Share Transfers Agreed/Cooling off period

[Baldy Foghorn]

Savills are an estate agent, must be when they were sourcing their 400k capacity ground?

[1two]

I like this twitter account related to the The Rangers https://twitter.com/RFCCreditors (https://twitter.com/rfcCreditors)


So I made this related to Hearts https://twitter.com/HOMFCCreditors

:aok:

[Hibby Kay-Yay]

Jamie Borthwick ‏@jamiekborthwick (https://twitter.com/jamiekborthwick)3h (https://twitter.com/jamiekborthwick/status/362593691258454016)
Correction on earlier. £1.2m loan from UBIG to Hearts was transferred to this 'Milson' corp in March 2013 http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/hearts/234601-hearts-debts-total-285m-administraor-report-reveals/ … (http://t.co/VoWfVtWbt5)



"boy that escalated quickly...I mean that really got out of hand" - Ron Burgandy

[YehButNoBut]

BBC story re the debt has a bit more detail than some but still no mention of the sums owed to charities, when these should be highlighted in the press. :rolleyes:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/23521149

Administrators reveal level of Hearts' debt

Hearts' unsecured creditors are likely to receive nothing in the event of an exit from administration via a company voluntary arrangement [CVA].

Total claims by club creditors amount to £28.4m, the bulk of which is owed to the collapsed Lithuanian companies of former owner Vladimir Romanov.

Ukio Bankas, who are owed £15.5m, hold Tynecastle Stadium as security against that debt.

And the value of the property is less than that amount.

The "book value" of the stadium from Hearts' statutory accounts in 2012 is listed at more than £13m.

The administrators have since commissioned a revaluation of Tynecastle but have not released details "so as not to prejudice the current sale" of the Edinburgh club.

BDO do say that a "nil value" has been placed on the leasehold interest Hearts have on their training complex at Riccarton, Herriot Watt University.

An initial creditors meeting will take place on 12 August, the day after the first Edinburgh derby of the new season.

Shareholders Ukio Bankas and UBIG are owed around £24m of the debt, making an exit via a CVA dependent on the approval of administrators acting on their behalf.

The administrator for Ukio Bankas has already dismissed the ongoing bids for the club as unacceptable.

In the report, distributed to all creditors, BDO state that rescuing Hearts through a CVA is its first objective.

A second option is listed as "a better result than liquidation", with winding up the club and realising property values the last resort.

Hearts debt to HM Revenue & Customs now stands at close to £1.9m, with Edinburgh Council owed more than £90,000, Big Hearts Community Trust (£34,000) and the Scottish Police Authority (£18,500).

The Scottish Football Association, which is owed £5,500, is almost certain to insist that any new owner of the club inherit the "football debt".

Money owed in wage arrears combined with cash for players made redundant and fees outstanding to Liverpool, Rangers, Ayr United, Kaunas, Musselburgh Athletic, Livingston, Stenhousemuir and Musselburgh Athletic totals £535,000.

Administrators fees for the running of Hearts have topped £227,000 in the first six weeks, with BDO saying they will not take any payment until it is agreed with those representing Ukio Bankas and UBIG.

BDO has recorded a trading surplus of £958,000 since taking over on 20 June, the vast majority coming from season-ticket sales.

The administrators also secured a £100,000 compensation fee for Arvydas Novikovas, who joined German side Erzgebirge Aue, while £48,000 in donations has been ring-fenced.

Meanwhile, BDO will attend a hearing with the Scottish FA on Thursday where additional sanctions for Hearts' insolvency may be imposed.

[RoslinInstHibby]

Just have to say - well done CWG for breaking this story and in doing so showing the mainstream media how they should be doing their jobs. See them all jump on it now, mind. They'd be none the wiser if it weren't for our resident .net experts. :top marks

Agreed, superb work!

[lapsedhibee]

The administrators also secured a £100,000 compensation fee for Arvydas Novikovas, who joined German side Erzgebirge Aue, while £48,000 in donations has been ring-fenced.

Ring-fenced unless BDO need to use it for their fees.

[Sanger]

Agreed, superb work!
Yes great work. The Yams in the office turned white when I forwarded it to them!

[tamsonsbairn]

There was me being informed by many Jambo's on Friday morning that my club were a complete and utter embarassment to the Scottish game after losing a football match.

Hibs may lose on the park, and results at times may be a shambles but going through that creditors list is a total and utter disgrace. Charities, Junior Clubs, Police, NHS, hotels, coaching companies etc. You name it - they just bumped them.


David Cameron £103.00 (Even PM was shafted) :cb :tee hee:


http://gs.delfi.lt/images/pix/300x188/d6389f7b/file52341879_d8a652ca.jpg
' Am I bovvered? '

Honest the hearts money was just resting in my account. :pfgwa

[Jack]

Maybe as 'concerned Edinburgh resident' the administrators in Lithuania could be gifted private membership of dotnet?

It would probably be the best 20 quid any Hibee has ever spent.

[...WentToMowAnSPL]

I like this one... From liquidback

"CJGJ, on 31 July 2013 - 07:53 PM, said:

So how is Massone going to fund the football debt? so he must also be out of the running."


Erm do you need to settle footballing debts to build flats, offices or shops ??

[Ozyhibby]

It's important the SFA increase the signing ban past January. Last thing we want is the yams building up another warchest in November when the Poppies go sale.

[sidneyhibbie]

Good man sidney - I admire your enthusiasm

Cheers mate, i think of every letter i write as another nail in the yams coffin, if it stirs up a hornets nest all the better they have cheated for years and its pay back time.:aok:

[Stantons Angel]

And Liverpool so I'm guessing they must have 'paid' for Michael ngoo!!!!!


As a loan player they would be due to pay part of his wages to Liverpool who in turn would pay the player as still on their books.

Obviously they found out what he was like and decided not to pay Liverpool at all................. or they just havent met their side of the bargain on the loan agreement.

They are doing the very same as Rangers and this list of creditors proves it. They were playing players they could not afford who won cups for them. Their wages might have been from monies collected for the Big Hearts Trust, macraes battalion and lady haig poppy factory.......

Rangers were taken to the cleaners by the SFA/SPL and dropped down to the third division AND IMHO this is were they should be!!!
Disgusting reading !

[CraigHibee]

Horrible ****my hearts *******s

owing money to charities! Terrible, hope they rot

[HFC 0-7]

http://gs.delfi.lt/images/pix/300x188/d6389f7b/file52341879_d8a652ca.jpg


You wanna buy a submarine

"Ha ha ha, honestly I told them I would sell them shares, I told them they are worthless and they still went for it!! Honestly I had to use two hands to carry the bag full of cash out of Tynecastle. I didnt even bother with share certificates and they still love me!!"

[sidneyhibbie]

Horrible ****my hearts *******s

owing money to charities! Terrible, hope they rot

I Will post many letters tomorrow to all the main news papers this news must be highlighted cheating charities now this is shocking news.:hnet: the power oh the pen is mightier than the Sword.

Sidney.:not worth

[jeffers]

Am I missing something here ? They owe the police £18,500, is that going to be paid ? If it's not how can the possibly play any more home games ?

[woody0-7]

"Ha ha ha, honestly I told them I would sell them shares, I told them they are worthless and they still went for it!! Honestly I had to use two hands to carry the bag full of cash out of Tynecastle. I didnt even bother with share certificates and they still love me!!"

Haha excellent mate :-)

[Sergey]

Cheers mate, i think of every letter i write as another nail in the yams coffin, if it stirs up a hornets nest all the better they have cheated for years and its pay back time.:aok:

you're a sterling young fellow, sid - remember; every letter you write will be filed for future reference.

you are the man main

[CropleyWasGod]

Am I missing something here ? They owe the police £18,500, is that going to be paid ? If it's not how can the possibly play any more home games ?

All debt prior to administration won't be paid.

All debt since then will be.

[Springbank]

Am I missing something here ? They owe the police £18,500, is that going to be paid ? If it's not how can the possibly play any more home games ?

Fair point

The police service Scotland (under the guise of the then Strathclyde Police) refused to police games at Ibrox last year

[kdhibees1]

I Will post many letters tomorrow to all the main news papers this news must be highlighted cheating charities now this is shocking news.:hnet: the power oh the pen is mightier than the Sword.

Sidney.:not worth
Sidney, you my friend are a ruddy legend!!!:applause:

[bingo70]

Am I missing something here ? They owe the police £18,500, is that going to be paid ? If it's not how can the possibly play any more home games ?

That's the nature of administration, they're drawing a line in the sand and admitting they can't afford the debts they've accumulated. The police will agree to police future games as it'll be a new owner.

[jeffers]

All debt prior to administration won't be paid.

All debt since then will be.
Thanks CWG, you'd think tho' the police would be justified in refusing to do any more games while they are owed money. If someone owed me for a service I had provided and told me I wouldn't see that money but wanted me to continue, I know what my response would be.

[lapsedhibee]

you're a sterling young fellow, sid

:agree: Sidney has now raised awareness of so many topics with so many people that he's become a kind of focus for all that needs to be done. Shouldn't we channel all future concerns through him? We could start a campaign to make sure that he knows about anything and everything that needs to be raised with anyone and everyone. Perhaps this campaign could have as its slogan "Tell Sid" ?

[YehButNoBut]

:agree: Sidney has now raised awareness of so many topics with so many people that he's become a kind of focus for all that needs to be done. Shouldn't we channel all future concerns through him? We could start a campaign to make sure that he knows about anything and everything that needs to be raised with anyone and everyone. Perhaps this campaign could have as its slogan "Tell Sid" ?

http://www.urban75.org/photos/rye/images/rye054.jpg (http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&frm=1&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&docid=DDVCSy61VJo1UM&tbnid=UASRCXMDazDYPM:&ved=0CAUQjRw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.urban75.org%2Fphotos%2Frye%2F rye054.html&ei=DHH5UY_fK8fH0QWdtYGADg&bvm=bv.49967636,d.d2k&psig=AFQjCNE5eMDgv4uWQVd_kx7Ze0NIzrmx-A&ust=1375388265614886)

[clerriehibs]

I know it will have been asked, and answered, earlier, but why so many debts to all sorts of companies for £100? What's that all about?

[CropleyWasGod]

I know it will have been asked, and answered, earlier, but why so many debts to all sorts of companies for £100? What's that all about?

Don't know if it has been asked.

I suspect that there are a few estimated figures in there. The accounting records of HMFC are, I am guessing, in a poor state and it was probably very difficult to compile that list in such a short time. There will be mistakes in the list.... see the poppy thread as an example... and other situations where it has not been possible to establish the exact amount of debts. Thus estimates will have been made, and those £100's may be an example of that.

All debts are adjudicated, ie have to be proven by the creditor. BDO acknowledge that, and there will be many changes to that list.


Thanks CWG, you'd think tho' the police would be justified in refusing to do any more games while they are owed money. If someone owed me for a service I had provided and told me I wouldn't see that money but wanted me to continue, I know what my response would be.

But they are getting money for current work. That's the issue. Refusing to do any more games would be a daft decision commercially. They know that they'll get paid for these ones, so why would they turn it down?

[bighairyfaeleith]

I'm intrigued by all the kaunas based companies that are owed money by hearts, how long have these companies been submitting invoices for hundreds of thousands?

