Help give Scotland a progressive and egalitarian national anthem

[joe breezy]

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?v=wall&ref=mf&gid=190707442928#/group.php?gid=297668183293&ref=ts

[J-C]

Scotland the Brave for me sums up Scotland and it's people. :greengrin

[iwasthere1972]

Scotland the Brave for me sums up Scotland and it's people. :greengrin

Think this says it better that Scotland the BRave

YouTube - RKL We're Back We're Pissed (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LTa9lo8lQY0)

[jabis]

Think this says it better that Scotland the BRave

YouTube - RKL We're Back We're Pissed (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LTa9lo8lQY0)


why, on God's green earth,should we have a rip-off "Ballroom Blitz"by the Sweet,as a national anthem.

Words fail me :cool2:

[(((Fergus)))]

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?v=wall&ref=mf&gid=190707442928#/group.php?gid=297668183293&ref=ts

Outstanding choice for anthem IMO


Inspiring, non-chauvinistic, Enlightenment message
Lyrics by our national poet
Attractive, non-militaristic melody (possibly traditional Scots?)
Can be performed on the pipes without bum note at end
Can be performed as spoken piece without accompaniment

[iwasthere1972]

why, on God's green earth,should we have a rip-off "Ballroom Blitz"by the Sweet,as a national anthem.

Words fail me :cool2:

I agree. :greengrin

[Pete]

If it were to be changed then it would have to be Highland Cathedral.

Scotland is a place that we sometimes take for granted but mesmerizes outsiders...and masterpieces are born from such experiences.

I would even have it without the lyrics.

[(((Fergus)))]

If it were to be changed then it would have to be Highland Cathedral.

Scotland is a place that we sometimes take for granted but mesmerizes outsiders...and masterpieces are born from such experiences.

I would even have it without the lyrics.

You do know that was written by a couple of Germans in the 70s/80s?

http://www.highlandcathedral.de/texte/engl.html

[Pete]

You do know that was written by a couple of Germans in the 70s/80s?

http://www.highlandcathedral.de/texte/engl.html

Yes I did...hence the second sentence in my post.

I've been driving a cab around Edinburgh for nearly eight years and I've learnt so much from tourists reactions to our city and our country. They've actually taught me things about my country and made me appreciate things that I'd taken for granted.

This musical "outsiders interpretation" of our country is beautiful...and we should be proud that they feel strongly enough to write such a piece.

[ancient hibee]

Scotland the Brave.

Great pipe tune.

Words by one of Scotland's best ever journalists.

[Hibbyradge]

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?v=wall&ref=mf&gid=190707442928#/group.php?gid=297668183293&ref=ts

Scotland the bigotted, racist, jealous and drunk might be more accurate. :agree:

[Pretty Boy]

Anything would have to be better than the embarassing dirge that is Flower of Scotland anyway.

[(((Fergus)))]

Scotland the bigotted, racist, jealous and drunk might be more accurate. :agree:

Every country has its positives and negatives though and an anthem should inspire us to emulate the former. The message in "For Honest Poverty" does that very well IMO - better than most other anthems I can think of.

[Hainan Hibs]

Every country has its positives and negatives though and an anthem should inspire us to emulate the former. The message in "For Honest Poverty" does that very well IMO - better than most other anthems I can think of.

Agreed and it's time to start talking ourselves and our country up, too many people have a constant want to put us down and look at everything negatively.

I like the message of A Man's A Man For A That and think it would be a cracking anthem.

[(((Fergus)))]

Yes I did...hence the second sentence in my post.

I've been driving a cab around Edinburgh for nearly eight years and I've learnt so much from tourists reactions to our city and our country. They've actually taught me things about my country and made me appreciate things that I'd taken for granted.

This musical "outsiders interpretation" of our country is beautiful...and we should be proud that they feel strongly enough to write such a piece.

I see what you mean - 'to see ourselves as others see us'. In this case though I feel the music is a pastiche of Scottishness. Strip out the grace notes and it is quite a bland Euro disco-type melody. The following picture from the website is a visual equivalent in terms of misinterpreting Scotland:
http://www.highlandcathedral.de/bilder/moench_neu.jpg
As in the song, the only Scottish thing about it is the piper - even that is a post-Jacobean representation and one of the biggest cliches of Scottishness.

