Rugby World Cup 2011

[CFC]

Just around the corner. Scotland have never failed to make the quarters though it will be a tough ask being in the same group as Argentina and England. Well looking foward to it, starts September 9th I believe

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

They've been known to bottle it before, but, surely all The All Blacks need to do is turn up!

[CFC]

Yes, the All Blacks red hot favourites to win their first RWC since 1987. They lost in South Africa on Saturday but they fielded a de facto reserve side full of fringe/squad players.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Aye, SA -7.5 was easy money!

[CFC]

Tri Nations decider this weekend in Brisbane between the All Blacks and Wallabies. Winner takes all as both teams have 2 wins and one defeat. Interestingly, the All Blacks have never failed to win the 3 Nations in a world cup year (1999, 2003, 2007). However they have also never won the world cup subsequently so its something of a poisoned chalice.

[Steve-O]

As I'm already here, I shall be attending all the Scotland games, should be good :agree:

The Kiwis are fairly confident but they are also sheeeeiting themselves at the same time. If they don't win, there'll be bother around these parts :greengrin

[JimBHibees]

They've been known to bottle it before, but, surely all The All Blacks need to do is turn up!

Completely disagree. Australia in particular are more than capable of beating the All Blacks on a given day in a tournament. The expectation is all on the All Blacks and they have struggled with that in the past.

[CFC]

Hope you have a good time at the Scotland games Steve. Lets hope for a cracking tournament, plenty of good Rugby whatever the results.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Completely disagree. Australia in particular are more than capable of beating the All Blacks on a given day in a tournament. The expectation is all on the All Blacks and they have struggled with that in the past. The last part of your post pretty much reflects the first line of my previous post, so, not completely disagreeing at all! ;-)

[Steve-O]

http://www.vectorarena.co.nz/bannockburn/

Here's a wee event in Auckland to whet the appetite before the England game :greengrin:thumbsup:

[cabbageandribs1875]

http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/home/fixtures/poolstage.html



w (http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/home/fixtures/poolstage.html)inners of scotlands group will probably play france, runners-up will play the all-blacks :boo hoo:

[Steve-O]

http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/home/fixtures/poolstage.html



w (http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/home/fixtures/poolstage.html)inners of scotlands group will probably play france, runners-up will play the all-blacks :boo hoo:

Ach easy, bring them all on!

[Sick Boy]

http://www.vectorarena.co.nz/bannockburn/

Here's a wee event in Auckland to whet the appetite before the England game :greengrin:thumbsup:

That sounds quality! Pity I'm stuck over the Tasman.
:saltireflag

[Steve-O]

Completely disagree. Australia in particular are more than capable of beating the All Blacks on a given day in a tournament. The expectation is all on the All Blacks and they have struggled with that in the past.

Like today!

[CFC]

That win for the Wallabies against a full strength All Black XV leaves things perfectly in the balance for the World Cup. Didnt see it but heard it was some game, Australia having the best of the first half with the Kiwis pushing them right to the wire in the 2nd.

[heretoday]

What's the TV situation for the RWC? Is it on BBC/ITV live or only for Murdoch's Mercenaries?

[cabbageandribs1875]

What's the TV situation for the RWC? Is it on BBC/ITV live or only for Murdoch's Mercenaries?



cooncil TV(and always will be hopefully) http://www.justplymouth.co.uk/rugby.php



(http://www.justplymouth.co.uk/rugby.php)All blacks first up in the morning 9:30am KO, looking forward to all the games :rockin:

[CFC]

cooncil TV(and always will be hopefully) http://www.justplymouth.co.uk/rugby.phpAll blacks first up in the morning 9:30am KO, looking forward to all the games :rockin:Me too, I just can't wait!

[heretoday]

Great! I remember the first WC in NZ. I used to get up early for the matches and then go to work. The All Blacks were supreme. Don't think they'll have it so easy this time.

[Iain G]

http://www.vectorarena.co.nz/bannockburn/

Here's a wee event in Auckland to whet the appetite before the England game :greengrin:thumbsup:

I'll be at the Scotland v Argentina game in Wellington, not a huge rugby fan but thought better go and support the Scots!

I do hope the AB's win it or there will be a lot of p'd off locals here...

[CFC]

Superb opening game, the All Black backline executed very well, some great offloads from Sonny Bill Williams. Great to see Tonga score a try after they were camped out in front of the goaline for so long. Should be a great tournament!

[Iain G]

Superb opening game, the All Black backline executed very well, some great offloads from Sonny Bill Williams. Great to see Tonga score a try after they were camped out in front of the goaline for so long. Should be a great tournament!

Funny I don't really like Sonny Bill at all, he goes for personal glory too much when I have seen him play and doesnt always seem to fit with the AB's philosophy or ethos. Israel Dagg and Richard Kahui especially looked impressive going foward, as did Nonu.

Good start and should keep everyone happy :greengrin

[CFC]

Funny I don't really like Sonny Bill at all, he goes for personal glory too much when I have seen him play and doesnt always seem to fit with the AB's philosophy or ethos. Israel Dagg and Richard Kahui especially looked impressive going foward, as did Nonu.Good start and should keep everyone happy :greengrinThing I like about SBW is he always commits defenders and then looks to keep the ball alive whilst being tackled. Btw any idea why Conrad Smith did'nt play, were they just giving Nonu a run at outside centre? PS Enjoy the England game Iain!

