PDA

View Full Version : Average Home League Crowds of All Scottish Football Champions since 1946



LHWM
20-04-2010, 03:54 PM
We've put up the 'Average Home League Crowds of All Scottish Football Champions since 1946'

Hibs only team outside the OF to top 30,000.

Hibs have been above Aberdeen for the last 5 years apart from 2008-09.

Inc the OF

http://www.londonhearts.com/charts/avg_l_crowdsOF_files/image001.png

Exc OF

http://www.londonhearts.com/charts/avg_l_crowdsOF_files/image002.png

PaulSmith
20-04-2010, 03:57 PM
Can you change your postings to "I think Hearts are a bigger club than Hibs because....." and just be done with it?

Twa Cairpets
20-04-2010, 04:10 PM
Can you change your postings to "I think Hearts are a bigger club than Hibs because....." and just be done with it?

No need. LHWM puts some interesting stats up and immediately its a yam bash. Hearts do get better attendances than we do, sadly, and the stats prove it. Doesnt mean theyre a bigger club, just have a wider appeal to the intellectually disadvantaged.

What interested me was the fact that this season, even with its apparent drop of in attendances, has only been beaten once (excluding post-Mowbray), since the early-70s.

PaulSmith
20-04-2010, 04:11 PM
No need. LHWM puts some interesting stats up and immediately its a yam bash. Hearts do get better attendances than we do, sadly, and the stats prove it. Doesnt mean theyre a bigger club, just have a wider appeal to the intellectually disadvantaged.

What interested me was the fact that this season, even with its apparent drop of in attendances, has only been beaten once (excluding post-Mowbray), since the early-70s.

I'm sure they'll be available via Kickback if anyone wants to look

greenlex
20-04-2010, 04:16 PM
Other than actual bums on seats its quite interesting to note that the pattern of both Edinburgh clubs almost mirrors each other in peaks and troughs. Except the early 50's and 70's .

Disc O'Dave
20-04-2010, 04:20 PM
No need. LHWM puts some interesting stats up and immediately its a yam bash. Hearts do get better attendances than we do, sadly, and the stats prove it. Doesnt mean theyre a bigger club, just have a wider appeal to the intellectually disadvantaged.

What interested me was the fact that this season, even with its apparent drop of in attendances, has only been beaten once (excluding post-Mowbray), since the early-70s.

To be fair, you don't often (i.e. never) see LHWM post stats that show Hearts in a poorer light than us.

Either;

a) They are superior to us in every way
b) He posts selectively

Interesting they may be, a nice guy he might be, but don't for a minute think he doesn't know exactly what he's doing when posting his stats here.

vanNISHtelroy
20-04-2010, 04:40 PM
Ours aren't that impressive due to emmmm......statistical inaccuracies etc KTID

Cropley10
20-04-2010, 04:50 PM
To be fair, you don't often (i.e. never) see LHWM post stats that show Hearts in a poorer light than us.

Either;

a) They are superior to us in every way
b) He posts selectively

Interesting they may be, a nice guy he might be, but don't for a minute think he doesn't know exactly what he's doing when posting his stats here.
:agree: why chose 1946 on wards.

I simply satisfy myself with the FACT that in my 42 years weve only managed to win 3 trophies whereas HOMFC have still on just 2.

Big Club? My erchie!

Cabbage East
20-04-2010, 04:51 PM
Great stuff :rolleyes:

Phil D. Rolls
20-04-2010, 04:58 PM
I'm sure they'll be available via Kickback if anyone wants to look


To be fair, you don't often (i.e. never) see LHWM post stats that show Hearts in a poorer light than us.

Either;

a) They are superior to us in every way
b) He posts selectively

Interesting they may be, a nice guy he might be, but don't for a minute think he doesn't know exactly what he's doing when posting his stats here.

A bit off there guys. LHWM chips in with stats whenever someone is after them. I, for one, find him an interesting contributor.

LHWM
20-04-2010, 05:18 PM
The raw tab on the website link has the details of every club from 1890

Details of 2009-10 will be updated for non SPL clubs at the end of the season.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

RoxburghHibs
20-04-2010, 06:03 PM
What your "stats" don't show is the actual attendances at the games. Hearts issue tickets sold as apposed to the crowd in the stadium.

So yer stats are baws

RoxburghHibs
20-04-2010, 06:04 PM
To be fair, you don't often (i.e. never) see LHWM post stats that show Hearts in a poorer light than us.

Either;

a) They are superior to us in every way
b) He posts selectively

Interesting they may be, a nice guy he might be, but don't for a minute think he doesn't know exactly what he's doing when posting his stats here.

Agree 100%

His stats are always having a wee dig at Hibs, he's a first class Yam fudd

Disc O'Dave
20-04-2010, 06:08 PM
A bit off there guys. LHWM chips in with stats whenever someone is after them. I, for one, find him an interesting contributor.

Easy Mr Rolls.....:o)

I'm not suggesting he isn't interesting, or that he shouldn't post his stats. By the same token, I'm just a little wary of the LHMW love-in. Take the stats for what they are, a Hearts Fan, posting stats, that seem to show his favoured club to come out on top of our favoured club.

(It seems a bit silly discussing him in the third person when he's on the thread too, I concede)

LHWM
20-04-2010, 06:17 PM
What your "stats" don't show is the actual attendances at the games. Hearts issue tickets sold as apposed to the crowd in the stadium.

So yer stats are baws


Hearts did do it during season 2006-07 (as the Old Firm were doing though Celtic are so embaraased that they are now issuing lower figures. However even those numbers appear inflated. ) which is why I posted the folowing on JKB.


2006-07 16888 100.70% 100.70% <-- The average crowd is 'wrong' as some games counted tickets sold rather than bums on seats

I'm working with the Hearts Historian to get the 'real' figures rather than 'PR figure'.

Incidently the record crowd at Easter Road was probably at least 5,000 bigger. Having spoken to fans of both clubs there was a gate opened that allowed a large number of fans to get in without being counted through the turnstyles.

http://www.londonhearts.com/scores/images/1950/1950010201.jpg

http://www.londonhearts.com/scores/images/1950/1950010202.jpg

Borders Hibby
20-04-2010, 06:28 PM
Hearts did do it during season 2006-07 (as the Old Firm were doing though Celtic are so embaraased that they are now issuing lower figures. However even those numbers appear inflated. ) which is why I posted the folowing on JKB.



I'm working with the Hearts Historian to get the 'real' figures rather than 'PR figure'.

Incidently the record crowd at Easter Road was probably at least 5,000 bigger. Having spoken to fans of both clubs there was a gate opened that allowed a large number of fans to get in without being counted through the turnstyles.

http://www.londonhearts.com/scores/images/1950/1950010201.jpg

http://www.londonhearts.com/scores/images/1950/1950010202.jpg

Who won?

Frogga
20-04-2010, 06:32 PM
Who cares if the stats look a bit better for the Jambos... Its still interesting, especially for folk like me who are too young to know what Scottish football used to be like before it become more business-orientated.

PS- Did we have a 'mare in the late 70's?!

LHWM
20-04-2010, 06:34 PM
Who won?


Full report - Mon 02 Jan 1950 Hibernian 1 Hearts 2. (http://www.londonhearts.com/scores/images/1950/1950010201.htm)

Phil D. Rolls
20-04-2010, 07:08 PM
Easy Mr Rolls.....:o)

I'm not suggesting he isn't interesting, or that he shouldn't post his stats. By the same token, I'm just a little wary of the LHMW love-in. Take the stats for what they are, a Hearts Fan, posting stats, that seem to show his favoured club to come out on top of our favoured club.

(It seems a bit silly discussing him in the third person when he's on the thread too, I concede)

It's done in the right spirit, so I just wanted to stick up for the guy.

BTW, does he take sugar? :greengrin

On the subject of the stats. Dundee haven't been very impressive for many years - if ever.

DH1875
20-04-2010, 08:19 PM
It all a load a rubbish. I rem playing against celtic away in the early - mid 90s and no way there was more than 15,000 at the games.
Herd Rangers only got crowds of 8,000 years ago, don't know how true that is as would have been before my time.

Jonnyboy
20-04-2010, 08:20 PM
It all a load a rubbish. I rem playing against celtic away in the early - mid 90s and no way there was more than 15,000 at the games.
Herd Rangers only got crowds of 8,000 years ago, don't know how true that is as would have been before my time.

There was a time when Rangers attracted only around 4,000 or so to a home match. Pre Souness but it did happen :agree:

Killiehibbie
20-04-2010, 08:27 PM
There was a time when Rangers attracted only around 4,000 or so to a home match. Pre Souness but it did happen :agree:

Early 80's v Raith (maybe) less than 4000 but 40000 huns who swear they were there.

