Old Firm NOT going to Premier League

[heretoday]

The proposal under discussion this week by some Prem chairmen is for a new two-tier premier league. Celtic and Rangers would be invited to join the lower tier initially.

There would be promotion and relegation to and from this new structure.

Should either of the OF get promoted or, hopefully, relegated, wouldn't that mean the end of the OF fixture possibly for years unless they were drawn together in a Cup competition?

Surely the loony OF fans wouldn't put up with their regular bloodletting and flag waving days out being curtailed?

[Phil D. Rolls]

The proposal under discussion this week by some Prem chairmen is for a new two-tier premier league. Celtic and Rangers would be invited to join the lower tier initially.

There would be promotion and relegation to and from this new structure.

Should either of the OF get promoted or, hopefully, relegated, wouldn't that mean the end of the OF fixture possibly for years unless they were drawn together in a Cup competition?

Surely the loony OF fans wouldn't put up with their regular bloodletting and flag waving days out being curtailed?

I think they would have a good chance of meeting up in the Glasgow Cup. Before we let them play each other a guaranteed four times every year they relied on this competition for extra revenue.

[MyJo]

Couldn't give a monkeys what those bunch of inbreds do to be honest and if they go and join EPL2, an atlantic league or ****** off and play each other 30 times a season the quicker the better :agree:

Get rid of them and stop them ruining scottish football and take the opportunity to completely overhaul our game for the better, summer football, fewer leagues of 16 teams with a proper pyramid system with promotion & relegation from top to bottom with 1 regulatory body managing everything, focus on clubs to develop thier own players with home-grown quotas etc.

bring it on

[heretoday]

Couldn't give a monkeys what those bunch of inbreds do to be honest and if they go and join EPL2, an atlantic league or ****** off and play each other 30 times a season the quicker the better :agree:

Get rid of them and stop them ruining scottish football and take the opportunity to completely overhaul our game for the better, summer football, fewer leagues of 16 teams with a proper pyramid system with promotion & relegation from top to bottom with 1 regulatory body managing everything, focus on clubs to develop thier own players with home-grown quotas etc.

bring it on

Okay! I just suspect that the prospect of no regular OF game in future could give the "inbreds" reason to think again.

[The_Todd]

Grossly unfair to the other 72 league clubs who don't get automatic buy in to this weird EPL2 setup.

It'll never happen. The EPL clubs don't need Celtic and Rangers, they seem to be doing OK without their help thank you very much.

[Tinyclothes]

The only way they should be allowed to go down south is if they start from the bottom in the Unibond league or equivilent, the same as newly formed club. One that springs to mind is my mates team Halifax Town that went under and reformed as FC Halifax and are now 4 leagues lower then they were. If they want to go this route then fair enough but to just parachute them into the EPL on the strength of their fan base and earning power is a disgrace. If they do that then Leeds can say that they shouldn't be in league 1 because they have way more fans than Leyton Orient.

[WindyMiller]

Just imagine both of them drawn away on the same weekend; the thought of 10k bigot brothers roaming the highways and byways of England would give the chief constables apoplexy.

[Jim44]

Okay! I just suspect that the prospect of no regular OF game in future could give the "inbreds" reason to think again.

Add to that, the possibility of no 'almost guaranteed' involvement in European matches, until they managed to drag themselves up to the standard of the 'big guys' in the EPL........which might be never. I can't se their 'fans' standing for this.

[Phil MaGlass]

The sooner the EPL allow them in,the better,for me that day cant come quick enough,and if the rest of the SPL are smart enough, they will resign from the SPL 2 years before the OF go, and fu-- them up for revenue for 2 years.

[WindyMiller]

Add to that, the possibility of no 'almost guaranteed' involvement in European matches, until they managed to drag themselves up to the standard of the 'big guys' in the EPL........which might be never. I can't se their 'fans' standing for this.


I feel that them going to any other league is showing huge disrespect to their fans.
The costs to the travelling fan will be prohibitive, but the clubs really don't care as it's all about making money from t.v.

[jacomo]

The proposal under discussion this week by some Prem chairmen is for a new two-tier premier league. Celtic and Rangers would be invited to join the lower tier initially.

There would be promotion and relegation to and from this new structure.

Should either of the OF get promoted or, hopefully, relegated, wouldn't that mean the end of the OF fixture possibly for years unless they were drawn together in a Cup competition?

Surely the loony OF fans wouldn't put up with their regular bloodletting and flag waving days out being curtailed?

They were talking about this on 5 Live last night, and asked listeners to text in with their comments.

All the texts were about the feasibility or otherwise of the proposals, with the vast majority against the move... apart from one Yam, who texted in to say that in 5 years time Hearts would be "dominating" Scottish football.

Bless!

[Kaiser1962]

The only way they should be allowed to go down south is if they start from the bottom in the Unibond league or equivilent, the same as newly formed club. One that springs to mind is my mates team Halifax Town that went under and reformed as FC Halifax and are now 4 leagues lower then they were. If they want to go this route then fair enough but to just parachute them into the EPL on the strength of their fan base and earning power is a disgrace. If they do that then Leeds can say that they shouldn't be in league 1 because they have way more fans than Leyton Orient.

The other way it might happen is if the EPL teams buckle under their massive debts which would lead to a restructuring of the English Leagues and perhaps open up a British system. These are the only conditions that FIFA/UEFA would allow this to happen. The English that "might" vote for this (Bolton?) are only thinking that an EPL2 might soften the financial blow if they got relegated. I have to say that, if you ignore the debt being racked up, then the English League system is as good and as fair as it gets.

[Hibercelona]

They were talking about this on 5 Live last night, and asked listeners to text in with their comments.

All the texts were about the feasibility or otherwise of the proposals, with the vast majority against the move... apart from one Yam, who texted in to say that in 5 years time Hearts would be "dominating" Scottish football.

Bless!

I totally agree. I think they will dominate Scottish football. :agree:















If the highland league don't mind like. :devil:

[Joe Baker II]

Just imagine both of them drawn away on the same weekend; the thought of 10k bigot brothers roaming the highways and byways of England would give the chief constables apoplexy.

No evidence this is the case, this is something non-OF firms tend to want to believe so they can get on their sanctimonious high horse. There are far more important reasons for concern over this.

Although, I used to be totally opposed to OF leaving Scottish League (they are not of course leaving Scotland) because of the damage it would do to the rest of Scottish football for a variety of well-documented reasons. I may be more favourable now as there may be a case for saying that the hugely increased income to Scottish clubs (even if goes direct to Old Firm at first instance - apologies to any fans of these clubs reading as I know many do not like the term) would have trickle down effect that would benefit Scottish game overall. Given the way Premiership clubs in England have spent revenues since 1994 I have doubts on this but less than I used to.

[Antifa Hibs]

If this happens scottish fitba is fk'd.

I can't see it going through though, Rangers and Celtic fans don't want it, well the hardcore, the lads that have been going for the last 3 decades. No doubt the pr1cks who go to games in their suits and have held a season ticket for the last 5 years in leather seats as its fashionable will want it.

F&*K MODERN FOOTBALL

[MB62]

If this happens scottish fitba is fk'd.


care to expand on why this would be the case IYO?

[Dashing Bob S]

No evidence this is the case, this is something non-OF firms tend to want to believe so they can get on their sanctimonious high horse. There are far more important reasons for concern over this.

Although, I used to be totally opposed to OF leaving Scottish League (they are not of course leaving Scotland) because of the damage it would do to the rest of Scottish football for a variety of well-documented reasons. I may be more favourable now as there may be a case for saying that the hugely increased income to Scottish clubs (even if goes direct to Old Firm at first instance - apologies to any fans of these clubs reading as I know many do not like the term) would have trickle down effect that would benefit Scottish game overall. Given the way Premiership clubs in England have spent revenues since 1994 I have doubts on this but less than I used to.

I cringe whenever I hear that phrase used.This effect is a fallacy, and it's always adopted by the powerful to further promote their selfish interests at the expense of everyone else.

[heretoday]

They were talking about this on 5 Live last night, and asked listeners to text in with their comments.

All the texts were about the feasibility or otherwise of the proposals, with the vast majority against the move... apart from one Yam, who texted in to say that in 5 years time Hearts would be "dominating" Scottish football.

Bless!

The only way Hearts will dominate Scottish football is if we win the league the next couple of years and take the road south along with the OF!

Do you fancy it?

[Antifa Hibs]

care to expand on why this would be the case IYO?

No sponsorship money or TV revenue for starters.

Lower crowds for the diddy teams.

[StevieC]

No sponsorship money or TV revenue for starters.

Which the OF take the vast majority of anyway.


Lower crowds for the diddy teams.

It only affects the teams in the top division, and have the OF really been bringing that many to games recently. I think the travelling OF support has been dropping for years.

I think that the teams that will lose out on OF crowds are just as likely to see their own crowds increase as actually winning something becomes a reality.