What are these bills for?
Who are the directors of these companies?

I suspect I know the answers but would be good to get some proof

[clerriehibs]

Don't know if it has been asked.

I suspect that there are a few estimated figures in there. The accounting records of HMFC are, I am guessing, in a poor state and it was probably very difficult to compile that list in such a short time. There will be mistakes in the list.... see the poppy thread as an example... and other situations where it has not been possible to establish the exact amount of debts. Thus estimates will have been made, and those £100's may be an example of that.

All debts are adjudicated, ie have to be proven by the creditor. BDO acknowledge that, and there will be many changes to that list.

Cheers.

Apart from the fun aspect for us, almost a waste of effort by BDO? Apart from the big two, will any of these creditors will ever get paid anything in the pound? Any CVA is almost certainly going to be the Dunfermline flavour.

[CropleyWasGod]

Cheers.

Apart from the fun aspect for us, almost a waste of effort by BDO? Apart from the big two, will any of these creditors will ever get paid anything in the pound? Any CVA is almost certainly going to be the Dunfermline flavour.

At £189k thus far, certainly not a waste of effort :greengrin

My thinking now is that UBIG will get shafted, and that only UKIO will get anything, whether by a CVA or liquidation. Up until today, I wasn't sure about the security situation, but now that BDO have clarified it, I can't see any way of UBIG getting anything.

Ask me again tomorrow.... :greengrin

[lord bunberry]

But they are getting money for current work. That's the issue. Refusing to do any more games would be a daft decision commercially. They know that they'll get paid for these ones, so why would they turn it down?

Because they know hearts have the means to pay what they are owed, and they know if they refuse to police future hearts games then hearts won't be allowed to play.

[CropleyWasGod]

Because they know hearts have the means to pay what they are owed, and they know if they refuse to police future hearts games then hearts won't be allowed to play.

They don't have the means to pay what the owe, prior to administration.

They only have the means to pay what they owe currently.

So the police's income is virtually secured.

[Col2]

All debt prior to administration won't be paid.

All debt since then will be.

Understand that but will be interesting to see stance of police for future games, minimum cash up front?

Wonder if Heriot Watt arrangement to let them train once a day (before U14 netball team use it) will remain or not? Appreciate legal position but common sense would make me say stuff it, you can find somewhere else unless you pay on advance?

[CropleyWasGod]

Understand that but will be interesting to see stance of police for future games, minimum cash up front?

Wonder if Heriot Watt arrangement to let them train once a day (before U14 netball team use it) will remain or not? Appreciate legal position but common sense would make me say stuff it, you can find somewhere else unless you pay on advance?

The police and BDO will have an arrangement, just as there was with Rangers.

I'm sure that HWU have a similar arrangement; think that was mentioned a few weeks back.

[lord bunberry]

They don't have the means to pay what the owe, prior to administration.

They only have the means to pay what they owe currently.

So the police's income is virtually secured.
Are the administrators not allowed to pay debts that were run up prior to administration?

[jgl07]

Are the administrators not allowed to pay debts that were run up prior to administration?

Surely not?

That would amount to giving preference to one creditor over others,

[CropleyWasGod]

Are the administrators not allowed to pay debts that were run up prior to administration?

No. They are effectively frozen.

That's what this list is. A (provisional) list of monies owed at the date of administration.

[Hibernia Na Eir]

What a devious little outfit they are. Knowingly taking on debts in the full knowledge they weren't ever gonna deliver payments.

Punish them. End them!

[monktonharp]

Spotted that too, only incorporated on 7th March 2013. Registered office seems to be HBJ. Lot of debt to rack up in three months. :confused: there is a company in the same building(or was) Ensco 146:confused: dissolution date there too for it/them

[bighairyfaeleith]

What a devious little outfit they are. Knowingly taking on debts in the full knowledge they weren't ever gonna deliver payments.

Punish them. End them!

What a deviant little outfit they are, harbouring known sex offenders for several years.

Punish Them, End Them!

[lord bunberry]

No. They are effectively frozen.

That's what this list is. A (provisional) list of monies owed at the date of administration.

Sorry I didn't realise that.

[Hibernia Na Eir]

No. They are effectively frozen.

That's what this list is. A (provisional) list of monies owed at the date of administration.

so, how DID they pay for their Belfast jaunt?
if someone borrowed money, or was due me money, and feked off to another country, I'd be mighty peeved if I didn't see my £'s again!

I guess an outfit such as that lot don't know the meaning of morality.


What a deviant little outfit they are, harbouring known sex offenders for several years.

Punish Them, End Them!

.....harbouring Corbett too! holy fek!

[bighairyfaeleith]

No. They are effectively frozen.

That's what this list is. A (provisional) list of monies owed at the date of administration.

but what if the police did refuse, the only way to continue to operate would be to pay the previous bill, surely they wouldn't just cease trading rather than pay that one bill?


.....harbouring Corbett too! holy fek!

he is easily hidden

[CropleyWasGod]

so, how DID they pay for their Belfast jaunt?
if someone borrowed money, or was due me money, and feked off to another country, I'd be mighty peeved if I didn't see my £'s again!

I guess an outfit such as that lot don't know the meaning of morality.

They would have got a guarantee of income from the tournament organiser.


but what if the police did refuse, the only way to continue to operate would be to pay the previous bill, surely they wouldn't just cease trading rather than pay that one bill?

As JGL says, BDO aren't allowed to favour one creditor over another, so that couldn't be paid.

I would think it pretty daft of the police to refuse. A publicly-funded body, turning down guaranteed substantial income? I wouldn't like to be the cop who took that decision...

[The Falcon]

No. They are effectively frozen.

That's what this list is. A (provisional) list of monies owed at the date of administration.

Do we know how much the securities in favour of UKIO and/or UBIG are yet? And would this be excluded from any CVA vote? Also the Novikovas £100k is that not income from an asset that should be covered by the "floating charge"?

apologies in advance .


It must rankle with a lot of these smaller guys/ public bodies owed money that HMFC are sitting on £1m and they wont get their money.

[sidneyhibbie]

http://www.urban75.org/photos/rye/images/rye054.jpg (http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&frm=1&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&docid=DDVCSy61VJo1UM&tbnid=UASRCXMDazDYPM:&ved=0CAUQjRw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.urban75.org%2Fphotos%2Frye%2F rye054.html&ei=DHH5UY_fK8fH0QWdtYGADg&bvm=bv.49967636,d.d2k&psig=AFQjCNE5eMDgv4uWQVd_kx7Ze0NIzrmx-A&ust=1375388265614886)

Thanks guys i am trying my best every letter and Email i send is a nuclear bomb fired into the PBS my relentless pursuit of justice will continue till the bitter end:thumbsup:

[bighairyfaeleith]

As JGL says, BDO aren't allowed to favour one creditor over another, so that couldn't be paid.

I would think it pretty daft of the police to refuse. A publicly-funded body, turning down guaranteed substantial income? I wouldn't like to be the cop who took that decision...

I know, I understand it is unlikely for all the reasons given, however surely if you held them over a barrel they would have to pay would they not?

After all by paying they get revenue from being able to play more games


Thanks guys i am trying my best every letter and Email i send is a nuclear bomb fired into the PBS my relentless pursuit of justice will continue till the bitter end:thumbsup:

has anyone ever seen one of these letters, would like to read one, any printed?

[21.05.2016]

Thanks guys i am trying my best every letter and Email i send is a nuclear bomb fired into the PBS my relentless pursuit of justice will continue till the bitter end:thumbsup:

Gon yersel son :wink::greengrin:top marks

[CraigHibee]

I Will post many letters tomorrow to all the main news papers this news must be highlighted cheating charities now this is shocking news.:hnet: the power oh the pen is mightier than the Sword.

Sidney.:not worth


The media should be making a massive issue of this, it's morally wrong, it's hearts though so they probably see this as being acceptable for them

[CropleyWasGod]

Do we know how much the securities in favour of UKIO and/or UBIG are yet? And would this be excluded from any CVA vote? Also the Novikovas £100k is that not income from an asset that should be covered by the "floating charge"?

apologies in advance .


It must rankle with a lot of these smaller guys/ public bodies owed money that HMFC are sitting on £1m and they wont get their money.

One thing that has been clarified for me today is that UBIG have no security; all of their debt can "vote" in the CVA. UKIO's debt, insofar as it is unsecured (ie all but £6.8m), has a vote. They are roughly the same, about £8m.

Not sure about the Novikovas money. Think UKIO, as the sole secured creditor, will get that.

[sidneyhibbie]

Am I missing something here ? They owe the police £18,500, is that going to be paid ? If it's not how can the possibly play any more home games ?

I Have already written to the police to highlight this fact no reply so far i intend to send a recorded delivery letter to them tomorrow demanding an answer and another letter to HWU

[Sanger]

At £189k thus far, certainly not a waste of effort :greengrin

My thinking now is that UBIG will get shafted, and that only UKIO will get anything, whether by a CVA or liquidation. Up until today, I wasn't sure about the security situation, but now that BDO have clarified it, I can't see any way of UBIG getting anything.

Ask me again tomorrow.... :greengrin
They are one and the same: the Lithuanian state and its people.

[bighairyfaeleith]

how much does it cost to police a game, anyone know how many games 18k equates to?

[Wat Dabney]

But they are getting money for current work. That's the issue. Refusing to do any more games would be a daft decision commercially. They know that they'll get paid for these ones, so why would they turn it down?

...but do the police make money from football games? Does policing football games not just get in the way of catching criminals and keeping the public safe? :tin hat:

[The Falcon]

One thing that has been clarified for me today is that UBIG have no security; all of their debt can "vote" in the CVA. UKIO's debt, insofar as it is unsecured (ie all but £6.8m), has vote. They are roughly the same, about £8m.

Not sure about the Novikovas money. Think UKIO, as the sole secured creditor, will get that.


Thanks

[70hibby]

they ram their war hero stuff down our throats and yet we see they steal from "their own".

Oo I know a song about that:

You steal from your own,
You steal from your own,
You cheating bassas's,
You steal from your own.

:greengrin

[Iggy Pope]

how much does it cost to police a game, anyone know how many games 18k equates to?

Does not sound like much. I would imagine any single game involving them and HIBERNIAN / celtic. / zombies / sheep would run past that figure.
The real figure must have got lost in lots of knuckles.

The NHS is interesting too.
One on site ambulance is a must every game. No ambulance = no game.
FACT I believe.

[Eternal Hibbie]

Now that the scale of the debt has been disclosed and the mismanagement and deceit laid bare I wonder what our widely regarded tightwad Rod makes of it all. :eek:

[LeithBoozy]

http://gs.delfi.lt/images/pix/300x188/d6389f7b/file52341879_d8a652ca.jpg

Look it was all fair and above board, Rodders got almost 100% of the votes.Ask anyone who was at the AGM. Would I lie to you. :wink:

[clerriehibs]

Taking out a loan, to pay players, that was never going to be repaid (they had their eye on the admin finishing line) ... that is in no way self-sufficient.

SURELY grounds for the SPFL to launch them, as the SPL reserved the right to revise their adjudication after their investigation.

[Wat Dabney]

http://gs.delfi.lt/images/pix/300x188/d6389f7b/file52341879_d8a652ca.jpg


Where's my statue?

