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View Full Version : Losing for the greater good?



R'Albin
19-10-2011, 08:45 AM
Know this was a couple of weeks ago now, but I was listening to the Motherwell Hibs cup game on open all mics, and a few Hibbies wrote in letters saying they wanted us to lose so that CC was closer to the sack. For the record- I 100% want Hibs to win every game they play in, but I was wondering, does anyone on here want us to "Lose for the greater good" on Saturday? If it were to get CC sacked so we would maybe have a new man or BB in charge next Wedensday night? Would anyone on here want us to get beat by the saints?

Hermit Crab
19-10-2011, 09:22 AM
[QUOTE=R'Albin;2950881]Know this was a couple of weeks ago now, but I was listening to the Motherwell Hibs cup game on open all mics, and a few Hibbies wrote in letters saying they wanted us to lose so that CC was closer to the sack. For the record- I 100% want Hibs to win every game they play in, but I was wondering, does anyone on here want us to "Lose for the greater good" on Saturday? If it were to get CC sacked so we would maybe have a new man or BB in charge next Wedensday night? Would anyone on here want us to get beat by the saints?[/


I would say that anyone who wants Hibs to lose is off their heed mate. I want Hibs to win every game regardless of the managerial situation. :agree:

blackpoolhibs
19-10-2011, 10:15 AM
Never want us to lose, in fact nothing would make me happier if i was wrong about Calderwood and this team, and they went on a run of wins and rammed my criticism up my erse. So no, i want us to win.

Yet after saying all that, when i look back in hindsight, i'd rather we lost that game at the ****s under duffy, instead of coming back from 2 down and snatching that draw, we might have seen him sacked after it. Instead he carried on for longer giving JGP virtually no chance of keeping us up.

Stevie Reid
19-10-2011, 10:25 AM
I would never want us to lose, but sadly I can see us losing to Saints AND still having CC as manager afterwards. I would be happy to be wrong about one of those things.

Saorsa
19-10-2011, 10:45 AM
Know this was a couple of weeks ago now, but I was listening to the Motherwell Hibs cup game on open all mics, and a few Hibbies wrote in letters saying they wanted us to lose so that CC was closer to the sack. For the record- I 100% want Hibs to win every game they play in, but I was wondering, does anyone on here want us to "Lose for the greater good" on Saturday? If it were to get CC sacked so we would maybe have a new man or BB in charge next Wedensday night? Would anyone on here want us to get beat by the saints?NO! Hibs tae win all the time.


Never want us to lose, in fact nothing would make me happier if i was wrong about Calderwood and this team, and they went on a run of wins and rammed my criticism up my erse. So no, i want us to win.

Yet after saying all that, when i look back in hindsight, i'd rather we lost that game at the ****s under duffy, instead of coming back from 2 down and snatching that draw, we might have seen him sacked after it. Instead he carried on for longer giving JGP virtually no chance of keeping us up.This.

If CC started turning things round right now (no just picking up the odd win here and there for another false dawn) and it meant Hibs doing well I couldnae give a toss if that meant everything I had said was wrong, in fact I'd never be more delighted tae be wrong, Hibs winning is what is important tae me. Sadly there hasnae been the slightest sign of that IMO and I dinnae think there will be. If there had been anything at all he'd be getting more of a chance but after a year in charge we're worse than ever. We cannae afford tae leave it 'til it's too late, relegation would be an absolute disaster.

IMO as there has been nae improvement, he should go now before it is too late.

PeeJay
19-10-2011, 10:58 AM
Know this was a couple of weeks ago now, but I was listening to the Motherwell Hibs cup game on open all mics, and a few Hibbies wrote in letters saying they wanted us to lose so that CC was closer to the sack. For the record- I 100% want Hibs to win every game they play in, but I was wondering, does anyone on here want us to "Lose for the greater good" on Saturday? If it were to get CC sacked so we would maybe have a new man or BB in charge next Wedensday night? Would anyone on here want us to get beat by the saints?