[cabbageandribs1875]

sconnie botland v romania at 2am stv :aok:



think i'l give Fiji v Namibia @4:30am and france v japan@7am a miss tho :greengrin then back up for engerlund v argentina @9:30am :eyes:

[Darth Hibbie]

sconnie botland v romania at 2am stv :aok:

Scotland getting a lesson on how to play rugby by that famous rugby nation Romania :rolleyes:



think i'l give Fiji v Namibia @4:30am and france v japan@7am a miss tho :greengrin then back up for engerlund v argentina @9:30am :eyes:

Got home from work in time to watch the Scotland game. Love watching Fiji play but don't think I will be able to keep my eyes open. Might get up in time for the England game though

[cabbageandribs1875]

Scotland getting a lesson on how to play rugby by that famous rugby nation Romania :rolleyes:




Got home from work in time to watch the Scotland game. Love watching Fiji play but don't think I will be able to keep my eyes open. Might get up in time for the England game though



two great trys in the last couple of mins :agree: 34-24 scotland, amazing finish by scotland, the romanians will be wondering how on earth they lost that after going ahead, they were far superior in the scrum and according to the commentary team georgia are even bigger and stronger than the romanians in the scrum

[brianmc]

I'd actually rather watch hibs than rugby! Sorry folks I'll leave this thread to the egg lovers.

[Pete]

I'd actually rather watch hibs than rugby! Sorry folks I'll leave this thread to the egg lovers.


There are plenty hibs related threads on other boards.

If you dont like rugby feel free to go away. I'll stop short of saying **** off!

[Pete]

Go FIJI!

Us nightshift boys ken whits goin oan!





...am I allowed to say that?

[HH81]

Were currently on Hibs.net/OTHERSPORTS/RUGBYWORLDCUP2011 , now I'm no rugby union fan but what's your problem lad? Were currently on an other sports board where you can speak about, funny enough other sports. I personally think you need some alone time and get rid of some fustration. Have fun.

[Pete]

Were currently on Hibs.net/OTHERSPORTS/RUGBYWORLDCUP2011 , now I'm no rugby union fan but what's your problem lad? Were currently on an other sports board where you can speak about, funny enough other sports. I personally think you need some alone time and get rid of some fustration. Have fun.

I'm on nightshift and the rugby is great. Those of us who are up and having beers now actually have sport to compliment it.

chill out brian.

[Iain G]

Well I was going to leave well alone but alas naw, this is a board called HIBS.NET ya cock, why don't YOU **** off to a board called egg chasing twat Net?

Cos I suspect it would be less fun without your erudite and witty contributions like this one... :wink:

[CFC]

Japan did themselves proud, made a real game of it in the second half, scoreline flattered the French tbh. Thank God Scotland just scraped a win v Romania, England Argies up next, cant beat it.

[Mikey]

England are making pretty heavy work of this so far. It wouldn't be a major upset if Argentina beat any of the Northern hemisphere teams.

[CFC]

England down to 14 men for next 10 minutes wonder if Argentina can capitalise.

[Mikey]

They really should have gone for a drop goal there to try and make it 9-3 at HT.

[Mikey]

Right on cue :greengrin

Bit far out though.

[CFC]

Argentina are kicking away too much ball for my money.

[Mikey]

Way too many missed penalties for Argentina. They could be on 24 points now, not 9.

[cabbageandribs1875]

wtf is it with argentina taking penalties from the half-way line :rolleyes: thats four times, kick it for touch and take a chance at the line-out ffs :boo hoo:

[Darth Hibbie]

two great trys in the last couple of mins :agree: 34-24 scotland, amazing finish by scotland, the romanians will be wondering how on earth they lost that after going ahead, they were far superior in the scrum and according to the commentary team georgia are even bigger and stronger than the romanians in the scrum

:agree: Scotland played in the last 10 mins how they should have played the full game, running and quick passes, the way the game is supposed to be played.

[fife hfc]

Scotland were very poor, but thankfully they got there in the end. England done the same but I'm worried now about us against the Pumas. I am very tired now and may have to go for a sleep this afternoon, thankfully Hibs don't play until tomorrow.

[heretoday]

England were lucky.

[hibsbollah]

How bad is ITVs coverage? On every level: commentators, analysts, that oirish anchor man, all totally amateurish and cliche-ridden. And its totally anglo-centric even by the standards of itv's coverage of a football world cup campaign.

[heretoday]

The kicking was appalling today. Argentina should have won easily.

[heretoday]

How bad is ITVs coverage? On every level: commentators, analysts, that oirish anchor man, all totally amateurish and cliche-ridden. And its totally anglo-centric even by the standards of itv's coverage of a football world cup campaign.

I am watching S.Africa v Wales. The commentator is awful. He seems to have an unnatural obsession with wellmuscled Springboks. I'm reduced to listening to radio instead with the accursed Brian Moore!

[Iain G]

I am watching S.Africa v Wales. The commentator is awful. He seems to have an unnatural obsession with wellmuscled Springboks. I'm reduced to listening to radio instead with the accursed Brian Moore!

You are lucky, we've got Gavin "Yawwwwwwwwwwn" Hastings doing co-commentery...

[Darth Hibbie]

I am watching S.Africa v Wales. The commentator is awful. He seems to have an unnatural obsession with wellmuscled Springboks. I'm reduced to listening to radio instead with the accursed Brian Moore!

Fantastic game though. Speaking as a part Welsh person :greengrin

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

All Blacks 83 Japan 7, 13 tries with 11 different scorers!

[CFC]

I know Hutchy New Zealand are scarily good. Theyve got tryscorers throughout that backline.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Argentina looked good earlier, could see Scotland having major problems against them if we are even slightly off the pace.

[Mikey]

Looking forward to Oz v Ireland at 9:30 today. The big problem for Ireland is that they seem to be doing their usual, they're in transition in a World Cup year and aren't as good as they were a couple of years ago.