[kennyh]

Personally I would hope they go and let the rest of us get on with things.
I appreciate there would be a lower TV pot to be divvied up and some clubs would lose out big time due to their reliance on the travelling OF support but those clubs must be aware that the supporters of the OF are no longer selling out every ground. If the competition between those that remained was as competitive as I think then travelling supports would increase to help compensate for the lack of OF punters.

I dont for a minute expect the OF to consult fans before taking up any offer if it came their way and the initial enthusiasm will be met with the realisation that they are no longer winning anything and are having to pay through their noses to watch their teams in England (if they can get a ticket).
Some of the larger clubs charge £50/60 a ticket to home and away fans so that will be a bit of a culture shock to them and would the OF start to do the same to try and remain competitive?

Most of the big clubs also sell out every week so the away allocation is at best 1-2K. I appreciate at Blackburn, Wigan etc they can get a much larger allocation but would the OF really take 5-7K to games like that when they struggle to take that many 15 miles down the road to the likes of Kilmarnock or Motherwell these days.

At the end of the day I cant see the Premiership in any form inviting the OF down but I really hope they do and we can watch as both clubs crowds dwindle away and the debts increase and increase as they chase the impossible dream of becoming a dominant force.

Just look at the debt Bolton have and they take in all that TV cash year after year. its no surprse they want Prem 2. Its to protect them from sliding down the Leagues like Leeds and others have done.

It aint gonna happen but I hope it does......

[The_Todd]

So tomorrow the EPL will be discussing the merits of EPL2 and once again the OF will probably be mentioned.

Ewan Cameron spouting off on Real Radio just now that everyone should support one of the OF in the event it would happen. WTF is he banging on about? Surely as a supporter of Hearts he should be more concerned about this would affect the rest of the SPL, his team included than jumping on the OF bandwagon?

The guys a class A fud.

[Dr_Regal]

I have just got a sneaky suspicion that this might happen. Been a bit of support for them recently from certain individuals. One part of me wants them to stay, and the other wants them gone.

[HibbyAndy]

:pray:

[Hibercelona]

Good.

They are graceless, classless fuds.

And we certainly wouldn't miss them. :bye:

[sahib]

So tomorrow the EPL will be discussing the merits of EPL2 and once again the OF will probably be mentioned.

Ewan Cameron spouting off on Real Radio just now that everyone should support one of the OF in the event it would happen. WTF is he banging on about? Surely as a supporter of Hearts he should be more concerned about this would affect the rest of the SPL, his team included than jumping on the OF bandwagon?

The guys a class A fud.

Sorry, if I have said it before, but this is the danger of the OF going to England. They will still be physically here, their supporters will be here and their TV audience will be here.
"Roll up, Roll up support one of bonny Scotland's representatives against the hated English. Blue for proddies, green for green grapes."
Even those of us that detest them, will watch hoping to see them stuffed on national telly.

[The_Todd]

Don't get me wrong I hope the GTF and let us get on without it, but I take exception to Ewan Camerons assertion that everyone should support one of them. Why should I give a flying one about either of them when they go? Especially odd that a so called Hearts fan is wetting his pants from an OF point of view and seems to not care what happens to his team.

I suspect his claims of supporting hearts are as dubious as chick youngs claims of supporting st mirren.

[Horse]

The proposal under discussion this week by some Prem chairmen is for a new two-tier premier league. Celtic and Rangers would be invited to join the lower tier initially.

There would be promotion and relegation to and from this new structure.

Should either of the OF get promoted or, hopefully, relegated, wouldn't that mean the end of the OF fixture possibly for years unless they were drawn together in a Cup competition?

Surely the loony OF fans wouldn't put up with their regular bloodletting and flag waving days out being curtailed?

If the scenario suggested by the Bolton chairman today was to happen then English football really would be a total farce. It was also mentioned that they may consider inviting an Irish "franchise" into he new set up! The game in England has lost it's working man's game status and become a playground for international billionaires to test their egos against one another. If they were to let two sectarian Scottish teams plus a brand new Irish team with no history into their set up then it is no longer a national league it is simply a money making scam. Where would it stop? would a Welsh or French franchise then be allowed to join or even an American franchise? It sounds far fetched but market for sport in TV in the USA is huge and the cash-greedy swines in English football would love to get heir snouts in that trough!

National Leagues should be exactly as the name suggests - Leagues for teams from one nation. Anything else simply is not a national league!

FWIW I would love to get rid of our sectarian franchise but as much as we hate it they're Scottish football's problem and it would be morally wrong to wish them on anyone else!

[Ireallywasthere]

been listening and not only have the In Firm been the saviours of Scottish football, they are about to roll into the English Premiership and save them from financial ruin !!
And here was me thinking that the Jambos were deluded

Oh, and we should be grateful for all they have done for us........

[Dr_Regal]

Don't get me wrong I hope the GTF and let us get on without it, but I take exception to Ewan Camerons assertion that everyone should support one of them. Why should I give a flying one about either of them when they go? Especially odd that a so called Hearts fan is wetting his pants from an OF point of view and seems to not care what happens to his team.

I suspect his claims of supporting hearts are as dubious as chick youngs claims of supporting st mirren.
I see your point, I would watch any game I could that they play in and pray for them to get beat, same as I do now. But they will probably advertise it in a way that we'll be getting the scottish vs english, braveheart stuff and support the cause, similar to the supporting scottish clubs in europe we get now.

[The_Todd]

I wonder how many of us diddy fans take up camerons offer of supporting one of the Old Filth?

Ewan Cameron GTF.

[Keith_M]

.....we'll be getting the scottish vs english, braveheart stuff and support the cause, similar to the supporting scottish clubs in europe we get now.


That would be hilarious. Support the Scottish team whose end of the stadium is full of Union Jacks or the Scottish team whose end of the stadium is full of Irish Tricolours.


:faf:

[blackpoolhibs]

Never going to happen, its either all or nothing.

[JimBHibees]

So tomorrow the EPL will be discussing the merits of EPL2 and once again the OF will probably be mentioned.

Ewan Cameron spouting off on Real Radio just now that everyone should support one of the OF in the event it would happen. WTF is he banging on about? Surely as a supporter of Hearts he should be more concerned about this would affect the rest of the SPL, his team included than jumping on the OF bandwagon?

The guys a class A fud.

He is as much a yam as me IMO.

[JimBHibees]

Don't get me wrong I hope the GTF and let us get on without it, but I take exception to Ewan Camerons assertion that everyone should support one of them. Why should I give a flying one about either of them when they go? Especially odd that a so called Hearts fan is wetting his pants from an OF point of view and seems to not care what happens to his team.

I suspect his claims of supporting hearts are as dubious as chick youngs claims of supporting st mirren.

:agree: Totally.

[JimBHibees]

Why would any English team vote for 2 teams to come in and potentially stop their team staying in the top division. Turkeys voting for Xmas. What was it last time 0 for, 20 against.

[ballengeich]

Why would any English team vote for 2 teams to come in and potentially stop their team staying in the top division. Turkeys voting for Xmas. What was it last time 0 for, 20 against.

Precisely. The question the Scottish media seem unable to ask is what's in it for the English. Accepting the OF will only make sense to them if it leads to an increase in total league tv payments which is greater than the amount the OF will take out. How many people who don't currently watch the Premier will be added? I suspect very few.

[Hibbyradge]

Why would any English team vote for 2 teams to come in and potentially stop their team staying in the top division. Turkeys voting for Xmas. What was it last time 0 for, 20 against.

I guess you should ask the Chairmen and Managers of the English clubs who support the idea.

There are several who have said as much recently. :agree:

[The_Todd]

Precisely. The question the Scottish media seem unable to ask is what's in it for the English. Accepting the OF will only make sense to them if it leads to an increase in total league tv payments which is greater than the amount the OF will take out. How many people who don't currently watch the Premier will be added? I suspect very few.

Well, if you believe Ewan Cameron the EPL is in a state of decline and is badly faltering, rantic are apparently the "Viagra" (his words) that the EPL needs. Also, Sky are calling the shots in a joint conspiracy with ESPN and they demand it happens. Or so he says.

[jacomo]

Never going to happen, its either all or nothing.

:agree:

However, I am almost enjoying this... by getting their hopes up, it will make the inevitable collapse of the "OF to England" campaign all the sweeter.

Can you imagine if the Old Firm did try to leapfrog over clubs like Newcastle, Leeds or Forest into the Premiership? Their lawyers would be the busiest people in England.

[Hibbyradge]

Well, if you believe Ewan Cameron the EPL is in a state of decline and is badly faltering, rantic are apparently the "Viagra" (his words) that the EPL needs. Also, Sky are calling the shots in a joint conspiracy with ESPN and they demand it happens. Or so he says.

Seriously, you need to calm down and not take what Cameron says so seriously.

Real Radio is a wind-up station.

They say what they think will spark the biggest controversy so folk will tune in.

Cameron is a Yam. He doesn't believe what he's saying about Rantic.

[Minder]

Please, please take them. We have had enough of the whining, cheating,paranoia, hatred,bile and fleas. Sooner the better.

[Biggie]

There was some rantic fan on saying they would join forces and it would be like scotland vs england every week :eek:
Can you imagine the destruction when the old firm come to town....oh dear...they'd soon get punted, and I hope scottish football has grown a pair by then and tell them to gtf if they want back here !

