Arrogance beyond belief

[Sir David Gray]

I came across THIS (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-11798863) article yesterday and it really made me angry.

This guy is my elected representative in Parliament and he clearly believes that the law doesn't apply to him.

Not only was he driving whilst most probably over the legal limit, but he also damaged a road sign through the careless nature of his driving and, more seriously, he forced another driver into taking evasive action to avoid hitting him. The possible consequences of that turn of events just don't bear thinking about.

However, for me, the worst aspect of this whole story is that he point blank refused to take a breath test when requested to do so by Police Officers. It is the sheer arrogance behind this that I just can't get my head around. He obviously is of the opinion that because he is "somebody", he can do whatever he likes and can act outwith the boundaries of the law.

It's not the first time that Eric Joyce has been convicted of a driving offence, as the article I have linked to explains at the end, and that makes it even worse.

Then we have the situation with his excessive expenses claims over the past couple of years to consider too. This is a man who claimed £180 for three oil paintings "because they look nice".

The really galling thing is that Eric Joyce would need to be thrown out of the Labour Party before he would lose his seat in Falkirk. Despite his previous misdemeanours, he has continually held his seat by a huge majority, since he first became an MP ten years ago, and this latest incident will do nothing to harm his chances of winning again at the next election, most probably by another landslide.

The guy would need to murder somebody before he'll be beaten at the polls, purely because of the party that he belongs to. He's not alone in that respect with regards to Labour candidates in Scotland. I've said it before in other threads, but there's possibly several constituencies in Scotland that Osama Bin Laden would win, if he stood as a Labour Party candidate.

The General Election in May was the first time that I have been able to vote at a General Election and I did not vote for Eric Joyce. I will continue to vote for anyone but him, until he is no longer my voice in the UK Parliament.

However, I fear I could be waiting a long time before that day arrives.

[Beefster]

Joyce is one of those people that it's difficult to believe that voters actually put in the House of Commons. He seems to have absolutely no shame every time he's caught doing something questionable/wrong.

I still can't believe that a constituency voted for Lembit Opik in four successive elections.

[Twa Cairpets]

There must be something in the water round here.

I've had the misfortune to have had to communicate with Michael Connarty MP for Linlithgow and Falkirk East. A more arrogant piece of self important puffery it would be hard to envisage.

Mary Mulligan the MSP is good, mind you.

[Hibbyradge]

It's quite clear you don't like Eric Joyce. I don't know or care about the man, but there is nothing even remotely arrogant about his actions.

He was probably drunk, and refused to take a breath test. Thousands of folk do that and suffer the consequences. I doubt it had anything to do with him thinking that "he was somebody." More likely he was trying not to reveal the true extent of his alcohol problem. Hardly arrogant behaviour.

He was done for speeding over 2 years ago. So what? Loads of people get caught speeding. He was fined and banned as per the law of the land.

What do you think should happen to folk who speed?

[Hibbyradge]

There must be something in the water round here.

I've had the misfortune to have had to communicate with Michael Connarty MP for Linlithgow and Falkirk East. A more arrogant piece of self important puffery it would be hard to envisage.

Mary Mulligan the MSP is good, mind you.

That'll be Mary Mulligan, the non-water drinker. :wink:

[goosano]

......More likely he was trying not to reveal the true extent of his alcohol problem......

Do you not think that that is a pretty major issue for an MP?

[ancienthibby]

I came across THIS (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-11798863) article yesterday and it really made me angry.

This guy is my elected representative in Parliament and he clearly believes that the law doesn't apply to him.

Not only was he driving whilst most probably over the legal limit, but he also damaged a road sign through the careless nature of his driving and, more seriously, he forced another driver into taking evasive action to avoid hitting him. The possible consequences of that turn of events just don't bear thinking about.

However, for me, the worst aspect of this whole story is that he point blank refused to take a breath test when requested to do so by Police Officers. It is the sheer arrogance behind this that I just can't get my head around. He obviously is of the opinion that because he is "somebody", he can do whatever he likes and can act outwith the boundaries of the law.

It's not the first time that Eric Joyce has been convicted of a driving offence, as the article I have linked to explains at the end, and that makes it even worse.

Then we have the situation with his excessive expenses claims over the past couple of years to consider too. This is a man who claimed £180 for three oil paintings "because they look nice".

The really galling thing is that Eric Joyce would need to be thrown out of the Labour Party before he would lose his seat in Falkirk. Despite his previous misdemeanours, he has continually held his seat by a huge majority, since he first became an MP ten years ago, and this latest incident will do nothing to harm his chances of winning again at the next election, most probably by another landslide.

