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Part/Time Supporter
28-11-2010, 05:54 PM
on breaking news ticker on BBC Sport website.

Will Celtc stop their bleating now?

Maybe if they start winning.

:wink:

Minder
28-11-2010, 05:54 PM
Dougie - best of luck.

Sammy7nil
28-11-2010, 05:58 PM
good luck - he is a good Hibby :wink:

Sir David Gray
28-11-2010, 05:59 PM
It had to be happen to be honest. As soon as someone who relies on integrity and honesty, like a referee, admits to lying their position is probably untenable.

Celtic should be happy. I wonder if that will stop Lennon and Reid coming out with their ridiculous statements from now on. :rolleyes:

Barney McGrew
28-11-2010, 06:00 PM
Will Celtc stop their bleating now?

:faf:

Aye right.

Part/Time Supporter
28-11-2010, 06:03 PM
:faf:

Aye right.

For a club that purports to be oppressed by the Scottish establishment (whatever that is), they seem to have an awful lot of influence in the corridors of power.

Westie1875
28-11-2010, 06:05 PM
And still we await the punishment for Lennon, Reid & Hooper for their ridiculous rants over the past few weeks....... :rolleyes: :I'm waiti

marinello59
28-11-2010, 06:07 PM
For a club that purports to be oppressed by the Scottish establishment (whatever that is), they seem to have an awful lot of influence in the corridors of power.

I guess that would be members of the Westminster Government etc. They'll never get any ex cabinet ministers fighting their case with weapons of mass distraction will they?

Barney McGrew
28-11-2010, 06:17 PM
And still we await the punishment for Lennon

Now that the refgate saga is coming to an end, people will begin to focus on Lennon and realise that actually, when you look past all his tantrums and blaming of match officials, he's not a very good manager. He's lost every 'big' game he's been in charge of Celtc for.

His punishment will ultimately be the sack, and probably early in the new year. I'd expect his behaviour to get more and more erratic as the pressure mounts between now and then.

Part/Time Supporter
28-11-2010, 06:22 PM
Now that the refgate saga is coming to an end, people will begin to focus on Lennon and realise that actually, when you look past all his tantrums and blaming of match officials, he's not a very good manager. He's lost every 'big' game he's been in charge of Celtc for.

His punishment will ultimately be the sack, and probably early in the new year. I'd expect his behaviour to get more and more erratic as the pressure mounts between now and then.

Their form is now deteriorating in the other games as well, having done very well for the first 5-6 months he was in post.

Is he the ginger Yogi?

:greengrin

PaulSmith
28-11-2010, 06:25 PM
So Dallas away who was excellent in running the development if refs and McDonald who is the most respected ref in Scotland plus another who put loads back into refereeing development are both gone due to the influence of Celtic football club.
I'm pretty certain that we'll see other cat 1's walk away from the game now

Barney McGrew
28-11-2010, 06:29 PM
I'm pretty certain that we'll see other cat 1's walk away from the game now

It wouldn't surprise me and it's a sad state of affairs when you have one club that can put that much pressure onto officials and have the governing body stand back and let it happen.

Hibs Class
28-11-2010, 06:34 PM
So Dallas away who was excellent in running the development if refs and McDonald who is the most respected ref in Scotland plus another who put loads back into refereeing development are both gone due to the influence of Celtic football club.
I'm pretty certain that we'll see other cat 1's walk away from the game now

This is the key thing for me. Anyone who isn't paranoid or vindictive will see that Scottish football is worse off because of these two departures.

PISTOL1875
28-11-2010, 06:35 PM
He shouldve been sacked after it was found he lied at Tannadice...

marinello59
28-11-2010, 06:39 PM
It wouldn't surprise me and it's a sad state of affairs when you have one club that can put that much pressure onto officials and have the governing body stand back and let it happen.
:agree: Yet again the SFA shows itself to be incapable of doing anything to save our game. I think they have done more damage than Celtc with their failure to get any sort of grasp of the situation.

PISTOL1875
28-11-2010, 06:40 PM
:agree: Yet again the SFA shows itself to be incapable of doing anything to save our game. I think they have done more damage than Celtc with their failure to get any sort of grasp of the situation.

Of course they have.. If they had punished Dougie McDonald immediately instead of farting around , then none of this wouldve happened...

Barney McGrew
28-11-2010, 06:44 PM
:agree: Yet again the SFA shows itself to be incapable of doing anything to save our game. I think they have done more damage than Celtc with their failure to get any sort of grasp of the situation.

The quotes from Dougie MacDonald lay the blame fairly and squarely at the SFA General Purposes Committee and their inaction

"It is with regret that I have decided, with immediate effect, to retire from my role as a category one referee. My category one colleagues decided rightly to withdraw their services from matches this weekend in response to the outrageous way they have been treated by sections within Scottish football and, in my opinion, the lack of support they have received from the SFA General Purposes Committee in recent years. However, their united stand, and the position of strength they have established this weekend, has been clouded by one issue, namely the aftermath of the Dundee United v Celtic match on 17 October. I apologised for my role in that and wanted my previously unblemished 29-year career to move on. Now is the time for all of Scottish football to move on. My decision will therefore remove that issue from the debate and ensure that the next day of action - which, in my opinion, will undoubtedly come if the football community does not have a massive change of heart - will result in media coverage being concentrated on those who engage in referee bashing and those who condone it."

"It is also important to make clear that just as this issue is not about Dougie McDonald alone, nor is it about Celtic Football Club alone," he added.
"The truth is, since I became a class one referee, managers or players - and sometimes directors - at almost every club, at one time or another, have been guilty of such behaviour. The only difference being the degree and tenor of the criticism and the inferences from it. The constant has been the unwillingness of the SFA General Purposes Committee to deal with it. I suggest they check the meaning of phrases such as 'wasn't impartial' used by (former Celtic winger) Aiden McGeady and 'conspires to' used by (Dundee United manager) Peter Houston and consider whether we want those used in Scottish football."

It also seems to suggest that there will be further action from the referees too.

