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nickwhibs
11-08-2009, 09:36 AM
Sorry to bring up 'trouble in Bolton' again but I've just been reading a thread on Pie n Bovril and we as Hibs fans seem to be getting absolutely slated for what went on in Bolton. Admittedly most seem to be yams, and many jumping on the bandwagon of simply labelling Hibs fans as hooligans. We all know that 99% of us who went down to Bolton had a great time and did the club proud, but I'm just worried that the trouble the small amount of trouble that did occur seems to have led to Hibs fans now being seen as some kind of thugs. I think a lot of people are quick to judge and label without knowing the facts. What are people's thoughts on this?

hibhib7
11-08-2009, 09:45 AM
Sorry to bring up 'trouble in Bolton' again but I've just been reading a thread on Pie n Bovril and we as Hibs fans seem to be getting absolutely slated for what went on in Bolton. Admittedly most seem to be yams, and many jumping on the bandwagon of simply labelling Hibs fans as hooligans. We all know that 99% of us who went down to Bolton had a great time and did the club proud, but I'm just worried that the trouble the small amount of trouble that did occur seems to have led to Hibs fans now being seen as some kind of thugs. I think a lot of people are quick to judge and label without knowing the facts. What are people's thoughts on this?There were a lot of idiots down there and a section of them spent so much time baiting Bolton fans that I doubt they saw any of the game. They won't read any comments on forums like this as they are not much interested in the football side of the club.

Dashing Bob S
11-08-2009, 09:46 AM
Sorry to bring up 'trouble in Bolton' again but I've just been reading a thread on Pie n Bovril and we as Hibs fans seem to be getting absolutely slated for what went on in Bolton. Admittedly most seem to be yams, and many jumping on the bandwagon of simply labelling Hibs fans as hooligans. We all know that 99% of us who went down to Bolton had a great time and did the club proud, but I'm just worried that the trouble the small amount of trouble that did occur seems to have led to Hibs fans now being seen as some kind of thugs. I think a lot of people are quick to judge and label without knowing the facts. What are people's thoughts on this?

To be fair, I think it was considerably more than 1% of fans who caused trouble/behaved badly. However, most people are pretty clued-up about this and while it gives Yams with nothing better to do the opportunity for points scoring, people generally have some perspective on this.

Following on from Rangers in Manchester last year, one has to wonder whether its a good idea to have Scottish clubs with a persistent hooligan element playing 'friendlies' in England.

Owain_1987
11-08-2009, 09:56 AM
To be honest I could not care what other fans think. If other fans are scared of us good on them. Am a Hibs and Cardiff fan use to other teams not liking us! CCS and Soul Crew haha

nickwhibs
11-08-2009, 10:08 AM
I'm not on here to have a go at anyone who was involved in any trouble but I just find it annoying when other people generalise about our club's fans as whole

Iain G
11-08-2009, 10:08 AM
To be honest I could not care what other fans think. If other fans are scared of us good on them. Am a Hibs and Cardiff fan use to other teams not liking us! CCS and Soul Crew haha

Grow Up :grr:

Antifa Hibs
11-08-2009, 10:12 AM
It just shows you how boring and tame football in this country has become when the things like what happened on Saturday are deemed as 'major voilence'. The "trouble" I witnessed wasn't any worse than what i've witnessed at other events when there's been a large group of men, having a bevvy. I've seen worse at gigs, T In The Park, up town on a Saturday night etc. If it wasn't for the internet the so-called "voilence" we all "witnessed" would've been a non-event, but the internet messageboards give people a platform to spout absulute p!sh and exaggarate, the media and others who havn't a clue pick up on this and make it out to be worse than it is, we then post links of these exaggarated articles and threads back on the forums. Mental.

Those that are 'disgusted' by the things that allegedly happened on Saturday aren't half excited by it all. A thread congratulating the Hibs support, 30 replies. A thread on the 'voilence', last time I looked over 220 replies.

Storm in a tea cup....

J-C
11-08-2009, 10:13 AM
Grow Up :grr:


Well said, we get invited down to Bolton for a testamonial game and a few with too much bevvy in them think it's a good idea to have a wee go at their supporters. Come on now, we are better than that surely :confused:

nickwhibs
11-08-2009, 10:15 AM
It just shows you how boring and tame football in this country has become when the things like what happened on Saturday are deemed as 'major voilence'. The "trouble" I witnessed wasn't any worse than what i've witnessed at other events when there's been a large group of men, having a bevvy. I've seen worse at gigs, T In The Park, up town on a Saturday night etc. If it wasn't for the internet the so-called "voilence" we all "witnessed" would've been a non-event, but the internet messageboards give people a platform to spout absulute p!sh and exaggarate, the media and others who havn't a clue pick up on this and make it out to be worse than it is, we then post links of these exaggarated articles and threads back on the forums. Mental.

Those that are 'disgusted' by the things that allegedly happened on Saturday aren't half excited by it all. A thread congratulating the Hibs support, 30 replies. A thread on the 'voilence', last time I looked over 220 replies.

Storm in a tea cup....

My point exactly. That is why our club is getting a bad name because of overreactions and exaggeration.

marinello59
11-08-2009, 10:15 AM
To be honest I could not care what other fans think. If other fans are scared of us good on them. Am a Hibs and Cardiff fan use to other teams not liking us! CCS and Soul Crew haha
:bitchy:
Hope you are used to Hibs fans not liking you either.

Antifa Hibs
11-08-2009, 10:18 AM
And if a few internet geeks on pie and bovril have tarnished our 'reputation' then good, I honestly couldn't give a flying f... as they are nothing to me and are nothing to their own fellow fans who actually goto matches.

Any match going Jambo, Sheepy, Motherwell fan etc will know what the score is with Hibs, that our fans are as good as they come but can on occassion have a nutty element, just like we know the same with them, despite having a hooligan element or a rangers-wannabe element, are generally fine.

Si_17
11-08-2009, 10:18 AM
To be honest I could not care what other fans think. If other fans are scared of us good on them. Am a Hibs and Cardiff fan use to other teams not liking us! CCS and Soul Crew haha

Pleb.

Billychaotic182
11-08-2009, 10:22 AM
To be honest I could not care what other fans think. If other fans are scared of us good on them. Am a Hibs and Cardiff fan use to other teams not liking us! CCS and Soul Crew haha

:blah::blah::blah:

LancashireHibby
11-08-2009, 10:22 AM
And if a few internet geeks on pie and bovril have tarnished our 'reputation' then good, I honestly couldn't give a flying f... as they are nothing to me and are nothing to their own fellow fans who actually goto matches.

Any match going Jambo, Sheepy, Motherwell fan etc will know what the score is with Hibs, that our fans are as good as they come but can on occassion have a nutty element, just like we know the same with them, despite having a hooligan element or a rangers-wannabe element, are generally fine.

Let's just hope the police agree. I'm not exactly confident that I'll have the chance to see Hibs on my doorstep for a long while now after Saturday's events. Hope I'm wrong.

--------
11-08-2009, 10:25 AM
Well said, we get invited down to Bolton for a testamonial game and a few with too much bevvy in them think it's a good idea to have a wee go at their supporters. Come on now, we are better than that surely :confused:


He says he's a 'Hibs and Cardiff fan use to other teams not liking us' - location 'Lockerbie'?

That, and "CCS and Soul Crew haha" just about says it all, really.

The unfortunate fact is that he ISN'T better than that. That's exactly the level at which he operates - two levels below pond-life.

stubru59
11-08-2009, 10:26 AM
You can debate this subject from now until doomsday and you would be no nearer to getting an answer.

I would imagine that whatever affiliations the hooligan elements claim to have, theirs is a mind-set completely divorced from any sporting spectacle which may be on show.

In another time in another place they would probably have been the spectacle themselves.

The Romans used often to put them in a ring with some mean and God forbidden opponent - a couple of lions for example - and let them get on with it.

Civilisation as it is has yet to devise an outlet of this type. Consequently, we are forced to have them attend the odd game of football where they wreak havoc on all and sundry.

Might it not be a good idea to ship them over to Afghanistan where with some light weapons and no body armour they could sort out that mess.

nickwhibs
11-08-2009, 10:26 AM
And if a few internet geeks on pie and bovril have tarnished our 'reputation' then good, I honestly couldn't give a flying f... as they are nothing to me and are nothing to their own fellow fans who actually goto matches.

Any match going Jambo, Sheepy, Motherwell fan etc will know what the score is with Hibs, that our fans are as good as they come but can on occassion have a nutty element, just like we know the same with them, despite having a hooligan element or a rangers-wannabe element, are generally fine.

That was just an example. Ok maybe fans in Scotland know the score but do you think Hibs are going to be invited back for a friendly in England any time soon? I'm not saying there would be a problem, but just what has been built up into being a big thing may mean other clubs across the UK view us an 'unattractive' club.

col02
11-08-2009, 10:27 AM
Does anyone really believe that Hibs have a reputation to tarnish in the first place? Most fans of other teams that i know regard our support as having a ****bag element to it and i am no different in that opinion. Same applies to most other teams in Scotland with regards to them having an element of support that is not your average punter on the street purely there for to watch football.

poolman
11-08-2009, 10:30 AM
To be honest I could not care what other fans think. If other fans are scared of us good on them. Am a Hibs and Cardiff fan use to other teams not liking us! CCS and Soul Crew haha



Dearie me

Antifa Hibs
11-08-2009, 10:31 AM
Let's just hope the police agree. I'm not exactly confident that I'll have the chance to see Hibs on my doorstep for a long while now after Saturday's events. Hope I'm wrong.

We've hardly played any big clubs in England in the last 15 or so years, so if we don't go back down again I don't think it'll be anything to do with this.

When Scottish play English clubs and vice versa there's always potential for "trouble", or in my vew boisterous behaviour. Long drinking times, visiting places you've never been before, then off course the scotland v england thing. Not strictly just for big clubs aswell, even Wigan and St Mirren were having a pop at each other on Saturday!

Bishop Hibee
11-08-2009, 10:35 AM
It just shows you how boring and tame football in this country has become when the things like what happened on Saturday are deemed as 'major voilence'. The "trouble" I witnessed wasn't any worse than what i've witnessed at other events when there's been a large group of men, having a bevvy. I've seen worse at gigs, T In The Park, up town on a Saturday night etc. If it wasn't for the internet the so-called "voilence" we all "witnessed" would've been a non-event, but the internet messageboards give people a platform to spout absulute p!sh and exaggarate, the media and others who havn't a clue pick up on this and make it out to be worse than it is, we then post links of these exaggarated articles and threads back on the forums. Mental.

Those that are 'disgusted' by the things that allegedly happened on Saturday aren't half excited by it all. A thread congratulating the Hibs support, 30 replies. A thread on the 'voilence', last time I looked over 220 replies.

Storm in a tea cup....

Good post. Trouble inside and outside the Calvin Harris gig last night but no one is suggesting gigs are stopped as far as I know.

I'm not an apologist for hooligans but it's merely a manifestation of how the rest of society is, mostly fine, some bad.

Antifa Hibs
11-08-2009, 10:36 AM
That was just an example. Ok maybe fans in Scotland know the score but do you think Hibs are going to be invited back for a friendly in England any time soon? I'm not saying there would be a problem, but just what has been built up into being a big thing may mean other clubs across the UK view us an 'unattractive' club.

Couldn't tell you..... I'd say probably yes, 2500 paying customers and a few bodies went over the score.... to me, no big deal.

People seem to just think its a Hibs thing. Sunderland caused bother at Celtic Park, Man City had a pop at the Tims on Saturday, as above Wigan and St Mirren were at it, the huns and pompey were upto mischief, all just this pre-season. In previous years Hearts were at it down at Preston and Hull, Aberdeen at Bradford, Leeds up here etc etc.

gogs_t
11-08-2009, 10:38 AM
To be honest I could not care what other fans think. If other fans are scared of us good on them. Am a Hibs and Cardiff fan use to other teams not liking us! CCS and Soul Crew haha

That comment shouldn't even be deserving of a reply but I'm afraid I couldn't resist.

