Our highly successful 'Sign more journeymen!' strategy

[Nailrod]

Just a thought, but if we had pooled the money we've wasted on a dozen journeymen per year every year for the last five years, and if we had used the same amount of money to sign four or five decent players, and if we had backed them up with the youngsters who were good enough to win the league and cup double...

Then we wouldn't have spent a penny more than we've spent anyway... :agree:
So we would be in exactly the same financial position we are currently in... :agree:
But we would have a much better first team squad... :agree:
And when we had to bring promising youngsters into the team because of injuries and suspension they would be playing alongside quality players instead of a bunch of fourth rate dross... :agree:
So you might reasonably hope that they would progress well instead of going backwards :agree:...
And we might not be staring at the prospect of relegation a quarter of the way into the season... :agree:

But then if my auntie had boz she'd be my uncle.

In Rod we trust!

How many of the double-winning under-19s are actually still on our books, by the way?

[Cocaine&Caviar]

Booth, Byrne, Currie, Welsh, Taggart, Flynn, Wotherspoon, and Moyes?

[BEEJ]

How many of the double-winning under-19s are actually still on our books, by the way?
Seven, I think. Currie, Welsh, Moyes, Booth, Byrne, Flynn, Smith.

[Nailrod]

Booth, Byrne, Currie, Welsh, Taggart, Flynn, Wotherspoon, and Moyes?
Eight of them still on the books!

That's clearly an oversight on the part of the board. Never mind. I'm sure they're on the way to being eased out the door in order to 'free up wages' for several more of the top players from St Mirren, Kilmarnock, and any other team that looks like it means to establish itself firmly in the bottom six of the SPL.

[Matty_Jack04]

ever thought that they might not be ready for the step up? in the past the natural progression would be reserve team football but our glorious football assosation made sure that stopped along with the infirm.

the best thing for them at the moment is being out on loan, getting first team experience regular games and as far away from whats going on at Easter Road as possible.

As for the journeymen, a club like ours needs to be signing players no older than 28 IMO, there needs to be a chance of players we get in being sold for a decent price for us to develop as a club, unfortunatley i dont think that has happend for a long long time, im hoping that CC will be able to identify these types from the lower divisions in england and punt them on to championship level teams.

I was hopefull we where moving on from that stage after selling players for mega during and after the mowbray era but unfortunatley the money spent in recent years has been wasted beyond beleif. (on players)

[Bishop Hibee]

In the 90's we were able to buy decent players from other SPL teams e.g. John O'Neill from St Johnstone, Mikey O'Neill and Darren Jackson from Dundee Utd and Keith Wright from Dundee. We also spent money on players like Lavety who turned out to be duds.

The point is we bought players who had or seemed to have potential. Are things so bad that signings like Murray Davidson from St Johnstone or Jamie Murphy from Motherwell are beyond us?

Forget players like Dickoh, Trakys and De Graaf and give players like Booth and Byrne a go on their return especially if we can't get decent players from our rivals who pay lower wages.

I hope Calderwood can do the business in the transfer market in the window or we are in a relegation dogfight with a chance of going down.

[sesoim]

We have a wage budget of around £4 to £4.5M for players, so really we should be able keep a good core of about 15 or 16 players on that, and make up the rest of the first team squad with young players with potential.

Over the next year I would hope to see about 15 players leave, 6 quality players come in, and that should leave us with a decent mix of youth and experience.

Unfortunately this season already looks a write off, but if we can have an early clearout in January that would certainly leave some room for youngsters to start breaking through. But we still need to bring a few GOOD players in as well.

[sesoim]

ever thought that they might not be ready for the step up? in the past the natural progression would be reserve team football but our glorious football assosation made sure that stopped along with the infirm.

the best thing for them at the moment is being out on loan, getting first team experience regular games and as far away from whats going on at Easter Road as possible.

As for the journeymen, a club like ours needs to be signing players no older than 28 IMO, there needs to be a chance of players we get in being sold for a decent price for us to develop as a club, unfortunatley i dont think that has happend for a long long time, im hoping that CC will be able to identify these types from the lower divisions in england and punt them on to championship level teams.

I was hopefull we where moving on from that stage after selling players for mega during and after the mowbray era but unfortunatley the money spent in recent years has been wasted beyond beleif. (on players)


I disagree with that - the youngsters are more likely to learn and improve if they have few "old heads" in the team beside them. If we had a handful of Sauzee's, Latapy's and Mixu's in the squad instead of about 15 journeyman then we'd progress quicker. There hasn't been enough leadership on the park and, again, that's where a few good experienced players would help.

[FitbaFolkKen]

This is spot on, Rod needs to have a look at the players he is scouting identifying and signing....or wait should the managers not be picking who we sign...

Thought you were going to list our board overusing the fax machine there too....

[BEEJ]

We have a wage budget of around £4 to £4.5M for players, so really we should be able keep a good core of about 15 or 16 players on that, and make up the rest of the first team squad with young players with potential.
Must be a bit less than that.

Total wage bill in 2009/10 was £4.8m. That's for everyone. The salaries of the Directors alone was £492k. You also have to account for Commercial and Admin staff. And then there's CC and the coaching team. Plus a small amount for the U19s squad.

Quite a lot less than £4m when you factor in all the non first team squad headcount.

[Cropley10]

Must be a bit less than that.

Total wage bill in 2009/10 was £4.8m. That's for everyone. The salaries of the Directors alone was £492k. You also have to account for Commercial and Admin staff. And then there's CC and the coaching team. Plus a small amount for the U19s squad.

Quite a lot less than £4m when you factor in all the non first team squad headcount.

We pay £496k for our Board? We're lucky to be able afford such quality people.

[sunshine1875]

I am not sure about this talk that our U19 double winners are not ready for it yet.

When you go back to the time when O'Connor, Riordan, Thomson, Brown, Whittaker etc first started playing for Hibs, they were all 17 or 18 and at that time I don't recall Hibs having a strong U19 team.

So is this telling me that the current crop of players are not good enough to get into what is a pretty poor Hibs team now. Sounds like they will never be ready.

[Matty_Jack04]

I am not sure about this talk that our U19 double winners are not ready for it yet.

When you go back to the time when O'Connor, Riordan, Thomson, Brown, Whittaker etc first started playing for Hibs, they were all 17 or 18 and at that time I don't recall Hibs having a strong U19 team.

So is this telling me that the current crop of players are not good enough to get into what is a pretty poor Hibs team now. Sounds like they will never be ready.

they did however have a reserve league where they played in also before we saw them at first team level.
im not saying that im 100% sure there not ready i have no idea im just offering up alternitives to why we have not seen many of them make the squad which as you say is a very poor team, i also think going by the rumour mill it could have been down to previous management.


I disagree with that - the youngsters are more likely to learn and improve if they have few "old heads" in the team beside them. If we had a handful of Sauzee's, Latapy's and Mixu's in the squad instead of about 15 journeyman then we'd progress quicker. There hasn't been enough leadership on the park and, again, that's where a few good experienced players would help.

I agree older heads would help younger lads come through, im not saying sell players as they reach 28 im saying the players we bring in shouldnt be older than that, its no good going and signing players 30+ because they've played at a good level and could help the younger lads and then they arrive and are guff e.g de graaf, they're more likly to play a year or 2 and leave for nothing whilst hibs pay big wages for no return.
If we where to clear out the 16 out of contract or the majority of them and add 5 or 6 quality players I'd rather see us pay for players who have much better quality than those leaving but with a potential to sell on in the future, as sad as it is its how hibs have to continue to work.

[Kaiser1962]

We dont know that they wont be any good until we sign them. A bit like buying a used car. Looks the part and looks good value but only when we've had it a wee while we realise it's not a new car and it has some faults. We would all like Wayne Rooney/brand new BMW 7 series but cant afford it so sometimes we have to settle for what we perceive is the best we can afford rather than what we would like.

[Phil D. Rolls]

Eight of them still on the books!

That's clearly an oversight on the part of the board. Never mind. I'm sure they're on the way to being eased out the door in order to 'free up wages' for several more of the top players from St Mirren, Kilmarnock, and any other team that looks like it means to establish itself firmly in the bottom six of the SPL.

Sounds like an easy way to win an argument to me.