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Hibernia Na Eir
07-05-2011, 07:16 PM
the guy is no manager. Lets get a proper person in. CC has now proved he's no use now. Unless you enjoy being a laughing stock???

Andy74
07-05-2011, 07:20 PM
the guy is no manager. Lets get a proper person in. CC has now proved he's no use now. Unless you enjoy being a laughing stock???

I think he's proved he's no better than we had but I think we need to stick with him and let him do what he needs to do now.

matty_f
07-05-2011, 07:20 PM
the guy is no manager. Lets get a proper person in. CC has now proved he's no use now. Unless you enjoy being a laughing stock???

Better idea would be to actually let him do the rebuilding job he was brought in to do, and let him build his own team.

We've had far too many managerial changes over the last 5 years. We need stability and to have some consistency at the club. We don't need to be panicking and changing managers every few months when it's not going our way.

Capt Mainwaring
07-05-2011, 07:21 PM
I have grave doubts about CC, but he needs at least another transfer window to pull things round.

Sir Alex couldn't make a team out of the lazy, unprofessional, useless , non triers that make up the majority of the current squad ( and yes i accept that CC has signed some of them - hence my grave doubts).

Too many of the current squad are a disgrace to the jersey.

Ed De Gramo
07-05-2011, 07:21 PM
the guy is no manager. Lets get a proper person in. CC has now proved he's no use now. Unless you enjoy being a laughing stock???

:troll:

:bitchy:

bighairyfaeleith
07-05-2011, 07:25 PM
:troll:

:bitchy:

what he said:agree:

Tricla
07-05-2011, 07:26 PM
Aye let's dump the guy before he's had a chance.

We wanted him to keep us up and he delivered.

I believe he'll do well if given time and support.

Why do we always have to be emptying managers.

As Matty says, stability is required.

eastmainsmsh
07-05-2011, 07:28 PM
Starting to think the same

Watching the game there we were outclassed in the middle.. hamilton dragged our players out of position with there passing ..Who is our playmaker coz Miller was terrible we have no leader in defence ...Palsson and miller no communication .. Vaz Te is only one willing to take people on and have a pop at goal ..Really dire no shape to our play .

Billy Reid is positive and can motivate and bring out best in young players Perhaps we shouldve went down that route

matty_f
07-05-2011, 07:31 PM
Starting to think the same

Watching the game there we were outclassed in the middle.. hamilton dragged our players out of position with there passing ..Who is our playmaker coz Miller was terrible we have no leader in defence ...Palsson and miller no communication .. Vaz Te is only one willing to take people on and have a pop at goal ..Really dire no shape to our play .

Billy Reid is positive and can motivate and bring out best in young players Perhaps we shouldve went down that route

This is the same Billy Reid that's won once in a year at home, and is about to get relegated? :confused:

Next we'll be hearing about how we should have gone for Craig Brown.:rolleyes:

Bishop Hibee
07-05-2011, 07:40 PM
This is the same Billy Reid that's won once in a year at home, and is about to get relegated? :confused:

Next we'll be hearing about how we should have gone for Craig Brown.:rolleyes:

:top marks When Yogi was righty sacked I would have gone for Pa' Broon but after an initial surge, the sheep have been mince. Quality of players is the key. The Dons and ourselves have not got quality players. I don't believe there is 1 player in their squad who would improve us.

CC brought in players who have kept us up and I'd thank him for that. He'll be judged on players he brings in over the summer and our performances thereafter.

Arch Stanton
07-05-2011, 07:48 PM
You're being naive Matt.
The testimonials from a massive percentage of his previous club's must carry some credence ..Never mind what you yourself can see with your own eyes.He's not the man.

Smashing post - and not just for the apostrophe either - that just adds a certain something special.

From what you say CC has been outvoted as surely as AV and Scottish Labour - shame really, since we've been looking like a proper football team since he came.

Brizo
07-05-2011, 07:53 PM
We like the majority of SPL clubs not only operate in the bargain basement for players but in the bargain basement for managers. Thats no disrespect to CC or his predecessors , its just the facts. Sometimes we get lucky with bargain basement players signings and sometimes we get lucky with bargain basement managerial appointments. Some of the suggestions on here for who'd come in after Yogi were laughable , punters coming on with lists of ex EPL and Championship managers , when these guys wouldnt get out of bed for an SPL managers salary or transfer budget.

Any replacement for CC would likely either be an unproven at SPL level lower league manager , a coach stepping up to try his hand at management or someone off the SPL managerial merry go round.All of them a gamble. For that reason and also because I think every manager deserves at least a full season in the post I would keep CC for next season. Its not a vote of confidence more a stay of execution.

IberianHibernian
07-05-2011, 07:54 PM
Thought that Yogi should have been given more time but now we have CC we have to back him - for a number of reasons we can`t afford to keep changing manager ( not least compensation we keek having to pay ) . Not in favour of changing managers during the season and sure board have no thoughts of doing so now so we have to back CC next season . Squad is very weak and we are struggling against all SPL teams because we are not better than them as simple as that . Haven`t seen anything from new signings to suggest they`ll help us to be much better next season but don`t mean that as a criticism of CC ( like his predecessors he`s very limited - in Scotland we`re limited to signing players like Scott who would have struggled to make our reserve team only 3 or 4 years ago and English clubs pay even mediocre players so much it`s hard for us to sign well there ) . A more flamboyant manager ( whether better or not ) would probably make more press headlines and increase interest in club which would mean more season ticket sales but Petrie has obviously decided to start from scratch and support CC with a mediocre squad and hopefully build up .

blairwallace
07-05-2011, 08:00 PM
so far calderwood has made great signings like thornhill, palsson, scott and towell who are all fairly young and have time to improve more.He has seen the potential in booth and given him a long run of games which has even brought interest from over seas. Not to mention getting rid of the wage thieves of rankin, hogg, thicot, nish ect.

i think during the summer he'll be able to completely rebuild the team and if his quality of signings keep up then we should have a good team on the park next season and seasons to come

Badge
07-05-2011, 08:11 PM
You're being naive Matt.
The testimonials from a massive percentage of his previous club's must carry some credence ..Never mind what you yourself can see with your own eyes.He's not the man.
Unfortunately I think you're right. I have real doubts about CC and think we will be in real trouble again next season if he is still in charge.

hibs0666
07-05-2011, 08:22 PM
You're being naive Matt.
The testimonials from a massive percentage of his previous club's must carry some credence ..Never mind what you yourself can see with your own eyes.He's not the man.

Top Trolling. :agree:

blackpoolhibs
07-05-2011, 08:30 PM
HAHA Its started already, and to think he has never pored any kind of alcoholic drink over anyone as far as i know?:greengrin

ronaldo7
07-05-2011, 08:41 PM
HAHA Its started already, and to think he has never pored any kind of alcoholic drink over anyone as far as i know?:greengrin

But he poured some oil on his Rocket the other night.

The guy knows what he has to do guys..................GIVE HIM A CHANCE FFS!

NORTHERNHIBBY
07-05-2011, 08:45 PM
Petrie has decided that CC is the man to take us forward. I think that this is fairly clear. What else is patently obvious, is that it won't be with dross we have had to watch this season. There is no credibility in a situation where you bring in a good workman, but don't give him the tools. The close season will see him getting the toolbox he wants, and then no excuses.

blackpoolhibs
07-05-2011, 08:46 PM
But he poured some oil on his Rocket the other night.

The guy knows what he has to do guys..................GIVE HIM A CHANCE FFS!

Yip he needs to be given a chance, and yes he knows what he has to do, we all can see that ronny. Is he up to the task though, maybe he should be sacked, we hung on to the last one too long, he should have gone before he took us from 3rd to 10th. :wink:

ronaldo7
07-05-2011, 08:50 PM
Yip he needs to be given a chance, and yes he knows what he has to do, we all can see that ronny. Is he up to the task though, maybe he should be sacked, we hung on to the last one too long, he should have gone before he took us from 3rd to 10th. :wink:

So he's got 6 months in your eyes then G.

I said the team that Yogi put out in Mariboobs was wrong:greengrin

stoneyburn hibs
07-05-2011, 08:59 PM
here we go again, i dont know if cc is the answer, but we have to give him a chance, at least another season, going from manager to manager will be a detriment to the club, we will just stumble each season as a club with managers coming and going , as we have done in recent seasons, yes we want/should have been better this term , but the manager has to be given a chance longterm.

The Green Goblin
07-05-2011, 09:00 PM
We really are a right hysterical bunch at times.

Lose a few games at a stage of the season where we have nothing to play for (but managed to fairly convincingly avoid the very real threat of relegation, not that that seems to matter) ...and...what shall we do?