Another problem is that they're playing Australia :greengrin

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Ireland drawing 6 6 @ HT. I think the constant pen misses will come back to haunt them.

[Mikey]

It's a cracking game. You do feel that those missed kicks might cost them, as they did with Argentina last week.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Starting to score the pens now - 12 6 with 15 mins to play, good effort so far!

[Mikey]

Fantastic game and fantastic result for Ireland. That could be enough to get them as far as the semis.

[Darth Hibbie]

Fantastic stuff towards the end there. Even had me shouting at the telly. Up at half four tomorrow for the Wales game.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Was going to back Aus -12.5 pts!
I suppose i've used my get out of jail free card for todays punting without even having a bet!

[heretoday]

Great performance by Ireland. I love rugby when it's played like that.

[CFC]

Fantastic game and fantastic result for Ireland. That could be enough to get them as far as the semis.Yes, that result shakes up the draw for the knockout stages. If Ireland win their group now they will likely face Wales (runner up group D) in the quarters and the Wallabies will play the Springboks. Well done the Paddies :greengrin

[Steve-O]

England reasonably lucky again there, Georgia could've had about 30 odd points if it wasn't for all those missed kicks! Got to hope Parks / Paterson bury those if they concede so many penalties against us.

Looking forward to this week's game since I live here in Wellington...although dreading it a bit too! A hammering wouldn't be too good heading into the England game.

[CFC]

Steve juust out of interest do you get along to many Hurricanes games? Bit of an annus horribilis I know, what is the general attitude to Mark Hammett in Wellington?

[CFC]

Just read that bagpipes are banned from the stadia in NZ. What a joke! If we had to endure those vuvuzela last summer the pipes should be allowed at the rugby. Apparently some Scottish ministers are intervening in the situation!

[Steve-O]

Steve juust out of interest do you get along to many Hurricanes games? Bit of an annus horribilis I know, what is the general attitude to Mark Hammett in Wellington?

I had a season ticket this season and it was utter garbage.

As far as I can tell Hammett is not exactly well liked but someone I work with who has close ties with the rugby world told me that it's actually the directors who are the problem and Hammett has been hung out to dry.

Seems like there are parallels to the John Collins at Hibs situation in a way! Players not listening to his 'philosophy' and being out on the bevvy etc.

[CFC]

Hadnt thought of it in those terms but very definite similarities between the Hammet and JC's situations. Getting rid of a malcontent like Nonu may be disadvantagous short term but in the long term interests of building a good club culture. Hope you enjoy the game Sunday Steve, fingers crossed for a Scotland win.

[Mikey]

Looking forward to NZ v France this morning.

Apparently England have "arrived at this World Cup" because they're gubbing Romania. The hibs.net XV would give Romania a run for their money :greengrin

[CFC]

France really taking the game to NZ here. Theyll not want to tire themselves out too early though.

[Mikey]

Great first 10 mins from France but what a reply from NZ. Can't see them getting this back and they could be heading for a really big defeat.

[derekHFC]

Looking forward to NZ v France this morning.

Apparently England have "arrived at this World Cup" because they're gubbing Romania. The hibs.net XV would give Romania a run for their money :greengrin

Is this the mens XV or the womens XV :greengrin

[Col2]

Thoug we were unlucky against Argentina today. Can someone tell me - if Scotland win against England are we through or does it need a very very unlikely bonus point? This is assuming Argentina beat Georgia.....

[hibsbollah]

Thoug we were unlucky against Argentina today. Can someone tell me - if Scotland win against England are we through or does it need a very very unlikely bonus point? This is assuming Argentina beat Georgia..... Dan Parks just isnt very good at rugby.

[JimBHibees]

Thoug we were unlucky against Argentina today. Can someone tell me - if Scotland win against England are we through or does it need a very very unlikely bonus point? This is assuming Argentina beat Georgia.....

Personally thought they blew it, massive errors in the game at key points. 2 by Paterson dropping an easy ball for 3 points then missing the tackle for the try. Also made a couple of poor decisions when near the line at start of the second half. The ref also missed a blatant penalty near the end which should have given the Scots a penalty in front of the posts.

I found it bizarre there was an English ref on this game given that England were directly affected by the result, it doesnt make any sense or look good. Not telling me they couldnt get a SA, NZ, Aus, French, Welsh, Irish or whoever ref instead.

[cabbageandribs1875]

quite bizarre the referee having an association with a country in the same group:agree: does anyone else think that's why he missed the blatant argentinian offside(hence dan parks going bananas) right at the end ?:dunno: as for that try ffs how many missed tackles jeeezo :brickwall talk about a sucker punch, the first time they got anywhere near our line :-( no chance whatsoever of getting through now, we need at least 4 tries against engerlundy, we probably wont score 4 tries before the NEXT WC

[--------]

Dan Parks just isnt very good at rugby.


Someone ought to tell him.

I have it on unimpeachable authority that he's an arrogant over-inflated plook.

That's OFF the field as well as on it.

[CFC]

Thoug we were unlucky against Argentina today. Can someone tell me - if Scotland win against England are we through or does it need a very very unlikely bonus point? This is assuming Argentina beat Georgia.....This permutation will get Scotland through (Im 99 % sure): Scotland beat England by more than 8 (denying England a losing bonus pt) AND Argentina win AND score 4 tries or more. Unlikely but far from impossible.

[hibbysam]

This permutation will get Scotland through (Im 99 % sure): Scotland beat England by more than 8 (denying England a losing bonus pt) AND Argentina win AND score 4 tries or more. Unlikely but far from impossible.

I was talking absolute tosh and missed the bit where head to head is the first decision when teams are tied.. so yes a Scotland win by more than 7 points and we will be through.

