PDA

View Full Version : Back to reality



steviehfc
13-09-2009, 06:23 PM
After todays result and perhaps more importantly performance, coupled with some bad tactical decisions by Yogi mean we will have more realistic aspirations for this season? It will take time for the team to gel, for Yogi to get his ideas across and most importantly to strengthen our TBH very weak defence.
The way some posters were talking last week we were a stick on to finish third, some even going as far as to say we could split the Bigot Brothers this season. While agreeing that we have a squad that is a vast improvement on last seasons and a manager that at least sounds like he has an idea of what he wants we have to start winning games like todays regularly to start talking of finishing third.
Maybe we were beginning to believe our own press and starting to think we are a bit better than we actually are and this will be the boot up the erse we need to kick on....In the meantime back to reality for some.

Dibben
13-09-2009, 06:27 PM
After todays result and perhaps more importantly performance, coupled with some bad tactical decisions by Yogi mean we will have more realistic aspirations for this season? It will take time for the team to gel, for Yogi to get his ideas across and most importantly to strengthen our TBH very weak defence.
The way some posters were talking last week we were a stick on to finish third, some even going as far as to say we could split the Bigot Brothers this season. While agreeing that we have a squad that is a vast improvement on last seasons and a manager that at least sounds like he has an idea of what he wants we have to start winning games like todays regularly to start talking of finishing third.
Maybe we were beginning to believe our own press and starting to think we are a bit better than we actually are and this will be the boot up the erse we need to kick on....In the meantime back to reality for some.

:agree:

Things are looking up for us, but on todays performance, we still need to sort out the defence (can't believe we're STILL saying that after 5 years and 4 managers...).

Hey ho...

BH.

banarc7062
13-09-2009, 06:31 PM
Ah well as a lifelong Hibs supporter we widnae have it any other way. Some we win , some we lose but at the end of it all we are Hibbees.
GGTTH

truehibernian
13-09-2009, 06:33 PM
Hogg and Bamba do not gel or work together as a partnership. Hogg for me has been the poorest Hibs player from all 4 games and needs a spell on el bencho. Yogi needs to take a share of the blame today though for a poor decision to go 4-3-3 with no pace or width on the flanks. Wotherspoon must be gutted at being dropped twice now after being potentially MOM on both his starts (St Mirren and Brechin) and doing nowt wrong v Celtic. He would have done more in 5 minutes than Nish has done all season had he started in that midfield today and we'd gone a more solid 4-4-2 :agree:

Hibercelona
13-09-2009, 06:40 PM
Hogg and Bamba do not gel or work together as a partnership. Hogg for me has been the poorest Hibs player from all 4 games and needs a spell on el bencho. Yogi needs to take a share of the blame today though for a poor decision to go 4-3-3 with no pace or width on the flanks. Wotherspoon must be gutted at being dropped twice now after being potentially MOM on both his starts (St Mirren and Brechin) and doing nowt wrong v Celtic. He would have done more in 5 minutes than Nish has done all season had he started in that midfield today and we'd gone a more solid 4-4-2 :agree:

A lot of people are saying this.

But IMO, he doesnt need benched, he needs striped of the arm band.

Hogg was a cracking defender before he got landed with the armband.

The armband should go to (and i've been saying it since Jones left) Ian Murray. I think he has the age and experience for captaincy.

I think Hogg's performance would improve again without the pressure of captaincy.

truehibernian
13-09-2009, 06:45 PM
I have been to three of the four league games and the Brechin game and Hogg was the poorest on show for all four, only run close by Van Zanten in the Falkirk game. Murray for captain and a starting berth at CH, yes, but Hogg needs to be dropped. If Yogi can make the tough decisions to drop young Wotherspoon who has been a class apart, then he must show consistency in his decision making and drop those who are clearly underperforming. Stokes comes into that category too by the way these last two games.

Bishop Hibee
13-09-2009, 06:53 PM
Summariser on Radio Scotland reckoned Hibs lost every single battle on the pitch. Didn't sound like anyone got pass marks and I wasn't at the game so I can't criticise individual players.

Why oh why do managers insist in playing players out of position? Murray is not a right back!