Yes, let`s sack yet another manager.

It seems to be the answer every time the boat rocks slightly at Hibs, doesn`t it? So, who would we bring in to replace CC, (at least until he loses a few games and has to go?)

Sometimes, I think we as a group of fans get exactly what we deserve.

GG

blackpoolhibs
07-05-2011, 09:10 PM
So he's got 6 months in your eyes then G.

I said the team that Yogi put out in Mariboobs was wrong:greengrin

Just playing devils advocate pal. :wink: There were some wanting the previous man out after the same time, and the record then was a wee bit better than we see at the moment.

How long should a new man get these days? :confused:

weonlywon6-2
07-05-2011, 09:16 PM
:top marks When Yogi was righty sacked I would have gone for Pa' Broon but after an initial surge, the sheep have been mince. Quality of players is the key. The Dons and ourselves have not got quality players. I don't believe there is 1 player in their squad who would improve us.

CC brought in players who have kept us up and I'd thank him for that. He'll be judged on players he brings in over the summer and our performances thereafter.

for me this is the big thing.the board really need to back him and virtually transform the complete team cause we are terrible.being a hibby for the last few years has been dire.

Ray_
07-05-2011, 09:17 PM
I think he's proved he's no better than we had but I think we need to stick with him and let him do what he needs to do now.

What, you saying your pal got it wrong yet again!

moredun
07-05-2011, 09:20 PM
Just playing devils advocate pal. :wink: There were some wanting the previous man out after the same time, and the record then was a wee bit better than we see at the moment.

How long should a new man get these days? :confused:

I think it is more of a case of how little time does a new man get these days:rolleyes:

blackpoolhibs
07-05-2011, 09:23 PM
What, you saying your pal got it wrong yet again!

If Petrie has got this appointment wrong, then we have to ask if he's the right man to appoint managers?

Every manager gets backed, we spend more than most, they just happen to spend it on dross.

blackpoolhibs
07-05-2011, 09:24 PM
I think it is more of a case of how little time does a new man get these days:rolleyes:

Should yogi have got longer?

ronaldo7
07-05-2011, 09:48 PM
Just playing devils advocate pal. :wink: There were some wanting the previous man out after the same time, and the record then was a wee bit better than we see at the moment.

How long should a new man get these days? :confused:

Until he gets it right and skelps that wee fud Locke into next year:greengrin

darwenhibby
07-05-2011, 10:17 PM
Should yogi have got longer?

Maybes Aye Maybes Naw

We should decide now whether to back Claderwood or not in the next transfer market or make a move for Jefferies now that he is allegedlly available.

Stick with CC roll on next week, roll on next season

Sodje_18
07-05-2011, 10:32 PM
Aye thats what to do, get rid of the guy who got us out of a relegation battle :rolleyes:

:flag::cgwa:flag:

moredun
07-05-2011, 10:33 PM
Should yogi have got longer?

Did Yogi not get 3 transfer windows and a team clearly going backwards, that was quite long enough.

Was thinking more Mixu, but even then i can't exactly remember how long he got, 8 months?

Forza Fred
07-05-2011, 10:39 PM
I think everybody has already written off THIS season, and although we (including me) may have a moan about results during that season, there is a grudging understanding with most that absolutey dire results wlilbeb tolerated until this season finally ends.

Even the mightiest of CC defenders though, will concede that come next season its a different story.

Explaining it away as part of a 'transition period 'wont wash - continued performances/results like we have seenl (a) ensure the stands are empty and (b) put us in relegation trouble.

I have no probs with CC - provided he steps up to the mark next season.

IWasThere2016
07-05-2011, 11:03 PM
You're being naive Matt.
The testimonials from a massive percentage of his previous club's must carry some credence ..Never mind what you yourself can see with your own eyes.He's not the man.

We didnae listen to Falkirk fans right enough - but then I recall Killie fans being disappointed that we nabbed Blobby!

The Falcon
08-05-2011, 07:30 AM
This is the same Billy Reid that's won once in a year at home, and is about to get relegated? :confused:

Next we'll be hearing about how we should have gone for Craig Brown.:rolleyes:


Aye! At leasy Craig Brown (Archie Knox) "know what they're doing".

Got an instant response when they joined Aberdeen (and CC didnt) which only proves this!

Oh wait.........:greengrin

TornadoHibby
08-05-2011, 10:28 AM
You're being naive Matt.
The testimonials from a massive percentage of his previous club's must carry some credence ..Never mind what you yourself can see with your own eyes.He's not the man.

Here you go again! :confused:

Last time you posted "journalistsic evidence" to "support" your case, it was clear to anyone, with even a modest modicum of grey matter, that you had provided the exact tone of the responses that you were looking for within the question you posed to those Forest fans who happened accross the relevant thread on their MB. :agree:

Even with that "help", their responses did not support your case at all except to drop serious hints to Hibs fans as to what you are trying to achieve even if the motive remains currently invisible! :rolleyes:

Kaiser1962
08-05-2011, 01:31 PM
I'm still waiting on the "journalistic evidence" detailing how much profit STF has already made from Hibs. This was from December :rolleyes:



Here you go again! :confused:

Last time you posted "journalistsic evidence" to "support" your case, it was clear to anyone, with even a modest modicum of grey matter, that you had provided the exact tone of the responses that you were looking for within the question you posed to those Forest fans who happened accross the relevant thread on their MB. :agree:

Even with that "help", their responses did not support your case at all except to drop serious hints to Hibs fans as to what you are trying to achieve even if the motive remains currently invisible! :rolleyes:

marinello59
08-05-2011, 02:11 PM
I'm a genius. According to a MENSA test I did a few years ago.. Albeit in the lower part of that " level"....:greengrin

You have to admire your modesty, only claiming low level genius. :greengrin

matty_f
08-05-2011, 02:19 PM
You have to admire your modesty, only claiming low level genius. :greengrin

I'm not the best at knowing what the politically correct term is for this, so apologies in advance as I'm really not trying to be offensive, but I think claiming to be a low level genius is just a nice way of saying he's a high level ******.:greengrin

EasterRoad4Ever
08-05-2011, 02:24 PM
If Petrie has got this appointment wrong, then we have to ask if he's the right man to appoint managers?

Every manager gets backed, we spend more than most, they just happen to spend it on dross.

We're way past that point. Petrie's record of appointing managers (and supporting them) has been as poor to say the least. The ONLY reason Petrie is still in his job is because he's done a good job on the financial front and is STF's right hand man. As far the footballing side is concerned, history will show Petrie's tenure as CE to be a missed opportunity - Hibs have greatly underachieved. Petrie should have stepped down when Hughes was fired. IMHO he has been too long in his position and should have done the decent thing some time ago. If we have to add CC to the latest string of expensive failures, then Petrie should get pushed if he doesn't want to jump.

marinello59
08-05-2011, 02:39 PM
A good pal of mine was so intensively and accurately into the journalistic investigation that he was taken off the case as Farmer was threatening to sue..I've been through this before :yawn:

Surely Farmer could only sue if what was being alleged was untrue. :confused:

IWasThere2016
08-05-2011, 03:45 PM
Not in this case IMO .. He frightened the then editor of the Scotsman into pulling the story. Google it...Any combination of Simon Pia/Farmer /Scotsman/Story used to bring it up:agree:

Don't know if this will work:

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Scotia+Nostra%3A+BAD+TASTE+OF+A+SCOTSMAN+CULL.-a0138337429

IWasThere2016
08-05-2011, 03:46 PM
Surely Farmer could only sue if what was being alleged was untrue. :confused:

Or why not let it go to print and then trash it once and for all???

marinello59
08-05-2011, 04:01 PM
I have nothing but admiration for myself:greengrin

More than one person on here has suggested you are partial to a bit of self loving. :greengrin


Not in this case IMO .. He frightened the then editor of the Scotsman into pulling the story. Google it...Any combination of Simon Pia/Farmer /Scotsman/Story used to bring it up:agree:

I'll do that.

Peevemor
08-05-2011, 04:06 PM
Don't know if this will work:

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Scotia+Nostra%3A+BAD+TASTE+OF+A+SCOTSMAN+CULL.-a0138337429


None of the stories eventually ran because McGurk allegedly "bottled it" fearing reprisals from the tycoon. Pia's articles were published instead in The Scotsman by then-editor Alan Ruddock (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/ruddock) who took a more fearless attitude. rud·dock
n. Chiefly British
An Old World robin (Erithacus rubecula) having olive-brown upper plumage and a conspicuous orange breast.
..... Click the link for more information.

They were so scandalous that I don't remember a thing about them.