[Part/Time Supporter]

So tomorrow the EPL will be discussing the merits of EPL2 and once again the OF will probably be mentioned.

Ewan Cameron spouting off on Real Radio just now that everyone should support one of the OF in the event it would happen. WTF is he banging on about? Surely as a supporter of Hearts he should be more concerned about this would affect the rest of the SPL, his team included than jumping on the OF bandwagon?

The guys a class A fud.

Let me guess, Roughy took the opposite position, no?

:deal:

:tumble:

:zzzzz!:

:troll:

[The_Todd]

Let me guess, Roughy took the opposite position, no?


Roughy was pretty quiet during Camerons whole pro OF speech, was a bit of a one sided affair.

I hope he gets his wish and he can support the OF down south. If that happens maybe Real Radio can be limited to Glasgow and we can get Talk107 back.

[Steve20]

Roughy was pretty quiet during Camerons whole pro OF speech, was a bit of a one sided affair.

I hope he gets his wish and he can support the OF down south. If that happens maybe Real Radio can be limited to Glasgow and we can get Talk107 back.

As much as I hate Real Radio, I would never wish for Talk107 back.

[basehibby]

FFS what a complete bore this has become.

Message to the EPL - PLEASE take them off our hands.

Message to the OF - PLEASE F- Off and Die

Money grabbing bawbags the lot of them :bitchy::jamboak:

[PeeKay]

FFS what a complete bore this has become.

Message to the OF - PLEASE F- Off and Die

:

If they do go to the EPL then I think you might get your wish. Although TV money will increase the glory hunters will stop turning up if they can no longer be guaranteed to see an OF win - and in fact are likely to see them humped by the likes of Arsenal. And if they want to compete with the best in England they will have to take on levels of debt that will make the huns £30million look like pin money.

[LancsHibs]

When they get relegated, where will they go???:confused:
Will they be relagated into the English Coke League or are we expected to welcome them back!!!:bitchy:
Never going to happen:bye:

[Mikey]

I can't help feeling that those who would be happy to see the back of them are being spectacularly short sighted. The income will dry up overnight and Scottish football would fall off the map. The OF have plundered Scotland for years and this really should be time to bite back.

Assuming their move is rejected, every senior team in Scotland should resign from their league and start a new set up from next season. If Rangers and Celtic want to be a part of it that's fine, but it'll be on our terms. It's time their power was diluted.

The only other viable option is a British League with the lower tiers being regionalised. Anything else will leave us with a League of Wales type set up in 5-10 years time.

[LancsHibs]

I can't help feeling that those who would be happy to see the back of them are being spectacularly short sighted. The income will dry up overnight and Scottish football would fall off the map. The OF have plundered Scotland for years and this really should be time to bite back.

Assuming their move is rejected, every senior team in Scotland should resign from their league and start a new set up from next season. If Rangers and Celtic want to be a part of it that's fine, but it'll be on our terms. It's time their power was diluted.

The only other viable option is a British League with the lower tiers being regionalised. Anything else will leave us with a League of Wales type set up in 5-10 years time.

I too would support a 'British League' (maybe partly for selfish reasons:greengrin) BUT NOT AT THE DETRAMENT OF THE SCOTTISH NATIONAL TEAM.
Also agree that a stand alone Scottish League would suffer without the Uglies but not be as pishy as the LOW, would probably end up with something like the Irish League in size & quality

[blackpoolhibs]

I too would support a 'British League' (maybe partly for selfish reasons:greengrin) BUT NOT AT THE DETRAMENT OF THE SCOTTISH NATIONAL TEAM.
Also agree that a stand alone Scottish League would suffer without the Uglies but not be as pishy as the LOW, would probably end up with something like the Irish League in size & quality

Maybe it would be like the swedish league, maybe the irish league, or maybe it would get stronger, who knows? At least we would have a league that would sink or swim without having to pander to the 2 clubs that are doing everything in their power to squeeze every last penny out of it for themselves.

We would be left with a more competitive league, thats for sure. Would the standard dip, perhaps? Although at least the kids will get a chance, as every club would need to go down that road. I don't believe any of this is relivant, as its never going to happen. The English clubs who are not in the top leagues will never vote for more competition. The national teams question comes up, another reason. Plus it would open up the biggest can of worms for uefa or fifa. The top Austrian clubs would then want to join the German league.

The top Portuguese teams the Spanish, and the French top sides would probably also want to join in over the water with england.

Its just not going to happen.

[MB62]

I can't help feeling that those who would be happy to see the back of them are being spectacularly short sighted. The income will dry up overnight and Scottish football would fall off the map. The OF have plundered Scotland for years and this really should be time to bite back.

Assuming their move is rejected, every senior team in Scotland should resign from their league and start a new set up from next season. If Rangers and Celtic want to be a part of it that's fine, but it'll be on our terms. It's time their power was diluted.

The only other viable option is a British League with the lower tiers being regionalised. Anything else will leave us with a League of Wales type set up in 5-10 years time.

Can't agree with this Mikey. YES, income would be affected but it wouldn't DRY UP, there will be income, most probably on a much reduced rate, but there will be sponsors. Clubs will yet again have to cut their cloth and tighten theirs belts even further, and we might see more and more teams relying on their youth players as first team regulars to reduce wage bills further, but the game will survive.

I think the reason Hibs gates have not increased as much as we would have hoped so far this year, despite our general good form, is because everybody is expecting the inevitable dropping of points and rantic running away with things as usual. IMO, if we were sitting top of a OF free SPL, with Dundee Utd, Motherwell, etc chasing us hard, Hibs crowds would be well on the up as there would be a far greater hope of continuing this run to the end of the season with a possible title to be won.
There will be a T.V. deal, greatly reduced no doubt, but somebody would want to show and OF free SPL. With the prospect of a possible champions league spot available to the winners, money will come in to the game.

I can't share your fear over their departure and remember, it was not that long ago that Hibs, Hearts and Aberdeen stood firm and told them to GTF, so obviously our board think it is workable without them.

[big-mo]

Let's face it, the EPL is currently an international league that just happens to be played in England. More and more of the owners don't even live in England, the vast majority of top players are foreign, their audiences are (as far as TV coverage) world wide, so why not let the OF join, and while we are at it, why not a couple of French teams, or Dutch, or Portuguese?

If the OF do eventually go, it is essential that they are not allowed to have a presence left playing in the Scottish structure. There was talk of them leaving their reserves in the league, that way it would only be a win-win situation for them and a lose-lose for the rest of us.

[LancsHibs]

Its just not going to happen.

Correct:agree:

[The_Todd]

I don't think the SPL would be reduced to a LoW type league at all. The LoW was invented in 1992 and made up of amateur teams, mostly from outside the cities.

Without the OF we still have ourselves, Aberdeen, Hearts, United, Motherwell... any one of these teams probably has a bigger fan base than the entire Welsh League combined. And so what if we become less competitive in Europe even if we did qualify? We don't exactly set the heather alight as it is.

But no matter what the future holds, it's about time the Old Firm decided what they're doing - they're either in or out of the SPL. All the heel dragging and putting the SPL down is doing nobody any good. I think the SPL should grow a pair and give them a deadline to commit or leave. Even if they don't have an offer of anywhere else to play.

[Hibbyradge]

Which the OF take the vast majority of anyway.



It only affects the teams in the top division, and have the OF really been bringing that many to games recently. I think the travelling OF support has been dropping for years.

I think that the teams that will lose out on OF crowds are just as likely to see their own crowds increase as actually winning something becomes a reality.

The Old Firm do not take the vast majority of the TV money.

The team which finishes 1st receives 17% and the second place receives 15%.

Assuming that Rantic occupy these positions every year, they still only get 32%, not the vast majority.

It could be argued that 32% is too much, but first and second will always receive more than the other places. What percentage would be fairer? :dunno:

However, my problem with the OF leaving isn't what would happen to the Scottish League in the first couple of years, but in the longer term.

Celtic v Everton or Spurs or Wolves, for example, will still be a more attractive proposition than almost any of the remaining SPL games. When Liverpool, Man U, Man City, Chelsea, Arsenal or Rangers were involved, it would dwarf almost anything else in Europe.

If there were spare tickets for a Celtic game in the EPL or St Mirren v Hibs, which game would a neutral, or more to the point, a new young football fan, want to see?

In the shadow of the EPL on the doorstep, the appeal of Scottish Football would steadily decline.

We can argue about the timescale.

[MB62]

However, my problem with the OF leaving isn't what would happen to the Scottish League in the first couple of years, but in the longer term.

Celtic v Everton or Spurs or Wolves, for example, will still be a more attractive proposition than almost any of the remaining SPL games. When Liverpool, Man U, Man City, Chelsea, Arsenal or Rangers were involved, it would dwarf anything else in Europe almost.

You are of course assuming that they will both be in the top division, which there is no guarantee of.


If there were spare tickets for a Celtic game in the EPL or St Mirren v Hibs, which game would a neutral, or more to the point, a new young football fan, want to see?