[Steve-O]

This permutation will get Scotland through (Im 99 % sure): Scotland beat England by more than 8 (denying England a losing bonus pt) AND Argentina win AND score 4 tries or more. Unlikely but far from impossible.

And in that case, Argentina and Scotland will be through :wink:

Heartbreaking stuff last night to be honest. Only started watching rugby since I came over here really but last night's emotions came pretty close to how I feel after Hibs semi final defeats and derbies where we lose late goals etc. :brickwall

Onwards and upwards though. We definitely can beat England I think but it would be the Scottish way if we do win, and still go out so I'm fully expecting not to progress now.

[cabbageandribs1875]

wales scrape through against Namibia













81-7

[Darth Hibbie]

wales scrape through against Namibia













81-7

Namibia should never of got their 7 it was a definite crossover in the pass :grr: The ref was joke allowing that :greengrin

[cabbageandribs1875]

Namibia should never of got their 7 it was a definite crossover in the pass :grr: The ref was joke allowing that :greengrin


i forgot the rugby was on, only saw wales score the last try :clapper: looking like it will be a wales v ireland QF now

[Darth Hibbie]

USA giving a Italy a good game. They were expecting Italy to slaughter them!

[CFC]

The good news: Scotland have beaten England twice and drawn once in the last three meetings at Murrayfield (make no mistake this will be a de facto home game). The bad news: The winning margin in both wins was less than the required +8 for this weekends game. Hoping for a famous win.

[Darth Hibbie]

Fantastic game between South Africa and Samoa. Thankfully for Wales Samoa never got their, more than deserved, bonus point. :greengrin

[HH81]

How can they have games when in final group game they don't kick off at same time?

The argies will kick off tomorrow knowing what they have to do. There will have been more pressure all kicking off today.

However, Scotland v England today will not even come close to the fantastic rugby game at warrington last night. Not a chance.

[cabbageandribs1875]

9-3 scotland HT :greengrin wilkinson missing 3 penalties, wonder if the english backroom staff will try and illegally change the ball again :wink:

[Hibee87]

Scotland playing well, few handling errors when the ball is coming down but in this half the wind is behind us. wilkinson kicking off the boil which helps especially now hes kicking into the wind hope paterson and/or parks shows him how to do it this half. wee need a try early and push on from there, max evans or danielli (sp) seem the most likely to spring away from nothing and get that try. going good so far keep it up scotland :agree:

[Golden Bear]

A mammoth effort from the Scots but as usual the lack of flair behind the scrum means that we're unlikely to score any match winning tries. Or tries for that matter.

Disappointing but perfectly predictable.

:boo hoo:

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

In front with a handful of minutes to go the last twice and blew it each time, our own fault unfortunately.
I thought the commentator could have hidden his glee a bit more when they got their try!

[CFC]

A mammoth effort from the Scots but as usual the lack of flair behind the scrum means that we're unlikely to score any match winning tries. Or tries for that matter.



It was a good blood, sweat and tears type of Test match, alas I dont think Scotland did enough in any of the 4 games to really justify a place in the last 8. ^ Thats it in a nutshell pal. Just dont have the backs to really break a game open, can't convert pressure, possession and territory into points. At the Test match level you have to be clinical and you have to score tries its that simple, if you are too one dimensional you are just too predictable and therefore easy to defend against.

Edinburgh won last night in convincing fashion against Munster and theres a fly half coming through the ranks (name escapes me) who is supposed to be one to watch for, cant be worse than Parks thats for sure.

Ah well only a few months to the 6 Nations, onward and upward.

[essexhibee]

Dan Carter OUT for the rest of the world cup.

New Zealand must be thinking....

[CFC]

Dan Carter OUT for the rest of the world cup.

New Zealand must be thinking....

Yeah and Slade (his understudy) is pish, the All Blacks have no depth at flyhalf unlike most other positions where they can replace the incumbent player with an equally effective substitute.

All bets are off now....................

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Dan Carter OUT for the rest of the world cup.New Zealand must be thinking.... Thats a big blow for them, what a player he is!

[LancashireHibby]

Fact of the day for you is that I played against Chris Ashton on several occasions at junior level. To my knowledge, he never scored against us either.

[CFC]

Fact of the day for you is that I played against Chris Ashton on several occasions at junior level. To my knowledge, he never scored against us either.

He was at Wigan wasn't he mate?

[essexhibee]

Yeah and Slade (his understudy) is pish, the All Blacks have no depth at flyhalf unlike most other positions where they can replace the incumbent player with an equally effective substitute. All bets are off now....................This is his time. Don't know much about slade to make a judgement but its a massive loss.

[CFC]

This is his time. Don't know much about slade to make a judgement but its a massive loss.

If anything it makes the rest of the world cup massively interesting................as things stood it would have taken an act of God for NZ not win they have been the best team in the tournament by a country mile, now its wide open..................

[LancashireHibby]

He was at Wigan wasn't he mate?

Yeah he was and to be honest wasn't always a shining light. In fact it was only recently that someone told me that Ashton played in the school side that I'd played against from 11-16 whereas several players both in the same side as myself and also on Ashton's team were pretty much always nailed on to turn professional (Joel Tomkins at Wigan and Andy Bracek at Crusaders are two that spring to mind at that time). Wigan's conveyor belt means they don't have to wait long for something similar and their current winger Josh Charnley is certainly well on track to at least be as good as Ashton, if not better.