Peevemor
08-05-2011, 04:42 PM
They weren't the full story.

Ah right .... :wink: :wink:

:rolleyes:

Arch Stanton
08-05-2011, 04:43 PM
They weren't the full story.

That's not a lot of use - forget saying what to Google, just give us a link.

Aldo
08-05-2011, 05:12 PM
FFS the we want rid of CC thread. Hes not good enough thread.
do we honestly think he has been given ample time?

Where were all these threads when we went ...wot 8 unbeaten.
I will judge the guy in about a years time when he has his own team in place.
so the doom and gloomers get a grip.

Kaiser1962
08-05-2011, 05:55 PM
I don't have a link.You'll have to do your own digging.

Did that. They semed to want Brian Kennedy? Is that right? Nothing concrete at all in anything else. All what if's and supposition.

Arch Stanton
08-05-2011, 05:57 PM
I don't have a link.You'll have to do your own digging.

Are you trying to start a cult?

Kaiser1962
08-05-2011, 06:03 PM
I'm not the best at knowing what the politically correct term is for this, so apologies in advance as I'm really not trying to be offensive, but I think claiming to be a low level genius is just a nice way of saying he's a high level ******.:greengrin


****** is not a term in use now Matty. Now if you'd suggested he had a learning disability, or failing that a learing difficulty, I would maybe have gone for it. :greengrin

As for the Mensa entry was it the supervised test you took? As the minimum accepted score on the Stanford-Binet is 132, while for the Cattell it is 148. Genius is usually accepted as 140 or above under Terman.

son of haggart
08-05-2011, 06:48 PM
****** is not a term in use now Matty. Now if you'd suggested he had a learning disability, or failing that a learing difficulty, I would maybe have gone for it. :greengrin

As for the Mensa entry was it the supervised test you took? As the minimum accepted score on the Stanford-Binet is 132, while for the Cattell it is 148. Genius is usually accepted as 140 or above under Terman.

Genius is used too liberally to describe mental ability measured through verbal and non-verbal reasoning tests.

Lateral thinking would be a better measure of real genius, IMO.

matty_f
08-05-2011, 06:52 PM
Genius is used too liberally to describe mental ability measured through verbal and non-verbal reasoning tests.

Lateral thinking would be a better measure of real genius, IMO.

Nah, genius should be reserved for sarcastic use only. Like if you see someone who's managed to wedge a cow in a doorway. That person should be labelled a genius.

Just my opinion (which is, by my own definiton, genius).:greengrin

ancient hibee
08-05-2011, 07:39 PM
Nah, genius should be reserved for sarcastic use only. Like if you see someone who's managed to wedge a cow in a doorway. That person should be labelled a genius.

Just my opinion (which is, by my own definiton, genius).:greengrin
Surely it depends on whether the cow is entering or leaving?

matty_f
08-05-2011, 07:46 PM
Surely it depends on whether the cow is entering or leaving?

That's a good point. I should have considered that, to be fair.:agree:

HibbyAndy
08-05-2011, 07:46 PM
Surely it depends on whether the cow is entering or leaving?

Normally when im pished i enter the Cow and leave first thing in the morning when i realise what ive done.

ancient hibee
08-05-2011, 07:48 PM
Normally when im pished i enter the Cow and leave first thing in the morning when i realise what ive done.
Always make sure it's a cow not a bull.You don't want to give them hang ups.

JACK_HFC
08-05-2011, 07:51 PM
the guy is no manager. Lets get a proper person in. CC has now proved he's no use now. Unless you enjoy being a laughing stock???


Spot On!
He's not a manager, not much left to play for but we should be putting 3 or 4 past these teams! Time to get it sorted...
:taxi

matty_f
08-05-2011, 08:34 PM
I'm a genius then .... :greengrin ....dunno if that's a good thing or not..:greengrin.

It's also measured using the MAKA test, and I think we all know how you fared on that one!:greengrin

son of haggart
08-05-2011, 08:45 PM
I'm a genius then .... :greengrin ....dunno if that's a good thing or not..:greengrin.

As a Hibs fan you are therefore a 'tortured genius'

My form of genius comes without the tortured prefix

paulhfc88
08-05-2011, 08:46 PM
Calderwood has saved us from the drop, brung in players who have improved the team, got rid of the deadwood we had? Wasnt this what we all wanted?

We all want us to win games, but does winning in the bottom 6 really matter? we have nothing to play for, so calderwood is basically using these 5 games as friendlies, experimenting for next year, playing people in different positions, giving them different roles.

The season is starting 2/3 weeks earlier than usual, so how much time does that give you for pre-season friendlies, that will benefit the current team and new signing.

I have faith in calderwood and the signings he makes will only improve the club further1 GGTTH

sesoim
08-05-2011, 09:57 PM
Better idea would be to actually let him do the rebuilding job he was brought in to do, and let him build his own team.

We've had far too many managerial changes over the last 5 years. We need stability and to have some consistency at the club. We don't need to be panicking and changing managers every few months when it's not going our way.



But He is the WRONG appointment. Again. Shame on Petrie for lumbering us again. CC will sign 7 or 8 players in the summer, we'll be bottom three in September and eventually Petrie will have to make another change. And if he appoints the wrong guy (again), we'll have another wasted season on our hands, more comings and goings and eventually we'll end up in the First Division.

....sorry, the depression's setting in again. I'll just have to kid on we've appointed Guus Hiddinck.

sesoim
08-05-2011, 10:18 PM
Just playing devils advocate pal. :wink: There were some wanting the previous man out after the same time, and the record then was a wee bit better than we see at the moment.

How long should a new man get these days? :confused:



If Petrie was capable of appointing a decent manager, we wouldn't be discussing how long he needs.

sesoim
08-05-2011, 10:21 PM
I think it is more of a case of how little time does a new man get these days:rolleyes:


It depends how rubbish he is at his job.

sesoim
08-05-2011, 10:24 PM
Aye let's dump the guy before he's had a chance.

We wanted him to keep us up and he delivered.

I believe he'll do well if given time and support.

Why do we always have to be emptying managers.

As Matty says, stability is required.


I think, in October, we would have been hoping for a bit more than survival. The bad run we went on under CC turned it into a relegation battle. So really, CC saved us from a position he put us in.

BEEJ
08-05-2011, 10:27 PM
But He is the WRONG appointment. Again.

....sorry, the depression's setting in again. I'll just have to kid on we've appointed Guus Hiddinck.
Based on what evidence?

His past record? You don't like his persona? What? :confused:

R'Albin
08-05-2011, 10:28 PM
But He is the WRONG appointment. Again. Shame on Petrie for lumbering us again. CC will sign 7 or 8 players in the summer, we'll be bottom three in September and eventually Petrie will have to make another change. And if he appoints the wrong guy (again), we'll have another wasted season on our hands, more comings and goings and eventually we'll end up in the First Division.

....sorry, the depression's setting in again. I'll just have to kid on we've appointed Guus Hiddinck.

Cheer up a bit min:greengrin

seanshow
08-05-2011, 11:43 PM
The players put in the effort when they want to winning five on the bounce, and then when safe from relegation go on to lose to the same teams because they can't be arsed!
We've seen it all before.....I don't think CC can be blamed for that.

Viva_Palmeiras
09-05-2011, 05:47 AM
The players put in the effort when they want to winning five on the bounce, and then when safe from relegation go on to lose to the same teams because they can't be arsed!
We've seen it all before.....I don't think CC can be blamed for that.

Makes you wonder whether there was an additional financial incentive for the players to stay up .....

blackpoolhibs
09-05-2011, 09:49 AM
The players put in the effort when they want to winning five on the bounce, and then when safe from relegation go on to lose to the same teams because they can't be arsed!
We've seen it all before.....I don't think CC can be blamed for that.

Was he not brought in to change this attitude, or was he just brought in to save us from relegation?

Hibernia Na Eir
09-05-2011, 09:56 AM
Spot On!
He's not a manager, not much left to play for but we should be putting 3 or 4 past these teams! Time to get it sorted...
:taxi

Totally mate.

Hibs, one of Scotland's "Top Teams"(?) SHOULD be walking into top slot in the SPL bottom 6 cut. Its shambolic and disgraceful that we are not.

Watching Hibs lately has become nothing short of awful, in every department. A better team would really annihilate us on any given Saturday right now. I really worry for 2011/12. I honestly do.

CC's post match comments do nothing to inspire me or give us any hint that things might change.

Unless there are huge changes this summer, its bottom 6 once more next season :agree:

Its not all CC's fault may i add. The board have to take blame.

Oh dear.