Hibs Class
28-11-2010, 06:45 PM
Of course they have.. If they had punished Dougie McDonald immediately instead of farting around , then none of this wouldve happened...

As far as I'm aware they did punish him - McDonald was investigated and reprimanded. I think that was a reasonable punishment.

Unfortunately there were some who saw the opportunity for a continuing witch-hunt and today's outcome is primarily the reflection of a weak governing body and a bullying football club.

Sir David Gray
28-11-2010, 06:52 PM
The quotes from Dougie MacDonald lay the blame fairly and squarely at the SFA General Purposes Committee and their inaction

"It is with regret that I have decided, with immediate effect, to retire from my role as a category one referee. My category one colleagues decided rightly to withdraw their services from matches this weekend in response to the outrageous way they have been treated by sections within Scottish football and, in my opinion, the lack of support they have received from the SFA General Purposes Committee in recent years. However, their united stand, and the position of strength they have established this weekend, has been clouded by one issue, namely the aftermath of the Dundee United v Celtic match on 17 October. I apologised for my role in that and wanted my previously unblemished 29-year career to move on. Now is the time for all of Scottish football to move on. My decision will therefore remove that issue from the debate and ensure that the next day of action - which, in my opinion, will undoubtedly come if the football community does not have a massive change of heart - will result in media coverage being concentrated on those who engage in referee bashing and those who condone it."

"It is also important to make clear that just as this issue is not about Dougie McDonald alone, nor is it about Celtic Football Club alone," he added.
"The truth is, since I became a class one referee, managers or players - and sometimes directors - at almost every club, at one time or another, have been guilty of such behaviour. The only difference being the degree and tenor of the criticism and the inferences from it. The constant has been the unwillingness of the SFA General Purposes Committee to deal with it. I suggest they check the meaning of phrases such as 'wasn't impartial' used by (former Celtic winger) Aiden McGeady and 'conspires to' used by (Dundee United manager) Peter Houston and consider whether we want those used in Scottish football."

It also seems to suggest that there will be further action from the referees too.

I would fully expect that to be the case.

I'm not actually sure why they are seemingly quite happy to officiate next week when none of the issues that made them go on strike this weekend in the first place have apparently been rectified by the SFA.

If they feel so strongly about how they are being treated, they should refuse to officiate until further notice.

PISTOL1875
28-11-2010, 06:54 PM
As far as I'm aware they did punish him - McDonald was investigated and reprimanded. I think that was a reasonable punishment.

Unfortunately there were some who saw the opportunity for a continuing witch-hunt and today's outcome is primarily the reflection of a weak governing body and a bullying football club.

Dougie should've been suspended or even sacked... But once again the SFA bottle to take any proper action.. All they do is give him a slap on the wrist , tell not to be a naughty boy , send him on his merry way to the lower leagues for a couple of weeks and then give him Hibs v Motherwell a few weeks later with everything swept under the carpet...

skipster7
28-11-2010, 06:55 PM
He shouldve been sacked after it was found he lied at Tannadice...
not for me,he got the decision right so it shouldn't matter who came to the decision.the fact it was celtic and the flack because of that is clouding the issue.we would all be daft to think ref teams dont get stories straight if there are any major calls that are debatable.it doesn't mean they are corrupt, just looking out for each other.

ozzie
28-11-2010, 06:55 PM
just glad he walked away rather than appologise to them.

johnrebus
28-11-2010, 06:57 PM
Right.

That's the decks just about cleared.


Time now for the SFA to deal with Celtic (and Hearts / Dundee United).


:I'm waiti

Barney McGrew
28-11-2010, 06:58 PM
just glad he walked away rather than appologise to them.

He tried to. He called Lennon, Lennon didn't answer and didn't return the message left by MacDonald on his voicemail.

Another example of Lennon being the classless wee fud that he is.

Twa Cairpets
28-11-2010, 07:00 PM
I would fully expect that to be the case.

I'm not actually sure why they are seemingly quite happy to officiate next week when none of the issues that made them go on strike this weekend in the first place have apparently been rectified by the SFA.

If they feel so strongly about how they are being treated, they should refuse to officiate until further notice.

Because the action was to highlight the issue and start the process of change, according to McKendrick on the radio last night.

PISTOL1875
28-11-2010, 07:01 PM
not for me,he got the decision right so it shouldn't matter who came to the decision.the fact it was celtic and the flack because of that is clouding the issue.we would all be daft to think ref teams dont get stories straight if there are any major calls that are debatable.it doesn't mean they are corrupt, just looking out for each other.

He did get the decision right and I must say that I applauded him for having the balls to change his mind BUT he lied about the linesman incident and got caught out trying to cover it up..

No doubts ref's have looked out for each other in the past and will probably do the same in the future but after he got caught the SFA should've done something concrete instead of trying to let it all blow over and sweep it under the carpet like they usually do...

Twa Cairpets
28-11-2010, 07:03 PM
Dougie should've been suspended or even sacked... But once again the SFA bottle to take any proper action.. All they do is give him a slap on the wrist , tell not to be a naughty boy , send him on his merry way to the lower leagues for a couple of weeks and then give him Hibs v Motherwell a few weeks later with everything swept under the carpet...

I hope you hold the same piece of moral high ground the next time one of our players dives for a penalty, and insist he is sacked.

I think what McDonald has done and the statement made is both fundamentally decent and clear in describing where the blame lies.

Nuitdelune
28-11-2010, 07:06 PM
He likely lied because he was too frightened of Lennon & Co to take responsibility for changing his mind

PaulSmith
28-11-2010, 07:08 PM
Dougie should've been suspended or even sacked... But once again the SFA bottle to take any proper action.. All they do is give him a slap on the wrist , tell not to be a naughty boy , send him on his merry way to the lower leagues for a couple of weeks and then give him Hibs v Motherwell a few weeks later with everything swept under the carpet...

So 29 years service and currently one of the top refs in Scotland should be sacked for trying to keep one of his asst's out of the crap and telling a fib which he then admitted fairly quickly and had no bearing on anyone bar him and the ref dept.