[woodythehibee]

Paolo Nutini's version is superb :agree:

YouTube - Paolo Nutini - A Man's a man (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wOBcFt5tevY)

[jabis]

Paolo Nutini's version is superb :agree:

YouTube - Paolo Nutini - A Man's a man (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wOBcFt5tevY)



:top marks:top marks:top marks:top marks:top marks:top marks

Even the man from del'monte say YES !

[(((Fergus)))]

YouTube - A Man's a man. Opening of Parliament 1999. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9raiKg7R1JY)

[Peevemor]

YouTube - Hoots Mon (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z7Ymov6JhRE)

[Peevemor]

Failing that, I've long advocated A Man's a Man.

Sung here by Jim Malcolm - a class act :agree:

YouTube - Jim Malcolm - A Man's A Man for All That (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bd68sw71UDI)

[Peevemor]

Outstanding choice for anthem IMO


Inspiring, non-chauvinistic, Enlightenment message
Lyrics by our national poet
Attractive, non-militaristic melody (possibly traditional Scots?)
Can be performed on the pipes without bum note at end
Can be performed as spoken piece without accompaniment



In fact, the note you refer to in Flower of Scotland can be played on the pipes but almost never is. There is however one note in A Man's a Man that definitely cannot.

[Hainan Hibs]

Failing that, I've long advocated A Man's a Man.

Sung here by Jim Malcolm - a class act :agree:

YouTube - Jim Malcolm - A Man's A Man for All That (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bd68sw71UDI)

First time I've heard that, it's great!

[(((Fergus)))]

Failing that, I've long advocated A Man's a Man.

Sung here by Jim Malcolm - a class act :agree:

YouTube - Jim Malcolm - A Man's A Man for All That (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bd68sw71UDI)

Great stuff :top marks


In fact, the note you refer to in Flower of Scotland can be played on the pipes but almost never is. There is however one note in A Man's a Man that definitely cannot.

Ach who gives a **** about the pipes? :devil:

I suppose you mean that very top note towards the end? "...the wo-rld o'er". Not a massive issue though, is it?

How do you play FoS without that strange note at the end?

[Peevemor]

Great stuff :top marks



Ach who gives a **** about the pipes? :devil:

I suppose you mean that very top note towards the end? "...the wo-rld o'er". Not a massive issue though, is it?

How do you play FoS without that strange note at the end?

The "think" note in FoS is nearly always played as a C (or what pipers call C) as shown in the first image (the green dots show the fingers to be lifted). It should however be a C natural as shown in the second image.

The C natural isn't widely taught/used in Scottish piping and will only work if the pipes are reeded up properly.

[lapsedhibee]

The "think" note in FoS is nearly always played as a C (or what pipers call C) as shown in the first image (the green dots show the fingers to be lifted). It should however be a C natural as shown in the second image.

The C natural isn't widely taught/used in Scottish piping and will only work if the pipes are reeded up properly.

:thumbsup: Barry gen.

[(((Fergus)))]

:thumbsup: Barry gen.

:agree: Is there a link out there of someone playing FOS with C natural?

[Peevemor]

:agree: Is there a link out there of someone playing FOS with C natural?


YouTube - Flower of Scotland (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8xqyAizAIIA)

I had to listen to some amount of pish before I found that! :bitchy:

[hibbytam]

scots wha hae?

[Dashing Bob S]

I'd go for Europe's The Final Countdown or Van Halen's Livin On A Prayer.

[joe breezy]

I'd go for Europe's The Final Countdown or Van Halen's Livin On A Prayer.

One of my Welsh pals suggested BA Robertson's We Have a Dream, as a football song it certainly hits that mark

[(((Fergus)))]

YouTube - Flower of Scotland (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8xqyAizAIIA)

I had to listen to some amount of pish before I found that! :bitchy:

That sounds great, thanks very much for finding it. :agree:

See on "Man's a Man", could you play the top couple of notes an octave down if you happened to be accompanying vocalists?

