Petrie. Get this mess sorted out or resign

[HIBERNIAN-0762]

No other words are needed, if he can't see how bad our playing staff is from his comfy seat in the stand then it's time he stepped down or attract new investors, we are a relegation cert if this garbage is allowed to play in the proud jersey's of Hibernian FC any longer

[SRHibs]

What the **** do you want him to do?
It's up to Colin Calderwood so sort the squad out, and he's stated in the media that his budget is 'perfect'.

The current squad is Yogi's, not Petrie's...

[Idlewild]

Throwing money at a problem won't solve it. I think we just need to get through this season (!) get rid of most of the squad in the close season and start again....

[down the slope]

He has sold anything that could move !, he also takes 100k a year for this service and has replaced the decent players with dross-fact.

[sesoim]

Petrie can't do much just now, but he has to take LARGE part of the blame for this mess- after all his managerial appointments have been progressively worst since Mowbray.

[Idlewild]

Petrie can't do much just now, but he has to take LARGE part of the blame for this mess- after all his managerial appointments have been progressively worst since Mowbray.

Appointments that we, as fans, wanted at the time.

[7Hero]

What the **** do you want him to do?

we have proven we sell everything and invest nothing in the team, it is scandalous...

i would like him to prioritise the team on the park, no excuses now rod, you have the stadium and the training facilities..

[matty_f]

we have proven we sell everything and invest nothing in the team, it is scandalous...

i would like him to prioritise the team on the park, no excuses now rod, you have the stadium and the training facilities..

He'd be looking a lot better if we hadn't *****ed a load of money on players like AOB, Brian Kerr, Joe Keenan, Maka, HKT, and so on and so on.

[BoltonHibee]

His priorities of late have been all wrong!!

More investment was needed on the management side of things and certainly the playing side.

[mcfly]

well the simple solution is for the fans to get motivated and confront the board.

either the money is invested in the team or you dont get our season ticket money.

there is no point in moaning about the family silver being sold if you dont do anything about it.

successful teams get bigger crowds.....however if we dont get serious investment in january then we'll have the biggest empty stadium in the 1st division.

this team has no fight,no guts, very little skill and they dont deserve the support they get. the board takes the fans for granted, we dont care re balance sheets but we do care re the quality of players that pull on the green jersey

[DarlingtonHibee]

No other words are needed, if he can't see how bad our playing staff is from his comfy seat in the stand then it's time he stepped down or attract new investors, we are a relegation cert if this garbage is allowed to play in the proud jersey's of Hibernian FC any longer

FFS :bitchy:

[7Hero]

He'd be looking a lot better if we hadn't *****ed a load of money on players like AOB, Brian Kerr, Joe Keenan, Maka, HKT, and so on and so on.

even hearts ***** money on a better class of player..

[PeeJay]

What the **** do you want him to do?
It's up to Colin Calderwood so sort the squad out, and he's stated in the media that his budget is 'perfect'.

The current squad is Yogi's, not Petrie's...

I think we should put this 'It's Yogi's squad' **** to bed: Yogi's gone, Calderwood is here and if he is the guy for the job then we as fans must expect him to - at the very least - have these guys doing the basics correctly. We saw none of that today - no organisation in the team: what do they do on the training ground?
I lost count of the times 2 Hibs players jumped for the same ball or - as with both goals - where no-one wanted to take responsibility: so what do they do at the training ground?
How many free kicks were pumped into a box full of taller guys today (by Rankin and Riordan) - to whom? Again what do they do at training? Did we win any headers in the air today?
I didn't get our tactics going forward - was there a tactic - hit it to Riordan: is that a tactic? Is that why we sacked Yogi?
If it takes having these 'players' in at East Mains every day of the week for hours on end just practising the basics then so be it, then we shoud go ahead and do it: but I do wonder what they actually do at training because there was no evidence today that it is of any use to us as a club at all.

[HIBERNIAN-0762]

FFS :bitchy:


Eh?

So you are quite happy for him to sell anything up the M8 and not re invest in paying any player coming in a decent wage? his biscuit tin mentality is wearing thin don't you think...

FFS :bitchy:

[Matty_Jack04]

I think we should put this 'It's Yogi's squad' **** to bed: Yogi's gone, Calderwood is here and if he is the guy for the job then we as fans must expect him to - at the very least - have these guys doing the basics correctly. We saw none of that today - no organisation in the team: what do they do on the training ground?
I lost count of the times 2 Hibs players jumped for the same ball or - as with both goals - where no-one wanted to take responsibility: so what do they do at the training ground?
How many free kicks were pumped into a box full of taller guys today (by Rankin and Riordan) - to whom? Again what do they do at training? Did we win any headers in the air today?
I didn't get our tactics going forward - was there a tactic - hit it to Riordan: is that a tactic? Is that why we sacked Yogi?
If it takes having these 'players' in at East Mains every day of the week for hours on end just practising the basics then so be it, then we shoud go ahead and do it: but I do wonder what they actually do at training because there was no evidence today that it is of any use to us as a club at all.

and its calderwoods fault that these players cant do the basics?? there professional football players FFS the basics should have been learnt years ago! the team we have assembled over the last few year is a disgrace but thats what you get when u appoint managers who arent good enough, who start building teams and then leave or are sacked (JC Mixu yogi)
CC isnt a ****in magician! he cant take these guys into training and make them into world beaters there not good enough by a long shot and calderwoods job is to attempt to get some points on the board and keep us safe untill he can clear out and build in the summer.
its yogi's team he has to work with they failed him and theyre failing CC, we have to give calderwood the time to get his guys in before any judgement on him is made, hiring and firing is why we are in this mess in the first place, stability is what we need and im in no doubt given time calderwood will have us going again

[hibees53]

Eh?

So you are quite happy for him to sell anything up the M8 and not re invest in paying any player coming in a decent wage? his biscuit tin mentality is wearing thin don't you think...

FFS :bitchy:

10/10 He has done this time and time again,time for him to step down and let another chairman who has an interest in the playing side of the team take over.

[matty_f]

Eh?

So you are quite happy for him to sell anything up the M8 and not re invest in paying any player coming in a decent wage? his biscuit tin mentality is wearing thin don't you think...

FFS :bitchy:

That's not the problem though - we've been spending about as much as we can on wages, to the point where we'd be running a loss but for player sales.

The problem is (and it goes back to Collins, IMHO) that -

Collins was given a budget of XX amount. He decided he wanted to get a couple of expensive signings in, and threw a large chunk of the amount at AOB and Maka.
He also spent on SPL players like Brian Kerr, who wasn't the most expensive but didn't come cheap.

After that he didn't have much scope for signing great quality, and he needed more players, so he spent unwisely and filled the team with poor players.

When he wanted to bring in another player, there simply wasn't enough of the original 'XX' amount left, he realised the game was up, and walked.

Mixu came in, again had a decent amount to spend so chose to spend it on a couple of 'big' signings. JJ and Deek, and Nish all came in and that meant we had not very much left to bring in wonder players like Joe Keenan et al.

So then Yogi comes in, gets three keepers in (again, none of them will have come cheap), and gets the 'box office' signings of Miller and Stokes in there as well. He adds De Graaf, gets Gow for a bit, and Duffy, but still has remnants of the pish players from previous managers stifling his budget. With no real room for maneuvre, and needing a striker in, he gets Trakys. Great.

The one saving grace, is that the legacy of these numerous pish signings will almost totally be wiped out come the summer, when we can say goodbye to them at no cost to the club, leaving Calderwood with room in the budget to improve the squad.

Can't come quick enough, IMHO.

[RickyS]

and its calderwoods fault that these players cant do the basics?? there professional football players FFS the basics should have been learnt years ago! the team we have assembled over the last few year is a disgrace but thats what you get when u appoint managers who arent good enough, who start building teams and then leave or are sacked (JC Mixu yogi)
CC isnt a ****in magician! he cant take these guys into training and make them into world beaters there not good enough by a long shot and calderwoods job is to attempt to get some points on the board and keep us safe untill he can clear out and build in the summer.
its yogi's team he has to work with they failed him and theyre failing CC, we have to give calderwood the time to get his guys in before any judgement on him is made, hiring and firing is why we are in this mess in the first place, stability is what we need and im in no doubt given time calderwood will have us going again

:top marks

[PeeJay]

and its calderwoods fault that these players cant do the basics?? there professional football players FFS the basics should have been learnt years ago! the team we have assembled over the last few year is a disgrace but thats what you get when u appoint managers who arent good enough, who start building teams and then leave or are sacked (JC Mixu yogi)
CC isnt a ****in magician! he cant take these guys into training and make them into world beaters there not good enough by a long shot and calderwoods job is to attempt to get some points on the board and keep us safe untill he can clear out and build in the summer.
its yogi's team he has to work with they failed him and theyre failing CC, we have to give calderwood the time to get his guys in before any judgement on him is made, hiring and firing is why we are in this mess in the first place, stability is what we need and im in no doubt given time calderwood will have us going again

I'n not looking for a magician, just a guy who can set the team up, organise it and make sure - at the training ground - that everyone knows what they are doing come match day - that wasn't the case today: it's not Yogi's fault anymore! How long does getting the simple things right take? I see no reason to give CC time when he can't even get the team up for a derby game.

[DarlingtonHibee]

Eh?

So you are quite happy for him to sell anything up the M8 and not re invest in paying any player coming in a decent wage? his biscuit tin mentality is wearing thin don't you think...

FFS :bitchy:

1. Be good enough to share with us who you would like to see buy Hibs, and on what basis ?

2. Stokes left for non football reasons - get over him. We bought Duffy - bad luck on injury

3. I agree CC has a huge test, but we have got to get behind him - this season is going to be hard - but he needs TIME !!

4. Hibs player budget is competitive.

[Nailrod]

Eh?

So you are quite happy for him to sell anything up the M8 and not re invest in paying any player coming in a decent wage? his biscuit tin mentality is wearing thin don't you think...

FFS :bitchy:
10/10

A couple of weeks back Falkirk Hibby took the trouble to trawl through our records and ascertain that 80-odd players have appeared for Hibs over the last five years. It was frightening to look through the list and see how many of them were nothing but pointless, worthless dross. 'Only' half of them, if you're being generous.

If Rod is too thick to get it into his thick head that four journeymen earning five hundred quid a week each is not the footballing equivalent of one decent player earning two grand a week then maybe a lot of people need to shout and swear at him till he gets it into his thick head.

Thanks for selling David Murphy and giving us David van Zanten in his place, for example, Rod. I guess in what passes for your football brain they're pretty much the same thing cos their name's were both David...

[TheEastTerrace]

10/10

A couple of weeks back Falkirk Hibby took the trouble to trawl through our records and ascertain that 80-odd players have appeared for Hibs over the last five years. It was frightening to look through the list and see how many of them were nothing but pointless, worthless dross. 'Only' half of them, if you're being generous.

If Rod is too thick to get it into his thick head that four journeymen earning five hundred quid a week each is not the footballing equivalent of one decent player earning two grand a week then maybe a lot of people need to shout and swear at him till he gets it into his thick head.

Thanks for selling David Murphy and giving us David van Zanten in his place, for example, Rod. I guess in what passes for your football brain they're pretty much the same thing cos their name's were both David...

If you'll excuse the pun, you've hit the nail on the head right there. :agree:

[DarlingtonHibee]

10/10

A couple of weeks back Falkirk Hibby took the trouble to trawl through our records and ascertain that 80-odd players have appeared for Hibs over the last five years. It was frightening to look through the list and see how many of them were nothing but pointless, worthless dross. 'Only' half of them, if you're being generous.

If Rod is too thick to get it into his thick head that four journeymen earning five hundred quid a week each is not the footballing equivalent of one decent player earning two grand a week then maybe a lot of people need to shout and swear at him till he gets it into his thick head.

Thanks for selling David Murphy and giving us David van Zanten in his place, for example, Rod. I guess in what passes for your football brain they're pretty much the same thing cos their name's were both David...

How is when we lose, Rod is to bame.

Do you honestly think he scout's the player's. what the ****** are the mangers and scout's doing then ?

Yes, they have a budget, but football is a business, unless you want to end up like Heart's will.

Id rather my son was watching Hibs in 50 year's.

[sesoim]

Appointments that we, as fans, wanted at the time.


I didn't want Collins, Hughes, or (that) Calderwood.

[Jim44]

1. Be good enough to share with us who you would like to see buy Hibs, and on what basis ?

2. Stokes left for non football reasons - get over him. We bought Duffy - bad luck on injury

3. I agree CC has a huge test, but we have got to get behind him - this season is going to be hard - but he needs TIME !!

4. Hibs player budget is competitive.

:confused: Please enlarge.

[Nailrod]

1. Be good enough to share with us who you would like to see buy Hibs, and on what basis ?
Somebody - anybody! - who will actually MAKE A DIFFERENCE!