No - and I personally doubt very much that the adoption of a loser mentality amongst its fan base could ever help push this club forward - wrong way to go IMO.

smurf
19-10-2011, 11:22 AM
Always want a Hibs win but I now go into every game suspecting defeat is the most likely scenario.

HibeeMcGinn1
19-10-2011, 11:31 AM
I would never EVER want my club to lose just to get rid of any manager. If any 'Hibs' fan would want that to happen they are not a Hibs fan. Moronic Clowns if you ask me.

Franck is God
19-10-2011, 11:34 AM
I go into every game with no idea whether we'll win or lose but always hope we win and that never changes regardless of who the manager is.

Up until the Motherwell game I was 100% behind CC and fully believed that he would get it right, the game on Saturday did dent that a bit though, now I'm down to approx 85% and if it hadn't been for the slight improvement in the second half it may be lower than that.

Hainan Hibs
19-10-2011, 12:09 PM
I don't want us to get beat, but if we do I don't really care anymore.

NORTHERNHIBBY
19-10-2011, 12:45 PM
S'pose we could have fluked 3 points Saturday past but that would have been papering over the cracks. Nobody would want us to get beat, but it is easier to stomach if you can see a pattern or a method and you can reason that if we stick with it, the breaks will come. Rght now we are getting turned over and sneaking the odd point here and there without ever looking like we have a clue. Either in the dug-out, on the touchline or on the pitch.

Phil D. Rolls
19-10-2011, 12:47 PM
Know this was a couple of weeks ago now, but I was listening to the Motherwell Hibs cup game on open all mics, and a few Hibbies wrote in letters saying they wanted us to lose so that CC was closer to the sack. For the record- I 100% want Hibs to win every game they play in, but I was wondering, does anyone on here want us to "Lose for the greater good" on Saturday? If it were to get CC sacked so we would maybe have a new man or BB in charge next Wedensday night? Would anyone on here want us to get beat by the saints?

Must hold my hands up here. At the end of Yogi's time, his sacking was so inevitable that I felt any results he got in his favour would prolong the misery. Whilst I still wanted Hibs to win, I am ashamed to admit I was relieved when they lost.

As for Brown taking over, I don't think that's going to happen, but if anyone saw his muckers "infomercial" on last night' Scotland Today, Jim Jeffries was making all the right noises to the Hibs board. "I am able to bring on teams with little money"; "in this day and age you have to take whatever job you can get"; and - most significantly "I would have loved the Barcelona job, but it wasn't to be".

If Hibs have a person specification JJ is ticking all the boxes. I don't look forward to 0-7 and 2-6 drubbings by our neighbours, nor do I look forward to losing 2-5 to Kilmarnock in a cup final. But, in this day and age you have to take what you can get.:agree:

Phil D. Rolls
19-10-2011, 12:50 PM
I would never EVER want my club to lose just to get rid of any manager. If any 'Hibs' fan would want that to happen they are not a Hibs fan. Moronic Clowns if you ask me.

Says you.

Joe Baker II
19-10-2011, 02:29 PM
Are several times I have wanted Hibs to lose certain games for the sake of the greater good of Hibs/Scottish football generally (unsurprisingly a disproprotionate number of which were in the Williamson period!) - however the current time is not one of those.

R'Albin
19-10-2011, 02:39 PM
Are several times I have wanted Hibs to lose certain games for the sake of the greater good of Hibs/Scottish football generally (unsurprisingly a disproprotionate number of which were in the Williamson period!) - however the current time is not one of those.

I wasn't really old enough to understand at the time, but I would have thought if there was any time you wanted this to happen it would be now? Surely the Williamson era couldn't have been as bad as this!

Stevie Reid
19-10-2011, 02:45 PM
I wasn't really old enough to understand at the time, but I would have thought if there was any time you wanted this to happen it would be now? Surely the Williamson era couldn't have been as bad as this!

There was some awful stuff played under Williamson but it was never as bad as this. BW's record: -




25 Feb, 2002
20 Apr, 2004
P 93
W 34
D 21
L 38



As you can see, despite being in charge for 48 games more than CC has at the moment, Calderwood has only lost 14 less games. Calderwood is so far behind being as good as Hibs managers that were considered to be crap, it's truly scary.

