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View Full Version : We need a much bigger midfield



RIP
23-09-2009, 09:33 AM
Oh for the days of .............

Scott Brown - 5foot9 and 10.5stone
Kevin Thomson - 5foot11 and 10.5stone
Michael Stewart - 6foot and 11stone
Ivan Sproule - 5foot9 and 10.5stone

(Weights then - not now)

Now that's what I call a big midfield :wink:

Not like our shortarses ........

Patrick Cregg - 5foot9 and 10.5stone
Kevin McBride - 5foot10 and 10.5stone
David Wotherspoon - 5foot11 and 11stone
John Rankin - 5foot8 and 12.5stone

Speedway
23-09-2009, 09:35 AM
Oh for the days of .............

Scott Brown - 5foot9 and 10.5stone
Kevin Thomson - 5foot11 and 10.5stone
Michael Stewart - 6foot and 11stone
Ivan Sproule - 5foot9 and 10.5stone

(Weights then - not now)

Now that's what I call a big midfield :wink:

Not like our shortarses ........

Patrick Cregg - 5foot9 and 10.5stone
Kevin McBride - 5foot10 and 10.5stone
David Wotherspoon - 5foot11 and 11stone
John Rankin - 5foot8 and 12.5stone


Now then, dictionary at the ready, searching for the definition of 'Irony'

Hibs Giant
23-09-2009, 09:49 AM
Your right. There's definitely more to it than size. When Thomson added a bit of physical know-how to his game he became twice as good. Zemmama was the smallest midfielder out there and he certainly wasn't getting bullied like the others.

Jamesie
23-09-2009, 11:59 AM
We need Bamba back in the midfield. I know his preference is in defence but he is a bombscare there, while in the middle of the park he offers some much needed height and muscle.

Going back to the early 00's, I'd love to see Bamba in a Matty Jack kind of role allowing Zemmama - who did well in my book when he came on last night - taking on the role of Latapy. Can see the latter happening but I'm not convinced Bamba is in Jack's league.

I was just thinking, Bamba has been p!sh since the transfer window closed. Given all the speculation, do you think he has taken the hump given he didn't get a move?

Franck is God
23-09-2009, 12:06 PM
there are some fans that believe that having three Sol Bamba's in the middle is that answer to our problems.

I've never understood that mentality, Jody Morris was the best midfielder on the pitch last night and also the smallest. Size has nothing to do with anything.

I'll take work rate and ability over size any day.

TornadoHibby
23-09-2009, 12:17 PM
there are some fans that believe that having three Sol Bamba's in the middle is that answer to our problems.

I've never understood that mentality, Jody Morris was the best midfielder on the pitch last night and also the smallest. Size has nothing to do with anything.

I'll take work rate and ability over size any day.

:top marks

The former (work rate) was seriously posted missing for us last night as it was on Saturday with last night even worse though! :confused:

We just didn't compete physically or effort wise with St J and they deserved their victory on merit as a result! :agree:

Good luck to them in the next round and as far as they go in the competition! :agree:

Tomsk
23-09-2009, 12:22 PM
there are some fans that believe that having three Sol Bamba's in the middle is that answer to our problems.

I've never understood that mentality, Jody Morris was the best midfielder on the pitch last night and also the smallest. Size has nothing to do with anything.

I'll take work rate and ability over size any day.

Agreed. It's not bigger we need (leaving aside the OP's obviousy intended irony) it's better.

I would move Bamba into centre mid not because he's bigger but because he's better.

The_Horde
23-09-2009, 01:10 PM
Oh for the days of .............

Scott Brown - 5foot9 and 10.5stone
Kevin Thomson - 5foot11 and 10.5stone
Michael Stewart - 6foot and 11stone
Ivan Sproule - 5foot9 and 10.5stone

(Weights then - not now)

Now that's what I call a big midfield :wink:

Not like our shortarses ........

Patrick Cregg - 5foot9 and 10.5stone
Kevin McBride - 5foot10 and 10.5stone
David Wotherspoon - 5foot11 and 11stone
John Rankin - 5foot8 and 12.5stone


Really?

VegasHibby
23-09-2009, 06:07 PM
there are some fans that believe that having three Sol Bamba's in the middle is that answer to our problems.

I've never understood that mentality, Jody Morris was the best midfielder on the pitch last night and also the smallest. Size has nothing to do with anything.

I'll take work rate and ability over size any day.

:top marks absolutely right. This myth people have,especially in Scotland that height is fundamental to a midfield is complete nonesense. It's all about skill and hunger to win the ball. I'll say it again Manu Utd are THE smallest team in the EPL !

lumbo_hfc
23-09-2009, 07:47 PM
:top marks absolutely right. This myth people have,especially in Scotland that height is fundamental to a midfield is complete nonesense. It's all about skill and hunger to win the ball. I'll say it again Manu Utd are THE smallest team in the EPL !