[Steve-O]

Wales through to the semis, and deservedly so. :agree:

Next up, ALLEZ LES BLEUS!!! :sauzee: :aok:

[cabbageandribs1875]

16-0 for france HT, pity that boy has missed a few penalties(and two missed convertions) for them :boo hoo:

[cabbageandribs1875]

FT 19-12 francais :sauzee::sauzee::sauzee:

[blackpoolhibs]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHInYlR8sgA&feature=fvst:greengrin:greengrin:greengrin:top marks

[Steve-O]

Had France 11-15 on the betting so a bit pissed off at that last try, but that'll do nicely! Now I don't really care who wins the thing! Been saying all week that France would beat them though...if I'd had a bit more courage I could've lumped on and nearly trebled my money. :rolleyes:

[Golden Bear]

It seems to be a trait these days that if you don't win then it's a result of your own team's deficiencies rather than the superior abilities of the opposition.

Never more so than with the TV pundits after today's result. France played well and were the better team so thoroughly deserved their win.

They should leave it at that.

[Steve-O]

It seems to be a trait these days that if you don't win then it's a result of your own team's deficiencies rather than the superior abilities of the opposition.

Never more so than with the TV pundits after today's result. France played well and were the better team so thoroughly deserved their win.

They should leave it at that.

What they are really saying is that England ARE better than France and if they hadn't made all these errors / picked that team / played as well as they could then they'd have won :greengrin

Bawbags. :agree:

[iwasthere1972]

So glad that France beat England after some of the England fans were predicting on SSN that they would win by 15 points. They had probably already planned an extended stay in New Zealand. Arrogance.

:sauzee: :sauzee: :sauzee:

[heretoday]

It seems to be a trait these days that if you don't win then it's a result of your own team's deficiencies rather than the superior abilities of the opposition.

Never more so than with the TV pundits after today's result. France played well and were the better team so thoroughly deserved their win.

They should leave it at that.

There's nothing like the English for disembowelling themselves. You never hear them simply credit the opposition, least of all France.

I heard the Talksport commentator saying today: "And we were told France were in disarray last week!"

No, mate, YOU told us they were in disarray!

[Danderhall Hibs]

Brian Moore said on TalkSport during the week that England had no chance of winning the World Cup this year. Just so an outsider doesn't think it's all English bias! BTW the pundits today were Pienaar, Fitzpatrick and Dallaglio - were Pienaar and Fitzpatrick really that biased toward England?

[sambajustice]

Pienaar said before the game, "I won't sit on the fence like these two, if England aren't 2 tries infront after an hour they WILL LOSE this game"



Great shout!!! Dallaglio predicted an england new zealand final!

[cabbageandribs1875]

different codes, but well done Leeds Rhinos in a superb comeback against st.Helens in the grand final :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

[LancashireHibby]

different codes, but well done Leeds Rhinos in a superb comeback against st.Helens in the grand final :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

Awesome game from start to finish, had absolutely everything. Highlights will be on BBC2 tomorrow and presumably on the BBC website - well worth a watch for those who were watching the Scotland game instead.

[cabbageandribs1875]

Awesome game from start to finish, had absolutely everything. Highlights will be on BBC2 tomorrow and presumably on the BBC website - well worth a watch for those who were watching the Scotland game instead.





i dont have sky, was watching the scotland game on TV and getting updates for the rugby on the bbc site, started listening to commentary on radio5 at HT at the footy, st.helens were starting to run away with it and leading 16-8 with 20-odd mins left, leeds 'sounded' well out of it, so just left it at that, finished watching the footy then had to hit the refresh button on the beeb site a few times in disbelief :greengrin i'l catch-up on the BBCiplayer tomorrow :aok:


p.s. att: 69,107 superb crowd for a saturday night :agree:

[heretoday]

Good show by Argentina although it was inevitable they'd wilt after the hour. NZ seem to have unearthed a saviour in Cruden.

[Biggie]

Backingblack.....next week should be interesting...battle of the giants in the semi....southern hemisphere vs northern...I go for NZ vs Wales final, with the AB's lifting the trophy on home soil......gutted for Carter, he is the main man and will be missed, but it's time for the others to step up to the plate.

[LancashireHibby]

i dont have sky, was watching the scotland game on TV and getting updates for the rugby on the bbc site, started listening to commentary on radio5 at HT at the footy, st.helens were starting to run away with it and leading 16-8 with 20-odd mins left, leeds 'sounded' well out of it, so just left it at that, finished watching the footy then had to hit the refresh button on the beeb site a few times in disbelief :greengrin i'l catch-up on the BBCiplayer tomorrow :aok:


p.s. att: 69,107 superb crowd for a saturday night :agree:

Much bigger crowd than I expected considering neither of the finalists were 'new' and the traffic must have been a nightmare with how much rain there was yesterday. My bank manager is pleased I watched the game at home but would much rather have been there!

[heretoday]

Backingblack.....next week should be interesting...battle of the giants in the semi....southern hemisphere vs northern...I go for NZ vs Wales final, with the AB's lifting the trophy on home soil......gutted for Carter, he is the main man and will be missed, but it's time for the others to step up to the plate.

If NZ had Carter I'd say they were a certainty. Without his kicking game and despite Cruden's promise I'm going for Oz!

[CFC]

2011 semi finalists all time RWC records: All Blacks: 1 x RWC, 1 x runner up, 6 x semi finalists. Wallabies: 2 x RWC, 1 x runner up, 5 x semi finalists. France: 2 x runner up, 6 x semi finalists. Wales: 2 x semi finalists.

[Steve-O]

If NZ had Carter I'd say they were a certainty. Without his kicking game and despite Cruden's promise I'm going for Oz!

Weepu kicked 7 penalties/conversions last week though? He'll probably start over Cruden.

Edit - stand corrected, BOTH are starting. Weepu will kick though.

[cabbageandribs1875]

does it EVER stop raining in NZ :confused:

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Red card for the Welsh captain after 20 mins, very dubious decision, probably spoiled a very good looking game!