Keith_M
19-10-2011, 02:49 PM
I'm not sure what difference it would make to CC's position if Hibs do lose. He could probably lose the next ten games and still be manager.

R'Albin
19-10-2011, 02:50 PM
There was some awful stuff played under Williamson but it was never as bad as this. BW's record: -




25 Feb, 2002

20 Apr, 2004

P 93

W 34

D 21

L 38





As you can see, despite being in charge for 48 games more than CC has at the moment, Calderwood has only lost 14 less games. Calderwood is so far behind being as good as Hibs managers that were considered to be crap, it's truly scary.

Dearie me we have lost half our games under CC:rolleyes:

I think I remember one Blobby game, we were away to Dundee who had some argentinian international called Ravenelli or something playing for them? And we were getting beat 1-0 but it then got postponed 'cause of snow, then when we played the postponed match got beat 4-0? For some reason I can still remember that.

Stevie Reid
19-10-2011, 02:54 PM
Dearie me we have lost half our games under CC:rolleyes:

More than half, he has a 52% loss ratio: -



18 Oct, 2010
Present
P 45
W 11
D 10
L 24



Incidentally it took Williamson 20 games to get 11 wins as Hibs manager.

Broken Gnome
19-10-2011, 02:58 PM
Dearie me we have lost half our games under CC:rolleyes:

I think I remember one Blobby game, we were away to Dundee who had some argentinian international called Ravenelli or something playing for them? And we were getting beat 1-0 but it then got postponed 'cause of snow, then when we played the postponed match got beat 4-0? For some reason I can still remember that.

First game was postponed at half-time, when very lucky to be only 1-0 down. We used our reprieve to fall into a 3-0 humping. Symbolic of BW - it was horrific.

R'Albin
19-10-2011, 03:00 PM
More than half, he has a 52% loss ratio: -



18 Oct, 2010

Present

P 45

W 11

D 10

L 24






Incidentally it took Williamson 20 games to get 11 wins as Hibs manager.

That record(CC's) is an embarrasment, how he is still in charge I do not know!

11 wins in 20 is actually not a bad record at all.

Stevie Reid
19-10-2011, 03:07 PM
That record is an embarrasment, how he is still in charge I do not know!

11 wins in 20 is actually not a bad record at all.

Williamson's initial impact was considerable and GOC and Craig Brewster had a superb partnership where Garry couldn't stop scoring - alas, we lost Brewster in the close season and were never the same afterwards. We started the following season with 4 straight defeats, but went on a run of 5 straight wins shortly afterwards. The rest was up and down, very much mostly down - the League Cup defeat to Livi sealed BW's fate, though that run up to the final was special, and the young team did show signs of what was to come under Mowbray at times. Calderwood's team has never shown anything similar.

It took BW 54 league games to get to 24 defeats, but he won a fair portion of those games too.

R'Albin
19-10-2011, 03:19 PM
Williamson's initial impact was considerable and GOC and Craig Brewster had a superb partnership where Garry couldn't stop scoring - alas, we lost Brewster in the close season and were never the same afterwards. We started the following season with 4 straight defeats, but went on a run of 5 straight wins shortly afterwards. The rest was up and down, very much mostly down - the League Cup defeat to Livi sealed BW's fate, though that run up to the final was special, and the young team did show signs of what was to come under Mowbray at times. Calderwood's team has never shown anything similar.

It took BW 54 league games to get to 24 defeats, but he won a fair portion of those games too.

Oh yeah! Remember that as well, we beat both the OF on the way, Daniel Anderson saved 2 pens did he not? Also, bit harsh that a cup final loss makes someone lose there job ?

Stevie Reid
19-10-2011, 03:27 PM
Oh yeah! Remember that as well, we beat both the OF on the way, Daniel Anderson saved 2 pens did he not? Also, bit harsh that a cup final loss makes someone lose there job ?