The SPL does not even come close to comparing with the EPL in quality, 2 different games in my eyes! in scotland on tighter pitches i think a player who is going to win tackles and headers is essential (obviously playing beside a player who is willing to get forward and support the strikers) This player does not have to be big but i think and what i think everyone else who says to play bamba in there is that he is our best option that we have!:agree:

Franck is God
23-09-2009, 08:37 PM
the pitches aren't any tighter in Scotland than England, there is generally only a few feet to a yard in it between grounds particularly at a professional level.

Winning the ball back is to do with desire and pace and size has very little to do with it. As for heading the ball that is what your centre halfs are supposed to do, if they aren't it means the entire team is sitting too deep.

Last night St johnstones players didn't look much bigger than ours but they chased and harried and worked twice as hard as any of ours, that was why they won the midfield battle and very deservedly the game.

VegasHibby
23-09-2009, 09:05 PM
The SPL does not even come close to comparing with the EPL in quality, 2 different games in my eyes! in scotland on tighter pitches i think a player who is going to win tackles and headers is essential (obviously playing beside a player who is willing to get forward and support the strikers) This player does not have to be big but i think and what i think everyone else who says to play bamba in there is that he is our best option that we have!:agree:

I agree about Bamba only because he's less dangerous to Hibs there.
All pitches in U.k. are regulated they're inches within the requirements. And you're completely missing the point with the EPL and SPL reference. It's all relative.
Look mate it's simple HEIGHT HAS GOT NOTHING TO DO WITH IT !

Sir David Gray
23-09-2009, 09:45 PM
For me, Bamba is a centre half. I don't believe that he is a central midfielder as his passing just isn't good enough to play in that position. You need your midfielders to be good passers of the ball and I don't believe that he fits that criteria.

He is (usually) a good tackler but there's not much use in making a tackle that wins possession if you simply just give it away two seconds later by making a bad pass.

Unfortunately for Bamba, although I think it's his best position, he wasn't even good at being centre half last night, in fact that's a massive understatement, he had a complete nightmare.

sahib
23-09-2009, 10:39 PM
For me, Bamba is a centre half. I don't believe that he is a central midfielder as his passing just isn't good enough to play in that position. You need your midfielders to be good passers of the ball and I don't believe that he fits that criteria.

He is (usually) a good tackler but there's not much use in making a tackle that wins possession if you simply just give it away two seconds later by making a bad pass.

Unfortunately for Bamba, although I think it's his best position, he wasn't even good at being centre half last night, in fact that's a massive understatement, he had a complete nightmare.

Hogg was criticised for his distribution at Hamilton and dropped. Now it is Bamba getting the same criticism. I didn't go to either game, but could it be due to the way we are playing, as much as the players deficiencies.

Sir David Gray
23-09-2009, 11:04 PM
Hogg was criticised for his distribution at Hamilton and dropped. Now it is Bamba getting the same criticism. I didn't go to either game, but could it be due to the way we are playing, as much as the players deficiencies.

To be fair, it wasn't just the passing that was letting Bamba down last night, he was absolutely murder at practically everything from start to finish. Not many of our players came out of the match with much pride but Bamba was our worst player last night by quite some distance IMO.

However, since Bamba's joined Hibs, I think his passing has been the main weakness in his game.

lumbo_hfc
24-09-2009, 07:02 PM
the pitches aren't any tighter in Scotland than England, there is generally only a few feet to a yard in it between grounds particularly at a professional level.

Winning the ball back is to do with desire and pace and size has very little to do with it. As for heading the ball that is what your centre halfs are supposed to do, if they aren't it means the entire team is sitting too deep.

Last night St johnstones players didn't look much bigger than ours but they chased and harried and worked twice as hard as any of ours, that was why they won the midfield battle and very deservedly the game.


I agree about Bamba only because he's less dangerous to Hibs there.
All pitches in U.k. are regulated they're inches within the requirements. And you're completely missing the point with the EPL and SPL reference. It's all relative.
Look mate it's simple HEIGHT HAS GOT NOTHING TO DO WITH IT !

Fair doos, maybe that was a bad example, what i really meant is that in the SPL and scotland in general, you get alot less time on the ball in the midfield, the pitch seems alot tighter where as in the EPL players seem to get more time on the ball until they get in the final third of the pitch! or maybe im getting it all wrong?:confused:

and with use to saying height has nothing to do with it, if you read my post i said i agreed this player does not have to be big, i just said that i think that Bamba is our best option if we need a player to win the ball in the centre of the park and maybe Murray but i would rather see him at the back!

Toaods
24-09-2009, 07:15 PM
Oh for the days of .............