Get a grip

PISTOL1875
28-11-2010, 07:13 PM
So 29 years service and currently one of the top refs in Scotland should be sacked for trying to keep one of his asst's out of the crap and telling a fib which he then admitted fairly quickly and had no bearing on anyone bar him and the ref dept.

Get a grip

If he had any decency then he would've resigned as soon as he admitted it...

Baldy Foghorn
28-11-2010, 07:16 PM
It wouldn't surprise me and it's a sad state of affairs when you have one club that can put that much pressure onto officials and have the governing body stand back and let it happen.

:agree::agree:

Think this will act as a catalyst, and throw our game into further chaos

Twa Cairpets
28-11-2010, 07:17 PM
He likely lied because he was too frightened of Lennon & Co to take responsibility for changing his mind

What a spectacularly stupid post on amost every level.

Seriously.

mim
28-11-2010, 07:18 PM
So 29 years service and currently one of the top refs in Scotland should be sacked for trying to keep one of his asst's out of the crap and telling a fib which he then admitted fairly quickly and had no bearing on anyone bar him and the ref dept.

Get a grip

He actually dropped his assistant in the crap. He wrongly informed Lennon that the assistant had called him over and told him it wasn't a penalty - putting the onus on his assistant, who resigned over the matter.

PISTOL1875
28-11-2010, 07:23 PM
So 29 years service and currently one of the top refs in Scotland should be sacked for trying to keep one of his asst's out of the crap and telling a fib which he then admitted fairly quickly and had no bearing on anyone bar him and the ref dept.

Get a grip

Where have you been hiding ?? DM lied when he said to Lennon that the linesman called him over to inform him it wasn't a penalty.. He tried to shift the blame onto his linesman and got found out when the linesman told the papers he didn't call him over...

PaulSmith
28-11-2010, 07:26 PM
If he had any decency then he would've resigned as soon as he admitted it...

Know anything about the man or his career to make such a sweeping statement?

PaulSmith
28-11-2010, 07:29 PM
He actually dropped his assistant in the crap. He wrongly informed Lennon that the assistant had called him over and told him it wasn't a penalty - putting the onus on his assistant, who resigned over the matter.

Rubbish.
Craven was going to get slaughtered from the ref Obs and Dallas for not having the bottle to raise his flag even though he admitted that he knew it wasn't a penalty when Dougie asked him, McDonald tried to cover for him by saying that he called him over via his ear piece.
Craven then used this against Dallas and McDonald when he knew he'd ****ed up again and prob wouldn't get another game

Nuitdelune
28-11-2010, 07:30 PM
What a spectacularly stupid post on amost every level.

Seriously.

Why?

PISTOL1875
28-11-2010, 07:33 PM
Know anything about the man or his career to make such a sweeping statement?

He can be trusted now.. He was in a position of trust and he blew it...

Hopefully now with him and Hugh Dallas away , Scottish football can move on and start making headlines on the park...

Twa Cairpets
28-11-2010, 07:33 PM
Why?

If he was worried about abuse or stick from Celtc, then he simply would not have changed his mind about the penalty award in the first place. Easy option was to award the penalty, let it stand and it wouldnt even have been seen as a particularly contentious award.

Part/Time Supporter
28-11-2010, 07:34 PM
He can be trusted now.. He was in a position of trust and he blew it...

Hopefully now with him and Hugh Dallas away , Scottish football can move on and start making headlines on the park...

Fat chance.

Barney McGrew
28-11-2010, 07:35 PM
Hopefully now with him and Hugh Dallas away , Scottish football can move on and start making headlines on the park...

Do you honestly think Celtc are going to let this drop now?

Not a ****ing chance.

LeithBoozy
28-11-2010, 07:35 PM
I have been following Hibs for a lot of years, Dougie is the only Ref I know who is a fellow Hibby. He really should hang his head In shame, nothing to do with any controversial decision given against the soap-dodgers. But how can he show his face at ER again after being in charge of a derby that Hearts won, what a sin. :agree:

marinello59
28-11-2010, 07:35 PM
He can be trusted now.. He was in a position of trust and he blew it...

Hopefully now with him and Hugh Dallas away , Scottish football can move on and start making headlines on the park...

I wish. :boo hoo:

mim
28-11-2010, 07:36 PM
Rubbish.
Craven was going to get slaughtered from the ref Obs and Dallas for not having the bottle to raise his flag even though he admitted that he knew it wasn't a penalty when Dougie asked him, McDonald tried to cover for him by saying that he called him over via his ear piece.
Craven then used this against Dallas and McDonald when he knew he'd ****ed up again and prob wouldn't get another game

That's one way of looking at it - the wrong way imho.
The assistant correctly did not signal for a penalty. The reaction of the Dundee Utd players caused McDonald to realise that he had probably screwed up. He went to Craven, who confirmed his suspicions. McDonald got the deceision right, eventually. There was absolutely no need to lie.

Part/Time Supporter
28-11-2010, 07:37 PM
FAO those suggesting McDonald should automatically go because he "told a lie" to an SPL manager:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/r/rangers/8935276.stm


Hughes, meanwhile, while saying both players should have remained on the pitch, felt McBride in particular was dealt with too severely by Brines.

"It's a little bit disappointing the players got involved but if he wants to pick out McBride for his part, he actually got rag-dolled more than being the aggressor," he argued.

And the Easter Road manager suggested Brines changed his mind over why he sent his player off.

"I asked him at half-time and he said it was for running into him and barging him and that's not the case," he said.

"When I went in to speak to him after the match he said it was because he kicked the ball at him so that's a little disappointing.

Logically, Brines must have "told a lie" in one or both instance.

Presumably Celtic, in the same circumstances, would have demanded that Brines should go.

PaulSmith
28-11-2010, 07:42 PM
That's one way of looking at it - the wrong way imho.
The assistant correctly did not signal for a penalty. The reaction of the Dundee Utd players caused McDonald to realise that he had probably screwed up. He went to Craven, who confirmed his suspicions. McDonald got the deceision right, eventually. There was absolutely no need to lie.

