Isn't It True That...

[Dashing Bob S]

...the only thing that stops us from denouncing Calderwood as an inept failure is the fact that we no longer really care what happens for the rest of this season?

At least when we were ****-e under Yogi we cared enough to protest.

Well done CC, master of the Alex Miller/Blobby Williamson school of lowered expectations.

[HibeeMcGinn1]

:fishin:

[Forza Fred]

...the only thing that stops us from denouncing Calderwood as an inept failure is the fact that we no longer really care what happens for the rest of this season?
.

No, I think there is a feeling that he shuold be given time with HIS signings before any denounciation takes place.

And that is a reasonable stance, given that he did improve things with his winter singings.

Having said that, I still cant ignore that when he came he managed to turn án under performing squad into a terribly unde rperforming squad, something which most people have chosen to, if not ignore, then simply dismiss as just an acceptable part of the journey of change.

I'm not yet convinced about Mr CC, and he will stand or fall on the results of the first eight or so games of the new season.

It may be harsh, but the reality of football these days is that a manager does not get two or three years to turn things around, and success, or imporvement at least, is expected in a very short time.

At the moment I'd say we are doing no more than........ treading water.

[hibiedude]

No, I think there is a feeling that he shuold be given time with HIS signings before any denounciation takes place.

And that is a reasonable stance, given that he did improve things with his winter singings.

Having said that, I still cant ignore that when he came he managed to turn án under performing squad into a terribly unde rperforming squad, something which most people have chosen to, if not ignore, then simply dismiss as just an acceptable part of the journey of change.

I'm not yet convinced about Mr CC, and he will stand or fall on the results of the first eight or so games of the new season.

It may be harsh, but the reality of football these days is that a manager does not get two or three years to turn things around, and success, or imporvement at least, is expected in a very short time.

At the moment I'd say we are doing no more than........ treading water.

I have agree the first 8 -10 games of the new season will make or break CC- His summer signings have to be based on quality rather than hoping on the bargan basement method.

I'm not convinced CC is the man for the job but happy to be proved wrong

[lucky]

I , like most Hibs fans desperately want him to succeed but I have serious concerns over the teams performance since he took over. I reckon he has got to Xmas or Rodders will swing his axe again. The football on show is truly awful. 7 season ticket holders all sit together, yesterday lost another one who wont renew. So far only have done so. The summer signings have to be decent or Hibs are going back to crowds of around 7500

[The Falcon]

...the only thing that stops us from denouncing Calderwood as an inept failure is the fact that we no longer really care what happens for the rest of this season?

At least when we were ****-e under Yogi we cared enough to protest.

Well done CC, master of the Alex Miller/Blobby Williamson school of lowered expectations.

You just denounced him so whats your problem? :dunno:

In fact there are posters on here that have denounced him since the day he joined, whilst silent when we were winning, are vocal again. Strange that?

[matty_f]

If truth be told, I think that the month of March, where we lost any momentum we had built up and when the time came to play again our safety was pretty much assured and our chances of top 6 had faded to the point of it being practically impossible, was what did for us more than any managerial decisions did.

[Viva_Palmeiras]

Reading some of the comments seems like we've learned nothing as a support.
Setting up the revolving door scenario yet again

[Arch Stanton]

...the only thing that stops us from denouncing Calderwood as an inept failure is the fact that we no longer really care what happens for the rest of this season?

At least when we were ****-e under Yogi we cared enough to protest.

Well done CC, master of the Alex Miller/Blobby Williamson school of lowered expectations.

Not at all - the season being a washout is all the more reason for having a jolly good denouncement I would say! There's no shortage of ammunition, is there, with the results we've been having.

No, I think the lack of denouncements is because the people who are itching to do so remember the last time they roundly denounced him and then had to fall silent when both performances and results picked up. As the saying goes, once bitten twice shy. :agree:

[BEEJ]

No, I think there is a feeling that he shuold be given time with HIS signings before any denounciation takes place.