Sevenil73
09-05-2011, 10:14 AM
Give CC the pre season then see what were like in august thats when and the only sure way to judge

The Gorf
09-05-2011, 10:39 AM
Aye let's dump the guy before he's had a chance.

We wanted him to keep us up and he delivered.

I believe he'll do well if given time and support.

Why do we always have to be emptying managers.

As Matty says, stability is required.

I agree. The main thing is that we are still in the SPL. I think half the issue is that CC is has a quiet persona compared to Yogi. CC doesn't say much but thinks a lot whereas Yogi (who I liked) was just a wee bit too much outspoken.
Point is that we wait and see if CC gets the cash backing of the Board. That's the main issue. No cash no new players. No new players then we have to put up with what we've got which ain't a lot .I still feel we should and could have used some of the younger players who have got passion for the jersey. Passion is something that has been sadly lacking thiese past few months, especially from the players who are no longer signing new contracts. Leave CC be until the start and see what he has to play with for the new season.
GGTTH:flag:

silverhibee
09-05-2011, 11:13 AM
But He is the WRONG appointment. Again. Shame on Petrie for lumbering us again. CC will sign 7 or 8 players in the summer, we'll be bottom three in September and eventually Petrie will have to make another change. And if he appoints the wrong guy (again), we'll have another wasted season on our hands, more comings and goings and eventually we'll end up in the First Division.

....sorry, the depression's setting in again. I'll just have to kid on we've appointed Guus Hiddinck.

No chance that will happen, 3 players at most will be brought in this summer.

If it doesn't work out for CC, (hope it does) and he has to be removed as the manager, then surley this time round Mr Petrie has to step down as well, he cant be trusted to pick a manager.

And can anyone tell me what Stokes transfer was used for, did it go towards the new east stand.?

blackpoolhibs
09-05-2011, 11:28 AM
No chance that will happen, 3 players at most will be brought in this summer.

If it doesn't work out for CC, (hope it does) and he has to be removed as the manager, then surley this time round Mr Petrie has to step down as well, he cant be trusted to pick a manager.

And can anyone tell me what Stokes transfer was used for, did it go towards the new east stand.?

:agree: Every new manager gets backed, we spend more than most. The manager has to be the right one, those appointing him must get it right.

3pm
09-05-2011, 11:42 AM
No chance that will happen, 3 players at most will be brought in this summer.

If it doesn't work out for CC, (hope it does) and he has to be removed as the manager, then surley this time round Mr Petrie has to step down as well, he cant be trusted to pick a manager.
And can anyone tell me what Stokes transfer was used for, did it go towards the new east stand.?

It's not just Rod Petrie, I think we need an overhaul of the club from top to bottom - the mentality has to change for me, is it professional enough? We just seem to accept what's served up far too often and just plaud on. We need people in there with a fresh outlook on things in my view.

We have a fantastic framework in place but we need more. We need the mentality to go with it too.

Far from being a 'Petrie GTF' post as I am well aware that the grass isn't always greener - and I'd hate to end up with the lunatic that Hearts have ended up with. However, we need more.

And if we only make 3 signings, then deary me. Make that about 7-9 signings and then we might do something.

Albion Hibs
09-05-2011, 11:59 AM
How Calderwood can be deemed as not the man at this stage in the game in beyond me. He came in when we were rancid and took over managing a team that was subject to constant relegation threads on here. During the transfer window he managed to scrape around to get players in January that he thought would keep us up. Whether they did, or there arrival helped the team mentally in another question, but we went on a run good enough to get away from that bottom of the league battle.

I have every confidence that he has seen the ability/mental attitude of the current players over the past few games and that coupled with the rest of the knowledge will allow him to strengthen us over the summer months.

As a fan base we need to get away from this constant, constant, sack, replace, get a new one chat.

JimBHibees
09-05-2011, 12:14 PM
Bottom line is when CC took over Hibs were in freefall. When he was able to bring a few players in we went on a very good unbeaten run which saved us from a relegation battle. The general malaise will stay until all the players leaving have left and he has brought more of his own choices in. The recent games have been poor no doubt about that however the time to judge is probably Xmas when he has brought in a few, punted out who he doesnt want and had a preseason to get the team fit both physically and mentally. Talk of him not being the man and getting rid to me comes from closet yams or people who have no idea about the game. Things take time to change the culture.

superfurryhibby
09-05-2011, 12:19 PM
They weren't the full story.

Many Hibs fans have chosen to "forget" the stories which were run in The Scotsman and in Scotland on Sunday. Simon Pia was the journalist and Glen Ross, a well kent Hibee face, featured heavilly. Some of the stuff printed was very bold and I do believe that litigation was avoided because there were some very damaging documents available to the papers in question, these were alleged to have deterred STF. I have heard stories that the return of the staduium to it's rightful owners may have been prompted by Pia's "research"

As for Calderwood, his record is very poor overall. The team showed some signs of becoming a team, but that lasted around two months. Tactics and signings have had mixed results and I am surprised that anyone thinks that Scott and Thornhill have added to the side.

Whilst overall unimpressed by CC, I feel he should be given another transfer window and let's see where we are by Christmas

Cropley10
09-05-2011, 12:40 PM
As a manager you either get sacked or leave for bigger/better things, typically.

The last manager who did that at Hibs was Mowbray.

Calderwood has a job to do and will need to get on and do that.

Constantly blaming the manager and asking for a new one is madness. Although I recognise that some people like to provoke the situation. However if you stop and think, we simply cannot go on hiring and firing managers; we're in the mess we're in because we've done precisely that thing...:rolleyes:

silverhibee
09-05-2011, 12:44 PM
:agree: Every new manager gets backed, we spend more than most. The manager has to be the right one, those appointing him must get it right.

:agree:

But the bit in bold, they dont often get it right do they, only time will tell if the board have got it right with the appointment with CC, my biggest disapointment has been some of the players he has brought in tried for a time then seemed to give up when wee were safe from being relagated, these players should be leading the team on to better performance's, but its not happened.
I get the impression that alot of Hibs fans seem to think that Hibs have plenty money to spend on players because wee have and will get rid of a number of players before the end of the season, i dont think it will work like that, i will be surprised if CC can bring in a quality player like the last two managers did with Riordan Bamba Stokes and Miller, i think they days are over, Hibs cant afford it anymore.
Without any quality being added to this squad over the summer, then i think wee both know what will be the outcome for next season, of course i will be there next season, but cant say i am looking forward to it.

Speedway
09-05-2011, 12:44 PM
It's not just Rod Petrie, I think we need an overhaul of the club from top to bottom - the mentality has to change for me, is it professional enough? We just seem to accept what's served up far too often and just plaud on. We need people in there with a fresh outlook on things in my view.

We have a fantastic framework in place but we need more. We need the mentality to go with it too.

Far from being a 'Petrie GTF' post as I am well aware that the grass isn't always greener - and I'd hate to end up with the lunatic that Hearts have ended up with. However, we need more.

And if we only make 3 signings, then deary me. Make that about 7-9 signings and then we might do something.

The online community of fans are largely loser minded. When we had relative success under Mowbray, it was 'why can't a defender sort out the comedy defending' That was the tone of discussions.

When 4th with Yogi, the focus was purely on the February slide and not our league position.

Under Williamson, steadying the ship was forgotten as soon as it was completed. Quality of football wasn't good enough.

It will never be good enough, there is no such thing as good enough. Even the fans of successful clubs find the smallest things to complain about. Otherwise there's nothing to discuss.

Sadly, successful clubs have resources and we don't so we'll carry on being losers because its ingrained in the psyche 'Hibs have always let me down, typical Hibs etc'

So it doesn't matter if it's Calderwood, Deadwood or Victoria Wood - He/she/they are not good enough until they are sacked or are proven to be good enough at which point a new level will be set which they do not reach and will be 'not good enough'

We need 'not good enough'

Speedway
09-05-2011, 01:13 PM
You're right.:agree:And if you take it forwards a bit you'd have to wonder why we spend money on something that is highly unlikely to give us what we really dream of?

To earn the right to moan about it whilst maintaining the vital 'I go to the games' ante.

Andy74
09-05-2011, 04:38 PM
I was happy when Hughes was appointed even though the testimonials from Falkirk fans weren't good. Turns out they were right.I was undecided about Calderwood.The testimonials from Forest fans aren't good and I've seen nothing to suggest that they'll be proved wrong.We'll just have waste another year or so of our lives until we can try and get it right next time.OR,we can bin him now!

Or we can stop turning on people when they go through bad runs, even long ones, and let them work on sorting it out and turning it round.

This chop and change culture in football has never produced anything other than short trm uplifts at best, you rarely change the whole direction of a club for too long.

