is it ever acceptable to sing the 'skacel' song?

[MCameron]

Don't want another 7 page thread on this. Am interested in how the outcome of a poll on this would look though.

[CB_NO3]

Rubbish song IMO. Its just a complete lie and considering we have a Czech goalie on our books, it makes it more stupid.

[Hibby D]

Idiotic song sung by idiots who don't know any better.

They should change the words to "...is a big smelly jobby" and it might just become a hit :greengrin

[Sas_The_Hibby]

It's as bad as 'Paul Hartley is Gay'; the reason being both songs imply there's something despicable about being a refugee/gay.

No place for it, IMO.

[Baldy Foghorn]

Idiotic song sung by idiots who don't know any better.

They should change the words to "...is a big smelly jobby" and it might just become a hit :greengrin

Haha Diane I can't see that taking off but I am liking your thinking....:thumbsup:

[Mikeystewart]

Rubbish song IMO. Its just a complete lie and considering we have a Czech goalie on our books, it makes it more stupid.

:top marks

Anyone who sings this song and finds it acceptable should contact this organisation for some support.

http://www.scotlandagainstracism.com/onescotland/73.1.41.html

[basehibby]

The Skatchel song has never been acceptable IMO - from the very first time I heard it I was never anything other than embarassed to be associated with the vacant bell ends that seem to think it's funny and smart.

Almost as bad as the Edinburgh song :bye:

[scott7_0(Prague)]

Stupid song.... It would then make me a refugee in his homeland..... But having said that, anyone who is offended by it needs to get out more!!!

[Mikeystewart]

The Skatchel song has never been acceptable IMO - from the very first time I heard it I was never anything other than embarrassed to be associated with the vacant bell ends that seem to think it's funny and smart.

Almost as bad as the Edinburgh song :bye:

:top marks

Don't want to sound like I'm hijacking the thread, but I would include the Wallace mercer song into the same category, it may not have any racist connotations but I get the same feeling of distaste and embarrassment when sung by our support. No matter what the man tried to do to the club his family must not appreciate it either.

Some see our support as some sort darling race but it has its fair share of Neanderthals singing out of date offensive pish.

[Ryan91]

It's as bad as 'Paul Hartley is Gay'; the reason being both songs imply there's something despicable about being a refugee/gay.

No place for it, IMO.

The Skacel song has no place in football, however the 'Paul Hartley is Gay' ditty was if anything a reply to the accusation by our illustrious big team neighbours that we as a support were all homosexual. I highly doubt that either of those songs were supposed to cause offence, they were sung with a mind to winding up the opposition than anything else.

[Tricla]

Don't want another 7 page thread on this. Am interested in how the outcome of a poll on this would look though.

I like how you have put one of the options as 'Yes - I don't sing it but don't let it bother me when others do'.

This to me implies that people like me (who don't care if it's sung or not) do infact think it's acceptable.

As I have said, I'm not denying it's inappropriateness but I as well as many others don't get offended by a daft, misguided song.

How about having an option that says 'Couldn't give a toss and I get out enough not to let it bother me'?

No offence mate but you really do have a bee in your bonnet about this one song when IMO there are far worse things that go on at the game that need the fans and the clubs attention. Missile throwing for example.

For your info, I polled 'other' as the above option wasn't available.

[marinello59]

I like how you have put one of the options as 'Yes - I don't sing it but don't let it bother me when others do'.

This to me implies that people like me (who don't care if it's sung or not) do infact think it's acceptable.

As I have said, I'm not denying it's inappropriateness but I as well as many others don't get offended by a daft, misguided song.

How about having an option that says 'Couldn't give a toss and I get out enough not to let it bother me'?

No offence mate but you really do have a bee in your bonnet about this one song when IMO there are far worse things that go on at the game that need the fans and the clubs attention. Missile throwing for example.

For your info, I polled 'other' as the above option wasn't available.

I thought you were a 'sticks and stones ' kind of guy?
Is this going to the the same as the other thread where apparently it was all about you.:greengrin

[Hibby D]

Stupid song.... It would then make me a refugee in his homeland..... But having said that, anyone who is offended by it needs to get out more!!!


I like how you have put one of the options as 'Yes - I don't sing it but don't let it bother me when others do'.

This to me implies that people like me (who don't care if it's sung or not) do infact think it's acceptable.

As I have said, I'm not denying it's inappropriateness but I as well as many others don't get offended by a daft, misguided song.

How about having an option that says 'Couldn't give a toss and I get out enough not to let it bother me'?

No offence mate but you really do have a bee in your bonnet about this one song when IMO there are far worse things that go on at the game that need the fans and the clubs attention. Missile throwing for example.

For your info, I polled 'other' as the above option wasn't available.

Oh I see! People whose opinion is anything other than acceptable/couldn't give a toss need to get out more?

That's a good argument right enough :rolleyes:

[givescotlandfreedom]

It's a daft song and makes Hibs fans look crap for singing it. Singing abuse at opposition players is part of the game - slag him for being a manky, diving, arrogant, spitting Jambo turd instead.

[marinello59]

Oh I see! People whose opinion is anything other than acceptable/couldn't give a toss need to get out more?

That's a good argument right enough :rolleyes:

Shhhhh. I am actually showing this thread to Mrs M59 as evidence that I do need to get out more.

[Tricla]

I thought you were a 'sticks and stones ' kind of guy?
Is this going to the the same as the other thread where apparently it was all about you.:greengrin

I am a sticks and stones guy. That's how I roll! :greengrin

The other thread wasn't all abbot me. It was many people sharing their opinions but only some being seen as acceptable.

And with this poll, I was just pointing out that there wasn't an option for everyone and that the OP seems obsessed with this song when there are far bigger problems that his and everyone else's energies could be focussed on.

[marinello59]

I am a sticks and stones guy. That's how I roll! :greengrin

The other thread wasn't all abbot me. It was many people sharing their opinions but only some being seen as acceptable.

And with this poll, I was just pointing out that there wasn't an option for everyone and that the OP seems obsessed with this song when there are far bigger problems that his and everyone else's energies could be focussed on.

I kind of like that line. I have no idea what it means but I aim to use it at least once today. :greengrin

[Sir David Gray]

As I said in the other thread a few days ago, I'm not bothered in the slightest by the song.

Personally, I'd much rather we took steps towards binning the "Forever and ever..." song that has surfaced this season.

[Hibby D]

I am a sticks and stones guy. That's how I roll! :greengrin

The other thread wasn't all abbot me. It was many people sharing their opinions but only some being seen as acceptable.

And with this poll, I was just pointing out that there wasn't an option for everyone and that the OP seems obsessed with this song when there are far bigger problems that his and everyone else's energies could be focussed on.

Doesn't everyone have a right to focus their energy wherever they want?

For all you know whilst we're all debating his hand grenade, he could be out feeding homeless people or campaigning against public service cuts :greengrin

[givescotlandfreedom]

As I said in the other thread a few days ago, I'm not bothered in the slightest by the song.

Personally, I'd much rather we took steps towards binning the "Forever and ever..." song that has surfaced this season.

:agree: Bogging song

[Wotherspiniesta]

I'm interested to know what the "other" option is. :greengrin

[Brooster]

Any song that may offened that knob or his fans will do for me.

[marinello59]

Any song that may offened that knob or his fans will do for me.

It offends a lot of Hibs fans too. Is that acceptable?

[Brooster]

Get a grip. Did Hibs fans get offended when we sang about 'Baldy' Jim Duffy or 'fat' John Robertson?

[marinello59]

Get a grip. Did Hibs fans get offended when we sang about 'Baldy' Jim Duffy or 'fat' John Robertson?

Any need for that? :confused:
If you consider the song racist it is offensive no matter who you support.

[Tricla]

Any song that may offened that knob or his fans will do for me.

You've really gone and done it now!

[Hibby D]

Get a grip. Did Hibs fans get offended when we sang about 'Baldy' Jim Duffy or 'fat' John Robertson?


There's banter and there's banter though and I guess it's up to us as individuals to set a benchmark.

Singing songs about someone being "bald" or "fat" doesn't quite reach the murky grey quagmire that the Skacel songs does.

Even you know that ya fat baldy........ :na na:


Disclaimer: Brooster is neither fat nor bald but it was fun calling him names :greengrin

[Hibby D]

I'm interested to know what the "other" option is. :greengrin



Or do you think this thread will be closed before we prove its scientific worth?

:greengrin

[Wotherspiniesta]

Or do you think this thread will be closed before we prove its scientific worth?

:greengrin

I think Brooster had guaranteed that :greengrin

Would it also be wrong of me to suggest the OP is a jambo looking for a bite? Or am I slightly paranoid?:paranoid:

[marinello59]

Would it also be wrong of me to suggest the OP is a jambo looking for a bite? Or am I slightly paranoid?:paranoid:

He's behind you. :agree:

[Dunbar Hibee]

Any song that may offened that knob or his fans will do for me.

Agreed.

[marinello59]

Agreed.

And the same question to you then.:greengrin
Is the fact that it also offends a lot of Hibs fans acceptable as well?

[Dunbar Hibee]

And the same question to you then.:greengrin
Is the fact that it also offends a lot of Hibs fans acceptable as well?

There is a lot of songs that offend Hibs fans, and im not saying it is acceptable.. but that is the way it is. I personally think the Skacel song is the least offensive, why is it that it offends you may I ask?

[marinello59]

There is a lot of songs that offend Hibs fans, and im not saying it is acceptable.. but that is the way it is. I personally think the Skacel song is the least offensive, why is it that it offends you may I ask?

I think it is racist. That is also a matter of some debate I know but there you go.

[Keith_M]

I've come to be of the opinion that it's pointless discussing these kind of topics.

The people who sing the Skacel or Mercer songs are not going to be dissuaded from doing so by reason alone and those who are against it won't change their minds either. Pretty much the same issue with those people in the West (or in Gorgie) that think it OK to sing songs of racial bigotry or glorifying terrorism.

[iwasthere1972]

Don't want another 7 page thread on this. Am interested in how the outcome of a poll on this would look though.

That and the Wallace Mercer song should never be sung again. They are both an embarrassment.

Well that's my opinion.

Could exceed 7 pages.

[Dunbar Hibee]

I think it is racist. That is also a matter of some debate I know but there you go.

Fair enough. I disagree.

[Andy74]

I've come to be of the opinion that it's pointless discussing these kind of topics.

The people who sing the Skacel or Mercer songs are not going to be dissuaded from doing so by reason alone and those who are against it won't change their minds either. Pretty much the same issue with those people in the West (or in Gorgie) that think it OK to sing songs of racial bigotry or glorifying terrorism.

Not the same issue at all as plenty of people like myself don't actually think this song should be interpreted the way people have and so there's another option to this whole thing.

I think people who are overly offended by this song show a complete lack of undersatanding of a number of issues, not least of which the simple mechanics of how the song is put together, so there you go. :greengrin

[marinello59]

Not the same issue at all as plenty of people like myself don't actually think this song should be interpreted the way people have and so there's another option to this whole thing.

I think people who are overly offended by this song show a complete lack of undersatanding of a number of issues, not least of which the simple mechanics of how the song is put together, so there you go. :greengrin

Overly offended? Not sure what that means. Maybe it's you that has a complete lack of understanding. Or maybe boorishly singing something no matter what the majority of your fellow fans think is fine? :dunno:

[hibsbollah]

Not the same issue at all as plenty of people like myself don't actually think this song should be interpreted the way people have and so there's another option to this whole thing.

I think people who are overly offended by this song show a complete lack of undersatanding of a number of issues, not least of which the simple mechanics of how the song is put together, so there you go. :greengrin

I'm just grateful that your opinions and your rather ropey interpretations are firmly in the minority.

[marinello59]

Fair enough. I disagree.

And we probably never will agree on this one. :greengrin

Surely the best songs are ones that not only unite the support, they show a degree of humour. I would suggest that the Skacel song fails on both counts and should be binned for that alone. A large group of young guys sung for ninety minutes yesterday at Pittodrie and proved that an atmosphere can be created without this type of song. Some of their stuff was pretty funny too, the Sheep fans won't have enjoyed it. :greengrin

[CropleyWasGod]

Not the same issue at all as plenty of people like myself don't actually think this song should be interpreted the way people have and so there's another option to this whole thing.

I think people who are overly offended by this song show a complete lack of undersatanding of a number of issues, not least of which the simple mechanics of how the song is put together, so there you go. :greengrin

Ok, I am offended by it. What issues do I show a complete lack of understanding about?

[marinello59]

Ok, I am offended by it. What issues do I show a complete lack of understanding about?

Are you offended or overly offended?:greengrin

[ScottB]

No, it's pitiful, racist bull****

[DH1875]

Is singing about Aberdeen fans and sheep no offensive :dunno:. What about Glasgow slums, is that any different :dunno:. I don't get how people think it's OK to sing about Hartley being gay and then have a problem with the skacel song.

I've no problem with the song and in my opinion it's no where near racist.

[CropleyWasGod]

Are you offended or overly offended?:greengrin

I'll tell you once I hear the answer.... :greengrin

[stuartmcdee]

Rudie Skacels bird stole all his cash
Rudie Skacels bird stole all his cash

no hard feelings in still gives him a bit of stick :flag:

[Tricla]

Is singing about Aberdeen fans and sheep no offensive :dunno:. What about Glasgow slums, is that any different :dunno:. I don't get how people think it's OK to sing about Hartley being gay and then have a problem with the skacel song.

I've no problem with the song and in my opinion it's no where near racist.

:top marks

If we were to dissect every song the way the Sacktchel song has been dissected then we'd soon be silent on the terraces.

I can't fathom why this one song irks some so much when it's the same as some and nowhere near as bad as others.

[marinello59]

:top marks

If we were to dissect every song the way the Sacktchel song has been dissected then we'd soon be silent on the terraces.

I can't fathom why this one song irks some so much when it's the same as some and nowhere near as bad as others.

I thought you didn't care that it was racist or whatever. Now you seem to be arguing it is harmless. And you don't sing it. But now if we don't the terraces will be silent. And if anybody defends the song that you really don't care about you offer full support. Make up your mind, you really couldn't carry the arguments you have made over the two threads in a bucket.

[Tricla]

I thought you didn't care that it was racist or whatever. Now you seem to be arguing it is harmless. And you don't sing it. But now if we don't the terraces will be silent. And if anybody defends the song that you really don't care about you offer full support. Make up your mind, you really couldn't carry the arguments you have made over the two threads in a bucket.

If you took a minute to read my post you will see that I am not bigging up the Sacktchel song but am saying that I can't see why it irks some more than others.

Where do I say it is harmless?

I was offering support to the fact that there are other songs that we sing collectively that never receive this kind of scrutiny.

You are right though. I don't sing the refugee song.

At least you are paying a wee bit of attention.

[Albanian Hibs]

I don't mind the song and I've sung it a few times. I must be a racist then...but how is that possible when my husband is from Eastern Europe :rolleyes:

[Tricla]

I don't mind the song and I've sung it a few times. I must be a racist then...but how is that possible when my husband is from Eastern Europe :rolleyes:

I'm sure some soap boxer on here will tell you! :greengrin

[marinello59]

I'm sure some soap boxer on here will tell you! :greengrin

And your trademark, the petty jibe at those who disagree with you. :greengrin

[Tricla]

And your trademark, the petty jibe at those who disagree with you. :greengrin

Or as I call it, a satirical take on reality. :greengrin

Look, someone with an Eastern European husband sings this song at games and can see no harm in it.

Why are these threads even taking place. :confused:

[marinello59]

Or as I call it, a satirical take on reality. :greengrin

Look, someone with an Eastern European husband sings this song at games and can see no harm in it.

Why are these threads even taking place. :confused:

At times I find myself asking the same question. Maybe because me and you are keeping them going.:greengrin

[Tricla]

At times I find myself asking the same question. Maybe because me and you are keeping them going.:greengrin

Cough, I think you'll find it's you and I! :greengrin

[marinello59]

Cough, I think you'll find it's you and I! :greengrin

It's a fair cop. :greengrin

[pentlando]

If you simply look at the words in its song, then it would appear to be in bad taste. But skacel isn't sung about because Hibs fans are racist, it's cause he's an unpopular member of our rivals. Nobody cared whether Hartley was gay, or that Cameron's wife left him (iirc) or what Aberdeen fans do with their livestock. The songs are simply aimed at grating on the fans or the player. The words have no meaning behind them. I suspect that many people, me included, used to sing this without even thinking it may be in any way racist.

Finding a song that will upset the opposing fans or players without it being offensive is near on impossible, so these songs will continue to be sung

[Harpandcastle]

As I said in the other thread a few days ago, I'm not bothered in the slightest by the song.

Personally, I'd much rather we took steps towards binning the "Forever and ever..." song that has surfaced this season.

If your on about the song I think you are it has hardly surfaced this season, its been belted out for the 30 years I have been going to E.R.

And why do tell me should we be taking steps to binning it?

[Tricla]

If you simply look at the words in its song, then it would appear to be in bad taste. But skacel isn't sung about because Hibs fans are racist, it's cause he's an unpopular member of our rivals. Nobody cared whether Hartley was gay, or that Cameron's wife left him (iirc) or what Aberdeen fans do with their livestock. The songs are simply aimed at grating on the fans or the player. The words have no meaning behind them. I suspect that many people, me included, used to sing this without even thinking it may be in any way racist.

Finding a song that will upset the opposing fans or players without it being offensive is near on impossible, so these songs will continue to be sung

A fair reflection IMO.

[Hibby D]

I don't mind the song and I've sung it a few times. I must be a racist then...but how is that possible when my husband is from Eastern Europe :rolleyes:

It's perfectly possible to be racist against one culture and not another :agree:

I don't think singing that song automatically makes one a racist but it does make me question what your (and others) interpretation of a "refugee" is and the relevance to Rudi Skacel.

Out of interest, what does your husband think? :dunno:

[Andy74]

It's perfectly possible to be racist against one culture and not another :agree:

I don't think singing that song automatically makes one a racist but it does make me question what your (and others) interpretation of a "refugee" is and the relevance to Rudi Skacel.

Out of interest, what does your husband think? :dunno:

You will find the whole point is he isn't a refugee and in reality it has no relevance to Skacel.

Same as Hartley not being gay for example.

I don't think that song is really a reflection on what we think if gay people, just an attempt at an immature wind up.

The Skacel song is just the same.

[Andy74]

It's perfectly possible to be racist against one culture and not another :agree:

I don't think singing that song automatically makes one a racist but it does make me question what your (and others) interpretation of a "refugee" is and the relevance to Rudi Skacel.

Out of interest, what does your husband think? :dunno:
Along with the Eastern European people I know probably nothing as the song makes no sort of reference to them or what we think of them at all.

[marinello59]

You will find the whole point is he isn't a refugee and in reality it has no relevance to Skacel.

Same as Hartley not being gay for example.

I don't think that song is really a reflection on what we think if gay people, just an attempt at an immature wind up.

The Skacel song is just the same.

Is ******* refugee a term of endearment to refugees everywhere then? Surely they will get the irony? You are still ignoring the fact that many Hibs fans do think it is racist and therefore offensive. So why offend your fellow fans?

[marinello59]

If you simply look at the words in its song, then it would appear to be in bad taste. But skacel isn't sung about because Hibs fans are racist, it's cause he's an unpopular member of our rivals. Nobody cared whether Hartley was gay, or that Cameron's wife left him (iirc) or what Aberdeen fans do with their livestock. The songs are simply aimed at grating on the fans or the player. The words have no meaning behind them. I suspect that many people, me included, used to sing this without even thinking it may be in any way racist.

Finding a song that will upset the opposing fans or players without it being offensive is near on impossible, so these songs will continue to be sung

Ignorance is not a defence.

[marinello59]

Along with the Eastern European people I know probably nothing as the song makes no sort of reference to them or what we think of them at all.

Really. Have you been closing your ears? I have heard Eastern Europeans described as ******* scrounging illegals and refugees. Maybe not what you think of them but certainly what many think. And the Skacel song lets some think that is acceptable

[Hibby D]

You will find the whole point is he isn't a refugee and in reality it has no relevance to Skacel.



Thanks for pointing that out to me :rolleyes:




Same as Hartley not being gay for example.

And you know this for sure yeah? By the way I don't sing that either



I don't think that song is really a reflection on what we think if gay people, just an attempt at an immature wind up.


For some that may be the case - and who is this "we" you're referring to? :dunno:



The Skacel song is just the same.

No Andy it's not :no way:

The "we" you refer to don't sing "Hartley is ****ing gay" in the way the "we" sing Rudi is a "****ing refugee". The emphasis is on "****ing refugee" so it's not the same at all. It's disrespectful to no-one but refugees.... and the majority of the Hibs support who dislike it intensely.

[Ernie Cobra]

i can only guess the 29 people who voted yes, would also be in favour of Edinburgh is wonderful........:rolleyes:

[MCameron]

Hey - did you not read the op? I said not ano:wink:.ther 7 pages! You out to get out more....:wink:

For your info. I've been to Almond valley yesterday and for a walk and lunch with family today proving I do get out :greengrin

Anyhow the reason I posted about this particular song is I couldn't be erchied posting a poll for the Harley song, the Edinburgh song and other similar immature neanderthal spouting that I feel just as strongly about (after all I had places to go)

The reason I added other and not tractors option was that I couldn't actually work out from the posts what his stance is but didn't want him and others to feel 'excluded'. Oh wait a minute why should I care about others views :devil:

[Tricla]

Thanks for pointing that out to me :rolleyes:



And you know this for sure yeah? By the way I don't sing that either



For some that may be the case - and who is this "we" you're referring to? :dunno:



No Andy it's not :no way:

The "we" you refer to don't sing "Hartley is ****ing gay" in the way the "we" sing Rudi is a "****ing refugee". The emphasis is on "****ing refugee" so it's not the same at all. It's disrespectful to no-one but refugees.... and the majority of the Hibs support who dislike it intensely.

Maybe it's me but how does the sweary word make it worse?

[marinello59]

Maybe it's me but how does the sweary word make it worse?

It adds a large dollop of aggression.
Not that you care. :greengrin

[lapsedhibee]

Maybe it's me but how does the sweary word make it worse?

Makes him more of a refugee, in the same way that "[sweary word] brilliant" is better than just "brilliant"?

[Tricla]

Hey - did you not read the op? I said not ano:wink:.ther 7 pages! You out to get out more....:wink:

For your info. I've been to Almond valley yesterday and for a walk and lunch with family today proving I do get out :greengrin

Anyhow the reason I posted about this particular song is I couldn't be erchied posting a poll for the Harley song, the Edinburgh song and other similar immature neanderthal spouting that I feel just as strongly about (after all I had places to go)

The reason I added other and not tractors option was that I couldn't actually work out from the posts what his stance is but didn't want him and others to feel 'excluded'. Oh wait a minute why should I care about others views :devil:

Is this meant to be me?

[Tricla]

It adds a large dollop of aggression.
Not that you care. :greengrin

I see.

I thought it made it fit with the beat better.

Must be a stick or a stone. :wink:

[marinello59]

Is this meant to be me?

Sticks and stones Tractor. It's what makes you roll. :greengrin

[Tricla]

Makes him more of a refugee, in the same way that "[sweary word] brilliant" is better than just "brilliant"?

I thought it was just a working class Scottish thing to prefix everything with a **** or a *******!

[Tricla]

Sticks and stones Tractor. It's what makes you roll. :greengrin

:faf:

[Hibby D]

Maybe it's me but how does the sweary word make it worse?

Marinello and Lapsed summed it up much better than I could have, so I'll let their responses stand as your answer.

Although I suspect you are clever enough to have worked that out already :greengrin

[Tricla]

Marinello and Lapsed summed it up much better than I could have, so I'll let their responses stand as your answer.

Although I suspect you are clever enough to have worked that out already :greengrin

Thanks.

I wasn't fully aware there were different levels of refugeeness identifiable only by crudeness of sweary word applied.

By that logic a ******* refugee is by far the purest whereas a god damn refugee is slightly less prickly.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

When did refugees become a race?

[marinello59]

When did refugees become a race?
:rolleyes:

[Andy74]

Is ******* refugee a term of endearment to refugees everywhere then? Surely they will get the irony? You are still ignoring the fact that many Hibs fans do think it is racist and therefore offensive. So why offend your fellow fans?

I don't sing it, but I do think many of my fellow fans are being a bit daft about this one, but as it is out there as being interprested this way I won't sing it.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

:rolleyes:

Helpful response! I take it the song, whether you sing it or not, isn't racist then?

[Andy74]

Thanks for pointing that out to me :rolleyes:



And you know this for sure yeah? By the way I don't sing that either



For some that may be the case - and who is this "we" you're referring to? :dunno:



No Andy it's not :no way:

The "we" you refer to don't sing "Hartley is ****ing gay" in the way the "we" sing Rudi is a "****ing refugee". The emphasis is on "****ing refugee" so it's not the same at all. It's disrespectful to no-one but refugees.... and the majority of the Hibs support who dislike it intensely.

Do you live in Scotland?

You will know the sweary word is just a filler most of the time and makes no odds to the song. singing Hartley is gay or Hartley is ****ing gay is only different due to the phrasing of the song.

[Tricla]

Helpful response! I take it the song, whether you sing it or not, isn't racist then?

This is what I have been thinking. It may be considered inappropriate at most but surely not racist given that refugees are not a race:-

rac·ism (rszm)
n.
1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

Therefore it surely falls into the realm of the 'Weegie Slums' or 'Sheep ****ging ********' songs that seem to be widely accepted.

Can I ask, do any of the anti refugee song clan sing either of these songs?

[marinello59]

Helpful response! I take it the song, whether you sing it or not, isn't racist then?

OK. Refugees are all white anglo saxons then? So I guess that using refugee as a derogatory term can't possibly be racist then. Is that your point? Or maybe you are just playing with semantics rather than making a properly thought out contribution.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

My properly thought out contribution is I couldnae give a flying one about the song!

[marinello59]

This is what I have been thinking. It may be considered inappropriate at most but surely not racist given that refugees are not a race:-


Refugees are all British then?

For somebody who doesn't care you are spending a lot of time defending the song.

[MCameron]

[QUOTE=Andy74;2777032]Do you live in Scotland?

You will know the sweary word is just a filler most of the time and makes no odds to the song. singing Hartley is gay or Hartley is ****ing gay is only different due to the phrasing of the song.[/QUOTEiy


Dearie dearie me!:bitchy::bitchy:

....and nothing to do with it being blatantly homophobic whether expletives are added or not.

[Tricla]

OK. Refugees are all white anglo saxons then? So I guess that using refugee as a derogatory term can't possibly be racist then. Is that your point? Or maybe you are just playing with semantics rather than making a properly thought out contribution.

Refugees are 'people' exiled and fleeing for safety regardless of their skin colour.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

OK. Refugees are all white anglo saxons then?

Has anyone told the Somalians? ;-)

[marinello59]

Refugees are 'people' exiled and fleeing for safety regardless of their skin colour.

And they are all Scots....or British? Keep digging.

[Tricla]

Refugees are all British then?

For somebody who doesn't care you are spending a lot of time defending the song.

I'm not defending the song. Just the will of common sense and definition. And no, refugees are not all British. They're not actually any race therefore by definition the song cannot be considered racist.

I'm happy to spend more time posting web sourced definitions if it helps.

[Tricla]

And they are all Scots....or British? Keep digging.

I'm sorry but I don't get your point.

The definition of racism is clear and proves that the refugee song is not racist. What are you getting at?

[Ernie Cobra]

Refugees are 'people' exiled and fleeing for safety regardless of their skin colour.

for one so intellectual :rolleyes: it shoud be apparent that the song would be deemed racist. It was meant to be sung as a slur not congratulatory, so yes pendantics are taking over here, refugee is not a race however when discussed in terms of social ettiquette to call someone a ****ing refugee is derogatory and demeaning.

Do you think the edinburgh is wonderful song is ok?

[MCameron]

Refugees are 'people' exiled and fleeing for safety regardless of their skin colour.

Scakel is a foreigner who has chosen to work here. He's branded a ****ing refugee which isn't being sung to show how welcome he is. It's tinged with hatred and intolerance and that is what OUR club wants to cut out. So by choosing to go against their wishes are you a 'supporter' of Hibernian football club?

[marinello59]

I'm not defending the song. Just the will of common sense and definition. And no, refugees are not all British. They're not actually any race therefore by definition the song cannot be considered racist.

I'm happy to spend mire time posting web sourced definitions if it helps.

Fill your boots. it still won't make you right. I would have thought that there is a fair chance that refugees are of a different race from the rest of the population. I would hazard a guess at a 100% chance. How many times have you heard people equating refugee with illegal immigrant? Tell me that isn't racist. Play with semantics all you want, it's the same tactics used by the Old Firm to defend their 'folk' songs and most decent people see right through it.

I'm out, it's time for a very large glass of wine.

[DH1875]

Therefore it surely falls into the realm of the 'Weegie Slums' or 'Sheep ****ging ********' songs that seem to be widely accepted.

Can I ask, do any of the anti refugee song clan sing either of these songs?


Hey, that's my argument, You get your own :na na:. It's a good one though aint it. Stupid thing is we've hundreds of fans that come from Aberdeen, Glasgow and the west. Where's the consideration for them? You don't find them all on here crying about the songs we sing, in fact you'll find a lot of them join in.

The song is not racist and I make no apologies cause I'll be singing it the next time we play the yams and, by the looks of it I won't be the only one.

[MCameron]

Hey, that's my argument, You get your own :na na:. It's a good one though aint it. Stupid thing is we've hundreds of fans that come from Aberdeen, Glasgow and the west. Where's the consideration for them? You don't find them all on here crying about the songs we sing, in fact you'll find a lot of them join in.

The song is not racist and I make no apologies cause I'll be singing it the next time we play the yams and, by the looks of it I won't be the only one.


If Hibs were to issue a statement that said they considered the skacel song racist, the Harley song homophobic, the Edinburgh song as inappropriate would that change your decision on whether to sing them? Or don't you care to be part of the club and what it stands for?

[Tricla]

for one so intellectual :rolleyes: it shoud be apparent that the song would be deemed racist. It was meant to be sung as a slur not congratulatory, so yes pendantics are taking over here, refugee is not a race however when discussed in terms of social ettiquette to call someone a ****ing refugee is derogatory and demeaning.

Do you think the edinburgh is wonderful song is ok?

I'll be 100% honest when I say I have no idea how the Edinburgh is wonderful song goes BTW. I am a Hibs supporter of 25 years but not originally from Edinburgh.

In answer to your point, whether the refugee song is deemed racist or not is irrelevant. It simply isn't. Pedantics don't come in to it.

It can cause offense and clearly does with some and is meant to put that wee scrote off his game and it's effectiveness therein is questionable as he is good against us more often than not.

Social etiquette is something that has rarely crept in to football in 135 years so I don't see it starting any time soon.

[lapsedhibee]

Marinello and Lapsed summed it up much better than I could have, so I'll let their responses stand as your answer.

Although I suspect you are clever enough to have worked that out already :greengrin

I actually have some sympathy with Tractor's point about the significance of the sweary f word in this context.

[scoopyboy]

Is it ok to whistle the tune when smelly jambos are in your boozer?

[Tricla]

Scakel is a foreigner who has chosen to work here. He's branded a ****ing refugee which isn't being sung to show how welcome he is. It's tinged with hatred and intolerance and that is what OUR club wants to cut out. So by choosing to go against their wishes are you a 'supporter' of Hibernian football club?

Why would we welcome a Hertz player? :confused: The paranoid gestures that you are a Yam don't seem so far fetched IMO.

So you're now suggesting that because I don't care if this song is sung I am going against the clubs wishes and therefore am not a supporter of HFC?

I'm not going to get in to another argument about what not sharing your views means.

Not that I need to prove it to you but I am a supporter of 25 years. You seem more like a crap politician than an actual football fan.

Do one mate.

:bye:

[Ernie Cobra]

I'll be 100% honest when I say I have no idea how the Edinburgh is wonderful song goes BTW. I am a Hibs supporter of 25+ years but not originally from here. Ask another Hibs fan, maybe one of 30 years + for guidance :greengrin

In answer to your point, whether the refugee song is deemed racist or not is irrelevant. it is! its the topic we are discussing

It simply isn't. running the risk of this becoming a pantomime but it is
Pedantics don't come in to it. your web based analogies for the definition of refugee makes it pendantic in thier attempt to belittle the fact the song is deemed to be racist

It can cause offense and clearly does with some and is meant to put that wee scrote off his game and it's effectiveness therein is questionable as he is good against us more often than not. Well lets throw bananas at black players aswell im sure this would upset them

Social etiquette is something that has rarely crept in to football in 135 years so I don't see it starting any time soon. Did you know that up untill circa 300 years ago we thought the world was flat and somewhere you could fall off the edge!!
...:wink:

[Tricla]

I'll be 100% honest when I say I have no idea how the Edinburgh is wonderful song goes BTW. I am a Hibs supporter of 25+ years but not originally from here. Ask another Hibs fan, maybe one of 30 years + for guidance :greengrin

Honestly I don't know how it goes.

In answer to your point, whether the refugee song is deemed racist or not is irrelevant. it is! its the topic we are discussing

It simply isn't. running the risk of this becoming a pantomime but it is
Pedantics don't come in to it. your web based analogies for the definition of refugee makes it pendantic in thier attempt to belittle the fact the song is deemed to be racist[/QUOTE]

So what? The fact that it isn't racist by definition prevails I'm afraid.

[/QUOTE]
It can cause offense and clearly does with some and is meant to put that wee scrote off his game and it's effectiveness therein is questionable as he is good against us more often than not. Well lets throw bananas at black players aswell im sure this would upset them[/QUOTE]

Now you're being pedantic.

[/QUOTE]Social etiquette is something that has rarely crept in to football in 135 years so I don't see it starting any time soon. Did you know that up untill circa 300 years ago we thought the world was flat and somewhere you could fall off the edge!![/QUOTE]
...:wink:[/QUOTE]

And again.....

[MCameron]

Why would we welcome a Hertz player? :confused

I wasnt suggesting we should welcome him - You just don't seem to get it!

The paranoid gestures that you are a Yam don't seem so far fetched IMO.

Think what you like - I know I'm 100% hibby.

So you're now suggesting that because I don't care if this song is sung I am going against the clubs wishes and therefore am not a supporter of HFC?

The club 100% want these types of song to stop.

I'm not going to get in to another argument about what not sharing your views means.

Good. I'm not saying you shouldn't be able to share your views tricolor. I am sure the club would be interested in your views - they have different views though. Would you vote for a political party whose views you disagreed with?

Not that I need to prove it to you but I am a supporter of

25 years. You seem more like a crap politician than an actual football fan. Sticks snd stones aye.

Do one mate. - WHEN ALL ELSE FAILS EH!:aok:

[Tricla]

And put you point in bold red to make sure it gets through to me! :greengrin

[1875godsgift]

[QUOTE=Ernie Cobra;2777079][QUOTE=Tricla;2777069]I'll be 100% honest when I say I have no idea how the Edinburgh is wonderful song goes BTW. I am a Hibs supporter of 25+ years but not originally from here. Ask another Hibs fan, maybe one of 30 years + for guidance :greengrin

I've been going to ER for 35+ years, albeit not regularly, and come from there, but I can't think which song it is? :confused:

[Removed]

Why can't folk manage to quote properly? I'm getting confused who's on what side now :greengrin

[Ernie Cobra]

In answer to your point, whether the refugee song is deemed racist or not is irrelevant. it is! its the topic we are discussing

It simply isn't. running the risk of this becoming a pantomime but it is
Pedantics don't come in to it. your web based analogies for the definition of refugee makes it pendantic in thier attempt to belittle the fact the song is deemed to be racist

So what? The fact that it isn't racist by definition prevails I'm afraid.

[/QUOTE]
It can cause offense and clearly does with some and is meant to put that wee scrote off his game and it's effectiveness therein is questionable as he is good against us more often than not. Well lets throw bananas at black players aswell im sure this would upset them[/QUOTE]

Now you're being pedantic.

[/QUOTE]Social etiquette is something that has rarely crept in to football in 135 years so I don't see it starting any time soon. Did you know that up untill circa 300 years ago we thought the world was flat and somewhere you could fall off the edge!![/QUOTE]
...:wink:[/QUOTE]

And again.....[/QUOTE]

yawn....i grow weary of your poor web based dictionary grammar and logic, all points made are valid other than the last little point which was meant in its origin to draw a parrallell with your illogical musings. I must retire now and have my chech refugee maid fetch my smoking jacket and pipe. As it is time for Mr mcilroy to fall apart in front of the watching world for thier televisual delectation.

[Ernie Cobra]

[QUOTE=Ernie Cobra;2777079][QUOTE=Tricla;2777069]I'll be 100% honest when I say I have no idea how the Edinburgh is wonderful song goes BTW. I am a Hibs supporter of 25+ years but not originally from here. Ask another Hibs fan, maybe one of 30 years + for guidance :greengrin

I've been going to ER for 35+ years, albeit not regularly, and come from there, but I can't think which song it is? :confused:
ask a fan of 40 years + for guidance :wink:

[lapsedhibee]

[QUOTE=65bd;2777098]Why can't folk manage to quote properly? I'm getting confused who's on what side now :greengrin

Totally agree :agree:

[Wembley67]

Just shows how ***** a day out on the terraces has become, some people must get offended just opening their eyes in the morning.

Oh and mercer is deid.

[Tricla]

WHEN ALL ELSE FAILS EH!

Yes, I feel defeated by you and your avalanche of solid political and social standpoints.

But not half as defeated as I feel as I have been by how mediocre you have made me feel as a Hibs supporter and how much I have gone against a club I have paid £1000's to over the years due to my views on a few meaningless words.

Still do one ya :trumpet:

[Removed]

[QUOTE=lapsedhibee;2777108][QUOTE=65bd;2777098]Why can't folk manage to quote properly? I'm getting confused who's on what side now :greengrin

Totally agree :agree:[/QUOTE

:greengrin

[Tricla]

Just shows how ***** a day out on the terraces has become, some people must get offended just opening their eyes in the morning.

Oh and mercer is deid.

:not worth

[1875godsgift]

ask a fan of 40 years + for guidance :wink:

How does the Edinburgh is Wonderful song go?

[Ernie Cobra]

How does the Edinburgh is Wonderful song go?
to the tune of when the saints go marching in...replaced with some rather choice right wing lyrics. And has been heard on the terraces of easter road, not now it has to be said, but as we are on the downward spiral.......

[HNA12]

How does the Edinburgh is Wonderful song go?

Somebody can PM you if you really don't know. It isn't getting posted up on here.

[Tricla]

yawn....i grow weary of your poor web based dictionary grammar and logic, all points made are valid other than the last little point which was meant in its origin to draw a parrallell with your illogical musings. I must retire now and have my chech refugee maid fetch my smoking jacket and pipe. As it is time for Mr mcilroy to fall apart in front of the watching world for thier televisual delectation.

It's not my logic. It's fact but don't let that get in the way for you!

Throwing bananas at black people is meant as a racist slur and has been well documented which I agree with and accept. IMO the refugee song doesn't have that intention nor definition so isn't comparable.

I am glad you are retiring as I was growing weary of your non factually backed up chat! :devil:

I hope Rory hangs on though!

[Tricla]

Only 2 pages to go ladies and gents!

[1875godsgift]

Somebody can PM you if you really don't know. It isn't getting posted up on here.

It's ok, I still don't know it but if it's right wing ***** I don't want to!

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

So, have we established that the little ditty is objectionable to some, but, not racist yet?

[Wembley67]

So, have we established that the little ditty is objectionable to some, but, not racist yet?

Looks like it. I really don't appreciate the bigoted nature of it though.

[hibsbollah]

Looks like it. I really don't appreciate the bigoted nature of it though.

you might not like it, but thats the nature of the song.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Good! I was starting to worry about myself after being accused of being racist by a young Brazilian with a strange haircut after the Scotland game @ The Emirates!

[Tricla]

Looks like it. I really don't appreciate the bigoted nature of it though.

I'm afraid not. Some still 'deem' it as racist and choose to ignore what racist actually is.

[Andy74]

[QUOTE=Andy74;2777032]Do you live in Scotland?

You will know the sweary word is just a filler most of the time and makes no odds to the song. singing Hartley is gay or Hartley is ****ing gay is only different due to the phrasing of the song.[/QUOTEi


Dearie dearie me!:bitchy::bitchy:

....and nothing to do with it being blatantly homophobic whether expletives are added or not.

Thanks. You are kind of making my point for me.

[Ernie Cobra]

I think some are using this thread to increase thier post count, thus gving them the uber fan status that they so clearly crave.

[Removed]

I think some are using this thread to increase thier post count, thus gving them the uber fan status that they so clearly crave.

Surely not :bitchy:

[MCameron]

Yes, I feel defeated by you and your avalanche of solid political and social standpoints.

But not half as defeated as I feel as I have been by how mediocre you have made me feel as a Hibs supporter and how much I have gone against a club I have paid £1000's to over the years due to my views on a few meaningless words.

Still do one ya :trumpet: Yup - says it all really. when debate and discussion get too difficult it's the easiest route to take tricycle.

[Tricla]

I think some are using this thread to increase thier post count, thus gving them the uber fan status that they so clearly crave.

:confused:

[Dashing Bob S]

Can't be bothered looking through the thread. Did we resolve the riveting issue of whether the Rudi S Refugee song is racist or just offensive, embarrassing crap?

[Tricla]

Yup - says it all really. when debate and discussion get too difficult it's the easiest route to take tricycle.

Now you have called me Tricolor, Tractor and Tricycle! None of which has appeared witty nor humerous so can only be a feeble attempt at slander. Should I complain to the club under your interpreted rules of racism? What if I was to act bairnesk and and call you various connotations of your username such as MCamerprat, MCamertool or MC***.

Thank heavens I roll as a sticks and stones type of guy! :greengrin

You are hypocrisy personified my friend.

Debate and discussion are impossible with someone who is devoid of these skills such as yourself. These skills involve being able to hear the views of others whilst not necessarily accepting them.

Again, do one.

[Ernie Cobra]

:confused:


i hae processed all of your posts throught the flux capacitor, and its findingsare, that you are:

a) at the wind up
b) feeling somewhat inadequate due to your low post count and see this thread as an ideal way of inflation
c) you are indeed Johnny of johnny goes to the shops with 50p fame.......
d) Rudi Skatchel, meaning you are actually best place to pass comment on the emotional turmoil that is felt upon hearing this song.

[HNA1]

i hae processed all of your posts throught the flux capacitor, and its findingsare, that you are:

a) at the wind up
b) feeling somewhat inadequate due to your low post count and see this thread as an ideal way of inflation
c) you are indeed Johnny of johnny goes to the shops with 50p fame.......
d) Rudi Skatchel, meaning you are actually best place to pass comment on the emotional turmoil that is felt upon hearing this song.

Any chance you guys can keep this on topic before it degenerates into tit-for-tat digs, please?

[Tricla]

i hae processed all of your posts throught the flux capacitor, and its findingsare, that you are:

a) at the wind up
b) feeling somewhat inadequate due to your low post count and see this thread as an ideal way of inflation
c) you are indeed Johnny of johnny goes to the shops with 50p fame.......
d) Rudi Skatchel, meaning you are actually best place to pass comment on the emotional turmoil that is felt upon hearing this song.

Again :confused:

BTW, can I see your flux capacitor? :greengrin

Edit: You're post count is miles lower than mine! Who's on the windup?

[Ernie Cobra]

Any chance you guys can keep this on topic before it degenerates into tit-for-tat digs, please?


i feel that i am on topic........as i have said on numerous occassions there is absolutely no doubt whatsoever in my mind that yuri gagarins first space flight is more important than the american moon landing

[HNA1]

i feel that i am on topic........as i have said on numerous occassions there is absolutely no doubt whatsoever in my mind that yuri gagarins first space flight is more important than the american moon landing

That's more like it.:thumbsup:

[The Falcon]

Now you have called me Tricolor, Tractor and Tricycle! None of which has appeared witty nor humerous so can only be a feeble attempt at slander. Should I complain to the club under your interpreted rules of racism? What if I was to act bairnesk and and call you various connotations of your username such as MCamerprat, MCamertool or MC***.

Thank heavens I roll as a sticks and stones type of guy! :greengrin

You are hypocrisy personified my friend.

Debate and discussion are impossible with someone who is devoid of these skills such as yourself. These skills involve being able to hear the views of others whilst not necessarily accepting them.

Again, do one.

Fair enough. But is it racsist or bigoted? Thats the big question.

[blairwallace]

i find it funny that the older members of this forum are saying that the song is unacceptable, when these members, who in their youth had people at easter road singing irish songs and went about in 'firms' as hooligans fighting other teams fans, notorious for weapon wielding (poles, petrol bombs). yet a song sang against our teams closest rivals as a way of getting stuck into them about saying their "idol" is a refugee to simply wind them up and find this offensive

[Ernie Cobra]

i find it funny that the older members of this forum are saying that the song is unacceptable, when these members, who in their youth had people at easter road singing irish songs and went about in 'firms' as hooligans fighting other teams fans, notorious for weapon wielding (poles, petrol bombs). yet a song sang against our teams closest rivals as a way of getting stuck into them about saying their "idol" is a refugee to simply wind them up and find this offensive


youve been dan the battle cruiser wiv danny dyer again intcha geezer.

[sesoim]

There's banter and there's banter though and I guess it's up to us as individuals to set a benchmark.

Singing songs about someone being "bald" or "fat" doesn't quite reach the murky grey quagmire that the Skacel songs does.





Personally, I'd rather get called a refugee than "fatty" or "baldy"

[sesoim]

You will find the whole point is he isn't a refugee and in reality it has no relevance to Skacel.

Same as Hartley not being gay for example.

I don't think that song is really a reflection on what we think if gay people, just an attempt at an immature wind up.

The Skacel song is just the same.


:agree: People that take these things literally must be pretty thick. But some folk also use these things as an excuse to get all politically correct (ie a couple of embarrassing posters here), as it makes them feel in some way morally superior.

What I hate the most about this kind of issue is the hypocrisy. In society now, an individual can receive all kind of disgusting personal insults and get no support. But if someone receives even the slightest hint of an insult that ticks the PC brigade's agenda, then there is a huge public outcry.

[marinello59]

:agree: People that take these things literally must be pretty thick.(Starting your post by insulting those who hold a different viewpoint from yourself is certainly an interesting tactic. ) But some folk also use these things as an excuse to get all politically correct (Ah, that term again. A lazy way of labelling those who disagree with the users viewpoint (ie a couple of embarrassing posters here), (Actually I will put my hands up to that one. My family would agree.:greengrin.) as it makes them feel in some way morally superior.
(Morally superior? Is asking fellow fans not to sing a song because you find it racist or just plain embarrassing an attempt to claim moral superiority? Anyway now we have got past your spiteful sneers let's get to your actual point)
What I hate the most about this kind of issue is the hypocrisy. In society now, an individual can receive all kind of disgusting personal insults and get no support. But if someone receives even the slightest hint of an insult that ticks the PC brigade's agenda, then there is a huge public outcry.

Pc brigades agenda? That lazy label again. Surely the majority of people are fairly well adjusted and find any disgusting personal insult objectionable. Or am I moving in the wrong circles? What point are you actually making here? Are you calling for all disgusting chants to be banned or are you suggesting that two wrongs would make a right? Or are you simply throwing another jibe at those who disagree with you by labelling them hypocrites?

I wouldn't claim the poll result on here to be scientific but it does seem that the majority dislike the song for whatever reason. (Whether it is because they find it racist or just an embarrassment to our support.) You never actually said yourself. Do you sing it?

[bighairyfaeleith]

read a lot of the posts on here, and I have to say that my viewpoint is still the same, I generally do not sing it, but it doesn't bother me as a song and I don't think racist when I hear it sung.

I personally think as a set of fans, we are far to quick to jump on our own, after the derby this always comes up but I was far more annoyed at he throwing of objects etc than I was by any song that was sung.

If people don't like the song don't sing it, if no one sings it will quickly disappear.

[Beefster]

:agree: People that take these things literally must be pretty thick. But some folk also use these things as an excuse to get all politically correct (ie a couple of embarrassing posters here), as it makes them feel in some way morally superior.

What I hate the most about this kind of issue is the hypocrisy. In society now, an individual can receive all kind of disgusting personal insults and get no support. But if someone receives even the slightest hint of an insult that ticks the PC brigade's agenda, then there is a huge public outcry.

From the man that insisted that Colin Calderwood was a proven huddie and that Jimmy Calderwood was the answer to all our prayers before falling completely silent once we started winning, I'm not sure that you're qualified to comment on what makes a poster embarrassing.

[MCameron]

:agree: People that take these things literally must be pretty thick. But some folk also use these things as an excuse to get all politically correct (ie a couple of embarrassing posters here), as it makes them feel in some way morally superior.

If you're referring to me let me make my point crystal clear. I think ANY song that taunts others on grounds of race, religion, gender or ANY other aspect that people think make them different is unaceptable (as do 'our' club). If half the effort was put into singing songs 'bigging up' our club and our players perhaps they would get a positive lift from it that would outweigh the negative effect you claim to be trying to have on the other team's players - no?

This poll shows a significant percentage of support deem the song unacceptable. What worries me is the element that see nothing at all wrong with it. If 30% of our fanbase is okay about this being sung is this really any more than across at Gorgie, Ibrox or Parkhead in percentage terms that sing songs that they can see nothing wrong with? It goes deeper than songs at football - Scottish society is still rotten with racism, bigotry, homophobia and other intolerances.

[pentlando]

If you're referring to me let me make my point crystal clear. I think ANY song that taunts others on grounds of race, religion, gender or ANY other aspect that people think make them different is unaceptable (as do 'our' club). If half the effort was put into singing songs 'bigging up' our club and our players perhaps they would get a positive lift from it that would outweigh the negative effect you claim to be trying to have on the other team's players - no?

This poll shows a significant percentage of support deem the song unacceptable. What worries me is the element that see nothing at all wrong with it. If 30% of our fanbase is okay about this being sung is this really any more than across at Gorgie, Ibrox or Parkhead in percentage terms that sing songs that they can see nothing wrong with? It goes deeper than songs at football - Scottish society is still rotten with racism, bigotry, homophobia and other intolerances.

I'm not pro the skacel song or anti it, but by your point there it would wipe out the majority of songs. For example we could no longer sing 'you hearts *****', as we would be taunting them because of a sporting institute they chose to represent, meaning taunting them on an 'aspect that people think make them different'. Once this song is broken down it is in theory no worse than the above chant that i've never heard anyone complain about before.

[JimBHibees]

:agree: People that take these things literally must be pretty thick. But some folk also use these things as an excuse to get all politically correct (ie a couple of embarrassing posters here), as it makes them feel in some way morally superior.

What I hate the most about this kind of issue is the hypocrisy. In society now, an individual can receive all kind of disgusting personal insults and get no support. But if someone receives even the slightest hint of an insult that ticks the PC brigade's agenda, then there is a huge public outcry.

The rallying call of the bigot I am afraid. The Skacel song is one that no doubt sad losers that follow the BNP would be creaming themselves with given it completely suits their agenda of hating foreigners who come to this country to work or make a life. To sing this song at a football game is an embarressment to the club and like it or not is full of racist overtones.

[Tricla]

If you're referring to me let me make my point crystal clear. I think ANY song that taunts others on grounds of race, religion, gender or ANY other aspect that people think make them different is unaceptable (as do 'our' club). If half the effort was put into singing songs 'bigging up' our club and our players perhaps they would get a positive lift from it that would outweigh the negative effect you claim to be trying to have on the other team's players - no?

This poll shows a significant percentage of support deem the song unacceptable. What worries me is the element that see nothing at all wrong with it. If 30% of our fanbase is okay about this being sung is this really any more than across at Gorgie, Ibrox or Parkhead in percentage terms that sing songs that they can see nothing wrong with? It goes deeper than songs at football - Scottish society is still rotten with racism, bigotry, homophobia and other intolerances.

Just out of interest, do you have a problem with the 'Gorgie/Weegie Slums' song, the 'Sheep' song, the 'Only happy on Giro day' song etc?

These have been aired on the terraces for years and 'our club' don't seem to care. However according to you (the new club spokesman it would appear) they are no longer acceptable.

You really are a budding martyr for political correctness (apologies for use of the lazy term) and if you have it your way we will soon be standing on the terraces humming tunes rather than singing songs for fear of making somebody cry.

[Tricla]

I'm not pro the skacel song or anti it, but by your point there it would wipe out the majority of songs. For example we could no longer sing 'you hearts b*****d', as we would be taunting them because of a sporting institute they chose to represent, meaning taunting them on an 'aspect that people think make them different'. Once this song is broken down it is in theory no worse than the above chant that i've never heard anyone complain about before.

Good point. MCameron is on a one man mission to silence the masses.

[RickyS]

Just out of interest, do you have a problem with the 'Gorgie/Weegie Slums' song, the 'Sheep' song, the 'Only happy on Giro day' song etc?

These have been aired on the terraces for years and 'our club' don't seem to care. However according to you (the new club spokesman it would appear) they are no longer acceptable.

You really are a budding martyr for political correctness (apologies for use of the lazy term) and if you have it your way we will soon be standing on the terraces humming tunes rather than singing songs for fear of making somebody cry.

one would like to congratulate you on the excellent post old chap:greengrin

[Greentinted]

i find it funny that the older members of this forum are saying that the song is unacceptable, when these members, who in their youth had people at easter road singing irish songs and went about in 'firms' as hooligans fighting other teams fans, notorious for weapon wielding (poles, petrol bombs). yet a song sang against our teams closest rivals as a way of getting stuck into them about saying their "idol" is a refugee to simply wind them up and find this offensive

When you say 'older' where about in the chronological scheme of things does your generalisation fall? (Serious question - not a dig)
If you refer to the 70s-80s, it would be fair to say that not all of us endorsed any of the examples you cite above and many others stopped attending Easter Road, particularly when the casual movement had taken a firm hold (and I'm not wishing to take this down the digressive avenue of another 'casual/hooligan' debate).
I'd like to think we are a more enlightened society now, and add this to the post-internet phenomena of instant information which is a major precipitant factor in this enlightenment, then surely even us 'older guys' are permitted a modicum of regret and a post-enlightenment rebuttal of the once accepted 'values'.

[basehibby]

:top marks

If we were to dissect every song the way the Sacktchel song has been dissected then we'd soon be silent on the terraces.

I can't fathom why this one song irks some so much when it's the same as some and nowhere near as bad as others.

Genuine refugees are among the most vulnerable people in our society - these are ordinary people who have lost everything in fleeing war, persecution or natural disaster and they include men, women and children of all ages.

Personally I don't feel at all right about singing any song that further stigmatises these people. I also feel embarassed and annoyed at the ignorant fandangoes in our support who would associate the name of Hibernian FC with their own small mindeness by singing this along with other garbage like the "Edinburgh Song" at ER.

"If they knew their history" these fannies would realise that the founders of Hibernian FC would likely hold a very dim view of these pathetic attempts at "banter", coming as they did from an imigrant population some of whom were probably refugees of a kind themselves.

[Mikeystewart]

It interesting that the two mostly vied and posted on topics on the thread the last couple of days has been related to hearts. Is there nothing going on with Hibs at the moment?

[Albanian Hibs]

It's perfectly possible to be racist against one culture and not another :agree:

I don't think singing that song automatically makes one a racist but it does make me question what your (and others) interpretation of a "refugee" is and the relevance to Rudi Skacel.

Out of interest, what does your husband think? :dunno:

My husband couldn't care less. You could change Skacel's name to his name in the song and he would find it amusing. Those close to us know his past "immigration status" and he is happy to tell us all the stories. This song means nothing, it's not offensive or racist to us what so ever. It's just a very catchy tune IMO.

[basehibby]

Or as I call it, a satirical take on reality. :greengrin

Look, someone with an Eastern European husband sings this song at games and can see no harm in it.

Why are these threads even taking place. :confused:

Some of Hitler's Brown shirts had jewish girlfriends.....

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Some of Hitler's Brown shirts had jewish girlfriends.....

surprised it took so long! :rolleyes:

[Harpandcastle]

Good point. MCameron is on a one man mission to silence the masses.

The self importance certain people grant themselves is outstanding.

Maybe game by game we could be told what every individual in the stadium will find offensive, funny, rude etc so we know what can and cannot be said, sung or even thought. Or maybe we just sit there thinking pure thoughts looking like a team of clowns with our green glasses on then go online afterwards and give ourselves a big pat on the back for being really great guys?

The last thing I need is trying to watch a game in an environment of people keeling over in shock or bursting into tears. It would also save all the moral cruisaders collecting seat numbers and calling for people to be banned on a weekly basis.

[Beefster]

The self importance certain people grant themselves is outstanding.

Maybe game by game we could be told what every individual in the stadium will find offensive, funny, rude etc so we know what can and cannot be said, sung or even thought. Or maybe we just sit there thinking pure thoughts looking like a team of clowns with our green glasses on then go online afterwards and give ourselves a big pat on the back for being really great guys?

The last thing I need is trying to watch a game in an environment of people keeling over in shock or bursting into tears. It would also save all the moral cruisaders collecting seat numbers and calling for people to be banned on a weekly basis.

Why don't you post on the 'Rangers to be punished by UEFA' thread that they should be able to sing whatever bigoted ***** that they want, that UEFA's self-importance is breathtaking and who cares anyway if a few Catholics get targeted for abuse?

[basehibby]

surprised it took so long! :rolleyes:

What?!?!?

It's a perfectly valid comparison - the assertion that just cos someone who's married to an Eastern European finds the Skachel song amusing then it must be OK, holds about as much water as saying that just cos some of Hitler's Brown Shirts were dating Jewish girls then the Nazis didn't have an anti semitic agenda.

Get it?!?!?

[Luna_Asylum]

surprised it took so long! :rolleyes:

Its more of the same in fact. We were lectured on Belsin by the thread starter/unofficial club spokeman on the Scotsman article thread.

[basehibby]

Its more of the same in fact. We were lectured on Belsin by the thread starter/unofficial club spokeman on the Scotsman article thread.

Is it so surprising when we're discussing a song disparaging refugees that the subject wanders in this direction?

[bighairyfaeleith]

What?!?!?

It's a perfectly valid comparison - the assertion that just cos someone who's married to an Eastern European finds the Skachel song amusing then it must be OK, holds about as much water as saying that just cos some of Hitler's Brown Shirts were dating Jewish girls then the Nazis didn't have an anti semitic agenda.

Get it?!?!?

seriously get a grip!!!

[basehibby]

seriously get a grip!!!

You need to get a grip of your senses if you can't see the comparison - as obvious as the nose on your face!

[HNA12]

If this is just going to degenerate in to a series of posts telling each other to get a grip etc etc we'll just close the thread. The Poll has closed anyway, too late to change each others voting intentions now.:greengrin

[basehibby]

If this is just going to degenerate in to a series of posts telling each other to get a grip etc etc we'll just close the thread. The Poll has closed anyway, too late to change each others voting intentions now.:greengrin

OK - just let me clear up that in my post above I have not acused anyone on this thread of being a Nazi - I can see how that could maybe be misconstrued so lets put that to bed - however, lets also be clear that to SOME folk, singing songs ripping the pish out of refugees DOES make you a nazi - which is why some of us feel very uncomfortable about such songs being associated with our precious Hibernian FC.

[Harpandcastle]

Why don't you post on the 'Rangers to be punished by UEFA' thread that they should be able to sing whatever bigoted ***** that they want, that UEFA's self-importance is breathtaking and who cares anyway if a few Catholics get targeted for abuse?

As I understand it Uefa are a governing body who organise tournaments and therefore set the rules, not some individual with a major opinion of themselves.

Twice previously (I think) Rangers had been warned by this organisation as to their fans conduct, things have continued. To my knowledge Hibernian have recieved no warnings or charges from any governing body.

In everyday life I see and hear all manner of things I agree with and disagree with. I get on with things and dont get too upset, some of the things mentioned on this thread I personally would choose not to say / sing, that does not mean I expect all others to behave as I do nor will I be emailing Hibs requesting anyone to be banned from attending.

[Beefster]

As I understand it Uefa are a governing body who organise tournaments and therefore set the rules, not some individual with a major opinion of themselves.

Twice previously (I think) Rangers had been warned by this organisation as to their fans conduct, things have continued. To my knowledge Hibernian have recieved no warnings or charges from any governing body.

In everyday life I see and hear all manner of things I agree with and disagree with. I get on with things and dont get too upset, some of the things mentioned on this thread I personally would choose not to say / sing, that does not mean I expect all others to behave as I do nor will I be emailing Hibs requesting anyone to be banned from attending.

So you have to get a couple of fines/warnings from the club or an authority before bigotry becomes unacceptable? Fair enough, I disagree though.

[bighairyfaeleith]

OK - just let me clear up that in my post above I have not acused anyone on this thread of being a Nazi - I can see how that could maybe be misconstrued so lets put that to bed - however, lets also be clear that to SOME folk, singing songs ripping the pish out of refugees DOES make you a nazi - which is why some of us feel very uncomfortable about such songs being associated with our precious Hibernian FC.

I'm sorry, thats so obvious now:not worth

[bighairyfaeleith]

So you have to get a couple of fines/warnings from the club or an authority before bigotry becomes unacceptable? Fair enough, I disagree though.

you'd think you where a tory with that sort of spin beefy:greengrin

I think the point is that many people don't see it as bigotry and as we have not been punished for it or told not to sing that song then is it actually bigotry?

Just because someone on a forum says it is doesn't mean it's true.

[Hibercelona]

Don't sing it myself, but I don't see the big deal with it either. I personally think the pedo/beast songs are far worse.

[Dinkydoo]

Don't sign it myself as I think it's a really offensive song, not racist but it's showing an intolerance towards people that have been through a hell of a lot of crap to escape thier homeland in order to live peacefully and without threat elsewhere.

It's actually quite sad that people still sign it; probably the same folk who call hearts mini huns too, oh the irony. :rolleyes:

[Tricla]

OK - just let me clear up that in my post above I have not acused anyone on this thread of being a Nazi - I can see how that could maybe be misconstrued so lets put that to bed - however, lets also be clear that to SOME folk, singing songs ripping the pish out of refugees DOES make you a nazi - which is why some of us feel very uncomfortable about such songs being associated with our precious Hibernian FC.


I assume you feel uncomfortable therefore see people who sing this song as Nazi's therefore you are calling them Nazi's. :confused:

Thanks for clearing that up.

[Beefster]

you'd think you where a tory with that sort of spin beefy:greengrin

I think the point is that many people don't see it as bigotry and as we have not been punished for it or told not to sing that song then is it actually bigotry?

Just because someone on a forum says it is doesn't mean it's true.

62% of folk saying it gives it more weight than those that think it's harmless banter though.

[Tricla]

Genuine refugees are among the most vulnerable people in our society - these are ordinary people who have lost everything in fleeing war, persecution or natural disaster and they include men, women and children of all ages.

Personally I don't feel at all right about singing any song that further stigmatises these people. I also feel embarassed and annoyed at the ignorant fandangoes in our support who would associate the name of Hibernian FC with their own small mindeness by singing this along with other garbage like the "Edinburgh Song" at ER.

"If they knew their history" these fannies would realise that the founders of Hibernian FC would likely hold a very dim view of these pathetic attempts at "banter", coming as they did from an imigrant population some of whom were probably refugees of a kind themselves.

So should we refrain from further stigmatising Weegies, Sheep and Jumbos by not singing the songs we have sung about them for decades?

Where do we actually draw the line.

As I have said, if it were up to those who IMO have shown a gross overreaction to this subject then we'd have very muted terraces indeed.

[Tricla]

62% of folk saying it gives it more weight than those that think it's harmless banter though.

Will this same 62% feel the same about calling Hertz fans 'Hertz B*******', singing 'In yer Gorgie/Weegie Slums or 'Yer Just a Sheep ******** *******'?

I very much doubt it.

By the letter of the 'law' these can be seen as bigoted too surely?

The refugee song is overly scrutinised IMO and those who sing the above songs but say the refugee song is unacceptable need to get their argument in order.

[MCameron]

Its more of the same in fact. We were lectured on Belsin by the thread starter/unofficial club spokeman on the Scotsman article thread.

Lectured? That's your opinion - it's a forum and I was merely stating a matter fact.

[HibsMax]

I like how you have put one of the options as 'Yes - I don't sing it but don't let it bother me when others do'.

This to me implies that people like me (who don't care if it's sung or not) do infact think it's acceptable.

As I have said, I'm not denying it's inappropriateness but I as well as many others don't get offended by a daft, misguided song.

How about having an option that says 'Couldn't give a toss and I get out enough not to let it bother me'?

No offence mate but you really do have a bee in your bonnet about this one song when IMO there are far worse things that go on at the game that need the fans and the clubs attention. Missile throwing for example.

For your info, I polled 'other' as the above option wasn't available.

I have not read all this thread. In fact, I stopped after reading the bit in bold. Irrelevant, condescending and laughable. LOL.

[bighairyfaeleith]

62% of folk saying it gives it more weight than those that think it's harmless banter though.

It does, but it also shows a sizeable % who either aren't bothered by it or actively sing it.

I can understand people not liking this song, however I also understand peoples frustration at being continually told you can't say this, you can't sing that, etc etc.

I suppose I just don't like the watering down of the matchday experience, for me football isn't politically correct, it isn't polite, it isn't courteous to others, for those 90 minutes I genuinely don't care about the people in the other stands, for one afternoon every other week I can pretty much say what I want. I am in no hurry to change that situation.

[iwasthere1972]

Will this same 62% feel the same about calling Hertz fans 'Hertz B*******', singing 'In yer Gorgie/Weegie Slums or 'Yer Just a Sheep ******** *******'?

I very much doubt it.

By the letter of the 'law' these can be seen as bigoted too surely?

The refugee song is overly scrutinised IMO and those who sing the above songs but say the refugee song is unacceptable need to get their argument in order.

The difference being is that they are factually correct.

[MCameron]

As I have said, if it were up to those who IMO have shown a gross overreaction to this subject then we'd have very muted terraces indeed.

Because we can't sing songs that promote our club and players?

[basehibby]

I assume you feel uncomfortable therefore see people who sing this song as Nazi's therefore you are calling them Nazi's. :confused:

Thanks for clearing that up.

Eh??? WTF you on about :confused:

[basehibby]

So should we refrain from further stigmatising Weegies, Sheep and Jumbos by not singing the songs we have sung about them for decades?

Where do we actually draw the line.

As I have said, if it were up to those who IMO have shown a gross overreaction to this subject then we'd have very muted terraces indeed.

None so blind as those that refuse to see eh?!?

Are Weegies, Sheep and Jumbos particularly vulnerable members of society - NO - they are just football fans like the rest of us who have an unspoken license to rip the pish oot each other.

You ask where we draw the line??? I personally draw the line at racist and sectarian bullsheight which is at odds with our club and holds it in a bad light to the rest of the world - IMO the Skachell song comes into that category - even if some of it's perpetrators seem blissfully unaware of the fact.

[Storar]

Because we can't sing songs that promote our club and players?

What about Hail Hail, We Are Hibernian FC, We Hate Glasgow Rangers, You Are My Palsson, He's One of our own, Glory Glory, ooh to be, only one Sodje, Sunshine on Leith...?

silly argument. The Skacel song is probably a bit racist and is definitely offensive but so what? That's the point. Football games are just a massive pantomime anyway and people shouldn't take what goes on inside the ground seriously at all.

[Wembley67]

Woooohoooooo 7 pages of rubbish, we hit the target :rockin::applause:

[MCameron]

I never mentioned at any point I was a spokesman for the club - but I can read their rules and apply logic to them.

Perhaps our club's actual spokesman should make the club's views known? I wouldn't have a problem with that - perhaps more families would be inclined to come along if this nonsense was a thing of the past. I remember the feeling on the Hampden stands after the killie final - positive songs sung with emotion - great day to be a hibby.

[bighairyfaeleith]

Woooohoooooo 7 pages of rubbish, we hit the target :rockin::applause:

:thumbsup: only on :hnet:

[Hibercelona]

Woooohoooooo 7 pages of rubbish, we hit the target :rockin::applause:

Err 5 pages. :greengrin

Will no doubt spin out into a 500+ page cracker though.... :drool:

[MCameron]

What about Hail Hail, We Are Hibernian FC, We Hate Glasgow Rangers, You Are My Palsson, He's One of our own, Glory Glory, ooh to be, only one Sodje, Sunshine on Leith...?

silly argument. The Skacel song is probably a bit racist and is definitely offensive but so what? That's the point. Football games are just a massive pantomime anyway and people shouldn't take what goes on inside the ground seriously at all.

No your right - neither should they take the resultant breaches of the peace, domestic violence, glassings, stabbings and murders seriously either. Dearie me....

[Tricla]

None so blind as those that refuse to see eh?!?

Are Weegies, Sheep and Jumbos particularly vulnerable members of society - NO - they are just football fans like the rest of us who have an unspoken license to rip the pish oot each other.

You ask where we draw the line??? I personally draw the line at racist and sectarian bullsheight which is at odds with our club and holds it in a bad light to the rest of the world - IMO the Skachell song comes into that category - even if some of it's perpetrators seem blissfully unaware of the fact.

This is irrelevant. According to the OP's (our new club spokesman) logic we cannot sing anything that singles anyone or any group out from anyone else because of their differences. Also, we cannot sing anything offensive or prejudiced in any way. We can only sing songs that promote our team and players.

Based on this you'd need to draw your line in a different place I'm afraid.

[MCameron]

This is irrelevant. According to the OP's (our new club spokesman) logic we cannot sing anything that singles anyone or any group out from anyone else because of their differences. Also, we cannot sing anything offensive or prejudiced in any way. We can only sing songs that promote our team and players.

Based on this you'd need to draw your line in a different place I'm afraid.

Yawn...running out of arguments Tricla?

[Storar]

No your right - neither should they take the resultant breaches of the peace, domestic violence, glassings, stabbings and murders seriously either. Dearie me....

If that's your opinion then fair enough. Personally I think that domestic violence, stabbings and murders should be taken seriously though.
As for singing a stupid song at a football ground...nah

[Tricla]

No your right - neither should they take the resultant breaches of the peace, domestic violence, glassings, stabbings and murders either. Dearie me....

And this is all due to racism and bigotry??? :confused:

So how do you explain the above when it's a Hibs v Celtic match or a Rangers v Hertz match because surely if it's all down to bigotry then we would see no disturbance at all before, during and after these fixtures as both sets of fans are batting for the same team surely?

[Tricla]

Yawn...running out of arguments Tricla?

:confused:

[basehibby]

This is irrelevant. According to the OP's (our new club spokesman) logic we cannot sing anything that singles anyone or any group out from anyone else because of their differences. Also, we cannot sing anything offensive or prejudiced in any way. We can only sing songs that promote our team and players.

Based on this you'd need to draw your line in a different place I'm afraid.

Read the thread title - this is nothing to do with the OP's logic, it's about whether we find the Skatchell song "acceptable" - I'll draw my line where I chose to and for me the Skatchel song crosses it. From the poll at the top of the thread it would appear that a CLEAR majority agree with the OP's conclusion, regardless of the logic he used to get there - so going by that he's more of a club spokesman than you are on this topic.

[Tricla]

Read the thread title - this is nothing to do with the OP's logic, it's about whether we find the Skatchell song "acceptable" - I'll draw my line where I chose to and for me the Skatchel song crosses it. From the poll at the top of the thread it would appear that a CLEAR majority agree with the OP's conclusion, regardless of the logic he used to get there - so going by that he's more of a club spokesman than you are on this topic.

I think you'll find it is everything to do with his logic not only on this thread but the Scotsman Article thread too. I can't find the exact post but he says that we can't sing anything that can be remotely construed as prejudiced so the vast majority of our 'dittys' would fall in to this category.

As I have made clear before, I do not sing the refugee song and I can see why some may find it offensive. What I am concerned with is the holes in the logic of some who have singled this song and its supposed undertones out for scrutiny whilst ignoring that based on their logic there are many others that couldn't be sung either.

Also, I (not that I care remember cos I'm a sticks and stones guy:wink:) I and others have been branded bigots for not caring if this song is sung and that we are lesser supporters for having this view.

Where does the OP get the right to make these statements and then maintain that it is not acceptable to try and offend people?

IMO his argument especially is tainted in its content and by his attempts at a moral crusade.

[MCameron]

And this is all due to racism and bigotry??? :confused:

So how do you explain the above when it's a Hibs v Celtic match or a Rangers v Hertz match because surely if it's all down to bigotry then we would see no disturbance at all before, during and after these fixtures as both sets of fans are batting for the same team surely?

......'batting for the same team'. Care to expand o what you mean there?

[marinello59]

I think you'll find it is everything to do with his logic not only on this thread but the Scotsman Article thread too. I can't find the exact post but he says that we can't sing anything that can be remotely construed as prejudiced so the vast majority of our 'dittys' would fall in to this category.

As I have made clear before, I do not sing the refugee song and I can see why some may find it offensive. What I am concerned with is the holes in the logic of some who have singled this song and its supposed undertones out for scrutiny whilst ignoring that based on their logic there are many others that couldn't be sung either.

Also, I (not that I care remember cos I'm a sticks and stones guy:wink:) I and others have been branded bigots for not caring if this song is sung and that we are lesser supporters for having this view.

Where does the OP get the right to make these statements and then maintain that it is not acceptable to try and offend people?

IMO his argument especially is tainted in its content and by his attempts at a moral crusade.

Point out where somebody has actually called you a bigot in this thread. Or on the other one.

[MCameron]

I think you'll find it is everything to do with his logic not only on this thread but the Scotsman Article thread too. I can't find the exact post but he says that we can't sing anything that can be remotely construed as prejudiced so the vast majority of our 'dittys' would fall in to this category.

I'll clear this up. I wouldn't want to sing anything prejudiced. Not sure why anyone would tbh. What I am against is people singing songs that are racist, bigotted, homophobic - the same as the club actually. If promoting the rules that our club have published on their website makes me a spokesman for the club I have supported for 35 years then so be it.:na na:

[MCameron]

What I am concerned with is the holes in the logic of some who have singled this song and its supposed undertones out for scrutiny whilst ignoring that based on their logic there are many others that couldn't be sung either.

Said on the other thread (or was it this one I'm getting tired now :rolleyes:) that it is not just this particular song I find offensive - but do you really want numerous other polls for the Hartley song, the Edinburgh song etc?? I picked one of a rank bunch. Oh and I saidat least twice previously that if you say you don't sing this it I believe you.

If you're so sure I'm trying to be spokesman for the 60ish percent that detest this song are you happy to be the spokesman for the other 30 odd percent?

[marinello59]

but do you really want numerous other polls for the Hartley song, the Edinburgh song etc??

For the love of all that is good in this world DON'T. :greengrin

[MCameron]

For the love of all that is good in this world DON'T. :greengrin

spoilsport :na na:

[Tricla]

Point out where somebody has actually called you a bigot in this thread. Or on the other one.

I can't be erchied to dig out posts but MCameron was suggesting on the other thread that those who don't care what is sung at the game or 'tolerate' bigotry/racism in his eyes by not policing it are advocates of bigotry/racism themselves.

As I fall in to that category he is pointing the finger at me.

[Tricla]

Said on the other thread (or was it this one I'm getting tired now :rolleyes:) that it is not just this particular song I find offensive - but do you really want numerous other polls for the Hartley song, the Edinburgh song etc?? I picked one of a rank bunch. Oh and I saidat least twice previously that if you say you don't sing this it I believe you.

If you're so sure I'm trying to be spokesman for the 60ish percent that detest this song are you happy to be the spokesman for the other 30 odd percent?

You mean the bigots? :devil:

[Tricla]

I'll clear this up. I wouldn't want to sing anything prejudiced. Not sure why anyone would tbh. What I am against is people singing songs that are racist, bigotted, homophobic - the same as the club actually. If promoting the rules that our club have published on their website makes me a spokesman for the club I have supported for 35 years then so be it.:na na:

Have you ever sung the 'Weegie/Gorgie Slums' song, the 'Sheep ******** *******' song, the 'Only happy on giro day' song or have you ever referred to a Hertz fan as 'You Hearts *******' whilst on the terraces.

Be honest now.

[MCameron]

You mean the bigots? :devil:

surely spokesman for the 'bigots/racists/canny be ersed worrying about the bigots/racists/homophobe' brigade - no? :aok:

[marinello59]

I can't be erchied to dig out posts but MCameron was suggesting on the other thread that those who don't care what is sung at the game or 'tolerate' bigotry/racism in his eyes by not policing it are advocates of bigotry/racism themselves.

As I fall in to that category he is pointing the finger at me.

So you can't then. :hilarious

[lapsedhibee]

Are Weegies, Sheep and Jumbos particularly vulnerable members of society - NO - they are just football fans like the rest of us who have an unspoken license to rip the pish oot each other.

Weegies from Shettleston are. Worst health in Europe, lowest life expectancy, bla bla bla. If you're going to sing about Weegies could you please insert an extra line specifically exempting Shettlestonians from your taunts. Thanks. :agree:

[Tricla]

surely spokesman for the 'bigots/racists/canny be ersed worrying about the bigots/racists/homophobe' brigade - no? :aok:

:confused:

Would this not be the people he/she would represent?

[Tricla]

So you can't then. :hilarious

You posted on that thread so you know what I am talking about.

Hamilton Handling said something along the lines of, "This thread needs to get some perspective before Tricla gets blamed for the holocaust!"

[marinello59]

You posted on that thread so you know what I am talking about.

Hamilton Handling said something along the lines of, "This thread needs to get some perspective before Tricla gets blamed for the holocaust!"

Well point out where somebody actually said you were a bigot, both on this thread and the other one. If you are going to claim victim status at least back it up. It's kind of ironic coming from somebody who has spent so much time defending a song using a term for true victims of society in a derogatory manner.

[MCameron]

Have you ever sung the 'Weegie/Gorgie Slums' song, the 'Sheep ******** *******' song, the 'Only happy on giro day' song or have you ever referred to a Hertz fan as 'You Hearts *******' whilst on the terraces.

Be honest now.

I've been nothing but honest. I've sung the sheep song in the past (long time ago now as I'm getting on a bit!) and in my opinion those who really **** sheep won't get any sympathy from me. The others I've never cared for as they're just immature tripe.

You never clarified what you meant by batting for the same side?

[Greentinted]

If nothing else at least it's been established that the name 'Skacel' is a notoriously difficult one to spell...:devil:

[Wembley67]

I've been nothing but honest. I've sung the sheep song in the past (long time ago now as I'm getting on a bit!) and in my opinion those who really **** sheep won't get any sympathy from me. The others I've never cared for as they're just immature tripe.

You never clarified what you meant by batting for the same side?

I think he may be referring that you like the mardi gras.

[MCameron]

I think he may be referring that you like the mardi gras.
I think you are off the mark....and surely that would be homophobic so let's not go there.

[bighairyfaeleith]

I think you are off the mark....and surely that would be homophobic so let's not go there.

surely not going to the mardi gras would be homophobic?:greengrin

[Beefster]

Will this same 62% feel the same about calling Hertz fans 'Hertz B*******', singing 'In yer Gorgie/Weegie Slums or 'Yer Just a Sheep ******** *******'?

I very much doubt it.

By the letter of the 'law' these can be seen as bigoted too surely?

The refugee song is overly scrutinised IMO and those who sing the above songs but say the refugee song is unacceptable need to get their argument in order.

I don't actually believe that you're as naive / stupid as this post would suggest. If you are though, knock yourself out defending whatever you want.


It does, but it also shows a sizeable % who either aren't bothered by it or actively sing it.

I can understand people not liking this song, however I also understand peoples frustration at being continually told you can't say this, you can't sing that, etc etc.

I suppose I just don't like the watering down of the matchday experience, for me football isn't politically correct, it isn't polite, it isn't courteous to others, for those 90 minutes I genuinely don't care about the people in the other stands, for one afternoon every other week I can pretty much say what I want. I am in no hurry to change that situation.

I'm not really sure the point that you're making, to be honest, other than to say we should be able to say what we want at the football.

The 38% that aren't bothered by the song would also probably say that the song about Sodje's manhood is 'banter' too and then go on to demonise the Rangers fans for singing about the Queen, Pope or some battle from hundreds of years ago.

[Tricla]

Well point out where somebody actually said you were a bigot, both on this thread and the other one. If you are going to claim victim status at least back it up. It's kind of ironic coming from somebody who has spent so much time defending a song using a term for true victims of society in a derogatory manner.

Firstly, I'm not claiming victim status. I don't feel victimised. I was pointing out that IMO MCamerons argument is all over the place. I it infests you why don't you go and trawl through the other thread and tell me if he was suggesting I was a bigot because of my opinion.

Secondly, I haven't defended the refugee song. I have only questioned it scrutinisation which IMO is way over the top. Especially if this who are against it choose to accept other songs that are sung.

[marinello59]

Firstly, I'm not claiming victim status. I don't feel victimised. I was pointing out that IMO MCamerons argument is all over the place. I it infests you why don't you go and trawl through the other thread and tell me if he was suggesting I was a bigot because of my opinion.

Secondly, I haven't defended the refugee song. I have only questioned it scrutinisation which IMO is way over the top. Especially if this who are against it choose to accept other songs that are sung.

It was you that raised this not me. :greengrin I did look and at no point are you labelled a bigot. You even go further on the other thread and declare that you were labelled a racist and a bigot. Which you seem to have simply made up as I can't find that either.
As for not defending the song, your first post on the other thread does just that where you declare it not to be racist. Isn't that a defense?

[Tricla]

I don't actually believe that you're as naive / stupid as this post would suggest. If you are though, knock yourself out defending whatever you want

I'm not defending anything and I do believe that by the OP's logic that these songs are also unacceptable.

Therefore I must be stupid. Thanks for the heads up.:wink:

[Harpandcastle]

A bit harsh removing my previous post I feel. I owned up to singing / shouting things in the past that may have caused offence to some.

Back on topic, having been to plenty games outside of Scotland I honestly think the Edinburgh derby is very tame compared with loads of other high profile or derby matches, it could even be considered a very watered down version of what it was itself only 15 to 20 years ago. While everyone realises things move on too much sanatization of football will seee crowds dwindle and atmosphere die even more IMO.

[Tricla]

It was you that raised this not me. :greengrin I did look and at no point are you labelled a bigot. You even go further on the other thread and declare that you were labelled a racist and a bigot. Which you seem to have simply made up as I can't find that either.
As for not defending the song, your first post on the other thread does just that where you declare it not to be racist. Isn't that a defense?

I said that MCameron suggested that people who share my opinion are as good as bigots.

The song isn't racist IMO.

[MCameron]

Firstly, I'm not claiming victim status. I don't feel victimised. I was pointing out that IMO MCamerons argument is all over the place. I it infests you why don't you go and trawl through the other thread and tell me if he was suggesting I was a bigot because of my opinion.

Secondly, I haven't defended the refugee song. I have only questioned it scrutinisation which IMO is way over the top. Especially if this who are against it choose to accept other songs that are sung.

How do you reach the concussion that my argument is all over the place? Where have o changed from the fact that I think there is mo place for racist, bigoted or homophobic songs - whether inside or outside a football stadium.

[.Sean.]

I take it the old ones moaning on this thread never belted out a daft 'offensive' song at the football in their youth?

[HNA12]

This one now appears to be going round and round in circles. Thread closed.