How many people who are truly neutral attend football matches. I would guess at 99% of people at games support one team or the other.
We have all been new young football fans at some point, but again I would suggest the reason we are all Hibs supporters is because we were taken along to the game by Father/brother/uncle or whom ever, there was probably no choice in the matter and I doubt that would change much in the future.



We can argue about the timescale.

Well rantic are signed up until 2014 so can't leave the SPL before then, unless of course they are allowed to by the rest of the club and compensation is paid.

[Hibbyradge]

How many people who are truly neutral attend football matches. I would guess at 99% of people at games support one team or the other.
We have all been new young football fans at some point, but again I would suggest the reason we are all Hibs supporters is because we were taken along to the game by Father/brother/uncle or whom ever, there was probably no choice in the matter and I doubt that would change much in the future.



And yet, there are still more folk who leave Edinburgh to watch Rantic every weekend, than go to see Hibs or Hearts at home.

That won't change, in fact, I can only see it getting worse.

I do hope that I'm wrong, but I just can't see how removing the most successful and best supported teams from a league could possibly make it stronger.

Yes, it may be a more competitive league (are we sure about this?), but if fans only wanted competition, they would be watching the East of Scotland league or maybe the Juniors. Yet they don't.

I think folk want to see the best players, the best football on offer and the glamour.

Celtic v even anyone in EPL2 is surely more glamourous than Celtic v Hamilton for example.

Also, I'm not as confident as those who simply say it won't happen.

More and more voices down south are heard in support of the idea. People are getting used to the idea and warming to it.

However, in truth, it only needs one voice to make it happen.

The voice of Rupert Murdoch.

If Rantic can convince him that their inclusion will give Sky an even higher profile globally, things could change very quickly.

[joe breezy]

The Old Firm do not take the vast majority of the TV money.

The team which finishes 1st receives 17% and the second place receives 15%.

Assuming that Rantic occupy these positions every year, they still only get 32%, not the vast majority.

It could be argued that 32% is too much, but first and second will always receive more than the other places. What percentage would be fairer? :dunno:

However, my problem with the OF leaving isn't what would happen to the Scottish League in the first couple of years, but in the longer term.

Celtic v Everton or Spurs or Wolves, for example, will still be a more attractive proposition than almost any of the remaining SPL games. When Liverpool, Man U, Man City, Chelsea, Arsenal or Rangers were involved, it would dwarf almost anything else in Europe.

If there were spare tickets for a Celtic game in the EPL or St Mirren v Hibs, which game would a neutral, or more to the point, a new young football fan, want to see?

In the shadow of the EPL on the doorstep, the appeal of Scottish Football would steadily decline.

We can argue about the timescale.

I agree.

To be honest I'd like us to move top EPL 2 - if we finish 2nd in the SPL this season yet aren't invited to EPL2 surely we could take someone to court?

[Phil MaGlass]

nows the time for the rest of the SPL teams to resign.

http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/sport/Old-Firm-move-south-expected.5816997.jp

[JimBHibees]

I guess you should ask the Chairmen and Managers of the English clubs who support the idea.

There are several who have said as much recently. :agree:

What they say and what they vote for are 2 different things. Why would Bolton a team who are in the area of the league most likely affected get from this. Sounds to me like another agenda at play IMO.

Just saw the article above lower teams are not happy about the money the top 4 are getting. Nothing to do with the OF imo.

[bighairyfaeleith]

If this happens scottish fitba is fk'd.

I can't see it going through though, Rangers and Celtic fans don't want it, well the hardcore, the lads that have been going for the last 3 decades. No doubt the pr1cks who go to games in their suits and have held a season ticket for the last 5 years in leather seats as its fashionable will want it.

F&*K MODERN FOOTBALL

Scottish fitba is already ****ed, and the old firm have played a huge part in that. The status quo is like the band totally ****. Tell the old firm tom play on there own in the spl as soon as possible and lets get a proper setup going that benefits scottish football at all levels and allows us to get back to being a good footballing nation again without this bigotry pish :soapbox:

[Dan Sarf]

I want them to stay. And shrivel. :greengrin

[MB62]

And yet, there are still more folk who leave Edinburgh to watch Rantic every weekend, than go to see Hibs or Hearts at home.

That won't change, in fact, I can only see it getting worse.

I do hope that I'm wrong, but I just can't see how removing the most successful and best supported teams from a league could possibly make it stronger.


This was not about making the league STRONGER, it was some have been suggesting that it would be the end of Scottish football and I was disagreeing on that point.

Parkhead holds 60,000 I believe, and until this year, they were selling that out. So whether it is Celtic v Man Utd or Celtic v Hamilton, it still only holds 60,000 so I don't see how people leaving Edinburgh can get any worse, unless of course the increase capacity by another 10 or 20,000.

My main point though is, regardless of whether they leave or not, Scottish Football will survive.

[Hibbyradge]

My main point though is, regardless of whether they leave or not, Scottish Football will survive.

I agree. There will always be a Scottish League.

I just don't think the standard will be any good and I don't think many folk will watch it.

[HFC93]

The Premier league have rejected the old firm.:boo hoo:

[Benny Brazil]

14 of the Premier League clubs have told the Infirm to bolt. - On BBC Website now.

[HFC93]

14 of the Premier League clubs have told the Infirm to bolt. - On BBC Website now.

Is anyone actually suprised by this?

Suppose we will just have to wait another 6 months for the next proposal.

[Bad Martini]

:bye::bye::bye::bye::bye:

OFGTF

ENDOF

[Dunbar Hibee]

Barely good enough for the SPL never mind the ****in EPL:greengrin

[Kato]

14 of the Premier League clubs have told the Infirm to bolt. - On BBC Website now.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/eng_prem/8353937.stm

The clubs welcomed the additional input into an ongoing process, however, they were of the opinion that bringing Celtic and Rangers into any form of Premier League set-up was not desirable or viable.

Not unexpected. The Old Firm are undesirables - what news about that?

If Scottish Clubs had a vote now I doubt they'd win acceptance into the SPL as they are so despicable.

However - cue loads of mumpy moany rhetoric from the OF about "how they deserve it", why they've "outgrown Scotland" and, in a few months, how a move to the EPL is "on the cards".

If they started acting like the Dutch and Scandi clubs with proper youth systems and training schools they might make a decent fist of things.

[down-the-slope]

Proposal for them to join 2 tier EPL dismissed out of hand.

No one wants them...maybe they should just play each other every week end :rolleyes:

[down-the-slope]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/eng_prem/8353937.stm

[Benny Brazil]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/eng_prem/8353937.stm

The clubs welcomed the additional input into an ongoing process, however, they were of the opinion that bringing Celtic and Rangers into any form of Premier League set-up was not desirable or viable.

Not unexpected. The Old Firm are undesirables - what news about that?

If Scottish Clubs had a vote now I doubt they'd win acceptance into the SPL as they are so despicable.

However - cue loads of mumpy moany rhetoric from the OF about "how they deserve it", why they've "outgrown Scotland" and, in a few months, how a move to the EPL is "on the cards".

If they started acting like the Dutch and Scandi clubs with proper youth systems and training schools they might make a decent fist of things.

Now is the time that the Scottish clubs should be thinking about this. Time for a major shake up in Scottish football and first on the agenda - get the bloodsuckers out.

[Irish Al 2]

The Old Firm do not take the vast majority of the TV money.

The team which finishes 1st receives 17% and the second place receives 15%.

Assuming that Rantic occupy these positions every year, they still only get 32%, not the vast majority.

It could be argued that 32% is too much, but first and second will always receive more than the other places. What percentage would be fairer? :dunno:



In the Premiership last season the top two clubs took 12.7% of the revenue. In percentage terms the gap from top to bottom in the premiership is much narrower. Bolton's chairman though, as well as thinking the bigots would be a worthwhile addition, wants that gap from top to bottom narrowed as the rewards for the top four in terms of CL revenue will continue to make the top four richer and richer.

A pity there's no chairman in the SPL with the sense to try this argument.

Al

[Viva_Palmeiras]

Right, time for the SPL and SFA to either get the OF to draw a line under this or penalise them and censure them for bringing the game into disrepute.

The OF cannot continue to bring this up to the detriment and threat to the Scottish game without sanction IMO.

To the tune the Yambos used on Vlad (when he was in favour)

"You're undesirable,
You're undesirable..."

[Bad Martini]

No one wants them...maybe they should just play each other every week end :rolleyes:

Now then, if the rest of the SPL kicked THEM out of OUR league, I wonder how their league of 2 would do with regards to getting into Europe?

I'd really love to see them both piss off for sure......:thumbsup:

...and all their glory hunting, unwashed, odious fans anaw :thumbsup:

[Green_one]

So they need a 70% vote to get them in but at present they have 70% AGAINST.

Good one

So its the Europa league for them now is it. That is not going to happen any time soon either.

Steady decline of OF ahead.

[1875er]

Not sure how I feel about this as I despise the OF and eveything they stand for, so would have been happy not having them drinking their Bucky and singing their hate filled songs through here.