[Glory Lurker]

Where's my statue?

:greengrin:top marks

[21.05.2016]

What is the likliest outcome of tomorrows meeting between hearts and the SPFL?

[SMAXXA]

90.7k due to the council plus another 2.6k for flats

Only £56 for TNT though - must have been that planning application.

Was the TNT for the explosives, maybe planning an insurance job blowing up tyni

[CropleyWasGod]

What is the likliest outcome of tomorrows meeting between hearts and the SPFL?

It's the SFA.

[Iggy Pope]

Where's my statue?

**** that is good!

:greengrin

[nonshinyfinish]

Thanks guys i am trying my best every letter and Email i send is a nuclear bomb fired into the PBS my relentless pursuit of justice will continue till the bitter end:thumbsup:

Sidney/Sydney/Sindey...anyone else starting to think that he Disney exist? :dunno:

[HFC 0-7]

At £189k thus far, certainly not a waste of effort :greengrin

My thinking now is that UBIG will get shafted, and that only UKIO will get anything, whether by a CVA or liquidation. Up until today, I wasn't sure about the security situation, but now that BDO have clarified it, I can't see any way of UBIG getting anything.

Ask me again tomorrow.... :greengrin

How would ukio get anything from a CVA? From my understanding a cva can't be passed until Ukio's security is satisfied, unless they are proposing a cva for the club without Tynie? All the bids have been less than the security so will ukio not get everything and nothing left to even try the cva?

[SloopJB]

It's the SFA.
Yeah, that's what I think the outcome will be too.

[Coco Bryce]

Where's my statue?

Class.

[CropleyWasGod]

How would ukio get anything from a CVA? From my understanding a cva can't be passed until Ukio's security is satisfied, unless they are proposing a cva for the club without Tynie? All the bids have been less than the security so will ukio not get everything and nothing left to even try the cva?

They won't. BDO have said there will be nothing for unsecured creditors.

So, for the CVA to pass, it will have to be Pars-style, nil/£.

[monktonharp]

The original HMFC was founded in 1874 and incorporated in 1903 about a month earlier than Hibs. That 1874 incarnation, however, folded in March 1905 and started as a Newco in April 1905. If you recall the Rangers fiasco in that, in Scots Law, the corporate entity is inseperable from the club then this incarnation of the Yams is the original Sevco. The yams proudly claim titles won in 1895 1897 and Cups won in 1894,1899 and 1904 (yes, they went bust a year after winning a Scottish Cup, spooky or what?) whilst claiming Sevco are a new start with no history.


*Yes we folded in 1891 but we were not an incorporated body at the time so we were able to pick up where we left off. ooooer! and yet, they insist on listing our problems about that period, in their match programme, every derby day doon gorgie way. they do have a tendancy to gloss over wee things that might otherwise put a more honest picture on things.:wink:

[jeffers]

Thanks CWG for responding to my query re policing costs. I'm not alone in appreciating the factual information you and others provide on their financial affairs.

I suppose it was wishful thinking on my part that the police would refuse to cover their subsequent games, but I wasn't aware that they were a profit making organisation ? I, probably incorrectly, thought they would just charge a club what it cost them to provide officers for the match and no more.

[CyberSauzee]

It does seem somewhat strange that the UBIG debt has been reduced. I'd guess that it's the share money and part of their ST proceeds that's been hived off.

I'll see what I can find out about the Lith companies on the list.

:agree:

And don't forget the £400k they received from HunNewCo for Lee Wallace back in February. £1.1M for the share fraud, the Wallace money and a combination of advance season ticket sales and SPL TV and prize money is enough to get circa £2M hived off to UBIG, and onwards to whatever Vlad's BVI company was called at the time.

[SuperAllyMcleod]

http://gs.delfi.lt/images/pix/300x188/d6389f7b/file52341879_d8a652ca.jpg


Hearts? Who are Hearts? Never heard of them!

[SaulGoodman]

Cringe.

This should be posted frequently when they die.

[nonshinyfinish]

Cringe.

This should be posted frequently when they die.

:faf:

The depths of delusion that they plumb would scare the s*** out of Jacques Cousteau.

[Treadstone]

What is the likliest outcome of tomorrows meeting between hearts and the SPFL?

Signing ban from 1st September to 31st December.:greengrin

[CyberSauzee]

I'm intrigued by all the kaunas based companies that are owed money by hearts, how long have these companies been submitting invoices for hundreds of thousands?

What are these bills for?
Who are the directors of these companies?

I suspect I know the answers but would be good to get some proof

Don't forget that convicted nonces that are still on a club's books cannot possibly be expected to house themselves when they are loaned out to another club in the Empire. Far better to make sure that local Kaunas companies are paid over the odds to help convicted sex offenders.

As you say, who are the directors - cohorts of the Great Leader one suspects?

[monktonharp]

All debt prior to administration won't be paid.

All debt since then will be.that's as much as saying, we don't owe 28.5 million to anyone. we owe it to ourselves. a bit pedantic/ I suppose, but hey man they cant surely walk away from that?

[greenginger]

That £ 90,700 due to the Council for business rates will be a real kick in the teeth for us IF they survive.

I guess that will be the bill for the whole year, they must failed to pay the first month of this financial year and would then get billed for the whole year which will get settled at zero pence in the pound.

So, if they survive they will pay ZERO business rates while we hand over £ 10,000 per month to our dear Council.

[Glesgahibby]

They won't. BDO have said there will be nothing for unsecured creditors.

So, for the CVA to pass, it will have to be Pars-style, nil/£.
If UBIG are unsecured this could force there admins to A.vote against a cva or B.hold on to shares.

[jgl07]

That £ 90,700 due to the Council for business rates will be a real kick in the teeth for us IF they survive.

I guess that will be the bill for the whole year, they must failed to pay the first month of this financial year and would then get billed for the whole year which will get settled at zero pence in the pound.

So, if they survive they will pay ZERO business rates while we hand over £ 10,000 per month to our dear Council.

Business rates do not go to the council. They are paid to the centre and the money is then distributed to each council using a formula.

[macca70]

10751

Here you go. Knock yourselves out.

Some very appropriately named creditors on that list:

Savills
Scrubbers
Waste Management

Seriously though, what an absolute disgrace of a state to get into.

They should be shut down with immediate effect.

The SPL or SFA, whoever runs our league needs to have contingency in place for Hearts not being in the league cause they are well and truly Broon Breed!!

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

What is the likliest outcome of tomorrows meeting between hearts and the SPFL?

Their meeting with the SFA might be different thanks to yesterdays creditors list making an appearance.

[greenginger]

Business rates do not go to the council. They are paid to the centre and the money is then distributed to each council using a formula.

Not quite true. They are paid locally, my business rates are billed from and paid to Chessar House in Edinburgh.

The centre decides how much must be passed on for distribution to other areas.

The point is we will be paying our share all year and the Gorgie crooks will have a free year.

[PapillonVert]

Am I missing something here ? They owe the police £18,500, is that going to be paid ? If it's not how can the possibly play any more home games ?

Looks like everyone except the secured creditors will receive precisely 0p in the £ back. Even the secured creditors won't get all their money back.

So, there will be absolutely no money left to pay unsecured creditors after the secured creditors and the admin/liquidation fees are accounted for.

Remember, they paid Skacel at least £10,000 per week (allegedly) and others many of thousands per week to put a winning team on the park whilst simultaneously avoiding paying debts due.

This is the true cost of the financial doping. Taxpayer (HMRC, NHS, Police, Edinburgh Council), charities, and small businesses all massively out of the pocket due to financial doping.

Why is the establishment trying to sweep this inconvenient fact under the carpet and bail them out (again!)?

Ian Murray should start representing the interests of the majority of his constituents (as he is well paid by the taxpayer to do) instead of trying to get some free publicity out of a disgraced organisation.

Never mind buying the corrupt club - give the money raised through the pledges and bake sales and illicit alcohol brewing to those who really deserve it!

That way the stink of cheating emanating from the Gorgie area might start to dissipate a bit.

[The Falcon]

Looks like everyone except the secured creditors will receive precisely 0p in the £ back. Even the secured creditors won't get all their money back.

So, there will be absolutely no money left to pay unsecured creditors after the secured creditors and the admin/liquidation fees are accounted for.

Remember, they paid Skacel at least £10,000 per week (allegedly) and others many of thousands per week to put a winning team on the park whilst simultaneously avoiding paying debts due.

This is the true cost of the financial doping. Taxpayer (HMRC, NHS, Police, Edinburgh Council), charities, and small businesses all massively out of the pocket due to financial doping.

Why is the establishment trying to sweep this inconvenient fact under the carpet and bail them out (again!)?

Ian Murray should start representing the interests of the majority of his constituents (as he is well paid by the taxpayer to do) instead of trying to get some free publicity out of a disgraced organisation.

Never mind buying the corrupt club - give the money raised through the pledges and bake sales and illicit alcohol brewing to those who really deserve it!

That way the stink of cheating emanating from the Gorgie area might start to dissipate a bit.

:top marks

Given that Dunfermlines creditors got nothing and it looks like Hearts ordinary creditors will also get nothing, you could add Old Rangers whose creditors got as close to next to nothing as it gets, there are others but it begs the question as to why should anybody pay anything.


Hearts have taken in as much money as us in transfer fees but we have used it to bring down debt, develop the infrastructure and pay bills. The have used it to hire mercenaries to get relative success on the pitch whilst stiffing their suppliers (and the Liths). Now they are exerting pressure on the SFA that they shouldnt get any meaningful punishment today.

Who are the fools here?

[lapsedhibee]

Ian Murray should start representing the interests of the majority of his constituents (as he is well paid by the taxpayer to do) instead of trying to get some free publicity out of a disgraced organisation.

Remember that he's not just a constituency MP though, he's also Shadow Business Minister, so his salary will be bumped up for that.

Hard to avoid the conclusion, after reading his Save Hearts In Trouble crap, that not only are Hearts goosed but so also are Her Maj's Opposition, if that's the best they can muster for a business brain.

[Sanger]

Looks like everyone except the secured creditors will receive precisely 0p in the £ back. Even the secured creditors won't get all their money back.

So, there will be absolutely no money left to pay unsecured creditors after the secured creditors and the admin/liquidation fees are accounted for.

Remember, they paid Skacel at least £10,000 per week (allegedly) and others many of thousands per week to put a winning team on the park whilst simultaneously avoiding paying debts due.

This is the true cost of the financial doping. Taxpayer (HMRC, NHS, Police, Edinburgh Council), charities, and small businesses all massively out of the pocket due to financial doping.

Why is the establishment trying to sweep this inconvenient fact under the carpet and bail them out (again!)?

Ian Murray should start representing the interests of the majority of his constituents (as he is well paid by the taxpayer to do) instead of trying to get some free publicity out of a disgraced organisation.

Never mind buying the corrupt club - give the money raised through the pledges and bake sales and illicit alcohol brewing to those who really deserve it!

That way the stink of cheating emanating from the Gorgie area might start to dissipate a bit.
And also the £200 mill the Lith state have paid out to bail out Ukio's depositors. Hearts contribution to this loss is at least £65m from our calculations. Disgrace of an institution and fans.

[CropleyisGod]

If UBIG are unsecured this could force there admins to A.vote against a cva or B.hold on to shares.

