Signing no-one

[one day maybe...]

Would it matter that much if we failed to sign anyone. If we promoted from the youth, went with the first team players we already have. No Billy big time players, just a bunch of guys playing for the jersey and the pride of being part of Hibernian.

We will sign players I realise that, but imagine we never, scarey eh!

[Broken Gnome]

Would it matter that much if we failed to sign anyone.

Yes. It couldn't matter more.

[Sir David Gray]

If we go with what we currently have, we will almost certainly be relegated this coming season.

[Hakim Sar]

Current hibs squad would struggle to win the 1st Division. Maybe finish top 3 in 1st division.

We'd probably get relegated next year too as the youngsters would crack under the pressure.

[KeithTheHibby]

Would it matter that much if we failed to sign anyone. If we promoted from the youth, went with the first team players we already have. No Billy big time players, just a bunch of guys playing for the jersey and the pride of being part of Hibernian.

We will sign players I realise that, but imagine we never, scarey eh!

Soccer suicide with that squad.

[hibeeleicester]

GK. Stack
RB. Wotherspoon/Taggart
CB. Stephens
CB. Hanlon
LB. Booth

DM. Palsson

Rm. Sproule
CM. Scott
CM. Thornhill
LM. Galbraith

ST. Sodje

Subs:
Brown
Scott Smith
Hart
Welsh
Stevenson
Murray
Horner


On Paper it looks a decent team.... prepared to be shot down.

[Broken Gnome]

GK. Stack
RB. Wotherspoon/Taggart
CB. Stephens
CB. Hanlon
LB. Booth

DM. Palsson

Rm. Sproule
CM. Scott
CM. Thornhill
LM. Galbraith

ST. Sodje

Subs:
Brown
Scott Smith
Hart
Welsh
Stevenson
Murray
Horner


On Paper it looks a decent team.... prepared to be shot down.

It was a low scoring Hibs team last year. That side's even less likely to win games.

[Spike Mandela]

Who would play as striker if Sodje was injured:confused:

[Steve20]

GK. Stack
RB. Wotherspoon/Taggart
CB. Stephens
CB. Hanlon
LB. Booth

DM. Palsson

Rm. Sproule
CM. Scott
CM. Thornhill
LM. Galbraith

ST. Sodje

Subs:
Brown
Scott Smith
Hart
Welsh
Stevenson
Murray
Horner


On Paper it looks a decent team.... prepared to be shot down.

That team would finish in the bottom six.

[one day maybe...]

GK. Stack
RB. Wotherspoon/Taggart
CB. Stephens
CB. Hanlon
LB. Booth

DM. Palsson

Rm. Sproule
CM. Scott
CM. Thornhill
LM. Galbraith

ST. Sodje

Subs:
Brown
Scott Smith
Hart
Welsh
Stevenson
Murray
Horner


On Paper it looks a decent team.... prepared to be shot down.

My thoughts exactly, we seem to be clambering to get players signed, i'd rather we signed the right calibre of player. Hopefully we sign 3 quality player to add to what we already have, hopefully Calderwood has identified these targets and the Hibs board are backing him. But if we don't sign anymore players and go with what we have, are we really going to be that bad as to get relegated?
Personally I don't think we would get relegated.

[Inch Cabbage]

That team would finish in the bottom six.

Of Division 1, aye! :agree:

[Saorsa]

GK. Stack
RB. Wotherspoon/Taggart
CB. Stephens
CB. Hanlon
LB. Booth

DM. Palsson

Rm. Sproule
CM. Scott
CM. Thornhill
LM. Galbraith

ST. Sodje

Subs:
Brown
Scott Smith
Hart
Welsh
Stevenson
Murray
Horner


On Paper it looks a decent team.... prepared to be shot down.1st Division this way
http://www.funspot.tutengraphics.com/mypages/Fun%20Spot%20Rewards/animated-arrow-down.gif

[hibeeleicester]

GK. Stack
RB. Wotherspoon/Taggart
CB. Caldwell
CB. Hanlon
LB. Booth

DM. Palsson

Rm. Sproule
CM. Scott
CM. Thornhill
LM. Flynn

ST. Rooney

Subs:
Brown
Scott Smith
Hart
Welsh
Stevenson
Murray
Horner
Sodje
Stephens
Galbraith

On Paper it looks a decent team.... prepared to be shot down.


Ok then, here's my team with only 3 new signings. And already it looks like a decent team.. no?

[HibsMax]

That team would finish in the bottom six.