Jonnyboy
20-04-2010, 08:32 PM
Early 80's v Raith (maybe) less than 4000 but 40000 huns who swear they were there.

:greengrin

seanraff07
20-04-2010, 08:32 PM
At least we've had the biggest crowd outwith the OF.:greengrin

Big Frank
20-04-2010, 08:58 PM
To be fair, you don't often (i.e. never) see LHWM post stats that show Hearts in a poorer light than us.

Either;

a) They are superior to us in every way
b) He posts selectively

Interesting they may be, a nice guy he might be, but don't for a minute think he doesn't know exactly what he's doing when posting his stats here.


Absolutely correct.

...but I've grown to like London yam :agree:, and to be fair, moroon tinted or not, he can still post better than some "hibbys".

sahib
20-04-2010, 09:55 PM
It worries me how people can accuse the man of having a go at us through statistics. The facts are the facts, why people argue about who is the biggest club perplexes me. What does it matter? Are you a Hibs supporter because you decided to support the best attended team in Edinburgh and now feel duped? Rise above it folks :greengrin

KWJ
21-04-2010, 03:08 AM
Statsaregreat!

myspaceardoes'twork:(

LHWM
21-04-2010, 05:05 AM
There was a time when Rangers attracted only around 4,000 or so to a home match. Pre Souness but it did happen :agree:

Here are the 'bottom' 10 crowds for the 8 Champions in 'Division 1' since 1946 i.e. excluding any when the sides were out of the Top Tier. Celtic have 'rounded numbers' which may well have been lower than those issued.


1 Wed 28 Mar 1962 Aberdeen 2 Falkirk 2 2642
2 Sat 31 Mar 1962 Aberdeen 3 Kilmarnock 3 3269
3 Sat 19 Apr 1975 Aberdeen 4 Clyde 1 3302
4 Sat 21 Mar 1964 Aberdeen 3 Queen of the South 0 3479
4 Sat 19 Dec 1964 Aberdeen 0 Clyde 3 3479
6 Sat 31 Oct 1964 Aberdeen 2 Falkirk 1 3515
7 Sat 12 Mar 1966 Aberdeen 2 Partick Thistle 1 3793
8 Sat 18 Apr 1964 Aberdeen 0 Dundee United 0 4002
9 Wed 24 Mar 1965 Aberdeen 5 Airdrieonians 2 4220
10 Sat 13 Jan 1962 Aberdeen 1 Airdrieonians 1 4221

1 Mon 29 Apr 1957 Celtic 0 Queen of the South 0 3000
2 Wed 05 Mar 1958 Celtic 4 East Fife 0 4000
2 Mon 07 Apr 1958 Celtic 5 Queens Park 1 4000
2 Wed 30 Apr 1958 Celtic 4 Third Lanark 1 4000
2 Tue 10 Mar 1959 Celtic 1 Airdrieonians 2 4000
2 Mon 30 Apr 1956 Celtic 1 Falkirk 0 4000
7 Tue 24 Apr 1984 Celtic 3 Dundee 0 4596
8 Mon 13 May 1963 Celtic 6 Motherwell 0 4692
9 Wed 09 Apr 1958 Celtic 6 Clyde 2 5000
9 Mon 21 Apr 1958 Celtic 2 Motherwell 2 5000
9 Wed 17 Apr 1957 Celtic 2 St Mirren 3 5000

1 Fri 10 Mar 1967 Dundee 3 Ayr United 0 2251
2 Wed 01 Apr 1970 Dundee 4 Partick Thistle 1 2342
3 Sat 20 Apr 1957 Dundee 0 East Fife 1 2500
4 Wed 03 Dec 1986 Dundee 3 Hamilton Academical 3 2525
5 Sat 25 Apr 1987 Dundee 4 Clydebank[4] 1 2598
6 Sat 07 May 1994 Dundee 4 Hibernian 0 2731
7 Sat 26 Mar 1994 Dundee 3 Kilmarnock 0 2758
8 Sat 05 May 1990 Dundee 1 Motherwell 2 2846
9 Sat 09 Apr 1994 Dundee 0 St Johnstone 1 2871
10 Sat 13 Mar 1993 Dundee 1 Airdrieonians 1 2929

1 Wed 21 Nov 1973 Dundee United 2 Falkirk 1 1302
2 Fri 10 May 1974 Dundee United 4 Morton 2 1437
3 Wed 05 Apr 1967 Dundee United 4 Falkirk 4 1815
4 Mon 25 Mar 1968 Dundee United 1 Airdrieonians 0 2054
5 Sat 03 Apr 1971 Dundee United 4 Cowdenbeath 2 2396
6 Wed 24 Apr 1974 Dundee United 1 Partick Thistle 1 2626
7 Wed 22 Apr 1970 Dundee United 1 Dunfermline Athletic 3 2727
8 Wed 26 Apr 1978 Dundee United 3 Ayr United 1 2735
9 Sat 06 Oct 1973 Dundee United 4 Clyde 0 2817
10 Wed 11 Mar 1970 Dundee United 3 Clyde 1 2850

1 Wed 19 Apr 1967 Heart Of Midlothian 5 Stirling Albion 1 1846
2 Sat 04 Apr 1981 Heart Of Midlothian 1 Kilmarnock 0 1866
3 Mon 07 May 1979 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Morton 1 2253
4 Sat 18 Apr 1981 Heart Of Midlothian 1 St Mirren 2 2649
5 Sat 28 Feb 1981 Heart Of Midlothian 1 Partick Thistle 1 3491
6 Sat 28 Mar 1981 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Dundee United 4 3786
7 Sat 17 Apr 1971 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Motherwell 1 4305
8 Sat 21 Apr 1973 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Airdrieonians 1 4328
9 Sat 21 Jan 1967 Heart Of Midlothian 1 Ayr United 0 4351
10 Mon 24 Mar 1969 Heart Of Midlothian 2 Morton 2 4539

1 Wed 23 Mar 1955 Hibernian 4 Stirling Albion 1 875
2 Mon 05 May 1980 Hibernian 0 Partick Thistle 1 1191
3 Wed 04 Apr 1962 Hibernian 2 St Mirren 1 1508
4 Tue 29 Apr 1980 Hibernian 2 St Mirren 1 2590
5 Wed 29 Feb 1984 Hibernian 3 Dundee 1 2601
6 Sat 08 Dec 1984 Hibernian 2 St Mirren 3 2631
7 Mon 21 Apr 1980 Hibernian 1 Kilmarnock 2 2659
8 Wed 20 Apr 1977 Hibernian 2 Ayr United 0 2835
9 Sat 28 Apr 1962 Hibernian 3 Stirling Albion 1 2942
10 Sat 08 May 1982 Hibernian 1 Partick Thistle 1 3118

1 Wed 15 Apr 1981 Kilmarnock 0 Morton 0 973
2 Wed 27 Apr 1983 Kilmarnock 2 St Mirren 2 1049
3 Sat 14 May 1983 Kilmarnock 1 Motherwell 1 1203
4 Sat 19 Mar 1983 Kilmarnock 4 Morton 0 1230
5 Sat 18 Apr 1981 Kilmarnock 0 Partick Thistle 1 1262
6 Tue 24 Mar 1981 Kilmarnock 2 Heart Of Midlothian 0 1445
7 Wed 20 Apr 1977 Kilmarnock 1 Partick Thistle 3 1543
8 Sat 30 Apr 1977 Kilmarnock 1 Dundee United 2 1643
9 Sat 12 Feb 1983 Kilmarnock 0 Dundee United 5 1834
10 Sat 28 Mar 1981 Kilmarnock 0 Airdrieonians 1 1849

1 Wed 05 May 1982 Rangers 3 St Mirren 0 4765
2 Wed 24 Mar 1965 Rangers 2 St Johnstone 1 5671
3 Wed 31 Mar 1982 Rangers 1 Airdrieonians 0 5681
4 Mon 01 May 1972 Rangers 4 Ayr United 2 5869
5 Thu 27 Apr 1972 Rangers 3 Dunfermline Athletic 4 6021
6 Wed 23 May 1979 Rangers 1 Partick Thistle 0 6087
7 Wed 01 Apr 1981 Rangers 4 Morton 0 6216
8 Mon 28 Apr 1969 Rangers 1 Dundee 1 6821
9 Sat 08 May 1982 Rangers 4 Dundee 0 7052
10 Wed 02 May 1984 Rangers 2 Dundee United 2 7354