I hope so. Getting worried they'll do a Pars "no point in voting against a CVA as you get nout anyway", could keep them alive and in the SPFL Premier Division?

I'd now like a swift execution using rope, sharp blades and toxic chemicals just to make sure. Don't want smug Corstorphine zombies staggering about all over the place...

[Gettin' Auld]

http://gs.delfi.lt/images/pix/300x188/d6389f7b/file52341879_d8a652ca.jpg


"Hey. What happened to my statue guys?"

[EuanH78]

I hope so. Getting worried they'll do a Pars "no point in voting against a CVA as you get nout anyway", could keep them alive and in the SPFL Premier Division?

I'd now like a swift execution using rope, sharp blades and toxic chemicals just to make sure. Don't want smug Corstorphine zombies staggering about all over the place...

Just to avoid/ create confusion... is there a GodisCropley username in use as well?

[PapillonVert]

Remember that he's not just a constituency MP though, he's also Shadow Business Minister, so his salary will be bumped up for that.

Hard to avoid the conclusion, after reading his Save Hearts In Trouble crap, that not only are Hearts goosed but so also are Her Maj's Opposition, if that's the best they can muster for a business brain.

A politician = considers spending other people's money as normal and then socialising the debt when it all goes - predictably - Pete Tong.

[CropleyisGod]

Just to avoid/ create confusion... is there a GodisCropley username in use as well?

Haven't seen one...field open ;-)

[Gettin' Auld]

Haven't seen one...field open ;-)

Aye there is one, it confuddled me too when i saw it.

[Dibben]

http://gs.delfi.lt/images/pix/300x188/d6389f7b/file52341879_d8a652ca.jpg


'and here's the best bit... When I bought them, the debt was only THIS size!!!'

[CyberSauzee]

Just to avoid/ create confusion... is there a GodisCropley username in use as well?

It's GodWasCropley you need to look out for. The omnipotent left peg takes many forms, both past and present.

[Moulin Yarns]

Just to avoid/ create confusion... is there a GodisCropley username in use as well?


Haven't seen one...field open ;-)


Aye there is one, it confuddled me too when i saw it.


It's GodWasCropley you need to look out for. The omnipotent left peg takes many forms, both past and present.

Aye, but I only pop up now and again to cause utter confusion.

[Cabbage East]

Aye, but I only pop up now and again to cause utter confusion.

So you've changed your username just to confuse people on here?

[StevieC]

Just to avoid/ create confusion... is there a GodisCropley username in use as well?

There will be a whole generation of Hibs supporters that will grow up thinking that Cropley was a firm of financial experts that frequented message boards providing sound advice upon request. :wink:

[CropleyWasGod]

There will be a whole generation of Hibs supporters that will grow up thinking that Cropley was a firm of financial experts that frequented message boards providing sound advice upon request. :wink:

Don't tar me with that brush :greengrin

[southsider]

Am i the only one thinking that perhaps it is time to end Limited Company Status so if you are a director of a company that goes belly up then every single asset that you own is put into the pot to pay the creditors. Just a thought.

[CropleyisGod]

Aye, but I only pop up now and again to cause utter confusion.

Who was that masked Cropley?...

[Twa Cairpets]

Am i the only one thinking that perhaps it is time to end Limited Company Status so if you are a director of a company that goes belly up then every single asset that you own is put into the pot to pay the creditors. Just a thought.

What if you're the Director of a company that goes belly up as a result of, say, Hearts wilful neglect of creditors? How would that be fair?

[CropleyWasGod]

Am i the only one thinking that perhaps it is time to end Limited Company Status so if you are a director of a company that goes belly up then every single asset that you own is put into the pot to pay the creditors. Just a thought.

... which would be the end of the Stock Exchange?

[sidneyhibbie]

The mountain of debt is shocking i note items CSOH GSO1 And GSO5 Scottish Power are due over 16k, letter going to them today to request disconnection of Electricity supply to the PBS. Further interest is item CSOF Ambulance Services 2.5k letter also going to them today they should not attend any more games at PBS Till they are paid.:hnet:

[CropleyWasGod]

The mountain of debt is shocking i note items CSOH GSO1 And GSO5 Scottish Power are due over 16k, letter going to them today to request disconnection of Electricity supply to the PBS. Further interest is item CSOF Ambulance Services 2.5k letter also going to them today they should not attend any more games at PBS Till they are paid.:hnet:

I know you mean well, Sidney, but that would be illegal. :greengrin

[Gettin' Auld]

I know you mean well, Sidney, but that would be illegal. :greengrin

Is insanity still accepted as a plea in court? :greengrin

[Bostonhibby]

I know you mean well, Sidney, but that would be illegal. :greengrin

Would it be okay if Sidney did it himself with a pair of boltcutters?

[Gettin' Auld]

I know you mean well, Sidney, but that would be illegal. :greengrin

He could always plead 'not guilty' by letter.

[sidneyhibbie]

I know you mean well, Sidney, but that would be illegal. :greengrin

Why is it illegal to cut off the electricity crops ? i would have thought that they at least could install one of they pay as you go meters i have one in my flat and they overcharged me till i paid off the debt can they no do the same thing at the PBS ?

[MB62]

I know you mean well, Sidney, but that would be illegal. :greengrin

so if everybody just stopped paying their electricty bill, the company couldn't just cut us all off, they would still be legally bound to supply us?

[BarneyK]

so if everybody just stopped paying their electricty bill, the company couldn't just cut us all off, they would still be legally bound to supply us?

Was more of a reference to the Ambulance Service surely?

[CropleyWasGod]

so if everybody just stopped paying their electricty bill, the company couldn't just cut us all off, they would still be legally bound to supply us?

What I meant was that, because the company is in administration, no action can be taken on pre-administration debt. It would only be legal to cut off the supply if the company failed to pay its current debt.


Why is it illegal to cut off the electricity crops ? i would have thought that they at least could install one of they pay as you go meters i have one in my flat and they overcharged me till i paid off the debt can they no do the same thing at the PBS ?

See above

[Cabbage East]

Sidney, tell us a bit about yourself.

[Pedantic_Hibee]

Why is it illegal to cut off the electricity crops ? i would have thought that they at least could install one of they pay as you go meters i have one in my flat and they overcharged me till i paid off the debt can they no do the same thing at the PBS ?

With this post, I think you have just won the internet.

[Treadstone]

Looking at the Hootsman site and the report on the Yams creditors has Bathgate nowhere to be seen. Hard to spin near £30m debt and stiffing charities.:brokenyam:

[21.05.2016]

Looks like everyone except the secured creditors will receive precisely 0p in the £ back. Even the secured creditors won't get all their money back.

So, there will be absolutely no money left to pay unsecured creditors after the secured creditors and the admin/liquidation fees are accounted for.

Remember, they paid Skacel at least £10,000 per week (allegedly) and others many of thousands per week to put a winning team on the park whilst simultaneously avoiding paying debts due.

This is the true cost of the financial doping. Taxpayer (HMRC, NHS, Police, Edinburgh Council), charities, and small businesses all massively out of the pocket due to financial doping.

Why is the establishment trying to sweep this inconvenient fact under the carpet and bail them out (again!)?

Ian Murray should start representing the interests of the majority of his constituents (as he is well paid by the taxpayer to do) instead of trying to get some free publicity out of a disgraced organisation.

Never mind buying the corrupt club - give the money raised through the pledges and bake sales and illicit alcohol brewing to those who really deserve it!

That way the stink of cheating emanating from the Gorgie area might start to dissipate a bit.

Spot on :top marks


Absolutely shameless, vulgar organisation with no morals or dignity hense why they are an absolute shambles of a club and the laughing stock of British football.

[Kojock]

http://gs.delfi.lt/images/pix/300x188/d6389f7b/file52341879_d8a652ca.jpg


Vladimir Romanov, you say,? Sorry officer never heard of him.

[Time For Heroes]

With this post, I think you have just won the internet.

And a years supply of envelopes funded by hibs.net
:D

[Kojock]

Is insanity still accepted as a plea in court? :greengrin

Very much so, it can be used two ways

1/ As a special defence. Insane at time of crime or

2/ Plea in bar of trial. Insane a time of trial.

Anyone reading Hibs Net would agree that Sidney was in dire need of psychiatric help. :greengrin

Just found a picture of Sidney. Anyone know him.

10761

[Gettin' Auld]

Very much so, it can be used two ways

1/ As a special defence. Insane at time of crime or

2/ Plea in bar of trial. Insane a time of trial.

Anyone reading Hibs Net would agree that Sidney was in dire need of psychiatric help. :greengrin

Plus, he could always plead 'not guily' by letter. :wink:

[hibs0666]

Would it be okay if Sidney did it himself with a pair of boltcutters?

Sidney's power is in his ideas and his pen. Sidney should leave the practical stuff to others or Sidney might do himself some harm.

[silverhibee]

Will Scottish Police be turning up for duties this weekend at the Savilledome.

[Bostonhibby]

Sidney's power is in his ideas and his pen. Sidney should leave the practical stuff to others or Sidney might do himself some harm.
Ah right, I see, Sidney does strike me as the persistent sort so maybe he could hack through the cable with his pen? Might take a while but its better than doing nothing like most of the major or establishment creditors seem to have done, often with our money. Direct action!

[Jack]

From the BDO document; “Arrangements have been made with various key suppliers to ensure continued supply of services during the Administration period …”

I’m with Little Sid on this! I might crayon a letter! :greengrin

Why don't, or didn't, the key suppliers just say NO?

Folk like the Police, Ambulance Service, Hairy Twat, in fact all those who have been funded in some way by the Scottish Government stand together as one and say if we don't get paid you don't get our services?

[BarneyK]

Will Scottish Police be turning up for duties this weekend at the Savilledome.

Is there something happening this weekend at the Savilledome, like? :wink:

[Mr White]

Will Scottish Police be turning up for duties this weekend at the Savilledome.

Probably not,hearts are playing in Perth :greengrin

[Green Man]

Will Scottish Police be turning up for duties this weekend at the Savilledome.

Nope. Hearts are away :greengrin

[Deansy]

Why is it illegal to cut off the electricity crops ? i would have thought that they at least could install one of they pay as you go meters i have one in my flat and they overcharged me till i paid off the debt can they no do the same thing at the PBS ?

'Pay-as-you-go' Meters aren't available for business-customers, only for domestic-customers.

[lapsedhibee]

Sidney, tell us a bit about yourself.

How on earth can he do that, when you haven't provided a mailing address? :crazy:

[silverhibee]

Has anyone suggested that Hibs should donate the money to the poppy folk and macraes batallion - let's take the moral high ground once and for all.

Maybe Fish could do a charity concert for them. :cb

[clerriehibs]

Fair to say that, with the HMRC debt near £2m, no instalment of the payment plan was ever paid, despite assurances to the contrary at the time?

SPFL should take note. These gimps were in no way self-sufficient.

[kdhibees1]

Grainger - Welt!
http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/latest/hearts-administration-grainger-feels-for-old-club-1-3024390
“Hearts is a unique club – there’s nobody else like them,” he said. “Getting paid on time here is definitely a bonus, though.
Unique indeed!!