[Darth Hibbie]

Red card for the Welsh captain after 20 mins, very dubious decision, probably spoiled a very good looking game!

:agree: Disgraceful decision

[essexhibee]

Allain Roland has just ruined this game. Pathetic decision.

[grunt]

Allain Roland has just ruined this game. Pathetic decision.Agreed.

[Hibs Class]

Allain Roland has just ruined this game. Pathetic decision.

:agree: Disgraceful. I'm sure that ref wouldn't have made the same decision against other teams. Wales have done well since then though, and just scored a try. I hope they go on to win, but the missed conversion might be costly.

[Hibs Class]

9-8 to France. Brilliant effort by the Welsh. They were robbed today by a ref who was at the very least negligent (he shouldn't be allowed near international rugby again) and whose impartiality has to be questioned.

[essexhibee]

Scottish but went mental when the welsh scored, genuinely gutted that they didn't do it. Inspirational stuff from the welsh, going that long with just 14 men.

Really think that the welsh would have done it with 15 men. Mr Rolland hang your head!!

[heretoday]

What if the French guy had broken his neck?

[cabbageandribs1875]

What if the French guy had broken his neck?


that was my first thought after watching the first replay :agree: guys in the studio saying that he had let go when he saw the way he was falling, but that would have been akin to shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted(or sommit like that:greengrin) everyone agreed it was at least a yellow, maybe if he had broke his neck they would have said it was possibly a red then, having said all that, wales were very unlucky, but not one pundit has given any credit to the french, preferring to predict that wales 'would' have won had they had 15 men.

[Steve-O]

does it EVER stop raining in NZ :confused:

Annoyingly enough, the weather has been pretty decent between games, but it seems to rain during every game! The Scotland v Argentina game here in Wellington for example - it was nice during the afternoon before the game, and then started hosing down just in time for kick off. Then for the next 3 days after there was not a cloud in the sky!!

[joe breezy]

Wales has chances to win it though, missed kicks and not going for a drop goal made the difference too..,

I was rooting for Wales so was pissed off with the ref at the time. I don't really know what makes the difference between a red and a yellow but if you take someone off the ground you're supposed to make sure they return to the ground with care...he didn't do that - anyway with no England Wales or Scotland I've lost interest a bit

Want NZ to win it now and they seem to be doing ok v the Aussies now

[Danderhall Hibs]

What if the French guy had broken his neck?

If he had it would've been an accident. Never a red card.

[Danderhall Hibs]

That's NZ just won the World Cup this morning. Beat the Aussies comfortably.

[Steve-O]

I think France have shown this year, and in the past, they can't be written off completely.

Still, think the All Blacks will do it and pretty pleased I shall be here in NZ to witness it...AND we've all got a Monday holiday the day after the final, happy days! :greengrin :party:

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

That's NZ just won the World Cup this morning. Beat the Aussies comfortably. Couldnae agree more, cannae be bothered checking what it is just now, but, wouldnae be surprised if NZ break the record for the biggest winning margin in a WC Final.

[Steve-O]

Couldnae agree more, cannae be bothered checking what it is just now, but, wouldnae be surprised if NZ break the record for the biggest winning margin in a WC Final.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rugby_World_Cup

Record is 22.

I'd be a bit surprised if there's that much in it. 11-15 is my margin prediction :agree:

[Biggie]

Well done the all blacks....what intensity...some of the hits in that game...jesus.
Say what you like about rugby, but at that level, it is great to watch.....strength, power, pace....looking forward to next Sunday....all blacks by 10

[cabbageandribs1875]

Captain Sam Warburton will miss Wales' World Cup third-place play-off against Australia (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/15307850.stm) after receiving a three-week ban for his "dangerous tip tackle" in the 9-8 semi-final defeat by France (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/15307018.stm).


http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/15325714.stm






(http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/15325714.stm)

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rugby_World_CupRecord is 22.I'd be a bit surprised if there's that much in it. 11-15 is my margin prediction :agree: Only 1-2 on Betfair to win by over 12.5pts.9-2 for All Blacks to win by 11-15pts.

[Sergio sledge]

9-8 to France. Brilliant effort by the Welsh. They were robbed today by a ref who was at the very least negligent (he shouldn't be allowed near international rugby again) and whose impartiality has to be questioned. According to the rules of the game he did the 100% correct thing. Why should he never be allowed near international rugby again and why should his impartiality be questioned? Some refs might have given more leeway, but some strictly stick to the rules. You play the ref, if he's strict, don't make stupid tackles. The only person to blame is the Wales captain who had a rush of blood to the head and committed a red card offence.

[Danderhall Hibs]

According to the rules of the game he did the 100% correct thing. Why should he never be allowed near international rugby again and why should his impartiality be questioned? Some refs might have given more leeway, but some strictly stick to the rules. You play the ref, if he's strict, don't make stupid tackles. The only person to blame is the Wales captain who had a rush of blood to the head and committed a red card offence.

What is the exact law? I don't think he meant to lift him up, but when he did he made sure he didn't follow it through.

[Sergio sledge]

What is the exact law? I don't think he meant to lift him up, but when he did he made sure he didn't follow it through.