Of Division 1, aye! :agree:

Why do people assume that change can only be negative? Can a team not get better as well as worse? Is the ONLY way for Hibs to get better by signing more players? I personally think we need to make more signings but there seems to be this feeling that a team, once it has performed badly, cannot possibly turn things around e.g., 10th last season means AT LEAST 10th next year. We do need to strengthen the team and we definitely need to build some depth but I'm not sure I'm ready to throw the existing players on the scrap heap.

[silverhibee]

GK. Stack
RB. Wotherspoon/Taggart
CB. Stephens
CB. Hanlon
LB. Booth

DM. Palsson

Rm. Sproule
CM. Scott
CM. Thornhill
LM. Galbraith

ST. Sodje

Subs:
Brown
Scott Smith
Hart
Welsh
Stevenson
Murray
Horner


On Paper it looks a decent team.... prepared to be shot down.


On the park it would get ripped to pieces imo.

[aberhibsfc]

:agree:
Yes. It couldn't matter more.

If we had a strong nucleus then the drafting of youth into the first team would be beneficial, in fact it's what we should be aiming for whether we were the size of Berwick Rangers or Barcelona.

Unfortunately this is not the case, we have released players on big wages and most of which did not perform. We now have a clean slate and opportunity to re-invest our savings into a better more reliable form of player. Smaller player pool with the best of the youngsters as trimmings, it's the healthy and most economical path.

To rely on youngsters being catapulted into a 1st team which itself at present is not fit for purpose would be a disaster. Yes, sometimes a young player can come in and play without fear and progress, but many more benefit from being integrated gradually into a team performing well. This would reduce the fear factor, burn out, bad habits, over reliance of youth.

It's a false economy saving money by not re-investing in the team. We have been quilty in the past of putting teams on the park without signficant financial support whilst we attacked ground development and our accounts. We need to at some point turn this trend around and invest on the park to ease the long suffering and to be honest, it's about time. That said, it's not all about throwing money at it. We need to be astute in our efforts to capture players and I'd rather wait and get the right ones. What I don't want to see though is us going for the calibre of players such as Keenan etc that are not sought after at our level of football. We need to be both sensible and determined to improve the player pool. We might see a name or two that are unkown to us but as long as their attitude and ability are right we'll get behind them whoever they are.

I just hope that Calderwood has the freedom to move around within his budget in terms of salaries.

The board will be missing a trick if we don't start bring players in soon, that generates the excitement and encourages season ticket purchases. I think this is why Sproule was signed early in window, but it needed a bit more fanfare to get the salivation going. Happy with the addition of Sproule, more like it would be great. I am glad the board don't let things slip until the deals done, especially as we work within a tight budget, the last thing we need is this information slipping out to rivals, especially fat Jim's mob. Part of me thinks the poster that bumped into Caldwell might be onto something. Caldwell not disclosing the information sounds like a Petrie caveat. I'll wait and see what happens.

Not upset with the goings on, but hope we get some good news soon. GGTH.

[Steve20]

Why do people assume that change can only be negative? Can a team not get better as well as worse? Is the ONLY way for Hibs to get better by signing more players? I personally think we need to make more signings but there seems to be this feeling that a team, once it has performed badly, cannot possibly turn things around e.g., 10th last season means AT LEAST 10th next year. We do need to strengthen the team and we definitely need to build some depth but I'm not sure I'm ready to throw the existing players on the scrap heap.

I'm not saying they can't get better. All I said was that team would finish bottom six, imo.

[Sir David Gray]

GK. Stack
RB. Wotherspoon/Taggart
CB. Stephens
CB. Hanlon
LB. Booth

DM. Palsson

Rm. Sproule
CM. Scott
CM. Thornhill
LM. Galbraith

ST. Sodje

Subs:
Brown
Scott Smith
Hart
Welsh
Stevenson
Murray
Horner


On Paper it looks a decent team.... prepared to be shot down.

A few observations...;

Defence far too young and inexperienced.

Not sure that the midfield has enough creativity about it.

We had a shocking goalscoring record last season and since then, although he had a poor season by his standards, we have gone on to lose our top goalscorer without replacing him so far. It stands to reason that our goalscoring will suffer even more.

Sodje is our only recognised striker in the first team squad. If he gets injured or suspended, we will be knackered.

If we went with that squad next season, I don't see us improving on our 10th place finish last season and I would say that relegation would be a real possibility.

I have said before and I'll say it again, we need about 6 or 7 players in the summer, most of which need to be of a required standard that they can go straight into the first team.

[Inch Cabbage]

Why do people assume that change can only be negative? Can a team not get better as well as worse? Is the ONLY way for Hibs to get better by signing more players? I personally think we need to make more signings but there seems to be this feeling that a team, once it has performed badly, cannot possibly turn things around e.g., 10th last season means AT LEAST 10th next year. We do need to strengthen the team and we definitely need to build some depth but I'm not sure I'm ready to throw the existing players on the scrap heap.