And that is a reasonable stance, given that he did improve things with his winter singings.

Having said that, I still cant ignore that when he came he managed to turn án under performing squad into a terribly unde rperforming squad, something which most people have chosen to, if not ignore, then simply dismiss as just an acceptable part of the journey of change.

I'm not yet convinced about Mr CC, and he will stand or fall on the results of the first eight or so games of the new season.

It may be harsh, but the reality of football these days is that a manager does not get two or three years to turn things around, and success, or imporvement at least, is expected in a very short time.

At the moment I'd say we are doing no more than........ treading water.
Spot on! :top marks


If truth be told, I think that the month of March, where we lost any momentum we had built up and when the time came to play again our safety was pretty much assured and our chances of top 6 had faded to the point of it being practically impossible, was what did for us more than any managerial decisions did.
:agree: Very true.

[The Falcon]

Ahem....I wasn't silent.I just couldn't be bothered repeating myself.

You seem to have made a recovery from that particular debility.

Co-inciding with a the end of a good run of results for Hibs, spookily enough.

[The Falcon]

The extended break might not have helped but there's little doubt the manager has shown in his tactics,team selection and substitutions what his qualities are.The only chance of him surviving is if he gets lucky and signs some outstanding players who will make the team good enough to get the results we need despite him:wink:

So if he does do well you're still not going to give him any credit?

[Kaiser1962]

The extended break might not have helped but there's little doubt the manager has shown in his tactics,team selection and substitutions what his qualities are.The only chance of him surviving is if he gets lucky and signs some outstanding players who will make the team good enough to get the results we need despite him:wink:

I was undecided before this post.

No such indecision anymore though.......... :asshole:

[BEEJ]

The extended break might not have helped but there's little doubt the manager has shown in his tactics,team selection and substitutions what his qualities are.The only chance of him surviving is if he gets lucky and signs some outstanding players who will make the team good enough to get the results we need despite him:wink:
Bit like Yogi, then? :wink:

[greenlex]

8 or 10 games? What nonsense. He will be releasing the majority of the squad and will bring in replacements. A further full season is the minimum he should be judged on. Yesterday he tried something different and it plainly didn't work. In case folks have forgotten there is nothing to play for and these games are "meaningless" so he should be cut a little slack regards experimentation and results. He is building a squad and finding out about players.

[The Falcon]

Of course I'll give him credit. But like I said it'll be by signing really good players that are good enough to make up for his bemusing formations and tactics. I can't see it all coming together unfortunately.

That would be acceptable if that has been a view you have arrived at over time had it not been your opinion since the day he joined us. Probably your bitterness now stems from your dissapointment at not being relegated though. Understandable I suppose.

[Baldy Foghorn]

8 or 10 games? What nonsense. He will be releasing the majority if the squad and will bring in replacements. A further full season is the minimum he should be judged on. Yesterday he tried something different and it plainly didn't work. In case folks have forgotten there is nothing to play for and these games are "meaningless" so he should be cut a little slack regards experimentation and results. He is building a squad and finding out about players.

Good points Lex, too many ready to write him off if we are not topping League by September.......

[Kaiser1962]

Good points Lex, too many ready to write him off if we are not topping League by September.......

Oh they'll still do it. Even if we are top there will still be something wrong. :rolleyes:

[matty_f]

8 or 10 games? What nonsense. He will be releasing the majority of the squad and will bring in replacements. A further full season is the minimum he should be judged on. Yesterday he tried something different and it plainly didn't work. In case folks have forgotten there is nothing to play for and these games are "meaningless" so he should be cut a little slack regards experimentation and results. He is building a squad and finding out about players.

The game shouldn't have been meaningless though, to be honest.

I had to jump through hoops to get down to the game yesterday and others would have been the same. We don't pay season ticket money to get to the split and have the rest of the games not count for anything.

The players and the coaching staff should be be doing their utmost to win every game. If we're going to be experimenting, then it needs to be done in bounce games at East Mains or wherever when there's nothing at stake, and only once we're confident that it'll work should it be brought into the first team when there's points to be played for.