Law 10 (j) of the IRB Laws (http://www.irblaws.com/downloads/EN/IRB_Laws_2011_EN.pdf) states:

"Lifting a player from the ground and dropping or driving that player into the ground whilst that player’s feet are still off the ground such that the player’s head and/or upper body come into contact with the ground is dangerous play.
Sanction: Penalty kick"

The punishment for this was clarified in a memo issued by the IRB in June 2009 (http://ht.ly/6Yd0Y) which stated:

"To summarise, the possible scenarios when a tackler horizontally lifts a player off the ground:

The player is lifted and then forced or “speared” into the ground. A red card should be issued for this type of tackle.
The lifted player is dropped to the ground from a height with no regard to the player’s safety. A red card should be issued for this type of tackle.
For all other types of dangerous lifting tackles, it may be considered a penalty or yellow card is sufficient."
For me it's clear. The Welsh captain lifted the player off the ground then let go of him in mid air and didn't take responsibility for getting the player to ground safely. The players have known that this type of tackle was outlawed since 2007 and that it would result in a straight red since 2009, so the Welsh have no cause for complaints. People are saying it should have been a yellow card. Not according to the laws and not according to the briefing the coaches had before the tournament. Listen to what Kingsley Jones says from about 4.10 on here. (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/15330130.stm)

For me it shows an ignorance on the part of the "experts" that none of them knew that this was a red card offense.

[Danderhall Hibs]

For me it shows an ignorance on the part of the "experts" that none of them knew that this was a red card offense.

I think they didn't think it looked that dangerous.

As you say though the letter of the law says red, it's just the case that the other refs don't apply the law every week (in fact Roland normally doesn't either) .

[CFC]

By the letter of the law it was a red card but the question I have is once Warburton had Clerc off his feet how was he supposed to let him down gently? I would rather have seen a yellow given in this instance because Warburton has an exemplary disciplinary record and the call was too marginal to have been made in a World Cup semi for mine. These arent things that the ref can really take into consideration but all the same a red was just too harsh in the circumstances imo. Again, I just dont see how you can safely bring someone down when they are off their feet.

[Sergio sledge]

I think they didn't think it looked that dangerous.

As you say though the letter of the law says red, it's just the case that the other refs don't apply the law every week (in fact Roland normally doesn't either) .

From the video I linked, it seems Rolland has previous for this type of sending off. Ref consistency is important, but generally you get to know the ref's style and what they are tough on and learn to adjust your game for them. Rolland ref's in Magners league every week so all the Welsh players should have known what he's like.


By the letter of the law it was a red card but the question I have is once Warburton had Clerc off his feet how was he supposed to let him down gently? I would rather have seen a yellow given in this instance because Warburton has an exemplary disciplinary record and the call was too marginal to have been made in a World Cup semi for mine. These arent things that the ref can really take into consideration but all the same a red was just too harsh in the circumstances imo. Again, I just dont see how you can safely bring someone down when they are off their feet.

Unfortunately there is no room in the law or the memo to allow for the things you say, although I do agree there should be room for the ref to take this sort of thing into account. My first thought at the time was that the red card was harsh, but its the law and, most importantly, the player that is to blame, not the ref.

On your other point, the key thing is to not tip them so that their feet are above their head, if their feet are kept low you can put them down on their feet/legs/backside/side/back. Anywhere but their neck/head/shoulders really. Once Warburton had raised his feet above his head, he really had no chance of not conceding a penalty and getting carded. Nearly everyone who has played rugby will have done tackles like this before, dump tackles used to be allowed, but not really anymore. As I said though, you can still lift them off the ground if they don't go beyond the horizontal and you don't drop or drive them into the ground you'll probably be ok and not get carded, or sometimes even penalised.

[Hibs Class]

According to the rules of the game he did the 100% correct thing. Why should he never be allowed near international rugby again and why should his impartiality be questioned? Some refs might have given more leeway, but some strictly stick to the rules. You play the ref, if he's strict, don't make stupid tackles. The only person to blame is the Wales captain who had a rush of blood to the head and committed a red card offence. I'm reminded of a penalty which was given against West Brom when mowbray was manager, for a shirt tug in the box. It drew a lot of debate and the letter of the law was quoted then as well. I don't have an issue with you supporting the red card, but my view on initial viewing was a yellow card and a pen. I saw it as a low tackle where there was a "pivot" type action which saw the frenchman turned horizontal and then no aggressive / dangerous / spearing action by warburton. On the basis of what actually happened I believed at the time a red was harsh / wrong and i still hold that view. The consensus expert view is aligned to mine. For some reason rolland chose to show red. If he had been reffing sunday's semi i doubt he would have made the same decision, so I stand by my view that his impartiality is suspect.

[CFC]

Nearly everyone who has played rugby will have done tackles like this before, dump tackles used to be allowed, but not really anymore.

All good points in that post SS. Yeah I played Rugby at school thats what I was basing my opinion off. From my experience it is easier than it might appear to perform a tackle that Warburton did especially on a player who is smaller and/or lighter. If you establish a low body position and get underneath his centre of gravity it can quite easily happen, especially as it all happens in an instant.

Oh well, glad that Clerc wasnt injured if he's landed on his neck that would have been nasty. Just ashame for Warburton cos for mine there was no intent on his part.

[Sergio sledge]

I'm reminded of a penalty which was given against West Brom when mowbray was manager, for a shirt tug in the box. It drew a lot of debate and the letter of the law was quoted then as well. I don't have an issue with you supporting the red card, but my view on initial viewing was a yellow card and a pen.

That was my initial view too and there wouldn't have been any complaints if that had happened.


I saw it as a low tackle where there was a "pivot" type action which saw the frenchman turned horizontal and then no aggressive / dangerous / spearing action by warburton.

Unfortunately the laws of the game say that if a player is lifted off their feet and dropped to the ground it is classed as dangerous play, no matter whether there is aggressive / spearing action involved. I quoted that in an earlier post. The French player was also turned beyond the horizontal, which makes the tackle even more dangerous as he runs the risk of landing on his head.