But I do find it funny that they have been brought crashing back down to earth and them and their fans delusions of grandeur have been shattered once again!!:wink::wink:

[The_Todd]

It will be interesting to see what happens now, that is quite a strong "no" from the EPL there. Will the OF accept that they're simply not wanted in England, or will they throw the toys out the pram?

Both clubs have officially stated that thier future lies outside the SPL, but nobody wants them. What do they do now? We do WE do now? Deduct them 20 points apeice for their treatment of the SPL would be a good start.

[JimBHibees]

So they need a 70% vote to get them in but at present they have 70% AGAINST.

Good one

So its the Europa league for them now is it. That is not going to happen any time soon either.

Steady decline of OF ahead.

Did they actually have a vote on it. It states they need 14 out of the 20 but doesnt mention tehm voting. Sounds like Gartside was just raising this as an excuse to have a go at the SPL re money distribution.

[Viva_Palmeiras]

Surely the issue is a bigger one than the OF.

The issue to me is that FIFA have failed to reign in the MEGA rich clubs. Its like a deregulated zone (like banks anyone?). So until the regulatory bodies get a grip on this there will never be a level playing field. The genie's out the bottle so difficult to see what FIFA can do fairer distribution of TV rights spreading more to grassroots would be a start.

They say what goes up must come down it just mad to see the money spent during a mega-recession on clubs in the EPL. So maybe logic doesn't apply here. One things for sure if/when the billionaires lose interest and call in their loans (Romanov is doing it all on loans right?) then there will be some heavy casualties.

[heretoday]

It would appear that the only people who want Rangers and Celtic are......well.....Rangers and Celtic!

[Shaggy]

bazaar idea in the first place, corporate greed based.
The Rangers fan base are union jack wavers any way,
but Celtic......they are anti english to their rotton core.

Imagine these a-holes rioting every week down south,
they would be ejected from EPL within a month.

So let them go....... and freeze them both out from any return to the SPL:greengrin

(If scots were allowed in, why not dutch, then swedes etc etc blah de***inblahblah)

[BoltonHibee]

What they say and what they vote for are 2 different things. Why would Bolton a team who are in the area of the league most likely affected get from this. Sounds to me like another agenda at play IMO.
Just saw the article above lower teams are not happy about the money the top 4 are getting. Nothing to do with the OF imo.

If Bolton get relegated, they are finished.

The only route for survival for Bolton is if the league they were relegated to, were paying the sides very large amounts of cash (ie television money).The debt Bolton has hanging over them, is massive and a return to the top flight would never happen for them. Gartside is only looking out for himself and Bolton with this EPL2 clap trap.

[Baker9]

The only way Hearts will dominate Scottish football is if we win the league the next couple of years and take the road south along with the OF!

Do you fancy it?

Does it need to be with the old firm? The logical future for Scottish teams joining the EPL would be two teams, one from each of Edinburgh and Glasgow. I seem to recall a throwaway line from John Hughes in one of his interviews along the lines of , "Why not Hibs?", when discussing the OF and England.

I would imagine the following to be more attractive to the EPL:
A respectable, solvent Edinburgh Hibs from the capital with, optional, one team from Glasgow. The Glasgow choice could be made on financial stability, for example. Long term it makes sense.

[crewetollhibee]

Does it need to be with the old firm? The logical future for Scottish teams joining the EPL would be two teams, one from each of Edinburgh and Glasgow. I seem to recall a throwaway line from John Hughes in one of his interviews along the lines of , "Why not Hibs?", when discussing the OF and England.

I would imagine the following to be more attractive to the EPL:
A respectable, solvent Edinburgh Hibs from the capital with, optional, one team from Glasgow. The Glasgow choice could be made on financial stability, for example. Long term it makes sense.
Exactly - that's what I have been thinking all along. Surely a visit to Edinburgh once a year would be far more attractive to travelling supporters ? Oh hang on; I mentioned supporters. We all know how far down WE come into it, don't we ? :wink:

[GreenCastle]

Hum....

So we don't want them and the EPL doesn't want or need them :faf:

They have ruined the game in Scotland and become a victim of their own success - buying other players talents etc.

Scottish football is needing changed - everyone can see that - but why does the SFA not see this ?? Are they too Old Firm biased to realise ?

Just imagine if Rangers hadn't qualified for the Champions League this year where they would be now - even worse financially than they are now!! :agree:

I also agree with what people are saying that they aren't exactly promoting the game in Scotland and in a way bringing the game into disrepute with all this talk of leaving the league - again not doing themselves or the league any favours.

[blackpoolhibs]

English chief executive Richard Scudamore says, Rangers and Celtic will never join the English Premiership. Whats the betting those deluded tossers will still be talking about just that, next year, the year after and 10 years from now?

Its time for the rest of this countries chairmen to grow a huge set of balls, and restructure the whole of Scottish football, top to bottom. Whats the chances of that?:faf::boo hoo:

[MrSmith]

^^ Correct!

Time for change on all levels. We must sack the lot of the OF baised sycophants who run/ruin our game!

someone please design a smiley of 'non OF teams uniting'!

[Part/Time Supporter]

posts re the Huns accounts moved here (http://www.hibs.net/message/showthread.php?t=166498)

[hibee92]

summing up his views on celtic and rangers being rejected from the premiership... basically saying that he's happy they are still part of scottish football but feels for them :agree:

[Part/Time Supporter]

summing up his views on celtic and rangers being rejected from the premiership... basically saying that he's happy they are still part of scottish football but feels for them :agree:

Good on ye Yogi, patronise the buggers.

:greengrin

:top marks

[Hibercelona]

summing up his views on celtic and rangers being rejected from the premiership... basically saying that he's happy they are still part of scottish football but feels for them :agree:

What he really means is...

"I couldn't give a toss where they ended up, they are both rank rotton".

But he's being sensible and keeping it quietly to himself. :agree:

[JimBHibees]

Good on ye Yogi, patronise the buggers.

:greengrin

:top marks

:agree: Aw diddums with a big smile on his face. :greengrin

[Exiled Hibby]

Not much chance of it happening, but imagine if we, or any other non OF team could do the unthinkable this year and win the league - mass loss of interest from the bigoted OF fans for certain. That could lead to a long decline as they, in particular the Huns, struggle to get temselves back on a decent financial footing.
Come on the hibbs!! or United, or Well, or Hea....... phew, stopped my drifting into madness just in time

[Twa Cairpets]

Now that they have been well and truly told that it isnt going to happen, if these morally destitute institutions have any pretence to humility they should say:

"Right, thats it. We're now committed to Scottish Football and will work to genuinely strengthen both the domestic product and the SPL's success in Europe. we will work to maximise revenue through sponsorship in an equitable fashion, and develop football across the country".

I suspect we might be in for a wait, but the first time these arrogant ******** say we want to play in England they should be hammered by the SPL and SFA for bringing the game into disrepute. Every time they bleat or bitch directly affects Hibs and all other teams by devaluing the worth of the League.

[Rossco1875]

ohwell looks like we will beating them on our way to winning the league next season :flag:

[Green_one]

Did they actually have a vote on it. It states they need 14 out of the 20 but doesnt mention tehm voting. Sounds like Gartside was just raising this as an excuse to have a go at the SPL re money distribution.

I think you are right. I was quoting figures from an earlier post. Could be only 1 for, the rest against. Ouch.

Even the one for could be bogus. :faf:

[Part/Time Supporter]

English chief executive Richard Scudamore says, Rangers and Celtic will never join the English Premiership. Whats the betting those deluded tossers will still be talking about just that, next year, the year after and 10 years from now?

Its time for the rest of this countries chairmen to grow a huge set of balls, and restructure the whole of Scottish football, top to bottom. Whats the chances of that?:faf::boo hoo:

Very high, the patter will be that it was 20-0 last time, now they're getting a few English chairmen and managers speaking in favour of them, next time they'll do this, that and the next thing, it will come because Sky will demand it....

:blah: :blah: :blah:

[Hibbyradge]

Very high, the patter will be that it was 20-0 last time, now they're getting a few English chairmen and managers speaking in favour of them, next time they'll do this, that and the next thing, it will come because Sky will demand it....

:blah: :blah: :blah:

And, that may well be the truth.

[jgl07]

No sponsorship money or TV revenue for starters.

Lower crowds for the diddy teams.
I don't follow that one.

Look at the crowds in Division One. In many cases they are higher than the SPL. Ross County v ICT attracted a 6,000 crowd whereas the Lanarkshire
derby between Hamilton and Motherwell was way below 4,000. Dundee are getting crowds in excess of a number of SPL teams.

Division One of the SFL is a very competitive league just as a post OF SPL would be.

Still there is not a chance of it happening.

[Danderhall Hibs]

it will come because Sky will demand it....

:blah: :blah: :blah:


And, that may well be the truth.

Wasn't there claims that Sky were demanding it this time?

[jgl07]

bazaar idea in the first place, corporate greed based.
The Rangers fan base are union jack wavers any way,
but Celtic......they are anti english to their rotton core.