Eh? Did you see us towards the end of last season at all?

[Albion Hibs]

GK. Stack
RB. Wotherspoon/Taggart
CB. Stephens
CB. Hanlon
LB. Booth

DM. Palsson

Rm. Sproule
CM. Scott
CM. Thornhill
LM. Galbraith

ST. Sodje

Subs:
Brown
Scott Smith
Hart
Welsh
Stevenson
Murray
Horner


On Paper it looks a decent team.... prepared to be shot down.

It looks like a very small and weak team with not a lot of fight in them. We would get battered IMO. In addition if we scored more than 20 goals for the season I would be suprised.

[Saorsa]

Eh? Did you see us towards the end of last season at all?just the end?

[HibsMax]

I'm not saying they can't get better. All I said was that team would finish bottom six, imo.

OK, so 9th. :wink:

Many of the players listed by HibeeLeicester will be an active part of next season's team, we're not replacing everyone so we have to have some confidence in the players that survived the clearout.

[Allant1981]

We really need a couple strikers and some good experienced defenders, we lost a lot of stupid goals last season and id imagine with CC being a defender he would not have been happy with his defence last year

[HibsMax]

Eh? Did you see us towards the end of last season at all?

I didn't say we weren't pish last season. I asked if it was a one-way street and it appears, to some, that it is i.e., pish last season means pish this season. Players can improve but it doesn't appear as though everyone here agrees with that.

If you play golf and you shoot 105 three rounds in a row, does that mean you won't break a hundred? If you play pool and you lose 7 out of 10 matches in a season, does that mean you can't do better next season? There are literally hundreds of examples.

YES, we need more players but the players that let us down last season are not guaranteed to make the same mistakes next season. They COULD improve.

All I am saying is that we don't have to replace every player to get better.

[TRC]

Yes. It couldn't matter more.


You're alive amazed to be honest:wink:

[greenlex]

Its not going to happen.

[Broken Gnome]

You're alive amazed to be honest:wink:

No one more amazed than me...

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Would it matter that much if we failed to sign anyone. If we promoted from the youth, went with the first team players we already have. No Billy big time players, just a bunch of guys playing for the jersey and the pride of being part of Hibernian.

We will sign players I realise that, but imagine we never, scarey eh!

Wind up?

[Inch Cabbage]

just the end?

Yes, with most the "dross" not playing either. We were terrible with and without the dross we have emptied. :rolleyes:

[Arch Stanton]

Would it matter that much if we failed to sign anyone. If we promoted from the youth, went with the first team players we already have. No Billy big time players, just a bunch of guys playing for the jersey and the pride of being part of Hibernian.

We will sign players I realise that, but imagine we never, scarey eh!

So, with other clubs with much smaller budgets often out-performing us your approach would be to DECREASE our budget? A bit counter-intuitive, no?

And I know that our best football in recent years was played by a low-budget team full of young up-and-comings but that's no reason to ever try it again, is it?

[HibsMax]

So, with other clubs with much smaller budgets often out-performing us your approach would be to DECREASE our budget? A bit counter-intuitive, no?
Not really because as you said in your own post, clubs spending less than us are finishing above us which would seem to imply the problem isn't with the amount of money we're spending.


And I know that our best football in recent years was played by a low-budget team full of young up-and-comings but that's no reason to ever try it again, is it?
Why wouldn't we want to repeat something that, by your own admission, worked better than anything else we've tried recently? To deviate from a plan that worked in the past......now that seems counter-intuitive. :wink: I know what you mean though.

[Arch Stanton]

Why wouldn't we want to repeat something that, by your own admission, worked better than anything else we've tried recently? To deviate from a plan that worked in the past......now that seems counter-intuitive. :wink: I know what you mean though.

And now that you've explained it to me, I do now too - cheers. :greengrin

[Spender]

GK. Stack
RB. Wotherspoon/Taggart
CB. Stephens
CB. Hanlon
LB. Booth

DM. Palsson

Rm. Sproule
CM. Scott
CM. Thornhill
LM. Galbraith

ST. Sodje

Subs:
Brown
Scott Smith
Hart
Welsh
Stevenson
Murray
Horner


On Paper it looks a decent team.... prepared to be shot down.

did we forget about De-graff

[Kaiser1962]

Why wouldn't we want to repeat something that, by your own admission, worked better than anything else we've tried recently? To deviate from a plan that worked in the past......now that seems counter-intuitive. :wink: I know what you mean though.

Exactly right.

Or we could try to use the model which has been tried many times before, by spending fortunes, that seldom ever works.