The factual way, one that is in danger if being lost in all this hysteria.
Do you mean he was correct not to raise his flag even though he knew it wasn't a penalty??
Celtic Football Club have used this incident and the Dallas email to 'prove' that since their inception they have been the victims of sectarian prejudice.
Sad sad days ahead for Scottish football when a club can effectively bring down the SFA if they have a grievance.

Nuitdelune
28-11-2010, 07:43 PM
If he was worried about abuse or stick from Celtc, then he simply would not have changed his mind about the penalty award in the first place. Easy option was to award the penalty, let it stand and it wouldnt even have been seen as a particularly contentious award.

Ah but in there he is an honourable man and knew he had made an error and wanted to put it right but wanted to spread the load for the decision to change his mind. Sorry someone on here said I had no class and was a half wit because I made a joke and have been smarting ever since and so was being a bit over sensitive--thought you were doing the same!

mim
28-11-2010, 07:44 PM
Celtic Football Club have used this incident and the Dallas email to 'prove' that since their inception they have been the victims of sectarian prejudice.
Sad sad days ahead for Scottish football when a club can effectively bring down the SFA if they have a grievance.

At least we can agree about this. :agree:

Hibs Class
28-11-2010, 07:47 PM
The factual way, one that is in danger if being lost in all this hysteria.
Celtic Football Club have used this incident and the Dallas email to 'prove' that since their inception they have been the victims of sectarian prejudice.
Sad sad days ahead for Scottish football when a club can effectively bring down the SFA if they have a grievance.

Spot on. Anyone (including some of those on this thread) who thinks this was about one decision at Tannadice should consider the following quote from John Reid:

"We're not asking for special treatment, but neither will we be treated as less than anyone else.Those days are gone."

The proper response here would have been a disrepute charge for Celtic.

hughio
28-11-2010, 07:49 PM
Somebody will I hope copy this article by Ian Bell in today's Sunday Herald and post it here since my computer skills are somewhat limited.
He says the problem is much deeper than has been portrayed by the various arguments about Dallas Mcdonald and the actual decisions and regrettably exemplifies a deeper sickness in Scottish society,
I feel he is right and his conclusion that this may in fact spell an end to the game as we know it up here.The product itself is flawed,,,the lack of quality obvious,The big two with their bigoted hoardes constantly browbeating the spineless suits in the SFA, the conspiracy theorists and the bile that masquerades as support, hand in hand with the traditional scottish aggression and now we cant even get a ref to officiate the rubbish.

RIP

Vini1875
28-11-2010, 07:50 PM
Considering what the refs are saying that it is all clubs who share the blame/responsibilty for this I wonder if they will start to become more hard line with regard to the rules.

I am sure that if they booked players for every infringement, especially the disent rules we would see few games finishing with full teams on the park and virually no mangers in the dug outs.

Albion Hibs
28-11-2010, 07:57 PM
The factual way, one that is in danger if being lost in all this hysteria.
Do you mean he was correct not to raise his flag even though he knew it wasn't a penalty??
Celtic Football Club have used this incident and the Dallas email to 'prove' that since their inception they have been the victims of sectarian prejudice.
Sad sad days ahead for Scottish football when a club can effectively bring down the SFA if they have a grievance.


Totally agree, I am sick to death of all the religion feel sorry for us chat. It has no place in football, it is boring the life out of me.

The way Celtic have conducted themselves is nothing sort of embarrassing, if I was a fan, player or anyone associated with the club I would be even more ashamed of myself than usual.

The majority of my work are OF supporters, I honestly get my kill at the fact they think they are so hard done by. There are only so many ways you can say "spend a season following a non-OF team and then complain about referring injustices unwashed one".

Hope they are taken to town over this, come January hope there is plenty of conspiracy chants going on.

Minder
28-11-2010, 07:57 PM
It takes a big man to admit they were wrong (which Dougie has admitted). His statement today shows the mans class. Once a Hibby always a Hibby.

As for Lennon and Reid, what goes round comes round. Would not surprise me at all if both are out by start of next season.

The Harp Awakes
28-11-2010, 08:00 PM
FAO those suggesting McDonald should automatically go because he "told a lie" to an SPL manager:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/r/rangers/8935276.stm



Logically, Brines must have "told a lie" in one or both instance.

Presumably Celtic, in the same circumstances, would have demanded that Brines should go.

Spot on mate. There is no difference in what Brines did earlier on in the season. The only difference is that Hibs didn't make a big deal of it.

BEEJ
28-11-2010, 08:01 PM
And still we await the punishment for Lennon, Reid & Hooper for their ridiculous rants over the past few weeks....... :rolleyes: :I'm waiti
Genuinely merited. But don't hold your breath. :rolleyes:


FAO those suggesting McDonald should automatically go because he "told a lie" to an SPL manager:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/r/rangers/8935276.stm

Logically, Brines must have "told a lie" in one or both instance.

Presumably Celtic, in the same circumstances, would have demanded that Brines should go.
Good spot. :top marks Hope Hibs start their campaign tomorrow.:wink:


Celtic Football Club have used this incident and the Dallas email to 'prove' that since their inception they have been the victims of sectarian prejudice.

Sad sad days ahead for Scottish football when a club can effectively bring down the SFA if they have a grievance.
:agree: These are truly disturbing developments.

Celtic FC will now feel fully vindicated and the SFA will be even more scared of them than they were before. What an utter farce.

allezsauzee
28-11-2010, 08:02 PM
He can be trusted now.. He was in a position of trust and he blew it...

Hopefully now with him and Hugh Dallas away , Scottish football can move on and start making headlines on the park...

So everybody who has told a lie should be sacked now? Did your dad get his jotters when you found out there was nae santa?

hibbill2002
28-11-2010, 08:09 PM
So everybody who has told a lie should be sacked now? Did your dad get his jotters when you found out there was nae santa?
:confused:




:boo hoo:

Alfred E Newman
28-11-2010, 08:10 PM
So everybody who has told a lie should be sacked now? Did your dad get his jotters when you found out there was nae santa?