4. Hibs player budget is competitive.
Yes. And for some bizarre reason we would rather ***** it down the drain on six no-hopers than spend it on a couple of players who might actually MAKE A DIFFERENCE - and for whom we would actually get some money back if and when they did move on. Go and have a look at Falkirk Hibby's list, one by one, and ask yourself the questions:
Did this player make any significant contribution at all during his time with Hibs?
Did we get anything for him when he moved on?
What, exactly, was the point in him being at Easter Road for six months / a year / eighteen months, apart for acting as a drain on our wage budget?

[Dirkster23]

I'n not looking for a magician, just a guy who can set the team up, organise it and make sure - at the training ground - that everyone knows what they are doing come match day - that wasn't the case today: it's not Yogi's fault anymore! How long does getting the simple things right take? I see no reason to give CC time when he can't even get the team up for a derby game.

FFS, how about giving the boy a bit longer than 3 weeks to get things sorted out:bitchy: He's taken a job where he has no knowledge of the players at the club or the league itself.

He can organize a team, change formations but he can't give them fight or heart and that's what we lack at the moment!

[sesoim]

How is when we lose, Rod is to bame.

Do you honestly think he scout's the player's. what the ****** are the mangers and scout's doing then ?

Yes, they have a budget, but football is a business, unless you want to end up like Heart's will.

Id rather my son was watching Hibs in 50 year's.


Because he keeps on making bad appointments. He should step aside if Calderwood flops like he did at Notts Forest.

[Aubenas]

There really is some nonsense being talked on here. The Chairman's job is to make sure Hibs survive financially. The Manager's job is to identify the right players within the budget and make them play well. ( cf Butcher at ICT or even Mixu currently at Killie). I believe Mixu and Yogi both reckoned they got a fair budget to play with and certainly in the last few windows Hibs have spent more than anyone else except OF (and on a couple of occasions more than the Hun).
Whatever a club does, the chemistry between players and managers is an unknown, it may work, it may not. All the Board can do is guard against failure by keeping the finances right - whatever happens - anything else is just plain irresponsible.

Most of us thought that Mixu and JH were fair enough choices as managers - difference is, when they are failing we can call for their head but RP and co have to deal with the consequences.

The facts are that Hibs have spent well in recent years, but, for whatever reasons, not wisely - Managers' fault.

If we were in our current position and heavily in debt, we would be looking at a Dundee situation - especially if we were relegated - and Petrie did the deals - he didn't spot the players.

As for building the infrastructure - look across the city. If Hibs had a half finished stadium and needed a training ground, what investment would we attract after STF? We'd have to accept any offer that came along, rather than what was best for the club. Hibs don't have a huge fan base, they need to attract investment by being a well run club.

I know a lot on here wish it wasn't like that, but that's the facts of life. Results are temporary, financial solidity is permanent. Ask Cannigia, Craig Burley, Gordon Chisholm and Billy Dodds and co!

[Sumner]

Hibs need to SPEND on players

Not Stands, training facilities, car parks, offices,
furniture, carpets, toilet rolls, paper clips, shoe polish
or any other SHTE that the board puts ahead of players. :grr:

Hibs need to SPEND on players

[sesoim]

Somebody - anybody! - who will actually MAKE A DIFFERENCE!


Yes. And for some bizarre reason we would rather ***** it down the drain on six no-hopers than spend it on a couple of players who might actually MAKE A DIFFERENCE - and for whom we would actually get some money back if and when they did move on. Go and have a look at Falkirk Hibby's list, one by one, and ask yourself the questions:
Did this player make any significant contribution at all during his time with Hibs?
Did we get anything for him when he moved on?
What, exactly, was the point in him being at Easter Road for six months / a year / eighteen months, apart for acting as a drain on our wage budget?


We paid Sauzee and Latapy less wages than the summer signings cost combined. I know who I'd rather have. We would have to bring more youngsters into the team quickly if we did that, but at least they'd learn something from playing alongside quality players rather than that bunch we have just now.

[Nailrod]

How is when we lose, Rod is to bame.


Because it's THE STRATEGY that is wrong. And the only worthwhile contribution the Board of Directors of Hibernian Football Club that costs us half a million quid a year has to offer to the club is the STRATEGY. That's their job. That's why they're called 'Directors'.

What the hell is the poInt of recruiting six players that MAKE NO DIFFERENCE, when for THE SAME AMOUNT OF MONEY you could recruit two players who might MAKE A DIFFERENCE.

We're bottom of the effing league FFS. How much worse off could we have been if we had invested the wage money we invested this summer in a couple of players who might actually have MADE A DIFFERENCE?

[PeeJay]

FFS, how about giving the boy a bit longer than 3 weeks to get things sorted out:bitchy: He's taken a job where he has no knowledge of the players at the club or the league itself.

He can organize a team, change formations but he can't give them fight or heart and that's what we lack at the moment!

Great decision by the club wasn't it - somebody who knows nothing about the team or the league he's playing in - sorry, I see no reason to cut the guy any slack - that was an atrocious performance by the team today and he's the man in charge. Defensive mistakes as bad as anything we've seen all season and last season - If he's not to blame who is? We're bottom of the league - and he hasn't made the slightest bit of difference! And as to organising the team - perhaps you weren't watching - no-one knows what they are supposed to do - it's so obvious, particularly to the opposing team! Hearts strolled it today - and they are not very good. :grr:

[cabbageandribs1875]

we have proven we sell everything and invest nothing in the team, it is scandalous...

i would like him to prioritise the team on the park, no excuses now rod, you have the stadium and the training facilities..


i agree no excuses now, but at least give him the time now that everything else is in place, there's only one area at the club most of the income can go on now, players :agree:

[Aubenas]

Defensive mistakes as bad as anything we've seen all season and last season - If he's not to blame who is?

Who's to blame?
Well how about the 3 players who gave Templeton an escort from the half way line to the penalty box for the first goal. Do you really think that's what CC told them to do????
You can do all the training and tactics you want but if you are landed with a team of lily livered shirkers in the shirts it will have no effect!

[HIBERNIAN-0762]

Hibs need to SPEND on players

Not Stands, training facilities, car parks, offices,
furniture, carpets, toilet rolls, paper clips, shoe polish
or any other SHTE that the board puts ahead of players. :grr:

Hibs need to SPEND on players


:top marks and so say all of us

[cabbageandribs1875]

As for building the infrastructure - look across the city. If Hibs had a half finished stadium and needed a training ground, what investment would we attract after STF? We'd have to accept any offer that came along, rather than what was best for the club. Hibs don't have a huge fan base, they need to attract investment by being a well run club.

I know a lot on here wish it wasn't like that, but that's the facts of life. Results are temporary, financial solidity is permanent. Ask Cannigia, Craig Burley, Gordon Chisholm and Billy Dodds and co!

good post, but the results need to be good(ish) to enable the financial solididity :greengrin it's trying to get the balance right

[Davy Mac]

Who's to blame?
Well how about the 3 players who gave Templeton an escort from the half way line to the penalty box for the first goal. Do you really think that's what CC told them to do????
You can do all the training and tactics you want but if you are landed with a team of lily livered shirkers in the shirts it will have no effect!

Lily livered is exaxctly the type of player Hibs have bought in abundance for years now.

What really gets me is we've been crying out for an old experienced head in the middle of the park for years now and he would have taken the wee bawbag out well before he got his shot in.

Naw, Hibs are not that kind of fitba team we apparently play the Hibs way, lovely flowing attacking fitba - what a pile of nonsense, never played fancy fitba in my lifetime apart from maybe Latapy.

It's time for us to wake up and learn how to win but learning not to lose a game would be start.

[PeeJay]

Who's to blame?
Well how about the 3 players who gave Templeton an escort from the half way line to the penalty box for the first goal. Do you really think that's what CC told them to do????
You can do all the training and tactics you want but if you are landed with a team of lily livered shirkers in the shirts it will have no effect!


NO - but the team shirks from responsibility at too many situations as far as I can see - several times 2 Hibs players went up for the same ball - or failed to challenge (goal 1 and 2) - that has to be sorted out at the training ground, that's the manager and his training team's job - what do they actually do at East Mains? Tempelton waltzed past 6 players, not 3. They should be working on the defence non-stop: that's where we have problems, so why did today's performance prove that nothing has changed since Yogi left?Players make mistakes - but the team has to be better organised and aware of its task - that's wasn't the case today. I expect the new man to make improvements and I expect the basics to be sorted out quickly - they can get down to the difficult stuff later on - and if CC cannot get the basics right like organisation , tactics (what was our tactic today?) and so on then the players will not perform: it's his job. We don't have time to give him time: he has to get it right now.

[Nailrod]

Who's to blame?
Well how about the 3 players who gave Templeton an escort from the half way line to the penalty box for the first goal. Do you really think that's what CC told them to do????
You can do all the training and tactics you want but if you are landed with a team of lily livered shirkers in the shirts it will have no effect!
Templeton is a perfect example of players who will make a difference. Anybody who ever saw him play could see he was going to be a good player. I saw him playing in a pre-season trial match for Stenhousemuir against Falkirk. He was the outstanding player on the park by a mile.

Hearts signed him as a teenager about three years ago when they didn't even have enough money to pay the landladies who looked after their youth squad. But they probably offered him four or five hundred quid when that's what our first-team players were getting. Like Deano. That's what Deano was getting when he was playing at his best for Hibs.

[Cropley10]

Appointments that we, as fans, wanted at the time.

Revisionist nonsense.

[Ferryhibby]

Not CC's problem at the moment he's came into a team that are just crap and no amount of motigvation seems to be working seemes like a good idea to get rid of yogi now eh?, what needs to happen is that come christmas CC gets in the players he needs to keep us in the league and the ones he doesnt want get them out the door b4 their contracts expire,theyl only have 6 more months wages to pay anyway, then get rid of the whole ***in lot of them come end of season and start again, this has to be the most gutless spineless bunch ive seen playin for hibs but dont see how its RP's problem hes given every manager all the leeway and funds they need, players are to blame simple as that.

[Kaiser1962]

No other words are needed, if he can't see how bad our playing staff is from his comfy seat in the stand then it's time he stepped down or attract new investors, we are a relegation cert if this garbage is allowed to play in the proud jersey's of Hibernian FC any longer

Why dont you "invest" by buying Petrie out.

[cabbageandribs1875]

Not CC's problem at the moment he's came into a team that are just crap and no amount of motigvation seems to be working seemes like a good idea to get rid of yogi now eh?, what needs to happen is that come christmas CC gets in the players he needs to keep us in the league and the ones he doesnt want get them out the door b4 their contracts expire,theyl only have 6 more months wages to pay anyway, then get rid of the whole ***in lot of them come end of season and start again, this has to be the most gutless spineless bunch ive seen playin for hibs but dont see how its RP's problem hes given every manager all the leeway and funds they need, players are to blame simple as that.

these wages could possibly ONLY amount to 36k(1.5k/week) for those 6 months, then X's that for each other player we wanted to do that with, btw i agree with the rest of your post :agree:

[HIBERNIAN-0762]

Why dont you "invest" by buying Petrie out.


Oh aye nae problem, already got my euro millions ticket for Friday

:wink:

[Nailrod]

Why dont you "invest" by buying Petrie out.
Er... because without ever risking a penny of his own money, and while being paid hundreds of thousands of pounds for the privilege, he's managed to acquire a ten per cent stake in several million pounds worth of real estate?

[IWasThere2016]

That's not the problem though - we've been spending about as much as we can on wages, to the point where we'd be runnng a loss but for player sales.

The problem is (and it goes back to Collins, IMHO) that -

Collins was given a budget of XX amount. He decided he wanted to get a couple of expensive signings in, and threw a large chunk of the amount at AOB and Maka.
He also spent on SPL players like Brian Kerr, who wasn't the most expensive but didn't come cheap.

After that he didn't have much scope for signing great quality, and he needed more players, so he spent unwisely and filled the team with poor players.

When he wanted to bring in another player, there simply wasn't enough of the original 'XX' amount left, he realised the game was up, and walked.

Mixu came in, again had a decent amount to spend so chose to spend it on a couple of 'big' signings. JJ and Deek, and Nish all came in and that meant we had not very much left to bring in wonder players like Joe Keenan et al.

So then Yogi comes in, gets three keepers in (again, none of them will have come cheap), and gets the 'box office' signings of Miller and Stokes in there as well. He adds De Graaf, gets Gow for a bit, and Duffy, but still has remnants of the pish players from previous managers stifling his budget. With no real room for maneuvre, and needing a striker in, he gets Trakys. Great.

The one saving grace, is that the legacy of these numerous pish signings will almost totally be wiped out come the summer, when we can say goodbye to them at no cost to the club, leaving Calderwood with room in the budget to improve the squad.

Can't come quick enough, IMHO.

You do recognise that RP is the common factor through all of this however?


Because it's THE STRATEGY that is wrong. And the only worthwhile contribution the Board of Directors of Hibernian Football Club that costs us half a million quid a year has to offer to the club is the STRATEGY. That's their job. That's why they're called 'Directors'.