The guy would need to murder somebody before he'll be beaten at the polls, purely because of the party that he belongs to. He's not alone in that respect with regards to Labour candidates in Scotland. I've said it before in other threads, but there's possibly several constituencies in Scotland that Osama Bin Laden would win, if he stood as a Labour Party candidate.

The General Election in May was the first time that I have been able to vote at a General Election and I did not vote for Eric Joyce. I will continue to vote for anyone but him, until he is no longer my voice in the UK Parliament.

However, I fear I could be waiting a long time before that day arrives.

You're spot on with this one FH!

Joyce is, IIRC, the most expensive MP in Scotland, if not the whole UK. That's to say it costs the taxpayer more to pay for Joyce, than it does for an MP from the Orkneys or the Western Isles.

Joyce has 'previous' with respect to his expenses and folks may be interested in his interview with G Brewer on that very subject:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rFsAdp2v4Y

Talk about shifty, evasive, arrogant, yes, very arrogant.

There was another good example of this earlier this year when Joyce opened an office in Denny ('Carbuncle Town') in the upstairs rooms of the local TSB branch and he put up massive, garish-red three-sided signs on the second floor. They lit up Denny like the gas flares light up Grangemouth!

And quess what - they were down within three weeks - I guess he had not bothered to get planning permission!! Arrogant beyond belief applies! And of course the taxpayer pays!

But take heart, FH, at the election he got a real fright from John McNally who stood for the SNP and made signifigant inroards into his majority. A similar swing in the next election and he'll be out!!

[hibsbollah]

The voters of Falkirk must have got the worst MP succession in British Political History; out goes the legendary Dennis Canavan, in comes Joyce.

[Hibbyradge]

Do you not think that that is a pretty major issue for an MP?

It's a huge issue for anyone. If he has a problem with alcohol, I hope he gets it sorted.

It's not arrogance though, and the OP labelled him as arrogant.

[Hibbyradge]

And quess what - they were down within three weeks - I guess he had not bothered to get planning permission!! Arrogant beyond belief applies!


What's arrogant about that?

You "guess" he hadn't bothered to get planning permission.

Maybe his staff put the signs up and he didn't like them so got them removed.

Maybe he didn't know he needed planning permission.

Maybe he was excited about his new office and forgot.

You don't like him though, and arrogance is such a useful slur.

[lyonhibs]

What's arrogant about that?

You "guess" he hadn't bothered to get planning permission.

Maybe his staff put the signs up and he didn't like them so got them removed.

Maybe he didn't know he needed planning permission.

Maybe he was excited about his new office and forgot.

You don't like him though, and arrogance is such a useful slur.

Stop it!!!!

This is literally the first time a man has ever got in trouble for drink driving and acting like a bit of a twat.

Tho he should do some proper jail time for being drunk at the wheel in the 1st place IMHO

Failing that, hang him high I say!!!!!

[Hibbyradge]

Stop it!!!!

This is literally the first time a man has ever got in trouble for drink driving and acting like a bit of a twat.

Tho he should do some proper jail time for being drunk at the wheel in the 1st place IMHO

Failing that, hang him high I say!!!!!

Ooh you are persuasive, you silver tongued devil!

[Lucius Apuleius]

Canavan was my MP in Stirling when I first got married. With the boundary changes and me moving he became my MP in Denny. A nicer man you could not meet (apart from myself that is). I used to go along to his pre election meetings and seed him questions:greengrin. Sore day he decided to pack it all in but understandable with the things he went through. The day he left Westminster was the day I stopped voting Labour. Eric Joyce I have absolutely no time for. As Ancient One says, McNally gave him a run and maybe, just maybe the tide is turning. The one that surprises me is Connarty. I haven't seen him for a few years, in fact I think it was before he became an MP and was still a councilor in Stirling. He was always pretty arrogant but actually came over pretty well. Maybe times change a man.

As for Joyce's office in Denny, I have to agree, the sooner it gets pulled down the bloody better. Only problem there is, they already kicked me out the Bonnybridge TSB branch when they closed it. If they close this one as well I will be mightily peeved!!!! They unfortunately also closed what used to be my favourite pub right beside it.:boo hoo:

[ancienthibby]

What's arrogant about that?

You "guess" he hadn't bothered to get planning permission.

Maybe his staff put the signs up and he didn't like them so got them removed.

Maybe he didn't know he needed planning permission.

Maybe he was excited about his new office and forgot.

You don't like him though, and arrogance is such a useful slur.

Maybe you should change your name to 'pedantradge':greengrin

[Beefster]

What's arrogant about that?

You "guess" he hadn't bothered to get planning permission.

Maybe his staff put the signs up and he didn't like them so got them removed.

Maybe he didn't know he needed planning permission.

Maybe he was excited about his new office and forgot.

You don't like him though, and arrogance is such a useful slur.

Call me cynical but I don't think you'd be as charitable if Joyce was a Tory.

[Hibbyradge]

Call me cynical but I don't think you'd be as charitable if Joyce was a Tory.

You're cynical.

[--------]

Oyez! Oyez!

MP driving while drunk and generally behaving like a twonk....




Hardly a Pulitzer story, guys. :rolleyes:

[Dashing Bob S]

Arrogance beyond belief my backside.

If you wanted to see arrogance beyond belief, you should have been with me and Tom R, in the Tynecastle hospitality suite at the Millenium Derby, loaded up on Bolivian marching powder, when Miller's third went in.

This MP is an amateur.

[Sir David Gray]

It's quite clear you don't like Eric Joyce. I don't know or care about the man, but there is nothing even remotely arrogant about his actions.

He was probably drunk, and refused to take a breath test. Thousands of folk do that and suffer the consequences. I doubt it had anything to do with him thinking that "he was somebody." More likely he was trying not to reveal the true extent of his alcohol problem. Hardly arrogant behaviour.

He was done for speeding over 2 years ago. So what? Loads of people get caught speeding. He was fined and banned as per the law of the land.

What do you think should happen to folk who speed?

The fact that he chose to consume alcohol in the first place, when he knew that he had to drive a car a few hours later was, in my opinion, an example of arrogance. Knowing what Joyce has been like during his time as an MP (I claimed for three oil paintings because "they look nice") I am of the belief that he thought "I'm an MP, I'm going to my own constituency and no-one will touch me".

You imply that he possibly has a fairly serious problem with alcohol. If that is the case, I think that is a major issue for an MP to have and his constituents deserve to know "the true extent of his alcohol problem". If he has a problem with alcohol, he needs to leave public office ASAP and be allowed to face these problems, in private, with his family.

In terms of what I think should happen to people who speed, I think they should be fined and banned, which is what the law currently allows.

The only reason I mentioned the speeding conviction was, not to make out that Eric Joyce was some kind of monster because of this, but to emphasise my opinion that he is unsuitable to work as an MP. I know lots of people speed, it doesn't make it right, and I certainly don't believe someone who serves the public like an MP does, can afford to have convictions of any sort.

[Part/Time Supporter]

Hard to believe that he would ever be done for drink driving after watching this coherent interview about an expenses scandal...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rFsAdp2v4Y

[Twa Cairpets]

Hard to believe that he would ever be done for drink driving after watching this coherent interview about an expenses scandal...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rFsAdp2v4Y

:Ummm:

WTF.

Managed display every unpleasant stereotype of MP's in 7 minutes.

My favourite, paraphrased slightly (but only slightly)

Int. "£180 quid for oil paintings? Really?"
EJ "They were nice"
Int "But you think it ok for taxpayers to pay it"
EJ "I just walked through the BBC lobby - how much did you pay?"
Int "Not the point, is it right for taxpayers to pay for your paintings?"
EJ "Im entirely comfortable. My constituents like them"

[ancienthibby]

:Ummm:

WTF.

Managed display every unpleasant stereotype of MP's in 7 minutes.

My favourite, paraphrased slightly (but only slightly)

Int. "£180 quid for oil paintings? Really?"
EJ "They were nice"
Int "But you think it ok for taxpayers to pay it"
EJ "I just walked through the BBC lobby - how much did you pay?"
Int "Not the point, is it right for taxpayers to pay for your paintings?"
EJ "Im entirely comfortable. My constituents like them"

Were you really not aware of this before?? (and I don't mean my earlier post!)

This MP has got FORM!!

I really hope the Falkirk West electorate have got a lesson here and that there will be a change in the MSP ASAP!

[lucky]

The arrgance shown by some on here by slurring the people who voted for Joyce and Connarty is staggering. But unfortunately that's typical of the Tories and their tartan cousins. Having been in the company of both men over the years I can say I have never found them arrogant. Over 30000 Scots voted for them to return them to the UK parliament.

[IWasThere2016]

:Ummm:

WTF.

Managed display every unpleasant stereotype of MP's in 7 minutes.

My favourite, paraphrased slightly (but only slightly)

Int. "£180 quid for oil paintings? Really?"
EJ "They were nice"
Int "But you think it ok for taxpayers to pay it"
EJ "I just walked through the BBC lobby - how much did you pay?"
Int "Not the point, is it right for taxpayers to pay for your paintings?"
EJ "Im entirely comfortable. My constituents like them"

What a tosser!

[Hibbyradge]

The fact that he chose to consume alcohol in the first place, when he knew that he had to drive a car a few hours later was, in my opinion, an example of arrogance.

Does it follow then, that everyone who consumes alcohol when they know they have to drive a few hours later, or earlier, is arrogant? Or is it just MPs?

What about someone with extremely low self esteem? I'm sure there have been folk like that who have driven with a drink in them.

My view is that they are probably lazy or too poor/mean to get a taxi and that they're flouting the law, hoping not to get caught.

You're just pandering to my pedantry! :greengrin

[Twa Cairpets]

The arrgance shown by some on here by slurring the people who voted for Joyce and Connarty is staggering. But unfortunately that's typical of the Tories and their tartan cousins. Having been in the company of both men over the years I can say I have never found them arrogant. Over 30000 Scots voted for them to return them to the UK parliament.

Wow.

Your experience of Connarty is very positive. Mine is very negative. I have never slagged off people who voted for Connarty - I was in fact quite impressed by his record and stance on things prior to the election. It was only when I had reason to contact him that I was genuinely staggered by his response and attitude.

I'm not into bashing all representatives - as I said Mary Mulligan (Lab) was excellent a few years ago when some help was needed, and our local councillor here (an SNP guy) is also very active and diligent in helping the community.

People can vote for who they like without any disdain from me (well, apart from the BNP maybe), but Connarty wont be getting my vote even though I've voted Labour most of my life.

[Beefster]

The arrgance shown by some on here by slurring the people who voted for Joyce and Connarty is staggering. But unfortunately that's typical of the Tories and their tartan cousins. Having been in the company of both men over the years I can say I have never found them arrogant. Over 30000 Scots voted for them to return them to the UK parliament.

The Tories get blamed for some ludicrous things but this is, by far, the best yet.

[Part/Time Supporter]

The Tories get blamed for some ludicrous things but this is, by far, the best yet.

Maggie Thatcher drove Eric Joyce to drink.

FACT

:greengrin

[lucky]

The Tories get blamed for some ludicrous things but this is, by far, the best yet.

Not blaming Tories over anything in my post just stating the fact that Joyce and Connarty are being attacked because they are Labour MP's by Tory and SNP supporters.. In my experience in dealing with both of them neither are arrogant. yet some on here are making judgements on their characters without even knowing them.

[Beefster]

Not blaming Tories over anything in my post just stating the fact that Joyce and Connarty are being attacked because they are Labour MP's by Tory and SNP supporters.. In my experience in dealing with both of them neither are arrogant. yet some on here are making judgements on their characters without even knowing them.

Is everyone who criticised Phil Woolas or Denis McShane a Tory too? That'll be news to those running the Labour Party.

Folk are making judgements on Joyce based on his public conduct, expense claims and public utterances. Considering that he's an MP, I think that's fair enough. Either that, or you can't criticise any other party's MPs seeing that you won't even know them.

[lucky]

Is everyone who criticised Phil Woolas or Denis McShane a Tory too? That'll be news to those running the Labour Party.

Folk are making judgements on Joyce based on his public conduct, expense claims and public utterances. Considering that he's an MP, I think that's fair enough. Either that, or you can't criticise any other party's MPs seeing that you won't even know them.

Wrong again. The comments on here by OP was based on an article alleging he had perpetuated a crime. I don't think exercising his right to refuse a breathalyser test is arrogance. Unfortunaetly he like many he may fallen foul of the laws.

[Twa Cairpets]

Not blaming Tories over anything in my post just stating the fact that Joyce and Connarty are being attacked because they are Labour MP's by Tory and SNP supporters.. In my experience in dealing with both of them neither are arrogant. yet some on here are making judgements on their characters without even knowing them.

This is a collection of selective interpretation and making things up.

I'm the only one who's had a pop at Connarty. it's not because he is a Labour MP, nor because I am an SNP or Tory supporter - I would rather remove my baws with a rusty chisel than vote Conservative.

I am making my entirely subjective opinion on the basis of my interaction with him as a constituent. He may well do some good things in his parliamentary activity as his website would suggest but I personally don't what to be represented by an indvidual whose attitude is one I found to be less than I would have expected.

Having a certain level of arrogance is pretty much a prerequisite for seeking election I would have thought, and being arrogant does not necessarily mean that they are not good politicians or seek to do good things. If people want to vote for him on the basis of their experience or what he does in Westminster or for his party, thats fine by me. But I certainly be putting my X next to his name.

[Beefster]

Wrong again. The comments on here by OP was based on an article alleging he had perpetuated a crime. I don't think exercising his right to refuse a breathalyser test is arrogance. Unfortunaetly he like many he may fallen foul of the laws.

You need to read the OP again. It clearly mentioned 'previous misdemeanours'.

Keep crying 'Tory, Tory, Tory' to mask a Labour politician's failings though. It saves having to bother with real arguments.