Once you change manager then the players all change, the whole way the club works changea and then you just ask for it all to happen again.

matty_f
09-05-2011, 05:57 PM
Or we can stop turning on people when they go through bad runs, even long ones, and let them work on sorting it out and turning it round.

This chop and change culture in football has never produced anything other than short trm uplifts at best, you rarely change the whole direction of a club for too long.

Once you change manager then the players all change, the whole way the club works changea and then you just ask for it all to happen again.

Spot on. We're crying out for consistency and to have a manager that builds a team over a period of time, where we have players getting an affinity with the club that they play for etc.

Barney McGrew
09-05-2011, 06:05 PM
No chance that will happen, 3 players at most will be brought in this summer.

That would leave us with a first team squad of 16.

There will be more than three come in.

BEEJ
09-05-2011, 06:13 PM
That would leave us with a first team squad of 16.

There will be more than three come in.
There are more than 13 in the current first team squad who are under contract to be at ER next season.

Barney McGrew
09-05-2011, 06:20 PM
There are more than 13 in the current first team squad who are under contract to be at ER next season.

If you count Scott Taggart and Lewis Horner, yes.

BEEJ
09-05-2011, 06:24 PM
If you count Scott Taggart and Lewis Horner, yes.
And they are on professional contracts with the club, listed on the official site as members of the first team squad.

Should they not be included?

Barney McGrew
09-05-2011, 06:29 PM
And they are on professional contracts with the club, listed on the official site as members of the first team squad.

Should they not be included?

I stand corrected :wink:

ancient hibee
09-05-2011, 06:29 PM
I don't know what supporters of other clubs are like-I never look at their websites but Hibs supporters have always been too quick to criticise.Events this week set me thinking back fifty odd years to when Eddie Turnbull was regularly booed at Easter Road as he slowed up.The same year he was picked by journalists for the team of the tournament at the 1958 World Cup.Only scored 200 goals for Hibs-obviously not Hibs class.

BEEJ
09-05-2011, 06:35 PM
I stand corrected :wink:
OK. :aok:

I was wondering if / hoping that you had come across another definition of 'first team squad' which would have put CC's recent comments of 'around 20' in a different context.

Barney McGrew
09-05-2011, 06:58 PM
OK. :aok:

I was wondering if / hoping that you had come across another definition of 'first team squad' which would have put CC's recent comments of 'around 20' in a different context.

The impression I got was that it would be a first team squad of around twenty, with some youngsters on top of that in the hope they'd 'step up to the plate' as it were if required.

Whether the likes of Taggart, Horner and even Smith would fall into that category, or as 'true' first team squad members I don't know :dunno:

The Falcon
09-05-2011, 08:10 PM
Many Hibs fans have chosen to "forget" the stories which were run in The Scotsman and in Scotland on Sunday. Simon Pia was the journalist and Glen Ross, a well kent Hibee face, featured heavilly. Some of the stuff printed was very bold and I do believe that litigation was avoided because there were some very damaging documents available to the papers in question, these were alleged to have deterred STF. I have heard stories that the return of the staduium to it's rightful owners may have been prompted by Pia's "research"

As for Calderwood, his record is very poor overall. The team showed some signs of becoming a team, but that lasted around two months. Tactics and signings have had mixed results and I am surprised that anyone thinks that Scott and Thornhill have added to the side.

Whilst overall unimpressed by CC, I feel he should be given another transfer window and let's see where we are by Christmas

Eh? The stadium was owned by a company owned lock stock by Tom Farmer and it was transferred to another company owned lock stock by Tom Farmer?

What a fiddle that was. :rolleyes:

If there was so much easy money to be made why was there not a queue to buy it?

I would really be grateful if somebody could publish this evidence of shady goings on? Or report it to either the Police or the stock exchange?

Arch Stanton
09-05-2011, 08:30 PM
I was happy when Hughes was appointed even though the testimonials from Falkirk fans weren't good. Turns out they were right.I was undecided about Calderwood.The testimonials from Forest fans aren't good and I've seen nothing to suggest that they'll be proved wrong.We'll just have waste another year or so of our lives until we can try and get it right next time.OR,we can bin him now!

OK so "you've" seen nothing to suggest that CC is any good but who exactly is the bunch of fellow cretins you refer to as "we" - or am I happier not knowing?

Alternatively, is binning "YOU" an option? Please say that it is!

IWasThere2016
09-05-2011, 08:34 PM
Crawford will feature next season will he not?

BEEJ
09-05-2011, 09:00 PM
Crawford will feature next season will he not?
:agree: He's under contract as a first team squad member next season.

May be put out on loan again though. :dunno:

HibsMax
09-05-2011, 09:25 PM
I am already regretting making this post and I haven't even started typing yet!

Why, again, are we considering binning a new manager when he has had very little time to turn things around?

It seems that there are a certain group who can only ever be satisfied with an appointment that will take Hibs to the top of the table instantly, something that is obviously improbable.

What is the fascination in hiring and firing managers? Why can't we just give the team some time to settle? Consistency is not something you can achieve by upsetting the apple cart time and time again. Is that so difficult to appreciate?

My own personal thought is that we absolutely have to give CC a full season with this team. Actually, I shouldn't single out CC. I think that any manager we bring in should be given a year to show what he can do.

Results right now are embarrassing, I won't try to win that argument. I think there are a number of reasons for this including the fact that the season is already over, there is nothing to play for. We all know that's not 100% true, the players are professional and as such should continue to play to the best of their abilities. It goes without saying that every single one of us who posts on here is a conscientious worker and wouldn't dream of taking the foot off the gas when there is nothing left to strive for. Perish the thought. LOL. While I would love it if Hibs could finish the season on a high e.g., winning ALL their games after the split, the reality of the situation is that with nothing to play for it's harder to motivate.

So in my opinion we have to give CC the summer to work on the team. We should try and judge his new appointments only after we have seen how they perform in the Hibs setup (as opposed to reaching for our crystal balls and predicting failure across the board as is so popular here). That, to me, give him until Christmas. I'm not saying we should let him go if we're struggling but I do see that as the minimum amount of time he should be given. In my opinion, with just over a year at the helm and two transfer windows to bolster the team, we should have a decent idea of his worth. But I think it's still too early.

Alfred E Newman
09-05-2011, 09:30 PM
I don't know what supporters of other clubs are like-I never look at their websites but Hibs supporters have always been too quick to criticise.Events this week set me thinking back fifty odd years to when Eddie Turnbull was regularly booed at Easter Road as he slowed up.The same year he was picked by journalists for the team of the tournament at the 1958 World Cup.Only scored 200 goals for Hibs-obviously not Hibs class.

"Turnbull must go" was a regular chant in the late 70`s as well.:agree:

matty_f
09-05-2011, 11:34 PM
I am already regretting making this post and I haven't even started typing yet!

Why, again, are we considering binning a new manager when he has had very little time to turn things around?

It seems that there are a certain group who can only ever be satisfied with an appointment that will take Hibs to the top of the table instantly, something that is obviously improbable.

What is the fascination in hiring and firing managers? Why can't we just give the team some time to settle? Consistency is not something you can achieve by upsetting the apple cart time and time again. Is that so difficult to appreciate?

My own personal thought is that we absolutely have to give CC a full season with this team. Actually, I shouldn't single out CC. I think that any manager we bring in should be given a year to show what he can do.

Results right now are embarrassing, I won't try to win that argument. I think there are a number of reasons for this including the fact that the season is already over, there is nothing to play for. We all know that's not 100% true, the players are professional and as such should continue to play to the best of their abilities. It goes without saying that every single one of us who posts on here is a conscientious worker and wouldn't dream of taking the foot off the gas when there is nothing left to strive for. Perish the thought. LOL. While I would love it if Hibs could finish the season on a high e.g., winning ALL their games after the split, the reality of the situation is that with nothing to play for it's harder to motivate.

So in my opinion we have to give CC the summer to work on the team. We should try and judge his new appointments only after we have seen how they perform in the Hibs setup (as opposed to reaching for our crystal balls and predicting failure across the board as is so popular here). That, to me, give him until Christmas. I'm not saying we should let him go if we're struggling but I do see that as the minimum amount of time he should be given. In my opinion, with just over a year at the helm and two transfer windows to bolster the team, we should have a decent idea of his worth. But I think it's still too early.

Far too sensible!!:greengrin

Kaiser1962
10-05-2011, 07:01 AM
I don't know what supporters of other clubs are like-I never look at their websites but Hibs supporters have always been too quick to criticise.Events this week set me thinking back fifty odd years to when Eddie Turnbull was regularly booed at Easter Road as he slowed up.The same year he was picked by journalists for the team of the tournament at the 1958 World Cup.Only scored 200 goals for Hibs-obviously not Hibs class.