It sounds more like Hearts 'sale of the century'!

[Dashing Bob S]

Yes, it was obvious that Gartside was using them as a distraction to further his agenda. That one failed miserably. However, the non-story will surface again in a few months, as long as enough OF obsessed balloons are interested. We shouldn't encourage this guff on this board.

[Hibbyradge]

Wasn't there claims that Sky were demanding it this time?

I didn't read that and I very much doubt it was the case.

If Sky demanded it, it would happen.

[Danderhall Hibs]

I didn't read that and I very much doubt it was the case.

If Sky demanded it, it would happen.

I think it was Ewen Cameron on the radio. Probably no need to say anymore!

Probably the reason turned the mics off on Sunday though - they wouldn't want to harm the reputation of Celtc in advance of this vote.

[In_terms_of]

In the Premiership last season the top two clubs took 12.7% of the revenue. In percentage terms the gap from top to bottom in the premiership is much narrower. Bolton's chairman though, as well as thinking the bigots would be a worthwhile addition, wants that gap from top to bottom narrowed as the rewards for the top four in terms of CL revenue will continue to make the top four richer and richer.

A pity there's no chairman in the SPL with the sense to try this argument.

Al

:cool2:

[Horse]

Everytime the Sectarian Franchise isn't quite getting everything it's own way they come up with the "we're off tae England" crap. Everytime they do this the English clubs tell them to F-Off. Is it not about time these deluded sub-humans and their media puppets just accepted they're stuck here and get on with it? Well that won't happen but surely now it's time the rest of the Scottish clubs go together and stood up to these vile parasites who ruin our game?

Other than possibly Hibs, Hearts and Aberdeen, the rest of the SPL clubs would most likely bottle it when it comes to resigning from the SPL and leaving the OF to rot. Smaller teams who are more dependent on the OF for income would never be convinced. The only chance there would be of uniting Scottish clubs against them would be to do something along the lines of this:

Create a new "Super SPL" (or maybe some other similar name), bin this stupid 12 team split set up and go for an 18 team league. All SPL teams except the bigots resign from the SPL and offer 6 other places to teams from the SFL - A pretty attractive proposition to the likes of Dundee, Dunfermline, Raith etc. It may also be attractive to teams like Falkirk, Hamilton, St Mirren, Hearts etc who are likely to be flirting with relegation over the next few years. Offer the remaining 2 places to the OF but on the terms of the rest of the teams. If they accept then fine, they'll probably still dominate but the rest will have a bit more of a say in things. If they refuse simply offer the 2 places to the SFL teams and leave them to rot. I'd imagine they'd soon realise that no-one else wants them and come running back demanding to be let back in. At that point we should be charitable and allow them back in but only if they start right at the bottom of Scottish football and let them earn their right to be in the top league in Scotland.

I accept that the above is complete fantasy and will never happen but would it not be great to see the rest of us finally standing up to these bully's?

[Danderhall Hibs]

:cool2:

In terms of user IDs, are you any relation to spell-checker man? :thumbsup:

[Bad Martini]

What is most priceless and rather vintage aboot all this is their stupid arse backward business model they have gotten away with for so long;

They spend money to win the League/2nd place
They get into Europe, make more money, carry on cycle

...if they fail to get into Europe, they're ****ed.
...if they fail domestically, they are ****ed

They BOTH continue to pay massive wages but DONT get the income to support their spending - it does not take Professor Hawkings to work oot not enough cash coming IN to support the money being spent OUT = bad sheeeet.

Now, compare this with any other losing company right now (you need only look at some companies far bigger than the huns, say some of the biggest banks in the UK) and one can see all this, on the backdrop of the world global economic crisis in a lifetime is not, by anyones standards, good sheeetmon.

Thus, aye, I can see this heading one way. For all the over-spenders who MUST do well to survive, they inveriably wont. :greengrin

Live within yer means ya bawbags, or face extinction. They ARE so stupid they WILL Keep paying the big wages, they will continue to lose more than they win to quote a Tonyisim backwards and they WILL fall foul, just like the worlds largest banks, of the global economic downturn.

Meanwhile, we make a small, modest profit or even a modest loss but WE dont act like ********s. We dont buy or spend beyond our means and we STILL manage to sit up there in the league whlst spending vastly less than these erses.

Who's the wee team now?

And that's all before we get to our pals doon Gorgie :greengrin

Man, its good to be green.

ENDOF :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

[The_Todd]

So funny listening to real radio tonight, it isnae fair, they're frightened of us, why won't the explain themselves? And so on.

And why should they? It's their league after all. Nice lesson for the OF there, the world does not revolve around them.

[Bad Martini]

So funny listening to real radio tonight, it isnae fair, they're frightened of us, why won't the explain themselves? And so on.

And why should they? It's their league after all. Nice lesson for the OF there, the world does not revolve around them.

Aye. Thus meaning they are spending MORE than everyone else in Scotland, no prospect of recovering those costs in Scotland and if they don't do well in Europe (their only means to make some of their money back) they will be living outwith their means........a fine business model if you want to rack up lots of debt with no real clear means of repaying it.

That said, in todays financial climate I'm sure the banks will extend more credit, give them plenty time to repay and of course, indulge their excessive spending as they have plenty spare cash right now to lend :devil::devil::devil::devil:

[EasterRoad4Ever]

Precisely. The question the Scottish media seem unable to ask is what's in it for the English. Accepting the OF will only make sense to them if it leads to an increase in total league tv payments which is greater than the amount the OF will take out. How many people who don't currently watch the Premier will be added? I suspect very few.

This is all about vested interests. The so called Scottish media must be lickin their lips at the thought of covering EPL teams coming to Glasgae, and all the bigger paid jobs that go with it. To think of Chick Young going global id frightening :bitchy:

[Leithenhibby]

This is all about vested interests. The so called Scottish media must be lickin their lips at the thought of covering EPL teams coming to Glasgae, and all the bigger paid jobs that go with it. To think of Chick Young going global id frightening :bitchy:

:faf: :shocked:

Now that is a frightening thought.

[Woody1985]

This is all about vested interests. The so called Scottish media must be lickin their lips at the thought of covering EPL teams coming to Glasgae, and all the bigger paid jobs that go with it. To think of Chick Young going global id frightening :bitchy:

:greengrin

Do you think he'd still support St Mirren if they moved down there away from the SPL and the scrutiny? Would he ****.

[Kaiser1962]

So they need a 70% vote to get them in but at present they have 70% AGAINST.

Good one

So its the Europa league for them now is it. That is not going to happen any time soon either.

Steady decline of OF ahead.

Still an improvement of...erm...6...on the vote 9 years ago. I still suspect that the 6 may have crapped themselves if it got close but hey, 6 is still a moral victory and their cunning plan is working. In 30 years they should have 70%. Maybe.
Cue "the english are feart frae us" brigade.

[blackpoolhibs]

Still an improvement of...erm...6...on the vote 9 years ago. I still suspect that the 6 may have crapped themselves if it got close but hey, 6 is still a moral victory and their cunning plan is working. In 30 years they should have 70%. Maybe.
Cue "the english are feart frae us" brigade.

I dont think thats the case. They never said 6 voted for it.

[MrSmith]

They are still at it! convinced change will occur in 2 to 5 years and they'll be off to EPL!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/eng_prem/8353937.stm

But Rangers chairman Alastair Johnston believes the Premier League's rejection is not the end of the issue.
"I don't think it's the end of the talk in terms of moving away because I think there are winds of change moving across Uefa," he said.
"For Rangers or Celtic to enjoy a profile in a new world order of football, something will need to change in the next two to five years."


Total ****ing ******s!

I'm sick of them and very bored!!

[lapsedhibee]

"I don't think it's the end of the talk in terms of moving away because I think there are winds of change moving across Uefa," he said.

Winds of change moving across Uefa. Phhh. Big football clubs don't want the huns. They'll need to make do with a pan-European league of small darts players, where they'll fit in just perfick.

[Kaiser1962]

I dont think thats the case. They never said 6 voted for it.

Correct BH. Misread an earlier post so Bolton voted for it then and........errrrm.......... thats it. I feel even better. What a total humiliation.

[poolman]

Very high, the patter will be that it was 20-0 last time, now they're getting a few English chairmen and managers speaking in favour of them, next time they'll do this, that and the next thing, it will come because Sky will demand it....

:blah: :blah: :blah:


Here's a couple of snippets from the BBC report

they were of the opinion that bringing Celtic and Rangers into any form of Premier League set-up was not desirable or viable.

"As regards to Celtic and Rangers it's a non-starter," he said. "So we've made a clear and unequivocal statement and we're going to move on from there. No means no.

The clubs constitutionally voted to say we're not going to take this any further, Celtic and Rangers are not coming in."



Wolves chief executive Jez Moxey added: "It's the English Premier League. It's our product and we're working on our product. The Premier League clubs have made their decision and we move on. We wanted clarity and we've got clarity."