:agree: Nae cash to sort it .. operating at a loss - which is c. 20% of turnover .. and having taken on more debt .. not clever IMHO

[DarlingtonHibee]

Oh aye nae problem, already got my euro millions ticket for Friday

:wink:

The point is no-one is queing up to buy Hibs.....

[ballengeich]

You do recognise that RP is the common factor through all of this however?



:agree: Nae cash to sort it .. operating at a loss - which is c. 20% of turnover .. and having taken on more debt .. not clever IMHO

I think you're right. On players, the criticism of RP is in the selection of managers, not the budget provided.

On the budget, I hope we aren't relying on producing young players who can be sold on. There hasn't previously been a group like those who came through a few years ago in decades and we can't rely on repeating that.

[aberhibsfc]

good post, but the results need to be good(ish) to enable the financial solididity :greengrin it's trying to get the balance right

It will be a less expensive spending now than in the 1st Division. If we don't turn the corner soon we are going to be scrapping to get away from the drop.

This talk of losing 16 players is all well and good, but remember that there are players within that group which shouldn't be allowed to expire their contracts. Riordan should be signed up asap.

We better see some constructive transfer movement in the Jan window. I'm sick of Hibs policy of we don't need to sell but they still bash on and do it. There is no more infrastructure investment required. The team on the park have suffered for years to let this happen, no more.

The Hibs board need to be working towards improvement on the pitch, this should be everyone's aim at the club, everything else comes a distant 2nd.

[Dirkster23]

Great decision by the club wasn't it - somebody who knows nothing about the team or the league he's playing in - sorry, I see no reason to cut the guy any slack - that was an atrocious performance by the team today and he's the man in charge. Defensive mistakes as bad as anything we've seen all season and last season - If he's not to blame who is? We're bottom of the league - and he hasn't made the slightest bit of difference! And as to organising the team - perhaps you weren't watching - no-one knows what they are supposed to do - it's so obvious, particularly to the opposing team! Hearts strolled it today - and they are not very good. :grr:

The players that made the individual errors?!? Your having a laugh if you think CC's to blame for a terrible performance after being in charge for less that 3 weeks. Did you honestly think anyone was going to come in and turn things around ib such a short space of time?

Who do you think we should have got as manager if they had to have knowledge of the players and league before being appointed?

[PeeJay]

The players that made the individual errors?!? Your having a laugh if you think CC's to blame for a terrible performance after being in charge for less that 3 weeks. Did you honestly think anyone was going to come in and turn things around ib such a short space of time?

Who do you think we should have got as manager if they had to have knowledge of the players and league before being appointed?

With respect - I expect a manager to sort these things out and it shouldn't take a whole season or whatever some Hibs fans are already prepared to give him to sort it out: we don't have the time. He is now in charge and when it goes wrong, he has to carry the can. I don't expect us to progress in a short space of time to league contenders, but I don't see any progress - are you seriously suggesting that there's is nothing he can do with these players? I personally would have kept Yogi - I don't think the change has done the team any good at all, but the fact we changed I accept: what I don't accept is no progress. I expect to see some improvement at least. Perhaps, when CC has changed all the players he wants to and brought in his own ones things will get better - like after Mowbury, Collins, Mixu, and Yogi and so on...ad infinitum
I think we're best advised to be hounding CC from the start when things go wrong, instead of waiting 12 months to do it. Petrie should have him in the office on Monday demanding answers !

(I may be overreacting because my brother's a fan of the HoM)

[HFC 0-7]

Throwing money at a problem won't solve it. I think we just need to get through this season (!) get rid of most of the squad in the close season and start again....

I beg to differ, do you think better players will appear out of thin air? The writing has been on the wall for sometime regarding the quality throughout the squad. Petrie needs to get the cheque book out and start signing / loan players to stop us going down. Accounts are going to be crap either next year or the year after. If we dont spend a decent amount of money in january or now to get loan signings then the next set of accounts will be taking into account first division revenues.

The goings on a ER over the past couple of seasons should have taught petrie and some fans a lesson. The playing staff should come first, this is what drives everything else. Petrie has sold our best players after being quoted as saying we dont need to sell. He chose to build the big flashy stand which now appears has been financed by own funds and a mortgage which will mean our future budgets will be reduced. Some fans wanted to give Yogi more time, but now we are seeing that even although we brought in a manager now he will still struggle until he can buy.

Petrie has got to hold his hands up here and admit he has made mistakes. We are either in the mess we are in now because of a duff management appointment which we held onto for to long, or, there hasnt been enough investment into the team.

After todays performance I fear for us this season unless the cheque book is dusted off in January.

[Dirkster23]

With respect - I expect a manager to sort these things out and it shouldn't take a whole season or whatever some Hibs fans are already prepared to give him to sort it out: we don't have the time. He is now in charge and when it goes wrong, he has to carry the can. I don't expect us to progress in a short space of time to league contenders, but I don't see any progress - are you seriously suggesting that there's is nothing he can do with these players? I personally would have kept Yogi - I don't think the change has done the team any good at all, but the fact we changed I accept: what I don't accept is no progress. I expect to see some improvement at least. Perhaps, when CC has changed all the players he wants to and brought in his own ones things will get better - like after Mowbury, Collins, Mixu, and Yogi and so on...ad infinitum
I think we're best advised to be hounding CC from the start when things go wrong, instead of waiting 12 months to do it. Petrie should have him in the office on Monday demanding answers !

(I may be overreacting because my brother's a fan of the HoM)

I'm not suggesting it should take a season for the problems to be sorted out. I think we do have to realistic though and give CC more 3 weeks working with new players before we get on his back.

He's working with players that he doesn't know and lets face it,must be pretty low in morale after the run they've been on. He's also inherited a team with dearth of strikers, no width, pace or more importantly leaders.

CC has to get something more out of the players, but with no width or pace in the team it really restricts what he can do in terms of formations. I'd expect from what he said after todays game that the emphisis will be on making us hard to beat. It won't be pretty but i'd settle for it this year if it means we stay up.

I can't agree about keeping Yogi on though, he's the one that's left us with such a poor sqaud.

[matty_f]

I'm not suggesting it should take a season for the problems to be sorted out. I think we do have to realistic though and give CC more 3 weeks working with new players before we get on his back.

He's working with players that he doesn't know and lets face it,must be pretty low in morale after the run they've been on. He's also inherited a team with dearth of strikers, no width, pace or more importantly leaders.

CC has to get something more out of the players, but with no width or pace in the team it really restricts what he can do in terms of formations. I'd expect from what he said after todays game that the emphisis will be on making us hard to beat. It won't be pretty but i'd settle for it this year if it means we stay up.

I can't agree about keeping Yogi on though, he's the one that's left us with such a poor sqaud.

Agree with that, except Yogi isn't the only manager culpable for the state of the squad, it stretches back past his time here.

[Kaiser1962]

Agree with that, except Yogi isn't the only manager culpable for the state of the squad, it stretches back past his time here.

I noticed Collins in the paper today on about spending money on the team. Then I recalled Alan O'Brien and thought ...nah.

[FitbaFolkKen]

Because it's THE STRATEGY that is wrong. And the only worthwhile contribution the Board of Directors of Hibernian Football Club that costs us half a million quid a year has to offer to the club is the STRATEGY. That's their job. That's why they're called 'Directors'.

What the hell is the poInt of recruiting six players that MAKE NO DIFFERENCE, when for THE SAME AMOUNT OF MONEY you could recruit two players who might MAKE A DIFFERENCE.

We're bottom of the effing league FFS. How much worse off could we have been if we had invested the wage money we invested this summer in a couple of players who might actually have MADE A DIFFERENCE?

Are you on the wrong forum? surely the manager gets a budget and decides how to spend it?

If the managers have managed to recruit over 80 players in five years and we are still poor then that tells you exactly why none of them are managing the club.

Calderwood states his budget is perfect, he'll no a hell of a lot better then me and the majority of fans whether that is the case.

[Kaiser1962]

Are you on the wrong forum? surely the manager gets a budget and decides how to spend it?

If the managers have managed to recruit over 80 players in five years and we are still poor then that tells you exactly why none of them are managing the club.

Calderwood states his budget is perfect, he'll no a hell of a lot better then me and the majority of fans whether that is the case.

I think FalkirkHibby researched this further and we were very similar to most clubs.

[Dirkster23]

Agree with that, except Yogi isn't the only manager culpable for the state of the squad, it stretches back past his time here.

Yeah, i agree it goes back further than just Yogi. I just cant understand why he didn't add any pace and width to the team during the summer when he knew the squad lacked it and the pitch was being widened.

[Kaiser1962]

Yeah, i agree it goes back further than just Yogi. I just cant understand why he didn't add any pace and width to the team during the summer when he knew the squad lacked it and the pitch was being widened.

Yip. That was certainly strange.

[Matty_Jack04]

I'n not looking for a magician, just a guy who can set the team up, organise it and make sure - at the training ground - that everyone knows what they are doing come match day - that wasn't the case today: it's not Yogi's fault anymore! How long does getting the simple things right take? I see no reason to give CC time when he can't even get the team up for a derby game.

its been 30+ games since anyones got that lot up for anything mate!! how many managers will we go through untill u click on that its the attitude the players have thats the problem, THERE NOT GOOD ENOUGH there not smart enough and they are definatley not together as a team and theres not a person on this planet who can change that without clearing them out.:grr:

[new malkyhib]

i agree no excuses now, but at least give him the time now that everything else is in place, there's only one area at the club most of the income can go on now, players :agree:

You wanna bet? there's no club in Britain, as far as i can see, that proclaim as loudly as this Board do about their blessed "infastructure":grr:

Yet ask them to speak about the team and their silence is deafening - add to that a slavishly loyal local "paper"? who will not dare to criticise (aye, i'm talking about you, Hardie) and a blind man can see the balance is all wrong.

We've sold good players, replaced them with dross, on the back of a wage cap that defies all logic by refusing to go above a certain level - so we end up with 3 no-marks as opposed to first-team picks and we're wrong to question that?

What price relegation - and any chance of Petrie publicly addressing that?

Nah, thought not...

[matty_f]

i agree no excuses now, but at least give him the time now that everything else is in place, there's only one area at the club most of the income can go on now, players :agree:[/QUOTE]

You wanna bet? there's no club in Britain, as far as i can see, that proclaim as loudly as this Board do about their blessed "infastructure":grr:

Yet ask them to speak about the team and their silence is deafening - add to that a slavishly loyal local "paper"? who will not dare to criticise (aye, i'm talking about you, Hardie) and a blind man can see the balance is all wrong.

We've sold good players, replaced them with dross, on the back of a wage cap that defies all logic by refusing to go above a certain level - so we end up with 3 no-marks as opposed to first-team picks and we're wrong to question that?

What price relegation - and any chance of Petrie publicly addressing that?

Nah, thought not...


We turned a loss last year without player sales. There is the logic in the wage cap (which isn't a cap, as such, there's a wage budget for the squad- players can earn higher at the expense of others within that budget.).

Our wages/turnover was something like 68% last year, the recommended level is circa 60%.

Far easier to ignore this and go mad about illogical wage caps though.:rolleyes:

[down the slope]

i agree no excuses now, but at least give him the time now that everything else is in place, there's only one area at the club most of the income can go on now, players :agree:

You wanna bet? there's no club in Britain, as far as i can see, that proclaim as loudly as this Board do about their blessed "infastructure":grr:

Yet ask them to speak about the team and their silence is deafening - add to that a slavishly loyal local "paper"? who will not dare to criticise (aye, i'm talking about you, Hardie) and a blind man can see the balance is all wrong.

We've sold good players, replaced them with dross, on the back of a wage cap that defies all logic by refusing to go above a certain level - so we end up with 3 no-marks as opposed to first-team picks and we're wrong to question that?

What price relegation - and any chance of Petrie publicly addressing that?

Nah, thought not...

Well said, the wage cap that you mentioned is probably the root cause of the lack of class in our squad at the moment but if you were to get any sort of response from the tash it would be the usual we "pay at least as high as most teams outwith the O F which means the square root of didlley squat.
Rod could be a politician as he can wriggle out of most questions with the usual stock answers but now the merd has hit the fan he will have to do much better as he is now very much in the spotlight , by the way was someone not giving him it tight during todays game ?.

[new malkyhib]

We turned a loss last year without player sales. There is the logic in the wage cap (which isn't a cap, as such, there's a wage budget for the squad- players can earn higher at the expense of others within that budget.).

Our wages/turnover was something like 68% last year, the recommended level is circa 60%.

Far easier to ignore this and go mad about illogical wage caps though.:rolleyes:

I would fiercely dispute that, Mattie - and i've never heard any Board member deny it either - and i've asked a few of them publicly about it, believe me...

as another poster said, how many Joe Keenans' and Trakys' and van Zantens' and do we sign in comparison to a Latapy or a Sauzee (both of whom signed in the First Division, by the way)? Oh aye and the turnover includes all staff's wages, included the inflated amount we pay for our faceless Board...