I dont go back quite as far as you AH but I totally agree. My earliest memories of this is Joe Baker (who was injured) getting it tight in the car park at Dunfermline for keeping Arthur Duncan late (he was giving him a lift) and told he was finished. I also recall John Hazel getting it and Eddie Turnbull for picking him. An early Brian Hamilton if you like. Or Rankin or Nish and numerous inbetween.

At times its very sad but probably tells us more about the abusers than the abused.

Phil MaGlass
10-05-2011, 10:34 AM
I dont know why were jumping up and down saying CC is not the man for the job, the guy has inheritted a VERY poorly motivated team of 1st division quality players, he cant turn it around over night, he has just ditched the guys he thinks are not good enuff and brought in a few players he thinks are good enuff.
He is putting in the young guys, giving them a taste of 1st team fitba, saying, you want more of this, apply yourselves and I will give you a chance.
The team is unsettled due to all the changes and comings and goings, give them time to settle and hopefully next season will be a good one.
Get behind the team, the fact that we havent won many recently (although its a pain) doesnt mean we are not improving, it just means CC is looking to build the best team for next season, the only way he can do that is by using the last games of the season, as they are more competitive and of more use than friendlies before the new season.
If we had not went on that unbeaten run recently and were stuck in a relegation battle most or half of the young lads or players would never have been handed the opportunity.
I for one am looking forward with confidence to a new season with new opportunities, new players, a sellout ER, a bloody great atmospheric ER and a decent squad.
THINK POSITIVE AND PROSPER.

Its amazing what an SNP victory can do for you?????

Dashing Bob S
10-05-2011, 11:58 AM
Or we can stop turning on people when they go through bad runs, even long ones, and let them work on sorting it out and turning it round.

This chop and change culture in football has never produced anything other than short trm uplifts at best, you rarely change the whole direction of a club for too long.

Once you change manager then the players all change, the whole way the club works changea and then you just ask for it all to happen again.


The problem is that it doesn't seem to have changed.

matty_f
10-05-2011, 12:29 PM
[/B]

The problem is that it doesn't seem to have changed.

Probably because no one way has been given enough time to settle and become ingrained at the club.

superfurryhibby
10-05-2011, 12:45 PM
Eh? The stadium was owned by a company owned lock stock by Tom Farmer and it was transferred to another company owned lock stock by Tom Farmer?
What a fiddle that was. :rolleyes:

If there was so much easy money to be made why was there not a queue to buy it?

I would really be grateful if somebody could publish this evidence of shady goings on? Or report it to either the Police or the stock exchange?

The difference is rather fundamental. The stadium had been seperated from the football team. This deprived the football team of it's most significant asset, the land it owned and was built on. Do you remember how much the old Car park sold for? I recall that it was in excess of £10,000,000. Not chicken feed by any standards. STF generously agreed to give the football club some of that money back, significantly reducing the vast debt the club had accumulated by building a stadium and throwing money around like confetti during McLeish's era, oh, aye getting relegated no doubt didn't help much either

How do you know who wanted to buy the club after the Duff/Gray fiasco. I believe that there were other parties but the BOS had it's preferred bidder

No one suggested anything illegal except you.

CapitalHibs
10-05-2011, 02:21 PM
I am already regretting making this post and I haven't even started typing yet!

Why, again, are we considering binning a new manager when he has had very little time to turn things around?

It seems that there are a certain group who can only ever be satisfied with an appointment that will take Hibs to the top of the table instantly, something that is obviously improbable.

What is the fascination in hiring and firing managers? Why can't we just give the team some time to settle? Consistency is not something you can achieve by upsetting the apple cart time and time again. Is that so difficult to appreciate?

My own personal thought is that we absolutely have to give CC a full season with this team. Actually, I shouldn't single out CC. I think that any manager we bring in should be given a year to show what he can do.

Results right now are embarrassing, I won't try to win that argument. I think there are a number of reasons for this including the fact that the season is already over, there is nothing to play for. We all know that's not 100% true, the players are professional and as such should continue to play to the best of their abilities. It goes without saying that every single one of us who posts on here is a conscientious worker and wouldn't dream of taking the foot off the gas when there is nothing left to strive for. Perish the thought. LOL. While I would love it if Hibs could finish the season on a high e.g., winning ALL their games after the split, the reality of the situation is that with nothing to play for it's harder to motivate.

So in my opinion we have to give CC the summer to work on the team. We should try and judge his new appointments only after we have seen how they perform in the Hibs setup (as opposed to reaching for our crystal balls and predicting failure across the board as is so popular here). That, to me, give him until Christmas. I'm not saying we should let him go if we're struggling but I do see that as the minimum amount of time he should be given. In my opinion, with just over a year at the helm and two transfer windows to bolster the team, we should have a decent idea of his worth. But I think it's still too early.

Max, you and I know from watching the NFL regularly that the majority of head coaches are at least given a couple of drafts to see if they can improve their team's performance.
I think it took Belicheck a few good years to get the Patriots into the powerful position there are in and to be able to provide for a surplus of draft picks in the future.

HibsMax
10-05-2011, 02:40 PM
Max, you and I know from watching the NFL regularly that the majority of head coaches are at least given a couple of drafts to see if they can improve their team's performance.
I think it took Belicheck a few good years to get the Patriots into the powerful position there are in and to be able to provide for a surplus of draft picks in the future.
I suspect that talking about American sports might not meet with the open arms, but I agree with you. I know it cannot be replicated in Scottish football but I love the draft system. I love how schedules are dictated by how good a team you are. I could have my head waaaaaay up my arse but I truly believe that the NFL is interested in keeping things open. Just look at the past Superbowl champions (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Super_Bowl_champions) and you will see nothing! A couple of periods in time when one team was very strong but that didn't last more than a couple of years. Between 2000 and now, there have been NINE different winners. I know next to nothing about NHL but if I look over a similar time period I see that there have been eight different winners. NBA? five. MLS? eight.

Almost everywhere you look you see a similar pattern, except Scotland....

EasterRoad4Ever
10-05-2011, 03:43 PM
I am already regretting making this post and I haven't even started typing yet!

Why, again, are we considering binning a new manager when he has had very little time to turn things around?

It seems that there are a certain group who can only ever be satisfied with an appointment that will take Hibs to the top of the table instantly, something that is obviously improbable.

What is the fascination in hiring and firing managers? Why can't we just give the team some time to settle? Consistency is not something you can achieve by upsetting the apple cart time and time again. Is that so difficult to appreciate?

My own personal thought is that we absolutely have to give CC a full season with this team. Actually, I shouldn't single out CC. I think that any manager we bring in should be given a year to show what he can do.

Results right now are embarrassing, I won't try to win that argument. I think there are a number of reasons for this including the fact that the season is already over, there is nothing to play for. We all know that's not 100% true, the players are professional and as such should continue to play to the best of their abilities. It goes without saying that every single one of us who posts on here is a conscientious worker and wouldn't dream of taking the foot off the gas when there is nothing left to strive for. Perish the thought. LOL. While I would love it if Hibs could finish the season on a high e.g., winning ALL their games after the split, the reality of the situation is that with nothing to play for it's harder to motivate.

So in my opinion we have to give CC the summer to work on the team. We should try and judge his new appointments only after we have seen how they perform in the Hibs setup (as opposed to reaching for our crystal balls and predicting failure across the board as is so popular here). That, to me, give him until Christmas. I'm not saying we should let him go if we're struggling but I do see that as the minimum amount of time he should be given. In my opinion, with just over a year at the helm and two transfer windows to bolster the team, we should have a decent idea of his worth. But I think it's still too early.

No Hibs fans want managers hired and fired on a regular basis. The reason some get concerned early on - and I am one of them - is that we are looking for SIGNS that the manager knows what he is doing. He drops the obvious players, changes the formation when needed, makes subs when needed, fills the obvious gaps and weaknesses in the side, and talks a good game. CC has struggled to convince me on all these fronts. The reference points are managers who have been successful at ER previously - McLeish and Mowbray were able to do all the above and quickly instilled confidence among fans that they knew what they were doing. With Hughes for instance, no one - not even he - knew why Hibs went on that great run of wins, but when it ran out of steam it was clear that Hughes didn't have a clue what he was doing. His pre/post match interviews were one dimensional and desperate. The only surprise was that he wasn't fired before Oct.