Also, why not play Zemamma? He's the most creative player we have and for my money, Rankin and Cregg are too similar to play together.

Certainly brought some people back to earth but given Hibs unsurpassed capacity to disappoint, I wasn't that surprised at the result really. Yogi should be given 18 months, same as Mixu and then we'll be in a better position to judge.

CallumLaidlaw
13-09-2009, 06:54 PM
Hogg was a cracking defender when he had Rob Jones beside him

.

Changed it for you :wink:

I'm_cabbaged
13-09-2009, 06:59 PM
Summariser on Radio Scotland reckoned Hibs lost every single battle on the pitch. Didn't sound like anyone got pass marks and I wasn't at the game so I can't criticise individual players.

Why oh why do managers insist in playing players out of position? Murray is not a right back!

Also, why not play Zemamma? He's the most creative player we have and for my money, Rankin and Cregg are too similar to play together.

Certainly brought some people back to earth but given Hibs unsurpassed capacity to disappoint, I wasn't that surprised at the result really. Yogi should be given 18 months, same as Mixu and then we'll be in a better position to judge.

And he's not a CH either. Why anyone who's watched him playing thinks that I honestly don't know.

CallumLaidlaw
13-09-2009, 07:02 PM
Murray said in the paper himself yesterday that he feels just as comfortable in LB, RB, CB, LM, CM or RM, and finds it strange that other players can only play in 1 position

judas
13-09-2009, 07:03 PM
After todays result and perhaps more importantly performance, coupled with some bad tactical decisions by Yogi mean we will have more realistic aspirations for this season? It will take time for the team to gel, for Yogi to get his ideas across and most importantly to strengthen our TBH very weak defence.
The way some posters were talking last week we were a stick on to finish third, some even going as far as to say we could split the Bigot Brothers this season. While agreeing that we have a squad that is a vast improvement on last seasons and a manager that at least sounds like he has an idea of what he wants we have to start winning games like todays regularly to start talking of finishing third.
Maybe we were beginning to believe our own press and starting to think we are a bit better than we actually are and this will be the boot up the erse we need to kick on....In the meantime back to reality for some.

I am afraid that this comes as no suprise.

Mcbride is a poor signing. Cregg is an average one at best..

Both players are in our midfield.

I do think we will come good though. Miller is a good signing as is Stokes.

But I do think the present mood at ER has been slightly ott.

steviehfc
13-09-2009, 07:22 PM
A lot of people are saying this.

But IMO, he doesnt need benched, he needs striped of the arm band.

Hogg was a cracking defender before he got landed with the armband.

The armband should go to (and i've been saying it since Jones left) Ian Murray. I think he has the age and experience for captaincy.

I think Hogg's performance would improve again without the pressure of captaincy.Hogg looked half decent when he had Jones playing alongside him, but his frailties have been shown up big style ever since.
His distribution is woeful and some of his decision making leaves a lot to be desired at times, stripping him of the captaincy could knock his confidence but he should never have been given the armband in the first place, Murray should have been given it as soon as Jones left.

JimBHibees
13-09-2009, 07:27 PM
Hogg looked half decent when he had Jones playing alongside him, but his frailties have been shown up big style ever since.
His distribution is woeful and some of his decision making leaves a lot to be desired at times, stripping him of the captaincy could knock his confidence but he should never have been given the armband in the first place, Murray should have been given it as soon as Jones left.

Hogg is and always will be a very average defender if we are hoping for better than 6th or so he needs replaced pronto. Murray in centre back however that would still leave a right back slot which could be shared with Wotherspoon, McCann or McCormack.