[Peevemor]

That sounds great, thanks very much for finding it. :agree:

See on "Man's a Man", could you play the top couple of notes an octave down if you happened to be accompanying vocalists?

It's only one note which would be the equivalent of high B (hibernian :greengrin) on the pipes. A normal B would probably be too loud and sound daft. I would probably do high G-E-E (wor-ruld-o'er). :dunno:

[Ed De Gramo]

All this talk of national anthems...

YouTube - Ronnie Corrie Only an Excuse 2009 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0O4hhfTL8A0)

priceless :thumbsup:

[Calvin]

I'm in the Scots Wha Hae camp as well.

[Hainan Hibs]

All this talk of national anthems...

YouTube - Ronnie Corrie Only an Excuse 2009 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0O4hhfTL8A0)

priceless :thumbsup:

:faf::faf:

[J-C]

The one and only Frankie Miller singing Caledonia.


YouTube - Caledonia ( Frankie Miller ) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZrdo1PuUvQ)


:thumbsup:

[hibbytam]

I'm in the Scots Wha Hae camp as well.

:thumbsup:
Thought I was invisible. In an internet sense. Which I hopefully am.
YouTube - The Corries --- Scots Wha Hae (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WgskbClWZ68)

on a slightly related note, http://www.bbc.co.uk/robertburns/works/to_a_mouse/

there's a load of burns read online here.

[--------]

The "think" note in FoS is nearly always played as a C (or what pipers call C) as shown in the first image (the green dots show the fingers to be lifted). It should however be a C natural as shown in the second image.

The C natural isn't widely taught/used in Scottish piping and will only work if the pipes are reeded up properly.


:agree:

No reason for either 'Flower o Scotland' or 'Is There For Honest Poverty' to be misplayed on the pipes other than bad pipers.

Of which there are many, unfortunately.

Of the two I'd prefer 'Is There for Honest Poverty' because it's a better tune, better words, and the sentiments are such as I approve of. Especially verses 3 and 4.

Is there for honest poverty
That hings his heid, an a that?
The coward slave, we pass him by;
We dare be poor for a that.
For a that, an a that,
Our toil's obscure an a that;
The rank is but the guinea's stamp -
The man's the gowd for a that.

What though on hamely fare we dine,
Wear hoddin grey, an a that;
Gie fools their silks, and knaves their wine,
A man's a man for a that.
For a' that, an a that,
Their tinsel show an a that;
The honest man, tho e'er sae poor,
Is king o men for a that.

Ye see yon birkie ca'd a lord,
Wha struts an' stares an a that?
Tho hundreds worship at his word,
He's but a coof for a that.
For a that, an a that,
His ribband, star and a that;
The man o independent mind
He looks an laughs at a that.

A prince can mak a belted knight,
A marquis, duke, an a that
But an honest man's aboon his might -
Gude faith, he mauna fa that!
For a that an a that,
Their dignities an a that,
The pith o sense an pride o worth
Are higher rank that a that.

Then let us pray that come it may,
As come it will for a that,
That Sense and Worth o'er a the earth
Shall bear the gree an a that.
For a that an a that,
It's coming yet for a that,
That man to man the world o'er
Shall brithers be for a that.

However, it would rather commit the new Scotland to being a Republic, and to the aboltion of all aristocratic rank and title in any official sense?

:devil:

'Scots wha hae wi Wallace bled' is good, too - but only if it's played as a MARCH, on the pipes, and sung in the most belligerent and threatening manner possible. Of course, the same goes for 'Flower o Scotland' - it doesn't have to be played and sung as a dirge.

[(((Fergus)))]

Verse 5 is just a great climax to the anthem IMO.

Don't think the overall message is necessarily republican though Doddie, it merely says that rank and title in themselves are no guarantee of merit. The ruling class in a republic also have their paraphernalia of power, albeit these can be withdrawn at the next election - and usually need to be.

[khib70]

I'd go for Europe's The Final Countdown or Van Halen's Livin On A Prayer.
Big hair metal pedantry alert! Livin on a Prayer is by Bon Jovi.