Petrie's ability to appoint good managers is poor, so there is a reasonable expectation that CC is yet another poor appointment - until he proves otherwise. IMHO he has failed so far to do that. As fans we are rightly concerned at the financial cost to the club if poor managers are left to spend and contract crap players. We've just got rid of whole bunch who in reality were never good enough for Hibs and shouldn't have been signed. The quicker you find out crap managers, the better for all concerned. IMHO the process at ER is flawed and wil not improve until Petrie is removed from the decision-making process.

The Falcon
10-05-2011, 03:59 PM
The difference is rather fundamental. The stadium had been seperated from the football team. This deprived the football team of it's most significant asset, the land it owned and was built on. Do you remember how much the old Car park sold for? I recall that it was in excess of £10,000,000. Not chicken feed by any standards. STF generously agreed to give the football club some of that money back, significantly reducing the vast debt the club had accumulated by building a stadium and throwing money around like confetti during McLeish's era, oh, aye getting relegated no doubt didn't help much either

How do you know who wanted to buy the club after the Duff/Gray fiasco. I believe that there were other parties but the BOS had it's preferred bidder

No one suggested anything illegal except you.

Dont you suspect there may have been another reason for this? Do you think he was trying to sneak it onto e-bay without anyone noticing? He owned it then and owns it now. We mock the Yams but we are in basically the same position regarding ownership and if STF was so inclined he could do exactly as he wanted with the stadium.

The car park has been done to death and there is nothing other than supposition or insinuation that some dark, immoral if not illegal, deed has been done. Done by the person that owned it in the first place I may add.

There were some other bidders but none with the cash STF had and it was cash guarantees that got him the gig. If you think anything else then you are mistaken.

Arch Stanton
10-05-2011, 04:48 PM
No Hibs fans want managers hired and fired on a regular basis. The reason some get concerned early on - and I am one of them - is that we are looking for SIGNS that the manager knows what he is doing. He drops the obvious players, changes the formation when needed, makes subs when needed, fills the obvious gaps and weaknesses in the side, and talks a good game. CC has struggled to convince me on all these fronts. The reference points are managers who have been successful at ER previously - McLeish and Mowbray were able to do all the above and quickly instilled confidence among fans that they knew what they were doing. With Hughes for instance, no one - not even he - knew why Hibs went on that great run of wins, but when it ran out of steam it was clear that Hughes didn't have a clue what he was doing. His pre/post match interviews were one dimensional and desperate. The only surprise was that he wasn't fired before Oct.

Petrie's ability to appoint good managers is poor, so there is a reasonable expectation that CC is yet another poor appointment - until he proves otherwise. IMHO he has failed so far to do that. As fans we are rightly concerned at the financial cost to the club if poor managers are left to spend and contract crap players. We've just got rid of whole bunch who in reality were never good enough for Hibs and shouldn't have been signed. The quicker you find out crap managers, the better for all concerned. IMHO the process at ER is flawed and wil not improve until Petrie is removed from the decision-making process.

"Petrie's ability to appoint good managers is poor, so there is a reasonable expectation that CC is yet another poor appointment - until he proves otherwise."

To summarise then - CC is a poor manager unless and until he proves he isn't. In any case he must be a poor manager because Rod only hires poor managers. How'ma doin?

Now, I've come to the conclusion that CC knows what he is doing based on what I have seen him do with the squad and with the team. So, if you restricted yourself to these mundane considerations, instead of all your hocus pocus stuff above I mean, how would you rate CC?

Kaiser1962
10-05-2011, 05:40 PM
"Petrie's ability to appoint good managers is poor, so there is a reasonable expectation that CC is yet another poor appointment - until he proves otherwise."

To summarise then - CC is a poor manager unless and until he proves he isn't. In any case he must be a poor manager because Rod only hires poor managers. How'ma doin?

Now, I've come to the conclusion that CC knows what he is doing based on what I have seen him do with the squad and with the team. So, if you restricted yourself to these mundane considerations, instead of all your hocus pocus stuff above I mean, how would you rate CC?

Careful there crabit. You're dealing with a genius.

Arch Stanton
10-05-2011, 07:17 PM
Careful there crabit. You're dealing with a genius.

Case of mistaken identity I think. I'm pretty sure the genius is the one who bases his assessment of CC on what other people think - go figure!

HibsMax
10-05-2011, 08:12 PM
No Hibs fans want managers hired and fired on a regular basis. The reason some get concerned early on - and I am one of them - is that we are looking for SIGNS that the manager knows what he is doing. He drops the obvious players, changes the formation when needed, makes subs when needed, fills the obvious gaps and weaknesses in the side, and talks a good game. CC has struggled to convince me on all these fronts. The reference points are managers who have been successful at ER previously - McLeish and Mowbray were able to do all the above and quickly instilled confidence among fans that they knew what they were doing. With Hughes for instance, no one - not even he - knew why Hibs went on that great run of wins, but when it ran out of steam it was clear that Hughes didn't have a clue what he was doing. His pre/post match interviews were one dimensional and desperate. The only surprise was that he wasn't fired before Oct.

Petrie's ability to appoint good managers is poor, so there is a reasonable expectation that CC is yet another poor appointment - until he proves otherwise. IMHO he has failed so far to do that. As fans we are rightly concerned at the financial cost to the club if poor managers are left to spend and contract crap players. We've just got rid of whole bunch who in reality were never good enough for Hibs and shouldn't have been signed. The quicker you find out crap managers, the better for all concerned. IMHO the process at ER is flawed and wil not improve until Petrie is removed from the decision-making process.
Fair enough but it does seem like a manager has a very short time to impress the fans before he's punted. It seems like a manager has to hit the ground running and if he stumbles....punt him. Of course I would love a manager to come in and everything just falls into place but that's not realistic. CC has brought in a couple of players and is emptying a bunch of others (players that fans are happy to see the back of)....is that not something to give him credit for? I could be wrong but I don't believe it's CC's purpose to switch things around all the time, I believe he was doing that to try and determine who his best players are and where they perform best. I don't expect that a team built by CC will be unrecognisable from one week to the next.

I still think he deserves more time. We have no evidence to suggest that any other manager would have done a better or worse job than CC. I don't know that and you don't know that.

I see people drawing comparisons all the time e.g., see what ManagerA did at TeamA with only these resources. That counts for nothing. If we want to make those sorts of comparisons then it seems that we were wrong to get rid of Mixu when we did. But would Mixu have attained success with Hibs?

There is no quick fix.........at least I don't think there is. You said yourself that the process is flawed. Let's buck the trend. Let's stick with a manager for longer than 5 minutes, see if that helps.

RickyS
10-05-2011, 08:21 PM
Fair enough but it does seem like a manager has a very short time to impress the fans before he's punted. It seems like a manager has to hit the ground running and if he stumbles....punt him. Of course I would love a manager to come in and everything just falls into place but that's not realistic. CC has brought in a couple of players and is emptying a bunch of others (players that fans are happy to see the back of)....is that not something to give him credit for? I could be wrong but I don't believe it's CC's purpose to switch things around all the time, I believe he was doing that to try and determine who his best players are and where they perform best. I don't expect that a team built by CC will be unrecognisable from one week to the next.

I still think he deserves more time. We have no evidence to suggest that any other manager would have done a better or worse job than CC. I don't know that and you don't know that.

I see people drawing comparisons all the time e.g., see what ManagerA did at TeamA with only these resources. That counts for nothing. If we want to make those sorts of comparisons then it seems that we were wrong to get rid of Mixu when we did. But would Mixu have attained success with Hibs?

There is no quick fix.........at least I don't think there is. You said yourself that the process is flawed. Let's buck the trend. Let's stick with a manager for longer than 5 minutes, see if that helps.

someone should tell mickey adams, he just got punted after 4 months!

Sas_The_Hibby
10-05-2011, 08:27 PM
I suspect that talking about American sports might not meet with the open arms, but I agree with you. I know it cannot be replicated in Scottish football but I love the draft system. I love how schedules are dictated by how good a team you are. I could have my head waaaaaay up my arse but I truly believe that the NFL is interested in keeping things open. Just look at the past Superbowl champions (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Super_Bowl_champions) and you will see nothing! A couple of periods in time when one team was very strong but that didn't last more than a couple of years. Between 2000 and now, there have been NINE different winners. I know next to nothing about NHL but if I look over a similar time period I see that there have been eight different winners. NBA? five. MLS? eight.

Almost everywhere you look you see a similar pattern, except Scotland....

That is assuming Scotland and the USA are the only two countries in the world! :confused:

HibsMax
10-05-2011, 08:30 PM
That is assuming Scotland and the USA are the only two countries in the world! :confused:
Yes, that's a correct assumption. :rolleyes:

I guess I should have included a link to the the other thread on this very forum about league winners in Scotland, England, Spain and Italy with further additions regarding Portugal and Germany.