It's comments like that which highlight there will always be a problem when a guy who has been posting on here for quite a while comes out with guff like that :confused: pretty much glorifying the whole casual element. If we ever got to the stage when the majority had the same opinion, that's the day I'd walk away from football.

Thankfully that day will never come.

nickwhibs
11-08-2009, 10:43 AM
We've hardly played any big clubs in England in the last 15 or so years, so if we don't go back down again I don't think it'll be anything to do with this.

When Scottish play English clubs and vice versa there's always potential for "trouble", or in my vew boisterous behaviour. Long drinking times, visiting places you've never been before, then off course the scotland v england thing. Not strictly just for big clubs aswell, even Wigan and St Mirren were having a pop at each other on Saturday!

I agree with what you are saying. But it would still be nice to have friendlies against English opposition in the future as it was a great trip to Bolton. I just fear this episode, which has indeed been built up, may at least contribute to Hibs being less likely to be given friendlies against English clubs in the future.

jacomo
11-08-2009, 10:43 AM
Storm in a tea cup....

I wasn't in Bolton so don't have any first hand info, but I am pretty upset at the news if true.

If a few consenting adults want to have a rammy, then let them get on with it.

But if Hibs fans are rampaging through a retail park threatening and frightening families, then I find that disgusting behaviour, to be honest.

Or is scaring bairns fair game?

Part/Time Supporter
11-08-2009, 10:44 AM
It just shows you how boring and tame football in this country has become when the things like what happened on Saturday are deemed as 'major voilence'. The "trouble" I witnessed wasn't any worse than what i've witnessed at other events when there's been a large group of men, having a bevvy. I've seen worse at gigs, T In The Park, up town on a Saturday night etc. If it wasn't for the internet the so-called "voilence" we all "witnessed" would've been a non-event, but the internet messageboards give people a platform to spout absulute p!sh and exaggarate, the media and others who havn't a clue pick up on this and make it out to be worse than it is, we then post links of these exaggarated articles and threads back on the forums. Mental.

Those that are 'disgusted' by the things that allegedly happened on Saturday aren't half excited by it all. A thread congratulating the Hibs support, 30 replies. A thread on the 'voilence', last time I looked over 220 replies.

Storm in a tea cup....

If it was such a big deal, surely it would have been picked up by the press in Scotland? The only paper I have seen it in (so far) is the local Bolton paper.

jacomo
11-08-2009, 10:48 AM
If it was such a big deal, surely it would have been picked up by the press in Scotland? The only paper I have seen it in (so far) is the local Bolton paper.

Whether it got picked up by the national press or not isn't the issue.

The issue is, are we defending people who like to threaten innocent bystanders?

Dashing Bob S
11-08-2009, 10:49 AM
To be honest, I don't think our reputation has been as much tarnished as sustained. We have this conceit that as a support we're universally loved for our wit and good humour. The truth is that, particularly in England, we're perceived as quite a thuggish club, and perhaps not undeservedly.

Danderhall Hibs
11-08-2009, 10:51 AM
To be honest, I don't think our reputation has been as much tarnished as sustained. We have this conceit that as a support we're universally loved for our wit and good humour. The truth is that, particularly in England, we're perceived as quite a thuggish club, and perhaps not undeservedly.

I was just about to ask "what reputation?"

--------
11-08-2009, 10:52 AM
There were a lot of idiots down there and a section of them spent so much time baiting Bolton fans that I doubt they saw any of the game. They won't read any comments on forums like this as they are not much interested in the football side of the club.

:agree:

And here was me thinking that the point of going to a football match was to watch the football. Silly me!

"Baiting Bolton fans" (correct me if I'm wrong) means "trying to provoke Bolton fans to violence". That's what those guys were about - not the football.

Over the years I've been in a few scary places following Hibs. One of the better aspects of watching football nowadays is that the scary atmosphere has largely disappeared, thanks to seated stadia and better stewarding and policing.

No one should have to go to a sporting event wondering if they're going to be injured, abused, or put into a state of alarm by mindless thugs. No one should have to lift the phone at 7.00pm on a Saturday evening to be told that their son/husband/father is in hospital because there was 'trouble' at the game he went to see that afternoon.

I don't know exactly what happened at Bolton; from what I'm reading I suspect I've been in a lot worse situations over the years at OF games and derbies and afterwards.

But at a charity match the organisers and the police will want to keep costs to a minimum - to benefit the charity - and it appears that there were those who thought it would be a good idea to take advantage of more relaxed security to see if they could cause trouble. It's not what actually happens - it's what MIGHT happen, surely.

Aldo
11-08-2009, 10:53 AM
Sorry but blown well out of proportion. We are all aware of the Hooligan element that follows the club....every team has them. I would say though that it is a bit POT 'n' KETTLE when it comes to english teams complaining about Hibs and Hooligans.

As for Pie and Boviril i personally dont give a flying hoot what they think. To take 2500 fans to Bolton was excellent IMHO. When the bevvy and football is involved and is proven in the past....will cause some sort o bother.

They are looking for a reaction on that website...dont give them one.

Antifa Hibs
11-08-2009, 10:56 AM
Whether it got picked up by the national press or not isn't the issue.

The issue is, are we defending people who like to threaten innocent bystanders?

Don't think anyone is defending anyone as it never happened.

Or are the innocent by standers the Bolton fans who were giving as good as they got chanting 'Ingurland Ingurland Ingurland' while shouting jock barstewards :confused:

Innocent people in both supports might have got caught up in the over-heated banter but I very much doubt Hibs fans went out their way to threaten innocent bystanders while stealing their kids's sweets after throwing their puppy in the river.

Greenway
11-08-2009, 11:00 AM
It's very sad when "Lowlife ****" spoil the reputation of decent people, regardless of the team they support. We are probably very lucky that we only have tiny minority of these mentally challenged individuals. I like to think it's because we're a "family club" and hold ourselves to a higher standard.

That might just be wishful thinking on my part, but I do feel proud of my club and it's connection to the local community. I'm sure that the people of Bolton understand that these people are not representative of us and see similar problems in their community.

jacomo
11-08-2009, 11:06 AM
Don't think anyone is defending anyone as it never happened.

Or are the innocent by standers the Bolton fans who were giving as good as they got chanting 'Ingurland Ingurland Ingurland' while shouting jock barstewards :confused:

Innocent people in both supports might have got caught up in the over-heated banter but I very much doubt Hibs fans went out their way to threaten innocent bystanders while stealing their kids's sweets after throwing their puppy in the river.

Don't be smart... in my post above, I specifically alluded to the reports of Hibs fans making trouble in the retail park and scaring families who hadn't been at the football, not fighting with any Bolton fans who fancied a ruck.

If this didn't happen then fine, but more than one poster on here has referred to it.

J-C
11-08-2009, 11:22 AM
:agree:

And here was me thinking that the point of going to a football match was to watch the football. Silly me!

"Baiting Bolton fans" (correct me if I'm wrong) means "trying to provoke Bolton fans to violence". That's what those guys were about - not the football.

Over the years I've been in a few scary places following Hibs. One of the better aspects of watching football nowadays is that the scary atmosphere has largely disappeared, thanks to seated stadia and better stewarding and policing.

No one should have to go to a sporting event wondering if they're going to be injured, abused, or put into a state of alarm by mindless thugs. No one should have to lift the phone at 7.00pm on a Saturday evening to be told that their son/husband/father is in hospital because there was 'trouble' at the game he went to see that afternoon.

I don't know exactly what happened at Bolton; from what I'm reading I suspect I've been in a lot worse situations over the years at OF games and derbies and afterwards.

But at a charity match the organisers and the police will want to keep costs to a minimum - to benefit the charity - and it appears that there were those who thought it would be a good idea to take advantage of more relaxed security to see if they could cause trouble. It's not what actually happens - it's what MIGHT happen, surely.

:top marks

The fact that we were invited to take part in a Bolton players testamonial, probably due to the fact that Mixu was a mate of his, should've been seen as a good day out for all football fans to enjoy the occasion and celebrate the career of a good profession player.

Now whether there was any baiting by either supporter is neither here nor there, it's the low life individuals who deem it right to make an erse of themselves in the city centre, either before or after the game. This in itself has sod all to do with football and supporting your team, it's all to do with too much bevvy and mentalities below the age of 8.

What would've been nice to hear was that no trouble occured, everyone was on their best behaviour and Bolton and other teams down south would welcome us back with open arms. Now because of a tiny minority, invites pre season may be very scarce and we'll all be looking forward to playing Brechin, Alloa etc in pre season games.

GordonR
11-08-2009, 11:35 AM
Following on from Rangers in Manchester last year, one has to wonder whether its a good idea to have Scottish clubs with a persistent hooligan element playing 'friendlies' in England.

:fishin::greengrin

scott7_0(Prague)
11-08-2009, 11:38 AM
To be honest I could not care what other fans think. If other fans are scared of us good on them. Am a Hibs and Cardiff fan use to other teams not liking us! CCS and Soul Crew haha

When do the schools go back these days?

Ell_Chrisso
11-08-2009, 11:38 AM
To be honest, i think this is all just getting blown well out of proportion..
i dont want to start backing the folk who were involved in the incident at the retail park, but the more talk of it, the more publicised its getting.
i also believe, being at the game, some of the bolton fans are getting away with the flack.. i mean, it was there support that started the whole english chants etc, so technically, they were the ones that started making things heated...
untill then, all i heard was complete hibs songs, from our end...

i also wonder to myself, these things are normally organised, well away from the ground, not in public view..

so why the hibs fans are also getting the blame for starting things, im not sure, cos i heard it was the bolton fans that provoked them to come forward in the retial park itself..

all in all, whats done is done .. people got hurt, people got scared, but like others have said, it happens in day to day life, not just at football... but in bars/clubs/events everywhere...

lets all look forward to saturday and support our team, the RIGHT WAY!

:hnet::thumbsup:

Wembley67
11-08-2009, 11:49 AM
To be honest, I don't think our reputation has been as much tarnished as sustained. We have this conceit that as a support we're universally loved for our wit and good humour. The truth is that, particularly in England, we're perceived as quite a thuggish club, and perhaps not undeservedly.


:top marks

Unfortunately due to the glory days (:rolleyes:) of Millwall and such, as DBS says Hibs are seen in England as a thuggish team by many of the older crowd down there.

Obviously we have been trying to shed that image but now it's hanging over us once again, what are the chances of anymore pre-season friendlies down south :bye:

hibbie02
11-08-2009, 12:04 PM
Pleb.

Jeez that put him in his place!
:greengrin

Leith Green
11-08-2009, 12:06 PM
This is some of the most over the top bull ***** I have ever seen on this forum, and that says something..

Quite a lot of folk on here branding fans who took the time, effort and money to follow the club to a place which is basically a **** hole of a town.. I was there when it kicked off after the game, I aint a casual but I aint having some little twat giving it the big one in front of me and then gonna give him a round of applause.. I reckon quite a lot of Hibs fans are similar in this aspect. And the only reason innocent fans were anywhere near this is down to the fact that little Bolton twats who were giving it the big one shat it and dissapeared amongst the crowd when it became apparent trouble was kicking off..

Seems to be the Hibs casuals fault according to most on here, lot of bull *****, there were old men as well as young men, replica shirts as well as casually dressed guys from both sides dishing out the insults, and involved in what were minor scuffles, and seem to have been jumped upon by the local Bolton paper, which subsequently has Hibs to blame (surprise surprise)..

Only serious trouble came well away from the ground and the fact it hasn't really cropped up says it all, the folk who went to fight did so well away from innocent fans..

Where were all you people who are in such a state of shock in the 80s if you think this was anything major?

hibbie02
11-08-2009, 12:11 PM
To be honest I could not care what other fans think. If other fans are scared of us good on them. Am a Hibs and Cardiff fan use to other teams not liking us! CCS and Soul Crew haha

What a Bawbag!

Having had the dubious pleasure of travelling on public transport in London with Cardiff Fans I would hope to god, we were never put in the same category as them. Total ****, and I am not talking about small minorities. Even those not coming or going to football matches are abused, spat at, booted and jostled, by fat, beerswilling, obnoxious, shaven headed thugs, thinking they are the Mutts.