Nae Santa?

Andy74
28-11-2010, 08:12 PM
Sums up the self importance these guys have. Who cares who they are we don't really want to notice the refs. Refs in Scotland have never got this.

greenlex
28-11-2010, 08:18 PM
Is Santa a Catholic or Proddy?

allezsauzee
28-11-2010, 08:19 PM
Nae Santa?


Sorry mate I was only kidding .....of course there is, although he never gives Celtic anything :greengrin

hibsbollah
28-11-2010, 08:40 PM
on breaking news ticker on BBC Sport website.

Will Celtc stop their bleating now?

Maybe if they start winning.

:wink:
I don't think they'll ever stop bleating. They'd lose their whole reason for existing if they did.

NORTHERNHIBBY
28-11-2010, 08:57 PM
I really wish that McDonald had taken the long walk the day after because his position was always untenable but now it looks like he has bowed to pressure when the reality is that it ever should have mattered if the game involved Celtc or not. What he did was against his own code of conduct and someone within either the SFA or the referee's own set up should have had the nous to say we need to nip this now, because if we give it to Celtc to drive it we will never hear the end of it.

Not that I have real fondness for ICT, but what a shame they did not get a third yesterday. Lennon in his press conference, had to play a busted flush because his players could not deliver in the game under the biggest focus, and he knew that he couldn't tie the ref to anything to do with the Masons or Rangers.

fatbloke
28-11-2010, 09:24 PM
Totally agree, I am sick to death of all the religion feel sorry for us chat. It has no place in football, it is boring the life out of me.

The way Celtic have conducted themselves is nothing sort of embarrassing, if I was a fan, player or anyone associated with the club I would be even more ashamed of myself than usual.

The majority of my work are OF supporters, I honestly get my kill at the fact they think they are so hard done by. There are only so many ways you can say "spend a season following a non-OF team and then complain about referring injustices unwashed one".

Hope they are taken to town over this, come January hope there is plenty of conspiracy chants going on.

Anyone who supports that club has no shame, so you will wait a long time for that.

fatbloke
28-11-2010, 09:26 PM
I don't think they'll ever stop bleating. They'd lose their whole reason for existing if they did.

:agree::agree::agree::agree:

Argylehibby
28-11-2010, 09:31 PM
I really wish that McDonald had taken the long walk the day after because his position was always untenable but now it looks like he has bowed to pressure when the reality is that it ever should have mattered if the game involved Celtc or not. What he did was against his own code of conduct and someone within either the SFA or the referee's own set up should have had the nous to say we need to nip this now, because if we give it to Celtc to drive it we will never hear the end of it.



The problem is had it not involved Celtic he probably wouldn’t have felt the need to lie. Like all refs he is only human and having realised he had got it wrong he sorted that. However facing a backlash from Lennon/Celtic and no doubt the catholic Media Office in time, add nae support from his bosses he tried to cover up how the correct decision was reached. If that had been Motherwell v St Mirren do you honestly think there would have been any reason to try to cover it up?

Celtic have had an agenda for some time and that is to put pressure on refs to give decisions in their favour or get hounded as DM and Willie Column have been this season and the top brass at the SFA and SPL have done absolutely nothing about it. They might as well start calling Lord Reid the CEO of the SFA as he has more say on what goes on than anyone in a blazer at Hampden. The rest of this season will see every decision that goes against Celtic referred to as the backlash for standing up against McDonald and Dallas by Lennon (if he lasts that long)

DM was one of the best refs in Scotland, he is lost to the game because he wouldn’t bow to Celtics bullying. His card was marked at celicfootballlclub when he sent McGeady off for diving at ER.

PC Stamp
28-11-2010, 09:35 PM
And still we await the punishment for Lennon, Reid & Hooper for their ridiculous rants over the past few weeks....... :rolleyes: :I'm waiti

Indeed. If Celtc aren't hammered in the same manner every other club would be then it will speak volumes about who actually runs the game in Scotland.

Green Knight
28-11-2010, 09:36 PM
It's ridiculous - a man of patent integrity, who had the bottle to admit he was wrong over a penalty, and who allowed his linesman to embellish what happened, is sacrificed to a foul-mouthed ranter of a manager and a professional bully boy who is better suited to the everyday dishonesties of politics than to football.

So when is Reid going to apologise for all the soldiers he sent to their death in Afghanistan? There's an issue that has had less air time than his cowardly assassination of an excellent referee.

Pass the sick bag - and keep politicians out of football.

PaulSmith
28-11-2010, 09:38 PM
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/scotland/9143774.stm

Just in case anyone needs refreshed on the actual facts of the incident.

H18sry
28-11-2010, 09:40 PM
:greengrin So will Dougie be in line for Dallas's job then

silverhibee
28-11-2010, 09:45 PM
Indeed. If Celtc aren't hammered in the same manner every other club would be then it will speak volumes about who actually runs the game in Scotland.

:top marks

Kaiser1962
28-11-2010, 09:48 PM
Nae Santa?

WTF!!!! :boo hoo:

Kaiser1962
28-11-2010, 09:49 PM
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/scotland/9143774.stm

Just in case anyone needs refreshed on the actual facts of the incident.

Your wasting your time mate. Since when did facts come into this?

s.a.m
28-11-2010, 09:50 PM
The problem is had it not involved Celtic he probably wouldn’t have felt the need to lie. Like all refs he is only human and having realised he had got it wrong he sorted that. However facing a backlash from Lennon/Celtic and no doubt the catholic Media Office in time, add nae support from his bosses he tried to cover up how the correct decision was reached. If that had been Motherwell v St Mirren do you honestly think there would have been any reason to try to cover it up?