[HibsMax]

Exactly right.

Or we could try to use the model which has been tried many times before, by spending fortunes, that seldom ever works.

and when it does work it still blows up in our face as our relative success is noted by other teams who then swoop in and cherry pick our talent because we cannot afford to hold onto them. In that regard, the SPL outside of the Old Firm is little more than an extended scouting network.

[Arch Stanton]

and when it does work it still blows up in our face as our relative success is noted by other teams who then swoop in and cherry pick our talent because we cannot afford to hold onto them. In that regard, the SPL outside of the Old Firm is little more than an extended scouting network.

So, tell me, if your success was based on young talent then surely holding on to them would be looking for success based on mature talent - no?

Isn't that dropping something you are good at for something you are not?

[HibsMax]

So, tell me, if your success was based on young talent then surely holding on to them would be looking for success based on mature talent - no?

Isn't that dropping something you are good at for something you are not?

I'm sorry but I genuinely don't know what you mean with the second part of your first sentence.

I would personally like us to find a balance i.e., bring through our own talent whom we hold onto, or sell on for good money, while bolstering the squad with more mature, experienced players. If we could build a mature team using our youth, that would be a win-win for me.

I think the reasons that we struggle to do both are the same - money.

[Arch Stanton]

I'm sorry but I genuinely don't know what you mean with the second part of your first sentence.

I would personally like us to find a balance i.e., bring through our own talent whom we hold onto, or sell on for good money, while bolstering the squad with more mature, experienced players. If we could build a mature team using our youth, that would be a win-win for me.

I think the reasons that we struggle to do both are the same - money.

But don't you see the dichotomy in the highlighted sentence?

If you keep hold of your young players you will quickly no longer have a young team any more!

Subsequent generations of young players may as well have signed for some other team who don't have opportunities for them, won't they?

OK, you then fudge the issue by saying you advocate the best of both worlds as if that is that is so easy to do, and as if the players we decide to hold back will be happy that we are denying them the opportunity of aiming for something higher, and maybe ending up in Manchester, London, Madrid or even Barcelona - Edinburgh being such a great place and all!

[Beefster]

Having read the OP, maybe Fife Hyland was right...

[HibsMax]

But don't you see the dichotomy in the highlighted sentence?

If you keep hold of your young players you will quickly no longer have a young team any more!
Sorry if I was unclear. I'm looking for a balance of young players and older heads. If those older heads are former young Hibs players who have plied their trade with us all this time - super. If we have to go outside the organisation to get these players, that's fine too.


Subsequent generations of young players may as well have signed for some other team who don't have opportunities for them, won't they?
Not at all. I'm not suggesting we aim for ZERO turnover. There will always be attrition.


OK, you then fudge the issue by saying you advocate the best of both worlds as if that is that is so easy to do, and as if the players we decide to hold back will be happy that we are denying them the opportunity of aiming for something higher, and maybe ending up in Manchester, London, Madrid or even Barcelona - Edinburgh being such a great place and all!

LOL. Sorry for fudging. I didn't say anything was easy to do. I just told you what I think we should be aiming for (based upon my wealth of SPL team running experience :wink:). Rather than trying to buy a team or build a team, let's see if we can get the two pieces working harmoniously. I'm not going to lose sleep over potentially screwing up some young players chances because let's face it, there aren't many career players these days and given half a chance at $$$$$$, most of them will bolt.

[sesoim]

A few observations...;

Defence far too young and inexperienced.

Not sure that the midfield has enough creativity about it.

We had a shocking goalscoring record last season and since then, although he had a poor season by his standards, we have gone on to lose our top goalscorer without replacing him so far. It stands to reason that our goalscoring will suffer even more.

Sodje is our only recognised striker in the first team squad. If he gets injured or suspended, we will be knackered.

If we went with that squad next season, I don't see us improving on our 10th place finish last season and I would say that relegation would be a real possibility.

I have said before and I'll say it again, we need about 6 or 7 players in the summer, most of which need to be of a required standard that they can go straight into the first team.



:agree: You saved me a bit of writing, I agree with all the above. I'd also add that a better manager than CC would maybe get more out of the players we have, but I'll leave that issue to the side for the moment.

[Arch Stanton]

:agree: You saved me a bit of writing, I agree with all the above. I'd also add that a better manager than CC would maybe get more out of the players we have, but I'll leave that issue to the side for the moment.

Would maybe have got more huh?

So, a better manager may have been worse?

Your definition of better managers is that they may be worse than poorer managers (going by your own post that is).

I do not therefore wonder why you want your post to be left aside.

What I do wonder is why you ever want any of your posts to be given any consideration whatsoever.