Fair enough we have a fair number of nutters too, often happy to fight other Hibbies in the ground (CIS Semi and Final 07, for example.) The last think we need to do is give them any more oxygen for their cause.

Wee laddies pretending to be CCS........ Get a life.:grr:

wazoo1875
11-08-2009, 12:21 PM
what are the chances of anymore pre-season friendlies down south :bye:
I've read this statement time and again on this thread , why wouldn't we be invited back ? If we can take 3,000 fans to a pre season game and there is hassle involving only a few dozen , the pros far outweigh the cons . Why do Rangers and Celtic continuously get asked to play down south , there was only 9,000 people at Fratton Park to watch the Rangers v Pompey game at the weekend and i would bet there would be more aggro and loutish behaviour in and around that game . I feel confident that we will be invited back down south to play again as i feel 95% of the fans did the club proud . I wasn't at the game on saturday but i watched it on the telly and the Hibs fans there made me feel proud of my club . You could see something was going to happen in that corner though , there was little segregation and the supporters were close together , add in the Scotland v England thing and a few bevvies and a blind man galloping by on a horse could tell that there was going to be hassle . Poorly segregated and poorly stewarded/policed IMO .

--------
11-08-2009, 12:27 PM
:top marks

The fact that we were invited to take part in a Bolton players testamonial, probably due to the fact that Mixu was a mate of his, should've been seen as a good day out for all football fans to enjoy the occasion and celebrate the career of a good profession player.

Now whether there was any baiting by either supporter is neither here nor there, it's the low life individuals who deem it right to make an erse of themselves in the city centre, either before or after the game. This in itself has sod all to do with football and supporting your team, it's all to do with too much bevvy and mentalities below the age of 8.

What would've been nice to hear was that no trouble occured, everyone was on their best behaviour and Bolton and other teams down south would welcome us back with open arms. Now because of a tiny minority, invites pre season may be very scarce and we'll all be looking forward to playing Brechin, Alloa etc in pre season games.


Or back to entertaining Leeds, Cardiff and Millwall at ER.

Wonder whose side Owain would be on if we played Cardiff?

.... probably end up punching his owain lights out. :devil:

Wembley67
11-08-2009, 12:30 PM
I've read this statement time and again on this thread , why wouldn't we be invited back ? If we can take 3,000 fans to a pre season game and there is hassle involving only a few dozen , the pros far outweigh the cons . Why do Rangers and Celtic continuously get asked to play down south , there was only 9,000 people at Fratton Park to watch the Rangers v Pompey game at the weekend and i would bet there would be more aggro and loutish behaviour in and around that game . I feel confident that we will be invited back down south to play again as i feel 95% of the fans did the club proud . I wasn't at the game on saturday but i watched it on the telly and the Hibs fans there made me feel proud of my club . You could see something was going to happen in that corner though , there was little segregation and the supporters were close together , add in the Scotland v England thing and a few bevvies and a blind man galloping by on a horse could tell that there was going to be hassle . Poorly segregated and poorly stewarded/policed IMO .

Maybe the police would intervene? Maybe the home team couldn't be arsed stumping up for the extra policing, I really don't know but all I'm saying is it wouldn't surprise me.

I've not read all the other threads in details so I didn't know this had been mentioned many times already.

gogs_t
11-08-2009, 12:32 PM
This is some of the most over the top bull ***** I have ever seen on this forum, and that says something..

Quite a lot of folk on here branding fans who took the time, effort and money to follow the club to a place which is basically a **** hole of a town.. I was there when it kicked off after the game, I aint a casual but I aint having some little twat giving it the big one in front of me and then gonna give him a round of applause.. I reckon quite a lot of Hibs fans are similar in this aspect. And the only reason innocent fans were anywhere near this is down to the fact that little Bolton twats who were giving it the big one shat it and dissapeared amongst the crowd when it became apparent trouble was kicking off..

Seems to be the Hibs casuals fault according to most on here, lot of bull *****, there were old men as well as young men, replica shirts as well as casually dressed guys from both sides dishing out the insults, and involved in what were minor scuffles, and seem to have been jumped upon by the local Bolton paper, which subsequently has Hibs to blame (surprise surprise)..

Only serious trouble came well away from the ground and the fact it hasn't really cropped up says it all, the folk who went to fight did so well away from innocent fans..

Where were all you people who are in such a state of shock in the 80s if you think this was anything major?

LG - the hope is that we've moved on from those days.

I've sat in a bus all the way back along the M8 with hardly any windows left.

I've stood at the school end pre-PBS when we had that end but the Hearts supporters had to walk through to get to the shed - not for the faint hearted.

I've been kicked and punched at Cappielow and Tannadice by grown men when I was 13 back in the mid 70's - and I was only going for a pie! :confused:

I'm not naive enough that I don't expect things to kick off occasionally, especially with a certain amount of provocation, but if I thought this was ever going to be the norm again I wouldn't be taking my 10 year old along nowadays.

Owain_1987
11-08-2009, 12:37 PM
Listen I was not trying pretend be CCS or what ever just saying not worried what other fans think of us. Its anoying but dont think people are scared of Hibs fans. Also what did happen at Bolton? From looking at people photos and from what some people have told me it seems be Bolton fans also.

--------
11-08-2009, 12:38 PM
LG - the hope is that we've moved on from those days.

I've sat in a bus all the way back along the M8 with hardly any windows left.

I've stood at the school end pre-PBS when we had that end but the Hearts supporters had to walk through to get to the shed - not for the faint hearted.

I've been kicked and punched at Cappielow and Tannadice by grown men when I was 13 back in the mid 70's - and I was only going for a pie! :confused:

I'm not naive enough that I don't expect things to kick off occasionally, especially with a certain amount of provocation, but if I thought this was ever going to be the norm again I wouldn't be taking my 10 year old along nowadays.


:agree: Quite.

H1bs6H3arts2 FC
11-08-2009, 12:47 PM
This is some of the most over the top bull ***** I have ever seen on this forum, and that says something..

Quite a lot of folk on here branding fans who took the time, effort and money to follow the club to a place which is basically a **** hole of a town.. I was there when it kicked off after the game, I aint a casual but I aint having some little twat giving it the big one in front of me and then gonna give him a round of applause.. I reckon quite a lot of Hibs fans are similar in this aspect. And the only reason innocent fans were anywhere near this is down to the fact that little Bolton twats who were giving it the big one shat it and dissapeared amongst the crowd when it became apparent trouble was kicking off..

Seems to be the Hibs casuals fault according to most on here, lot of bull *****, there were old men as well as young men, replica shirts as well as casually dressed guys from both sides dishing out the insults, and involved in what were minor scuffles, and seem to have been jumped upon by the local Bolton paper, which subsequently has Hibs to blame (surprise surprise)..

Only serious trouble came well away from the ground and the fact it hasn't really cropped up says it all, the folk who went to fight did so well away from innocent fans..

Where were all you people who are in such a state of shock in the 80s if you think this was anything major?

:top marks- you can see worse trouble in any town in the lothians on a saturday night - the bolton fans were muppets !!! :agree:

The_Todd
11-08-2009, 01:02 PM
What a Bawbag!

Having had the dubious pleasure of travelling on public transport in London with Cardiff Fans I would hope to god, we were never put in the same category as them. Total ****, and I am not talking about small minorities. Even those not coming or going to football matches are abused, spat at, booted and jostled, by fat, beerswilling, obnoxious, shaven headed thugs, thinking they are the Mutts.

Fair enough we have a fair number of nutters too, often happy to fight other Hibbies in the ground (CIS Semi and Final 07, for example.) The last think we need to do is give them any more oxygen for their cause.

Wee laddies pretending to be CCS........ Get a life.:grr:

You might not believe it but they really are in the minority of Cardiff fans.

Every team has them, without fail.

Jack
11-08-2009, 01:13 PM
I wasn’t there but I think I’ve read every word of the reports and posts on the subject.

One thing that has struck me was where our fans were allocated their seating.

Why is it that the segregation at the Rebock puts the away fans right next to what a Bolton fan has described as there worst element? A part of the ground that is ‘their own’ that has its own little pet name, although the name escapes me at the moment. No surprise then that our intellectually challenged equivalent had the time of their lives.

Why not have the away support away from them, that part of the ground? It wouldn’t matter about segregation before / after the game because apparently its something they don’t do.

Still there's no excuse.

While Hibs can go to Europe and a few years later can still be contributing to help those less fortunate than ourselves; while Hibs can have neutrals and fans of other clubs congratulating us after a fantastic uber atmosphere cup final; while Hibs continue to do work in the community, we can hold our heads high.

Meanwhile those who tried to drag us down to their level only let themselves down.

wazoo1875
11-08-2009, 01:29 PM
Maybe the police would intervene? Maybe the home team couldn't be arsed stumping up for the extra policing, I really don't know but all I'm saying is it wouldn't surprise me.

I've not read all the other threads in details so I didn't know this had been mentioned many times already.
Sorry mate , i hope you don't think that i was having a dig at you , it has just been repeated rather a lot , FWIW the folk causing aggro with each other will no doubt be the ones who would happily do it every week if they could get away with it . From what a lot of people are saying the police and stewards were very freindly and in good spirits with the vast majority . They are also not daft and will know who the guys causing bother are , unless it was just drunken , loutish behaviour on the spur of the moment . I also don't believe we have a reputation as being this great club that a few folk seem to think we have . We never play any big teams other than at ER due to a lack of involvement in europe and the english or the majority of them who actually give a toss about us , will only really remember Hibs fans as guys who probably smashed there towns and pubs up in the 80's . We all know that our club has moved on greatly since then and that the club has taken steps to move us on from those days . This kind of stuff has a place in the history , it's just that some a***holes still live in the past . GGTTH

wazoo1875
11-08-2009, 01:37 PM
Still there's no excuse.

While Hibs can go to Europe and a few years later can still be contributing to help those less fortunate than ourselves; while Hibs can have neutrals and fans of other clubs congratulating us after a fantastic uber atmosphere cup final; while Hibs continue to do work in the community, we can hold our heads high.

Meanwhile those who tried to drag us down to their level only let themselves down.
:top marks This is what i am getting at Jack , i would rather we celebrated the fact that almost all of our fans who went down there , had a great time and came back up the road to us all how well they got on with the locals , police and barstaff etc

BravestHibs
11-08-2009, 01:48 PM
It seems that alot of people on this board are hellbent on a life entirely free of danger/excitement. Whatever happened in Bolton and from what I can tell, although I wasn't there, seems to be nothing more than one window which wasn't even completely smashed and a few fat dudes shouting at each other.

It does my head in the amount of people who are so eager to highlight their intellectual/moral superiority. "Disgusting!!", "Brain Dead Morons", "Animals" it honestly makes me cringe, it really does. It seems to me that there is a huge amount of pleasure derived by disapproving, or letting everyone know how disgusted they are.

Look, I don't know who you are trying to impress with all this holier than thou posturing but if you really are so appalled by what happened why not put your soft little hands up and tell the teacher,alternatively, if you're not willing to go the whole hog and grass anyone up, please stop whining. Because to me it's not the fact that people may or may not have been fighting that's embarrassing, it's certain posters on here that seem to be snivelling for approval from some kind omnipetent authority figure.

Pathetic.

flash
11-08-2009, 01:56 PM
It seems that alot of people on this board are hellbent on a life entirely free of danger/excitement. Whatever happened in Bolton and from what I can tell, although I wasn't there, seems to be nothing more than one window which wasn't even completely smashed and a few fat dudes shouting at each other.

It does my head in the amount of people who are so eager to highlight their intellectual/moral superiority. "Disgusting!!", "Brain Dead Morons", "Animals" it honestly makes me cringe, it really does. It seems to me that there is a huge amount of pleasure derived by disapproving, or letting everyone know how disgusted they are.

Look, I don't know who you are trying to impress with all this holier than thou posturing but if you really are so appalled by what happened why not put your soft little hands up and tell the teacher,alternatively, if you're not willing to go the whole hog and grass anyone up, please stop whining. Because to me it's not the fact that people may or may not have been fighting that's embarrassing, it's certain posters on here that seem to be snivelling for approval from some kind omnipetent authority figure.

Pathetic.

Good post. You truly are the "bravest Hibs."