Celtic have had an agenda for some time and that is to put pressure on refs to give decisions in their favour or get hounded as DM and Willie Column have been this season and the top brass at the SFA and SPL have done absolutely nothing about it. They might as well start calling Lord Reid the CEO of the SFA as he has more say on what goes on than anyone in a blazer at Hampden. The rest of this season will see every decision that goes against Celtic referred to as the backlash for standing up against McDonald and Dallas by Lennon (if he lasts that long)

DM was one of the best refs in Scotland, he is lost to the game because he wouldn’t bow to Celtics bullying. His card was marked at celicfootballlclub when he sent McGeady off for diving at ER.

I think you're absolutely right, and I'm completely sickened by the whole thing. I've had enough.

northern-hibee
28-11-2010, 11:57 PM
Hopefully now with him and Hugh Dallas away , Scottish football can move on and start making headlines on the park...[/QUOTE]

:top marks

Great news, hopefully a new brush will sweep clean

lucky
29-11-2010, 12:08 AM
Looks like the spin off get thier way again. They wanted McDonald and Dallas out. Now will the SFA have the bottle to deal with Lennon and Reid.

Hibbie_Cameron
29-11-2010, 12:14 AM
Wonder if he will be getting a half season ticket?

Now McDonald has gone i would be expecting the SFA or whatever organisation deals with it to punish Celtic, Lennon and Reid to the full.

After all this ref pantomime its time they grew a back bone and done something about it. I wont hold out much hope though

Hibbyradge
29-11-2010, 09:56 AM
I would fully expect that to be the case.

I'm not actually sure why they are seemingly quite happy to officiate next week when none of the issues that made them go on strike this weekend in the first place have apparently been rectified by the SFA.

If they feel so strongly about how they are being treated, they should refuse to officiate until further notice.

Interesting.

I'm sure the extreme left in the country would fully embrace your suggestion that all unions should go on all out indefinite strike everytime they have a grievance.

Hibbyradge
29-11-2010, 10:00 AM
If he had any decency then he would've resigned as soon as he admitted it...

You think he has no decency? :bitchy:

Do you know Dougie McDonald?

Phil D. Rolls
29-11-2010, 10:53 AM
on breaking news ticker on BBC Sport website.

Will Celtc stop their bleating now?

Maybe if they start winning.

:wink:

No, they'll just get worse. This is the wrong message to send to a baying mob that has lost any sense of reason they ever had.

Peat will be next. After that we'll really have to get this situation under control. :devil:

Sir David Gray
29-11-2010, 12:04 PM
Interesting.

I'm sure the extreme left in the country would fully embrace your suggestion that all unions should go on all out indefinite strike everytime they have a grievance.

It's not something that I am wanting them to do, I'm just surprised that with all the protests and demonstrations that are going on just now across the country about various grievances that people have, that the referees are happy to come back next week without any resolution being made to the situation.

I thought the whole point of a strike was to force your employer into changing their ways on whatever grievance their employees have. There's no point if you are going to strike once and then go back to work without anything changing.

Personally speaking, I am generally opposed to striking, except in exceptional circumstances. If everyone went on strike, the country would soon go to the wall.

Phil D. Rolls
29-11-2010, 12:07 PM
It's not something that I am wanting them to do, I'm just surprised that with all the protests and demonstrations that are going on just now across the country about various grievances that people have, that the referees are happy to come back next week without any resolution being made to the situation.

I thought the whole point of a strike was to force your employer into changing their ways on whatever grievance their employees have. There's no point if you are going to strike once and then go back to work without anything changing.

Personally speaking, I am generally opposed to striking, except in exceptional circumstances. If everyone went on strike, the country would soon go to the wall.

The referees have flexed their muscles. It lets their employer know what they are capable of and how far they can go.

Striking is sometimes the only way that people have to make others listen. If the whole country went on strike what would that say about British management?

CropleyWasGod
29-11-2010, 12:10 PM
It's not something that I am wanting them to do, I'm just surprised that with all the protests and demonstrations that are going on just now across the country about various grievances that people have, that the referees are happy to come back next week without any resolution being made to the situation.

I thought the whole point of a strike was to force your employer into changing their ways on whatever grievance their employees have. There's no point if you are going to strike once and then go back to work without anything changing.

Personally speaking, I am generally opposed to striking, except in exceptional circumstances. If everyone went on strike, the country would soon go to the wall.

Sometimes the point of industrial action is to raise awareness;to get people talking. That has certainly happened in this case... look at the length of the threads on this board alone. It also sends a message about what might happen again, and enable those with power to take notice and take appropriate action.

Jim44
29-11-2010, 12:12 PM
It's not something that I am wanting them to do, I'm just surprised that with all the protests and demonstrations that are going on just now across the country about various grievances that people have, that the referees are happy to come back next week without any resolution being made to the situation.

I thought the whole point of a strike was to force your employer into changing their ways on whatever grievance their employees have. There's no point if you are going to strike once and then go back to work without anything changing.

Personally speaking, I am generally opposed to striking, except in exceptional circumstances. If everyone went on strike, the country would soon go to the wall.

Strikes aren't always a case of all out/stay out till the death and hurt every body in the process scenario. They are often designed to be short and sharp and show the depth of feeling of the aggrieved party. I think that's what's happening here.

Hibbyradge
29-11-2010, 12:22 PM
It's not something that I am wanting them to do, I'm just surprised that with all the protests and demonstrations that are going on just now across the country about various grievances that people have, that the referees are happy to come back next week without any resolution being made to the situation.

I thought the whole point of a strike was to force your employer into changing their ways on whatever grievance their employees have. There's no point if you are going to strike once and then go back to work without anything changing.

Personally speaking, I am generally opposed to striking, except in exceptional circumstances. If everyone went on strike, the country would soon go to the wall.

A one day strike is a legitimate tactic in a dispute.

They raise awareness and let the employers, and the customers and public, understand the depth of the strikers concerns. It also builds a sense of strength amongst the strikers and a feeling that they're not alone.

The refs are saying "We're deadly serious about this and we're prepared to sacrifice our wages, £800, to prove it. If you don't do something about it, we may strike again."

As Cropley has pointed out, it's already been successful.

If the SFA don't do anything now, we'll see more action.

I don't want strikes either, and very few workers want to lose their wages, but what else can they do if their employer doesn't deal with their legitimate grievances?

CropleyWasGod
29-11-2010, 12:25 PM
A one day strike is a legitimate tactic in a dispute.

They raise awareness and let the employers, and the customers and public, understand the depth of the strikers concerns. It also builds a sense of strength amongst the strikers and a feeling that they're not alone.

The refs are saying "We're deadly serious about this and we're prepared to sacrifice our wages, £800, to prove it. If you don't do something about it, we may strike again."

As Cropley has pointed out, it's already been successful.

If the SFA don't do anything now, we'll see more action.

I don't want strikes either, and very few workers want to lose their wages, but what else can they do if their employer doesn't deal with their legitimate grievances?

It also, of course, allows the SPL to consider their own options. Why bother with an unreliable supply of services, when there are alternatives out there? That's the down side of taking industrial action when you are self-employed.

Dinkydoo
29-11-2010, 12:47 PM
What Lennon and co. have been guilty of over the past couple of months is nothing short of bullying.

If I put so much pressure on another member of staff at my work that they felt there was no other option than to walk away I'd most likely be up infront of a tribunal.

Scotland would be so much better off without the bigot brothers all together.

H18sry
29-11-2010, 12:49 PM
Dougie and Shuggie find Christmas work


http://elfyourself.jibjab.com/view/PQdgXIxNc9OUYkUT

Hibbyradge
29-11-2010, 01:03 PM
It also, of course, allows the SPL to consider their own options. Why bother with an unreliable supply of services, when there are alternatives out there? That's the down side of taking industrial action when you are self-employed.

Yes, it's an option, but not a realistic one, imo. It would be a huge mistake to decide not to have senior Scottish referees, not to mention a massive insult to the country.

Can you imagine the reaction if the SFA said that no-one in Scotland can be trusted to referee a game of football?

There aren't really alternatives anyway. The cost of bringing in our ref at the weekend must have been enormous. Multiply that 21 times every Saturday and more. They also have to attend meetings, go to training attend disciplinary hearings.

This won't happen.

Sir David Gray
29-11-2010, 01:05 PM
It also, of course, allows the SPL to consider their own options. Why bother with an unreliable supply of services, when there are alternatives out there? That's the down side of taking industrial action when you are self-employed.

:agree: That's the chance you take if you decide to go on strike. That's part of the reason why my situation at work would have to be almost intolerable before I would consider taking industrial action.

With the current situation in the country, I don't think you can blame people who agree to come in and replace workers who are on strike.

Twa Cairpets
29-11-2010, 01:26 PM
:agree: That's the chance you take if you decide to go on strike. That's part of the reason why my situation at work would have to be almost intolerable before I would consider taking industrial action.
With the current situation in the country, I don't think you can blame people who agree to come in and replace workers who are on strike.

Erm, hello? Haven't you read or listened to anything the referees have said?

And your final line is just, frankly, stupid. You think there are queues of impoversihed international referees just waiting to snaffle up crumbs from striking refs?

Phil D. Rolls
29-11-2010, 01:31 PM
:agree: That's the chance you take if you decide to go on strike. That's part of the reason why my situation at work would have to be almost intolerable before I would consider taking industrial action.

With the current situation in the country, I don't think you can blame people who agree to come in and replace workers who are on strike.

Maybe that explains why the refs went on strike?

Danderhall Hibs
29-11-2010, 01:39 PM
Maybe that explains why the refs went on strike?

Maybe it is. If only we knew!

Kaiser1962
29-11-2010, 03:23 PM
This is not finished yet. Celtic appear to be planning to undermine or dismantle the whole system in Scotland which would, in theory, allow them to ply their trade elsewhere.

Whether anybody wants these ****bags and all the baggage that goes with them remains to be seen.

Hibbyradge
29-11-2010, 03:40 PM
This is not finished yet. Celtic appear to be planning to undermine or dismantle the whole system in Scotland which would, in theory, allow them to ply their trade elsewhere.



Gosh, the worm has turned. Celtic conspiring against the rest of us now! :greengrin

What have you seen that has made you come to that conclusion?

Twa Cairpets
29-11-2010, 03:44 PM
Maybe it is. If only we knew!

Change the record. If you cant be ersed reading any of the links or full cut-and-pastes that have been provided then that's your problem.

Phil D. Rolls
29-11-2010, 04:14 PM
This is not finished yet. Celtic appear to be planning to undermine or dismantle the whole system in Scotland which would, in theory, allow them to ply their trade elsewhere.

Whether anybody wants these ****bags and all the baggage that goes with them remains to be seen.

Nail hit on head. Makes their case stronger if they are hounded out of Scotland.

Danderhall Hibs
29-11-2010, 04:39 PM
Change the record. If you cant be ersed reading any of the links or full cut-and-pastes that have been provided then that's your problem.

Read them. They never said anything about Celtic being the reason.

Twa Cairpets
29-11-2010, 04:41 PM
This is not finished yet. Celtic appear to be planning to undermine or dismantle the whole system in Scotland which would, in theory, allow them to ply their trade elsewhere.

Whether anybody wants these ****bags and all the baggage that goes with them remains to be seen.

The theory is right if the underlying assumption is correct, which it isnt. Unless there is a wholesale change in the set up of international club football, which is highly unlikely. It's not so much a case that no-one would want them, its more the case that no-one can take them even of they did want them

The pipe dream that these fuds have that they would be up there with the big boys is the main reason I want them to leave - purely for the schadenfreude that their lack of success would give.

Twa Cairpets
29-11-2010, 04:43 PM
Read them. They never said anything about Celtic being the reason.

Well done. They didnt mention Celtic, and it was very clear why they went on strike. you repeatedly saying "if only we knew" doesnt change that.

Danderhall Hibs
29-11-2010, 04:45 PM
Well done. They didnt mention Celtic, and it was very clear why they went on strike. you repeatedly saying "if only we knew" doesnt change that.

Another fine example of how our refs speak to people. The patronising course is obviously a massive success!

They want all the death threats and that to stop. I don't think they mentioned their situation at work being intolerable either though.

Because of them not really saying that's why so many are jumping to conclusions.

Part/Time Supporter
29-11-2010, 04:51 PM
Read them. They never said anything about Celtic being the reason.


Dougie McDonald cited Aiden McGeady saying he "wasn't impartial" in his statement yesterday.

BoltonHibee
29-11-2010, 04:56 PM
Dougie McDonald cited Aiden McGeady saying he "wasn't impartial" in his statement yesterday.
Just that,or did he go on to say anymore?

PaulSmith
29-11-2010, 04:59 PM
If Regan lied to the Euro refs to get them across to Scotland should he resign?

Twa Cairpets
29-11-2010, 05:02 PM
Another fine example of how our refs speak to people. The patronising course is obviously a massive success!

They want all the death threats and that to stop. I don't think they mentioned their situation at work being intolerable either though.

Because of them not really saying that's why so many are jumping to conclusions.

Sensitive wee soul aren't you petal? Now then, if you just want to stop your tantrum and define what it is you really have an issue with referees about then I think we'll all get on ever so much better. Maybe make yourself a nice wee cup of camomile tea.

If you want I'll give you the details of the patronising course if you give me the details of the pig-headed-selective-reading-of-situations-course you quite clearly got an A+ on.

If you havent got why the refs went out yet then its pointless rehashing them here - you can look at 30-odd pages of the initial thread for that. If you dont grasp the context of the statements they made, and the reasons why they cant come out and say "It was Celtc", then no amount of explanation will help because your mind is totally, completely and irrevocably made up on the matter.

Phil D. Rolls
29-11-2010, 05:30 PM
If Regan lied to the Euro refs to get them across to Scotland should he resign?

Absolutely, and any manager who has ever lied at a press conference (eg I didn't see the disputed penalty) should also walk.

snooky
29-11-2010, 05:49 PM
Celtc 2 Refs 0


:stirrer:

Danderhall Hibs
29-11-2010, 06:11 PM
Sensitive wee soul aren't you petal? Now then, if you just want to stop your tantrum and define what it is you really have an issue with referees about then I think we'll all get on ever so much better. Maybe make yourself a nice wee cup of camomile tea.

If you want I'll give you the details of the patronising course if you give me the details of the pig-headed-selective-reading-of-situations-course you quite clearly got an A+ on.

If you havent got why the refs went out yet then its pointless rehashing them here - you can look at 30-odd pages of the initial thread for that. If you dont grasp the context of the statements they made, and the reasons why they cant come out and say "It was Celtc", then no amount of explanation will help because your mind is totally, completely and irrevocably made up on the matter.

You mention sensitive wee petals and tantrums? That's my opinion of the refs actions this week.

You're right about not re-hashing the points though - given there weren't really any made in the 30-odd pages!

And I won't be changing my mind, I'm being honest here :wink:, I saw the trouble that got the last guy into. :greengrin

Twa Cairpets
29-11-2010, 06:45 PM
You mention sensitive wee petals and tantrums? That's my opinion of the refs actions this week.

You're right about not re-hashing the points though - given there weren't really any made in the 30-odd pages!

And I won't be changing my mind, I'm being honest here :wink:, I saw the trouble that got the last guy into. :greengrin

Now that was quite funny.


Petal.:greengrin

Part/Time Supporter
29-11-2010, 06:49 PM
If Regan lied to the Euro refs to get them across to Scotland should he resign?

Of course not, he's Celtic's new big buddy that's different.

Hibs Class
29-11-2010, 06:53 PM
According to the BBC, following the departure of Dallas and McDonald Celtic feel vindicated.

Having previously described that club as paranoid, classless, bigoted **** I too feel vindicated. There's a lot of vindication about this evening.

Hibs Class
29-11-2010, 06:55 PM
According to the BBC, following the departure of Dallas and McDonald Celtic feel vindicated.

Having previously described that club as paranoid, classless, bigoted **** I too feel vindicated. There's a lot of vindication about this evening.

& I don't understand why **** fails the swear test :confused:

Gettin' Auld
29-11-2010, 07:04 PM
& I don't understand why **** fails the swear test :confused:
There's a ****ing swear filter for all the foul mouthed ***** on here?

Well **** me!!

Sir David Gray
29-11-2010, 07:16 PM
Erm, hello? Haven't you read or listened to anything the referees have said?

And your final line is just, frankly, stupid. You think there are queues of impoversihed international referees just waiting to snaffle up crumbs from striking refs?

Yes, I have read what they have said. I have already said in other threads that I sympathise with the referees. No-one should be receiving death threats on the back of doing their job and the statements coming out of Parkhead are quite frankly ridiculous.

I'm not saying that the referees are wrong to have chosen to go on strike. All I said was that for me to go on strike, my situation at work would need to become intolerable because, at the back of my mind, I would be worried about my employer simply bringing in someone else to do my job.

I said all that, in response to the poster that I had quoted, who talked about the SPL bringing in other referees to replace those who are on strike.

As for your final part, again I wasn't just speaking about referees, I was speaking in more general terms. When you go on strike, you do run the risk of your employer replacing you with other workers and I wouldn't blame someone for accepting work by replacing people who are on strike, given the current economic situation in the country.

CropleyWasGod
29-11-2010, 07:19 PM
. When you go on strike, you do run the risk of your employer replacing you with other workers and I wouldn't blame someone for accepting work by replacing people who are on strike, given the current economic situation in the country.

Even with non-EU foreigners? :stirrer:

Kaiser1962
29-11-2010, 07:23 PM
Dougie McDonald cited Aiden McGeady saying he "wasn't impartial" in his statement yesterday.

This'll be the same Aiden McGeady who, having recieved a second yellow card for diving at ER claimed, in his defence, that he only went down cos he "anticipated" the incoming tackler.