On the basis of what actually happened I believed at the time a red was harsh / wrong and i still hold that view. The consensus expert view is aligned to mine. For some reason rolland chose to show red.

I also thought it was harsh at the time, and was mislead by the "experts" to believe that it was harsh, however having spoken to a friend who ref's matches, listened to some of the reaction and read the rules, my initial reaction and the consensus "expert" view are wrong. The law is very clear and very black and white on the matter, the IRB memo even going as far as to say that:

"Referees and Citing Commissioners should not make their decisions based on what they consider was the intention of the offending player. Their decision should be based on an objective assessment (as per Law 10.4 (e)) of the circumstances of the tackle."

Rolland had no room for maneuver, he had to issue a red card.

As I said before, it's not the ref at fault here, but the player and the laws. Warburton will have known this was illegal and had a red card punishment, and will also have known Rolland is a strict ref, so he should have known better, however there should be room for the allowed for the referee to assess the intent of the player in these situations. Perhaps this will change after the world cup.


If he had been reffing sunday's semi i doubt he would have made the same decision, so I stand by my view that his impartiality is suspect.

Rolland has previous for enforcing this very law in a similar situation, he has also refereed many top level matches including a world cup final and multiple France matches. With respect, it's silly to suggest that his impartiality is in doubt because of one instance where he followed the law to the letter.


All good points in that post SS. Yeah I played Rugby at school thats what I was basing my opinion off. From my experience it is easier than it might appear to perform a tackle that Warburton did especially on a player who is smaller and/or lighter. If you establish a low body position and get underneath his centre of gravity it can quite easily happen, especially as it all happens in an instant.

Oh well, glad that Clerc wasnt injured if he's landed on his neck that would have been nasty. Just ashame for Warburton cos for mine there was no intent on his part.

Yep, its very easy to do. Thats why I personally think that the ref's should be allowed to take intent into account. They can do it in other areas of the game, such as offside / knock on's etc. so why can't they do it for dangerous play. If the ref and touch judges think a tackle was deliberate, give the red card, if it seemed to be accidental, then a penalty and yellow card.

Rolland did the right thing in this case, so blaming him is wrong. But the law should be relaxed slightly to give the ref's some leeway to not have to give the red card every time.

[Hibs Class]

That was my initial view too and there wouldn't have been any complaints if that had happened. Unfortunately the laws of the game say that if a player is lifted off their feet and dropped to the ground it is classed as dangerous play, no matter whether there is aggressive / spearing action involved. I quoted that in an earlier post. The French player was also turned beyond the horizontal, which makes the tackle even more dangerous as he runs the risk of landing on his head. I also thought it was harsh at the time, and was mislead by the "experts" to believe that it was harsh, however having spoken to a friend who ref's matches, listened to some of the reaction and read the rules, my initial reaction and the consensus "expert" view are wrong. The law is very clear and very black and white on the matter, the IRB memo even going as far as to say that:"Referees and Citing Commissioners should not make their decisions based on what they consider was the intention of the offending player. Their decision should be based on an objective assessment (as per Law 10.4 (e)) of the circumstances of the tackle."Rolland had no room for maneuver, he had to issue a red card. As I said before, it's not the ref at fault here, but the player and the laws. Warburton will have known this was illegal and had a red card punishment, and will also have known Rolland is a strict ref, so he should have known better, however there should be room for the allowed for the referee to assess the intent of the player in these situations. Perhaps this will change after the world cup. Rolland has previous for enforcing this very law in a similar situation, he has also refereed many top level matches including a world cup final and multiple France matches. With respect, it's silly to suggest that his impartiality is in doubt because of one instance where he followed the law to the letter. Yep, its very easy to do. Thats why I personally think that the ref's should be allowed to take intent into account. They can do it in other areas of the game, such as offside / knock on's etc. so why can't they do it for dangerous play. If the ref and touch judges think a tackle was deliberate, give the red card, if it seemed to be accidental, then a penalty and yellow card. Rolland did the right thing in this case, so blaming him is wrong. But the law should be relaxed slightly to give the ref's some leeway to not have to give the red card every time.You make lots of very good points and a well reasoned argument. I find it hard to disagree with much of what you say. I think one of the most pertinent points of your post is referring to Rolland's strictness. I think that at this level there needs to be a balance between black and white and common sense, and I maintain that is where Rolland was found wanting. I expect we will agree to disagree.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

I see Paddy Power have paid out 600K on NZ winning the WC! I doubt they're wrong tho!

[hibsbollah]

All Blacks 5 France 0 halftime.

Dull game, referee giving every decision to NZ but kicker missing everything.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

I was hoping for a fast, open, expansive game, not to be, still interesting viewing though!

[Sylar]

Final: New Zealand 8-7 France

Terrible game and certainly done nothing to convert me to a rugger fan.

[essexhibee]

French were unlucky.

[Steve-O]

Was a poor game but good times were had last night. Pity they couldn't have wrapped it up in some more style, but judging by the parade through Auckland I am watching right now, the Kiwis don't really care too much!

[CFC]

Was a poor game but good times were had last night. Pity they couldn't have wrapped it up in some more style, but judging by the parade through Auckland I am watching right now, the Kiwis don't really care too much!

Agree, wasn't a great game for the neutral but I think after a 24 year wait the Kiwis will take it! I trust you were worse for wear Steve!

Got to give credit to the French, they are the only team that will lose in the same calendar year to both Tonga and Italy but push the All Blacks right to the 80th minute on home soil, and to credit the All Blacks its no mean feat winning a RWC with your 4th string flyhalf (Stephen Donald).

Well, cannot wait till the 6 Nations now, will be excited to see if Wales can carry some of their great Rugby in this tournament into the championship.