--------
11-08-2009, 02:02 PM
It seems that alot of people on this board are hellbent on a life entirely free of danger/excitement. Whatever happened in Bolton and from what I can tell, although I wasn't there, seems to be nothing more than one window which wasn't even completely smashed and a few fat dudes shouting at each other.

It does my head in the amount of people who are so eager to highlight their intellectual/moral superiority. "Disgusting!!", "Brain Dead Morons", "Animals" it honestly makes me cringe, it really does. It seems to me that there is a huge amount of pleasure derived by disapproving, or letting everyone know how disgusted they are.

Look, I don't know who you are trying to impress with all this holier than thou posturing but if you really are so appalled by what happened why not put your soft little hands up and tell the teacher,alternatively, if you're not willing to go the whole hog and grass anyone up, please stop whining. Because to me it's not the fact that people may or may not have been fighting that's embarrassing, it's certain posters on here that seem to be snivelling for approval from some kind omnipetent authority figure.

Pathetic.


When is a window 'incompletely' smashed? Was only one part of it broken? Just the bit with the cracks in it? :confused:

If you want a life of danger and excitement - go play on the bypass at rush hour. But sign an insurance waiver first, so that the poor sod who creams you doesn't have to lose any sleep over you.

Sporting events are entertainment events, and people have the right to go there without morons in whatever replica shirts making the atmosphere unpleasant or causing them fear an alarm. That includes women and children, by the way.

If 'brain-dead moron' is an expression that offends you, don't post like one.

Your last word perfectly sums up your attitude.

CABBAGE & RIBS
11-08-2009, 02:02 PM
It seems that alot of people on this board are hellbent on a life entirely free of danger/excitement. Whatever happened in Bolton and from what I can tell, although I wasn't there, seems to be nothing more than one window which wasn't even completely smashed and a few fat dudes shouting at each other.

It does my head in the amount of people who are so eager to highlight their intellectual/moral superiority. "Disgusting!!", "Brain Dead Morons", "Animals" it honestly makes me cringe, it really does. It seems to me that there is a huge amount of pleasure derived by disapproving, or letting everyone know how disgusted they are.

Look, I don't know who you are trying to impress with all this holier than thou posturing but if you really are so appalled by what happened why not put your soft little hands up and tell the teacher,alternatively, if you're not willing to go the whole hog and grass anyone up, please stop whining. Because to me it's not the fact that people may or may not have been fighting that's embarrassing, it's certain posters on here that seem to be snivelling for approval from some kind omnipetent authority figure.

Pathetic.


:top marks Agree with every point.

I was accused of being a casual one minute then a hearts fan the next on the "drink at football" thread by a couple of do gooders.

What reputation do hibs fans actually have.

Leith Green
11-08-2009, 02:18 PM
:top marks Agree with every point.

I was accused of being a casual one minute then a hearts fan the next on the "drink at football" thread by a couple of do gooders.

What reputation do hibs fans actually have.




Agree with this!

To me there is an element of folk on here who think they are something special good at shouting down other people and good at jumping on a band wagon without knowing facts etc..

Lost count of the times I have seen genuine Hibs fans accused of being yams on this board for having the audacity to disagree with regular posters points of views..

Now it's anybody who is prepared to get into a bit of a scrape rather than back down is a disgrace to club , country etc etc .. blah blah blah ...

I have been reading through a lot of these peoples take on Saturdays "trouble" and can only conclude that a lot of them werent present and have been reading a lot of the rubbish written on other forums, bolton news etc etc..

BravestHibs
11-08-2009, 02:22 PM
When is a window 'incompletely' smashed? Was only one part of it broken? Just the bit with the cracks in it? :confused:

If you want a life of danger and excitement - go play on the bypass at rush hour. But sign an insurance waiver first, so that the poor sod who creams you doesn't have to lose any sleep over you.

Sporting events are entertainment events, and people have the right to go there without morons in whatever replica shirts making the atmosphere unpleasant or causing them fear an alarm. That includes women and children, by the way.

If 'brain-dead moron' is an expression that offends you, don't post like one.

Yur last word perfectly sums up your attitude.

You're sound eh.

I disagree with what you're saying and you suggest I go and commit suicide. Interesting.

I see you're also picking up on what the definition of a broken window is. Pertinent.

What I would say to you regarding the rest of your tawdry and predictable post is that life has a tendency to not go as smoothly as you would like sometimes, and that as you seem to thrive on disapproval and finger pointing, I wouldn't whine too loudly about it or you might just see your transluscent grey life force slip clean out of that torn face of yours.

--------
11-08-2009, 02:26 PM
You're sound eh.

I disagree with what you're saying and you suggest I go and commit suicide. Interesting.

I see you're also picking up on what the definition of a broken window is. Pertinent.

What I would say to you regarding the rest of your tawdry and predictable post is that life has a tendency to not go as smoothly as you would like sometimes, and that as you seem to thrive on disapproval and finger pointing, I wouldn't whine too loudly about it or you might just see you transluscent grey life force slip clean out of that torn face of yours.




Not suicide - you'd have a fair chance of surviving. All depends how quick you are on your feet.

You were the one who brought up the subject of danger and excitement.

BravestHibs
11-08-2009, 02:30 PM
Not suicide - you'd have a fair chance of surviving. All depends how quick you are on your feet.

You were the one who brought up the subject of danger and excitement. :devil:

And you clearly understood exactly what I meant.

Jonnyboy
11-08-2009, 02:35 PM
Agree with this!

To me there is an element of folk on here who think they are something special good at shouting down other people and good at jumping on a band wagon without knowing facts etc..

Lost count of the times I have seen genuine Hibs fans accused of being yams on this board for having the audacity to disagree with regular posters points of views..

Now it's anybody who is prepared to get into a bit of a scrape rather than back down is a disgrace to club , country etc etc .. blah blah blah ...

I have been reading through a lot of these peoples take on Saturdays "trouble" and can only conclude that a lot of them werent present and have been reading a lot of the rubbish written on other forums, bolton news etc etc..

And yet you are agreeing with two posters who weren't there?

Odd

J-C
11-08-2009, 02:36 PM
My god, there's so many on here very quick to back the bad element in this club, how sad. :confused:

I'm not bothered about any trouble before during or after the game, there's always a chance that'll happen, it's more about the so called trouble caused by a few at a Botlon retail park, where families were threatened that's bothering me. Are you happy with supporters of this club causing bother away from the game itself, if you are then you have to have a word with yourselves. By all means stand up for youselves if confronted by opposing fans giving grief but I draw the line at behaving like morons at retail park etc threatening local people.

Leith Green
11-08-2009, 02:48 PM
And yet you are agreeing with two posters who weren't there?

Odd



What exactly are you talking about??

The point I was agreeing with 1 person was that, there are posters on here who are too quick to lable and brand people as something they may not even be..

1. Why would you need to be at Bolton to know this??
2. Who are the two posters I have agreed with?

Jonnyboy
11-08-2009, 02:52 PM
What exactly are you talking about??

The point I was agreeing with 1 person was that, there are posters on here who are too quick to lable and brand people as something they may not even be..

1. Why would you need to be at Bolton to know this??
2. Who are the two posters I have agreed with?

Sorry, I read your post to mean you were agreeing with those who feel too much is being made of what happened and I pointed out you'd mentioned folk were commenting and hadn't been there. Does that make sense :greengrin

Point is there was some bother and a few Hibs fans (other than the group who seemed to only be there for a fight) got involved. Many people, myself included, are disappointed by that as it reflects badly on Hibs.

The truth is that the vast majority of those that travelled had a great time but no-one is interested in debating that at length.

Leith Green
11-08-2009, 02:53 PM
My god, there's so many on here very quick to back the bad element in this club, how sad. :confused:

I'm not bothered about any trouble before during or after the game, there's always a chance that'll happen, it's more about the so called trouble caused by a few at a Botlon retail park, where families were threatened that's bothering me. Are you happy with supporters of this club causing bother away from the game itself, if you are then you have to have a word with yourselves. By all means stand up for youselves if confronted by opposing fans giving grief but I draw the line at behaving like morons at retail park etc threatening local people.



Pretty good post mate...

I don't agree with people smashing shop windows etc as I find it a stange thing to do, especially as the shoppers and shop workers are ordinary people and I wouldnt like my family to be working and a brick coming through their window..

I also do believe though that every person reacts differently to certain situations, and some when provoked will not back down, where is the disgrace in that?

Jonnyboy
11-08-2009, 02:54 PM
Pretty good post mate...

I don't agree with people smashing shop windows etc as I find it a stange thing to do, especially as the shoppers and shop workers are ordinary people and I wouldnt like my family to be working and a brick coming through their window..

I also do believe though that every person reacts differently to certain situations, and some when provoked will not back down, where is the disgrace in that?

Agree with all of that :agree:

jgl07
11-08-2009, 02:54 PM
It looks like Hearts hooligans are getting involved as well!

http://news.scotsman.com/news/Probe-into-caravan-fire.4684761.jp

Leith Green
11-08-2009, 02:57 PM
Sorry, I read your post to mean you were agreeing with those who feel too much is being made of what happened and I pointed out you'd mentioned folk were commenting and hadn't been there. Does that make sense :greengrin

Point is there was some bother and a few Hibs fans (other than the group who seemed to only be there for a fight) got involved. Many people, myself included, are disappointed by that as it reflects badly on Hibs.

The truth is that the vast majority of those that travelled had a great time but no-one is interested in debating that at length.



Sound mate, I was genuinelly confused by what you meant...

I do still however think that a lot has been over hyped about the trouble,

Jonnyboy
11-08-2009, 02:59 PM
Sound mate, I was genuinelly confused by what you meant...

I do still however think that a lot has been over hyped about the trouble,

Everyone says that to me :greengrin

I agree about this being over hyped :agree: This thread and related others have hunners of posts whereas those discussing positives about Hibs trail way behind!

J-C
11-08-2009, 03:00 PM
Pretty good post mate...

I don't agree with people smashing shop windows etc as I find it a stange thing to do, especially as the shoppers and shop workers are ordinary people and I wouldnt like my family to be working and a brick coming through their window..

I also do believe though that every person reacts differently to certain situations, and some when provoked will not back down, where is the disgrace in that?

At least you've seen where some posters are coming from. The ones who stood up for themselves at the game, that'll happen and I'm sure I wouldn't ignore any other fan hurling abuse, I'd stand up for myself. We don't need the hooligan element that causes mindless violence.

Jonnyboy
11-08-2009, 03:00 PM
It looks like Hearts hooligans are getting involved as well!

http://news.scotsman.com/news/Probe-into-caravan-fire.4684761.jp

:greengrin

marinello59
11-08-2009, 03:02 PM
It seems that alot of people on this board are hellbent on a life entirely free of danger/excitement. Whatever happened in Bolton and from what I can tell, although I wasn't there, seems to be nothing more than one window which wasn't even completely smashed and a few fat dudes shouting at each other.

It does my head in the amount of people who are so eager to highlight their intellectual/moral superiority. "Disgusting!!", "Brain Dead Morons", "Animals" it honestly makes me cringe, it really does. It seems to me that there is a huge amount of pleasure derived by disapproving, or letting everyone know how disgusted they are.

Look, I don't know who you are trying to impress with all this holier than thou posturing but if you really are so appalled by what happened why not put your soft little hands up and tell the teacher,alternatively, if you're not willing to go the whole hog and grass anyone up, please stop whining. Because to me it's not the fact that people may or may not have been fighting that's embarrassing, it's certain posters on here that seem to be snivelling for approval from some kind omnipetent authority figure.

Pathetic.




What I would say to you regarding the rest of your tawdry and predictable post is that life has a tendency to not go as smoothly as you would like sometimes, and that as you seem to thrive on disapproval and finger pointing, I wouldn't whine too loudly about it or you might just see your transluscent grey life force slip clean out of that torn face of yours.

Do you have to adopt such a sneering tone towards those that disagree with you?

Jonnyboy
11-08-2009, 03:05 PM
Do you have to adopt such a sneering tone towards those that disagree with you?

It comes with the superiority complex :agree:

BravestHibs
11-08-2009, 03:19 PM
Do you have to adopt such a sneering tone towards those that disagree with you?