The sad passing of Eddie Turnbull should lead to a big crowd for the final day of the season as many of us will want to pay tribute. The team should be under no illusions that it is for that reason the majority will be going, and not to recognise the 'efforts' of the team this season.

[Hibby D]

8 or 10 games? What nonsense. He will be releasing the majority of the squad and will bring in replacements. A further full season is the minimum he should be judged on. Yesterday he tried something different and it plainly didn't work. In case folks have forgotten there is nothing to play for and these games are "meaningless" so he should be cut a little slack regards experimentation and results. He is building a squad and finding out about players.

Excellent response. Sadly that won't suit the agenda of many; especially those who are just itching to start, and contribute towards, threads like this one.

I'm away back to read my copy of Caravans for Beginners

[Mikey]

I'm convinced CC is the man for the job but happy to be proved wrong

Jings!

[Ollie Reed]

Jings!

Crivvens!

[CallumLaidlaw]

Oh they'll still do it. Even if we are top there will still be something wrong. :rolleyes:

You get the feeling that people don't want CC to succeed cos he isn't "one of our own".
I really don't want to take any of the games since the hearts game into consideration. We have absolutely nothing to play for, and it's obvious that the players feel that way.
Next season is what counts, and CC must get the full season at the very least, otherwise the following season is going to be yet again another transitional period.

[Diclonius]

Hey, why not sack him now? There's never been a better time to appoint our 5th manager in 5 years.

And why stop there? Next manager GTF!

[HibbyAndy]

Hey, why not sack him now? There's never been a better time to appoint our 5th manager in 5 years.

And why stop there? Next manager GTF!


:tee hee:

[NORTHERNHIBBY]

In past seasons, bottom of the top six was a bad season, but we are quite a bit adrift from that just now, and I think we need to be prepared for another write-off season until we are back at that level. I don't think we can afford the quality that we need, so the only option is to wait for it to come through are much praised youth system. While I believe that we have the infra-structure to deliver that, the pay-off is a first team in a holding pattern until the younger players are ready.

[Paisley Hibby]

The game shouldn't have been meaningless though, to be honest.

I had to jump through hoops to get down to the game yesterday and others would have been the same. We don't pay season ticket money to get to the split and have the rest of the games not count for anything.

The players and the coaching staff should be be doing their utmost to win every game. If we're going to be experimenting, then it needs to be done in bounce games at East Mains or wherever when there's nothing at stake, and only once we're confident that it'll work should it be brought into the first team when there's points to be played for.

The sad passing of Eddie Turnbull should lead to a big crowd for the final day of the season as many of us will want to pay tribute. The team should be under no illusions that it is for that reason the majority will be going, and not to recognise the 'efforts' of the team this season.

I agree - no league game is meaningless. And as we are expected to pay full whack to watch why should we accept less than best effort from the team? A lot of things worried me yesterday - CC's signings missing or going off the boil already. Strange substitutions probably losing us the game and what was the point of bringing on Riorden at 87 minutes?

[jdships]

8 or 10 games? What nonsense. He will be releasing the majority of the squad and will bring in replacements. A further full season is the minimum he should be judged on. Yesterday he tried something different and it plainly didn't work. In case folks have forgotten there is nothing to play for and these games are "meaningless" so he should be cut a little slack regards experimentation and results. He is building a squad and finding out about players.



Thanks for a common sense post :thumbsup:
We all know , if we are honest, that the position we are in has not happened overnight.
JC,Mixu and Yogi all share the blame for failing to buy wisely and prudently while not sacrificing quality .

Again if we are honest with ourselves we know that since the break up of the cup winning side of 2007 the squad has lacked leadership and quality .

Let's give CC a chance before throwing the toys out the pram :rolleyes:
For what its worth I would suggest the same whoever had been appointed

:flag:

[ahibby]

Not surprised that some fans are peed off with our results since the break. As fans though we have to accept that CC has to use players at his disposal and drop players who are not in his plans. Which could mean we are weakened and appear to be just that. I feel for the fans though who are being in my view uder rewarded for their support (dare I say yet again). However I am going to be optimistic and say better things are coming our way, next season. I am not writing off CC just yet.

