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Pretty Boy
02-05-2010, 11:08 AM
Seen a lot of post on here in the last few months regarding a feeling of disinterest and apathy towards Hibs at the moment. There is also the very noticeable drop in both home and away suppport over the last few months.

I have to admit i said after the Ross County debacle that i was finding it hard to care and that is still the case, whilst yesterday hurt it didn't really spoil my weekend the way it usually would have. The simple fact is though i've still been to a couple of games that i was able to make since Ross County and i still check out this site and comment most days. I am losing patience though. I don't really see us going anywhere and after 20 odd years mid-table mediocrity is beginning to become boringly predictable.

A few posters seem to find this kind of attitude unthinkable and shout down those who are having doubts fairly quickly so my question is aimed at them. What is it that makes it hard for you to see why people are feeling this way? Is it a feeling of loyalty? A genuine belief we are making progress(on the park)? Or just that you enjoy the whole matchday experience so much you would find it hard to give it up?

Not trying to start an argument just genuinely interested as at the moment i find Hibs completely uninteresting and TBH it worries me because i have sat through far worse than this in the past and thought i always would.

Wembley67
02-05-2010, 11:11 AM
Hibs bored me stupid during the Blobby years, I gave up my season then and have only been to a handful of games since.

I used to go for the social aspect of it and used to get some pretty good entertainment but since then.......

Sylar
02-05-2010, 11:21 AM
It's not just Hibs - I feel very apathetic towards football in general right now. Same issues of contention which go unaddressed year in, year out; lack of competitive football (every league has their usual runaway leaders/winners); poor value for money (in Scotland anyway...); too money oriented.

I'd much rather be on a golf course somewhere these days than at the football. To be frank, I just don't really care anymore.

basehibby
02-05-2010, 12:57 PM
Seen a lot of post on here in the last few months regarding a feeling of disinterest and apathy towards Hibs at the moment. There is also the very noticeable drop in both home and away suppport over the last few months.

I have to admit i said after the Ross County debacle that i was finding it hard to care and that is still the case, whilst yesterday hurt it didn't really spoil my weekend the way it usually would have. The simple fact is though i've still been to a couple of games that i was able to make since Ross County and i still check out this site and comment most days. I am losing patience though. I don't really see us going anywhere and after 20 odd years mid-table mediocrity is beginning to become boringly predictable.

A few posters seem to find this kind of attitude unthinkable and shout down those who are having doubts fairly quickly so my question is aimed at them. What is it that makes it hard for you to see why people are feeling this way? Is it a feeling of loyalty? A genuine belief we are making progress(on the park)? Or just that you enjoy the whole matchday experience so much you would find it hard to give it up?

Not trying to start an argument just genuinely interested as at the moment i find Hibs completely uninteresting and TBH it worries me because i have sat through far worse than this in the past and thought i always would.

I've personally given people pelters on here before now for giving up the ghost on the whole season prematurely.
I've got to admit though that it's only a human reaction to yet ANOTHER massive let down and I'm feeling exactly the same today after what was yet another shocking result at home vs THEM.
Right now I'm finding it dificult to even acknowledge the existence of the game of football as even watching a bit of EPL highlights for example will send my mood spiralling into darkness as I reflect on what a bloody CURSE it is sometimes to be a Hibee.
Still though - if I stand back and take an objective view, the season is NOT over yet - as a win away at Motherwell would surely be enough to breathe life back into our European challenge. And that's the answer to your question really - it's when people refuse to acknowledge the facts that I start to get annoyed - whether that be blatantly exagerating the length or depth of the current slump in order to score some cheap points against the manager, or claiming the season is over when it patently is not - anyone coming on here and distorting the truth in such a fashion deserves to be challenged - regardless of how understandable their despondent mood might be.

Golden Bear
02-05-2010, 01:05 PM
With me it's just a feeling (although an unfounded feeling) that things are not right behind the scenes and this more than anything else is having a detrimental effect on team performances and the attitude of the Club's support.

For once ---- we can genuinely say - "Get it sorted Rod"!

truehibernian
02-05-2010, 01:06 PM
Still go to games, even more so now that my son is very much into going. Without him though, I would not attend as much. Football in Europe is around 50% cheaper, with season tickets in places like Spain and France around a quarter of what Hibs charge. Couple that with work commitments, money and women :wink:, football is not the be all and end all anymore for me. Spoke to two Hearts supporting mates recently who are not renewing their season books for the first time in years due to the boredum and lack of real talent on show. Hibs fans are in the same boat. The atmosphere is poor, the team is poor, the game is too expensive for the average person. Make it worth going and make it cheaper. Hibs are always in the blood though so you can always make time for them now and again by going to a few games.