[Removed]

I would fiercely dispute that, Mattie - and i've never heard any Board member deny it either - and i've asked a few of them publicly about it, believe me...

as another poster said, how many Joe Keenans' and Trakys' and van Zantens' and do we sign in comparison to a Latapy or a Sauzee (both of whom signed in the First Division, by the way)? Oh aye and the turnover includes all staff's wages, included the inflated amount we pay for our faceless Board...

How are our board faceless? We know who they are.

Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk

[FitbaFolkKen]

I would fiercely dispute that, Mattie - and i've never heard any Board member deny it either - and i've asked a few of them publicly about it, believe me...

as another poster said, how many Joe Keenans' and Trakys' and van Zantens' and do we sign in comparison to a Latapy or a Sauzee (both of whom signed in the First Division, by the way)? Oh aye and the turnover includes all staff's wages, included the inflated amount we pay for our faceless Board...

Stokes and Miller, surely were not on pennies and i would imagine one of the reasons or staff costs jumped

[new malkyhib]

How are our board faceless? We know who they are.

Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk

sorry, let me rephrase *faceless" how about ANONYMOUS?

[hibees53]

i agree no excuses now, but at least give him the time now that everything else is in place, there's only one area at the club most of the income can go on now, players :agree:

You wanna bet? there's no club in Britain, as far as i can see, that proclaim as loudly as this Board do about their blessed "infastructure":grr:

Yet ask them to speak about the team and their silence is deafening - add to that a slavishly loyal local "paper"? who will not dare to criticise (aye, i'm talking about you, Hardie) and a blind man can see the balance is all wrong.

We've sold good players, replaced them with dross, on the back of a wage cap that defies all logic by refusing to go above a certain level - so we end up with 3 no-marks as opposed to first-team picks and we're wrong to question that?

What price relegation - and any chance of Petrie publicly addressing that?

Nah, thought not...

Great Post,sums up how a lot of fans have been thinking for a while.

[Kaiser1962]

sorry, let me rephrase *faceless" how about ANONYMOUS?

same reply as 65bd I'm afraid :greengrin

Let's all take a deep breath guys. We've had worse days.

[Removed]

sorry, let me rephrase *faceless" how about ANONYMOUS?

That just means the same thing imo. I was in BTG today and could quite easily have had a conversation with one or more board members if I wanted to. How many SPL supporters get that opportunity every home game?

Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk

[Aubenas]

You wanna bet? there's no club in Britain, as far as i can see, that proclaim as loudly as this Board do about their blessed "infrastructure"

Yet ask them to speak about the team and their silence is deafening

The majority of clubs in Britain are silent about their infrastructure cos it's **** and they are hanging on by a thread. Petrie and Lyndsay talked at length about the team and signings at both AGMs this year, giving costs, percentages, turnover, income etc - all of which affect who we can sign, what we can pay etc (this is in the real world btw) If they talked about individual players and who we should sign they'd be accused of interfering with the manager's job.WE pay more and buy more players than all except OF and Hearts.

I don't understand blaming a successful business board for the team's failings. They make Hibs financially viable and that's what provides the funds for signings. Why is that so difficult to understand????

If we're getting it wrong it's down to managers' signings.

[Jonnyboy]

There really is some nonsense being talked on here. The Chairman's job is to make sure Hibs survive financially. The Manager's job is to identify the right players within the budget and make them play well. ( cf Butcher at ICT or even Mixu currently at Killie). I believe Mixu and Yogi both reckoned they got a fair budget to play with and certainly in the last few windows Hibs have spent more than anyone else except OF (and on a couple of occasions more than the Hun).
Whatever a club does, the chemistry between players and managers is an unknown, it may work, it may not. All the Board can do is guard against failure by keeping the finances right - whatever happens - anything else is just plain irresponsible.

Most of us thought that Mixu and JH were fair enough choices as managers - difference is, when they are failing we can call for their head but RP and co have to deal with the consequences.

The facts are that Hibs have spent well in recent years, but, for whatever reasons, not wisely - Managers' fault.

If we were in our current position and heavily in debt, we would be looking at a Dundee situation - especially if we were relegated - and Petrie did the deals - he didn't spot the players.

As for building the infrastructure - look across the city. If Hibs had a half finished stadium and needed a training ground, what investment would we attract after STF? We'd have to accept any offer that came along, rather than what was best for the club. Hibs don't have a huge fan base, they need to attract investment by being a well run club.

I know a lot on here wish it wasn't like that, but that's the facts of life. Results are temporary, financial solidity is permanent. Ask Cannigia, Craig Burley, Gordon Chisholm and Billy Dodds and co!

:top marks

[Kaiser1962]

Agree with all of this but I would add that we need, above all else, continuity. We all know whats coming, either in January or in the Summer, but whenever it happens its happening. Such a major change in personnel will NOT go smoothly so lets expect that and not hang anybody till it all shakes down.


The majority of clubs in Britain are silent about their infrastructure cos it's **** and they are hanging on by a thread. Petrie and Lyndsay talked at length about the team and signings at both AGMs this year, giving costs, percentages, turnover, income etc - all of which affect who we can sign, what we can pay etc (this is in the real world btw) If they talked about individual players and who we should sign they'd be accused of interfering with the manager's job.WE pay more and buy more players than all except OF and Hearts.

I don't understand blaming a successful business board for the team's failings. They make Hibs financially viable and that's what provides the funds for signings. Why is that so difficult to understand????

If we're getting it wrong it's down to managers' signings.

[matty_f]

I would fiercely dispute that, Mattie - and i've never heard any Board member deny it either - and i've asked a few of them publicly about it, believe me...

as another poster said, how many Joe Keenans' and Trakys' and van Zantens' and do we sign in comparison to a Latapy or a Sauzee (both of whom signed in the First Division, by the way)? Oh aye and the turnover includes all staff's wages, included the inflated amount we pay for our faceless Board...

Scott Lynsey has publicly stated that the manager has a budget and that no wage cap exists. It's on record and in black and white.

Sure someone will have stashed a link to it somewhere.

He said that, despite being faceless and anonymous.:greengrin

[new malkyhib]

Scott Lynsey has publicly stated that the manager has a budget and that no wage cap exists. It's on record and in black and white.

Sure someone will have stashed a link to it somewhere.

He said that, despite being faceless and anonymous.:greengrin

Well i don't believe him, Matty. And i pride myself on having a decent sense of humour, - just don't much feel like laughing tonight - and i'll ask all you Board brown-nosers one thing - will you be sticking up for them if we get relegated?

Oops sorry, stupid question...

[marinello59]

Well i don't believe him, Matty. And i pride myself on having a decent sense of humour, - just don't much feel like laughing tonight - and i'll ask all you Board brown-nosers one thing - will you be sticking up for them if we get relegated?

Oops sorry, stupid question...

Is that necessary?

[discman]

The majority of clubs in Britain are silent about their infrastructure cos it's **** and they are hanging on by a thread. Petrie and Lyndsay talked at length about the team and signings at both AGMs this year, giving costs, percentages, turnover, income etc - all of which affect who we can sign, what we can pay etc (this is in the real world btw) If they talked about individual players and who we should sign they'd be accused of interfering with the manager's job.WE pay more and buy more players than all except OF and Hearts.

I don't understand blaming a successful business board for the team's failings. They make Hibs financially viable and that's what provides the funds for signings. Why is that so difficult to understand????

If we're getting it wrong it's down to managers' signings.



Its not difficult to understand its just wrong! RP does all the signings did you not know that?

The manager gives rp a list he makes the decision,that decision is based upon his worth to hibs as a financial asset which is secondary to the managers perspective which would be value to the team etc etc

This is rp's sole responsibility so the manager may not get his 1st 2nd or even 3rd choice,thats the reallity.

I would like the customers who sustain this product ie hibs fc to have more input,
nothing radical,just an oppertunity to be allowed some meaningful dialogue as to how our money is being spent, why shouldnt rod and the rest of the board be accountable? they pay themselves approx,1/2 million a year of which rp gets the lions share, which is fine,but surely there must be some accountability if it continually goes wrong?

TF talked about the importance of the customer in the success of all his business's and listening to what they wanted,so how come were any different? :cool2:

[new malkyhib]

The majority of clubs in Britain are silent about their infrastructure cos it's **** and they are hanging on by a thread. Petrie and Lyndsay talked at length about the team and signings at both AGMs this year, giving costs, percentages, turnover, income etc - all of which affect who we can sign, what we can pay etc (this is in the real world btw) If they talked about individual players and who we should sign they'd be accused of interfering with the manager's job.WE pay more and buy more players than all except OF and Hearts.

I don't understand blaming a successful business board for the team's failings. They make Hibs financially viable and that's what provides the funds for signings. Why is that so difficult to understand????

If we're getting it wrong it's down to managers' signings.

I would argue the fans do that through season ticket purchases - the sale of the car park and any decent players do that as well. As far as i'm aware Petrie and Lindsay have put none of their own money into the club, foreby Petrie's initial 10% stake, which he'll get back in spades if he ever packs it in.

That's im my real world at least, where going to see the Hibs now is beginning to spoil my weekend thanks to the dross that this Board brings in on the park...

[Kaiser1962]

Well i don't believe him, Matty. And i pride myself on having a decent sense of humour, - just don't much feel like laughing tonight - and i'll ask all you Board brown-nosers one thing - will you be sticking up for them if we get relegated?

Oops sorry, stupid question...

So if we change the board it'll be all right? Who picks the new board? We could have one of those surveys on here.

[matty_f]

Well i don't believe him, Matty. And i pride myself on having a decent sense of humour, - just don't much feel like laughing tonight - and i'll ask all you Board brown-nosers one thing - will you be sticking up for them if we get relegated?

Oops sorry, stupid question...

So the basis of your argument (aside from the needless insult, btw) is that you are saying that the Board have told an outright lie to the shareholders?

You base this on your belief that your assumption is more accurate than the information given by the very men that know the exact detail of how the money is spent at the club?

[new malkyhib]

[QUOTE=marinello59;2629359]Is that necessary?[/QU

Possibly not, Marinello - just fed up of seeing sub-standard players at ER. As tired with this "debate" as much as you's are.

Cheers.

[discman]

I would argue the fans do that through season ticket purchases - the sale of the car park and any decent players do that as well. As far as i'm aware Petrie and Lindsay have put none of their own money into the club, foreby Petrie's initial 10% stake, which he'll get back in spades if he ever packs it in.

That's im my real world at least, where going to see the Hibs now is beginning to spoil my weekend thanks to the dross that this Board brings in on the park...



rp and tf have already got their loan back with interest :cool2:

[HFC 0-7]

We turned a loss last year without player sales. There is the logic in the wage cap (which isn't a cap, as such, there's a wage budget for the squad- players can earn higher at the expense of others within that budget.).

Our wages/turnover was something like 68% last year, the recommended level is circa 60%.

Far easier to ignore this and go mad about illogical wage caps though.:rolleyes:

Something has to move though as the model clearly isnt working and hasnt been for some time. Sometimes you have to speculate to accumulate, Petrie feels it prudent to speculate when it comes to infrastructure putting the club in debt without any guarantees to increased income, or enough to justify the spending. On the flip side speculating in the transfer market etc has no guarantees either however petrie and the board have shown no intention of doing this.

IMO, the board took the risk in appointing the cheap options in managers in the past and this has come back to haunt them with a series of poor player purchases. Also, IMO, I havent seen any purse strings being loosened where others have. People talk about the signings of Miller, Stokes and Riordan as signs of this however, I dont think they would have cost a lot and if they did it would mean the manager had less of a budget.

Which ever way you look at this the players havent been good enough, its either players arent good enough or the manager isnt good enough to manage them. Either way its the boards responsibility.

I can see a shift in in the fans feelings on the board coming soon unless money is made available. Todays game had a very sour taste to it, the fans are becoming very very annoyed and like it or not, we always look for someone to blame. Calderwood wont get the wrath as he is just in the door. If he goes through the january window without much money spent, the fans will be asking questions.

[Kaiser1962]

I would argue the fans do that through season ticket purchases - the sale of the car park and any decent players do that as well. As far as i'm aware Petrie and Lindsay have put none of their own money into the club, foreby Petrie's initial 10% stake, which he'll get back in spades if he ever packs it in.

That's im my real world at least, where going to see the Hibs now is beginning to spoil my weekend thanks to the dross that this Board brings in on the park...

That dosent make any sense? He didnt risk any of his own money, apart from his 10% stake? So he did risk his own money then?

[matty_f]

Something has to move though as the model clearly isnt working and hasnt been for some time. Sometimes you have to speculate to accumulate, Petrie feels it prudent to speculate when it comes to infrastructure putting the club in debt without any guarantees to increased income, or enough to justify the spending. On the flip side speculating in the transfer market etc has no guarantees either however petrie and the board have shown no intention of doing this.

IMO, the board took the risk in appointing the cheap options in managers in the past and this has come back to haunt them with a series of poor player purchases. Also, IMO, I havent seen any purse strings being loosened where others have. People talk about the signings of Miller, Stokes and Riordan as signs of this however, I dont think they would have cost a lot and if they did it would mean the manager had less of a budget.

Which ever way you look at this the players havent been good enough, its either players arent good enough or the manager isnt good enough to manage them. Either way its the boards responsibility.

I can see a shift in in the fans feelings on the board coming soon unless money is made available. Todays game had a very sour taste to it, the fans are becoming very very annoyed and like it or not, we always look for someone to blame. Calderwood wont get the wrath as he is just in the door. If he goes through the january window without much money spent, the fans will be asking questions.

Compensation was paid for Hughes and Mixu, so neither were cheap options. We took a punt on Collins, at the time most people thought it was a punt worth taking given the experience he has had in the game.

We have invested in players, without joy. We know that the training centre was needed, and that the stadium completion was a one-off expense in terms of building it.

This is taken from the Scotsman after we parted ways with Mixu:



In common with most SPL clubs, Hibs are tightening the purse strings given the deepening credit crunch while it is understood the club's spending plans were smashed over the course of the past year to support Paatelainen's revamp of the Easter Road squad.


Revealing Hibs' financial results last September, Lindsay said that the arrivals of Derek Riordan and Sol Bamba, at a cost of some £500,000, had taken the club's spending on players in the previous two years to more than £2.5 million.



Isn't that exactly the speculating to accumulating approach that you're talking about?

We have pushed the boat out to support managers to the point where we would have run a loss without player sales - how far do you want to push it?

The club are on record to explain why the stand was built when it was. We had the chance to do it at a time where the price was viable. That time might not have come around again.

[new malkyhib]

That dosent make any sense? He didnt risk any of his own money, apart from his 10% stake? So he did risk his own money then?

see original post - "foreby" - Scots' word, meaning "notwithstanding" or "except" - happy now?

[matty_f]

see original post - "foreby" - Scots' word, meaning "notwithstanding" or "except" - happy now?

I think he means that it's churlish to ignore the risk that he took just to make the point that he never took a risk.

[new malkyhib]

I think he means that it's churlish to ignore the risk that he took just to make the point that he never took a risk.

Oh right, thanks.

[discman]

So the basis of your argument (aside from the needless insult, btw) is that you are saying that the Board have told an outright lie to the shareholders?

You base this on your belief that your assumption is more accurate than the information given by the very men that know the exact detail of how the money is spent at the club?


Matty the shareholders are tf and rp they own 100% of 98% of the shares tf has 90% and rp 10%


Heres a quote from the Scotsman 4/4/2008 "Petrie Delegates control of Hibs"



"The Finn will identify his targets,but Petrie,as the man in charge of the money will decide which ones are worth pursuing and how big a sum should be offered for them.Petrie will also remain in charge of contract negotiations"



Its not a lie just a tad disingenuous :cool2:

[marinello59]

Possibly not, Marinello - just fed up of seeing sub-standard players at ER. As tired with this "debate" as much as you's are.

Cheers.

Fair enough. We are all hurting after this afternoons display.

[new malkyhib]

Matty the shareholders are tf and rp they own 100% of 98% of the shares tf has 90% and rp 10%


Heres a quote from the Scotsman 4/4/2008 "Petrie Delegates control of Hibs"



"The Finn will identify his targets,but Petrie,as the man in charge of the money will decide which ones are worth pursuing and how big a sum should be offered for them.Petrie will also remain in charge of contract negotiations"



Its not a lie just a tad disingenuous :cool2:


Back to you, Mattie...

[Kaiser1962]

see original post - "foreby" - Scots' word, meaning "notwithstanding" or "except" - happy now?

So i got my car for free "foreby" the fee I paid the garage/

[Kaiser1962]

rp and tf have already got their loan back with interest :cool2:

Hibs finances have been done to death. Look up the posts of Caversham Green and all will become clear. :cool2:

[HFC 0-7]

Compensation was paid for Hughes and Mixu, so neither were cheap options. We took a punt on Collins, at the time most people thought it was a punt worth taking given the experience he has had in the game.

We have invested in players, without joy. We know that the training centre was needed, and that the stadium completion was a one-off expense in terms of building it.

This is taken from the Scotsman after we parted ways with Mixu:




Isn't that exactly the speculating to accumulating approach that you're talking about?

We have pushed the boat out to support managers to the point where we would have run a loss without player sales - how far do you want to push it?

The club are on record to explain why the stand was built when it was. We had the chance to do it at a time where the price was viable. That time might not have come around again.

The stadium completion is not a one off expense if we are having to pay loans on it. The club are on record saying why they thought it was the correct idea to build the stand in their opinion, whether it was the correct one or not will remain to be seen as IMO, if we get relegated or fail to lock out 3rd and 4th spot in the near future it will have been a mistake.

Lets not forget the position we are in here. We are rank rotten, joint bottom and in danger of being relegated. Money needs to be spent, we are not talking about one or two players here either. Yes many players are out of contract at the end of the season but that could be too late.

Any player purchases like the Bamba and Riordan ones are offset by player sales, this needs to stop or it will just remain a one in one out situation which usually results in a good one out and an average one in. Thats not speculating IMO, thats just spending a little less than you just made selling someone else. How much money will we lose if we dont make the top 6 this season? Would that be about the same amount of money as it takes to service the debt on an overdraft?

[discman]

Hibs finances have been done to death. Look up the posts of Caversham Green and all will become clear. :cool2:


and your point is what? They have received their money back and it was with interest! Suggest you check out SPL fianances maybe a bit more specfic maybes not. :cool2:

[matty_f]

Matty the shareholders are tf and rp they own 100% of 98% of the shares tf has 90% and rp 10%


Heres a quote from the Scotsman 4/4/2008 "Petrie Delegates control of Hibs"



"The Finn will identify his targets,but Petrie,as the man in charge of the money will decide which ones are worth pursuing and how big a sum should be offered for them.Petrie will also remain in charge of contract negotiations"



Its not a lie just a tad disingenuous :cool2:

That quote has been superseded and the position clarified by scott lindsay. I will try to find the article, or it's maybe on a hibs tv interview, regardless I'll try and hunt it down.

Was that quote from someone at hibs, or the reporter's take on things?

[matty_f]

The stadium completion is not a one off expense if we are having to pay loans on it. The club are on record saying why they thought it was the correct idea to build the stand in their opinion, whether it was the correct one or not will remain to be seen as IMO, if we get relegated or fail to lock out 3rd and 4th spot in the near future it will have been a mistake.

Lets not forget the position we are in here. We are rank rotten, joint bottom and in danger of being relegated. Money needs to be spent, we are not talking about one or two players here either. Yes many players are out of contract at the end of the season but that could be too late.

Any player purchases like the Bamba and Riordan ones are offset by player sales, this needs to stop or it will just remain a one in one out situation which usually results in a good one out and an average one in. Thats not speculating IMO, thats just spending a little less than you just made selling someone else. How much money will we lose if we dont make the top 6 this season? Would that be about the same amount of money as it takes to service the debt on an overdraft?

We are already losing money though, if it wasn't for the player sales we'd have had a loss last year.
sure we could take an overdraft but we could easily spend that and be in no different a position to that which we are in now, except we would have another ongoing financial burden sapping money from the team.
We all want hibs to spend money on players, I do-i want the best players at hibs, but it doesn't take carol vorderman to deduce that we are already stretched in what we are currently spending.

[Nailrod]

I would argue the fans do that through season ticket purchases - the sale of the car park and any decent players do that as well. As far as i'm aware Petrie and Lindsay have put none of their own money into the club, foreby Petrie's initial 10% stake, which he'll get back in spades if he ever packs it in.
My understanding is that Petrie didn't put up any money at all for his 10%. Farmer put up all the money and assigned 10% of the shares in the new holding company to Petrie.

I would appreciate clarification on this. 'Not risking a penny of his own money' is a charge I've leveled at Petrie in the past, and if I'm wrong I'll stop doing it, and apologise for having done it in the past.

[Saorsa]

Appointments that we, as fans, wanted at the time.speak for yersel, ta. Cheap options IMO

[matty_f]

That quote has been superseded and the position clarified by scott lindsay. I will try to find the article, or it's maybe on a hibs tv interview, regardless I'll try and hunt it down.

Was that quote from someone at hibs, or the reporter's take on things?

Found this from a Herald article:


“What we’ve got right at this moment in time is a little bit of a cash cushion that’s been generated by the way the club’s been run. And we shouldn’t underestimate the benefit of that. Five years of consecutive profit has generated ‘positive’ cash and it’s been spent in a number of ways.

“Some of it has gone towards recruiting players – including paying transfer fees – some of it was spent reducing our debt and a big chunk of it was spent on building and paying for the training centre. After all the expenditure mentioned, we still had that small cash cushion and it’s probably allowed us to tweak how things have been running rather than take a machete to what we’re doing.

“We’re just gently amending how we’re going. The manager is the key to making the decisions as to whom he wants to bring to the club and he’s also vital in trying to convince those players 
that this is a good place to be. There are resources available to the manager; we’ve not changed anything about the way we operate. We’ve not changed direction in terms of the budgets 
we work with – it’s up to John how he spends that budget.”

http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/spl/hibernian/do-not-underestimate-the-determination-of-hibernian-s-quiet-man-scott-lindsay-1.995785

Wasn't the quote I was looking for, but re-affirms my point.

[matty_f]

Found it!!

http://sport.scotsman.com/spl/No-wage-cap-at-Hibernian.5654444.jp


HIBERNIAN chief executive Scott Lindsay has revealed that there is no maximum wage in existence for players at Easter Road, as the club sets its sights on ensuring the team challenges for European football and trophies every season.
Speaking to The Scotsman after Hibs' annual financial results showed a bottom-line profit for the fifth successive year, Lindsay insisted the club did not want to simply settle for a top-six finish each year and would be setting their sights a lot hiADVERTISEMENT
gher.

Net profit for the year fell to £700,000 from £1.2m in 2007-2008, and was boosted by a portion of the £3.5 million transfer of Steven Fletcher to Burnley, while the net debt stood at £3.6m as of 31 July. While welcoming the figures, Hibs insist they will continue to practice financial prudence, but Lindsay stressed there is recognition at board level of the need to first and foremost do well on the pitch.

The recent arrival of striker Anthony Stokes, a £2 million player when he joined his previous club Sunderland, and Republic of Ireland midfielder Liam Miller, are central to that objective. But Hibs supporters, used to more conservative approach, have been curious how the club have been able to finance such high-profile acquisitions.

The club also have been able to bring back Derek Riordan and Ian Murray, and stave off interest in Ivory Coast international Sol Bamba, prompting speculation that the wage structure has been relaxed at Easter Road.

However, Lindsay insisted there is no wage ceiling in place, and providing manager John Hughes can accommodate players within the budget he is given, salaries paid to top earners in his squad can and will vary.

"We do not have a wage cap," explained the Easter Road chief executive. "There is a budget that the manager must operate within, and it is up to him to spend the budget the best way he can. I will let other people decide on whether the calibre of player has improved, but what I can say is that staff costs have increased on the playing side now for five consecutive years, while there has been a reduction in non-football staff costs.

"We can only sign the players that the manager identifies – that is the case with John Hughes, and it has also been the case with previous managers.

"The accounts show we have spent close to £1 million on acquiring talent in the past year, in transfer fees alone. It is now close to three years in succession we have done that.

"There has been a gradual investment in the squad, and we are in a strong position now with regard to expenditure on transfer fees and wages. We are committed to always trying to improve the squad."

A statement released by Hibs to accompany their financial results made no attempt to hide the disappointment of last season's campaign under Mixu Paatelainen, where Hibs limped in at sixth in the Clydesdale Bank Premier League and exited both cup competitions at the first hurdle. Chairman Rod Petrie said: "We have maintained our rock solid financial performance against a background of sporting performances which have fallen below the standards the club has set for itself in recent years."

Defining those standards and outlining his vision for the club, Lindsay told The Scotsman: "Merely being in the top-six is not our target. Our objective is to be competing at the top end of the league and to be challenging for a place in European competition. We also want the team to be competing in the latter stages of cups. We are not in a position to budget for winning cups, but we have seen all the benefits an extended cup run can bring."




So, I've got a clear, straight from the horse's mouth, no room for interpretation denial of there being a wage cap from Scott Lindsay here.

Back over to you.

[Kaiser1962]

and your point is what? They have received their money back and it was with interest! Suggest you check out SPL fianances maybe a bit more specfic maybes not. :cool2:

The £5m of preference shares that were held in Morston and transferred to Infocus Investments for £1? Whose £5m do you think that is? This £5m, unlike Vlad's across the road, most certainly does not accrue interest.


You going to mention the £25m that the yams keep getting semi's over?
Please don't.

[Iain G]

It has been said before that fans get the team they deserve, reading some of the stuff on here, I'd say Hibs are exactly the team at the moment that our current most vociferous support deserves...

Glad I am very far away from Easter Road these days :agree:

[HFC 0-7]

We are already losing money though, if it wasn't for the player sales we'd have had a loss last year.
sure we could take an overdraft but we could easily spend that and be in no different a position to that which we are in now, except we would have another ongoing financial burden sapping money from the team.
We all want hibs to spend money on players, I do-i want the best players at hibs, but it doesn't take carol vorderman to deduce that we are already stretched in what we are currently spending.

I agree that spending beyond means is not ideal but we are in a position that requires it. Dont spend money and you could face losing loads because we could be in the bottom 6, or, worse case scenario be relegated. If we get relegated those players out of contract probably wont stick around then the management and board have the difficult situation of trying to bring players to a 1st division club. Yes we did it before but only through spending money.

Next year we could have around 16 players leaving us. 16 players could be difficult to replace without spending money. Would there be 16 better players available on frees for all the positions we will require?

[Kaiser1962]

I agree that spending beyond means is not ideal but we are in a position that requires it. Dont spend money and you could face losing loads because we could be in the bottom 6, or, worse case scenario be relegated. If we get relegated those players out of contract probably wont stick around then the management and board have the difficult situation of trying to bring players to a 1st division club. Yes we did it before but only through spending money.

Next year we could have around 16 players leaving us. 16 players could be difficult to replace without spending money. Would there be 16 better players available on frees for all the positions we will require?

On yesterday's showing could there be any worse?:greengrin

[matty_f]

I agree that spending beyond means is not ideal but we are in a position that requires it. Dont spend money and you could face losing loads because we could be in the bottom 6, or, worse case scenario be relegated. If we get relegated those players out of contract probably wont stick around then the management and board have the difficult situation of trying to bring players to a 1st division club. Yes we did it before but only through spending money.

Next year we could have around 16 players leaving us. 16 players could be difficult to replace without spending money. Would there be 16 better players available on frees for all the positions we will require?

I said on another thread that the board need to consider spending wages that we are paying to these players twice in the short term to bring in the players needed to get us out of this position.

I also think that finding 16 players better than those leaving should be one of the easiest tasks in football.

[Kaiser1962]

I said on another thread that the board need to consider spending wages that we are paying to these players twice in the short term to bring in the players needed to get us out of this position.

I also think that finding 16 players better than those leaving should be one of the easiest tasks in football.

At a combined cost of, including signing on fees, about fifty quid. :greengrin

[Phil D. Rolls]

A lot of barrack room company directors on here. If you don't like the way things are, don't go. Stop kidding yourselves on you have the slightest idea how to run a football club.

[Kaiser1962]

A lot of barrack room company directors on here. If you don't like the way things are, don't go. Stop kidding yourselves on you have the slightest idea how to run a football club.

:top marks

[HFC 0-7]

Found it!!

http://sport.scotsman.com/spl/No-wage-cap-at-Hibernian.5654444.jp




So, I've got a clear, straight from the horse's mouth, no room for interpretation denial of there being a wage cap from Scott Lindsay here.

Back over to you.

Matt, do you really think that Petrie doesnt have a hand in saying if someone signs or not? Lets remember, Petrie (or the board) did say that hibs no longer had to sell players because of our super duper financial position which turns out to be rubbish as we are still selling.

Whichever way you cut it, the board are getting key decisions wrong, whether its the money made available to the playing staff, the managerial appointments, what to spend the money on or when to get rid of the dud managers that they employed. 2 previous managers that have been shown the door both had things to say regarding Petrie.

The board are the only common denominators here. Who would you blame for the positions we have been finding ourselves in more often than not? In the last 11 years our average league positions has been 6th, IMO, that isnt good enough. Any season that we have finished 3rd or 4th (apart from last season which seems like it was a bit of a fluke now) its either been because we spent money or were blessed with great youth players, which we then sold and all of them!

This tells a story, the way the board are running this means we are not spending enough money or we are relying on excellent youth products. We cannot rely on youth as there isnt a constant conveyerbelt, this season proves that.

It would be interesting to see how much money was spent before and during a successful season and how much money was made through selling players the season after a successful one. The way its going is that we will never be a consistent team, we will have one good season followed by 2 or 3 bad ones which I think is what is getting to the fans now.

[number 27]

A lot of barrack room company directors on here. If you don't like the way things are, don't go. Stop kidding yourselves on you have the slightest idea how to run a football club.


Most of us aren't pro footballers either, maybe we should all stop going. :rolleyes:

[hibhib7]

I was slagged on here recently for criticising Petrie. Nothing anyone has said gives me any reason to change my mind. If you want to spend your weekend afternoons at a well-run, profit making organisation with a great infrastructure then go and spend 20-odd quid at Asda or Tesco. It would obviously be foolish to neglect the great strides our club has made in the last few years regarding the ground and training centre but, I repeat, it has come at a cost. The cost is having the most mediocre squad of players it has been my misfortune to watch in a long time.
Anthony Stokes would have been the difference between where we are now and half-way up the table, but we chose to sell him to one of our rivals for a pittance. And don't tell me he had to go - he didn't. We had him on a contract and we should have held him to it, at least to the end of this season. I'm embarrassed for the club I love. We consistently poke fun at the Hearts with their financial problems but who, invariably, gets the last laugh where it matters - on the pitch. We are now a joke of a team and anyone who is slagging Calderwood already, with the bunch of misfits he has at his disposal, really needs to wake up and smell the coffee.

[Cropley10]

A lot of barrack room company directors on here. If you don't like the way things are, don't go. Stop kidding yourselves on you have the slightest idea how to run a football club.

What utter, patronising nonsense.

Why don't YOU give up posting instead.

[sven nil]

[QUOTE=Filled Rolls;2629859]A lot of barrack room company directors on here. If you don't like the way things are, don't go. Stop kidding yourselves on you have the slightest idea how to run a football club.

Dont go? wtf.... why not just buy a mini convertable and rod can drive it from city chambers along princes st down to leith wk to the ground waving the accounts so your ilk can get some thrills?

[discman]

A lot of barrack room company directors on here. If you don't like the way things are, don't go. Stop kidding yourselves on you have the slightest idea how to run a football club.




Or you a football team :greengrin

[truehibernian]

I don't know, maybe I am just too simplistic in my old age. Scott says in the media that we consistently spend £1 million in transfer fees alone.

In that case, we look at the other teams around us, even those players in contract, and make bids. The state of other teams finances are such that they are in no position to turn down decent bids.

Murray Davidson. Good engine, young, scoring midfielder. I would say maybe £250,000

Leigh Griffiths. Needs to step up a division, learnt his trade in the lower league. Something to prove given he left under a wee cloud. Young, pace and energy to burn, scores goals......£300,000

Michael Duberry. Tough, no nonsense, does the basics and does them well. £75,000

Sone Aluko. Pace, trickery, decent outball on the wide area. £150,000

Willie Gibson. See above. Also scores goals.....£100,000

Charlie Mulgrew. Good left peg, set piece good, defends decently. £250,000 or on loan

For me, that's slightly over the £1 million quoted, but there you have 6 players, who could replace maybe 8 or 9 we currently pay.

Again....perhaps too simplistic, but these are the areas we need to be looking at. Also throw in Eremenko or Bryson from Killie if we have any left over.

[Cropley10]

I don't know, maybe I am just too simplistic in my old age. Scott says in the media that we consistently spend £1 million in transfer fees alone.

In that case, we look at the other teams around us, even those players in contract, and make bids. The state of other teams finances are such that they are in no position to turn down decent bids.

Murray Davidson. Good engine, young, scoring midfielder. I would say maybe £250,000

Leigh Griffiths. Needs to step up a division, learnt his trade in the lower league. Something to prove given he left under a wee cloud. Young, pace and energy to burn, scores goals......£300,000

Michael Duberry. Tough, no nonsense, does the basics and does them well. £75,000

Sone Aluko. Pace, trickery, decent outball on the wide area. £150,000

Willie Gibson. See above. Also scores goals.....£100,000

Charlie Mulgrew. Good left peg, set piece good, defends decently. £250,000 or on loan

For me, that's slightly over the £1 million quoted, but there you have 6 players, who could replace maybe 8 or 9 we currently pay.

Again....perhaps too simplistic, but these are the areas we need to be looking at. Also throw in Eremenko or Bryson from Killie if we have any left over.

But throwing money at the problem won't solve anything, will it? We spent good money on AOB...:wink::wink::wink:

[truehibernian]

I just think we should be adopting an Old Firm approach and cherry picking, where we can, the best of the rest.

Out of interest Cropley, would there be any on that list you would wish to see us bid for. I think they are all reasonable targets and not unrealistic.

[Cropley10]

I just think we should be adopting an Old Firm approach and cherry picking, where we can, the best of the rest.

Out of interest Cropley, would there be any on that list you would wish to see us bid for. I think they are all reasonable targets and not unrealistic.

I'll tell you what - they'd all be a known quantity and better than what we have, so yes absolutely.

This is precisely the strategy we should be adopting, based on the success or otherwise of the current one. owever I understand we neither pay transfer fees nor deal with agents. So this might be a moot point.

[Part/Time Supporter]

I don't know, maybe I am just too simplistic in my old age. Scott says in the media that we consistently spend £1 million in transfer fees alone.

In that case, we look at the other teams around us, even those players in contract, and make bids. The state of other teams finances are such that they are in no position to turn down decent bids.

Murray Davidson. Good engine, young, scoring midfielder. I would say maybe £250,000

Leigh Griffiths. Needs to step up a division, learnt his trade in the lower league. Something to prove given he left under a wee cloud. Young, pace and energy to burn, scores goals......£300,000

Michael Duberry. Tough, no nonsense, does the basics and does them well. £75,000

Sone Aluko. Pace, trickery, decent outball on the wide area. £150,000

Willie Gibson. See above. Also scores goals.....£100,000

Charlie Mulgrew. Good left peg, set piece good, defends decently. £250,000 or on loan

For me, that's slightly over the £1 million quoted, but there you have 6 players, who could replace maybe 8 or 9 we currently pay.

Again....perhaps too simplistic, but these are the areas we need to be looking at. Also throw in Eremenko or Bryson from Killie if we have any left over.

Davidson alone would cost the best part of your £1M.

[HFC 0-7]

Davidson alone would cost the best part of your £1M.

If Stokes went for 1.2 million then Davidson must be worth about 250K, 500K tops.

[truehibernian]

I rate him, but in the economics of Scottish football, and given Murray's CV, nowhere near a million IMHO. Geoff Brown is as hard nosed as Petrie, but I am sure McInnes would sacrifice Davidson for a quarter of a million if he could get in two players or more. They like any other club need to sell now and again to keep the club going strong. I think he signed a new contract recently which was a chance missed.

What about the other targets though. I think they are realistic valuations.

[Part/Time Supporter]

The only two that are semi-realistic are Griffiths (unproven at SPL level) and Mulgrew (who is not without significant flaws).

[truehibernian]

I would agree about Mulgrew's defensive failing yeah. But surely better than Grounds or Hanlon in that position ?

The times I have seen Duberry, okay he is getting on, but he proves how low the SPL quality is when he strolls it and still shows himself to be a solid, no nonsense player. Exactly what our lads need at the back. A bully.

I watched Leigh Griffiths a few times, and although he can have his wee Ivan Sproule moments and hot head incidents, he gives that burst of energy that puts the fans off their seats. Also has a wee nasty streak which sorry, is a good thing in my book if used the right way.

I suppose what I was trying to say is that there are players in other sides we could easily bid for and perhaps get.

[Kaiser1962]

But throwing money at the problem won't solve anything, will it? We spent good money on AOB...:wink::wink::wink:


:bye:

[Houchy]

I don't know, maybe I am just too simplistic in my old age. Scott says in the media that we consistently spend £1 million in transfer fees alone.

In that case, we look at the other teams around us, even those players in contract, and make bids. The state of other teams finances are such that they are in no position to turn down decent bids.

Murray Davidson. Good engine, young, scoring midfielder. I would say maybe £250,000

Leigh Griffiths. Needs to step up a division, learnt his trade in the lower league. Something to prove given he left under a wee cloud. Young, pace and energy to burn, scores goals......£300,000

Michael Duberry. Tough, no nonsense, does the basics and does them well. £75,000

Sone Aluko. Pace, trickery, decent outball on the wide area. £150,000

Willie Gibson. See above. Also scores goals.....£100,000

Charlie Mulgrew. Good left peg, set piece good, defends decently. £250,000 or on loan

For me, that's slightly over the £1 million quoted, but there you have 6 players, who could replace maybe 8 or 9 we currently pay.

Again....perhaps too simplistic, but these are the areas we need to be looking at. Also throw in Eremenko or Bryson from Killie if we have any left over.

:agree: Very well put together plan IMO. IF we could get all 6 players in for around £1m, it would certainly see me buying a half season ticket.. Even just the first 3 on that list would be awesome and would see us moving up the table fairly sharpish.:agree:

I thought even just a £600k investment from the board and 4 players at an average of £150,000 would shore us up and get us into the top 6.

[ancienthibby]

:agree: Very well put together plan IMO. IF we could get all 6 players in for around £1m, it would certainly see me buying a half season ticket.. Even just the first 3 on that list would be awesome and would see us moving up the table fairly sharpish.:agree:

I thought even just a £600k investment from the board and 4 players at an average of £150,000 would shore us up and get us into the top 6.


Can you put flesh on the bones here?? Exactly how do you see this being done??

As written, it sounds very much like yamcanomics!!
:confused:

[down the slope]

Just a wee thought, do we need the mega acres at east mains ?, i seem to recall that we bought loads of land in the deal and how about Rod sells of the surplus and ploughs it back in to the team if you will pardon the pun !. I'm sure he could sell this nae bother, he's had plenty of practice !.

[PeeJay]

Just a wee thought, do we need the mega acres at east mains ?, i seem to recall that we bought loads of land in the deal and how about Rod sells of the surplus and ploughs it back in to the team if you will pardon the pun !. I'm sure he could sell this nae bother, he's had plenty of practice !.

I've got a better idea - how about he makes the team turn up every day at East Mains and work at becoming a football team - 8 hours / 6 days a week if needs be? :greengrin

[Houchy]

[/B]

Can you put flesh on the bones here?? Exactly how do you see this being done??

As written, it sounds very much like yamcanomics!!
:confused:

What part don't you get? 4 x 150 = 600:confused:

Wages covered by the players that CC doesn't see fit to wear the Green and White.

[ancienthibby]

What part don't you get? 4 x 150 = 600:confused:

Wages covered by the players that CC doesn't see fit to wear the Green and White.


The earlier post suggested a spending of a bit more than £1 million to get maybe 6 players in.

You suggest the Board spends £600k. I just ask where is this money coming from??

And re the 4 players at £150k each - are you saying we have 4 players to sell at £150k each??

Wage savings do not help as the £1 million or so capital investment is an immediate cash outflow, while saving on wages will be spread over the contract periods. The two do not equate!!

[Houchy]

The earlier post suggested a spending of a bit more than £1 million to get maybe 6 players in.

You suggest the Board spends £600k. I just ask where is this money coming from??

And re the 4 players at £150k each - are you saying we have 4 players to sell at £150k each??

Wage savings do not help as the £1 million or so capital investment is an immediate cash outflow, while saving on wages will be spread over the contract periods. The two do not equate!!

As others have alluded to, what would cost more? Paying out a bit extra in wages for 6 months or relegation?

At no point have I said we have 4 players to sell for £150k but agai by spending £600k should see us stave off relegation and give us a spine to the team which will hopefully see us finish in, at least, the top six, which from league placings COULD cover most of the £600k.

Re the wages: remember we have 16 players out of contract next year so, yes, we may have to pay double wages for 6 months until we can get shot of them but at an average of £1500 per week x 24 weeks (6 months) is £36,000 which by producing better performances would increase attendances, we'd only have to have 1800 extra bums on seats over that 6 months to cover that shortfall ie extra 300 per week or 600 for every home game given that approximately 1 in 2 is played away but by finishing in the top 6 we'd have at least 1 other OF game so that 1800 extra is not a ridiculous figure.

Also IF we sell Bamba, how much do you think we'd get for him?

[ancienthibby]

As others have alluded to, what would cost more? Paying out a bit extra in wages for 6 months or relegation?

At no point have I said we have 4 players to sell for £150k but agai by spending £600k should see us stave off relegation and give us a spine to the team which will hopefully see us finish in, at least, the top six, which from league placings COULD cover most of the £600k.

Re the wages: remember we have 16 players out of contract next year so, yes, we may have to pay double wages for 6 months until we can get shot of them but at an average of £1500 per week x 24 weeks (6 months) is £36,000 which by producing better performances would increase atendances, we'd only have to have 1800 extra bums on seats over that 6 months to cover that shortfall.

And you still have not answered the fundamental question!!:grr::grr:

Where does the Board/the Club get £1 million CASH to buy the list of suggested players??

[Houchy]

And you still have not answered the fundamental question!!:grr::grr:

Where does the Board/the Club get £1 million CASH to buy the list of suggested players??

Where did I mention £1m??? but in answer to your question, is it not better to go £600k into debt short term until we inevitably sell Bamba from whoever else we can sell and the rest off at the end of the season from league placings.

It's not like i'm saying go £32m into debt with no plan to pay it back.

[IWasThere2016]

We've nae cash - we've borrowed for the East - BUT the weakness in the team CANNOT be ignored.

We need to sell and/or borrow and re-invest in the team in January.

I don't see that we have much choice tbh ..

[Kaiser1962]

We've nae cash - we've borrowed for the East - BUT the weakness in the team CANNOT be ignored.

We need to sell and/or borrow and re-invest in the team in January.

I don't see that we have much choice tbh ..

I agree but the main thing is that CC is given time. There are those who are questioning his ability already.

[sesoim]

And you still have not answered the fundamental question!!:grr::grr:

Where does the Board/the Club get £1 million CASH to buy the list of suggested players??


Forgive me if I'm way out here, but net debt on the last accounts was about £4.5M (can't remember exactly). Considering we have a £6M mortgage included in our accounts that has to be paid in 2020, does that not mean we effectively have about £1.5M cash sitting our bank account? Even if we don't, can't we have an advance from the bank to spend on a couple of quality players in January, especially considering we will (presumably) be letting go of at least ten players in June.

And then there is the old chestnut of STF. He could give us a short term loan to kick start the team, at least until some youngsters start to break through. He's given us loans before - it's not as if he is just handing us charity. Maybe he will see that it is time to get us going again. He wouldn't want to see what has been a very good investment (£2M in 1991) start to go belly up now.

[ancienthibby]

Where did I mention £1m??? but in answer to your question, is it not better to go £600k into debt short term until we inevitably sell Bamba from whoever else we can sell and the rest off at the end of the season from league placings.

It's not like i'm saying go £32m into debt with no plan to pay it back.

1. In post 127.

2. So £600k debt then!

3. Balance of £400k - pie in the sky!!

[Ray_]

I don't know, maybe I am just too simplistic in my old age. Scott says in the media that we consistently spend £1 million in transfer fees alone.

In that case, we look at the other teams around us, even those players in contract, and make bids. The state of other teams finances are such that they are in no position to turn down decent bids.

Murray Davidson. Good engine, young, scoring midfielder. I would say maybe £250,000

Leigh Griffiths. Needs to step up a division, learnt his trade in the lower league. Something to prove given he left under a wee cloud. Young, pace and energy to burn, scores goals......£300,000

Michael Duberry. Tough, no nonsense, does the basics and does them well. £75,000

Sone Aluko. Pace, trickery, decent outball on the wide area. £150,000

Willie Gibson. See above. Also scores goals.....£100,000

Charlie Mulgrew. Good left peg, set piece good, defends decently. £250,000 or on loan

For me, that's slightly over the £1 million quoted, but there you have 6 players, who could replace maybe 8 or 9 we currently pay.

Again....perhaps too simplistic, but these are the areas we need to be looking at. Also throw in Eremenko or Bryson from Killie if we have any left over.

I would suggest if the new manager was to sign players it would be from the market he knows & not from within the Scottish game.

[Cropley10]

I agree but the main thing is that CC is given time. There are those who are questioning his ability already.

You appear to be one of very few raising this point...

http://www.hibs.net/showthread.php?196845-Can-Any-Brave-Soul-Absolve-The-Board&p=2629936&highlight=#post2629936

[matty_f]

I would suggest if the new manager was to sign players it would be from the market he knows & not from within the Scottish game.

:agree: I would hope that was the case, anyway. I'm hoping calderwood's knowledge of the english league throws us some diamonds in the same way that mowbray did.

[ancienthibby]

Forgive me if I'm way out here, but net debt on the last accounts was about £4.5M (can't remember exactly). Considering we have a £6M mortgage included in our accounts that has to be paid in 2020, does that not mean we effectively have about £1.5M cash sitting our bank account? Even if we don't, can't we have an advance from the bank to spend on a couple of quality players in January, especially considering we will (presumably) be letting go of at least ten players in June.

And then there is the old chestnut of STF. He could give us a short term loan to kick start the team, at least until some youngsters start to break through. He's given us loans before - it's not as if he is just handing us charity. Maybe he will see that it is time to get us going again. He wouldn't want to see what has been a very good investment (£2M in 1991) start to go belly up now.

Understand your first para perfectly well.

The actual cash in the bank (leaving debt at its true, gross level) at 31 July was £2.2 million.

Hibs burnt cash for operating expenses at £8.1 million last year, or about £675k per month,. You can work out the numbers - they do not make for comforting reading!

My reading of the position is that BEFORE any investment of £1 million in new players can be contemplated, the Club is going to have secure external funding (overdraft?) anyway.

[Houchy]

1. In post 127.

2. So £600k debt then!

3. Balance of £400k - pie in the sky!!

Think you'll find that that post was in the reply to the quote 117.

I then alluded that £600k, might be all it may take rather than the full £1m discused and that £600k could see us finish in the top 6 or higher, practically paying back a large chunk of the £600k advance compared with being relegated of even finishing in the bottom 6 ie no more OF games or no more derbies.

Re your attempted sarcastic "point 3": Don't even start trying to come the smart **** with me.

[HIBERNIAN-0762]

Does anyone think the new east stand was built for the bigger picture, i.e semi finals, Scotland under 21's and music concerts?, just a thought

[ancienthibby]

Think you'll find that that post was in the reply to the quote from the OP.

I then alluded that £600k, might be all it may take rather than the full £1m discused and that £600k could see us finish in the top 6 or higher, practically paying back a large chunk of the £600k advance copared with being relegated of even finishing in the bottom 6 ie no more OF games or no more derbies.

Re your attempted sarcastic "point 3": Don't even start trying to come the smart **** with me.

Chill, man!
:shocked:

[King Paddy]

I have felt for many years that the powers that be Petrie/Farmer have cashed in on the family silver and asset stripped the playing staff. Any have decent player is sold on asap and that is the main reason why we are a solvent club. Because of our prudent selling strategy we have managed to build a superb stadium but only to the detriment of the team. Untill new investment is brought in get Farmer to sell we IMO will flirt between top six one year bottom six the next and relegation in between. I was part of the fans pressure group HOH back in 98 and i felt then that the board were let off lightly due to our relegation. One thing i would say because of our pressure on the owner/board we got mcleish the funs he needed to get out of the 1st div. Hibs badly need new direction and IMO fresh investment. It's up to all the fans out there who if they feel like i do protest about the way the club is being run. What is it 9 managers in so many years, are they all to blame for us being a laughing stock of the spl, i don't think so.

[Houchy]

I have felt for many years that the powers that be Petrie/Farmer have cashed in on the family silver and asset stripped the playing staff. Any have decent player is sold on asap and that is the main reason why we are a solvent club. Because of our prudent selling strategy we have managed to build a superb stadium but only to the detriment of the team. Untill new investment is brought in get Farmer to sell we IMO will flirt between top six one year bottom six the next and relegation in between. I was part of the fans pressure group HOH back in 98 and i felt then that the board were let off lightly due to our relegation. One thing i would say because of our pressure on the owner/board we got mcleish the funs he needed to get out of the 1st div. Hibs badly need new direction and IMO fresh investment. It's up to all the fans out there who if they feel like i do protest about the way the club is being run. What is it 9 managers in so many years, are they all to blame for us being a laughing stock of the spl, i don't think so.

:agree: My worry is that with this team, if we are relegated, we won't be guaranteed to bounce straight back up this time and if we spend more than 1 season there it'll be harder and harder each year:agree: read Dundee, Partick, Falkirk etc.

[Kaiser1962]

You appear to be one of very few raising this point...

http://www.hibs.net/showthread.php?196845-Can-Any-Brave-Soul-Absolve-The-Board&p=2629936&highlight=#post2629936

I am 100% behind CC. Let there be no doubt and he has to be given time no matter how unpalatable this becomes.

[Cropley10]

I am 100% behind CC. Let there be no doubt and he has to be given time no matter how unpalatable this becomes.

But what about when Hibs start winning games and doing well? :wink:

[Kaiser1962]

But what about when Hibs start winning games and doing well? :wink:

Uncalled for and personal

[joebakerforever]

And you still have not answered the fundamental question!!:grr::grr:

Where does the Board/the Club get £1 million CASH to buy the list of suggested players??

So enlighten us all with what has happened to the transfer fee received for Stokes in August ?

[Houchy]

So enlighten us all with what has happened to the transfer fee received for Stokes in August ?

:greengrin:top marks

[ancienthibby]

So enlighten us all with what has happened to the transfer fee received for Stokes in August ?

Thanks for the reminder.

That money will be consumed into the overall cash flow which burns £675k per month!!:grr:

Worth remembering that the majority of this year's cash flow will have already been banked through ST sales. Income from now on will be walk-up sales, merchandise, sponsorships, TV money and - dare I say it - a very good cup run.:greengrin

[Cropley10]

Appointments that we, as fans, wanted at the time.

Myth. TM? JC? Mixu and Yogi were both greeted with mixed receptions.

It's worth remembering that .net is not Hibs. There are plenty of fans who don't come anywhere near here.

[NAE NOOKIE]

What I dont get is that STF for a man who " never wanted to own a football club " seems to be doing a good job of holding on to his unwanted possesion.

He has been owner for 20 years now. Dont tell me that a man with his business accumen couldnt have offloaded HFC by now to an individual or company who were prepared to invest in the team.

We arnt talking about Man City or Chelsea type cash here. In football terms it would take a modest investment to get Hibs right up there.

The publicity to be had by pushing the OF off their pedestal would far exceed Scottish Footballs normal place in the order of things.

Man City spent about £30,000,000 or more on one player who they pay £250,000 per week. Thats ONE player.

For that kind of outlay you could build a team capable of winning the SPL.

So the bottom line for me is that unless we attract a new owner we may progress, but unfortunately some of us dont want to be 70 years old and still have never seen Hibs win the Scottish Cup or beat the Yams in every league game in a season.

And dont tell me the money aint out there. There will always be the mega rich with cash to splash no matter what the world financial situation is.

[joebakerforever]

Thanks for the reminder.

That money will be consumed into the overall cash flow which burns £675k per month!!:grr:

Worth remembering that the majority of this year's cash flow will have already been banked through ST sales. Income from now on will be walk-up sales, merchandise, sponsorships, TV money and - dare I say it - a very good cup run.:greengrin

So what you are saying is that none of the Stokes transfer fee will be available for for the purchase of new players.

Well if that is the commitment that Petrie and Farmer are making into the on field side of the business, they will not be surprised if a significant proportion of their customers respond to a diluted product by spending their cash elsewhere in the pursuit of value for their money.

[Stonewall]

What I dont get is that STF for a man who " never wanted to own a football club " seems to be doing a good job of holding on to his unwanted possesion.

He has been owner for 20 years now. Dont tell me that a man with his business accumen couldnt have offloaded HFC by now to an individual or company who were prepared to invest in the team.

We arnt talking about Man City or Chelsea type cash here. In football terms it would take a modest investment to get Hibs right up there.

The publicity to be had by pushing the OF off their pedestal would far exceed Scottish Footballs normal place in the order of things.

Man City spent about £30,000,000 or more on one player who they pay £250,000 per week. Thats ONE player.

For that kind of outlay you could build a team capable of winning the SPL.

So the bottom line for me is that unless we attract a new owner we may progress, but unfortunately some of us dont want to be 70 years old and still have never seen Hibs win the Scottish Cup or beat the Yams in every league game in a season.

And dont tell me the money aint out there. There will always be the mega rich with cash to splash no matter what the world financial situation is.

What would you say this modest outlay we need to knock the old firm off its pedestal is? Your premise that this is all that's required to put us 'right up there' is questionable to say the least. £30 million may not be far off the mark.

Your last paragraph shows you to be frankly deluded.

Don't you think every club in Scotland is looking for one of these 'mega rich' owners. I'm sure Dundee thought a modest investment would see them right but it didn't quite work out did it? Rangers have only managed to secure interest from a dodgy South African business man and some bunch of publicity seeking wido's from London.

Truth is that unless you're lucky and have a rich fan (Like Blackburn, Wolves and Middlesborough in recent times) prepared to throw his hard earned cash at the club then Scotish football provides neither the profile nor the potential cash generating capacity to attract these guys.

Our board (and STF) is certainly not beyond criticism but its got to have some basis in reality.

[IWasThere2016]

Stokes fee went towards the funding of the East, and top European goal-machine Trakysuit :agree:

[ancienthibby]

So what you are saying is that none of the Stokes transfer fee will be available for for the purchase of new players.

Well if that is the commitment that Petrie and Farmer are making into the on field side of the business, they will not be surprised if a significant proportion of their customers respond to a diluted product by spending their cash elsewhere in the pursuit of value for their money.

159 TQM - What he said.:agree:

[Part/Time Supporter]

What I dont get is that STF for a man who " never wanted to own a football club " seems to be doing a good job of holding on to his unwanted possesion.

He has been owner for 20 years now. Dont tell me that a man with his business accumen couldnt have offloaded HFC by now to an individual or company who were prepared to invest in the team.

We arnt talking about Man City or Chelsea type cash here. In football terms it would take a modest investment to get Hibs right up there.

The publicity to be had by pushing the OF off their pedestal would far exceed Scottish Footballs normal place in the order of things.

Man City spent about £30,000,000 or more on one player who they pay £250,000 per week. Thats ONE player.

For that kind of outlay you could build a team capable of winning the SPL.

So the bottom line for me is that unless we attract a new owner we may progress, but unfortunately some of us dont want to be 70 years old and still have never seen Hibs win the Scottish Cup or beat the Yams in every league game in a season.

And dont tell me the money aint out there. There will always be the mega rich with cash to splash no matter what the world financial situation is.

That's what Romanov thought. How has that one worked out again? He's about £40M down overall (having written off over £20M of that), despite selling over £10M of players. Hearts have won the same number of trophies as Hibs and nothing has been done to improve their facilities.

[Phil D. Rolls]

What I dont get is that STF for a man who " never wanted to own a football club " seems to be doing a good job of holding on to his unwanted possesion.

He has been owner for 20 years now. Dont tell me that a man with his business accumen couldnt have offloaded HFC by now to an individual or company who were prepared to invest in the team.

We arnt talking about Man City or Chelsea type cash here. In football terms it would take a modest investment to get Hibs right up there.

The publicity to be had by pushing the OF off their pedestal would far exceed Scottish Footballs normal place in the order of things.

Man City spent about £30,000,000 or more on one player who they pay £250,000 per week. Thats ONE player.

For that kind of outlay you could build a team capable of winning the SPL.

So the bottom line for me is that unless we attract a new owner we may progress, but unfortunately some of us dont want to be 70 years old and still have never seen Hibs win the Scottish Cup or beat the Yams in every league game in a season.

And dont tell me the money aint out there. There will always be the mega rich with cash to splash no matter what the world financial situation is.

Right up where, and what is a modest investment? The fact is the league title hasn't left Glasgow for a quarter of a century, despite clubs - including us - being seduced by big schemes to topple the OF.

Sorry, but your post just rings of deluded thinking. There is a massive financial gap between two clubs who have attendances of 50,000 + every home game, and the rest of us who struggle to break 12,000 (and yes I am including our pink chums in that).

If the money is out there, where is it? To my recollection the only serious interest we have seen in Hibs came from Brian Kennedy. It turned out that he wasn't the guy a lot of people wanted to believe he was.

There are people out there who will arrive at a club, promising the earth. Just ask the fans of Hearts or Dundee where that leads. Be careful what you wish for.

[Speedway]

Myth. TM? JC? Mixu and Yogi were both greeted with mixed receptions.

It's worth remembering that .net is not Hibs. There are plenty of fans who don't come anywhere near here.

:agree:

There's about 1,500 on here so on crowds of 11,000, it would be a struggle to even refer to opinion on here as a representative sample.

[joebakerforever]

159 TQM - What he said.:agree:

Which is not what you stated !

So if you were a customer at Rod's Diner and his spending on refurbishing the place resulted in the previous meaty broth turning into watery soup, and being charged the same or more, would you continue to patronise this establishment :confused:

[Speedway]

If Rod resigned, how would it improve things to have an ex-chairman looking for a return on his 10% stake (bearing in mind that the club owes him money) and still having to pay for a comparable standard executive in his place?

[joebakerforever]

Stokes fee went towards the funding of the East, and top European goal-machine Trakysuit :agree:

What percentage of Stokes transfer fee was spent on Trakys ?

Was it 0.1%. 1%, 10%, 50% or what ?

If as I suspect, a few crumbs were spent on the Lithuanian, it is disingenuous to give the impression that a significant chunk of the Stokes cash has been reinvested in replacement players.

[Kaiser1962]

:agree:

There's about 1,500 on here so on crowds of 11,000, it would be a struggle to even refer to opinion on here as a representative sample.

But what percentage of people on here actually attend games?

There are probably quite a few through who are either too far away, infirm or simply cant afford it and places like this allow them to keep up on Hibs chat. Dosent mean they dont have an opinion or they are any less fans of Hibs.
Alternatively some may choose not to go for other reasons.

[joebakerforever]

If Rod resigned, how would it improve things to have an ex-chairman looking for a return on his 10% stake (bearing in mind that the club owes him money) and still having to pay for a comparable standard executive in his place?

It is not his resignation that I am raising, it is the lack of a reasonable proportion of the millions accrued over the past 4 - 5 years, which would have permitted the various managers an opportunity to recruit decent standard players.

A lot of noise has been made on here about messrs O'Brien & Makalamby being expensive signings, but can anyone quote officially published figures on the actual fees?


Petrie may well continue with his present "infrastructure improvement to the detriment of team performance" strategy.

However he will be kidding himself if expects the discerning supporters to continue to pay to watch the dire fare that has been served up for some time.

PS Attended Easter Road since 1955 and Season Ticket Holder for 25 years.

[BEEJ]

What percentage of Stokes transfer fee was spent on Trakys ?

Was it 0.1%. 1%, 10%, 50% or what ?
Zilch. He was out of contract and looking for a club.

I think TQM's post was slightly 'tongue in cheek' in that respect.

[ancienthibby]

It is not his resignation that I am raising, it is the lack of a reasonable proportion of the millions accrued over the past 4 - 5 years, which would have permitted the various managers an opportunity to recruit decent standard players.

A lot of noise has been made on here about messrs O'Brien & Makalamby being expensive signings, but can anyone quote officially published figures on the actual fees?


Petrie may well continue with his present "infrastructure improvement to the detriment of team performance" strategy.

However he will be kidding himself if expects the discerning supporters to continue to pay to watch the dire fare that has been served up for some time.

PS Attended Easter Road since 1955 and Season Ticket Holder for 25 years.

Please define!

Do you mean payments for players sales not yet recorded intro cash, or what??

Remenbering that CASH IS KING??:agree::agree:

[joebakerforever]

Please define!

Do you mean payments for players sales not yet recorded intro cash, or what??

Remenbering that CASH IS KING??:agree::agree:

The actual transfer fees from sale of players, including any subsequent sell on receipts, such as Steven Fletcher £3,000,000 from Burnley, plus subsequent £500,000+ when sold on to Wolves, as an example of the many large transfer fees that Petrie & Co. have trousered over the past 4 - 5 years :agree::agree:

[BEEJ]

The actual transfer fees from sale of players, including any subsequent sell on receipts, such as Steven Fletcher £3,000,000 from Burnley, plus subsequent £500,000+ when sold on to Wolves, as an example of the many large transfer fees that Petrie & Co. have trousered over the past 4 - 5 years :agree::agree:
Whilst I have much sympathy for your sense of frustration, you don't honestly think that the proceeds of these player sales (or indeed any part of them) have found their way into STF's and RP's personal Swiss bank accounts. :greengrin

Do you? :confused:

[pacorosssco]

It's worth remembering that .net is not Hibs. There are plenty of fans who don't come anywhere near here.[/QUOTE]

thank ****

[ancienthibby]

The actual transfer fees from sale of players, including any subsequent sell on receipts, such as Steven Fletcher £3,000,000 from Burnley, plus subsequent £500,000+ when sold on to Wolves, as an example of the many large transfer fees that Petrie & Co. have trousered over the past 4 - 5 years :agree::agree:

With that post on a public forum, you should expect to hear from 'Petrie & Co's lawyers!!!:agree::agree:

[Cocaine&Caviar]

What mess?

[Hibbyradge]

Well done, Rod. :thumbsup:

[Part/Time Supporter]

The actual transfer fees from sale of players, including any subsequent sell on receipts, such as Steven Fletcher £3,000,000 from Burnley, plus subsequent £500,000+ when sold on to Wolves, as an example of the many large transfer fees that Petrie & Co. have trousered over the past 4 - 5 years :agree::agree:

rearrange the following into a well known phrase or saying

pish utter

[Hibbyradge]

The actual transfer fees from sale of players, including any subsequent sell on receipts, such as Steven Fletcher £3,000,000 from Burnley, plus subsequent £500,000+ when sold on to Wolves, as an example of the many large transfer fees that Petrie & Co. have trousered over the past 4 - 5 years :agree::agree:

That's nasty, uncalled for and plain wrong.

It's actually slanderous.

Are you really a Hibs supporter? :bitchy:

[Kaiser1962]

The actual transfer fees from sale of players, including any subsequent sell on receipts, such as Steven Fletcher £3,000,000 from Burnley, plus subsequent £500,000+ when sold on to Wolves, as an example of the many large transfer fees that Petrie & Co. have trousered over the past 4 - 5 years :agree::agree:

Hibs accounts, unlike others I could mention, are very transparent and actually get signed off by the auditors. The transfer fees, however unpalatable, have subsidised an otherwise loss making business and are directly responsible for its profitability and its continued existence.