[MrSmith]

Deja vu... Help ma Boab! Here we go again...

I really despair at some of our support, so here it is: Come up with a plan that will suit our budget and present it to our illustrious leaders and then shut the **** up!

[The_Sauz]

8 or 10 games? What nonsense. He will be releasing the majority of the squad and will bring in replacements. A further full season is the minimum he should be judged on. Yesterday he tried something different and it plainly didn't work. In case folks have forgotten there is nothing to play for and these games are "meaningless" so he should be cut a little slack regards experimentation and results. He is building a squad and finding out about players.
:top marks
It was always on the cards that once we were safe, he was going to experiment with the players that were going to be here next season.

[The Falcon]

Deja vu... Help ma Boab! Here we go again...

I really despair at some of our support, so here it is: Come up with a plan that will suit our budget and present it to our illustrious leaders and then shut the **** up!

The replies to this should be good. :greengrin

[Forza Fred]

8 or 10 games? What nonsense. He will be releasing the majority of the squad and will bring in replacements. A further full season is the minimum he should be judged on. Yesterday he tried something different and it plainly didn't work. In case folks have forgotten there is nothing to play for and these games are "meaningless" so he should be cut a little slack regards experimentation and results. He is building a squad and finding out about players.

They are only 'meaningless'because of the position we allowed ourselves to get to.

If after 8-10 games next season and we are in the bottom three or four, then the view may well be that come the last few weesks of next season, that more 'meaningless 'games will be on offer...and whether we like it or not, the 'denounciatoin'of CC will be well and truly aired by a lot of people.

I really dont think many have the patience to write off another season as a 'transition' season, and happily accept that things may not improve until the season after.

I admit I could be wrong though.

[hibs0666]

...the only thing that stops us from denouncing Calderwood as an inept failure is the fact that we no longer really care what happens for the rest of this season?

At least when we were ****-e under Yogi we cared enough to protest.

Well done CC, master of the Alex Miller/Blobby Williamson school of lowered expectations.

Panic merchant?

[hibs0666]

The extended break might not have helped but there's little doubt the manager has shown in his tactics,team selection and substitutions what his qualities are.The only chance of him surviving is if he gets lucky and signs some outstanding players who will make the team good enough to get the results we need despite him:wink:

So if we're Tom Kite it's the manager's fault. However, if we're good then the manger go lucky?

Deary deary me.

[Houchy]

I have agree the first 8 -10 games of the new season will make or break CC- His summer signings have to be based on quality rather than hoping on the bargan basement method.

I'm convinced CC is the man for the job but happy to be proved wrong

Am I reading this correctly? You think he's the man for the job but would be happy if he failed? Maybe I'm just still pi$$ed after drowning my sorrows after another terriblly shocking result.:agree:

[Dashing Bob S]

You just denounced him so whats your problem? :dunno:

In fact there are posters on here that have denounced him since the day he joined, whilst silent when we were winning, are vocal again. Strange that?

I know I just have, I was refering to 'us' as a support.

As for the other comments, well, football fans being fickle, basing their view of a manager on their teams results? Who'd have thunk it?

[SneakersO'Toole]

The game shouldn't have been meaningless though, to be honest.

I had to jump through hoops to get down to the game yesterday and others would have been the same. We don't pay season ticket money to get to the split and have the rest of the games not count for anything.

The players and the coaching staff should be be doing their utmost to win every game. If we're going to be experimenting, then it needs to be done in bounce games at East Mains or wherever when there's nothing at stake, and only once we're confident that it'll work should it be brought into the first team when there's points to be played for.

The sad passing of Eddie Turnbull should lead to a big crowd for the final day of the season as many of us will want to pay tribute. The team should be under no illusions that it is for that reason the majority will be going, and not to recognise the 'efforts' of the team this season.