This is a clear and unequivocal GTF to the Ugly Sisters

Maybe now they will realise that they are not the big-wigs of football they clearly think they are, the Huns have a lot more to think about than crawling their way into the EPL with their latest accounts just been published

Who would have thought five years ago that both Yams and Huns both being £30m in debt

The Tache, I salute you for your custody of the Hibees as Chairman and for the most part Chief Exec as well :not worth

[jgl07]

"As regards to Celtic and Rangers it's a non-starter," he said. "So we've made a clear and unequivocal statement and we're going to move on from there. No means no.

The clubs constitutionally voted to say we're not going to take this any further, Celtic and Rangers are not coming in."

Wolves chief executive Jez Moxey added: "It's the English Premier League. It's our product and we're working on our product. The Premier League clubs have made their decision and we move on. We wanted clarity and we've got clarity."

Hmmmmm

What happens if Cardiff and Swansea win promotion this season?

This is perfectly possible scenario.

[poolman]

Hmmmmm

What happens if Cardiff and Swansea win promotion this season?

This is perfectly possible scenario.


I heard him asked this earlier on the telly and he explained that this was a product of nearly a hundred years or so of them playing in Engerland

[JackRegan]

It would appear that the only people who want Rangers and Celtic are......well.....Rangers and Celtic!

I would also say that the fans of either club (well those over 25) are none too keen on the idea either.

Celtic and Rangers made their names in the scottish League, ergo both owe it to that league to stay and help it develop. If both Celtic and Rangers want to play in a more revenue rich and higher profile environment, then both have to perform better in Europe. Simple.

The over hyped bubble, that is the EPL, is all that is wrong with football - hopefully ist bubble will burst soon enough and we can get the game we all loved back.

Failing that - I'm taking up supporting the juniors.

[The_Todd]

Hmmmmm

What happens if Cardiff and Swansea win promotion this season?

This is perfectly possible scenario.

There's no comparison. Swansea and Cardiff have pretty much been there since the beginning, they didn't leave a Welsh league to move across the border, they've both worked up from the bottom. They're also the only two full time Welsh sides so it's not as if the LoW is a viable option for them now that it does exist.

Both teams have been in the top flight and done time in the basement division, they definitely didn't join the top division like Rantic want to.

No parallels between the two situations at all.

[JackRegan]

bazaar idea in the first place, corporate greed based.
The Rangers fan base are union jack wavers any way,
but Celtic......they are anti english to their rotton core.

Imagine these a-holes rioting every week down south,
they would be ejected from EPL within a month.

So let them go....... and freeze them both out from any return to the SPL:greengrin

(If scots were allowed in, why not dutch, then swedes etc etc blah de***inblahblah)

Nonsense.

[WindyMiller]

Nonsense.

Correct Jack.

Celtc are anti-British.

[Thecat23]

Here's a thought.. The way i see this the OF are like a cheating girlfriend! Imagine your girlfriend comes home and says to you, "here i like you're best mate i'm going to go and ask him out as he has more cash and looks better".

Then after she does and comes home and says "aw well i tried but he's not interested" would you just say oh that's fine then just stick with me? NO you would say GTF and i for one think the other 10 teams along with the first division should try and pull away from them and leave them in limbo! :agree:

[MrSmith]

Here's a thought.. The way i see this the OF are like a cheating girlfriend! Imagine your girlfriend comes home and says to you, "here i like you're best mate i'm going to go and ask him out as he has more cash and looks better".

Then after she does and comes home and says "aw well i tried but he's not interested" would you just say oh that's fine then just stick with me? NO you would say GTF and i for one think the other 10 teams along with the first division should try and pull away from them and leave them in limbo! :agree:


Make that 2 now!

[Thecat23]

Make that 2 now!

:thumbsup:

[Steve-O]

I would also say that the fans of either club (well those over 25) are none too keen on the idea either.

Celtic and Rangers made their names in the scottish League, ergo both owe it to that league to stay and help it develop. If both Celtic and Rangers want to play in a more revenue rich and higher profile environment, then both have to perform better in Europe. Simple.

The over hyped bubble, that is the EPL, is all that is wrong with football - hopefully ist bubble will burst soon enough and we can get the game we all loved back.

Failing that - I'm taking up supporting the juniors.

:faint:

I agree with your post!

Not often I can say that :greengrin

[Joe's ice cream]

I would also say that the fans of either club (well those over 25) are none too keen on the idea either.

Celtic and Rangers made their names in the scottish League, ergo both owe it to that league to stay and help it develop. If both Celtic and Rangers want to play in a more revenue rich and higher profile environment, then both have to perform better in Europe. Simple.

The over hyped bubble, that is the EPL, is all that is wrong with football - hopefully ist bubble will burst soon enough and we can get the game we all loved back.

Failing that - I'm taking up supporting the juniors.

Total nonsense, amazing that now you have been told your not welcome, all of a sudden the majority of OF supporters are telling us how over hyped the EPL is etc.......!! and they never realy wanted a part of it

[MB62]

Well they readily admit nobody likes them, now they know also, nobody WANTS them.

[blackpoolhibs]

I would also say that the fans of either club (well those over 25) are none too keen on the idea either.

Celtic and Rangers made their names in the scottish League, ergo both owe it to that league to stay and help it develop. If both Celtic and Rangers want to play in a more revenue rich and higher profile environment, then both have to perform better in Europe. Simple.

The over hyped bubble, that is the EPL, is all that is wrong with football - hopefully ist bubble will burst soon enough and we can get the game we all loved back.

Failing that - I'm taking up supporting the juniors.

Absolute drivel. What league thats higher in profile, and revenue rich wants a better performing rantic?:confused:

[lapsedhibee]

Absolute drivel. What league thats higher in profile, and revenue rich wants a better performing rantic?:confused:

CL, non? :dunno:

[blackpoolhibs]

CL, non? :dunno:

My mistake, i read it he was saying they need to perform better in Europe to still get that move to a better league ie england.

[JackRegan]

Total nonsense, amazing that now you have been told your not welcome, all of a sudden the majority of OF supporters are telling us how over hyped the EPL is etc.......!! and they never realy wanted a part of it

Not me - I said on here years ago when I first joined that I felt this wasy about the EPL - its not a new or unique opinion among Celtic or Rangers fans.

[JackRegan]

Absolute drivel. What league thats higher in profile, and revenue rich wants a better performing rantic?:confused:


You missed point, which is not like you........

I meant both clubs should try and improve by their own means and stay in Europe (CL or EL) for longer.

[blackpoolhibs]

You missed point, which is not like you........

I meant both clubs should try and improve by their own means and stay in Europe (CL or EL) for longer.

Well you should have made it clearer ya tit.

[BravestHibs]

Well you should have made it clearer ya tit.

Amazing.

[poolman]

They are still at it! convinced change will occur in 2 to 5 years and they'll be off to EPL!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/eng_prem/8353937.stm

But Rangers chairman Alastair Johnston believes the Premier League's rejection is not the end of the issue.
"I don't think it's the end of the talk in terms of moving away because I think there are winds of change moving across Uefa," he said.
"For Rangers or Celtic to enjoy a profile in a new world order of football, something will need to change in the next two to five years."


Total ****ing ******s!

I'm sick of them and very bored!!


He's ****in amazing this guy Johnston

Where's the bit about not desirable or viable that he doesn't understand :bitchy:

[Joe Baker II]

Surely the issue is a bigger one than the OF.

The issue to me is that FIFA have failed to reign in the MEGA rich clubs. Its like a deregulated zone (like banks anyone?). So until the regulatory bodies get a grip on this there will never be a level playing field. The genie's out the bottle so difficult to see what FIFA can do fairer distribution of TV rights spreading more to grassroots would be a start.

They say what goes up must come down it just mad to see the money spent during a mega-recession on clubs in the EPL. So maybe logic doesn't apply here. One things for sure if/when the billionaires lose interest and call in their loans (Romanov is doing it all on loans right?) then there will be some heavy casualties.

Precisely - not that you would think so from reading the gibberish in most of the posts from Hibs fans on here . Would add that if inequality of media revenue between different leagues was addressed there would be much less need for this debate to crop up.

[Joe Baker II]

Still an improvement of...erm...6...on the vote 9 years ago. I still suspect that the 6 may have crapped themselves if it got close but hey, 6 is still a moral victory and their cunning plan is working. In 30 years they should have 70%. Maybe.
Cue "the english are feart frae us" brigade.

You actually have a point here, the fact 6 out of 20 clubs seem to favour change regarding OF means only 4 more have to change minds and something might happen - not that I have any enthusiasm for OF in what even some Chairmen of Premierships clubs wrongly call the English League.

[blackpoolhibs]

You actually have a point here, the fact 6 out of 20 clubs seem to favour change regarding OF means only 4 more have to change minds and something might happen - not that I have any enthusiasm for OF in what even some Chairmen of Premierships clubs wrongly call the English League.

I dont think that is right? They never mentioned 6 clubs were in favour.:confused:

[JimBHibees]

You actually have a point here, the fact 6 out of 20 clubs seem to favour change regarding OF means only 4 more have to change minds and something might happen - not that I have any enthusiasm for OF in what even some Chairmen of Premierships clubs wrongly call the English League.