[Speedway]

I notice Belouis Some is attempting a comeback with a re-worked version of their 1985 classic - Imagination

Golden Gary was asked to manage, both hands behind his back
Thought he was desperate, lack of job offers saw to that
Only you can try to see what I'm really like
He said, only you can understand the way I've been pished on tonight
He blamed excesses on the Lithuanian dream
So seldom witnessed, never-er seen
Hah - hah - hah - hah - hah...

Liquidation - could make a laughing stock of you
Liquidation - could make me love you too
Liquidation - is all I want from you-ou

They lost their virtue before they could write
They lost their last clue when they went and signed N'goo
You'll have to guide me, to fund these impossible share schemes
You make me steal from charities, unstealable things
He blamed excesses on the Lithuanian dream
So seldom witnessed, never-er seen
Hah - hah - hah - hah - hah...

Liquidation - could make a laughing stock of you
Liquidation - could make me love you too
Liquidation - is all I want from you-ou

And - he blamed excesses on the Lithuanian dream
So seldom witnessed, never-er seen
Hah - hah - hah - hah - hah...

Liquidation - could make a laughing stock of you
Liquidation - could make me love you too
Liquidation - is all I want from you-ou

Liquidation
Liquidation
Liquidation
Liquidation

Liquidation
Liquidation
Liquidation
Liquidation
Liquidation
Liquidation
Liquidation
Liquidation

[Gus Fring]

I've been speaking to my sources this morning. Here's the skinny from both Hearts and the SPFL.

The feeling internally at Hearts is that Liquidation is the most likely outcome. This is because the bids submitted to UKIO were not the original offers, BDO had already advised the bidders they were unacceptable and asked them to increase them, HMFC Ltd gave their highest offer first time so they had no where else to go but drop out. The FOH have very little cash for a CVA (compared to the size of the debt) and there is concern about how much of the direct debits will be used to run the club and how much will be used to repay the startup costs.

There is also the added hurdles of the assets still being frozen. BDO have made it clear that this is not anywhere near as easy to resolve as the press has made out. BDO were also hoping that the creditors list would go under the radar, they knew some of the names would result in negative press but ultimately it's not their problem.

BDO are duty bound to follow this path until it becomes impossible though. They're not going to give up until they have to because their reputation and future business is on the line.

Now, the SPFL.

They've been discussing with their lawyers about what the options available are and their hands are tied. They refused financial assistance on 2 separate occasions before admin occurred because they want as much possible left in the pot to deal with Hearts no longer being in the league if needs be. The lawyers have told them they will be wide open to litigation if they don't do this by the book. No decision has been made yet about what the punishment will be, it's only fair to hear Hearts side of the story before making a decision. BDO gave repeated assurances to the SPL that Hearts will be able to fulfil they're fixtures including providing proof of funding (What they currently have in the bank and projected earnings during the season). BDO have good stock within the SPFL as they've always been open and honest in the past.

[coldingham hibs]

After reading about the CVA agreed for Dunfermline Athletic, I cannot help thinking that a very similar scenario is about to happen at the wongadome,

Creditors received a big fat zero despite debts of around £10 million. Preferential creditors receiving about £70K & only football debts to be paid £150K.

Pretty disgusting that the the pictures in the paper show Mr Leishman & his counter part celebrating with raised scarfs after shafting all those innocent creditors.

I'm not sure what the situation is with East End Park but if would appear that Pars Utd have obtained the ground (which must have been work a few bob to developers) for virtually nowt (unless there is some sort of retal agreement that I haven't heard about).

It is my guess that Hearts will get the ground & rights for less that £4 million & creditors will get Sweet FA.

The SFA will extend a transfer embargo until December and when that is lifted the Yams will sign a load of players, probably on higher wages than we currently pay in a bid to stay up.

[clerriehibs]

I've been speaking to my sources this morning. Here's the skinny from both Hearts and the SPFL.

The feeling internally at Hearts is that Liquidation is the most likely outco
that the creditors list would go under the radar, they knew some of the names would result in negative press but ultimately it's not their problem.

BDO are duty bound to follow this path until it becomes impossible though. They're not going to give up until they have to because their reputation and future business is on the line.

Now, the SPFL.

They've been discussing with their lawyers about what the options available are and their hands are tied. They refused financial assistance on 2 separate occasions before admin occurred because they want as much possible left in the pot to deal with Hearts no longer being in the league if needs be. The lawyers have told them they will be wide open to litigation if they don't do this by the book. No decision has been made yet about what the punishment will be tomorrow, it's only fair to hear Hearts side of the story before making a decision. BDO gave repeated assurances to the SPL that Hearts will be able to fulfil they're fixtures including providing proof of funding (What they currently have in the bank and projected earnings during the season). BDO have good stock within the SPFL as they've always been open and honest in the past.

Last bit is at odds with what BDO have said about having funding till October.

[lapsedhibee]

I've been speaking to my sources this morning. Here's the skinny from both Hearts and the SPFL.

The feeling internally at Hearts is that Liquidation is the most likely outcome. This is because the bids submitted to UKIO were not the original offers, BDO had already advised the bidders they were unacceptable and asked them to increase them, HMFC Ltd gave their highest offer first time so they had no where else to go but drop out. The FOH have very little cash for a CVA (compared to the size of the debt) and there is concern about how much of the direct debits will be used to run the club and how much will be used to repay the startup costs.

There is also the added hurdles of the assets still being frozen. BDO have made it clear that this is not anywhere near as easy to resolve as the press has made out. BDO were also hoping that the creditors list would go under the radar, they knew some of the names would result in negative press but ultimately it's not their problem.

BDO are duty bound to follow this path until it becomes impossible though. They're not going to give up until they have to because their reputation and future business is on the line.

Now, the SPFL.

They've been discussing with their lawyers about what the options available are and their hands are tied. They refused financial assistance on 2 separate occasions before admin occurred because they want as much possible left in the pot to deal with Hearts no longer being in the league if needs be. The lawyers have told them they will be wide open to litigation if they don't do this by the book. No decision has been made yet about what the punishment will be tomorrow, it's only fair to hear Hearts side of the story before making a decision. BDO gave repeated assurances to the SPL that Hearts will be able to fulfil they're fixtures including providing proof of funding (What they currently have in the bank and projected earnings during the season). BDO have good stock within the SPFL as they've always been open and honest in the past.

CWG in undermining fellow professionals shocker! :panic:

[hibs0666]

Last bit is at odds with what BDO have said about having funding till October.

They have £900,000 in the bank and are burning about £300,000 a month. That does not include any other cash that the club is due to receive from the league, sponsors etc. through the season.

[Gus Fring]

I forgot to add, there is no "Debt Free" scenario for Hearts to exit administration. Massone's bid has a loan that will be taken over by the club apparently and the FOH have to pay back all of the money they are using to buy the club. Both will have to pay back the footballing debt.

[Craig_in_Prague]

I hope those of you that wanted them to still be around & exit administration, are changing your minds - haven seen the long list of people & companies they have shafted. For a very long number of years, they have failed to pay various things that any sporting club should be paying without question & on time, every time!..... the tax man & their own training location FFS!
They threw ridiculous money at players & continued to do so and ignore all else..... and year on year became the most horrible football team on the planet.

This disgusting, turd coloured team, deserve to be liquidated and gone for good.

[CropleyWasGod]

CWG in undermining fellow professionals shocker! :panic:

I did wonder why it didn't appear on the Hearts website.

However, they are a bit naive if they thought that no-one would pick it up. Or, perhaps, they were relying on the MSM to do their usual non-job on stuff that is actually in the public domain.

[StevieC]

It is my guess that Hearts will get the ground & rights for less that £4 million & creditors will get Sweet FA.

Surely the Lithuanians must be thinking that, for less than £4m to squeeze through a CVA, it's worth a punt on the open market after liquidation.
At worst you will likely still get the same bids for Tynecastle from those trying to save the club, even after liquidation. And there is always the chance that a couple of property developers bidding against each other might see them double their money?

[Hibs7]

They have £900,000 in the bank and are burning about £300,000 a month. That does not include any other cash that the club is due to receive from the league, sponsors etc. through the season.

They also have 500,000 odd footballing debts that have to be paid out of that 900,000 plus the administrators fees which at present are £ 180,000 so not a lot left if they are burning £300,000 a month ..in fact if my calculations are correct they are on their bare arse !!

[Keith_M]

After reading about the CVA agreed for Dunfermline Athletic, I cannot help thinking that a very similar scenario is about to happen at the wongadome,

Creditors received a big fat zero despite debts of around £10 million. Preferential creditors receiving about £70K & only football debts to be paid £150K.

Pretty disgusting that the the pictures in the paper show Mr Leishman & his counter part celebrating with raised scarfs after shafting all those innocent creditors.

I'm not sure what the situation is with East End Park but if would appear that Pars Utd have obtained the ground (which must have been work a few bob to developers) for virtually nowt (unless there is some sort of retal agreement that I haven't heard about).

It is my guess that Hearts will get the ground & rights for less that £4 million & creditors will get Sweet FA.

The SFA will extend a transfer embargo until December and when that is lifted the Yams will sign a load of players, probably on higher wages than we currently pay in a bid to stay up.


Are you Rolland from the Scotsman comments section?

:hmmm:

[CropleyWasGod]

It is my guess that Hearts will get the ground & rights for less that £4 million & creditors will get Sweet FA.

The SFA will extend a transfer embargo until December and when that is lifted the Yams will sign a load of players, probably on higher wages than we currently pay in a bid to stay up.

Good guess. BDO have already stated that in their report.

[RoxburghHibs]

I hope those of you that wanted them to still be around & exit administration, are changing your minds - haven seen the long list of people & companies they have shafted. For a very long number of years, they have failed to pay various things that any sporting club should be paying without question & on time, every time!..... the tax man & their own training location FFS!
They threw ridiculous money at players & continued to do so and ignore all else..... and year on year became the most horrible football team on the planet.

This disgusting, turd coloured team, deserve to be liquidated and gone for good.


:top marksespecially the turd colour bit

[hibby rae]

I've been speaking to my sources this morning. Here's the skinny from both Hearts and the SPFL.

The feeling internally at Hearts is that Liquidation is the most likely outcome. This is because the bids submitted to UKIO were not the original offers, BDO had already advised the bidders they were unacceptable and asked them to increase them, HMFC Ltd gave their highest offer first time so they had no where else to go but drop out. The FOH have very little cash for a CVA (compared to the size of the debt) and there is concern about how much of the direct debits will be used to run the club and how much will be used to repay the startup costs.

There is also the added hurdles of the assets still being frozen. BDO have made it clear that this is not anywhere near as easy to resolve as the press has made out. BDO were also hoping that the creditors list would go under the radar, they knew some of the names would result in negative press but ultimately it's not their problem.

BDO are duty bound to follow this path until it becomes impossible though. They're not going to give up until they have to because their reputation and future business is on the line.

Now, the SPFL.

They've been discussing with their lawyers about what the options available are and their hands are tied. They refused financial assistance on 2 separate occasions before admin occurred because they want as much possible left in the pot to deal with Hearts no longer being in the league if needs be. The lawyers have told them they will be wide open to litigation if they don't do this by the book. No decision has been made yet about what the punishment will be tomorrow, it's only fair to hear Hearts side of the story before making a decision. BDO gave repeated assurances to the SPL that Hearts will be able to fulfil they're fixtures including providing proof of funding (What they currently have in the bank and projected earnings during the season). BDO have good stock within the SPFL as they've always been open and honest in the past.