It comes with the superiority complex :agree:

Right, so it's OK to adopt whatever tone you like as long as you have a certain number of posts yes?

Superiority complex? Cheers for the heads up doc.

marinello59
11-08-2009, 03:21 PM
Do you have to adopt such a sneering tone towards those that disagree with you?

It comes with the superiority complex :agree:

Right, so it's OK to adopt whatever tone you like as long as you have a certain number of posts yes?

Superiority complex? Cheers for the heads up doc.

Who mentioned your number of posts? Stick to the issues and cut out the insults, there really is no need for it.

gogs_t
11-08-2009, 03:23 PM
Everyone says that to me :greengrin

I agree about this being over hyped :agree: This thread and related others have hunners of posts whereas those discussing positives about Hibs trail way behind!

To be honest JB, I think the reason that there is more response on these posts is the concern of many that there was indeed trouble on what should have been (for some) a family day out at an event that was to raise money for charity.

There's a possibility that some of the responses on the level of trouble may be out of proportion with the actual events, but the fact that people are concerned that these things still happen at football matches - especially when Hibs are involved - is for me, a positive.

There's no way that trouble will be totally eradicated from football as emotions run high which is why we love it and get such a buzz, but as long as people condemn the few who deliberately go to cause trouble, that number may become fewer - in the perfect world!! :bitchy:

Jonnyboy
11-08-2009, 03:24 PM
To be honest JB, I think the reason that there is more response on these posts is the concern of many that there was indeed trouble on what should have been (for some) a family day out at an event that was to raise money for charity.

There's a possibility that some of the responses on the level of trouble may be out of proportion with the actual events, but the fact that people are concerned that these things still happen at football matches - especially when Hibs are involved - is for me, a positive.

There's no way that trouble will be totally eradicated from football as emotions run high which is why we love it and get such a buzz, but as long as people condemn the few who deliberately go to cause trouble, that number may become fewer - in the perfect world!! :bitchy:

Well said that man :thumbsup: :agree:

BravestHibs
11-08-2009, 03:26 PM
I mentioned the number of posts. What I was referring to was the fact that Doddie posts with a statement equal to go and play in traffic. Not to mention that he also refers to me as 'brain dead' and I'm meant to blow him a kiss?

You honestly don't see the double standard?

--------
11-08-2009, 03:28 PM
Do you have to adopt such a sneering tone towards those that disagree with you?

It comes with the superiority complex :agree:

Right, so it's OK to adopt whatever tone you like as long as you have a certain number of posts yes?

Superiority complex? Cheers for the heads up doc.


Look, I shouldn't have made that crack about the bypass. For that I apologise.

If you want danger and excitement in your life, that's fine by me.

Just look for it somewhere where the only person at risk is yourself. Don't go looking for it where there are women and kids to be hurt.

But if you post stuff like this, you're going to get a reaction:

"Look, I don't know who you are trying to impress with all this holier than thou posturing but if you really are so appalled by what happened why not put your soft little hands up and tell the teacher, alternatively, if you're not willing to go the whole hog and grass anyone up, please stop whining. Because to me it's not the fact that people may or may not have been fighting that's embarrassing, it's certain posters on here that seem to be snivelling for approval from some kind omnipetent authority figure."

Or is a reaction exactly what you're looking for? :cool2:

marinello59
11-08-2009, 03:29 PM
I mentioned the number of posts. What I was referring to was the fact that Doddie posts with a statement equal to go and play in traffic. Not to mention that he also refers to me as 'brain dead' and I'm meant to blow him a kiss?

You honestly don't see the double standard?

Why not stick to the point instead of trying to muddy the waters. Read through your first post on here and tell me it wasn't basically sneering at other posters who disagreed with you.

Darth Hibbie
11-08-2009, 03:34 PM
To be honest JB, I think the reason that there is more response on these posts is the concern of many that there was indeed trouble on what should have been (for some) a family day out at an event that was to raise money for charity.

There's a possibility that some of the responses on the level of trouble may be out of proportion with the actual events, but the fact that people are concerned that these things still happen at football matches - especially when Hibs are involved - is for me, a positive.

There's no way that trouble will be totally eradicated from football as emotions run high which is why we love it and get such a buzz, but as long as people condemn the few who deliberately go to cause trouble, that number may become fewer - in the perfect world!! :bitchy:

I was not at Bolton and have not commented on the incidents so far however this pretty much sums up my feelings perfectly.

BravestHibs
11-08-2009, 03:35 PM
Look, I shouldn't have made that crack about the bypass. For that I apologise.

If you want danger and excitement in your life, that's fine by me.

Just look for it somewhere where the only person at risk is yourself. Don't go looking for it where there are women and kids to be hurt.

But if you post stuff like this, you're going to get a reaction:

"Look, I don't know who you are trying to impress with all this holier than thou posturing but if you really are so appalled by what happened why not put your soft little hands up and tell the teacher, alternatively, if you're not willing to go the whole hog and grass anyone up, please stop whining. Because to me it's not the fact that people may or may not have been fighting that's embarrassing, it's certain posters on here that seem to be snivelling for approval from some kind omnipetent authority figure."

Or is a reaction exactly what you're looking for? :cool2:

So you want less elaborate language? Because the point I'm making is valid.

I'm not bothered about the crack about the bypass, you can say whatever you like, honestly, I'd rather you did. But I'm going to say whatever I like back at a level I deem proportional. It's just that simple.

My point about the number of posts still stands however. There is definite double standards in effect as I was the one pulled up when we were equally to blame for any kind of 'sneering tone'.

BravestHibs
11-08-2009, 03:43 PM
Why not stick to the point instead of trying to muddy the waters. Read through your first post on here and tell me it wasn't basically sneering at other posters who disagreed with you.

And what about all the posters who get accused of being Yams just for sticking their neck above the parrapet and disagreeing with those who are more established. My initial post was valid in the context of the discussion as the people who agreed with me illustrate. My language was slightly elaborate, granted, all I'm asking for is parity when dealing with people, which I don't really think is too much to ask.

--------
11-08-2009, 03:45 PM
I mentioned the number of posts. What I was referring to was the fact that Doddie posts with a statement equal to go and play in traffic. Not to mention that he also refers to me as 'brain dead' and I'm meant to blow him a kiss?

You honestly don't see the double standard?

Since my name's mentioned...

This is what i was objecting to.

"Look, I don't know who you are trying to impress with all this holier than thou posturing but if you really are so appalled by what happened why not put your soft little hands up and tell the teacher, alternatively, if you're not willing to go the whole hog and grass anyone up, please stop whining...."

The last person I encountered personally who expressed himself in those terms was an extremely unpleasant teenager who thought that because he was bigger and stronger than anyone else in his class he could bully the rest of us and get away with it.

I find it very sad to still encounter people with the attitude that because 'they' said/sang/chanted something 'we' didn't like, the appropriate response is to threaten to punch their lights out or whatever.

And to do so wearing the same colours and clothing that I wear when I go to see my football team. Which then involves me, and everyone else wearing those same colours, in the nonsense.

i don't really care whether 'we' started it on Saturday, or 'they' did. Nor am I deeply concerned whether what happened was more or less serious than things that happened in the 60's, the 70's, or the 80's.

Neither a football stadium with women and children present, nor a shopping precinct ditto, are appropriate places for even the bravest of us to go boxing.

Dashing Bob S
11-08-2009, 03:49 PM
I don't think there's anything wrong with discussing this issue.

My take is that the actual violence itself was quite minimal, (though obviously distressing to people who were caught up in it) but the general atmosphere with the Scotland-England subtext and lots of drink involved was highly charged, and there was a very retro 80's feel about the day. I felt it really could have got a lot more serious and if we'd taken 5,000 or more down.

So I feel discussion is merited as to whether we play such games in England in the future. Sadly, in the internet age it seems to be the perception that Hibs + games in England = trouble.

I know chaps like a good preseason beano, particularly in the absence of European games, but I wonder if this sort of event might just be more trouble than its worth?

Like a lot of posters I've been traditionally loathe to see football become even more sanitized, though I have changed a bit since the young one has become interested in the game, and I didn't enjoy the expressions of fear in the faces of the retail park shoppers.

marinello59
11-08-2009, 03:50 PM
And what about all the posters who get accused of being Yams just for sticking their neck above the parrapet and disagreeing with those who are more established. My initial post was valid in the context of the discussion as the people who agreed with me illustrate. My language was slightly elaborate, granted, all I'm asking for is parity when dealing with people, which I don't really think is too much to ask.

:faf: Slightly elaborate. Aye right, fairly flew over the heads of us lesser mortals.
Once again stop muddying the waters. Who called you a Yam. You have had posts deleted previously when you resorted to deragatory remarks rather than sticking to the issue. Seems to me you are being treated as fairly as you deserve.

Scouse Hibee
11-08-2009, 03:51 PM
To be honest I could not care what other fans think. If other fans are scared of us good on them. Am a Hibs and Cardiff fan use to other teams not liking us! CCS and Soul Crew haha


Age 22 Mental age 2

BravestHibs
11-08-2009, 03:53 PM
Since my name's mentioned...

This is what i was objecting to.

"Look, I don't know who you are trying to impress with all this holier than thou posturing but if you really are so appalled by what happened why not put your soft little hands up and tell the teacher, alternatively, if you're not willing to go the whole hog and grass anyone up, please stop whining...."

The last person I encountered personally who expressed himself in those terms was an extremely unpleasant teenager who thought that because he was bigger and stronger than anyone else in his class he could bully the rest of us and get away with it.

I find it very sad to still encounter people with the attitude that because 'they' said/sang/chanted something 'we' didn't like, the appropriate response is to threaten to punch their lights out or whatever.

And to do so wearing the same colours and clothing that I wear when I go to see my football team. Which then involves me, and everyone else wearing those same colours, in the nonsense.

i don't really care whether 'we' started it on Saturday, or 'they' did. Nor am I deeply concerned whether what happened was more or less serious than things that happened in the 60's, the 70's, or the 80's.

Neither a football stadium with women and children present, nor a shopping precinct ditto, are appropriate places for even the bravest of us to go boxing.

You are now painting me as a bully? This seems to be a nice little propaganda exercise for you here.

And with your last little comment you seem to glibly assume that I'm somehow involved in the CCS.

Can I ask what you're basing this on? Apart from unpleasent childhood memories that is.

--------
11-08-2009, 03:57 PM
I don't think there's anything wrong with discussing this issue.

My take is that the actual violence itself was quite minimal, (though obviously distressing to people who were caught up in it) but the general atmosphere with the Scotland-England subtext and lots of drink involved was highly charged, and there was a very retro 80's feel about the day. I felt it really could have got a lot more serious and if we'd taken 5,000 or more down.

So I feel discussion is merited as to whether we play such games in England in the future. Sadly, in the internet age it seems to be the perception that Hibs + games in England = trouble.

I know chaps like a good preseason beano, particularly in the absence of European games, but I wonder if this sort of event might just be more trouble than its worth?

Like a lot of posters I've been traditionally loathe to see football become even more sanitized, though I have changed a bit since the young one has become interested in the game, and I didn't enjoy the expressions of fear in the faces of the retail park shoppers.


The para in bold says it for me, Bob.

Not a major incident, but unpleasant and frightening for people who had the right not to have their Saturday afternoon shopping made that way.

And an unpleasant and threatening feeling in the stadium which everyone could have done without and which could have led to more serious trouble if there had been bigger numbers involved.

Is that a fair summary?

You're right, though - it didn't half change my attitude when my sprog started coming along with me.

Nowadays he looks after me and tries (usually unsuccessfully) to keep me out of trouble. :devil:

--------
11-08-2009, 04:01 PM
You are now painting me as a bully? This seems to be a nice little propaganda exercise for you here.

No, but you certainly come over like one in that paragraph.

And with your last little comment you seem to glibly assume that I'm somehow involved in the CCS.

I'm not assuming anything. I think you're reading in here. But big men who go on the rampage in a shopping precinct scaring women and kids aren't my idea of heroes.

Can I ask what you're basing this on? Apart from unpleasent childhood memories that is.