Nah, things were pretty bad league-wise at that stage and the football was horrible at times. To be fair to BW he bore the brunt of the first real cost cutting measures, which were harsh (we lost Brewster because Dunfermline offered more money on a longer contract [before they went into administration], couldn't afford to play John O'Neill because of his ridiculous appearance bonus, renegotiated contracts with some players) but people still expected better than 3 consecutive bottom 6 finishes (though only 2 of them that he was responsible for).

He does deserve a lot of credit for bringing a lot of the youngsters who really blossomed under Mowbray (not that he had much choice) but the final defeat against a Livi team in administration was always going to be impossible to recover from. Though the fact that Livi could play David Fernandez (who ran the show) whilst on loan from Celtic (and no doubt on great money) whilst other club employees had been made redundant will forever stick in my throat.

However, if we had won that we wouldn't have got Mowbray and probably wouldn't have won the League Cup in such style in 2007.

(And yes, Anderson saved 2 pens, one in normal time and one in the shootout).

HibeeMcGinn1
19-10-2011, 03:40 PM
Says you.

Meaning?

Dashing Bob S
19-10-2011, 03:58 PM
I think the argument is a bogus one. The fact is that, as stated, his record is poor, and it doesn't matter what we 'want', we are going to lose more games under this part-time temporary manager than we are going to win, and by a considerable distance.

Win lose or draw against St mirren, his record is deplorable, and most of the people who urged to give him time to enact SUSTAINED recovery have now lost all confidence in him.

connerg
19-10-2011, 07:57 PM
Dearie me we have lost half our games under CC:rolleyes:

I think I remember one Blobby game, we were away to Dundee who had some argentinian international called Ravenelli or something playing for them? And we were getting beat 1-0 but it then got postponed 'cause of snow, then when we played the postponed match got beat 4-0? For some reason I can still remember that.

No, the player was Caballero from Argentina and we were losing 2-0 before a snow storm stopped the game (we were getting ripped apart at that point but fat Boab couldn't see it) We lost 3-0 in the rearranged game, think Murray got sent off or scored an og.

silverhibee
19-10-2011, 07:58 PM
Never want us to lose, in fact nothing would make me happier if i was wrong about Calderwood and this team, and they went on a run of wins and rammed my criticism up my erse. So no, i want us to win.

Yet after saying all that, when i look back in hindsight, i'd rather we lost that game at the ****s under duffy, instead of coming back from 2 down and snatching that draw, we might have seen him sacked after it. Instead he carried on for longer giving JGP virtually no chance of keeping us up.


But you know its not going to happen. :greengrin

connerg
19-10-2011, 08:11 PM
Williamson's initial impact was considerable and GOC and Craig Brewster had a superb partnership where Garry couldn't stop scoring - alas, we lost Brewster in the close season and were never the same afterwards. We started the following season with 4 straight defeats, but went on a run of 5 straight wins shortly afterwards. The rest was up and down, very much mostly down - the League Cup defeat to Livi sealed BW's fate, though that run up to the final was special, and the young team did show signs of what was to come under Mowbray at times. Calderwood's team has never shown anything similar.

It took BW 54 league games to get to 24 defeats, but he won a fair portion of those games too.

Think the 4-4 draw against the yams at New year didn't help! 2 nil up then 4-2 up in injury time and guess what? We blew it!!!!!!!!
Still can't get over that game.

Joe Baker II
24-10-2011, 01:30 PM
There was some awful stuff played under Williamson but it was never as bad as this. BW's record: -




25 Feb, 2002
20 Apr, 2004
P 93
W 34
D 21
L 38



As you can see, despite being in charge for 48 games more than CC has at the moment, Calderwood has only lost 14 less games. Calderwood is so far behind being as good as Hibs managers that were considered to be crap, it's truly scary.

The crowds under Williamson tell a different story to results - they were even worse than they are now.

wearethehibs
24-10-2011, 03:28 PM
Way of topic but who else immediately thinks of Hot Fuzz when they see this thread tittle?