Have your sources gave you a prediction of when they think liquidation is most likely to take place, if it does?

[Baader]

That list is shameful (businesses they have used and completely disregarded including charities) and hilarious in parts - one individual is owed £41!!!

Will be an absolute disgrace if they get out of this without squaring off the many they conned along the way while still signing players...

[PapillonVert]

I forgot to add, there is no "Debt Free" scenario for Hearts to exit administration. Massone's bid has a loan that will be taken over by the club apparently and the FOH have to pay back all of the money they are using to buy the club. Both will have to pay back the footballing debt.

sorry, Bajillions, but for financial illiterates like myself, can you explain this a bit more?

Will Masssone's bid be funded 100% by club? Edit: Via loan which is landed on the club? So, he takes it over, realises the assets and pockets the proceeds and, bang, into admin. we go again?

For FoH you say they have to pay back all the money. To whom? Aren't the pledges the equivalent of gifts? I am not seeing why they would legally be obliged to pay that back if it has been freely and voluntarily handed over with no strings attached.


That list is shameful (businesses they have used and completely disregarded including charities) and hilarious in parts - one individual is owed £41!!!

Will be an absolute disgrace if they get out of this without squaring off the many they conned along the way while still signing players...

An interesting £457 owed to a company called Shred-it.

Wonder what documents were shredded. :wink:

[joe breezy]

After reading about the CVA agreed for Dunfermline Athletic, I cannot help thinking that a very similar scenario is about to happen at the wongadome,

Creditors received a big fat zero despite debts of around £10 million. Preferential creditors receiving about £70K & only football debts to be paid £150K.

Pretty disgusting that the the pictures in the paper show Mr Leishman & his counter part celebrating with raised scarfs after shafting all those innocent creditors.

I'm not sure what the situation is with East End Park but if would appear that Pars Utd have obtained the ground (which must have been work a few bob to developers) for virtually nowt (unless there is some sort of retal agreement that I haven't heard about).

It is my guess that Hearts will get the ground & rights for less that £4 million & creditors will get Sweet FA.

The SFA will extend a transfer embargo until December and when that is lifted the Yams will sign a load of players, probably on higher wages than we currently pay in a bid to stay up.

i take it you've not been following the Hearts case then, which is very different in many ways?

[Keith_M]

An interesting £457 owed to a company called Shred-it.

Wonder what documents were shredded. :wink:


That would be quite funny, get a company to shred all the evidence of financial mis-management then bump them for the bill :greengrin

[lapsedhibee]

I did wonder why it didn't appear on the Hearts website.

However, they are a bit naive if they thought that no-one would pick it up. Or, perhaps, they were relying on the MSM to do their usual non-job on stuff that is actually in the public domain.

There you go again! :wink:

They were shirley in serious error if they thought, after all that went on last year with the the the huns, that MSM's doziness would be enough to keep sensitive info under wraps.

Probably naive of me to think that a £240/hr average wage should bring with it more nous.

[Jack]

sorry, Bajillions, but for financial illiterates like myself, can you explain this a bit more?

Will Masssone's bid be funded 100% by club? Edit: Via loan which is landed on the club? So, he takes it over, realises the assets and pockets the proceeds and, bang, into admin. we go again?

For FoH you say they have to pay back all the money. To whom? Aren't the pledges the equivalent of gifts? I am not seeing why they would legally be obliged to pay that back if it has been freely and voluntarily handed over with no strings attached.

I'm no financial expert but what I understand of the foh bid Ann Budge and others are putting up the capital to buy the club, they are to be repaid from the pledges. I would imagine Massones backers will want something similar.

[rcarter1]

I hope, given that Dunfermline have burned £10 million, and Hearts one way or another set to burn another £X million, not to mention Rangers, that the SPFL finally get their act together to ensure ALL clubs are run in an honest and responsible fashion. :rules:

Unbelievable. I am going to start a Football club - Scam Utd FC, borrow 10 million, blow it on a good time, do a runner, and then say it was all for the fans... :idea::crazy:

[nribs]

I don't understand all this doing things by the book and leaving themselves open to being sued? I thought Hearts could be fined, transfer embaro, censored?? Or have their membership removed? Surely if the later is an option for going into admin then it's legaly covered?? Get rid of the cheating ****s!!

[PapillonVert]

I'm no financial expert but what I understand of the foh bid Ann Budge and others are putting up the capital to buy the club, they are to be repaid from the pledges. I would imagine Massones backers will want something similar.

Aah, bisto! I didn't know FoH had AB putting up the capital. Thought it was all coming from the pledges. That bid looks more la-la-land and wobbly by the minute. Surely not a viable business plan - unless they think they can continue the Jambo Way of ignoring all bills?

A sort of footballing "trou normand". Or Roman banquet.


I don't understand all this doing things by the book and leaving themselves open to being sued? I thought Hearts could be fined, transfer embaro, censored?? Or have their membership removed? Surely if the later is an option for going into admin then it's legaly covered?? Get rid of the cheating ****s!!

Also, where are they going to get the money to sue?

[CropleyWasGod]

There you go again! :wink:

They were shirley in serious error if they thought, after all that went on last year with the the the huns, that MSM's doziness would be enough to keep sensitive info under wraps.

Probably naive of me to think that a £240/hr average wage should bring with it more nous.

It wasn't under wraps, though. It was out there, for anyone to see.


Also, where are they going to get the money to sue?

It would be the liquidators who would sue. Along the lines of RFC's liquidators suing Collyer Bristow.

[ano hibby]

Thanks for the update Bajillions, appreciate some decent info. Sounds pretty sensible.
:aok:

[Jack]

I did wonder why it didn't appear on the Hearts website.

However, they are a bit naive if they thought that no-one would pick it up. Or, perhaps, they were relying on the MSM to do their usual non-job on stuff that is actually in the public domain.

Your posting of the debtors list was undoubtedly one of the most brilliant exposes made on this website EVER, IMO :-)

I have no doubt BDO, and anyone else associated with hahahearts, would have rather never seen it again after it was filed at Companies Hoose.

While they will have made contingency plans for it going public I bet they never thought they'd have to use them. I'd have loved to have been in the room when they found out the news broke.

[hibs0666]

They also have 500,000 odd footballing debts that have to be paid out of that 900,000 plus the administrators fees which at present are £ 180,000 so not a lot left if they are burning £300,000 a month ..in fact if my calculations are correct they are on their bare arse !!

I'd guess that the SFA will want the football debts paid if and when when they come out of administration so it won't affect the £900,000 directly. I fully agree that they are on their bare arse.

[PatHead]

Aah, bisto! I didn't know FoH had AB putting up the capital. Thought it was all coming from the pledges. That bid looks more la-la-land and wobbly by the minute. Surely not a viable business plan - unless they think they can continue the Jambo Way of ignoring all bills?

A sort of footballing "trou normand". Or Roman banquet.

At the very beginning of FoH coming out as a contender, when they offered to buy the club for paying off the tax bill and get Hearts for £500k they stated that the funds would come from a loan which had to be repaid. As they have not collected any money yet and only appear to have £48,000 I would assume the same will happen here as they don't have any funds to bridge the gap between £48k and £x million to buy the club. This means their playing budget is non existent. Almost makes you want them to survive. But hell no- die and die soon.

[Keith_M]

It wasn't under wraps, though. It was out there, for anyone to see.

"But Mr Dent, the plans have been available in the local planning office for the last nine months."

"Oh yes, well as soon as I heard I went straight round to see them, yesterday afternoon. You hadn't exactly gone out of your way to call attention to them, had you? I mean, like actually telling anybody or anything."

"But the plans were on display ..."

"On display? I eventually had to go down to the cellar to find them."

"That's the display department."

"With a flashlight."

"Ah, well the lights had probably gone."

"So had the stairs."

"But look, you found the notice didn't you?"

"Yes," said Arthur, "yes I did. It was on display in the bottom of a locked filing cabinet stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying 'Beware of the Leopard'."

[Gus Fring]

I don't understand all this doing things by the book and leaving themselves open to being sued? I thought Hearts could be fined, transfer embaro, censored?? Or have their membership removed? Surely if the later is an option for going into admin then it's legaly covered?? Get rid of the cheating ****s!!


Also, where are they going to get the money to sue?

We went over this a few pages back. Long story short, membership termination isn't an available punishment for going into administration.

Hearts have more than enough money now to mount a legal challenge, the money they have to see them into october could be repurposed on a court battle if they aren't going to be playing football as a result of the SPFL booting them out. This would inevitably result in Hearts winning the court case and costing the SPFL millions, which would have a direct impact on every team in the league.

[PatHead]

It wasn't under wraps, though. It was out there, for anyone to see.

Only if they bothered looking though. MSM have a history of not bothering. Thanks for finding it. Can we all get signed photos are you are fast becoming our hero? (At least until kick off on Sunday)

[Waxy]

Almost seems like their only option is liquidation. If they fo somehow manage to squirm out of administration, it'll be by alot of crooked actions by crooked people.

[PapillonVert]

It would be the liquidators who would sue. Along the lines of RFC's liquidators suing Collyer Bristow.

The liquidators represent the creditors. Why would they sue and use up the creditors' money?

It would be up to rump HMFC to sue and they don't have a bean.

Don't think the Collyer Bristow case was the same issue. They were sued for negligent advice IIRC.

[CropleyWasGod]

The liquidators represent the creditors. Why would they sue and use up the creditors' money?

It would be up to rump HMFC to sue and they don't have a bean.

Don't think the Collyer Bristow case was the same issue. They were sued for negligent advice IIRC.

They would make a decision on whether it was in the interests of the creditors to sue (that's the bit that would be like the Rangers case. BDO obviously thought it was worth it.) If, as Bajillions set out a few pages ago, the liquidators saw a case for loss of income, then they would be quite entitled to use some of the money available to them.


"But Mr Dent, the plans have been available in the local planning office for the last nine months."

"Oh yes, well as soon as I heard I went straight round to see them, yesterday afternoon. You hadn't exactly gone out of your way to call attention to them, had you? I mean, like actually telling anybody or anything."

"But the plans were on display ..."

"On display? I eventually had to go down to the cellar to find them."

"That's the display department."

"With a flashlight."

"Ah, well the lights had probably gone."

"So had the stairs."

"But look, you found the notice didn't you?"

"Yes," said Arthur, "yes I did. It was on display in the bottom of a locked filing cabinet stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying 'Beware of the Leopard'."

Thanks for the fish. :greengrin

[CyberSauzee]

http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/football/gary-locke-hearts-have-been-punished-enough.1375355187?

Locke saying the've been punished enough. It never rains but it showers, eh Gary? Never mind, there's maybe a glimmer of golden sunlight out there for you somewhere. Maybe Division 1 of the EoS League for 2014-15 if you can get a ground to play in somewhere?

[Gus Fring]

The liquidators represent the creditors. Why would they sue and use up the creditors' money?

It would be up to rump HMFC to sue and they don't have a bean.

Don't think the Collyer Bristow case was the same issue. They were sued for negligent advice IIRC.