LHWM
21-04-2010, 05:11 AM
Here are the Top 10s

I had no idea that Rangers vs Hibs was the only crowd over 100,000 post 1946


1 Sat 03 Apr 1948 Aberdeen 1 Rangers 1 44414
2 Sat 12 Feb 1949 Aberdeen 0 Rangers 2 42000
2 Sat 03 Feb 1951 Aberdeen 2 Rangers 4 42000
4 Wed 13 Aug 1947 Aberdeen 0 Hibernian 2 40000
5 Sat 29 Oct 1949 Aberdeen 1 Rangers 3 38000
5 Sat 09 Oct 1954 Aberdeen 0 Celtic 2 38000
5 Sat 07 Jan 1956 Aberdeen 1 Celtic 0 38000
8 Sat 27 Oct 1962 Aberdeen 2 Rangers 3 37750
9 Sat 17 Apr 1971 Aberdeen 1 Celtic 1 36000
10 Sat 20 Feb 1971 Aberdeen 0 Rangers 0 35251

1 Tue 02 Jan 1968 Celtic 2 Rangers 2 73480
2 Sat 03 Jan 1970 Celtic 0 Rangers 0 72265
3 Sat 08 Sep 1962 Celtic 0 Rangers 1 71116
4 Sat 12 Sep 1970 Celtic 2 Rangers 0 70656
5 Sat 14 Sep 1968 Celtic 2 Rangers 4 69561
6 Mon 03 Jan 1972 Celtic 2 Rangers 1 66751
7 Mon 02 Jan 1950 Celtic 1 Rangers 1 65000
7 Fri 01 Jan 1954 Celtic 1 Rangers 0 65000
9 Sat 06 Nov 1971 Celtic 1 Aberdeen 1 62236
10 Sat 23 Apr 1988 Celtic 3 Dundee 0 61927

1 Mon 03 Jan 1949 Dundee 3 Rangers 1 39975
2 Sat 30 Dec 1950 Dundee 2 Rangers 0 37400
3 Sat 22 Oct 1949 Dundee 3 Celtic 0 35000
4 Wed 14 Mar 1962 Dundee 0 Rangers 0 34208
5 Sat 23 Sep 1950 Dundee 2 Aberdeen 0 34000
5 Sat 24 Oct 1953 Dundee 1 Rangers 0 34000
7 Sat 07 Jan 1950 Dundee 3 Heart Of Midlothian 1 33500
8 Wed 21 Aug 1963 Dundee 1 Rangers 1 33283
9 Sat 19 Mar 1949 Dundee 4 Hibernian 3 32500
10 Mon 02 Jan 1950 Dundee 1 Aberdeen 1 32000
10 Mon 17 Apr 1950 Dundee 0 Rangers 1 32000
10 Sat 20 Oct 1951 Dundee 2 Celtic 1 32000
10 Sat 05 Jan 1952 Dundee 3 Heart Of Midlothian 3 32000

1 Sat 21 Apr 1979 Dundee United 1 Rangers 2 24264
2 Sat 11 Feb 1989 Dundee United 1 Rangers 1 22009
3 Wed 02 Jan 1985 Dundee United 2 Aberdeen 1 21944
4 Sat 10 Nov 1962 Dundee United 2 Rangers 1 21391
5 Mon 03 Jan 1966 Dundee United 2 Dundee 1 21325
6 Sat 21 Mar 1987 Dundee United 0 Rangers 1 21278
7 Thu 02 Jan 1964 Dundee United 2 Dundee 1 21255
8 Mon 09 Apr 1962 Dundee United 1 Dundee 2 21138
9 Sat 27 Feb 1988 Dundee United 1 Rangers 1 20846
10 Tue 27 Sep 1988 Dundee United 0 Rangers 1 20800

1 Sat 17 Mar 1956 Heart Of Midlothian 1 Rangers 1 50000
2 Sat 13 Apr 1957 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Rangers 1 49000
2 Sat 20 Feb 1954 Heart Of Midlothian 3 Rangers 3 49000
2 Sat 01 Jan 1955 Heart Of Midlothian 5 Hibernian 1 49000
5 Sat 20 Sep 1947 Heart Of Midlothian 2 Hibernian 1 47752
6 Sat 19 Jan 1952 Heart Of Midlothian 2 Rangers 2 47684
7 Sat 06 Feb 1954 Heart Of Midlothian 3 Celtic 2 47519
8 Sat 21 Jan 1950 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Rangers 1 46285
9 Sat 01 Jan 1949 Heart Of Midlothian 3 Hibernian 2 45030
10 Sat 19 Sep 1953 Heart Of Midlothian 4 Hibernian 0 45000
10 Sat 24 Sep 1955 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Hibernian 1 45000
10 Sat 05 Mar 1960 Heart Of Midlothian 2 Rangers 0 45000

1 Mon 02 Jan 1950 Hibernian 1 Heart Of Midlothian 2 65840
2 Mon 02 Jan 1956 Hibernian 2 Heart Of Midlothian 2 60812
3 Sat 17 Jan 1953 Hibernian 1 Rangers 1 60500
4 Sat 03 Nov 1951 Hibernian 1 Rangers 1 55000
5 Fri 01 Jan 1960 Hibernian 1 Heart Of Midlothian 5 54000
6 Sat 31 Jan 1948 Hibernian 1 Rangers 0 52750
7 Sat 05 Nov 1949 Hibernian 1 Rangers 0 51500
8 Sat 19 Feb 1949 Hibernian 0 Rangers 1 50000
8 Sat 20 Sep 1952 Hibernian 3 Heart Of Midlothian 1 50000
10 Wed 01 Jan 1958 Hibernian 0 Heart Of Midlothian 2 49200

1 Sat 04 Jan 1969 Kilmarnock 3 Rangers 3 32893
2 Thu 02 Jan 1947 Kilmarnock 0 Rangers 2 32325
3 Sat 14 Nov 1964 Kilmarnock 1 Rangers 1 32021
4 Sat 11 Feb 1967 Kilmarnock 1 Rangers 2 31551
5 Sat 01 Apr 1961 Kilmarnock 2 Rangers 0 29528
6 Sat 01 Jan 1955 Kilmarnock 1 St Mirren 1 27992
7 Sat 16 Nov 1963 Kilmarnock 1 Rangers 1 27624
8 Sat 03 Dec 1966 Kilmarnock 0 Celtic 0 27136
9 Sat 16 Apr 1960 Kilmarnock 1 Rangers 1 26925
10 Sat 19 Mar 1960 Kilmarnock 2 Heart Of Midlothian 1 26584

1 Sat 29 Apr 1950 Rangers 0 Hibernian 0 115000
2 Sat 01 Jan 1949 Rangers 4 Celtic 0 95000
3 Sat 16 Sep 1967 Rangers 1 Celtic 0 87595
4 Sat 22 Sep 1951 Rangers 1 Celtic 1 86000
5 Thu 02 Jan 1969 Rangers 1 Celtic 0 85341
6 Wed 01 Jan 1947 Rangers 1 Celtic 1 85000
7 Sat 20 Sep 1969 Rangers 0 Celtic 1 84140
8 Sat 02 Jan 1971 Rangers 1 Celtic 1 80453
9 Sat 04 Nov 1950 Rangers 1 Hibernian 1 80000
10 Mon 02 Jan 1961 Rangers 2 Celtic 1 79000

LHWM
21-04-2010, 05:16 AM
That crowd of 115,000 was the 'League Decider' which does explain it.

http://www.londonhearts.com/scores/images/1950/1950042901.jpg

http://www.londonhearts.com/scores/images/1950/1950042902.jpg

http://www.londonhearts.com/scores/images/1950/1950042903.jpg

LHWM
21-04-2010, 05:33 AM
Extending the 'Top 10s' to include Pre WWII

That crowd of 115,000 was only beaten once and Hibs have no 'large' crowds pre WWII due to the limited capacity pre WWII I presume.



1 Sat 20 Sep 1930 Celtic 2 Rangers 0 83500
1 Sat 01 Jan 1938 Celtic 3 Rangers 0 83500
3 Thu 01 Jan 1914 Celtic 4 Rangers 0 83000
4 Thu 01 Jan 1920 Celtic 1 Rangers 1 80000
5 Sat 10 Sep 1938 Celtic 6 Rangers 2 74500
10 Mon 02 Jan 1928 Celtic 1 Rangers 0 70000
10 Mon 01 Jan 1912 Celtic 3 Rangers 0 70000

2 Sat 05 Nov 1921 Dundee 0 Rangers 0 39000

2 Sat 30 Nov 1929 Dundee United 1 St Johnstone 1 23517

2 Sat 03 Sep 1938 Heart Of Midlothian 1 Celtic 5 49905
6 Sat 15 Sep 1928 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Rangers 1 48000

5 Sat 29 Dec 1928 Kilmarnock 1 Rangers 3 30000

1 Mon 02 Jan 1939 Rangers 2 Celtic 1 118567
4 Fri 01 Jan 1937 Rangers 1 Celtic 0 94811
10 Thu 01 Jan 1931 Rangers 1 Celtic 0 83500

LHWM
21-04-2010, 05:37 AM
The crowd numbers come from David Ross author of the magnificent 'Roar of the Crowd' (http://www.argyllbookstore.co.uk/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=57). Which explains the discrepency in the reported crowd of 101,000 and the figure of 115,000.

LHWM
21-04-2010, 05:51 AM
Excluding the OF; Hibs and Hearts dominate the Top 50 league crowds. I don't remember anything about no 45 in the list.

1 Mon 02 Jan 1950 Hibernian 1 Heart Of Midlothian 2 65840
2 Mon 02 Jan 1956 Hibernian 2 Heart Of Midlothian 2 60812

3 Fri 01 Jan 1960 Hibernian 1 Heart Of Midlothian 5 54000
4 Sat 20 Sep 1952 Hibernian 3 Heart Of Midlothian 1 50000

5 Wed 01 Jan 1958 Hibernian 0 Heart Of Midlothian 2 49200
6 Sat 01 Jan 1955 Heart Of Midlothian 5 Hibernian 1 49000
7 Fri 01 Jan 1954 Hibernian 1 Heart Of Midlothian 2 48000
8 Sat 20 Sep 1947 Heart Of Midlothian 2 Hibernian 1 47752
9 Mon 20 Apr 1953 Hibernian 2 East Fife 1 47000
10 Mon 02 Jan 1939 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Hibernian 1 45061
11 Sat 01 Jan 1949 Heart Of Midlothian 3 Hibernian 2 45030
12 Thu 01 Jan 1948 Hibernian 3 Heart Of Midlothian 1 45000
12 Sat 24 Sep 1955 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Hibernian 1 45000
12 Sat 19 Sep 1953 Heart Of Midlothian 4 Hibernian 0 45000

15 Sat 23 Sep 1950 Hibernian 0 Heart Of Midlothian 1 44976
16 Sat 22 Sep 1951 Heart Of Midlothian 1 Hibernian 1 44842
17 Mon 02 Jan 1961 Heart Of Midlothian 1 Hibernian 2 43000
18 Sat 18 Sep 1954 Hibernian 2 Heart Of Midlothian 3 42000
18 Sat 13 Jan 1951 Hibernian 3 Motherwell 1 42000
20 Mon 01 Jan 1951 Heart Of Midlothian 2 Hibernian 1 41832
21 Thu 01 Jan 1953 Heart Of Midlothian 1 Hibernian 2 41085
22 Sat 10 Sep 1960 Hibernian 1 Heart Of Midlothian 4 40000
22 Sat 17 Nov 1951 Hibernian 4 East Fife 2 40000
22 Tue 02 Jan 1951 Hibernian 6 Aberdeen 2 40000
22 Sat 21 Aug 1948 Hibernian 3 Heart Of Midlothian 1 40000
22 Sat 14 Aug 1948 Hibernian 5 East Fife 2 40000
22 Sat 05 Sep 1959 Heart Of Midlothian 2 Hibernian 2 40000
22 Sat 08 Sep 1945 Heart of Midlothian 0 Hibernian 2 40000
22 Wed 13 Aug 1947 Aberdeen 0 Hibernian 2 40000

30 Sat 08 Jan 1949 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Dundee 1 39389
31 Sat 22 Sep 1956 Hibernian 2 Heart Of Midlothian 3 39000
31 Tue 01 Jan 1952 Hibernian 2 Heart Of Midlothian 3 39000
31 Sat 07 Sep 1946 Hibernian 0 Heart Of Midlothian 1 39000
34 Fri 01 Jan 1937 Heart Of Midlothian 3 Hibernian 2 38908
35 Sat 24 Sep 1949 Heart Of Midlothian 5 Hibernian 2 37730
36 Sat 01 Jan 1938 Hibernian 2 Heart Of Midlothian 2 37606
37 Sat 19 Oct 1929 Heart Of Midlothian 2 Aberdeen 2 37500
38 Wed 01 Jan 1936 Hibernian 1 Heart Of Midlothian 1 37306
39 Sat 24 Apr 1965 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Kilmarnock 2 37275
40 Thu 01 Jan 1970 Hibernian 0 Heart Of Midlothian 0 36421
41 Fri 01 Jan 1965 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Hibernian 1 36297
42 Sat 01 Jan 1972 Hibernian 0 Heart Of Midlothian 0 36046
43 Sat 12 Mar 1955 Heart Of Midlothian 2 Aberdeen 0 36000
43 Mon 02 Jan 1928 Heart Of Midlothian 2 Hibernian 2 36000
45 Mon 01 Jan 1973 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Hibernian 7 35989
46 Wed 01 Jan 1975 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Hibernian 0 35969
47 Tue 01 Jan 1974 Hibernian 3 Heart Of Midlothian 1 35393
48 Mon 02 Jan 1950 St Mirren 1 Motherwell 1 35000
48 Thu 01 Jan 1959 Heart Of Midlothian 1 Hibernian 3 35000
48 Sat 19 Oct 1957 Heart Of Midlothian 4 Aberdeen 0 35000
48 Tue 01 Jan 1957 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Hibernian 2 35000
48 Sat 08 Dec 1956 Heart Of Midlothian 3 Motherwell 2 35000
48 Sat 04 Sep 1948 Aberdeen 1 Hibernian 2 35000
48 Sat 28 Aug 1948 Aberdeen 2 Motherwell 0 35000

Phil D. Rolls
21-04-2010, 07:35 AM
It worries me how people can accuse the man of having a go at us through statistics. The facts are the facts, why people argue about who is the biggest club perplexes me. What does it matter? Are you a Hibs supporter because you decided to support the best attended team in Edinburgh and now feel duped? Rise above it folks :greengrin

If anything, the whole big team/wee team myth is shown up for what it is. Yes, they have had bigger crowds than us - any fool who's followed Hibs for any length of time appreciates that.

However, the gap between us an Hearts is nothing like the gap between Hearts, the Sheep, and the OF. In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is king.

What is significant is the fact that we are so close to them when they had such an advantage over us, up until WW2. The real story of Hibs isn't that they are smaller than Hearts. It's the fact that we have more or less caught them up, and at times surpassed them in innovation and competitive spirit.

Hearts should have buried us years ago, but they couldn't. Our existence reminds them of how far they have fallen from their self appointed position of grace.

erskine-hibby
21-04-2010, 07:52 AM
Excluding the OF; Hibs and Hearts dominate the Top 50 league crowds. I don't remember anything about no 45 in the list.
1 Mon 02 Jan 1950 Hibernian 1 Heart Of Midlothian 2 65840
2 Mon 02 Jan 1956 Hibernian 2 Heart Of Midlothian 2 60812

3 Fri 01 Jan 1960 Hibernian 1 Heart Of Midlothian 5 54000
4 Sat 20 Sep 1952 Hibernian 3 Heart Of Midlothian 1 50000

5 Wed 01 Jan 1958 Hibernian 0 Heart Of Midlothian 2 49200
6 Sat 01 Jan 1955 Heart Of Midlothian 5 Hibernian 1 49000
7 Fri 01 Jan 1954 Hibernian 1 Heart Of Midlothian 2 48000
8 Sat 20 Sep 1947 Heart Of Midlothian 2 Hibernian 1 47752
9 Mon 20 Apr 1953 Hibernian 2 East Fife 1 47000
10 Mon 02 Jan 1939 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Hibernian 1 45061
11 Sat 01 Jan 1949 Heart Of Midlothian 3 Hibernian 2 45030
12 Thu 01 Jan 1948 Hibernian 3 Heart Of Midlothian 1 45000
12 Sat 24 Sep 1955 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Hibernian 1 45000
12 Sat 19 Sep 1953 Heart Of Midlothian 4 Hibernian 0 45000

15 Sat 23 Sep 1950 Hibernian 0 Heart Of Midlothian 1 44976
16 Sat 22 Sep 1951 Heart Of Midlothian 1 Hibernian 1 44842
17 Mon 02 Jan 1961 Heart Of Midlothian 1 Hibernian 2 43000
18 Sat 18 Sep 1954 Hibernian 2 Heart Of Midlothian 3 42000
18 Sat 13 Jan 1951 Hibernian 3 Motherwell 1 42000
20 Mon 01 Jan 1951 Heart Of Midlothian 2 Hibernian 1 41832
21 Thu 01 Jan 1953 Heart Of Midlothian 1 Hibernian 2 41085
22 Sat 10 Sep 1960 Hibernian 1 Heart Of Midlothian 4 40000
22 Sat 17 Nov 1951 Hibernian 4 East Fife 2 40000
22 Tue 02 Jan 1951 Hibernian 6 Aberdeen 2 40000
22 Sat 21 Aug 1948 Hibernian 3 Heart Of Midlothian 1 40000
22 Sat 14 Aug 1948 Hibernian 5 East Fife 2 40000
22 Sat 05 Sep 1959 Heart Of Midlothian 2 Hibernian 2 40000
22 Sat 08 Sep 1945 Heart of Midlothian 0 Hibernian 2 40000
22 Wed 13 Aug 1947 Aberdeen 0 Hibernian 2 40000

30 Sat 08 Jan 1949 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Dundee 1 39389
31 Sat 22 Sep 1956 Hibernian 2 Heart Of Midlothian 3 39000
31 Tue 01 Jan 1952 Hibernian 2 Heart Of Midlothian 3 39000
31 Sat 07 Sep 1946 Hibernian 0 Heart Of Midlothian 1 39000
34 Fri 01 Jan 1937 Heart Of Midlothian 3 Hibernian 2 38908
35 Sat 24 Sep 1949 Heart Of Midlothian 5 Hibernian 2 37730
36 Sat 01 Jan 1938 Hibernian 2 Heart Of Midlothian 2 37606
37 Sat 19 Oct 1929 Heart Of Midlothian 2 Aberdeen 2 37500
38 Wed 01 Jan 1936 Hibernian 1 Heart Of Midlothian 1 37306
39 Sat 24 Apr 1965 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Kilmarnock 2 37275
40 Thu 01 Jan 1970 Hibernian 0 Heart Of Midlothian 0 36421
41 Fri 01 Jan 1965 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Hibernian 1 36297
42 Sat 01 Jan 1972 Hibernian 0 Heart Of Midlothian 0 36046
43 Sat 12 Mar 1955 Heart Of Midlothian 2 Aberdeen 0 36000
43 Mon 02 Jan 1928 Heart Of Midlothian 2 Hibernian 2 36000
45 Mon 01 Jan 1973 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Hibernian 7 35989
46 Wed 01 Jan 1975 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Hibernian 0 35969
47 Tue 01 Jan 1974 Hibernian 3 Heart Of Midlothian 1 35393
48 Mon 02 Jan 1950 St Mirren 1 Motherwell 1 35000
48 Thu 01 Jan 1959 Heart Of Midlothian 1 Hibernian 3 35000
48 Sat 19 Oct 1957 Heart Of Midlothian 4 Aberdeen 0 35000
48 Tue 01 Jan 1957 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Hibernian 2 35000
48 Sat 08 Dec 1956 Heart Of Midlothian 3 Motherwell 2 35000
48 Sat 04 Sep 1948 Aberdeen 1 Hibernian 2 35000
48 Sat 28 Aug 1948 Aberdeen 2 Motherwell 0 35000


I do:notworthy:

Phil D. Rolls
21-04-2010, 08:02 AM
I do:notworthy:

If you remember it, you weren't there. :cool2:

basehibby
21-04-2010, 08:36 AM
To be fair, you don't often (i.e. never) see LHWM post stats that show Hearts in a poorer light than us.

Either;

a) They are superior to us in every way
b) He posts selectively

Interesting they may be, a nice guy he might be, but don't for a minute think he doesn't know exactly what he's doing when posting his stats here.

That's cobblers!

the vast majority of LHWM's stats show the bare facts - he often posts stats showing historical data re Hibs' performance in a particular fixture(not necessarily the derby) or on a particular date - so how on earth could that be intended as a dig???

Unfortunately, the Yams have a markedly better derby record and marginally better crowd figures on average - so that is bound to show up on any figures about derbys or attendances.

Personally I like his contributions and wouldn't like to see him discouraged by oversensitive Hibees seeing phantom digs where there are none.

basehibby
21-04-2010, 08:44 AM
One interesting thing about the stats is the steady upward trend in the Hibs crowds since what was something of a nadir in the early 80's.

If that trend is continued (which we can realisticaly hope for given a newly upgraded capacity) then we can expect to break through the 15,000 average mark in the next 5 years or so.

The stats also show, unsurprisingly, that crowds will rise sharply with any significant improvement in performance of the team on the pitch - over to you then Yogi!

LHWM
21-04-2010, 09:06 AM
One interesting thing about the stats is the steady upward trend in the Hibs crowds since what was something of a nadir in the early 80's.

If that trend is continued (which we can realisticaly hope for given a newly upgraded capacity) then we can expect to break through the 15,000 average mark in the next 5 years or so.

The stats also show, unsurprisingly, that crowds will rise sharply with any significant improvement in performance of the team on the pitch - over to you then Yogi!

The introduction of all seated stadiums has helped Hibs and Hearts via the need to get a season ticket so you can be beside your mates. So unlike in the past if the team was playing crap you just wouldn't go. Whilst some season ticket holders might not go (as per 2006-07 with hearts when they were reporting crowds of about 2000 higher), the majority will go along. This ensures that the minimum crowds are higher than they would have been pre all seating .

It will be interesting to see how Celtic's ST sales bear up next season and if their average goes back down to 50000 say.

Kilmarnock look to be in a perilous state if they go down.


The graphs also show what

HIBERNIAN-0762
21-04-2010, 09:09 AM
What your "stats" don't show is the actual attendances at the games. Hearts issue tickets sold as apposed to the crowd in the stadium.

So yer stats are baws

What he said

FACT!

:agree:

Phil D. Rolls
21-04-2010, 09:26 AM
What he said

FACT!

:agree:

See the post above you mate. He's put the record straight.

CheesyHibby
21-04-2010, 10:09 AM
imagine if we could get higher than 30,000 as an average, that would be quite summat.

Phil MaGlass
21-04-2010, 11:39 AM
Thing is attendances dont mean squat,hertz/sellik manipulate season ticket attendances,if hertz sell 10,000ST,s then they will roughly say every game they have 11,000, when the whole world and their dug knows hertz crowds have been pi5h this season,the 10,000 just have not been turning up (and thats from hertz mates telling me). I will say it again "attendances dont mean squat".

sorry, just noticed Roxburghhibs has mentioned the same thing.

erskine-hibby
21-04-2010, 01:19 PM
If you remember it, you weren't there. :cool2:

Oh but I was and I remember it very well:greengrin

dangermouse
21-04-2010, 01:24 PM
imagine if we could get higher than 30,000 as an average, that would be quite summat.

A bit difficult when our new stadium will only hold just over 20K

Twa Cairpets
21-04-2010, 01:27 PM
To be fair, you don't often (i.e. never) see LHWM post stats that show Hearts in a poorer light than us.

Either;

a) They are superior to us in every way
b) He posts selectively

Interesting they may be, a nice guy he might be, but don't for a minute think he doesn't know exactly what he's doing when posting his stats here.

Ridiculous. I dont know LHWM, so cant vouch whether or not he is a nice guy. Looking at stats - even if they do show Hearts have a bigger theoretical gate than us - gives a basis for discussion, not a basis for "he's a yam fud, therefore everything he is says is wrong and has an agenda".

And by the way, whether or not they count STs as attendances or not at the minute, im sure we have in the past too. And even the most blinkered of us if we've been going to watch football for a few years (in my case since the early seventies at ER, and a ST holder for the last 15 years) could dispute that they have had bigger attendances, in the main, than we have.

This does not mean they are a big or bigger club - that is complete yamfuddery of the highest order. I think by any sensible review, Hibs and Hearts are exactly the same size: relatively big, underperfoming fish in a very small pond.

Long suffering
21-04-2010, 04:02 PM
this might be pushing it a bit, but is it possible LHWM, to provide me with an avarage attendance since say 1900s to the present day, for hearts aberdeen and hibs?

WindyMiller
21-04-2010, 04:19 PM
Ridiculous. I dont know LHWM, so cant vouch whether or not he is a nice guy. Looking at stats - even if they do show Hearts have a bigger theoretical gate than us - gives a basis for discussion, not a basis for "he's a yam fud, therefore everything he is says is wrong and has an agenda".

And by the way, whether or not they count STs as attendances or not at the minute, im sure we have in the past too. And even the most blinkered of us if we've been going to watch football for a few years (in my case since the early seventies at ER, and a ST holder for the last 15 years) could dispute that they have had bigger attendances, in the main, than we have.

This does not mean they are a big or bigger club - that is complete yamfuddery of the highest order. I think by any sensible review, Hibs and Hearts are exactly the same size: relatively big, underperfoming fish in a very small pond.

I went to many games in the 70's and IMO the crowd was often considerably higher than annnounced, "Director's Turnstyle" was often quoted by my elders.
There were also a great many laddies, like my self, who got a lift over. Possibly as much as 5% could be added to account for the youngsters.

noseyhibby
21-04-2010, 04:20 PM
Well done London Hearts for these impressive stats.
I for one actually enjoy your posts and am man enough to rationalise them and not resort to the classic "yam fud" accusations.

HibbyAndy
21-04-2010, 04:46 PM
well done london hearts for these impressive stats.
I for one actually enjoy your posts and am man enough to rationalise them and not resort to the classic "yam fud" accusations.

ltyf.

Disc O'Dave
21-04-2010, 04:55 PM
Ridiculous. I dont know LHWM, so cant vouch whether or not he is a nice guy. Looking at stats - even if they do show Hearts have a bigger theoretical gate than us - gives a basis for discussion, not a basis for "he's a yam fud, therefore everything he is says is wrong and has an agenda".

And by the way, whether or not they count STs as attendances or not at the minute, im sure we have in the past too. And even the most blinkered of us if we've been going to watch football for a few years (in my case since the early seventies at ER, and a ST holder for the last 15 years) could dispute that they have had bigger attendances, in the main, than we have.

This does not mean they are a big or bigger club - that is complete yamfuddery of the highest order. I think by any sensible review, Hibs and Hearts are exactly the same size: relatively big, underperfoming fish in a very small pond.

Why is my opinion more ridiculous than yours?

Where did I call anyone a "Yam Fud"?

Where did I make any points about counting season tickets or not?

I thought I put my opinion across in a fairly polite and sensible way - I suggested he might well be a nice guy, I also suggest he is bright enough to know what his stats suggest, and that this is a Hibs supporters board - which I consider slightly more respectful than calling anyone a "Yam Fud" thank you very much.

Or is "discussion" only allowed if it tallys with your opinion?

LHWM
21-04-2010, 06:13 PM
this might be pushing it a bit, but is it possible LHWM, to provide me with an avarage attendance since say 1900s to the present day, for hearts aberdeen and hibs?

The data is all there on the 'raw' tab I'll add it to a graph.

http://www.londonhearts.com/charts/avg_l_crowdsOF_files/image006.png

Andy74
21-04-2010, 06:19 PM
Hearts fans seem obsessed with stats. An inferiority complex thing I think. They are notcquite sure why they aren't happier with themselves even though they seem a bigger club and so they keep trying to comfort themselves with something.

sahib
21-04-2010, 06:51 PM
If anything, the whole big team/wee team myth is shown up for what it is. Yes, they have had bigger crowds than us - any fool who's followed Hibs for any length of time appreciates that.

However, the gap between us an Hearts is nothing like the gap between Hearts, the Sheep, and the OF. In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is king.

What is significant is the fact that we are so close to them when they had such an advantage over us, up until WW2. The real story of Hibs isn't that they are smaller than Hearts. It's the fact that we have more or less caught them up, and at times surpassed them in innovation and competitive spirit.

Hearts should have buried us years ago, but they couldn't. Our existence reminds them of how far they have fallen from their self appointed position of grace.



The gap between the clubs is not so large, that a period of Hibs being relatively more successful, would see our attendances beat theirs. All things being roughly equal performance wise, then I would expect Hearts to have the larger crowds. Assuming both clubs are getting about the same conversion rate for supporters who actually go then Hearts with (I think) the larger fan base would have the bigger crowds.

RoxburghHibs
21-04-2010, 07:22 PM
Hearts fans seem obsessed with stats. An inferiority complex thing I think. They are notcquite sure why they aren't happier with themselves even though they seem a bigger club and so they keep trying to comfort themselves with something.

I think you've hit the nail on the head mate. The ONLY reason this Yam is posting/compiling these stats, is to show Hearts in a better light than Hibs and Aberdeen.

If Hearts stats were not as good as Hibernian's, do you really think he'd spend so much time on them and be so keen to tell anyone who will listen.

I think not

That old saying stats, stats and more lies

tony higgins
21-04-2010, 07:58 PM
It all a load a rubbish. I rem playing against celtic away in the early - mid 90s and no way there was more than 15,000 at the games.
Herd Rangers only got crowds of 8,000 years ago, don't know how true that is as would have been before my time.

Crowds collapsed in the early 1980s due to very high unemployment figures in Scotland.

LHWM
21-04-2010, 08:13 PM
Crowds collapsed in the early 1980s due to very high unemployment figures in Scotland.

One reason, However

the success of the 'New Firm'
the decline of Hearts and Hibs (relegation(s) etc)
the failure of the 'Old Firm' (they didn't want to watch crap)

were other factors as well.

Long suffering
21-04-2010, 08:50 PM
The data is all there on the 'raw' tab I'll add it to a graph.

http://www.londonhearts.com/charts/avg_l_crowdsOF_files/image006.png

thanks very much:thumbsup:

Long suffering
21-04-2010, 08:55 PM
The data is all there on the 'raw' tab I'll add it to a graph.

http://www.londonhearts.com/charts/avg_l_crowdsOF_files/image006.png

what do you mean raw tab?

LHWM
21-04-2010, 09:46 PM
what do you mean raw tab?

The bottotm left hand row on the web page (http://www.londonhearts.com/charts/avg_l_crowdsOF.htm)

Click on the individual tabs to see different charts and the tables.

tony higgins
22-04-2010, 06:10 AM
One reason, However

the success of the 'New Firm'
the decline of Hearts and Hibs (relegation(s) etc)
the failure of the 'Old Firm' (they didn't want to watch crap)
were other factors as well.

Correcto.

Dashing Bob S
22-04-2010, 07:05 AM
We have a bigger support than the self-styled 'wee fitba team'. As the graph shows, when we are playing very well and have an attacking, expansive winning team, we will always get more fans than Hearts because more people want to see football played that way.

All the big postwar attendances in Edinburgh have been at ER.

We always have a more discerning support, when we aren't playing decent football or fans will vote with their feet rather than Yams who will stick around and watch any garbage.

JackRegan
22-04-2010, 08:00 AM
One reason, However

the success of the 'New Firm'
the decline of Hearts and Hibs (relegation(s) etc)
the failure of the 'Old Firm' (they didn't want to watch crap)

were other factors as well.

:confused:

Failure of Rangers more like - we won two titles in the early 80's and lost one on the last day in 1983.


Corwds for games were lumpy, fans used to pick and chose tehir games more as this was before the Season Ticket culture.

JackRegan
22-04-2010, 08:01 AM
We have a bigger support than the self-styled 'wee fitba team'. As the graph shows, when we are playing very well and have an attacking, expansive winning team, we will always get more fans than Hearts because more people want to see football played that way.

All the big postwar attendances in Edinburgh have been at ER.

We always have a more discerning support, when we aren't playing decent football or fans will vote with their feet rather than Yams who will stick around and watch any garbage.

I actually agree with that!!!!!

Phil D. Rolls
22-04-2010, 09:26 AM
I think you've hit the nail on the head mate. The ONLY reason this Yam is posting/compiling these stats, is to show Hearts in a better light than Hibs and Aberdeen.

If Hearts stats were not as good as Hibernian's, do you really think he'd spend so much time on them and be so keen to tell anyone who will listen.

I think not

That old saying stats, stats and more lies

Quite pathetic, the way people can say with certainty what motivates others. I would suggest that unless you've asked the guy himself, you are just guessing. If anything, all you are doing is telling us how you think.

The_Sauz
22-04-2010, 09:48 AM
There was a time when Rangers attracted only around 4,000 or so to a home match. Pre Souness but it did happen :agree:
They had a crowd of 2500 against Clyde in the 70's :agree:

Peevemor
22-04-2010, 10:15 AM
Quite pathetic, the way people can say with certainty what motivates others. I would suggest that unless you've asked the guy himself, you are just guessing. If anything, all you are doing is telling us how you think.

:agree:

I appreciate that stats aren't everyone's 'thing' (yams neither for that matter), but there have been times when that LHWM has furnished us with information purely in relation to Hibs.

If people can't be bothered with his posts then that's up to them, but for me he's a welcome contributor to .net.

Forza Fred
22-04-2010, 10:27 AM
It worries me how people can accuse the man of having a go at us through statistics. The facts are the facts, why people argue about who is the biggest club perplexes me. What does it matter? Are you a Hibs supporter because you decided to support the best attended team in Edinburgh and now feel duped? Rise above it folks :greengrin

wot he said.

I don't go to count the crowd when I go to see Hibs play anyone.

The_Sauz
22-04-2010, 10:58 AM
:agree:

I appreciate that stats aren't everyone's 'thing' (yams neither for that matter), but there have been times when that LHWM has furnished us with information purely in relation to Hibs.

If people can't be bothered with his posts then that's up to them, but for me he's a welcome contributor to .net.



:top marks:agree:

Long suffering
22-04-2010, 03:39 PM
The bottotm left hand row on the web page (http://www.londonhearts.com/charts/avg_l_crowdsOF.htm)

Click on the individual tabs to see different charts and the tables.

thanks

son of haggart
22-04-2010, 04:44 PM
If you remember it, you weren't there. :cool2:

I remember the first thirty minutes - wasn't there for the rest

:boo hoo:

Dashing Bob S
22-04-2010, 05:05 PM
I actually agree with that!!!!!

Thank you Jack, just wishing some more of my Hibs chums weren't so taken in by the obsessions of those yam size queens. Ever since I can remember I've listened to this guff they relentlessly spew out. Just mindlessly parroting the same guff doesn't make it the case and attendances are a perfect example of the ymish prediliction for self deception. But when you have a club daft enough to claim a full house when Stevie Wonder could see a half empty stadium on the box, it's small wonder the support get so similarly deluded.

Phil D. Rolls
22-04-2010, 05:37 PM
I remember the first thirty minutes - wasn't there for the rest

:boo hoo:

Are you sure that wasn't the 1960s?:greengrin

son of haggart
22-04-2010, 05:40 PM
Are you sure that wasn't the 1960s?:greengrin

Unfortunately I started going in 1964/5 so just missed the glory days.

Most of the period 1965 to 1984 was rubbish for Hearts fans (low quality) so those of us who survived it are pretty resilient now

RoxburghHibs
22-04-2010, 07:42 PM
Quite pathetic, the way people can say with certainty what motivates others. I would suggest that unless you've asked the guy himself, you are just guessing. If anything, all you are doing is telling us how you think.

I can read his posts, and have seen what he rights on other message boards. I also work with a Yam who knows him (or should I say knows of him and he says even the Hearts fans don't take him seriously). So in short I am not being fooled like some.

If anything is pathetic, it's you being suckered in by his dodgy stats.

tony higgins
22-04-2010, 07:55 PM
They had a crowd of 2500 against Clyde in the 70's :agree:

And v us, May 1979 at Easter Rd.

jabis
22-04-2010, 08:01 PM
I can read his posts, and have seen what he rights on other message boards. I also work with a Yam who knows him (or should I say knows of him and he says even the Hearts fans don't take him seriously). So in short I am not being fooled like some.

If anything is pathetic, it's you being suckered in by his dodgy stats.

and me !

as for being "pathetic"......at least My mum loves me :agree:

RoxburghHibs
22-04-2010, 08:06 PM
and me !

as for being "pathetic"......at least My mum loves me :agree:

Is it just me or are people getting too serious on this MB

:thumbsup:

jabis
22-04-2010, 08:09 PM
Is it just me or are people getting too serious on this MB

:thumbsup:

:thumbsup:" go yersel ya grumpy sh*tehawk ":greengrin

RoxburghHibs
22-04-2010, 08:12 PM
:thumbsup:" go yersel ya grumpy sh*tehawk ":greengrin

Nothing better than a good moan :devil:

jabis
22-04-2010, 08:18 PM
Nothing better than a good moan :devil:


Often wondered why the Evening News refered to you as "RoxyNaeMates" :greengrin

have a great night,and post positive,Bhudda's watching your sorry ass :agree:

Phil D. Rolls
22-04-2010, 09:32 PM
I can read his posts, and have seen what he rights on other message boards. I also work with a Yam who knows him (or should I say knows of him and he says even the Hearts fans don't take him seriously). So in short I am not being fooled like some.

If anything is pathetic, it's you being suckered in by his dodgy stats.

They're dodgy? Yikes, I can't tell a norm from co-relational study, maybe I best just clock out now. Thanks for the heads up. :greengrin


Often wondered why the Evening News refered to you as "RoxyNaeMates" :greengrin

have a great night,and post positive,Bhudda's watching your sorry ass :agree:

As for you, you're just jealous. :faf:

LHWM
23-04-2010, 07:36 AM
I can read his posts, and have seen what he rights on other message boards. I also work with a Yam who knows him (or should I say knows of him and he says even the Hearts fans don't take him seriously). So in short I am not being fooled like some.

If anything is pathetic, it's you being suckered in by his dodgy stats.

The crowd figures are supplied by David Ross author of the definitive guide to Attendances in Scottish football 'The Roar of the Crowd'.


As I have stated elsewhere it is very disappointing that Hearts in 2006-07 reported 'ticket sales' rather than 'the bums on seats'. A policy used by the 'Old Firm'. The numbers are taken from the 'Official Returns' to the SPL rather us making them up.

The London Hearts photographs of the empty spaces in the stands were one reason they were discredited on JKB and Hearts now report the numbers through the turnstiles.

The Hibs statistics have been enhanced and corrected by various Hibs Historians.

London Hearts define 4 post war eras

Having a split in 1965 when Hearts lost the league on the last day to Kilmarnock.

Then from 1983 when they were promoted back to the Premier League.

London Hearts View
http://www.londonhearts.com/charts/HeartsHibsEras_files/image001.png

The Traditional View has a split at 1975 when the Premier league was formed.

Then another when the SPL was formed.

Traditional View
http://www.londonhearts.com/charts/HeartsHibsEras_files/image002.png

The second view obscures the success of the 'Turnbull Tornadoes' in Derbies. It shows Hearts as being 'top dog' in all three eras. That is why we split them differently to show the Hibs era of success from 1965 to 1979. It also show the success of 'The Robbo Years' which given the impact of the wee man in that period makes sense to have that split seperately as well.

The SPL era does show that there has been relatively little between the sides since 1999 compared to the 'previous 2 eras'

Joe Baker II
23-04-2010, 09:51 AM
1 Wed 23 Mar 1955 Hibernian 4 Stirling Albion 1 875
2 Mon 05 May 1980 Hibernian 0 Partick Thistle 1 1191
3 Wed 04 Apr 1962 Hibernian 2 St Mirren 1 1508
4 Tue 29 Apr 1980 Hibernian 2 St Mirren 1 2590
5 Wed 29 Feb 1984 Hibernian 3 Dundee 1 2601
6 Sat 08 Dec 1984 Hibernian 2 St Mirren 3 2631
7 Mon 21 Apr 1980 Hibernian 1 Kilmarnock 2 2659
8 Wed 20 Apr 1977 Hibernian 2 Ayr United 0 2835
9 Sat 28 Apr 1962 Hibernian 3 Stirling Albion 1 2942
10 Sat 08 May 1982 Hibernian 1 Partick Thistle 1 3118

There were 4-5000 at St Mirren game in 1984 I would have said, the only one of the above which I attended.

Was Dundee game in 1984 not one where was free admission after abandonment, I missed it but think crowd was 11,000 approximately, and would have doubted there were less than 3,000 at original game.

LHWM
23-04-2010, 10:17 AM
1 Wed 23 Mar 1955 Hibernian 4 Stirling Albion 1 875
2 Mon 05 May 1980 Hibernian 0 Partick Thistle 1 1191
3 Wed 04 Apr 1962 Hibernian 2 St Mirren 1 1508
4 Tue 29 Apr 1980 Hibernian 2 St Mirren 1 2590
5 Wed 29 Feb 1984 Hibernian 3 Dundee 1 2601
6 Sat 08 Dec 1984 Hibernian 2 St Mirren 3 2631


....


There were 4-5000 at St Mirren game in 1984 I would have said, the only one of the above which I attended.

Was Dundee game in 1984 not one where was free admission after abandonment, I missed it but think crowd was 11,000 approximately, and would have doubted there were less than 3,000 at original game.

The figures all come from David Ross who spent 25 or more years researching this stuff. If it has an exact figure rather than rounded one it would come from the official return to the league or what was recorded at league HQ.

So either somebody was cooking the returns to the SFL or your memory is mistaken or It may be that free entries were excluded from the returns.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

LHWM
23-04-2010, 01:05 PM
Alan Pattullo: 'Best fans in world? It doesn't look like it' (http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/sport/Alan-Pattullo-39Best-fans-in.6244649.jp) take on Celtic's attendance meltdown and their 'reporting' of their crowd figures.

judas
23-04-2010, 06:40 PM
Here are the 'bottom' 10 crowds for the 8 Champions in 'Division 1' since 1946 i.e. excluding any when the sides were out of the Top Tier. Celtic have 'rounded numbers' which may well have been lower than those issued.


1 Wed 28 Mar 1962 Aberdeen 2 Falkirk 2 2642
2 Sat 31 Mar 1962 Aberdeen 3 Kilmarnock 3 3269
3 Sat 19 Apr 1975 Aberdeen 4 Clyde 1 3302
4 Sat 21 Mar 1964 Aberdeen 3 Queen of the South 0 3479
4 Sat 19 Dec 1964 Aberdeen 0 Clyde 3 3479
6 Sat 31 Oct 1964 Aberdeen 2 Falkirk 1 3515
7 Sat 12 Mar 1966 Aberdeen 2 Partick Thistle 1 3793
8 Sat 18 Apr 1964 Aberdeen 0 Dundee United 0 4002
9 Wed 24 Mar 1965 Aberdeen 5 Airdrieonians 2 4220
10 Sat 13 Jan 1962 Aberdeen 1 Airdrieonians 1 4221

1 Mon 29 Apr 1957 Celtic 0 Queen of the South 0 3000
2 Wed 05 Mar 1958 Celtic 4 East Fife 0 4000
2 Mon 07 Apr 1958 Celtic 5 Queens Park 1 4000
2 Wed 30 Apr 1958 Celtic 4 Third Lanark 1 4000
2 Tue 10 Mar 1959 Celtic 1 Airdrieonians 2 4000
2 Mon 30 Apr 1956 Celtic 1 Falkirk 0 4000
7 Tue 24 Apr 1984 Celtic 3 Dundee 0 4596
8 Mon 13 May 1963 Celtic 6 Motherwell 0 4692
9 Wed 09 Apr 1958 Celtic 6 Clyde 2 5000
9 Mon 21 Apr 1958 Celtic 2 Motherwell 2 5000
9 Wed 17 Apr 1957 Celtic 2 St Mirren 3 5000

1 Fri 10 Mar 1967 Dundee 3 Ayr United 0 2251
2 Wed 01 Apr 1970 Dundee 4 Partick Thistle 1 2342
3 Sat 20 Apr 1957 Dundee 0 East Fife 1 2500
4 Wed 03 Dec 1986 Dundee 3 Hamilton Academical 3 2525
5 Sat 25 Apr 1987 Dundee 4 Clydebank[4] 1 2598
6 Sat 07 May 1994 Dundee 4 Hibernian 0 2731
7 Sat 26 Mar 1994 Dundee 3 Kilmarnock 0 2758
8 Sat 05 May 1990 Dundee 1 Motherwell 2 2846
9 Sat 09 Apr 1994 Dundee 0 St Johnstone 1 2871
10 Sat 13 Mar 1993 Dundee 1 Airdrieonians 1 2929

1 Wed 21 Nov 1973 Dundee United 2 Falkirk 1 1302
2 Fri 10 May 1974 Dundee United 4 Morton 2 1437
3 Wed 05 Apr 1967 Dundee United 4 Falkirk 4 1815
4 Mon 25 Mar 1968 Dundee United 1 Airdrieonians 0 2054
5 Sat 03 Apr 1971 Dundee United 4 Cowdenbeath 2 2396
6 Wed 24 Apr 1974 Dundee United 1 Partick Thistle 1 2626
7 Wed 22 Apr 1970 Dundee United 1 Dunfermline Athletic 3 2727
8 Wed 26 Apr 1978 Dundee United 3 Ayr United 1 2735
9 Sat 06 Oct 1973 Dundee United 4 Clyde 0 2817
10 Wed 11 Mar 1970 Dundee United 3 Clyde 1 2850

1 Wed 19 Apr 1967 Heart Of Midlothian 5 Stirling Albion 1 1846
2 Sat 04 Apr 1981 Heart Of Midlothian 1 Kilmarnock 0 1866
3 Mon 07 May 1979 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Morton 1 2253
4 Sat 18 Apr 1981 Heart Of Midlothian 1 St Mirren 2 2649
5 Sat 28 Feb 1981 Heart Of Midlothian 1 Partick Thistle 1 3491
6 Sat 28 Mar 1981 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Dundee United 4 3786
7 Sat 17 Apr 1971 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Motherwell 1 4305
8 Sat 21 Apr 1973 Heart Of Midlothian 0 Airdrieonians 1 4328
9 Sat 21 Jan 1967 Heart Of Midlothian 1 Ayr United 0 4351
10 Mon 24 Mar 1969 Heart Of Midlothian 2 Morton 2 4539

1 Wed 23 Mar 1955 Hibernian 4 Stirling Albion 1 875
2 Mon 05 May 1980 Hibernian 0 Partick Thistle 1 1191
3 Wed 04 Apr 1962 Hibernian 2 St Mirren 1 1508
4 Tue 29 Apr 1980 Hibernian 2 St Mirren 1 2590
5 Wed 29 Feb 1984 Hibernian 3 Dundee 1 2601
6 Sat 08 Dec 1984 Hibernian 2 St Mirren 3 2631
7 Mon 21 Apr 1980 Hibernian 1 Kilmarnock 2 2659
8 Wed 20 Apr 1977 Hibernian 2 Ayr United 0 2835
9 Sat 28 Apr 1962 Hibernian 3 Stirling Albion 1 2942
10 Sat 08 May 1982 Hibernian 1 Partick Thistle 1 3118

1 Wed 15 Apr 1981 Kilmarnock 0 Morton 0 973
2 Wed 27 Apr 1983 Kilmarnock 2 St Mirren 2 1049
3 Sat 14 May 1983 Kilmarnock 1 Motherwell 1 1203
4 Sat 19 Mar 1983 Kilmarnock 4 Morton 0 1230
5 Sat 18 Apr 1981 Kilmarnock 0 Partick Thistle 1 1262
6 Tue 24 Mar 1981 Kilmarnock 2 Heart Of Midlothian 0 1445
7 Wed 20 Apr 1977 Kilmarnock 1 Partick Thistle 3 1543
8 Sat 30 Apr 1977 Kilmarnock 1 Dundee United 2 1643
9 Sat 12 Feb 1983 Kilmarnock 0 Dundee United 5 1834
10 Sat 28 Mar 1981 Kilmarnock 0 Airdrieonians 1 1849

1 Wed 05 May 1982 Rangers 3 St Mirren 0 4765
2 Wed 24 Mar 1965 Rangers 2 St Johnstone 1 5671
3 Wed 31 Mar 1982 Rangers 1 Airdrieonians 0 5681
4 Mon 01 May 1972 Rangers 4 Ayr United 2 5869
5 Thu 27 Apr 1972 Rangers 3 Dunfermline Athletic 4 6021
6 Wed 23 May 1979 Rangers 1 Partick Thistle 0 6087
7 Wed 01 Apr 1981 Rangers 4 Morton 0 6216
8 Mon 28 Apr 1969 Rangers 1 Dundee 1 6821
9 Sat 08 May 1982 Rangers 4 Dundee 0 7052
10 Wed 02 May 1984 Rangers 2 Dundee United 2 7354

One can only be impressed.

Your stats are welcome on here.

Only the churlish would disagree.

RoxburghHibs
23-04-2010, 07:18 PM
For goodness sake when is this Yam fud going to stop posting anti-Hibs stats on a Hibernian message board, and to make matters worse some seem to be encouraging it....unbelievable!!

Hearts are p1sh get over it :bye:

Phil D. Rolls
23-04-2010, 07:26 PM
For goodness sake when is this Yam fud going to stop posting anti-Hibs stats on a Hibernian message board, and to make matters worse some seem to be encouraging it....unbelievable!!

Hearts are p1sh get over it :bye:

:faf:

It looks like there are two schools of thought on this matter.

You, and the rest of the planet. :greengrin

RoxburghHibs
23-04-2010, 07:26 PM
1 Wed 23 Mar 1955 Hibernian 4 Stirling Albion 1 875
2 Mon 05 May 1980 Hibernian 0 Partick Thistle 1 1191
3 Wed 04 Apr 1962 Hibernian 2 St Mirren 1 1508
4 Tue 29 Apr 1980 Hibernian 2 St Mirren 1 2590
5 Wed 29 Feb 1984 Hibernian 3 Dundee 1 2601
6 Sat 08 Dec 1984 Hibernian 2 St Mirren 3 2631
7 Mon 21 Apr 1980 Hibernian 1 Kilmarnock 2 2659
8 Wed 20 Apr 1977 Hibernian 2 Ayr United 0 2835
9 Sat 28 Apr 1962 Hibernian 3 Stirling Albion 1 2942
10 Sat 08 May 1982 Hibernian 1 Partick Thistle 1 3118

There were 4-5000 at St Mirren game in 1984 I would have said, the only one of the above which I attended.

Was Dundee game in 1984 not one where was free admission after abandonment, I missed it but think crowd was 11,000 approximately, and would have doubted there were less than 3,000 at original game.

Which is why these stats have to be taken with a very large pinch of salt.

RoxburghHibs
23-04-2010, 07:27 PM
:faf:

It looks like there are two schools of thought on this matter.

You, and the rest of the planet. :greengrin

Ah so you are now the spokesperson for the planet? I'm just seeing things from a Hibernian supporters view (ie don't like a Yam posting stats showing that mob as having the upper hand). If you believe everything this Yam says then all I can say about you is :faf:

Or do you back this Yam because you have a wee secret? :devil:

Ok look on a serious note, I don't see the harm in some of the stats he posts. But I can see what he is up to. He posts interesting stats about Hibernian and Scottish football in general (to be fair they are indepth). If he stopped at that I would be more trusting, however he gets your attention then posts his "Hearts are superior to Hibernian stats" in various formats (and has been doing this for years with the same stats..over and over and over) and that for me is the true reason he is on here.