Who said the memories were unpleasant? All I said was, I knew a guy who thought he could behave a particular way...

BravestHibs
11-08-2009, 04:02 PM
:faf: Slightly elaborate. Aye right, fairly few over the heads of us lesser mortals.
Once again stop muddying the waters. Who called you a Yam. You have had posts deleted previously when you resorted to deragatory remarks rather than sticking to the issue. Seems to me you are being treated as fairly as you deserve.

You mock, but I don't actually think you're getting what I mean. I didn't say anyone had called me a yam.

I have had posts deleted but only when I've been abused in the first instance. I'd love to see where I initiated any of those more heated discussions, or slanging matches if you'd rather. It just seems that it's always people whose post counts are in the thousands that initiate these with impunity. It also seems to me, and I can only base this on personal experience, that it may be these post counts which muddy the waters for you. I only hope you don't take this personally as it's just my opinion, and granted I can be a bit brusque, but that's just my manner. People who actually know me would say so too. Luckily they don't hold it against me.

PEACE!!

joe breezy
11-08-2009, 05:22 PM
Wasn't there but I'd be surprised if the Hibs support behaved any worse than a Celtic or Rangers support would on an awayday down south.

Alcohol makes things a bit more full on for some in these all-dayers I suppose.

I do wonder about the shock horror mob though. Were they born yesterday?

All of my football spectating life has involved some knowingness to rowdiness.

Personally don't want to be liked by Hearts fans etc the way some people seem to. I live in London and I either go to see Cardiff or Man U down here as none of the London teams do it for me. Cardiff and Man U fans aren't universally popular but they both have great away supports.

jakki
11-08-2009, 05:34 PM
After the bolton game I will NEVER take my grandkids to a game. It was advertised as a family game. Yes it started as a family game, the prematch was excellent and the match was a Ok but after the game we weren't allowed out by our exit. We walked round the track and got out the furtherst awayend, waiting for the trouble to stopfrom the trouble. We
waited and then headed to the only known way out to our pick up point. The Bolton fans were great and said that they enjoyed the game etc
We were stopped going up by the retail park, the only way that we knew for my mobility scooter
and while I was talking to a policemen my 13 year old grandson was asked for a square do by a 50? old gueazer with a bloody face who he believed that he had bloodyed his nose as he was wearing a Hibs top. Taylor would have had to have step ladders to reach his red boozed fully nose. after a few shouting matches the chap was led away by the polis..

What has this done to English football. All 5 grandkids have stated that they will not follow English football and all live in the Manchester and Warrington areas.

Nameless
11-08-2009, 05:40 PM
Any match going Jambo, Sheepy, Motherwell fan etc will know what the score is with Hibs, that our fans are as good as they come but can on occassion have a nutty element, just like we know the same with them, despite having a hooligan element or a rangers-wannabe element, are generally fine.

By far the most well thought out and reasoned response I have read regarding the incident in Bolton. Time to put this to bed surely:grr:

blackpoolhibs
11-08-2009, 05:49 PM
After the bolton game I will NEVER take my grandkids to a game.

My friend wanted me to take her 6 now 7 year old to the derby game were the bottles were thrown at the bus. She then said she was glad i had not taken him. She now asks me if hibs fans can behave when they go to football, and her son is going nowhere near a game involving hibs. Yet it was only pavement dancing, and nobody got hurt. :bitchy:

iwasthere1972
11-08-2009, 06:00 PM
After the bolton game I will NEVER take my grandkids to a game. It was advertised as a family game. Yes it started as a family game, the prematch was excellent and the match was a Ok but after the game we weren't allowed out by our exit. We walked round the track and got out the furtherst awayend, waiting for the trouble to stopfrom the trouble. We
waited and then headed to the only known way out to our pick up point. The Bolton fans were great and said that they enjoyed the game etc
We were stopped going up by the retail park, the only way that we knew for my mobility scooter
and while I was talking to a policemen my 13 year old grandson was asked for a square do by a 50? old gueazer with a bloody face who he believed that he had bloodyed his nose as he was wearing a Hibs top. Taylor would have had to have step ladders to reach his red boozed fully nose. after a few shouting matches the chap was led away by the polis..

What has this done to English football. All 5 grandkids have stated that they will not follow English football and all live in the Manchester and Warrington areas.


I've refrained from posting on this thread due to the fact that I wasn't there. Folk try to guess what it would have been like to be in the same situation as the innocent people who were in the middle of it or by the sidelines.

I hope that when things have died down that your grandkids will have a change of heart as nowadays and unlike the 70's and 80' these incidents really are a rare occurence.

oldbutdim
11-08-2009, 07:35 PM
I had a great time.

Completely missed ALL the aggro - left after applauding the end of the match, went outside and looked at the posh players cars...... up to the Beehive for a steak and couple of pints, then up the town until the early hours.
Fantastic.

Didn't know a thing about any bother until I looked on tinternet on Sunday aft.

Only time I felt intimidated at all was when I realise that Johnnyboy bloke was a few seats away from me.

Oh. And the size of the hotdog.

I'm still a bit in awe of that.

Jonnyboy
11-08-2009, 07:44 PM
I had a great time.

Completely missed ALL the aggro - left after applauding the end of the match, went outside and looked at the posh players cars...... up to the Beehive for a steak and couple of pints, then up the town until the early hours.
Fantastic.

Didn't know a thing about any bother until I looked on tinternet on Sunday aft.

Only time I felt intimidated at all was when I realise that Johnnyboy bloke was a few seats away from me.

Oh. And the size of the hotdog.

I'm still a bit in awe of that.

I saw ye :agree: :greengrin

panshibby
11-08-2009, 07:50 PM
to be honest i could not care what other fans think. If other fans are scared of us good on them. Am a hibs and cardiff fan use to other teams not liking us! Ccs and soul crew haha

fud

iwasthere1972
11-08-2009, 08:20 PM
To be honest I could not care what other fans think. If other fans are scared of us good on them. Am a Hibs and Cardiff fan use to other teams not liking us! CCS and Soul Crew haha

Where can I post your "No.1 Prize Tosspot of the Year" award to?

lucky
11-08-2009, 08:41 PM
I doubt the CCS will too chuffed now that the CCTV is getting checked. Wont belong before there is a knock at the door.

http://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/4539111.Violence_at_Hibs_match__Investigators_to_l ook_at_CCTV_footage/

iwasthere1972
11-08-2009, 09:04 PM
I doubt the CCS will too chuffed now that the CCTV is getting checked. Wont belong before there is a knock at the door.

http://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/4539111.Violence_at_Hibs_match__Investigators_to_l ook_at_CCTV_footage/

Good. Hope they hunt out each and every one of them and stick them on the next plane going to Afghanisan. When there open the door and throw them out. See how hard they are then. :bye:

brownlies bits
11-08-2009, 09:07 PM
I had a great time.

Completely missed ALL the aggro - left after applauding the end of the match, went outside and looked at the posh players cars...... up to the Beehive for a steak and couple of pints, then up the town until the early hours.
Fantastic.

Didn't know a thing about any bother until I looked on tinternet on Sunday aft.

Only time I felt intimidated at all was when I realise that Johnnyboy bloke was a few seats away from me.

Oh. And the size of the hotdog.

I'm still a bit in awe of that.



Same as me mate came out of the ground went to check into our Hotel(De Vere at the ground) never seen any bother ,only thing we got was being called "scottish ****" by the nice little bolton autograph hunters when we came out of hotel to go to the Beehive which was great by the way. My wife wanted to skelp their bums (shes a teacher) but managed to calm her down.


Moral of this drivel "dont rise to the bait"

VIOLENCE IS NOT AN OPTION IN ANY SITUATION


Drivel over "Hibs for the cup"

Sidley
11-08-2009, 09:13 PM
Completely missed ALL the aggro - left after applauding the end of the match, went outside and looked at the posh players cars

Don't you mean the players' posh cars? :devil:

woody47
11-08-2009, 09:13 PM
I had a great time in Bolton. Beehive staff were very friendly. Police before the game were laughing and joking with the Hibs fans.

During the game there were Bolton fans at both ends of the Hibs support baiting our fans. Our fans don't need much to retaliate but this happens EVERY time we play unfirm, yams, sheep etc.

I had no problems after the game as our bus was in the car park outside but one of our guys had been walking towards the bus and was hit a couple of times by Bolton fans.

Whilst I hate all this violence at games, I think there are a few on this board who just love when it happens so that they can put their holier than thou hats on.

I also think the police and jobsworths in the ground could have done a bit more to stop this happening in the first place.

ArabHibee
11-08-2009, 09:58 PM
To be honest I could not care what other fans think. If other fans are scared of us good on them. Am a Hibs and Cardiff fan use to other teams not liking us! CCS and Soul Crew haha

Owen, you are a twat. End of.


He says he's a 'Hibs and Cardiff fan use to other teams not liking us' - location 'Lockerbie'?

That, and "CCS and Soul Crew haha" just about says it all, really.

The unfortunate fact is that he ISN'T better than that. That's exactly the level at which he operates - two levels below pond-life.

:agree: Yip, and he's Macar's new bessie mate. What does that tell you?



I wasn’t there but I think I’ve read every word of the reports and posts on the subject.

One thing that has struck me was where our fans were allocated their seating.

Why is it that the segregation at the Rebock puts the away fans right next to what a Bolton fan has described as there worst element? A part of the ground that is ‘their own’ that has its own little pet name, although the name escapes me at the moment. No surprise then that our intellectually challenged equivalent had the time of their lives.

Why not have the away support away from them, that part of the ground? It wouldn’t matter about segregation before / after the game because apparently its something they don’t do.

Still there's no excuse.

While Hibs can go to Europe and a few years later can still be contributing to help those less fortunate than ourselves; while Hibs can have neutrals and fans of other clubs congratulating us after a fantastic uber atmosphere cup final; while Hibs continue to do work in the community, we can hold our heads high.

Meanwhile those who tried to drag us down to their level only let themselves down.

I don't think that the away fans "are put beside them". The away supporters in any ground will most always be seated in the same area and the "nutters" will make sure that they get seats nearest to the away end so that they can goad and sing at the away fans. I think the pet name you are looking for is "Crazy Corner", Sunderland fans call it this as well at the Stadium of Light. Just like at ER the "nutters" congregate towards the south end of the east stand.


:top marks Agree with every point.

I was accused of being a casual one minute then a hearts fan the next on the "drink at football" thread by a couple of do gooders.

What reputation do hibs fans actually have.

The reason you were accused of this is because you came on spouting nonsense and noising it up about the trouble in Bolton. You only joined .net this month. Only time will tell if you are a yam fud.

Oh. And note for Bravest Hibs. Well done for jumping over to the main board for a change. Watch you don't give yourself a nosebleed.

CABBAGE & RIBS
12-08-2009, 04:39 AM
The reason you were accused of this is because you came on spouting nonsense and noising it up about the trouble in Bolton. You only joined .net this month. Only time will tell if you are a yam fud.



I was a member years ago on the old site about 2000 so we will see.

Septimus
12-08-2009, 06:11 AM
It seems that alot of people on this board are hellbent on a life entirely free of danger/excitement. Whatever happened in Bolton and from what I can tell, although I wasn't there, seems to be nothing more than one window which wasn't even completely smashed and a few fat dudes shouting at each other.

It does my head in the amount of people who are so eager to highlight their intellectual/moral superiority. "Disgusting!!", "Brain Dead Morons", "Animals" it honestly makes me cringe, it really does. It seems to me that there is a huge amount of pleasure derived by disapproving, or letting everyone know how disgusted they are.

Look, I don't know who you are trying to impress with all this holier than thou posturing but if you really are so appalled by what happened why not put your soft little hands up and tell the teacher,alternatively, if you're not willing to go the whole hog and grass anyone up, please stop whining. Because to me it's not the fact that people may or may not have been fighting that's embarrassing, it's certain posters on here that seem to be snivelling for approval from some kind omnipetent authority figure.

Pathetic.

But its called civilisation and , thank you, I can get all the "danger/excitement" that I need without impinging on other peoples rights.