Scott Brown - 5foot9 and 10.5stone
Kevin Thomson - 5foot11 and 10.5stone
Michael Stewart - 6foot and 11stone
Ivan Sproule - 5foot9 and 10.5stone
(Weights then - not now)

Now that's what I call a big midfield :wink:



Not like our shortarses ........

Patrick Cregg - 5foot9 and 10.5stone
Kevin McBride - 5foot10 and 10.5stone
David Wotherspoon - 5foot11 and 11stone
John Rankin - 5foot8 and 12.5stone



...as the ladies will no doubt tell us there's a world of difference can be made by three inches...:greengrin

Franck is God
24-09-2009, 08:09 PM
Fair doos, maybe that was a bad example, what i really meant is that in the SPL and scotland in general, you get alot less time on the ball in the midfield, the pitch seems alot tighter where as in the EPL players seem to get more time on the ball until they get in the final third of the pitch! or maybe im getting it all wrong?:confused:


The big difference between the top sides in England and us is the physical conditioning of the players and their willingness to work for every second they are on the pitch.

If you were to match up our players and St Johnstones players the other night then very few would have predicted that we would have been outplayed the way we were. They had a desire and hunger that we didn't show at all, a few players did but you need all 11 to do it every week.

As a fan I can accept losing to a better team but we should never have to put up with a lack of effort and application. As long as Yogi feels the same way then we should be ok going forward.

mouvran
24-09-2009, 08:20 PM
Although our midfield is small, that is by no way the biggest problem about the midfield. We have no natural wide midfielders who regularly start, other than Wotherspoon and by playing miller, rankin and mcbride; who are all quite similar types of players in the way that they are small, not very strong and not very skillful. Those three players created nothing on Tuesday night and as soon as Zemmama came on, he created a few opportunities using his skill, to which none of these players have. I feel we should always play with a playmaker(not that we have many to choose from) as at the moment the midfield are created nothing.

VegasHibby
24-09-2009, 08:26 PM
Fair doos, maybe that was a bad example, what i really meant is that in the SPL and scotland in general, you get alot less time on the ball in the midfield, the pitch seems alot tighter where as in the EPL players seem to get more time on the ball until they get in the final third of the pitch! or maybe im getting it all wrong?:confused:

and with use to saying height has nothing to do with it, if you read my post i said i agreed this player does not have to be big, i just said that i think that Bamba is our best option if we need a player to win the ball in the centre of the park and maybe Murray but i would rather see him at the back!


I think you're probably right about players getting less time on the ball and the illusion of the pitch being tighter in Scotland I think it boils down to style of play. A good player will always find space because of composure compared to a player not so good running around like a headless chicken. There's alot more headless chickens in Scottish football. English teams play deeper aswell. Which means there is more time on the ball until you get to last third of pitch. Alot of European teams and S.American teams also play like this.
We keep asking oursleves everytime we're dumped out of European Championships or World Cup what is wrong with the Scottish game ?
There are alot of skilled players in Scotland I just think the strategy of the game needs to improve.

Hibercelona
25-09-2009, 12:50 AM
For me, Bamba is a centre half. I don't believe that he is a central midfielder as his passing just isn't good enough to play in that position. You need your midfielders to be good passers of the ball and I don't believe that he fits that criteria.

He is (usually) a good tackler but there's not much use in making a tackle that wins possession if you simply just give it away two seconds later by making a bad pass.

Unfortunately for Bamba, although I think it's his best position, he wasn't even good at being centre half last night, in fact that's a massive understatement, he had a complete nightmare.

Have to disagree with you there.

A lot of the things you say there are true.

But Bamba is a midfielder for me.

He's always a bombscare in defence. Last game was no "one off".

You're right, he does give the ball away far to cheaply.

But one thing he offers in midfield is a bit of fight and presence... something we are severely lacking in midfield at the moment.

Bob1875
25-09-2009, 07:37 AM
Maybe the problem is we have 2 midfielder, 6 foot + may I add, playing at centre half.

brydekirk
25-09-2009, 08:01 AM
JAMESIE- #5. totally agree . Bamba may not be the best passer othe ball,whitch is why id rather he made his mistakes further up the park.

HFC 0-7
25-09-2009, 08:28 AM
The reason our midfield looks so bad at tackling and winning balls is because we are only putting 3 in there. A flat 4 in midfield is the easiest way to break up play and defend as well as providing width. Right now we cant get close to their midfield because they always have men spare in midfield, meaning our midfield are constantly chasing the ball. We dont have the players to go with just 3 in the against 4 or at times 5. Can you remember how tiring it was in training when you were in the middle of the circle trying to get the ball off the circle of guys? Sure you will manage to get the ball eventually but its tiring! I think we are better at most teams in midfield when we have the ball. Defending in midfield we are probably about the same, but we look worse as 3 guys have to try and defend 4 or 5 guys!