Excellent post.

The will to win should be there regardless of the opposition or importance of the fixture.

There lies a big difference between Hibs and some of our opposition. Some players would be hurting after yesterdays game. Cursing to themsleves that they can and should have done better. I'll wager than most off the hibs squad were looking at it as one less week until their holiblabs.

Its a mentality thing and unfortunately its sadly lacking at Easter Road.

[Dashing Bob S]

Hey, why not sack him now? There's never been a better time to appoint our 5th manager in 5 years.

And why stop there? Next manager GTF!

Typical of the short-term thinking that plagues Hibs. I seriously think we should be looking at three or four managers down the line. Let's face it, those guys have shown us absolutely nothing so far. It's only fair that they should take their fair share of the blame for our future predicament.

[The Falcon]

I know I just have, I was refering to 'us' as a support.

As for the other comments, well, football fans being fickle, basing their view of a manager on their teams results? Who'd have thunk it?

Why dont you make a placard and protest then?

Or buy the club then you can appoint whoever you like.

[Keith_M]

You know what? I've come to the conclusion that we might as well have kept Yogi as manager after all...


:offski:

[sahib]

In past seasons, bottom of the top six was a bad season, but we are quite a bit adrift from that just now, and I think we need to be prepared for another write-off season until we are back at that level. I don't think we can afford the quality that we need, so the only option is to wait for it to come through are much praised youth system. While I believe that we have the infra-structure to deliver that, the pay-off is a first team in a holding pattern until the younger players are ready.

Goalpost shifting. :greengrin

I think Calderwood's demeanor of dignified concern, mixed with a look of determination, has bought him time with the fans. He is probably a good man manager and a natural leader type, but that will not save him in the long run, if his team is both boring and unsuccessful.

[Dashing Bob S]

Why dont you make a placard and protest then?

Or buy the club then you can appoint whoever you like.

1. Twenty first century - why carry around a heavy placard when you can just post on the internet?

2. Finances and other reasons - don't have enough money to buy Hibs and if I did I still wouldn't, as I acknowledge that I probably don't have the skill set or temperament to make it successful.

But as a fan I reserve the right to criticize a manager with a poor record of results in a shabby league.

[hibsbollah]

1. Twenty first century - why carry around a heavy placard when you can just post on the internet?

2. Finances and other reasons - don't have enough money to buy Hibs and if I did I still wouldn't, as I acknowledge that I probably don't have the skill set or temperament to make it successful.

But as a fan I reserve the right to criticize a manager with a poor record of results in a shabby league.

Thanks to modern carbon fibre materials, the new generation of placards arent as heavy as the old wooden numbers. Worth a try if you want to unseat a 21st century Hibs manager or Tory Govt.

[Pretty Boy]

I said on another thread we have to be patient this time.

CC has proved he can see a problem as was witnessed by his January signings in positions we had struggled in. I firmly believe he can see the lack of creativity and pace and will address this. A lot of the guys we see in the 1st team now will be squad players next year. There is still a hell of a lot of wages to be freed up and we will see new faces i have no doubt. We need to trust CC and give him more than a few games next season to shape a team. Personally i would accept a lower part of the top 6 finish next season as long as there was signs of consistent improvement. Let's just cool down a bit, accept that these last few games will see experiments to see who can do a job where, who can adapt, who can play our of position and follow an instruction etc.

A team next year of:

Stack

Towell
Hanlon
New CB
Booth

New RMF (Sproule)
Pallson/Thornhill
New CMF/Miller
New LMF

New CF
Sodje/Vaz Te/Riordan (assuming one of them gets a contract)

Not brilliant but thats the bare maintenance i think and would see us improve our finish on this year which gives us another platform to build on.

[Speedway]

Crivvens!

Help ma'boaby


Hey, why not sack him now? There's never been a better time to appoint our 5th manager in 5 years.

And why stop there? Next manager GTF!