Dashing Bob S
12-08-2009, 08:19 AM
I doubt the CCS will too chuffed now that the CCTV is getting checked. Wont belong before there is a knock at the door.

http://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/4539111.Violence_at_Hibs_match__Investigators_to_l ook_at_CCTV_footage/

Perhaps following Messers Dykes and Blance's books we might now have CCSTV?

BravestHibs
12-08-2009, 08:32 AM
Owen, you are a twat. End of.



:agree: Yip, and he's Macar's new bessie mate. What does that tell you?




I don't think that the away fans "are put beside them". The away supporters in any ground will most always be seated in the same area and the "nutters" will make sure that they get seats nearest to the away end so that they can goad and sing at the away fans. I think the pet name you are looking for is "Crazy Corner", Sunderland fans call it this as well at the Stadium of Light. Just like at ER the "nutters" congregate towards the south end of the east stand.



The reason you were accused of this is because you came on spouting nonsense and noising it up about the trouble in Bolton. You only joined .net this month. Only time will tell if you are a yam fud.

Oh. And note for Bravest Hibs. Well done for jumping over to the main board for a change. Watch you don't give yourself a nosebleed.

Zing!

oldbutdim
12-08-2009, 08:35 AM
Don't you mean the players' posh cars? :devil:

:embarrass


er....... yes.

SunnyLeither
12-08-2009, 09:04 AM
Let's just hope the police agree. .

Any money paid to that mob to look after events on Saturday should be refunded, don't think thay did a very good job for allegedly knowing beforehand what was going on and who the 'kent faces' were.

Dashing Bob S
12-08-2009, 09:09 AM
Can we hijack this thread and make it about Boabster?

Hibs Giant
12-08-2009, 09:37 AM
Age 22 Mental age 2

:faf:

I see what you did there.

Hibs Giant
12-08-2009, 09:39 AM
:applause:
Where can I post your "No.1 Prize Tosspot of the Year" award to?

:applause: :wink:

As if there's such a prize. :faf:

You guys crack me up sometimes.

hibs0666
12-08-2009, 11:15 AM
I doubt the CCS will too chuffed now that the CCTV is getting checked. Wont belong before there is a knock at the door.

http://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/4539111.Violence_at_Hibs_match__Investigators_to_l ook_at_CCTV_footage/

Evening News now reporting on it. Given the saturation CCTV coverage of shopping centres these days, a few people will have every right to be worried about the result of their actions.

--------
12-08-2009, 11:50 AM
Good.

dangermouse
12-08-2009, 11:54 AM
To be honest JB, I think the reason that there is more response on these posts is the concern of many that there was indeed trouble on what should have been (for some) a family day out at an event that was to raise money for charity.

There's a possibility that some of the responses on the level of trouble may be out of proportion with the actual events, but the fact that people are concerned that these things still happen at football matches - especially when Hibs are involved - is for me, a positive.

There's no way that trouble will be totally eradicated from football as emotions run high which is why we love it and get such a buzz, but as long as people condemn the few who deliberately go to cause trouble, that number may become fewer - in the perfect world!! :bitchy:

Which is a damn shame. I enjoy the buzz as much as the next man but once the game is over I have no desire to become involved in any altercation with opposing fans no matter what the result (and I hope I'm bringing my son up to support Hibs in the same manner).

IMHO, over consumption of alcohol was a major contributory factor. Maybe future juants down south could be sponsored by this lot (http://www.drinkaware.co.uk/).

RIP
12-08-2009, 11:56 AM
I personally doubt if many genuine Hibs fans were involved in trouble.

Bolton is an epicentre of far-right and loyalist activity in the North-West. Most of the time these Combat 18 heroes have little opportunity to meet in a crowded environment or wear their Engerlund shirts. Saturday gave them that opportunity.

When you see a group of fat, balding men, too old for their baseball caps, feverishly talking into mobile phones you know we can expect a re-enactment of the 80's casual 'press-the-flesh' lovefest.

Apparently there was enough pre-match goss around that even Lothian and Border's finest were tipped off. Some retired Hibs casuals are alledged to have dusted down their Jay Allen manual, donned their motheaten Lacoste, SI and Aquascutum, discreetly pinned a wee funny green Union Jack badge and jumped in a minibus to Bolton. I wouldnae mind betting there wasnae a season ticket holder amongst them.

Some trouble apparently happened at the football but let's be honest the Bolton match would have been too attractive to a particular kind of lonely lad as a holiday/p*ss-up/stag weekend. Most fans would be yer typical Easter Road regulars but we know that trips darn sarf and cup finals do attract the alkie brigade who love to turn these events into a jakie bender. The self-control goes oot the windae after the eight pint!

Will we be seeing either of these species of ugly mongs at Easter Road this season - I doubt it!

Phil D. Rolls
12-08-2009, 01:22 PM
To be honest I could not care what other fans think. If other fans are scared of us good on them. Am a Hibs and Cardiff fan use to other teams not liking us! CCS and Soul Crew haha

Don't flatter yourself, it's nothing to do with being a Hibs and Cardiff fan, I reckon you are just a tosser.

sadtom
12-08-2009, 02:01 PM
I personally doubt if many genuine Hibs fans were involved in trouble.

Bolton is an epicentre of far-right and loyalist activity in the North-West. Most of the time these Combat 18 heroes have little opportunity to meet in a crowded environment or wear their Engerlund shirts. Saturday gave them that opportunity.

When you see a group of fat, balding men, too old for their baseball caps, feverishly talking into mobile phones you know we can expect a re-enactment of the 80's casual 'press-the-flesh' lovefest.

Apparently there was enough pre-match goss around that even Lothian and Border's finest were tipped off. Some retired Hibs casuals are alledged to have dusted down their Jay Allen manual, donned their motheaten Lacoste, SI and Aquascutum, discreetly pinned a wee funny green Union Jack badge and jumped in a minibus to Bolton. I wouldnae mind betting there wasnae a season ticket holder amongst them.

Some trouble apparently happened at the football but let's be honest the Bolton match would have been too attractive to a particular kind of lonely lad as a holiday/p*ss-up/stag weekend. Most fans would be yer typical Easter Road regulars but we know that trips darn sarf and cup finals do attract the alkie brigade who love to turn these events into a jakie bender. The self-control goes oot the windae after the eight pint!

Will we be seeing either of these species of ugly mongs at Easter Road this season - I doubt it!

These comments are just not true. The idea that there is some sort of homogeniuos casual is nonsense.
I know a lot of the old Hibs boys, the vast majority who, thankfully, have grown out of it but a handful who are still dafties.
Within their ranks (in a way that probobly mirrors our whole support) there are a number who are absolute Hibs fanatics, to those who dont really care that much.
Of those who are casuals, some do it because they are total Hibs diehards (albeit misguided), some do it for the identity, some cause their mates do it, some for the danger, some purely for the violence just because they are downright evil barstewards, some for the cameraderie, some for the clothes/scene and the overwhelming majority because they are are a mixture of all the aforementioned reasons in varying degrees.

As for our 'reputation' down south. In my experience most english fans are at best oblivious to "scotch" football on a good day. Downright ignorant on a bad one. "Oh yeah, Hiberdeen of midlothian, they come from St Andrews dont they jock?"
Of the minority who do know their stuff on scottish fitba then they will know we are a decent sized club with a decent sized support who are part of a small clutch of clubs who occasionally threaten to challange the OF.
Of those who are into the hooley side of things they will know that our club has (or more had) a substantial casual element who have a fairly well deserved 'reputation' among their counterparts.
As such the events at bolton will, in the first case not even have registered amonst your commoner garden english fan.
In the second case the size of the support and the reasonable results will confirm our place as a good sized scottish club with a half decent team.
In the third case those who are into the casual scene will have their opinion of us as a club with a 'rep' as being confirmed.

So as far as our reputaion is concerned i dont think it will have been deminished, enhanced or affected in the least.
In short i wouldn't waste a moment worrying about it. Nobody else is.

Leith Green
12-08-2009, 02:08 PM
These comments are just not true. The idea that there is some sort of homogeniuos casual is nonsense.
I know a lot of the old Hibs boys, the vast majority who, thankfully, have grown out of it but a handful who are still dafties.
Within their ranks (in a way that probobly mirrors our whole support) there are a number who are absolute Hibs fanatics, to those who dont really care that much.
Of those who are casuals, some do it because they are total Hibs diehards (albeit misguided), some do it for the identity, some cause their mates do it, some for the danger, some purely for the violence just because they are downright evil barstewards, some for the cameraderie, some for the clothes/scene and the overwhelming majority because they are are a mixture of all the aforementioned reasons in varying degrees.

As for our 'reputation' down south. In my experience most english fans are at best oblivious to "scotch" football on a good day. Downright ignorant on a bad one. "Oh yeah, Hiberdeen of midlothian, they come from St Andrews dont they jock?"
Of the minority who do know their stuff on scottish fitba then they will know we are a decent sized club with a decent sized support who are part of a small clutch of clubs who occasionally threaten to challange the OF.
Of those who are into the hooley side of things they will know that our club has (or more had) a substantial casual element who have a fairly well deserved 'reputation' among their counterparts.
As such the events at bolton will, in the first case not even have registered amonst your commoner garden english fan.
In the second case the size of the support and the reasonable results will confirm our place as a good sized scottish club with a half decent team.
In the third case those who are into the casual scene will have their opinion of us as a club with a 'rep' as being confirmed.

So as far as our reputaion is concerned i dont think it will have been deminished, enhanced or affected in the least.
In short i wouldn't waste a moment worrying about it. Nobody else is.




Pretty fair and correct analysis in my opinion mate ! ... :agree:

J-C
12-08-2009, 02:25 PM
These comments are just not true. The idea that there is some sort of homogeniuos casual is nonsense.
I know a lot of the old Hibs boys, the vast majority who, thankfully, have grown out of it but a handful who are still dafties.
Within their ranks (in a way that probobly mirrors our whole support) there are a number who are absolute Hibs fanatics, to those who dont really care that much.
Of those who are casuals, some do it because they are total Hibs diehards (albeit misguided), some do it for the identity, some cause their mates do it, some for the danger, some purely for the violence just because they are downright evil barstewards, some for the cameraderie, some for the clothes/scene and the overwhelming majority because they are are a mixture of all the aforementioned reasons in varying degrees.

As for our 'reputation' down south. In my experience most english fans are at best oblivious to "scotch" football on a good day. Downright ignorant on a bad one. "Oh yeah, Hiberdeen of midlothian, they come from St Andrews dont they jock?"
Of the minority who do know their stuff on scottish fitba then they will know we are a decent sized club with a decent sized support who are part of a small clutch of clubs who occasionally threaten to challange the OF.
Of those who are into the hooley side of things they will know that our club has (or more had) a substantial casual element who have a fairly well deserved 'reputation' among their counterparts.
As such the events at bolton will, in the first case not even have registered amonst your commoner garden english fan.
In the second case the size of the support and the reasonable results will confirm our place as a good sized scottish club with a half decent team.
In the third case those who are into the casual scene will have their opinion of us as a club with a 'rep' as being confirmed.

So as far as our reputaion is concerned i dont think it will have been deminished, enhanced or affected in the least.
In short i wouldn't waste a moment worrying about it. Nobody else is.


I agree to an extent with most of this, just a pity ther's still an element within the club, whether season ticket holders or not who still hold onto the dream of having a "firm" ready and willing to get together at every oppertunity, to have a scrap with opposition "firms". The numbers being mentioned (20-30) seems to back up what you say that this was all organised beforehand.

Hibs07p
12-08-2009, 02:30 PM
These comments are just not true. The idea that there is some sort of homogeniuos casual is nonsense.
I know a lot of the old Hibs boys, the vast majority who, thankfully, have grown out of it but a handful who are still dafties.
Within their ranks (in a way that probobly mirrors our whole support) there are a number who are absolute Hibs fanatics, to those who dont really care that much.
Of those who are casuals, some do it because they are total Hibs diehards (albeit misguided), some do it for the identity, some cause their mates do it, some for the danger, some purely for the violence just because they are downright evil barstewards, some for the cameraderie, some for the clothes/scene and the overwhelming majority because they are are a mixture of all the aforementioned reasons in varying degrees.