They do, Hearts have cash in the bank. It makes sense for the liquidator to sue the SPFL. If it costs them, say, £200k to bring the court case and they win £5m then it will be worth it because this would mean more money for the creditors, it would also mean a likely overturning of the decision meaning a greater return on the Football club part of the liquidation.

"Don't get into a fight with a man who has nothing to lose"


To clarify for CropleyWasGod. BDO weren't trying to hide the creditors list, I just got the impression they didn't expect it to become common knowledge so quickly. I guess they hoped football fans wouldn't have the gumption to check Companies House. Clearly Mr Jackson doesn't frequent Hibs.net :wink:

[joe breezy]

http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/football/gary-locke-hearts-have-been-punished-enough.1375355187?

Locke saying the've been punished enough. It never rains but it showers, eh Gary? Never mind, there's maybe a glimmer of golden sunlight out there for you somewhere. Maybe Division 1 of the EoS League for 2014-15 if you can get a ground to play in somewhere?

Ha ha ha - 2 glorious summer's in a row

[HIBERNIAN-0762]

That list is shameful (businesses they have used and completely disregarded including charities) and hilarious in parts - one individual is owed £41!!!

Will be an absolute disgrace if they get out of this without squaring off the many they conned along the way while still signing players...

they claim that the McCrae's battalion debt has been paid, any proof of that?

[Liberal Hibby]

I notice Belouis Some is attempting a comeback with a re-worked version of their 1985 classic - Imagination

Golden Gary was asked to manage, both hands behind his back
Thought he was desperate, lack of job offers saw to that
Only you can try to see what I'm really like
He said, only you can understand the way I've been pished on tonight
He blamed excesses on the Lithuanian dream
So seldom witnessed, never-er seen
Hah - hah - hah - hah - hah...

Liquidation - could make a laughing stock of you
Liquidation - could make me love you too
Liquidation - is all I want from you-ou

They lost their virtue before they could write
They lost their last clue when they went and signed N'goo
You'll have to guide me, to fund these impossible share schemes
You make me steal from charities, unstealable things
He blamed excesses on the Lithuanian dream
So seldom witnessed, never-er seen
Hah - hah - hah - hah - hah...

Liquidation - could make a laughing stock of you
Liquidation - could make me love you too
Liquidation - is all I want from you-ou

And - he blamed excesses on the Lithuanian dream
So seldom witnessed, never-er seen
Hah - hah - hah - hah - hah...

Liquidation - could make a laughing stock of you
Liquidation - could make me love you too
Liquidation - is all I want from you-ou

Liquidation
Liquidation
Liquidation
Liquidation

Liquidation
Liquidation
Liquidation
Liquidation
Liquidation
Liquidation
Liquidation
Liquidation

Excellent. Not sure I'd like to see the video though...

[HIBERNIAN-0762]

http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/football/gary-locke-hearts-have-been-punished-enough.1375355187?

Locke saying the've been punished enough. It never rains but it showers, eh Gary? Never mind, there's maybe a glimmer of golden sunlight out there for you somewhere. Maybe Division 1 of the EoS League for 2014-15 if you can get a ground to play in somewhere?

This kind of sucking up to the media really is an insult to all those they owe money to, what a shameless shambles of a club.

[Harpandcastle]

http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/football/gary-locke-hearts-have-been-punished-enough.1375355187?

Locke saying the've been punished enough. It never rains but it showers, eh Gary? Never mind, there's maybe a glimmer of golden sunlight out there for you somewhere. Maybe Division 1 of the EoS League for 2014-15 if you can get a ground to play in somewhere?

Sure I read somewhere he prefers golden showers to golden sunlight.

[Ozyhibby]

they claim that the McCrae's battalion debt has been paid, any proof of that?

Doesn't matter if members of the public step up to make a payment now. Good on them if they do.
The damage to Hearts reputation is done. They are the club who trousered the poppy money.

[clerriehibs]

they claim that the McCrae's battalion debt has been paid, any proof of that?

If it has been paid, it wasn't by homfc. And that's to their eternal embarassment.

[CropleyisGod]

They do, Hearts have cash in the bank. It makes sense for the liquidator to sue the SPFL. If it costs them, say, £200k to bring the court case and they win £5m then it will be worth it because this would mean more money for the creditors, it would also mean a likely overturning of the decision meaning a greater return on the Football club part of the liquidation.

"Don't get into a fight with a man who has nothing to lose"


To clarify for CropleyWasGod. BDO weren't trying to hide the creditors list, I just got the impression they didn't expect it to become common knowledge so quickly. I guess they hoped football fans wouldn't have the gumption to check Companies House. Clearly Mr Jackson doesn't frequent Hibs.net :wink:

I know you accountancy types are not always computer literate but you can put an electronic 'watch' on any company registered at Companies House...no brainer really. ;-)

[21.05.2016]

http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/football/gary-locke-hearts-have-been-punished-enough.1375355187?

Locke saying the've been punished enough. It never rains but it showers, eh Gary? Never mind, there's maybe a glimmer of golden sunlight out there for you somewhere. Maybe Division 1 of the EoS League for 2014-15 if you can get a ground to play in somewhere?

Aww boo hoo poor little us, we are being victimised, everyone out to get us, poor wee us . . . .


Aye ****ing right, these arrogant, deluded morons have given it the big un' for years whilst they have been cheating, screwing so many people and organisations including charities and small business out of a hell of a lot of money so that they could splash ridiculous amounts of cash on players to get ahead. They lapped up the cheated success they bought now they have to deal with the consequences! It was always gonna end this way, everyone could see that the club was heading for a major crash as it was clearly being run by crooks and liars but no hearts fans continued to skip merrily along in Vlad fantasy land and therefore never stopped and realised where their club was heading. These ***** deserve EVERYTHING they get and more. Horrible, scabby, disgusting, moral-less, shameless laughing stock of a club!

[kdhibees1]

Unsure if already posted, list of creditors now on Scotsman site.
http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/spfl/hearts-list-of-creditors-in-full-1-3024802


Aww boo hoo poor little us, we are being victimised, everyone out to get us, poor wee us . . . .


Aye ****ing right, these arrogant, deluded morons have given it the big un' for years whilst they have been cheating, screwing so many people and organisations including charities and small business out of a hell of a lot of money so that they could splash ridiculous amounts of cash on players to get ahead. They lapped up the cheated success they bought now they have to deal with the consequences! It was always gonna end this way, everyone could see that the club was heading for a major crash as it was clearly being run by crooks and liars but no hearts fans continued to skip merrily along in Vlad fantasy land and therefore never stopped and realised where their club was heading. These ***** deserve EVERYTHING they get and more. Horrible, scabby, disgusting, moral-less, shameless laughing stock of a club! And...relax :greengrin
Great post!

[clerriehibs]

Unsure if already posted, list of creditors now on Scotsman site.
http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/spfl/hearts-list-of-creditors-in-full-1-3024802

Yesterday's news, courtesy of CWG

[21.05.2016]

Doesn't matter if members of the public step up to make a payment now. Good on them if they do.
The damage to Hearts reputation is done. They are the club who trousered the poppy money.

Heart of Midlothian FC - the club with no shame

[kdhibees1]

Yesterday's news, courtesy of CWG Copied and pasted. Joke newspaper!!

[PapillonVert]

Heart of Midlothian FC - the club with no shame

Soon to be the club with no hame.

[sidneyhibbie]

What I meant was that, because the company is in administration, no action can be taken on pre-administration debt. It would only be legal to cut off the supply if the company failed to pay its current debt.



See above

I Understand now still seems unfair

[CropleyWasGod]

I know you accountancy types are not always computer literate but you can put an electronic 'watch' on any company registered at Companies House...no brainer really. ;-)

Um... sorry to disillusion you, but that's exactly how i got the BDO report. I do it all the time, for a variety of reasons.

[PapillonVert]

They do, Hearts have cash in the bank. It makes sense for the liquidator to sue the SPFL. If it costs them, say, £200k to bring the court case and they win £5m then it will be worth it because this would mean more money for the creditors, it would also mean a likely overturning of the decision meaning a greater return on the Football club part of the liquidation.

"Don't get into a fight with a man who has nothing to lose"


To clarify for CropleyWasGod. BDO weren't trying to hide the creditors list, I just got the impression they didn't expect it to become common knowledge so quickly. I guess they hoped football fans wouldn't have the gumption to check Companies House. Clearly Mr Jackson doesn't frequent Hibs.net :wink:

OK, but I was thinking of the time after a possible liquidation had taken place.

Was always told that there is no such thing as a sure thing in litigation - if there was no cases would ever get to court! :wink:

[southsider]

Whilst nothing finnancial can be done to the ex and current directors of HoM, perhaps the said directors should be taken down the grassmarket and horse-whipped. Lying, cheating ****.

[CropleyWasGod]

Whilst nothing finnancial can be done to the ex and current directors of HoM, perhaps the said directors should be taken down the grassmarket and horse-whipped. Lying, cheating ****.

Yes it can.

If they can be shown to have taken on additional debt after the date that company was shown to be insolvent, they can be held personally liable for those debts.

[Coco Bryce]

Yes it can.

If they can be shown to have taken on additional debt after the date that company was shown to be insolvent, they can be held personally liable for those debts.

I would imagine this is quite difficult to prove?

[Billy Whizz]

Soon to be the club with no hame.

Must be a song in that for a week on Sunday

[CropleyWasGod]

I would imagine this is quite difficult to prove?

Yeah, and it would depend on a liquidator having sufficient funds to take the necessary action.

[CropleyisGod]

Um... sorry to disillusion you, but that's exactly how i got the BDO report. I do it all the time, for a variety of reasons.

That was my guess :-)

Cropleys ken stuff :-))

[Hibee87]

Any ideas what time the hearing is, and when we are likely to find out the outcome? :greengrin

[Moulin Yarns]

Yes it can.

If they can be shown to have taken on additional debt after the date that company was shown to be insolvent, they can be held personally liable for those debts.


That was my guess :-)

Cropleys ken stuff :-))

I didn't know that ;-)

[CropleyWasGod]

Any ideas what time the hearing is, and when we are likely to find out the outcome? :greengrin

130 pm

[Moulin Yarns]

Any ideas what time the hearing is, and when we are likely to find out the outcome? :greengrin

Right about Now, The funk soul brother

[Hibee87]

Right about Now, The funk soul brother

Check it out now ? :thumbsup:

[LongshanksED]

How much was rangers fined last year anyway?

Same rules apply surely?

[sidneyhibbie]

Ah right, I see, Sidney does strike me as the persistent sort so maybe he could hack through the cable with his pen? Might take a while but its better than doing nothing like most of the major or establishment creditors seem to have done, often with our money. Direct action!

I Am swithing my direct action from written letters to E Mails from now on i plan to trawl through the list and contact as many of the victims as possible and try to rally them into a direct action group nothing like stirring up bother for the yams.

And yes i am a bit like a dog with a bone once i get a mission to undertake.

Sidney :hnet:
:not worth

[Treadstone]

I Am swithing my direct action from written letters to E Mails from now on i plan to trawl through the list and contact as many of the victims as possible and try to rally them into a direct action group nothing like stirring up bother for the yams.

And yes i am a bit like a dog with a bone once i get a mission to undertake.

Sidney :hnet:
:not worth

A yam with a bone. no ?

[cabbageandribs1875]

what does swithing mean :confused:







i need to know

[21.05.2016]

I Am swithing my direct action from written letters to E Mails from now on i plan to trawl through the list and contact as many of the victims as possible and try to rally them into a direct action group nothing like stirring up bother for the yams.

And yes i am a bit like a dog with a bone once i get a mission to undertake.

Sidney :hnet:
:not worth


:top marks

[Sergey]

Fair to say that, with the HMRC debt near £2m, no instalment of the payment plan was ever paid, despite assurances to the contrary at the time?

SPFL should take note. These gimps were in no way self-sufficient.

If that is indeed the case, then it's a stick-on certainty that the share monies worked their way back to Vlad.

[Hibbyradge]

what does swithing mean :confused:







i need to know

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=swithing

[RoxburghHibs]

130 pm

It's 2pm now and no news so I'm guessing yuo mean this is when the meeting starts not when we will hear the results.

[Jim44]

A yam with a bone. no ?

My mother used to make soup using a Yam bone or was it a ham bone?

[lapsedhibee]

"But Mr Dent, the plans have been available in the local planning office for the last nine months."

"Oh yes, well as soon as I heard I went straight round to see them, yesterday afternoon. You hadn't exactly gone out of your way to call attention to them, had you? I mean, like actually telling anybody or anything."

"But the plans were on display ..."

"On display? I eventually had to go down to the cellar to find them."

"That's the display department."

"With a flashlight."

"Ah, well the lights had probably gone."

"So had the stairs."

"But look, you found the notice didn't you?"

"Yes," said Arthur, "yes I did. It was on display in the bottom of a locked filing cabinet stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying 'Beware of the Leopard'."
:faf: and :agree: Preciselymundo.


It wasn't under wraps, though. It was out there, for anyone to see.
Way too modest.


Your posting of the debtors list was undoubtedly one of the most brilliant exposes made on this website EVER, IMO :-)


:agree:

[cam75]

On broke back they reckon 3pm for results of hearing ?
GGTTH

[hibs0666]

how much was rangers fined last year anyway?

Same rules apply surely?

£50k

[CropleyWasGod]

It's 2pm now and no news so I'm guessing yuo mean this is when the meeting starts not when we will hear the results.

Sorry, that's when it started.

1.31 pm is when they adjourn it :greengrin

[brog]

Just catching up with this thread after losing my shirt at Goodwood yesterday. Its ok though I'm going to tell the Tote & the bookies I'm now in admin & they'll get hee haw!!
A few random thoughts.
1. Can I join in the general acclaim for CWG & disgust for Yams, a sorry, sordid outfit.
2. I take no pleasure in being proved correct that HMRC would be shafted by Yams. I'm intrigued to note however that the whole debt (£1.9mm) is shown as due to the Debt Mgt & Insolvency service. This could mean, either Yams lied re making the 1st debt payment, or payment was very small or possibly that subsequent unpaid PAYE/VAT was added to the total. Either way it's shameful & I don't think HMRC have covered themselves in glory either.
3. I continue to be concerned re Bryan Jackson's role in the admin process. In yesterday's DR he basically parrotted Foulkes' assertion a day earlier that PBS had limited value, that any developer would face hostility & there were lots of pitfalls in the way of selling PBS. Absolute nonsense as posters on here have affirmed & his job is to represent the creditors not Yams!
4. If Yams really want to have any standing as a community club they should use all donations already received or divert F of H funds etc to repay small local creditors. I know there are legal requirements re favouring of creditors & F of H haven't collected yet but if they use a small % of the imagination they showed in lying to everyone over this whole shameful episode, then they'll find a way to do it.
I'm not holding my breath though.

[poolman]

I Am swithing my direct action from written letters to E Mails from now on i plan to trawl through the list and contact as many of the victims as possible and try to rally them into a direct action group nothing like stirring up bother for the yams.

And yes i am a bit like a dog with a bone once i get a mission to undertake.

Sidney :hnet:
:not worth


Gaun yersel Sidders

Yooda man :thumbsup:

[poolman]

434 "GUESTS" make that 444 :greengrin

Yamyakbackers know where to come for real information :agree:

[21.05.2016]

434 "GUESTS" make that 444 :greengrin

Yamyakbackers know where to come for real information :agree:

Even some of the jambos are getting sick of the drivel over on keekback. Couple of yams I know used to post over there but even they said that some of the stuff posted over there was cringeworthy.

[Bostonhibby]

My mother used to make soup using a Yam bone or was it a ham bone?

Can't be a yam bone, as they have no bones, spineless. plankton..............

[rcarter1]

That £1.9m tax bill is never getting paid regardless and that is poor.

Why are 'football' debts considered more important than the tax debts? Surely this is an easy amendment to make to the rules, all football debts and all tax debts must be paid regardless.

As for the other creditors. I have genuine sympathy for them all, BUT.. do business in a submarine, prepare to get sunk...

Whatever sanctions the SPFL can make today, I hope they go about changing some rules fast, so they can hammer clubs 'legally' for financial irresponsibility.

[Bostonhibby]

Must be a song in that for a week on Sunday

Pay for the poppies, you never paid for the poppies, pay for the poppies.

[CropleyWasGod]

That £1.9m tax bill is never getting paid regardless and that is poor.

Why are 'football' debts considered more important than the tax debts? Surely this is an easy amendment to make to the rules, all football debts and all tax debts must be paid regardless.

As for the other creditors. I have genuine sympathy for them all, BUT.. do business in a submarine, prepare to get sunk...

Whatever sanctions the SPFL can make today, I hope they go about changing some rules fast, so they can hammer clubs 'legally' for financial irresponsibility.

Again, it's the SFA :wink:

[Ozyhibby]

That £1.9m tax bill is never getting paid regardless and that is poor.

Why are 'football' debts considered more important than the tax debts? Surely this is an easy amendment to make to the rules, all football debts and all tax debts must be paid regardless.

As for the other creditors. I have genuine sympathy for them all, BUT.. do business in a submarine, prepare to get sunk...

Whatever sanctions the SPFL can make today, I hope they go about changing some rules fast, so they can hammer clubs 'legally' for financial irresponsibility.

It's the SFA today.
Now that this tax bill has not been and won't be paid, that should mean another charge from the SPFL? The rules say that all tax payments must be up to date?

[Hibby Kay-Yay]

It's the SFA today.
Now that this tax bill has not been and won't be paid, that should mean another charge from the SPFL? The rules say that all tax payments must be up to date?

True but I'm unsure if this meeting covers pre or post admin.

[Hibbyradge]

Even some of the jambos are getting sick of the drivel over on keekback. Couple of yams I know used to post over there but even they said that some of the stuff posted over there was cringeworthy.

:agree:

Even I haven't posted there for ages.

[rcarter1]

Again, it's the SFA :wink:

Ah right, Im still confused about who is what and why they do whatever, but hey ho.:greengrin

[21.05.2016]

any word from the hearing yet?

[jonty]

10762

[YehButNoBut]

Did anyone else notice on the BDO document yesterday (page 13) it had Hearts down as being in existence from 1905, with the date of incorporation given as 29th April 1905.

Yet they still claim to be founded in 1874. :confused:


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BQk8dpgCAAAu1gv.png:large

[Bostonhibby]

I Am swithing my direct action from written letters to E Mails from now on i plan to trawl through the list and contact as many of the victims as possible and try to rally them into a direct action group nothing like stirring up bother for the yams.

And yes i am a bit like a dog with a bone once i get a mission to undertake.

Sidney :hnet:
:not worth

Good for you Sid, swith away, you know it makes sense.:wink:

[Hibby Kay-Yay]

10762

Need to swap their names around!

[cabbageandribs1875]

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=swithing



.net is indeed a place of learning ta :clapper:



(though often also for laughs or to be kinky) kinky sid

[Moulin Yarns]

Did anyone else notice on the BDO document yesterday (page 13) it had Hearts down as being in existence from 1905, with the date of incorporation given as 29th April 1905.

Yet they still claim to be founded in 1874. :confused:


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BQk8dpgCAAAu1gv.png:large

That has just been emailed round the office to all yam sympathisers. History repeats itself 108 years on. There's something to remind them about

[brog]

I just printed whole document for my bedtime reading ( bit of a change there! ). My wife says I'm sad, I replied I'm actually very happy!!
One interesting creditor is Il Ciocco, stiffed for £11,468. This is hotel/resort in Barga, Italy where Yams went for pre season training in 2012. It's full of Scots/Italians, an amazing place & lovely people who will be embarrassed by this ( well Yams won't be ). The really pertinent point is that this debt is a year old, as I'm sure many others on this list are yet Yams were self-sufficient a month or two ago! I really hope SFA/SPFL grow some!

[greenginger]

It's the SFA today.
Now that this tax bill has not been and won't be paid, that should mean another charge from the SPFL? The rules say that all tax payments must be up to date?


Simplest route would be to bring in performance bonds.

Owners/directors of clubs putting up personal guarantees, depending on turn-over of club would go a long way to solving these problems.

The thought of loosing their house/investments would ensure careful thought went into club budgets.

[Dashing Bob S]

have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet

[Ozyhibby]

@PeterAdamSmith: Hearts punished with January embargo by the SFA for going into administration. More on http://t.co/bezkFc6Hxn soon & @STVNews at Six.

[7062]

@PeterAdamSmith: Hearts punished with January embargo by the SFA for going into administration. More on http://t.co/bezkFc6Hxn soon & @STVNews at Six.

Bottled it.

[Gus Fring]

Bottled it.

What more were you expecting? Some were worried they'd get off with a fine or actually have the embargo lifted!

[Coco Bryce]

They'll be dead by then :cb

[Heisenberg]

So they'll be able to sign players in January?

[Ozyhibby]

Bottled it.

I'm happy enough. It won't make a blind bit of difference to their survival and it will upset fans of the old and new Rangers. What's not to like.

[hibs0666]

have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet have they been punished yet

Blink and you'll have missed it.

[Kojock]

So they'll be able to sign players in January?

No the embargo covers the January transfer window the earliest they will be able to sign anyone is next summer.

[Spike Mandela]

@PeterAdamSmith: Hearts punished with January embargo by the SFA for going into administration. More on http://t.co/bezkFc6Hxn soon & @STVNews at Six.

What does that mean? Up to January? Throgh January? What?

[Hibee87]

So they'll be able to sign players in January?

Just not register them till Feb 1st if they do a Sevco :rolleyes:

[hibs0666]

So they'll be able to sign players in January?

Yup.

[Thecat23]

Lets be honest, that's still a sore one. They have a poor squad add injury and suspensions and they are in trouble. They could be well adrift by Jan anyway and even when they can sign players in Jan they may not have the money.

Put it this way hearts days of spending big are gone and they will be toiling to pull in anyone remotely good.

[hibee62]

No the embargo covers the January transfer window the earliest they will be able to sign anyone is next summer.

Basically confirming their relegation... If they survive!

[YehButNoBut]

No fine imposed then

Peter A Smith ‏@PeterAdamSmith 9s (https://twitter.com/PeterAdamSmith/status/362949203992920065) No financial penalty for Hearts, but registration embargo is extended to January 31, 2014. More on http://stv.tv/news (http://t.co/bezkFc6Hxn)