberdeen last night play some reasonable football - think this weekend we will lose again - hopefully not though.

Next couple of months will shape our season - either pull away or be right down there till the end :agree:

[basehibby]

BTW in reply to OP - don't think we should be worried at this stage - we should be cheered that we have a new manager in the hot seat with a winning track record, who looks focused and motivated about the task in hand. I think it will be a wee while yet before we can expect to see any dramatic turnaround in our fortunes - if come mid-February we still look like relegation candidates THEN I'll be worried!

[sesoim]

I'm not that worried. I hate to say it, but the reason I'm not worried is that I just don't care about Hibs as much as I used to. I can't afford to go to games, and the ones that I do go to end up making me angry.

Having said all that. Hibs can't go on being this schidt this long. Most of the other clubs are financially on their knees, so if Fenlon can get 2 or 3 good signings in January and then sort the rest of the team out in the summer, we should be a lot better in SPL terms next season. But I still wont be able to afford to go to the games. :boo hoo:

[The_Todd]

Concerned. Very, very concerned. Let's look at it another way; say we were joint top at the moment, some people would be foaming at the mouth with excitement. Some people (a minority) would be making noises about trying to stay there all season, others would be saying we would be a stick on for third. As it is we're joint bottom, and to be perfectly honest deservedly so.

We can't say that it will all be alright because of Pat Fenlon - well, how do we know that? He's still by and large an unknown quantity and we know he won't have a blank cheque book to play with. Even if we do have a clear out and have a fresh squad come the end of January, with the wages we pay we should be challenging for the Top 6, but equally the new players could also be rank rotten and we could still end up where we are. That's not a pop at Pat Fenlon or Rod Petrie but the realities of the SPL as the same could apply to any SPL club.

Of course, I'm hopeful Pat turns this round and by May we can laugh at the season past, but I'm not counting my gold-plated Chickens from the eggs that Pat hasn't even laid yet (if you see what I mean).

[jacomo]

I don't think there's any room for complacency at all.

Things look better with the new man in charge but Hibs have been garbage and we are where we are. I think this squad lacks self-belief and so it will take a few good results to build a bit of confidence and form.

[The_Todd]

Pick up maximum points against, ICT, Dunfermline, St Mirren, St Johnstone, Kilmarnock, Hearts, Aberdeen and Utd we will be safe and top 6

If only Colin Calderwood thought of those tactics. Genuis.

[PapillonVert]

We are effectively bottom of the league. Any thoughts?

Fenners has a huge job on his hands. Is he up to it? No idea.

Generally speaking, the squad is poor and if we avoid relegation it won't be because we deserve to but because we were lucky someone else was even worse than us.

Sorry, but we are at rock bottom - I am happy to give Pat time and realise that he has inherited the proverbial poisoned chalice. I hope he can make the whole greater than the parts.

[Bostonhibby]

The only way is up?

We will still exist at the end of the season

That is all.................

[mca]

What comforts me is that since Fenlon has come in the noises coming from the dressing room have changed. There is now an acknowledgement that we are where we deserve to be and we have to work hard to get out of such a position.

This is a change from the previous manager who described his squad as 'perfect' and Ian Murray telling anyone who would listen we are in a false position.

Now we are acknowledging there is a problem we can and will address it and hopefully we can get things sorted ASAP.



I have heard that he is already kicking bums about without the actual need to kick bums aboot !! apparently his stare is enough to worry you !!


The squads are punctual and polite and there seems to be a strong air of authority around the training ground...


the january window is coming and i reckon this guy might just have a few gems already tied up :wink:

[connerg]

I am worried we do not have the mental toughness in the team to get us out of this position.:worried:

I agree, we are a soft touch and every team wants to play us. On the bright side though i think Pat Fenlon will bring a tougher regime to training and mental toughness in games. Must not lose our next two games!!!!!!!!

[BEEJ]

A largely depressing thread to read. :eyes:

Admins,
Can we stick this thread in the vault so that it can be presented as evidence the next time someone posts on here that Hibs supporters' expectations of their team are completely unrealistic?

:greengrin

[NOLA]

the way i see it, if we do get relegated we will be playing in the 1st division next season, nothing to be worried about, there will be some cracking away days to look forward to.:wink: