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(((Fergus)))
19-03-2011, 12:44 PM
Do you think it might be tough being a high-profile football manager? Well, just consider the ledger of aggravation that Neil Lennon, the Celtic manager, has had to endure, and still endures, in Glasgow.

Twenty months ago, Lennon suffered his third street assault in the city. He had been abused and then jumped on by two men, after which he had to be rushed to the Western Infirmary’s accident and emergency ward, where he underwent neurological tests. Lennon received facial bruises and a bloody nose that night.

Hearing about this through the grapevine, I phoned Lennon to find out how he was. “I’m OK, but I took quite a beating, I can tell you,” he said, happily admitting that he had come off second best (not something Lennon ordinarily likes to do). “They did me good and hard.”

As shocking as this incident was, it did not exactly revolt or appal Scottish society. In part, this is because we have become used to these episodes surrounding Lennon, a man who has received death threats and bullets through the post, on top of assaults in the street. Why does it happen? It happens because Lennon is an iconic figure at Celtic, the team he has led in his first year as manager to tomorrow’s Co-operative Insurance Cup final at Hampden Park against Rangers. It is a game that Lennon will have to watch from the stands, having been banned from leading out his team or sitting in the dugout after the fiery Scottish Cup replay this month.

That beating in the street did not surprise me because it had happened before, and even, at times, with a faintly comical twist to it. None more so than in Glasgow in 2003, when Lennon, the Celtic midfield enforcer in a dominant Martin O’Neill team, had his first introduction to the Glasgow street kiss.

Lennon was approached and physically threatened again, this time by two Glasgow University students (for the record, one of them studying law, the other studying medicine). He was jumped upon and the now time-honoured Lennon fracas broke out, with the Northern Irishman deciding to give as good as he got. His assailants were convicted in court of assault.

The incident came early in the timeline of Lennon’s exclusive war zone in Glasgow — heartier and scarier episodes were on the way — but I will never forget his description of that particular assault. “I was with my girlfriend at the time and I said to her, ‘Hang on, I think there’s going to be trouble here,’ ” he said.

“There I was in the West End of Glasgow — the supposedly leafy West End — and me and these two guys ended up rolling around on the pavement. My memory of that night was of the Glasgow traffic — cars and buses, with people looking out the windows — happily rolling by with next to no one batting an eyelid at this scrap in the street.”

One day in 2004, Lennon opened his curtains in his Glasgow home to find a death threat daubed on the street outside his front door. At least, it was supposed to be a death threat, although the doughballs had blundered in their artwork. “Neil Lennon: RPI”, the graffiti read, not having intended to quote the retail price index but instead wishing the Celtic player to rest in peace. By this point Lennon was becoming inured to such trash, but that day he traipsed from door to door around his neighbours, apologising for the street mess.

In this narrative called Let’s Kill Neil Lennon, it has sometimes been far worse. Only six weeks ago the Celtic manager was sent live bullets through the post, in a package that Celtic handed over to the police. Two weeks ago he was sent a hoax parcel bomb, a “suspicious package” that the police intercepted. In Belfast 12 days ago another “Neil Lennon RIP” daubing was spotted. Last week Celtic arranged private 24-hour security around Lennon’s home, within which he, his partner and their six-year-old child live.

On and on it goes. In Glasgow, where the city’s heartbeat throbs and the social vibrancy is openly admired, we tend to roll our eyes at it all. It is only now, in chronicling this saga, that I can step outside the bubble and ask just what the hell is going on? Well, it is obvious. Lennon is a victim of bigotry. There is no way that this can be camouflaged or soft-soaped. It is excruciating for Glasgow and the West of Scotland, but what has happened to Lennon is akin to a mirror being held up to Scottish society, only for a grim and ugly image to be seen in it.

There is something enduring in West of Scotland society that cannot stand a prominent Roman Catholic from Northern Ireland, such as Lennon, 39, coming to this part of the world and being successful with Celtic. For some, this is too much to bear. They feel it like a dagger to their heart. If this sounds absurd to many across sophisticated, multicultural Britain, well, I can only apologise. It is how it is.

The Lennon experience speaks of a deep truth about the way football can reveal a society to itself. “When I was at Leicester I wouldn’t say I was a nobody exactly, but I was nothing special and I was certainly no headline-maker,” Lennon once told me. “But all this kicked off when I signed for Celtic.”

So what was it exactly that “kicked off” that day in December 2000, when O’Neill signed Lennon for £5.5 million? It was this: Lennon pulled over his head one of the great, most visible, most iconic images of popular Catholic culture — the green-and-white hooped shirt of Celtic — and it changed his life for ever.

From that day on Lennon has been, to an extent, a marked man. He took up residence with a football club steeped in culture and tradition, yet for those mired in sectarian prejudice, in Scotland or Northern Ireland, it was like a provocation. “Get Lennon” seemed to become, if not a popular pastime, then at least a worthwhile pursuit for an alarming number of people. Almost casually, in 2001, a death threat ended Lennon’s Northern Ireland career.

Has he sometimes made it worse for himself? Probably. Lennon is no innocent when it comes to peace in the streets. He is no shrinking violet. He comes from an underdog tradition, politically and socially, in Lurgan, and to borrow from the vernacular of Glasgow and elsewhere, his motto is: “I take no s*** from anyone.”

He has a slightly comical habit of offering an old-fashioned shove to people with whom he disagrees. Lennon once pushed Aiden McGeady in open play after his former Celtic team-mate had criticised him to his face. If you look closely enough at the footage of the fracas at the end of the Celtic-Rangers Scottish Cup replay 17 days ago, you can see Lennon go to shove Ally McCoist after he and the Rangers assistant manager had gone face to face. So let it be affirmed again: Lennon is no pacifist.

Yet something, surely, is amiss when a football figure has to go through the gauntlet of bullets, assaults and death threats that Lennon has suffered. On the fewer occasions now when I see him — as Celtic manager he has to choose his friends more carefully — we share a black humour about his continuing survival. “Ah, still here, I see,” I will crassly joke, and he will smile and roll his eyes.

But it is no laughing matter. The Neil Lennon experience should make everyone in Scotland and elsewhere sit up and ask again, what can be done to cure the prejudice and bigotry in our midst?

Geo_1875
19-03-2011, 01:00 PM
So embarrassing, but at least Spiers has identified it as a Glasgow and West of Scotland problem rather than try to drag the rest of the country into their mire.

ScottB
19-03-2011, 01:27 PM
I would say he is a victim of bigotry and the like, but he himself has made it much worse than it would have been, had he not been such a provocative loud mouth and still suffered from this sort of thing then I'm sure he would have the sympathy from the general public that Spiers notes is lacking.

At the end of the day, Lennon is a deeply unlikable guy unless you're a Celtic fan, and while I have no love lost for him it's no excuse for his life, or the safety of his family, being threatened.

skipster7
19-03-2011, 01:43 PM
So embarrassing, but at least Spiers has identified it as a Glasgow and West of Scotland problem rather than try to drag the rest of the country into their mire.

i cant stand him for his general manner,contorted puss, red hair and bright yellow teeth.horrible wee fud.nothing at all to do with religion.i think he revels in being a hate figure but obviously you cant condone the simpleton mentality of some weedgies.

Pretty Boy
19-03-2011, 01:47 PM
Actually agree with a lot of what Spiers writes here.

Neil Lennon has been the victim of good old fashioned sectarianism and bigotry pure and simple. Yes, he doesn't help himself at times but there have been plenty characters in Scottish football who have been far more unlikeable than Lennon who haven't had to put up with a fraction of the pish he has had to contend with.

People can dress it up or attempt to justify it any way they like but the simple fact is absolutely no one deserves to receive bullets through the post, be physically assaulted, receive death threats etc purely because of events on and around a football field. The fact that so many people even attempt to justify it as being because of the actions of Lennon on the pitch or touchline is a rather sad reflection of Scottish society IMO.

I should add i don't apply this to everyone, i'm sure there are many people who dislike Lennon based purely on his footballing persona, this is very much aimed at the morons who have sent death threats etc and those who revel in it and try to defend it. I accept not everyone who dislikes Neil Lennon is a bigot.

Geo_1875
19-03-2011, 01:49 PM
I don't know the guy well enough to say whether I'd like him or not. What I do think is with him what you see is what you get. What I can't understand is the media love in with McCoist who was a horrible, sneaky coward as a player and doesn't appear to have changed a bit.

richard_pitts
19-03-2011, 01:58 PM
I have to agree about the bigotry thing, although Speirs misses an important and arguably crucial point: There's also the fact he is a Catholic from Northern Ireland who played for Northern Ireland which makes him a cult hate figure amongst some of the Rangers support, and indeed the Celtic support before he opens his mouth :rolleyes:

(((Fergus)))
19-03-2011, 01:58 PM
in other words, if you're a successful "pape" in (the west of) scotland just hold your tongue and take the abuse.

hibsbollah
19-03-2011, 02:08 PM
in other words, if you're a successful "pape" in (the west of) scotland just hold your tongue and take the abuse.

Quite. I doubt there'd be such a lack of sympathy if the recipient of prejudice was, say, a victim of racism or homophobia. Anti- catholicism is unspeakable and largely unspoken about in Scotland.

(although its true its possible to dislike Lennon for his behaviour not his religion, which is how i feel about him. I doubt if this applies to the rangers fans who sing 'Lennon must hang' though).

marinello59
19-03-2011, 02:42 PM
A good article. I wouldn't argue with any of it.

woody47
19-03-2011, 04:22 PM
Lennon is an odious, obnoxious wee turd........BUT
there is no way he should have to endure the threats and attacks.
FFS it is still only a game of football but some people treat is as if it is life and death. Pathetic :bitchy:

--------
19-03-2011, 05:13 PM
i cant stand him for his general manner,contorted puss, red hair and bright yellow teeth.horrible wee fud.nothing at all to do with religion.i think he revels in being a hate figure but obviously you cant condone the simpleton mentality of some weedgies.


What's his red hair got to do with anything?

If Lennon had played for Hibs, we'd have threads on here praising him up as a 'legend'.

He was the sort of player whom his own fans love and the opposition fans hate, because he was abrasive, provocative and totally competitive throughout his career.

I don't particularly like him myself - I can't see how his manner in front of the media can ever endear him to the supporters of the teams Celtic compete against. But then, I don't suppose he'll lose any sleep over that - why should he? He's got Celtic playing some very decent football at times - and winning games even when they don't play particularly well, too.

Maybe one of the things the Huns have to hold against him is that he's actually good at his job.

Admittedly, he's had a chip on his shoulder about referees all season - but then the experience we've had lately over Derek Adams' alleged abuse of officials suggests he might just have a point.

He might get more sympathy if he went about his business more quietly, but that's not his way. Hate-graffiti on the street and bullets in his mail are way out of order - not the work of simpletons, IMO, but threats Lennon would do well to take seriously. I'm quite sure he does just that.

I hope for his own sake he can find a way to calm down a bit when under public scrutiny, but I have to say that nothing I've heard him say or seen him do would justify the sort of hate some people are directing at him.

Sectarian hatred's a poison in Scottish society that needs to be rooted out. Don't ask me how we do it, though.

cabbageandribs1875
19-03-2011, 05:29 PM
What's his red hair got to do with anything?



takes all credibility away from a posters viewpoint when they revert to the old 'ginger heeded' 'fud' etc etc:agree: someone started a thread on here 2/3 weeks ago telling us all what a classless 'ginger fud' lennon is:rolleyes: if he had dark hair would he then become a classless 'dark-haired' fud ? blonde-haired fud ? having a problem with someones hair colour is a bit pathetic :agree::greengrin

Pretty Boy
19-03-2011, 05:51 PM
What's his red hair got to do with anything?

If Lennon had played for Hibs, we'd have threads on here praising him up as a 'legend'.

He was the sort of player whom his own fans love and the opposition fans hate, because he was abrasive, provocative and totally competitive throughout his career.

I don't particularly like him myself - I can't see how his manner in front of the media can ever endear him to the supporters of the teams Celtic compete against. But then, I don't suppose he'll lose any sleep over that - why should he? He's got Celtic playing some very decent football at times - and winning games even when they don't play particularly well, too.

Maybe one of the things the Huns have to hold against him is that he's actually good at his job.

Admittedly, he's had a chip on his shoulder about referees all season - but then the experience we've had lately over Derek Adams' alleged abuse of officials suggests he might just have a point.

He might get more sympathy if he went about his business more quietly, but that's not his way. Hate-graffiti on the street and bullets in his mail are way out of order - not the work of simpletons, IMO, but threats Lennon would do well to take seriously. I'm quite sure he does just that.

I hope for his own sake he can find a way to calm down a bit when under public scrutiny, but I have to say that nothing I've heard him say or seen him do would justify the sort of hate some people are directing at him.

Sectarian hatred's a poison in Scottish society that needs to be rooted out. Don't ask me how we do it, though.

:top marks Excellent post as always Doddie.

Keith_M
19-03-2011, 06:03 PM
takes all credibility away from a posters viewpoint when they revert to the old 'ginger heeded' 'fud' etc etc:agree: someone started a thread on here 2/3 weeks ago telling us all what a classless 'ginger fud' lennon is:rolleyes: if he had dark hair would he then become a classless 'dark-haired' fud ? blonde-haired fud ? having a problem with someones hair colour is a bit pathetic :agree::greengrin


...and racist, perhaps?


:dunno:

hibbymark
19-03-2011, 06:09 PM
I have heard that things have become so bad that Celtic are using a body double.

They have shaved a orangutan and painted its teeth yellow!!!!

--------
19-03-2011, 06:21 PM
...and racist, perhaps?


:dunno:


If the point is that he's Irish, then yes.

Arch Stanton
19-03-2011, 07:24 PM
............................

He has a slightly comical habit of offering an old-fashioned shove to people with whom he disagrees. Lennon once pushed Aiden McGeady in open play after his former Celtic team-mate had criticised him to his face. If you look closely enough at the footage of the fracas at the end of the Celtic-Rangers Scottish Cup replay 17 days ago, you can see Lennon go to shove Ally McCoist after he and the Rangers assistant manager had gone face to face. So let it be affirmed again: Lennon is no pacifist.

Yet something, surely, is amiss when a football figure has to go through the gauntlet of bullets, assaults and death threats that Lennon has suffered. On the fewer occasions now when I see him — as Celtic manager he has to choose his friends more carefully — we share a black humour about his continuing survival. “Ah, still here, I see,” I will crassly joke, and he will smile and roll his eyes.

But it is no laughing matter. The Neil Lennon experience should make everyone in Scotland and elsewhere sit up and ask again, what can be done to cure the prejudice and bigotry in our midst?

As I recall, there was nothing in the least bit comical about the way Lennon laid into McGeady (albeit after the final whistle - maybe Spiers recalls a more humourous altercation) - it was nothing short of vicious.

It has not been uncommon for lighter weight Scottish professional boxers to employ minders to protect themselves against mindless thugs. That could not have been pleasant for them any more than it could be pleasant for Lennon to be under the same threat of attack.

As far as I am concerned religious hatred is absolutely vile, but I also think that this journalistic exercise by Spiers has rather over-egged the pudding and added nothing to the "religious divide" debate.

Sir David Gray
19-03-2011, 07:31 PM
Martin O'Neill is a Roman Catholic from Northern Ireland who managed Celtic. Although a lot of Rangers fans also attacked him on religious grounds, I think that, in the main, he was respected when he was the Celtic manager because of the way he conducted himself.

Of course Lennon receives abuse of a sectarian nature from Rangers fans and from those of a Loyalist perspective in Northern Ireland but I honestly believe that most people in Scotland dislike Neil Lennon because he was a wee nyaff as a player for Celtic and he has continued to be a wee nyaff as manager of Celtic.

The death threats and the bullets that he received through the post is completely unacceptable and totally reprehensible because no sportsman deserves that kind of treatment, no matter where they come from, what religion they are or which football team they play for/manage.

However, as far as I'm concerned, Lennon does only have himself to blame for a large amount of the abuse that he receives. He is far too confrontational on the pitch and in the dugout and the way he behaved at the start of this season towards the officials was absolutely disgusting and some of the comments that he has made since then have been totally out of order.

That is a large part of the reason why I can't stand him and I suspect that is the reason why most people in this country can't stand him.

Horse
19-03-2011, 08:34 PM
As much as I dislike Lennon in football terms, I would never dream of attacking him - the treatment he has suffered at the hands of bigots is despicable and there is no place for it in a modern society. Unfortunately modern society has no place in the west of Scotland and beyond if you include the Glory hunting, sectarian tourists who flock to Glasgow every second week for a bit of time travelling back to the 1690's. Although the Spiers article highlights the behaviour of Huns, Celtic fans are every bit as bad as the Huns.

ScottB
19-03-2011, 09:36 PM
Martin O'Neill is a Roman Catholic from Northern Ireland who managed Celtic. Although a lot of Rangers fans also attacked him on religious grounds, I think that, in the main, he was respected when he was the Celtic manager because of the way he conducted himself.

Of course Lennon receives abuse of a sectarian nature from Rangers fans and from those of a Loyalist perspective in Northern Ireland but I honestly believe that most people in Scotland dislike Neil Lennon because he was a wee nyaff as a player for Celtic and he has continued to be a wee nyaff as manager of Celtic.

The death threats and the bullets that he received through the post is completely unacceptable and totally reprehensible because no sportsman deserves that kind of treatment, no matter where they come from, what religion they are or which football team they play for/manage.

However, as far as I'm concerned, Lennon does only have himself to blame for a large amount of the abuse that he receives. He is far too confrontational on the pitch and in the dugout and the way he behaved at the start of this season towards the officials was absolutely disgusting and some of the comments that he has made since then have been totally out of order.

That is a large part of the reason why I can't stand him and I suspect that is the reason why most people in this country can't stand him.

Martin O'Neill was never found squaring up to Rangers staff and didn't give the mindless among us any provocation. Lennon has built his career on being tough, in your face and provocative, by its nature that will attract the attention of idiots.

But then in general our society is as much blighted by adults who think it perfectly acceptable behaviour to set about innocent people, whether they have reason or not, as it is by sectarianism. Both are things that need to be eliminated.

heretoday
19-03-2011, 10:09 PM
I have a lot of sympathy for Lennon. If I was him, though, I'd get as far away from Scottish football as possible for the sake of his family more than anything.

He's a brave guy but he's not some kind of torch-bearer for ecumenism or whatever. His presence just seems to exacerbate matters and puts his own folks at greater risk.

RickyS
19-03-2011, 10:10 PM
Martin O'Neill is a Roman Catholic from Northern Ireland who managed Celtic. Although a lot of Rangers fans also attacked him on religious grounds, I think that, in the main, he was respected when he was the Celtic manager because of the way he conducted himself.

Of course Lennon receives abuse of a sectarian nature from Rangers fans and from those of a Loyalist perspective in Northern Ireland but I honestly believe that most people in Scotland dislike Neil Lennon because he was a wee nyaff as a player for Celtic and he has continued to be a wee nyaff as manager of Celtic.

The death threats and the bullets that he received through the post is completely unacceptable and totally reprehensible because no sportsman deserves that kind of treatment, no matter where they come from, what religion they are or which football team they play for/manage.

However, as far as I'm concerned, Lennon does only have himself to blame for a large amount of the abuse that he receives. He is far too confrontational on the pitch and in the dugout and the way he behaved at the start of this season towards the officials was absolutely disgusting and some of the comments that he has made since then have been totally out of order.

That is a large part of the reason why I can't stand him and I suspect that is the reason why most people in this country can't stand him.

my thoughts exactly mate, a prick of the highest order, nowt to do with Ireland, religion etc, just a grade A Twat

LaMotta
19-03-2011, 10:11 PM
my thoughts exactly mate, a prick of the highest order, nowt to do with Ireland, religion etc, just a grade A Twat

:agree:

Removed
19-03-2011, 10:11 PM
my thoughts exactly mate, a prick of the highest order, nowt to do with Ireland, religion etc, just a grade A Twat

Same for me. I don't care what religion he is or what team he played for/manages.

s.a.m
19-03-2011, 10:28 PM
Same for me. I don't care what religion he is or what team he played for/manages.

and me too. There are other ways to behave, and others have found them. Clearly, there's no place in life for the kind of nonsense he's attracted - no argument to be had. That doesn't make Lennon's behaviour acceptable though.

matty_f
19-03-2011, 11:39 PM
Same for me. I don't care what religion he is or what team he played for/manages.

I think the bullets and death threats are more likely than not due to religion, however the more widespread and general abuse that Lennon receives across Scotland's football grounds is undoubtedly because he comes across as a total prick, and not because he's a Catholic.

When we sang "Neil Lennon, you're a w***er" earlier in the season, it was because of the pish he'd been dragging up about refs and conspiracies - no connection to religion whatsoever.

Removed
19-03-2011, 11:52 PM
I think the bullets and death threats are more likely than not due to religion, however the more widespread and general abuse that Lennon receives across Scotland's football grounds is undoubtedly because he comes across as a total prick, and not because he's a Catholic.

When we sang "Neil Lennon, you're a w***er" earlier in the season, it was because of the pish he'd been dragging up about refs and conspiracies - no connection to religion whatsoever.

:agree:

I know we don't care what religion he is but unfortunately both Celtc and Rangers and inextricably linked to the nonsense in Ulster.

matty_f
20-03-2011, 12:03 AM
:agree:

I know we don't care what religion he is but unfortunately both Celtc and Rangers and inextricably linked to the nonsense in Ulster.

Yep, it's an argument I've had with a Celtc fan on here about the issue as well. Problem is that the OF only see things in that black and white way. They struggle to comprehend that we don't like Lennon 'cause he's a prick, and probably Killie, ICT, Aberdeen, Dundee Utd etc fans are just the same.

Sectarianism is part of the issue surrounding the grief Neil Lennon gets, but it's far from being the only one.

Pretty Boy
20-03-2011, 12:04 AM
I think the bullets and death threats are more likely than not due to religion, however the more widespread and general abuse that Lennon receives across Scotland's football grounds is undoubtedly because he comes across as a total prick, and not because he's a Catholic.

When we sang "Neil Lennon, you're a w***er" earlier in the season, it was because of the pish he'd been dragging up about refs and conspiracies - no connection to religion whatsoever.

From my reading of the arcticle i think this is the point Spiers is trying to make.

You and a few people on this thread (indeed probably the majority) dislike Neil Lennon based on his antics on and around a football field. But what form does this dislike take? You boo him, call him a w***er, slag him on a messageboard etc etc. All part and parcel of football and the banter surrounding it, no complaint from me.

I think Spiers is taking aim at the people who take it a step futher. Who find it acceptable to send a death threat to someone or send them a bullet in the post or whatever. Whilst football may be the catalyst for doing this, i think it takes a far more deep rooted bigotry and hatred to motivate someone to carry out such an action.

There can be no justification or defence for such behaviour. Whether Neil Lennon is in your face, aggressive, out of order in his comments about referees and so on is neither here nor there absoloutely no on deserves to have to explain to their children why there is graffiti accross the street proclaiming their Dad should rest in peace all because of what is at the end of the day a game. If Neil Lennon annoys people or makes people 'hate' him then fair enough boo him, sing songs about him being ginger, a w***er or whatever else but thats were the line should be drawn, anything that goes beyond that and involves violence real or threatened is bang out of order and a horrible blight on our society.

iwasthere1972
20-03-2011, 12:07 AM
From my reading of the arcticle i think this is the point Spiers is trying to make.

You and a few people on this thread (indeed probably the majority) dislike Neil Lennon based on his antics on and around a football field. But what form does this dislike take? You boo him, call him a w***er, slag him on a messageboard etc etc. All part and parcel of football and the banter surrounding it, no complaint from me.

I think Spiers is taking aim at the people who take it a step futher. Who find it acceptable to send a death threat to someone or send them a bullet in the post or whatever. Whilst football may be the catalyst for doing this, i think it takes a far more deep rooted bigotry and hatred to motivate someone to carry out such an action.

There can be no justification or defence for such behaviour. Whether Neil Lennon is in your face, aggressive, out of order in his comments about referees and so on is neither here nor there absoloutely no on deserves to have to explain to their children why there is graffiti accross the street proclaiming their Dad should rest in peace all because of what is at the end of the day a game. If Neil Lennon annoys people or makes people 'hate' him then fair enough boo him, sing songs about him being ginger, a w***er or whatever else but thats were the line should be drawn, anything that goes beyond that and involves violence real or threatened is bang out of order and a horrible blight on our society.

:top marks

matty_f
20-03-2011, 12:13 AM
From my reading of the arcticle i think this is the point Spiers is trying to make.

You and a few people on this thread (indeed probably the majority) dislike Neil Lennon based on his antics on and around a football field. But what form does this dislike take? You boo him, call him a w***er, slag him on a messageboard etc etc. All part and parcel of football and the banter surrounding it, no complaint from me.

I think Spiers is taking aim at the people who take it a step futher. Who find it acceptable to send a death threat to someone or send them a bullet in the post or whatever. Whilst football may be the catalyst for doing this, i think it takes a far more deep rooted bigotry and hatred to motivate someone to carry out such an action.

There can be no justification or defence for such behaviour. Whether Neil Lennon is in your face, aggressive, out of order in his comments about referees and so on is neither here nor there absoloutely no on deserves to have to explain to their children why there is graffiti accross the street proclaiming their Dad should rest in peace all because of what is at the end of the day a game. If Neil Lennon annoys people or makes people 'hate' him then fair enough boo him, sing songs about him being ginger, a w***er or whatever else but thats were the line should be drawn, anything that goes beyond that and involves violence real or threatened is bang out of order and a horrible blight on our society.
:agree: Totally agree with that, and I did say that the death threats etc were most likely sectarian related.

heretoday
20-03-2011, 10:19 AM
It always amuses me how the two tribes are split along denominational lines.

I'll wager most of the Rangers or Celtic numbskulls have never been to a church service save weddings and funerals and wouldn't know what to do if they did attend one.

Of course it's nothing to do with religion as such. That's just a handy flag to bear in the age-old game of giving offence to your fellow man and taking offence in equal measure.

Kaiser1962
20-03-2011, 10:53 AM
Lennon is an odious, obnoxious wee turd........BUT
there is no way he should have to endure the threats and attacks.
FFS it is still only a game of football but some people treat is as if it is life and death. Pathetic :bitchy:

I have met Neil Lennon a few times now and I cant for the life of me equate the guy I meet with the guy I see on TV.

Pretty Boy
20-03-2011, 11:11 AM
I have met Neil Lennon a few times now and I cant for the life of me equate the guy I meet with the guy I see on TV.

I've said this a few times now. I've met Neil Lennon 5 or 6 times and he's a very pleasant, friendly guy. He's gone way above and beyond what i expected when i asked him to help out the charity i work for.

I cringe when i see and hear him on TV, radio etc because he does himself absolutely no favours whatsoever.

ScottB
20-03-2011, 11:51 AM
I have met Neil Lennon a few times now and I cant for the life of me equate the guy I meet with the guy I see on TV.


I've said this a few times now. I've met Neil Lennon 5 or 6 times and he's a very pleasant, friendly guy. He's gone way above and beyond what i expected when i asked him to help out the charity i work for.

I cringe when i see and hear him on TV, radio etc because he does himself absolutely no favours whatsoever.

I suspect a lot of it is a put on persona, it certainly keeps the club in the media, shifts papers and the like.

But then it's quite possible for someone to be a totally sane, kind, balanced human being and a complete prat the second they take to a football pitch...

The Harp
20-03-2011, 11:54 AM
I have met Neil Lennon a few times now and I cant for the life of me equate the guy I meet with the guy I see on TV.

My cousin (another Hibee) met him in a Glasgow hotel on the eve of an OF league match at Parkhead. The Celtic team were staying in the hotel and Lennon was having a shandy in the bar. He said he came across as a friendly wee guy and enjoyed chatting to him. Maybe the red mist only descends when he's in a fitba environment.

skipster7
20-03-2011, 11:57 AM
takes all credibility away from a posters viewpoint when they revert to the old 'ginger heeded' 'fud' etc etc:agree: someone started a thread on here 2/3 weeks ago telling us all what a classless 'ginger fud' lennon is:rolleyes: if he had dark hair would he then become a classless 'dark-haired' fud ? blonde-haired fud ? having a problem with someones hair colour is a bit pathetic :agree::greengrin

if you check back i never called him a ginger fud, a horrible wee fud is how he comes accross to me.metioning his hair was just part of a light hearted summing up when i thought of him,same as his teeth.:wink:
if ive offended anyone because i never put a smiley in then then we really need to lighten up a bit.fwiw i dont have a problem with peoples hair,apart from jealousy.i have many ginger friends:greengrin oh and racist ?

aberhibsfc
20-03-2011, 11:58 AM
I have heard that things have become so bad that Celtic are using a body double.

They have shaved a orangutan and painted its teeth yellow!!!!
:faf:

aberhibsfc
20-03-2011, 11:59 AM
my thoughts exactly mate, a prick of the highest order, nowt to do with Ireland, religion etc, just a grade A Twat
:agree:

skipster7
20-03-2011, 12:02 PM
If the point is that he's Irish, then yes.
:confused:its not,ffs dont scots famously have red hair.are see you jimmy hats racist:confused:
help ma boab

aberhibsfc
20-03-2011, 12:03 PM
My cousin (another Hibee) met him in a Glasgow hotel on the eve of an OF league match at Parkhead. The Celtic team were staying in the hotel and Lennon was having a shandy in the bar. He said he came across as a friendly wee guy and enjoyed chatting to him. Maybe the red mist only descends when he's in a fitba environment.

Imagine this could be true as I can't imagine anyone being able to sustain the level of anger he displays without having some sort of fit. He is just piling the pressure on himself with the officials and opposing fans and possibly got on the wrong side of the any neutrals. There is only so long you can behave like a f4nny before everyone believes it to be true. If he could only reign in and compose himself he'd get on alot better, be healthy and concentrate on what he's paid for. But as he is associated with our opposition I am not interested in him doing well. But if he did behave himself maybe Scottish football could concentrate on the football.

skipster7
20-03-2011, 12:06 PM
I have heard that things have become so bad that Celtic are using a body double.

They have shaved a orangutan and painted its teeth yellow!!!!
careful mate, you might have offended some folk with yellow teeth :devil:

cabbageandribs1875
20-03-2011, 01:33 PM
if you check back i never called him a ginger fud, a horrible wee fud is how he comes accross to me.metioning his hair was just part of a light hearted summing up when i thought of him,same as his teeth.:wink:
if ive offended anyone because i never put a smiley in then then we really need to lighten up a bit.fwiw i dont have a problem with peoples hair,apart from jealousy.i have many ginger friends:greengrin oh and racist ?

and if YOU check back you will see that i was talking about a poster who started a thread 2/3 weeks ago :wink::greengrin

--------
20-03-2011, 03:05 PM
:confused:its not,ffs dont scots famously have red hair.are see you jimmy hats racist:confused:
help ma boab


Well CU Jimmy hats are really STUPID, and since they were originally invented by an ENGLISH "comedian" making "fun" of the Scots, then yes, they are.

If Russ Abbot had showed contempt for blacks or Asians the way he demonstrated his contempt for the Scots in those sketches, he's have been filletted and put off the air.

But we Scots have such a low opinion of ourselves, we watch HIM doing it, and then we do it ourselves.

Monkey see, monkey do. :rolleyes:

clerriehibs
20-03-2011, 05:47 PM
Lennon pulled over his head one of the great, most visible, most iconic images of popular Catholic culture — the green-and-white hooped shirt of Celtic — and it changed his life for ever.


I would've thought Spiers was intelligent enough to see what the problem is, and he unwittingly includes and promotes it in his piece;

Lennon didn't pull a great, visible, iconic image of Catholic culture. He pulled a football strip over his head. A football strip, nothing more, nothing less. Neither are Rangers strips the equivalent for Protestantism. They are just football strips as well.

As long as reporters like Spiers either can't see it, or refuse to condemn it, there'll be associated trouble.

Jones28
20-03-2011, 06:35 PM
i cant stand him for his general manner,contorted puss, red hair and bright yellow teeth.horrible wee fud.nothing at all to do with religion.i think he revels in being a hate figure but obviously you cant condone the simpleton mentality of some weedgies.

Keith Wright had red hair, problem with him too?

(((Fergus)))
20-03-2011, 07:16 PM
I would've thought Spiers was intelligent enough to see what the problem is, and he unwittingly includes and promotes it in his piece;

Lennon didn't pull a great, visible, iconic image of Catholic culture. He pulled a football strip over his head. A football strip, nothing more, nothing less. Neither are Rangers strips the equivalent for Protestantism. They are just football strips as well.

As long as reporters like Spiers either can't see it, or refuse to condemn it, there'll be associated trouble.

He said "one of the great, most visible, most iconic images of popular Catholic culture" and like it or not that is true.

lapsedhibee
20-03-2011, 07:29 PM
- is that a Scottish or just a weegie trait? :dunno:


Well CU Jimmy hats are really STUPID, and since they were originally invented by an ENGLISH "comedian" making "fun" of the Scots, then yes, they are.

If Russ Abbot had showed contempt for blacks or Asians the way he demonstrated his contempt for the Scots in those sketches, he's have been filletted and put off the air.

But we Scots have such a low opinion of ourselves, we watch HIM doing it, and then we do it ourselves.

Monkey see, monkey do. :rolleyes:

Bishop Hibee
20-03-2011, 08:02 PM
Well CU Jimmy hats are really STUPID, and since they were originally invented by an ENGLISH "comedian" making "fun" of the Scots, then yes, they are.

If Russ Abbot had showed contempt for blacks or Asians the way he demonstrated his contempt for the Scots in those sketches, he's have been filletted and put off the air.

But we Scots have such a low opinion of ourselves, we watch HIM doing it, and then we do it ourselves.

Monkey see, monkey do. :rolleyes:

I actually totally disagree with your analysis Doddie. The adoption of the 'see you Jimmy' hat was, in my opinion, taking an insulting stereotype and changing it's meaning to a badge of identity to stick 2 fingers up at people like Abbot. A small sign of our emerging confidence in our national identity. I've never worn one just to make that clear though!

As for Lennon, I've played football with guys who are nice as pie away from the pitch but are crazy on it (or on the sidelines). Martin O'Neill didn't get it as tight from the bigots because he didn't play for Celtc and had been away from Northern Ireland for so long and he wasn't so confrontational.

Bigotry is sadly still alive and kicking in 21st century Scotland. It was illustrated clearly in the hysteria which accompanied the visit of Pope Benedict including some of the more vitriolic comments on this board.

I also see "No Pope of Rome" seems to be acceptable given the chanting of it today by Rangers fans or should I expect an SFA clampdown :rolleyes:

New Corrie
20-03-2011, 09:58 PM
Neil Lennon doesn't even remotely offend me, what does is, Speirs hysterical nonsensical rant. It's not Bigotry that's the problem in this country, it's the drink/violence culture combined with the soft touch approach of the governing bodies. There is no deterrent, drunken jakes fighting and stabbing each other knowing that when they appear in court on Monday they will be accompanied by the best legal aid lawyers and social workers in front of the softest judicial system acts as fuel for these people. If you get two dregs breeding, the chances are they will churn out dregs, it's 100% a social thing, and those who say that OF bigotry and violence is exclusive to West Central Scotland are deluded. There will be inadequates rolling about outside pubs and clubs in Edinburgh/Midlothian/West Lothian as we speak. I noticed that Nicola Sturgeon described Celtic/Rangers as "great clubs" on last weeks Question Time, a very understandable benchmark from a politician who is trying to empty our prisons in a country where only 20% of those guilty of knife crime get incarcerated. It's known as denial, once we actually recognise that Scotland is a country with a large amount of poorly bred violent drunks we may well actually make some progress.

skipster7
20-03-2011, 10:07 PM
Keith Wright had red hair, problem with him too?
no, drama queen.did keith continually act like an obnoxious arse every chance he gets? lennons whole persona rubs me up the wrong way and in case you hadn't noticed red hair IS one of his characteristics .lighten up FFS (thoughtpolicesmily):rolleyes:

Purple & Green
20-03-2011, 10:26 PM
I think there's a couple of things to add.

Firstly, Lennon should take some lessons from Alan Thompson who seems to have matured immensely since hanging up his boots.

Secondly, I fear that Celtics contempt for authority is now coming full circle with a lack of respect for their own key figures. You can't set out to undermine governing bodies, and then be surprised when you are treated with a lack of respect.

clerriehibs
20-03-2011, 11:04 PM
He said "one of the great, most visible, most iconic images of popular Catholic culture" and like it or not that is true.

Regardless of whether it's actual culture or popular culture, my point's still the same.

Spiers describes the shirt as an iconic religious symbol, and the whole point of his article is bigotry against Neil Lennon, and I assume by extension against Celtic, and the ovious point is there's a problem with bigotry in football and in Scotland as a whole.

But accepting religious symbolism as normal in non-religious areas (i.e. football) will only ever accentuate the problem, because the hotheads will only ever see it as a war to be fought, without knowing and understanding what their (if they actually have it) religion really means and stands for.

Removed
21-03-2011, 12:09 AM
He said "one of the great, most visible, most iconic images of popular Catholic culture" and like it or not that is true.

Aye but only in Scotland and Northern Ireland where Catholics are in the minority and football is just used as an excuse for bigotry and violence.

The Catholic faith is pretty much worldwide but how many other Catholic countries have a Celtc strip as one of their iconic images..................


I'd have a guess at none.