:agree:

Due to the ******ed and diminished mind of the football supporter, we really want something until we get it and then it is automatically not good enough.

We have a loser mentality as a support. We are experts are criticising, fighting amongst ourselves and doing all we can to ignore the principles of success that winning clubs employ.

None of us can demonstrate in financial and logistical terms, a plan that would have the club in a better position than it currently is so basically, everything posted on this thread including this post, is an uneducated irrelevance.

[heretoday]

We just have to wait and see what happens. I admit the signs are not great. Hibs are dreadful at the moment and it's hard to see how CC can turn the players that remain into winners.

Money must be made available.

[Dashing Bob S]

Thanks to modern carbon fibre materials, the new generation of placards arent as heavy as the old wooden numbers. Worth a try if you want to unseat a 21st century Hibs manager or Tory Govt.

:hmmm:

[HibsMax]

...the only thing that stops us from denouncing Calderwood as an inept failure is the fact that we no longer really care what happens for the rest of this season?

At least when we were ****-e under Yogi we cared enough to protest.

Well done CC, master of the Alex Miller/Blobby Williamson school of lowered expectations.
All you can do is speak for yourself and let others voice their own opinions.

But I actually kinda agree with you. I don't care what happens between now and the end of the season. I stopped caring once we were safe. All I want is for the team to be rebuilt in time for next season. If that means we lose every game without scoring a goal, I don't really care......just as long as CC takes something from every single game, something that helps him build a better team for next year.

Some people will agree with that. Others will kinda agree with that. Others will tell me I'm talking pish. Doesn't matter. As I, and others, have been routinely reminded, this is a message board and we're all allowed our opinion. In my opinion these remaining games are useful only in terms of CC trying to learn as much as possible about his players so that he can tweak things over the summer.

EDIT : I'm not convinced CC is the man for the job but I'm also not convinced he's not the man for the job. Two different ways of essentially saying the same thing.

[Ed De Gramo]

...the only thing that stops us from denouncing Calderwood as an inept failure is the fact that we no longer really care what happens for the rest of this season?

At least when we were ****-e under Yogi we cared enough to protest.

Well done CC, master of the Alex Miller/Blobby Williamson school of lowered expectations.

What a pile of crap

[HibsMax]

The extended break might not have helped but there's little doubt the manager has shown in his tactics,team selection and substitutions what his qualities are.The only chance of him surviving is if he gets lucky and signs some outstanding players who will make the team good enough to get the results we need despite him:wink:
LOL.

So good signings are all about good luck?

You're balanced outlook is truly unmatched.

[HibsMax]

The game shouldn't have been meaningless though, to be honest.

I had to jump through hoops to get down to the game yesterday and others would have been the same. We don't pay season ticket money to get to the split and have the rest of the games not count for anything.

The players and the coaching staff should be be doing their utmost to win every game. If we're going to be experimenting, then it needs to be done in bounce games at East Mains or wherever when there's nothing at stake, and only once we're confident that it'll work should it be brought into the first team when there's points to be played for.

The sad passing of Eddie Turnbull should lead to a big crowd for the final day of the season as many of us will want to pay tribute. The team should be under no illusions that it is for that reason the majority will be going, and not to recognise the 'efforts' of the team this season.
What did we have to play for? Nothing, therefor a meaningless game. But it's obvious for everyone to see that CC didn't think it was a meaningless game - he used it to experiment, something he is being chastised for doing (since the experiment was largely a failure). Personally speaking, I don't think "meaningless" means that the players and coaching staff don't care and can't wait for their summer hols, I think it just means that the actual result is far less important than the other lessons learned from the game as a whole.

This is the perfect time for experimentation and there is / was nothing at stake for the remaining, post-split games. I 100% agree that we should not be experimenting with new systems during games with something at stake but what was at stake yesterday?