Sir David Gray
02-05-2010, 01:32 PM
I will always go to the football because it's part of my life but apathy has certainly set in with me over the past couple of years. I find football extremely boring and I can't say that I enjoy it.

I can't speak for anyone else but I think that feeling is prevalent amongst the wider Hibs support and it is a very worrying trend.

SneakersO'Toole
02-05-2010, 01:52 PM
I will always go to the football because it's part of my life but apathy has certainly set in with me over the past couple of years. I find football extremely boring and I can't say that I enjoy it.

I can't speak for anyone else but I think that feeling is prevalent amongst the wider Hibs support and it is a very worrying trend.

Your last sentence if absolutely true. No question.

Scottish football is not value for money. Fact. Maybe the recession has opened people's eyes to this.

I will buy a season ticket next season but it is more from a social point of view. It gives me an excuse not to go to idea on a saturday afternoon.

Its a sad state of affairs unfortunately but i think more and more people are happy to do other things with their money rather than watch football. I don't blame or judge these people as I can understand why. Football is rarely enjoyable these days. Its more habit for me than anything but others are happy to break this habit or perhaps create a new one that doesnt involved football.

sesoim
02-05-2010, 01:55 PM
For me it's financial reasons (too expensive and VERY poor value for money). Plus I spend too many games grumping and moaning, so it's probably best I pick and choose my games rather than buy a season ticket and regret it (again).

sesoim
02-05-2010, 02:01 PM
I will always go to the football because it's part of my life but apathy has certainly set in with me over the past couple of years. I find football extremely boring and I can't say that I enjoy it.

I can't speak for anyone else but I think that feeling is prevalent amongst the wider Hibs support and it is a very worrying trend.


:agree: I can barely sit through a game now without my mind wandering. I used to sit glued to games. There's too many reasons too mention - I think football in general has lost its innocence with all the money and diving and cheating and all the sleaze off the field. As far as Hibs go, I've been let down far too many times and it starts to numb you. The frustrating thing is, I still think Hibs could achieve alot, ie Cup wins, good runs in Europe, etc, but we keep on failing to appoint or hold onto decent managers.

snooky
02-05-2010, 02:35 PM
Some people say about winning something is a must. I don't feel that's a priority. I pay to see 90 minutes of entertainment. Goals/dribbles/"stramashes" etc. I do NOT go to watch referees although some of them seem to think I do.

These days watching football has become a bit of a bore due to the lack of characters and/or skillful players. The only two that have excited me in recent years is Deek and Ivan.

Sumner
02-05-2010, 02:35 PM
Same boring SPL
Same boring Old Firm bias
Same boring BAD referees
Same boring clueless linesmen
Same boring price-increasing
Same boring poor standard of football
Same boring negative relegation fearing bottom sides
Same boring lack of quality players
Same boring selling policy
Same boring managerial appointments
Same boring tactically inept managers
Same boring small-minded defeatist idle underacheiving *******s on pitch
Same boring winter collapse (on-going...)
Same boring 4-3-3
Same boring stupid line-ups, striker on left-wing?
Same boring post-match ***** from Hughes

... select from the above.

- for 16 used to be able to see Latapy & Sauzee,
now what? Rankin, Cregg & Nish... "That's Entertainment" right enough :bitchy:

krobertson12
02-05-2010, 02:58 PM
Same boring SPL
Same boring Old Firm bias
Same boring BAD referees
Same boring clueless linesmen
Same boring price-increasing
Same boring poor standard of football
Same boring negative relegation fearing bottom sides
Same boring lack of quality players
Same boring selling policy
Same boring managerial appointments
Same boring tactically inept managers
Same boring small-minded defeatist idle underacheiving *******s on pitch
Same boring winter collapse (on-going...)
Same boring 4-3-3
Same boring stupid line-ups, striker on left-wing?
Same boring post-match ***** from Hughes

... select from the above.

- for 16 used to be able to see Latapy & Sauzee,
now what? Rankin, Cregg & Nish... "That's Entertainment" right enough :bitchy:
Good point well made. just not worth the money now. you could argue that was when we spent slightly above our means however.

Blurry Face
02-05-2010, 03:19 PM
emotionally wrung out.
competing priorities.
lazieness
uncomfortable with some of the stupid venom spewed at games
weather
disenchantment
getting older but no wiser
TV Football coverage

re tv coverage - should have pointed out it is the way we get pissed on by the tv companies making saturday @ 3pm become 12:00 or Sunday or whatever. no claim to be a traditionalist just a working man.

Scouse Hibee
02-05-2010, 03:27 PM
Saturday afternoon (well sometimes) football has always been part of my life and has become the same with my son. You support your team whatever is my philosophy.

NAE NOOKIE
02-05-2010, 10:30 PM
Folk get drawn away from football for loads of reasons and this has always been the case.

If it were not so and every fan stuck with their team from the day they first walked through the turnstyles then the likes of Hibs would have a regular home support which would be a lot bigger than it is now.

I attended my first Hibs match in 1976 and our regular home support was about 8,000

From that season until now is a period of about 34 years. So if Hibs had just 200 new fans through the gates for every one of those years and those fans and the original original 8,000 were still watching the club that would be 14,800 people.

I dare say that 200 per year is a reasonably conservative estimate.

I suppose my point is that people will always drift away from football for loads of different and valid reasons.

The order of priority for any football club owner must be:

1 ..... Keep hold of the supporters you already have.
2 ..... Attract new supporters.
3 ..... Get folk who have stopped going to come back.

The trouble with this, is that at the very top of the game in Europe all that matters is the TV money and keeping the likes of Real Madrid and the like on side. The vast majority of fans who support the 90% of clubs who are also rans just dont matter.

The clubs who cant afford to pay between 10,000 and 40,000 per week in wages will always be left with the dross and as a result the product will for the most part always be less than brilliant for them

The fact that a lot of the clubs at the top of the tree have run up billions in debt doesnt seem to matter.

So unless you support one of the rich clubs in whatever country you happen to watch football in, you had better be prepared to suffer a lot of sheoit tempered with a small dose of sugar now and then.

I guess the ones who dont drift away are prepared to face up to that reality and put up with the fact that the product on offer wont always be as appealing as going to IKEA or cutting the grass or paying 30 a month for sky sports and watching the super duper teams on telly.

Anyway. As a Hibby I see myself as being as much a part of Hibs as the players the Chairman the manager or the ground.

Without me and all of the other paying spectators Hibs, like every other club in the world, would be no more of a TV or media spectacle than my local bowling club.

Anyway. Thats why I can keep going to matches and have done for those 35 years when so many others have fallen by the wayside.

:blah:

Iain G
02-05-2010, 10:43 PM
I will always support the Hibs, my current geographic location has dictated that I can't do so by having a season ticket and going to the matches, so supporting from afar naturally is different from going to Easter Road.

Also with all the problems and issues over the last 2 year, I find myself less intersted and less upset when we get gubbed, I wake up on a Sunday morning, turn the laptop on and Hibs have lost again, overnight when I've been asleep!! (Lucky me I hear you cry!) :greengrin

In contrast to that, I have the Wellington Phoenix to go along and support, now I know its the A League, but before you scoff and ridicule, here we have a team which the whole city is behind, where there isn't the 100+ years of baggage and everyone wants them to do well without a lot of the agendas/grumping/moaning that us as Hibs fans have ingrained into us after many years of hurt and suffering! :wink:

It is really refreshing to cynical old me to go along and see 32000+ Wellington fans go along to support their team when they get into the finals series in only their 3rd year, to see and hear everyone around town so interested in football and so excited and keen for the team to succeed!

The contrast between what I have seen and experienced this season to the pain that you go through supporting Hibs has been chalk & cheese for me this year.

The Modfather
02-05-2010, 10:58 PM
For me, it's not so much the money I grudge (although football certainly isn't value for money) it is the time. I hate losing an afternoon of my life to Hibs simply because it is a habit/emotional tie. Rather than looking forward to the games or enjoying them.

Hainan Hibs
02-05-2010, 11:03 PM
I used to be able to see Sauzee and co put on a master-class while showing effort that couldn't be matched, Le God himself losing his front teeth to smash in a goal against the Hearts, the Millenium Derby was to be won at all costs by the players for example.

Now I can see a group of wage thieves who could not give any less of a monkeys if they tried and embarrassing everyone connected with Hibs with some humiliating results.

I'll always support Hibs but it angers me so much when I see players stroll off the park not giving a **** about the disasters that are happening on the pitch. It's happening every week and all the players can do is tell us we don't know anything about football.

Si_17
03-05-2010, 12:12 AM
We may have been ***** last season, but at least there was a bit of fight in the team. Mixu got a team of reserves to beat Hearts at Tynie for Christ's sake! This lot look like they couldn't give a ****, so why should we?

Four hundred quid for a season ticket to watch this ***** next season doesn't really float my boat.

Mikeystewart
03-05-2010, 08:18 AM
I think another problem is from the Mowbray era to the end of collins reign we where spoilt for exciting flare players and players you knew could make a difference to a game. I don't have to list them but i will anyway. Oconnor Thomson Brown Whittaker Murphy Spoule Jones Fletcher Boozy Cauldwel (dont care what anyone says hes better than the guff we have now)

Even Mikey stewart now and then and his goal against the sheep was something special.

With the promise of things only getting better. We all knew things would go down hill when they all left but i (naively) along with others thought re investment in the team would still keep us near to that standard.

I don't know exactly how much collins mixu and yogi has had to spend but i know it was more than mowbray. But my question would be has it been invested well.

under collins a solid no with possible the execption now of thicot but he has been getting a good wage at hibs for a while now and hasnt shown untill recently his worth or mabey that is just down to managers not giving him a chance.

under Mixu i remeber him signinh someone on the basis of watching him in one game on DVD against Brazil in a friendly good one mixu...

under Yogi? jury is still out at least until Xmas if he gets that time.

Si_17
03-05-2010, 11:09 AM
under collins a solid no with possible the execption now of thicot but he has been getting a good wage at hibs for a while now and hasnt shown untill recently his worth or mabey that is just down to managers not giving him a chance.

Thicot was signed by Mixu.

Phil MaGlass
03-05-2010, 11:44 AM
Ive been Hibs daft all my years but the last 2-3 years have had a detrimental effect on me,its not all Hughes fault,its been a mix of Collins, Mixu and Hughes. I even stopped watching it live on the internet.We got beat, I turned off and done something else to while my day away instead of enjoying a Hibs win or decent display. I became disinterested on players not giving 100%, managers who dont know Jack, it is easy for me, I have even stopped coming back to Edinburgh for games, just not worth it. I can watch Hibs for free on the Net and cant be er5ed,and the only result that has bothered me recently is the hertz result and that was to be expected,thats worrying.
I have a season ticket now for my local club who play in Hollands top league, the ST cost me 175 Euro I think around 180quid or so. This team itself are not very skilful but the fans demand 100% fight from their team and thats what they get, if they dont, hundreds of fans are beating down the clubs main doors(I kid you not).
Hibs, my club,have been found wanting in the fight,organisation and spirit department too often over the last few years, that I dont want to give my money to an uninterested bunch of lazy er5ed overpaid oxygen thieves.
I dont want to go to a Hibs game, just for the reason, Im a loyal Hibs fan who should follow his team through thick and thin whatever, there comes a time when enough is enough.
If we scrape into Europe I will more than likely follow,but I wont be holding my breath about going back to ER in the near future.
The only thing that is interesting about anything Hibs just now is Hibsnet.

I do realise this was a thread for people why they should keep going etc.couldnt help masel.

PISTOL1875
03-05-2010, 11:45 AM
Ive been Hibs daft all my years but the last 2-3 years have had a detrimental effect on me,its not all Hughes fault,its been a mix of Collins, Mixu and Hughes. I even stopped watching it live on the internet.We got beat, I turned off and done something else to while my day away instead of enjoying a Hibs win or decent display. I became disinterested on players not giving 100%, managers who dont know Jack, it is easy for me, I have even stopped coming back to Edinburgh for games, just not worth it. I can watch Hibs for free on the Net and cant be er5ed,and the only result that has bothered me recently is the hertz result and that was to be expected,thats worrying.
I have a season ticket now for my local club who play in Hollands top league, the ST cost me 175 Euro I think around 180quid or so. This team itself are not very skilful but the fans demand 100% fight from their team and thats what they get, if they dont, hundreds of fans are beating down the clubs main doors(I kid you not).
Hibs, my club,have been found wanting in the fight,organisation and spirit department too often over the last few years, that I dont want to give my money to an uninterested bunch of lazy er5ed overpaid oxygen thieves.
I dont want to go to a Hibs game, just for the reason, Im a loyal Hibs fan who should follow his team through thick and thin whatever, there comes a time when enough is enough.
If we scrape into Europe I will more than likely follow,but I wont be holding my breath about going back to ER in the near future.
The only thing that is interesting about anything Hibs just now is Hibsnet.

What team is that ???

Phil MaGlass
03-05-2010, 11:47 AM
ADO Den Haag, The Hague

PISTOL1875
03-05-2010, 11:48 AM
ADO Den Haag, The Hague

No worries.. I knew guys who support Gronigen and thought you moight've supported them

Phil MaGlass
03-05-2010, 11:51 AM
Bumped in to a few of the Groningen lads at the Hibs v Rot Weiss Essen game a while back. Tremendous day that.

rightwinger
03-05-2010, 11:52 AM
I'm only 25 but Hibs have never changed and I get the feeling we never will.

I don't ask for much as a Hibs fan - I'd like a good cup run every season or two. Regular European qualification. Regular wins against Hearts (coupled with regular losses - fine). And regular wins against the OF.

I want to see good football but, more importantly, I want to see a team that knows when to play it. I want to see a team that can adapt for a battle when it needs to. I want to see a team that fights harder and gets stronger as the season progresses. A team that stands tall at the business end of the season - win lose or draw. Not a team that wins when it's easy, flatters to deceive for half the season then folds as soon as the crunch time gets near.

I don't mind periods in the doldrums. Highs and lows are fine. My favourite period as a Hibee was when we got relegated, came up, got some great results against Hearts the season after, and challenged for CL football the season after that.

Now it's the same old story every season a la Alex Miller. Do enough early in the season to assure mid-table. Fold after new year and screw up in the SC.

Have you noticed that - when push comes to shove at the business end of the season - Hibs can't be trusted to beat anybody? The only time we ever get a result at this time of year is when it's too little too late.

The SC obviously hurts us all. It would be nice to get to a final every now and again. We'll never even do that if we can't beat County and Dunfermline in the QFs/SFs.

The SC hoodoo mirrors our league form. We get to a certain point. Then the fans start to realise that we're at the point where we always bugger up. They get tetchy and impatient. It feeds through to the players and they duly blow it. An analogy would perhaps be a teenager learning to drive with his dad - the dad is getting exasperated with the son before he's even started the engine because he knows what's probably coming! It's only going to end in tears and recrimination! Like teenagers do to their dads, Hibs condition their support to fear the worst and never fail to deliver. The son has to be strong and only listen to the dad's encouragement. He must be strong enough to block out the negativity. He must work on this to succeed.

Pain is all the more painful psychologically when you can see it all coming.

What Hibs need is a complete change of psyche throughout the club. Hibs tradition? No - that equals failure I'm afraid. Every 'Hibs man' whose managed the club in the last 50 years (with 2 exceptions) has failed. And the eras of Turnbull and Collins are etched with controversy, underachievement and unhappy endings. Turnbull and Collins couldn't get a Hibs team to win a game after March either.

Hibs need a guy with no connection to the club. A tough guy - a winner. A man who can feed off the 'Hibs tradition' when it suits and kick it into touch when he has to. A man who can mix the flair with a bit of fight. A man who can mix the guile with a bit of graft. Mix the hubris with a bit of humility. A man who can lead the team and lead the players - who won't be beholden to the whims of a few luxury fans favourites who let us down as much as the next player. If the ***** of Riordan and Stokes and Benji can't be kicked then the new man should kick them out the door. When we don't get results we go down with a real fight rather than fumbles and excuses. A man who actually instils a tradition that can be followed by a successor when he departs.

That sounds a lot like Craig Levein! Looking at the above, I probably should have been a Dundee Utd fan!

It's not about money or talented players - our managers have had this. No worse than Dundee Utd anyway. It's about ethos and work ethic. It's about creating a structured squad with variety (height, pace, skill, arrogance, humility, strength, technique, brawn, youth, experience, talisman, unsung hero). We don't have that.

Look at the great managers - Stein, Shankly, Ferguson, Mourinho. Or in the SPL years Smith, McLeish, O'Neill. How many of them a):

Had a memorable playing career with the club(s) they managed?
Put out teams that weren't up for a fight?
Pandered to prima donnas?

I'd say Craig Levein fits that criteria too.

If John Hughes is on his way to becoming that type of boss fine. Give him the summer - has he realised what's gone wrong and what he needs to do to put it right? If the same issues arise next season then we'll know he's not the man for the job.

The next Craig Levein? Being realistic it's a tough one. Derek McInnes? More experience - Jimmy Calderwood? Not a huge fan of Calderwood but he could do three things that we should respect - he could get teams into Europe, he could get teams to finish a season strongly, and he could identify when he had to change tactics and change them accordingly.

PISTOL1875
03-05-2010, 11:53 AM
Bumped in to a few of the Groningen lads at the Hibs v Rot Weiss Essen game a while back. Tremendous day that.

They are great bunch of boys.. They were over recently for the St Johnstone game in February.. They had a great time apart from the game but that's common practice nowadays...