TornadoHibby
14-09-2009, 08:28 AM
Hogg and Bamba do not gel or work together as a partnership. Hogg for me has been the poorest Hibs player from all 4 games and needs a spell on el bencho. Yogi needs to take a share of the blame today though for a poor decision to go 4-3-3 with no pace or width on the flanks. Wotherspoon must be gutted at being dropped twice now after being potentially MOM on both his starts (St Mirren and Brechin) and doing nowt wrong v Celtic. He would have done more in 5 minutes than Nish has done all season had he started in that midfield today and we'd gone a more solid 4-4-2 :agree:

He should have been on for the last half hour in place of Nish with Murray moved into midfield to "even up" the numbers and give us some serious "bite" to compete with the Hamilton midfield bullies! :agree:

Wotherspoon could have played wide on the right so that he could introduce his type of dangerous crosses from that wing where nothing was really happening! :wink:

Andy74
14-09-2009, 09:11 AM
I think I had it confirmed yestersay that no matter how many good signings we make, no matter how inspirational our manager may be we will never achieve anyhting.

It was a season defining game, a game where we could confirm ourselves as a team that will not drop points in these type of matches and we went and proved that Hibs are capable of that type of thing more often than not.

I'm convinced that we habitiually sign players with psychological imabalances because through the years the teams change but the characteristics do not.

Maybe its our own fault, we want talented players who want to play football. More often than not if we can afford them it means we have players who think they want to be good players but for some reason haven't quite made it. That reason is normally mental or application and it shows through our teams.

We have a few maverick individuals who in theory are good players but who seem incapable of forming a team who just go out week in and wek out and do their job.

Really disappointed with yesterday, but it has just confirmed to me that things will probably never be any other way for us.

Dan Sarf
14-09-2009, 09:16 AM
I think I had it confirmed yestersay that no matter how many good signings we make, no matter how inspirational our manager we may be we will never achieve anyhting.

It was a season defining game, a game where we could confirm ourselves as a team that will not drop points in these type of matches and we went and proved that hibs are capable of that type of thing more often than not.

I'm convinced that we habitiually sign players with psychological imabalances because through the years the teams change but the characterisitcs do not.

Maybe its our own fault, we want talented players who want to play football. More often than not if we can afford them it means we have players who think they want to be good players but for some reason haven't quite made it. That reason is normal mental or application and it shows through our teams.

We have a few maverick individuals who in theory are good players but who seem incapable of forming a team who just go out week ina nd wek out and do their job.

Really disappointed with yesterday, but it has just confirmed to me that things will probably never be any other way for us.


What a brilliant insight. Failure is in our DNA. I'm feeling quite depressed now but I think you're right.

jacomo
14-09-2009, 04:08 PM
What a brilliant insight. Failure is in our DNA. I'm feeling quite depressed now but I think you're right.

You're onto something, Andy74, but I don't feel as depressed as you do.

Without a doubt, Hibs lack a winning mentality, and this mentality runs deep within the club - probably because we, er, aren't used to winning much.

When we DO win something (CIS Cup 2007), our players seem to think they can take the rest of the season off. This attitude can be turned around, but it takes tenacity and time.

Yesterday it seemed nothing worked and the team became dispirited. However, it was just one match - we should keep things in perspective.

Andy74
14-09-2009, 04:17 PM
You're onto something, Andy74, but I don't feel as depressed as you do.

Without a doubt, Hibs lack a winning mentality, and this mentality runs deep within the club - probably because we, er, aren't used to winning much.

When we DO win something (CIS Cup 2007), our players seem to think they can take the rest of the season off. This attitude can be turned around, but it takes tenacity and time.

Yesterday it seemed nothing worked and the team became dispirited. However, it was just one match - we should keep things in perspective.

By our nature we rarely sign players with a winning mentality or a burning desire to succeed.

We want talented players like Riordan, Benji, Zemamma, Boozy, Stokes, L Miller and Latapy.

The thing is, if these guys had both talent and a winning mentality and a strong desire they wouldn't be here, they'd be at the big clubs they started with or went to but failed.

We occasionally get guys from our own ranks who have a desire but when their talent reaches the right level they are off.

In many ways I like it more than having a team of honest grafters who would churn their way to the odd success but I have now accepted that even if we assemble a team that on paper is head and shoulders above the other also rans that we still won't ever translate that to the level of consistency we want to be at.

I hope I'm wrong and I know its early days for this team but I now know they are capable of that type of abject performance and that's not good news.

Dunkin' Donut
14-09-2009, 04:20 PM
yesterday's result was a shocker but with this squad we should defo finish higher than we did last season.