Stevie Reid
11-05-2011, 04:13 PM
Whilst this was obviously a few years ago and he could well have improved in the intervening period, a lifelong Forest fan describes Calderwood as 'unconvincing' in this article: -

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/jonathanstevenson/2011/05/forest_the_play-offs_and_me.html

I do not want Calderwood removed, but I think that unconvincing is the perfect description of his time thus far, here's hoping next season brings improvement.

hibs0666
11-05-2011, 06:27 PM
:agree:... I'd never really considered Petrie as being the common denominator until recently.As you said The SIGNS aren't there to justify optimism.And I can't see anything wrong with listening to testimonials from his previous employer's fans as a means to back up what what I see and think for myself:greengrin

What did the Newcastle supporters think of the job that Calderwood did?

superfurryhibby
12-05-2011, 11:52 AM
[QUOTE=The Falcon;2798428]Dont you suspect there may have been another reason for this? Do you think he was trying to sneak it onto e-bay without anyone noticing? He owned it then and owns it now. We mock the Yams but we are in basically the same position regarding ownership and if STF was so inclined he could do exactly as he wanted with the stadium.

The car park has been done to death and there is nothing other than supposition or insinuation that some dark, immoral if not illegal, deed has been done. Done by the person that owned it in the first place I may add.

There were some other bidders but none with the cash STF had and it was cash guarantees that got him the gig. If you think anything else then you are mistaken.[/QUOTurely you can manage a discussion (thread hijack) without sarcasm, the lowest form of wit.

Venture capitalism, it's what STF is good at? Nothing illegal but immoral, that's subjective. Personally, I can't see why the football club didn't benefit from the full proceeds of the car park, but hey, as you say STF can do what he likes. As for bidders, we must agree to differ and I won't bother telling you must be mistaken, all a bit bairnish that kind of stuff really.

The Falcon
12-05-2011, 12:57 PM
[QUOTE=The Falcon;2798428]Dont you suspect there may have been another reason for this? Do you think he was trying to sneak it onto e-bay without anyone noticing? He owned it then and owns it now. We mock the Yams but we are in basically the same position regarding ownership and if STF was so inclined he could do exactly as he wanted with the stadium.

The car park has been done to death and there is nothing other than supposition or insinuation that some dark, immoral if not illegal, deed has been done. Done by the person that owned it in the first place I may add.

There were some other bidders but none with the cash STF had and it was cash guarantees that got him the gig. If you think anything else then you are mistaken.[/QUOTurely you can manage a discussion (thread hijack) without sarcasm, the lowest form of wit.

Venture capitalism, it's what STF is good at? Nothing illegal but immoral, that's subjective. Personally, I can't see why the football club didn't benefit from the full proceeds of the car park, but hey, as you say STF can do what he likes. As for bidders, we must agree to differ and I won't bother telling you must be mistaken, all a bit bairnish that kind of stuff really.

Dont let reality get in the way of a good conspiracy theory.

We keep on hearing that all these bidders were desperate to buy Hibs but were somehow foiled by shenanigans bewteen STF and BOS, if thats the case why dont all these people that are desperate to buy Hibs buy them now?

Baker9
12-05-2011, 01:15 PM
I don't know what supporters of other clubs are like-I never look at their websites but Hibs supporters have always been too quick to criticise.Events this week set me thinking back fifty odd years to when Eddie Turnbull was regularly booed at Easter Road as he slowed up.The same year he was picked by journalists for the team of the tournament at the 1958 World Cup.Only scored 200 goals for Hibs-obviously not Hibs class.

From midfield! Was he the last regular midfield goalscorer we had? Right now it seems like it.

Peevemor
12-05-2011, 01:33 PM
The difference is rather fundamental. The stadium had been seperated from the football team. This deprived the football team of it's most significant asset, the land it owned and was built on. Do you remember how much the old Car park sold for? I recall that it was in excess of £10,000,000. Not chicken feed by any standards. STF generously agreed to give the football club some of that money back, significantly reducing the vast debt the club had accumulated by building a stadium and throwing money around like confetti during McLeish's era, oh, aye getting relegated no doubt didn't help much either

How do you know who wanted to buy the club after the Duff/Gray fiasco. I believe that there were other parties but the BOS had it's preferred bidder

No one suggested anything illegal except you.

What use is an asset to a football club? They could either sell it or use it as security for borrowing.

STF provided the securities that were required for the mortgages as well as loaning the club money from his own pocket.

The stadium was separated from the football club purely to protect the football club - something which was well explained/documeneted at the time.

And IIRC, the car park was sold for less than £9M.




Venture capitalism, it's what STF is good at? Nothing illegal but immoral, that's subjective. Personally, I can't see why the football club didn't benefit from the full proceeds of the car park, but hey, as you say STF can do what he likes. As for bidders, we must agree to differ and I won't bother telling you must be mistaken, all a bit bairnish that kind of stuff really.

But it did, only the money had been spent beforehand (ref. your previous post). As for STF being repaid the £2-3M personal loans he had made - why not?

SmokieJoe
13-05-2011, 09:44 PM
the guy is no manager. Lets get a proper person in. CC has now proved he's no use now. Unless you enjoy being a laughing stock???

A tad short sighted and lacking belief

Gatecrasher
13-05-2011, 09:48 PM
We really are a right hysterical bunch at times.

Lose a few games at a stage of the season where we have nothing to play for (but managed to fairly convincingly avoid the very real threat of relegation, not that that seems to matter) ...and...what shall we do?

Yes, let`s sack yet another manager.

It seems to be the answer every time the boat rocks slightly at Hibs, doesn`t it? So, who would we bring in to replace CC, (at least until he loses a few games and has to go?)

Sometimes, I think we as a group of fans get exactly what we deserve.

GG
:agree:
its getting pathetic some of the stuff said

new malkyhib
13-05-2011, 10:55 PM
Or we can stop turning on people when they go through bad runs, even long ones, and let them work on sorting it out and turning it round.

This chop and change culture in football has never produced anything other than short trm uplifts at best, you rarely change the whole direction of a club for too long.

Once you change manager then the players all change, the whole way the club works changea and then you just ask for it all to happen again.

What about changing the mindset of the club from one of "containment" to "attainment" - and for that change to be driven from the top?

Maybe Petrie could break cover once in a while as well and give a wide-ranging interview to the press setting out his "vision" for the club - instead of the clipped statements on the website and the ludicrous "family home" campaign?

It would cost nowt to do this as well...that would appeal to him would it not?

matty_f
13-05-2011, 11:00 PM
What about changing the mindset of the club from one of "containment" to "attainment" - and for that change to be driven from the top?

Maybe Petrie could break cover once in a while as well and give a wide-ranging interview to the press setting out his "vision" for the club - instead of the clipped statements on the website and the ludicrous "family home" campaign?

It would cost nowt to do this as well...that would appeal to him would it not?

How many chairmen, anywhere, are doing that??

I couldn't even tell you the names of other chairmen in the SPL, the Premiership even.

blackpoolhibs
14-05-2011, 07:22 AM
What about changing the mindset of the club from one of "containment" to "attainment" - and for that change to be driven from the top?

Maybe Petrie could break cover once in a while as well and give a wide-ranging interview to the press setting out his "vision" for the club - instead of the clipped statements on the website and the ludicrous "family home" campaign?
It would cost nowt to do this as well...that would appeal to him would it not?

Or maybe we could just get the manager whoever it is. to manage the team properly, with the tools he has, better than all but 3. Perhaps that man could just get his players playing better, show a better attitude and show us the fans just why they get paid as well as they do.

I couldnt give a toss what Petrie says one bit, although they have given us clear instructions every AGM just what their aim is. Some folk just choose to ignore it.

new malkyhib
14-05-2011, 08:23 AM
How many chairmen, anywhere, are doing that??

I couldn't even tell you the names of other chairmen in the SPL, the Premiership even.


When has Petrie ever done that Matty? Point me in the direction of a TV or radio interview or any articles in the press in that vein - because i'm struggling to think of one.

The media profile of the club is non-existent - and I suspect the Board like it that way.

The Falcon
14-05-2011, 10:35 AM
When has Petrie ever done that Matty? Point me in the direction of a TV or radio interview or any articles in the press in that vein - because i'm struggling to think of one.

The media profile of the club is non-existent - and I suspect the Board like it that way.


What would you want him to add that hasnt already been said at AGM's and the like?

Judas Iscariot
14-05-2011, 04:12 PM
Another disgrace today..

Thanks CC

:taxi

HIBERNIAN-0762
14-05-2011, 05:22 PM
The wife seen Gordon Strachan in Ocean Terminal today....

:agree:

:duck: