General Election 2010: Which way will you vote?

[The_Todd]

YouTube - Election Debate Rap Battle (by Dan Bull) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7h92DALSM_A&feature=player_embedded)

:faf:

:thumbsup:

[steakbake]

Usually by this stage I have decided where my vote is going. I am still a 'don't know.' Anybody else the same? The absence of election statements from anybody other than the sitting Labour MP standing in my constituency doesn't help.

I'm normally an SNP and/or Green voter. I've gone back and forward in my mind about who to go for but this time, I ended up voting LibDems in order to bin the sitting Labour MP.

I'm not looking forward to a Tory government if that is to be the outcome, but equally another 5 years of PM Brown is even less appealing. However, I hope any Tory government will be a minority one which can be held in check by a bolstered opposition. The worst outcome for me would be to see a Lab government. I would also be annoyed if the LibDems threw their weight behind Labour on Friday instead of using any increased mandate wisely to influence and support good government decisions on a case-by-case basis. However, that is the risk you take with the LibDems who have shown remarkably little pragmatism in the Scottish parliament in the same position.

I suspect that the way devolution is going, people might increasingly consider the SNP a Scottish parliament party as opposed to a Westminster party. That said, they're already looking at an improved performance on 2005 and only 2 years after that disastrous result, they won the Scottish Parliamentary elections.

The independence movement's turn will come, I think, especially in the light of a Tory government with little or no mandate from Scotland. The independence genie only needs to be let out of the bottle once whereas the Unionist parties' have to fight repeatedly to stop if from doing so.

Three things which the Tories have said which I hope they will do are a) to set the length of the parliamentary term from the very beginning and b) reduce the number of MPs in the Westminster parliament and c) reintroduce immigration exit checks on the way out of the UK, even though they were the ones who scrapped this fairly basic and elementary part of any workable immigration system in the first place. I'm also against a rise in national insurance as I think that would punish the very businesses which are most likely to be able to get us out of the recession that Brown did little to prepare us for. The UK and Scotland cannot live off the public sector alone and I do think that the Tory's mantra of "the government is not the economy" is actually quite sensible.

I would like the LibDems to use their influence if at all possible, to pursue the Trident and ID cards question - i.e., what is the point of them and we shouldn't even bother with either. I also think there is more chance of more powers for Scotland, devolution max if you will, from the LibDems than from Labour, especially when the top of the Labour party is dominated by Scots who would rather wield these powers themselves than given them away... at least while they are in that position. No doubt when Jim Murphy replaces Iain Gray as Scottish Labour leader, he'd be the first to call for more powers for Holyrood.

We'll see what happens. I think the Tories will win by a very very small majority - even single figures but enough to form a government. If they fall short of that, I still think they'll be the biggest party though, with Labour second and the LibDems not far behind.

[BroxburnHibee]

Polls have been wrong before - I hope I'm wrong but I think the tories will walk it - easily.

[Hainan Hibs]

Polls have been wrong before - I hope I'm wrong but I think the tories will walk it - easily.


Times now saying their last poll before the polls opened showed a tory majority.

I'm with you, I think they will have a majority and a large one at that.

[hibsbollah]

Polls have been wrong before - I hope I'm wrong but I think the tories will walk it - easily.

:agree:1992 most famously; even the exit polls at 10pm were predicting a Labour win, John Major ended up winning and hung on till 1997.

Nobody knows what will happen today.

[lyonhibs]

YouTube - Election Debate Rap Battle (by Dan Bull) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7h92DALSM_A&feature=player_embedded)

Brilliant :faf: :faf:

"Flipping Heck - I offer my sincerest apologies" :faf:

"Well Nick, you're a ****" :faf:

[New Corrie]

Was probaly going to vote for Gogs Broon or the Lib Dem until yesterday when I was with my young son chatting to the Tory candidate outside the shops at Drum Brae. Next minute up turns the chavved up VW with the token aggressive wee ned and his trashy nedette bird shouting "pheck off back to Engalnd, Tories are no welcum in scoatland yah phecking c***s" ,and my mind was made up for me. Disgusting little trash with the hate in his face and tattood neck that we seem to churn out millions out of in this country. Just reminded me of why I should be voting Conservative. If it riles all these disgusting little inbred neds with stupid chav names that will never contribute anything bar churning out more chavs with embarrassing names.......then that'll do for me. Just heading off to the polling station now, thank you very much.

[Betty Boop]

Was probaly going to vote for Gogs Broon or the Lib Dem until yesterday when I was with my young son chatting to the Tory candidate outside the shops at Drum Brae. Next minute up turns the chavved up VW with the token aggressive wee ned and his trashy nedette bird shouting "pheck off back to Engalnd, Tories are no welcum in scoatland yah phecking c***s" ,and my mind was made up for me. Disgusting little trash with the hate in his face and tattood neck that we seem to churn out millions out of in this country. Just reminded me of why I should be voting Conservative. If it riles all these disgusting little inbred neds with stupid chav names that will never contribute anything bar churning out more chavs with embarrassing names.......then that'll do for me. Just heading off to the polling station now, thank you very much.

Nothing to do with their policies then?

[New Corrie]

Nothing to do with their policies then?

They all pretty much appear to be saying the same thing, that's why so many are undecided, it's all become about personalities and Gogs Broon is to me the most trustworthy plus he hates the Nats which imo is a good thing), however as I said, that incident yesterday (added to the hysterical unjustified scaremongering on here) has brought it all back to me why I should be voting for the Tories.

[lyonhibs]

For those wondering on their incumbent MP's voting record

http://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/

Could be interesting for some floating voters.

[Mon Dieu4]

For those wondering on their incumbent MP's voting record

http://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/

Could be interesting for some floating voters.

http://www.theyworkforyou.com/msp/george_foulkes

Thanks for that, I particulary like the "Email me when he speaks (No more than once a day)" part

Presumably when he speaks once a day it's to slaver pish or say "copius amounts of Whisky NOW"

[LiverpoolHibs]

They all pretty much appear to be saying the same thing, that's why so many are undecided, it's all become about personalities and Gogs Broon is to me the most trustworthy plus he hates the Nats which imo is a good thing), however as I said, that incident yesterday (added to the hysterical unjustified scaremongering on here) has brought it all back to me why I should be voting for the Tories.

Yup, apparently pure, unadulterated class hatred.

[JimBHibees]

Was probaly going to vote for Gogs Broon or the Lib Dem until yesterday when I was with my young son chatting to the Tory candidate outside the shops at Drum Brae. Next minute up turns the chavved up VW with the token aggressive wee ned and his trashy nedette bird shouting "pheck off back to Engalnd, Tories are no welcum in scoatland yah phecking c***s" ,and my mind was made up for me. Disgusting little trash with the hate in his face and tattood neck that we seem to churn out millions out of in this country. Just reminded me of why I should be voting Conservative. If it riles all these disgusting little inbred neds with stupid chav names that will never contribute anything bar churning out more chavs with embarrassing names.......then that'll do for me. Just heading off to the polling station now, thank you very much.

But you were going to vote for them anyway though. :greengrin

[New Corrie]

Yup, apparently pure, unadulterated class hatred.

Not a class thing at all, just a hatred of aggressive chavvy neds that contribute nothing bar violence and chav kids with stupid names.

[Leicester Fan]

Yup, apparently pure, unadulterated class hatred.
Not the sort of thing that labour would indulge in at all.

[Sir David Gray]

How exactly does the UK form the Worlds biggest Carbon Trading Scheme by itself?

How does the UK form the Worlds largest internal trading market by itself?

How does the UK get us cheaper flights? Competition in the EU has helped drive prices down.

:faf: That has got to be one of the worst arguments yet.

How can you not see where the benefits of the EU internal trading market are coming from? It has helped grow GDP by 2.2% in 2006 more than it would have grown had the internal trading market not existed. It has also helped create an additional 2.75 million Jobs across Europe. How can you not "at least say yes I can see where your argument is coming from" to that?

And you are against the death penalty, but think EU support Laws banning the death penalty are a bad thing? :faf: Deary me.

Climate change is not high up in my list of concerns and I am very sceptical of the claim that it is caused predominantly by man-made factors, so any carbon trading schemes are not all that important to me.

As for trade agreements, I have no problem with them at all. If that was all the EU consisted of then I would be all for it. However, as I have already said, I don't see why we can't come out of the EU, and still maintain close ties, politically and in relation to trade, with the rest of Europe. I fully believe that we should set up agreements with other nations, as and when it suits us.

The main point that I was trying to make with regards to the death penalty is that I want it banned in the UK, but I want the UK Government to ban it. I don't want the ban to be forced upon us by some outside organisation. If it was to go to a referendum and the British people voted for it to be reinstated then I would be happy to go along with that, even although I would campaign vigorously for it to remain outlawed.

I absolutely believe that the UK Parliament should be responsible for making every single law that is passed in this country and I passionately believe that our sovereignty should be restored and only by leaving the European Union can that goal be achieved.

[Mibbes Aye]

Climate change is not high up in my list of concerns and I am very sceptical of the claim that it is caused predominantly by man-made factors, so any carbon trading schemes are not all that important to me.

As for trade agreements, I have no problem with them at all. If that was all the EU consisted of then I would be all for it. However, as I have already said, I don't see why we can't come out of the EU, and still maintain close ties, politically and in relation to trade, with the rest of Europe. I fully believe that we should set up agreements with other nations, as and when it suits us.

The main point that I was trying to make with regards to the death penalty is that I want it banned in the UK, but I want the UK Government to ban it. I don't want the ban to be forced upon us by some outside organisation. If it was to go to a referendum and the British people voted for it to be reinstated then I would be happy to go along with that, even although I would campaign vigorously for it to remain outlawed.

I absolutely believe that the UK Parliament should be responsible for making every single law that is passed in this country and I passionately believe that our sovereignty should be restored and only by leaving the European Union can that goal be achieved.

Yet you will obey and almost certainly benefit from laws passed, either at Holyrood or in Europe.

Do you opt out from the benefits of those pieces of legislation? If so, how?

[Phil D. Rolls]

Not a class thing at all, just a hatred of aggressive chavvy neds that contribute nothing bar violence and chav kids with stupid names.

I wouldn't blame any one political party for the lack of pride and self belief that so many youngsters seem to have these days. I do think that a lot of it has to do with the Tory laissez faire attitude though.

Thatcher encouraged to people to think as individuals rather as part of a larger whole. Quite laudible in a humanist sort of way, but the problem is that she changed society too quickly.

As well as those who were able to take advantage of the opportunities they had, there was a section who couldn't, or wouldn't. I think that's where the lack of pride and self respect comes from.

Add in the fact that Thatcher treated the thing like a cultural revolution rather than taking time to grow a new society, and a lot of the blame lies at the door of Tory policy.

[LiverpoolHibs]

Sorry FH, missed this at the time.


With regards to the bit in bold, I have done a bit of research that seems to contradict that point a little bit. Here are the following ten constituencies where the BNP had their best results at the 2005 election;

Barking
Dewsbury
Burnley
West Bromwich West
Dudley North
Dagenham
Keighley
Stoke-On-Trent South
Bradford South
Stoke-On-Trent Central

I accept that the BNP's support in places like Stoke and Barking is down to other factors and not really to do with immigration. However, places like Dewsbury, Burnley, West Bromwich, Dudley, Keighley and Bradford all have significant migrant populations and although the BNP supporters in those places may have other economic/social reasons for their political allegiances, I think immigration will have a pretty large bearing.

Of course you think that, because it fits with what you think about immigration as well.

You need to work out what you mean by 'migrant populations' here; is this just anyone who is not native white British regardless of when they arrived? That must be what you mean because the IPPR report is nothing to do with the levels of the non-White-British population in such areas, it's about levels of immigration to such areas and the corralation with the recent rise in the BNP vote. So whereas the constituencies you mention have relatively large non-White-British communities (although none of them really drop much below the 90% mark) they do not have relatively large levels of immigration in the last twenty or so years. As the report establishes, practically everywhere they do well has below average levels of immigration.


However, it does stand to reason that the constituencies with the highest levels of immigration have low levels of support for the BNP. In the constituency that has one of the least amount of "White British" people in the whole country (Bethnal Green and Bow), the BNP didn't even have a candidate in 2005, and in 2001 their candidate only polled 3.2% of the vote.

It stands to reason, yes, but not for the reasons you think.


Also, forgive me if I've picked you up incorrectly but it seems to me as if you are saying here that the BNP is picking up votes from disaffected Labour voters. That seems to be at odds with something that you said several months ago in another thread, when you seemed to be suggesting that BNP voters are more inclined to support the Conservatives.

If I have picked you up wrong then perhaps you could set me straight.

You have picked me up wrong, but I wasn't as clear as I could have been. I wasn't suggesting that the BNP were picking up substantial amounts of votes from Labour, I was suggesting that the massive decline of the Labour vote what have traditionally been their heartlands has made the increased BNP vote (which every piece of research suggests comes from people who have traditionally voted Tory or who define themselves as such) more noticeable and important than it otherwise would be.

---------- Post added at 11:22 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:20 AM ----------


Not a class thing at all, just a hatred of aggressive chavvy neds that contribute nothing bar violence and chav kids with stupid names.

So unadulterated class hatred then...

[Sir David Gray]

Yet you will obey and almost certainly benefit from laws passed, either at Holyrood or in Europe.

Do you opt out from the benefits of those pieces of legislation? If so, how?

Of course not. How I view the European Parliament and, to a lesser extent, Holyrood is exactly the same way that a Scottish nationalist views Westminster, i.e. they will undoubtedly benefit from certain laws that are passed by the UK Government but they are of the opinion that the Scottish Parliament should be responsible for making every single law that affects Scotland.

I am not 100% against Scottish independence, but I do not support the SNP or their vision of how an independent Scotland should look. I think we need to have either independence and rule ourselves or have direct rule from Westminster. I strongly believe that if the United Kingdom is one country, and is to remain as such, each and every person who stays in this country should have the same rights, the same responsibilities and have access to the same services and privileges.

For me the European Parliament is an entirely different kettle of fish. I would never say never but as far as the EU goes, I find it highly unlikely that I will ever accept legislation that affects the UK (or Scotland if we become independent) coming from Brussels.


It stands to reason, yes, but not for the reasons you think.

OK, could you tell me what you think the reason is then?

You have me on tenterhooks here. :greengrin

[GlesgaeHibby]

Climate change is not high up in my list of concerns and I am very sceptical of the claim that it is caused predominantly by man-made factors, so any carbon trading schemes are not all that important to me.

As for trade agreements, I have no problem with them at all. If that was all the EU consisted of then I would be all for it. However, as I have already said, I don't see why we can't come out of the EU, and still maintain close ties, politically and in relation to trade, with the rest of Europe. I fully believe that we should set up agreements with other nations, as and when it suits us.

The main point that I was trying to make with regards to the death penalty is that I want it banned in the UK, but I want the UK Government to ban it. I don't want the ban to be forced upon us by some outside organisation. If it was to go to a referendum and the British people voted for it to be reinstated then I would be happy to go along with that, even although I would campaign vigorously for it to remain outlawed.

I absolutely believe that the UK Parliament should be responsible for making every single law that is passed in this country and I passionately believe that our sovereignty should be restored and only by leaving the European Union can that goal be achieved.

Are you serious? Global concentrations of Carbon in the atmosphere have risen dramatically since the industrial revolution. Coincidence? I think not.

I would urge you to examine the evidence for anthropogenic climate change, because I do not seriously believe that anybody who does so can still maintain that our excessive consumption of fossil fuels and over pollution is having no negative side effects.

Again and again you ignore the fact that the EU Single Market has been responsible for 2.75 million more jobs across Europe and a 2.6% rise in GDP. How you still cannot see these as good things I just do not understand.

The regional development fund is also a great tool to help regions and people that need our help most.

The aid contributions to the developing world are all things we should applaud the EU for.

[Leicester Fan]

The regional development fund is also a great tool to help regions and people that need our help most.

The aid contributions to the developing world are all things we should applaud the EU for.

They're doing all that with our money. Why can't we just do all that directly ourselves without handing the money over to the EU and them taking their cut?

[Beefster]

They're doing all that with our money. Why can't we just do all that directly ourselves without handing the money over to the EU and them taking their cut?

We should be doing it ourselves. DFID is cheaper in administering aid, faster in getting it to where it is needed and targets the aid to poorer nations better than the EU.

[One Day Soon]

We should be doing it ourselves. DFID is cheaper in administering aid, faster in getting it to where it is needed and targets the aid to poorer nations better than the EU.

You and Leicester appear to me to be on the right of the political spectrum without being excessively so. Both voted Tory I'm guessing. Your views as expressed above are relatively mild in intent and expression and yet they jar horrendously with the position of the Lib Dems on Europe. And that alone demonstrates the grotesque nature of the coalition that has been created.

The Lib Dem Ministers won't care. Drunk on the status and trappings of office they are the new political pornstars - they will swallow anything. But just watch the membership and activist base as they have to accept this stuff, Clegg will - ultimately - fry for it.

[JimBHibees]

You and Leicester appear to me to be on the right of the political spectrum without being excessively so. Both voted Tory I'm guessing. Your views as expressed above are relatively mild in intent and expression and yet they jar horrendously with the position of the Lib Dems on Europe. And that alone demonstrates the grotesque nature of the coalition that has been created.

The Lib Dem Ministers won't care. Drunk on the status and trappings of office they are the new political pornstars - they will swallow anything. But just watch the membership and activist base as they have to accept this stuff, Clegg will - ultimately - fry for it.

Feeling your bitter pain. :greengrin

[One Day Soon]

Feeling your bitter pain. :greengrin

Are you deranged? In terms of what will happen next politically I could not be happier. There are going to be so many birds in the air as it were, that its going to be hard to know which one to shoot first. I actually feel sorry for the Scottish Parliament Lib Dems.

I was forgetting of course that you will be looking forward both to a Tory administration and to as savage a set of cuts as possible for your own narrow advantage.

[JimBHibees]

Are you deranged? In terms of what will happen next politically I could not be happier. There are going to be so many birds in the air as it were, that its going to be hard to know which one to shoot first. I actually feel sorry for the Scottish Parliament Lib Dems.

I was forgetting of course that you will be looking forward both to a Tory administration and to as savage a set of cuts as possible for your own narrow advantage.

Yep completely deranged. Why do Labour types have to get so personal? Sums up the arrogance of that party and the morally corrupt nature of their lust for power. Labour should think about getting back to their roots and not be concentrating so much on ingratiating themselves to big business through sleazy losers like Mandelson. How many times has he had to resign through inproprietary and he is still taking free trips on Russian billionaires boats along with his friend Osbourne.

The unedifying sight of ex Prime Minister Bliar whoring himself to big business is flabbergasting to be honest. The Iron Chancellors reputation has kind of rusted given he presided over the financial collapse and summarily failed to properly regulate both banks and the economy. Can you imagine the rage if a Tory party had presided over the Banking crisis, Labour would have been organising the Unions to march on the City of London, we then pumped billions into the banks without it appears telling the banks to lend more to business and the public.

How long did it take Patricia Hewitt to get a job with Boots after working as Health Secretary. The Stephen Byers 'do you want a pint with Tony' kind of sums up the malaise in that party.

Labour needs a root and branch review of how they operate and too many have been in power too long with their snouts in the trough.

As a one time Labour voter who has voted elsewhere since the illegal war I am as yet undecided over where to put my next X.

No I am not looking forward to a succession of cuts in the public sector, why would I, I work in that sector however lets not convince ourselves that savage cuts werent coming if Labour were still in power.

[bighairyfaeleith]

Yep completely deranged. Why do Labour types have to get so personal? Sums up the arrogance of that party and the morally corrupt nature of their lust for power. Labour should think about getting back to their roots and not be concentrating so much on ingratiating themselves to big business through sleazy losers like Mandelson. How many times has he had to resign through inproprietary and he is still taking free trips on Russian billionaires boats along with his friend Osbourne.

The unedifying sight of ex Prime Minister Bliar whoring himself to big business is flabbergasting to be honest. The Iron Chancellors reputation has kind of rusted given he presided over the financial collapse and summarily failed to properly regulate both banks and the economy. Can you imagine the rage if a Tory party had presided over the Banking crisis, Labour would have been organising the Unions to march on the City of London, we then pumped billions into the banks without it appears telling the banks to lend more to business and the public.

How long did it take Patricia Hewitt to get a job with Boots after working as Health Secretary. The Stephen Byers 'do you want a pint with Tony' kind of sums up the malaise in that party.

Labour needs a root and branch review of how they operate and too many have been in power too long with their snouts in the trough.

As a one time Labour voter who has voted elsewhere since the illegal war I am as yet undecided over where to put my next X.

No I am not looking forward to a succession of cuts in the public sector, why would I, I work in that sector however lets not convince ourselves that savage cuts werent coming if Labour were still in power.

Never voted labour this time. Unsure where I am going next s well becuase of the lib dems and there decisions as of late. I read on the beeb I think it was though that labours party memberships have suddenly shot up. Not sure if it is because of browns departure or lib/con coalition.

In regards to the cuts, we did all know they were/are coming but tbh I believed gordon when he talked about when and what he would cut. I'm not sure I believe the other two at all and thats my biggest concern. Although it's hard to believe any politician so I guess you just have to make a leap of faith at some point.

[One Day Soon]

Yep completely deranged. Why do Labour types have to get so personal? Sums up the arrogance of that party and the morally corrupt nature of their lust for power. Labour should think about getting back to their roots and not be concentrating so much on ingratiating themselves to big business through sleazy losers like Mandelson. How many times has he had to resign through inproprietary and he is still taking free trips on Russian billionaires boats along with his friend Osbourne.

The unedifying sight of ex Prime Minister Bliar whoring himself to big business is flabbergasting to be honest. The Iron Chancellors reputation has kind of rusted given he presided over the financial collapse and summarily failed to properly regulate both banks and the economy. Can you imagine the rage if a Tory party had presided over the Banking crisis, Labour would have been organising the Unions to march on the City of London, we then pumped billions into the banks without it appears telling the banks to lend more to business and the public.

How long did it take Patricia Hewitt to get a job with Boots after working as Health Secretary. The Stephen Byers 'do you want a pint with Tony' kind of sums up the malaise in that party.

Labour needs a root and branch review of how they operate and too many have been in power too long with their snouts in the trough.

As a one time Labour voter who has voted elsewhere since the illegal war I am as yet undecided over where to put my next X.

No I am not looking forward to a succession of cuts in the public sector, why would I, I work in that sector however lets not convince ourselves that savage cuts werent coming if Labour were still in power.

I see you can dish it out but you can't take it. You pour bile - often deeply uninformed bile - upon the party and then you seem surprised when you get it back. If you can't stand the heat...

[marinello59]

I see you can dish it out but you can't take it. You pour bile - often deeply uninformed bile - upon the party and then you seem surprised when you get it back. If you can't stand the heat...

There is a difference between criticising a political party in debate (which is fair game) and attacking somebody personally for holding opposing views from yourself. (Which is not.)

[One Day Soon]

There is a difference between criticising a political party in debate (which is fair game) and attacking somebody personally for holding opposing views from yourself. (Which is not.)

I agree, which is why I wrote what I wrote.

[JimBHibees]

I see you can dish it out but you can't take it. You pour bile - often deeply uninformed bile - upon the party and then you seem surprised when you get it back. If you can't stand the heat...

I am criticising the Labour party, not you, big difference. Highlight the uninformed bits.

[One Day Soon]

I am criticising the Labour party, not you, big difference. Highlight the uninformed bits.

I don't accept that. You wrote: "Feeling your bitter pain." That was personal (though inaccurate) and not political.

Just for a start your claim that Gordon Brown was insincere about the forces which was comprehensively demolished in the content of his resignation statement - at a point when he had absolutley nothing to gain personally or politically.