[HibsMax]

I agree - no league game is meaningless. And as we are expected to pay full whack to watch why should we accept less than best effort from the team? A lot of things worried me yesterday - CC's signings missing or going off the boil already. Strange substitutions probably losing us the game and what was the point of bringing on Riorden at 87 minutes?
Why is there this illusion that experimentation = lowered effort? I don't get that at all. "Hi Guys, we're going to try something a little different today......and yes, that means I will be expecting subpar performances from all of you so go out there and lose the game!". Hmmm........

[Dashing Bob S]

What a pile of crap

:hmmm: Deep analysis there. Way over my head, I'm afraid.

[Dashing Bob S]

All you can do is speak for yourself and let others voice their own opinions.

But I actually kinda agree with you. I don't care what happens between now and the end of the season. I stopped caring once we were safe. All I want is for the team to be rebuilt in time for next season. If that means we lose every game without scoring a goal, I don't really care......just as long as CC takes something from every single game, something that helps him build a better team for next year.

Some people will agree with that. Others will kinda agree with that. Others will tell me I'm talking pish. Doesn't matter. As I, and others, have been routinely reminded, this is a message board and we're all allowed our opinion. In my opinion these remaining games are useful only in terms of CC trying to learn as much as possible about his players so that he can tweak things over the summer.

EDIT : I'm not convinced CC is the man for the job but I'm also not convinced he's not the man for the job. Two different ways of essentially saying the same thing.

I'm in the same boat. But at the risk of sounding arrogant, a club the size of Hibs (and Hearts and A'deen) should always have the juice to be in the top six in such a poor domestic league as ours, and anytime we aren't counts as a dismal failure.

I don't want our season over by March again next year - that would be intolerable. I'm not suggesting we ditch Calderwood or that he isn't the man for the job (he might well be) but he needs to have a strong start to next season both in the quality of players he brings in, the mentality our club have, and the standard of entertainment on display.

The fact that we won't turn up in numbers to watch any old s*hi*te is a quality that distinguishes us from the Yams.

[Arch Stanton]

Seems to be a real double whammy argument against CC here -

The bad results are because CC is experimenting for next season and he shouldn't be doing that because we only want to watch our best players.

The bad results are because CC doesn't know how to manage and this bad form will continue into next year.

Now, I can see how people could hold either of these views but I am at a loss as to how many posters manage to hold BOTH these opinions as they pretty much contradict each other. :brickwall:brickwall

[HibsMax]

I'm in the same boat. But at the risk of sounding arrogant, a club the size of Hibs (and Hearts and A'deen) should always have the juice to be in the top six in such a poor domestic league as ours, and anytime we aren't counts as a dismal failure.

I don't want our season over by March again next year - that would be intolerable. I'm not suggesting we ditch Calderwood or that he isn't the man for the job (he might well be) but he needs to have a strong start to next season both in the quality of players he brings in, the mentality our club have, and the standard of entertainment on display.

The fact that we won't turn up in numbers to watch any old s*hi*te is a quality that distinguishes us from the Yams.

I don't think you're being arrogant, I think you're quite justified in believing that we SHOULD be doing better. But let's be honest with ourselves, with the league the way it is and with the financial state of the game, no club outside of the Old Firm is immune from going down the sh*tter for a few seasons. If we get good players we perform well.........but those players leave and we regress; we have to rebuild and it's tough because the fans expect us to be able to achieve what we previously achieved only with different players.

The key for success, IMO, is for one of two things to happen:
1. we manage to build a core of strong players AND hold onto them,
2. we find a Sugar Daddy who will keep on buying us expensive talent whenever we need it.

Option 1 seems like the most attainable.

But who wants to play in the SPL?

[HibsMax]

Seems to be a real double whammy argument against CC here -

The bad results are because CC is experimenting for next season and he shouldn't be doing that because we only want to watch our best players.

The bad results are because CC doesn't know how to manage and this bad form will continue into next year.

Now, I can see how people could hold either of these views but I am at a loss as to how many posters manage to hold BOTH these opinions as they pretty much contradict each other. :brickwall:brickwall
Some people don't let little things like contradictory viewpoints knock them off their stride. Common sense has little to do with a lynching.