Where is there any mention of 6 voting for them or indeed if there was a vote at all.

[ancient hibee]

The EPL is estimated to have £3billion of debt-call it £150 million per club(I realise the average isn't totally realistic)but this shows the level of expenditure the OF would need to undertake to get to the table;so far all they have thought of is the reward if it exists-where would they get the level of investment required to compete with no guarantee of success.

[GreenCastle]

The EPL is estimated to have £3billion of debt-call it £150 million per club(I realise the average isn't totally realistic)but this shows the level of expenditure the OF would need to undertake to get to the table;so far all they have thought of is the reward if it exists-where would they get the level of investment required to compete with no guarantee of success.

Shhh...

They go down south...FAIL...get into even more debt....crowds go down....then come crawling back to Scotland where they are told where to go :greengrin

[Rossco1875]

no wonder the EPL dont want them, why would they want 10,000 rangers or celtic fans tearing the place up every week but end of the day if they want to go somewhere let them go play each other 30 times a season or in a atlanta league somewhere the SPL would survive:bye:

[hibiedude]

The old firm not wanted in England and not needed in Scotland sums it up perfectly. Both in serous debt and looking at ways to sell there souls. This should be a wake up call to the forces of darkness because they need the SPL because what other League could they dominate the way they do in Scotland.

[GreenCastle]

The old firm not wanted in England and not needed in Scotland sums it up perfectly. Both in serous debt and looking at ways to sell there souls. This should be a wake up call to the forces of darkness because they need the SPL because what other League could they dominate the way they do in Scotland.

Surely other way around in a way ?

Not needed in England - they have enough money in the league already - although with debt etc.

Not wanted in Scotland - majority of football fans in the Scotland have a severe dislike to them and what they stand for.

Send them to the moon I say and play each other x30 a season :bye:

[VegasHibby]

just don't understand the people on here who would love to see the OF go.
Sure we hate them but Scottish football would be very dull without them. And to be honest would struggle.

[Horse]

just don't understand the people on here who would love to see the OF go.
Sure we hate them but Scottish football would be very dull without them. And to be honest would struggle.

We'd love to see them go because we hate them and the shame they bring on our game. Unfortunately they're our problem and we're stuck with them. It would be nice to eradicate this problem by ending their domination of the game and send them spiralling into oblivion by depriving them of the league title and Champions league for a year or two! A strong Hibs, Dundee Utd and Aberdeen over the next few years would be interesting!

[VegasHibby]

We'd love to see them go because we hate them and the shame they bring on our game. Unfortunately they're our problem and we're stuck with them. It would be nice to eradicate this problem by ending their domination of the game and send them spiralling into oblivion by depriving them of the league title and Champions league for a year or two! A strong Hibs, Dundee Utd and Aberdeen over the next few years would be interesting!

Yes a strong Hibs,Utd and Aberdeen would be interesting but not interesting enough. And as far as bringing shame to the game,did you hear about the Dons fan who was set on fire a couple of weeks ago ? Every set of fans has rotten apples at the bottom of the barrell. Not just Rantic

[Horse]

Yes a strong Hibs,Utd and Aberdeen would be interesting but not interesting enough. And as far as bringing shame to the game,did you hear about the Dons fan who was set on fire a couple of weeks ago ? Every set of fans has rotten apples at the bottom of the barrell. Not just Rantic

Not trying to defend such behaviour. By shame I was meaning the unique brand of sectarian and thuggish behaviour that is regularly broadcast across the world at old firm games. Every team has ersholes who follow them but not every team has such a large percentage of erseholes following them and not every team receives such widespread media coverage as the gruesome twosome.

[Horse]

Yes a strong Hibs,Utd and Aberdeen would be interesting but not interesting enough. And as far as bringing shame to the game,did you hear about the Dons fan who was set on fire a couple of weeks ago ? Every set of fans has rotten apples at the bottom of the barrell. Not just Rantic

I'd find a strong Hibs, Utd and Aberdeen challenging the OF over the next few years pretty interesting. I'm sure many Hibby's, Arabs and Sheep would agree!

[Hibbyradge]

Swansea and Cardiff.............. They're also the only two full time Welsh sides



Oh dear.

I bet Jamie McCluskey would disagree.

And the English get critisised for not knowing anything about the Scottish League. :wink:

[anon1]

Old Firm **** need to realise they are small time! Why the **** would any one in England, myself included in this being a Forest fan originally from Nottingham, want that rotten lot playing in the English league for no ther reason than money and their own arrogant greed.

Let them ROT!.. and 'mon the Hibees!! :agree:

[VegasHibby]

I'd find a strong Hibs, Utd and Aberdeen challenging the OF over the next few years pretty interesting. I'm sure many Hibby's, Arabs and Sheep would agree!

I see you're struggling now to make sense of your previous nonsense.......
Hibs ARE challenging the OF right now !!!

[Lucius Apuleius]

How the helldid we manage to have good teams in the old days when it was 2/6 to get in and we had no sponsorship on the jersey and very few televised game?. Boogered if I know.

[Keith_M]

How the helldid we manage to have good teams in the old days when it was 2/6 to get in and we had no sponsorship on the jersey and very few televised game?. Boogered if I know.


Not sure auld yin, Hibs were already Colin Nish when I started going to games in the late 70's. :wink:

[Lucius Apuleius]

Not sure auld yin, Hibs were already Colin Nish when I started going to games in the late 70's. :wink:

:grr:Bloody kids nowadays!!!!!!!:greengrin

Where I am coming from is the fact that we had great teams without all the hoo ha about money. Now I am obviously not that naive to appreciate that the game has changed, however if we had great players and teams before all the money, we can do again. Scottish football would not die without that pair of ass-spot teams.

OFGTF

Reckon a few choruses of nobody wants you, we don't care at the next game against either of them :agree:

[VegasHibby]

How the helldid we manage to have good teams in the old days when it was 2/6 to get in and we had no sponsorship on the jersey and very few televised game?. Boogered if I know.


Because football today is much more of a business. And in business you have to increase profit every year. With that pressure you have to secure sponsorship/tv to buy players to win consistently. The competition is far greater than during the good ol' days.....

Could be a lot worse,in America they actually have tv ads during the game(American football/basketball etc):grr:

[fatbloke]

Now that the EPL has rejected the Ugly Sisters should they ditch Follow Follow and Hail Hail and release a new version of Nobody's Child. The last line of the chorus sums it up perfectly

I quote-

I'm nobody's child, I'm nobody's child
I'm like a flower just growing wild
No mommy's kisses and no daddy's smile
Nobody wants me I'm nobody's child
:greengrin :greengrin: greengrin

O bye the way Old Firm - GIRFUY

[Steve-O]

How the helldid we manage to have good teams in the old days when it was 2/6 to get in and we had no sponsorship on the jersey and very few televised game?. Boogered if I know.

Because kids went out and played football constantly instead of posting on hibs.net, playing on Xbox's and staying in watching X-Factor :agree:

[Dashing Bob S]

To beat the Daily Record to it, I'm going to revise the fascinating topic of the OF joining the English Premier League.

The English would jump at the chance, after all, those are massive clubs.

But would this mean the end of Scottish football, or would a thriving more competitive league emerge?

Could the OF cope in England or would they soon be up there challenging, with the increased television and sponsorship revenue?

WTF will James Traynor, Chick Young, Keith Jackson and all the other useless gob*hites write about now?

[gilliecabbage]

Oh they beasted Maloney, McGeady and Darren O'Dea,
They beasted Hartson, Larsson and Paul McStay,
And all the Celtic greats who walked through park head gates,
Just to be beasted the Glasgow Celtic way.

:agree:

[blackpoolhibs]

Oh they beasted Maloney, McGeady and Darren O'Dea,
They beasted Hartson, Larsson and Paul McStay,
And all the Celtic greats who walked through park head gates,
Just to be beasted the Glasgow Celtic way.

:agree:

:faf::faf::top marks

[Lucius Apuleius]

Because football today is much more of a business. And in business you have to increase profit every year. With that pressure you have to secure sponsorship/tv to buy players to win consistently. The competition is far greater than during the good ol' days.....

Could be a lot worse,in America they actually have tv ads during the game(American football/basketball etc):grr:


Hell of a lot of failures going around then. Joking aside, I am pretty sure Chairmen made profits in the old days as well as supplying decnet football teams.


Because kids went out and played football constantly instead of posting on hibs.net, playing on Xbox's and staying in watching X-Factor :agree:

:agree: I agree too,however where I am coming from is that it should be possible to get them off their Boydesque asses into traing centres and develop them into decent home grown football players who don't demand huge salaries.

[Phil D. Rolls]

I watched Charlton v MK Dons last night. League One (Division Three in old money) seems to be about our level. I think that is where the OF would fit in as well.

[Horse]

I see you're struggling now to make sense of your previous nonsense.......
Hibs ARE challenging the OF right now !!!

Agreed, but it's still early days and we still have room for improvement. Having 2 or 3 non OF teams doing well and taking points of the OF regularly would make things very interesting over the next few years, given the state of the OF just now.