As for our 'reputation' down south. In my experience most english fans are at best oblivious to "scotch" football on a good day. Downright ignorant on a bad one. "Oh yeah, Hiberdeen of midlothian, they come from St Andrews dont they jock?"
Of the minority who do know their stuff on scottish fitba then they will know we are a decent sized club with a decent sized support who are part of a small clutch of clubs who occasionally threaten to challange the OF.
Of those who are into the hooley side of things they will know that our club has (or more had) a substantial casual element who have a fairly well deserved 'reputation' among their counterparts.
As such the events at bolton will, in the first case not even have registered amonst your commoner garden english fan.
In the second case the size of the support and the reasonable results will confirm our place as a good sized scottish club with a half decent team.
In the third case those who are into the casual scene will have their opinion of us as a club with a 'rep' as being confirmed.

So as far as our reputaion is concerned i dont think it will have been deminished, enhanced or affected in the least.
In short i wouldn't waste a moment worrying about it. Nobody else is.

Excellent analysis. :top marks

Dashing Bob S
12-08-2009, 03:33 PM
These comments are just not true. The idea that there is some sort of homogeniuos casual is nonsense.
I know a lot of the old Hibs boys, the vast majority who, thankfully, have grown out of it but a handful who are still dafties.
Within their ranks (in a way that probobly mirrors our whole support) there are a number who are absolute Hibs fanatics, to those who dont really care that much.
Of those who are casuals, some do it because they are total Hibs diehards (albeit misguided), some do it for the identity, some cause their mates do it, some for the danger, some purely for the violence just because they are downright evil barstewards, some for the cameraderie, some for the clothes/scene and the overwhelming majority because they are are a mixture of all the aforementioned reasons in varying degrees.

As for our 'reputation' down south. In my experience most english fans are at best oblivious to "scotch" football on a good day. Downright ignorant on a bad one. "Oh yeah, Hiberdeen of midlothian, they come from St Andrews dont they jock?"
Of the minority who do know their stuff on scottish fitba then they will know we are a decent sized club with a decent sized support who are part of a small clutch of clubs who occasionally threaten to challange the OF.
Of those who are into the hooley side of things they will know that our club has (or more had) a substantial casual element who have a fairly well deserved 'reputation' among their counterparts.
As such the events at bolton will, in the first case not even have registered amonst your commoner garden english fan.
In the second case the size of the support and the reasonable results will confirm our place as a good sized scottish club with a half decent team.
In the third case those who are into the casual scene will have their opinion of us as a club with a 'rep' as being confirmed.

So as far as our reputaion is concerned i dont think it will have been deminished, enhanced or affected in the least.
In short i wouldn't waste a moment worrying about it. Nobody else is.

By far the best post on this issue.

Peevemor
12-08-2009, 03:36 PM
By far the best post on this issue.

:agree:

Hibby_Ed
12-08-2009, 03:44 PM
What's done is done, nothing will change it. Focus on making as much noise at every home and away game this season, get ourselves into Europe and then we'll show other countries we can behave, this will silence the Yams and indeed let other teams/countries regard Hibs as a side known for football, not fighting. Just forget it.

BravestHibs
12-08-2009, 03:54 PM
These comments are just not true. The idea that there is some sort of homogeniuos casual is nonsense.
I know a lot of the old Hibs boys, the vast majority who, thankfully, have grown out of it but a handful who are still dafties.
Within their ranks (in a way that probobly mirrors our whole support) there are a number who are absolute Hibs fanatics, to those who dont really care that much.
Of those who are casuals, some do it because they are total Hibs diehards (albeit misguided), some do it for the identity, some cause their mates do it, some for the danger, some purely for the violence just because they are downright evil barstewards, some for the cameraderie, some for the clothes/scene and the overwhelming majority because they are are a mixture of all the aforementioned reasons in varying degrees.

As for our 'reputation' down south. In my experience most english fans are at best oblivious to "scotch" football on a good day. Downright ignorant on a bad one. "Oh yeah, Hiberdeen of midlothian, they come from St Andrews dont they jock?"
Of the minority who do know their stuff on scottish fitba then they will know we are a decent sized club with a decent sized support who are part of a small clutch of clubs who occasionally threaten to challange the OF.
Of those who are into the hooley side of things they will know that our club has (or more had) a substantial casual element who have a fairly well deserved 'reputation' among their counterparts.
As such the events at bolton will, in the first case not even have registered amonst your commoner garden english fan.
In the second case the size of the support and the reasonable results will confirm our place as a good sized scottish club with a half decent team.
In the third case those who are into the casual scene will have their opinion of us as a club with a 'rep' as being confirmed.

So as far as our reputaion is concerned i dont think it will have been deminished, enhanced or affected in the least.
In short i wouldn't waste a moment worrying about it. Nobody else is.

Scythed through the issue like a knife through butter. One of the best posts I've seen on .net.

RIP
12-08-2009, 04:19 PM
I accept that my post was a bit naive in hoping there were few daftie ST's involved in bovver. Maybe after the CCTV piccies are published there will a few less?

As for Bolton not knowing who we are :faf:

http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/HibernianFixtures2007_2008.php

They got mightily cuffed on the park 2 seasons ago and brought a sh*tty away support. Took them all their time to fill one boozer with a dozen ugly lard as ses!

Pathetic!

Dashing Bob S
12-08-2009, 04:28 PM
I accept that my post was a bit naive in hoping there were few daftie ST's involved in bovver. Maybe after the CCTV piccies are published there will a few less?

As for Bolton not knowing who we are :faf:

http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/HibernianFixtures2007_2008.php

They got mightily cuffed on the park 2 seasons ago and brought a sh*tty away support. Took them all their time to fill one boozer with a dozen ugly lard as ses!

Pathetic!

If that's what you think of Bolton Wanderers fans, it's perhaps not surprising that some of them displayed hostility to us.

I interests of balance, I have to say that I met some very nice BWFC people down there; good fans, knew their football and extended hospitality and the hand of friendship. I'll be keeping a lookout for their results this season.

The_Todd
12-08-2009, 04:52 PM
I accept that my post was a bit naive in hoping there were few daftie ST's involved in bovver. Maybe after the CCTV piccies are published there will a few less?

As for Bolton not knowing who we are :faf:

http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/HibernianFixtures2007_2008.php

They got mightily cuffed on the park 2 seasons ago and brought a sh*tty away support. Took them all their time to fill one boozer with a dozen ugly lard as ses!

Pathetic!


Off topic but looking at that run of results up until 20 October makes me so sad about how a promising season fell apart.

Up to that point:

P9 W6 D3 L0 with 21 points. Both Old Firm teams and Hertz taken care of...

Anyway... back to the conversation about hooligans...

VegasHibby
12-08-2009, 04:54 PM
It's very sad and mostly embarrassing that this animosity still exists in the game. Hibs are guilty of it as are Hearts,Aberdeen,Celtic,Rangers and many English clubs. Most teams with a decent following will have a small percentage of fans acting this way. If this is a sign that the violence will escalate this season then something really needs to be done.

An idea to resolve th problem would be for the club(and all clubs) to appoint a number of loyal fans who have been pre-qalified to be responsible upstanding Hibbys. To have them spread out amongst the crowd during match games and anyone seen initiating trouble will be removed from ground via The "Hibby police" and The police working together. That appointed Hibby(acting like a police fan)has the power(given by the club) to give the police acknowledgement of who the guilty fan is. After a few games or so it would be apparent to "Hibby police" and club who the trouble makers are. Wouldn't be long for the trouble to be stamped out.........
To find volunteers for monitoring trouble would maybe be for the club to offer incentives like half price or free seaon tickets

The_Todd
12-08-2009, 05:00 PM
It's very sad and mostly embarrassing that this animosity still exists in the game. Hibs are guilty of it as are Hearts,Aberdeen,Celtic,Rangers and many English clubs. Most teams with a decent following will have a small percentage of fans acting this way. If this is a sign that the violence will escalate this season then something really needs to be done.

An idea to resolve th problem would be for the club(and all clubs) to appoint a number of loyal fans who have been pre-qalified to be responsible upstanding Hibbys. To have them spread out amongst the crowd during match games and anyone seen initiating trouble will be removed from ground via The "Hibby police" and The police working together. That appointed Hibby(acting like a police fan)has the power(given by the club) to give the police acknowledgement of who the guilty fan is. After a few games or so it would be apparent to "Hibby police" and club who the trouble makers are. Wouldn't be long for the trouble to be stamped out.........
To find volunteers for monitoring trouble would maybe be for the club to offer incentives like half price or free seaon tickets

As good an idea as that might be, the trouble occured almost entirely away from the stadium. I don't think volunteers inside the stadium will be much use against the organised hooligan firms - much better left in the hands of the police.

MUSSI LEE
12-08-2009, 05:06 PM
These comments are just not true. The idea that there is some sort of homogeniuos casual is nonsense.
I know a lot of the old Hibs boys, the vast majority who, thankfully, have grown out of it but a handful who are still dafties.
Within their ranks (in a way that probobly mirrors our whole support) there are a number who are absolute Hibs fanatics, to those who dont really care that much.
Of those who are casuals, some do it because they are total Hibs diehards (albeit misguided), some do it for the identity, some cause their mates do it, some for the danger, some purely for the violence just because they are downright evil barstewards, some for the cameraderie, some for the clothes/scene and the overwhelming majority because they are are a mixture of all the aforementioned reasons in varying degrees.

As for our 'reputation' down south. In my experience most english fans are at best oblivious to "scotch" football on a good day. Downright ignorant on a bad one. "Oh yeah, Hiberdeen of midlothian, they come from St Andrews dont they jock?"
Of the minority who do know their stuff on scottish fitba then they will know we are a decent sized club with a decent sized support who are part of a small clutch of clubs who occasionally threaten to challange the OF.
Of those who are into the hooley side of things they will know that our club has (or more had) a substantial casual element who have a fairly well deserved 'reputation' among their counterparts.
As such the events at bolton will, in the first case not even have registered amonst your commoner garden english fan.
In the second case the size of the support and the reasonable results will confirm our place as a good sized scottish club with a half decent team.
In the third case those who are into the casual scene will have their opinion of us as a club with a 'rep' as being confirmed.

So as far as our reputaion is concerned i dont think it will have been deminished, enhanced or affected in the least.
In short i wouldn't waste a moment worrying about it. Nobody else is.:top marks:thumbsup:

capitals_finest
12-08-2009, 06:20 PM
These comments are just not true. The idea that there is some sort of homogeniuos casual is nonsense.
I know a lot of the old Hibs boys, the vast majority who, thankfully, have grown out of it but a handful who are still dafties.
Within their ranks (in a way that probobly mirrors our whole support) there are a number who are absolute Hibs fanatics, to those who dont really care that much.
Of those who are casuals, some do it because they are total Hibs diehards (albeit misguided), some do it for the identity, some cause their mates do it, some for the danger, some purely for the violence just because they are downright evil barstewards, some for the cameraderie, some for the clothes/scene and the overwhelming majority because they are are a mixture of all the aforementioned reasons in varying degrees.

As for our 'reputation' down south. In my experience most english fans are at best oblivious to "scotch" football on a good day. Downright ignorant on a bad one. "Oh yeah, Hiberdeen of midlothian, they come from St Andrews dont they jock?"
Of the minority who do know their stuff on scottish fitba then they will know we are a decent sized club with a decent sized support who are part of a small clutch of clubs who occasionally threaten to challange the OF.
Of those who are into the hooley side of things they will know that our club has (or more had) a substantial casual element who have a fairly well deserved 'reputation' among their counterparts.
As such the events at bolton will, in the first case not even have registered amonst your commoner garden english fan.
In the second case the size of the support and the reasonable results will confirm our place as a good sized scottish club with a half decent team.
In the third case those who are into the casual scene will have their opinion of us as a club with a 'rep' as being confirmed.

So as far as our reputaion is concerned i dont think it will have been deminished, enhanced or affected in the least.
In short i wouldn't waste a moment worrying about it. Nobody else is.


As said about 10 times now great post :thumbsup:. For someone to doubt that there are any 'genuine hibs fans' involved in the trouble clearly doesn't know any of the people involved or has been avoiding games for the last 25 years.

Reputation tarnished? Calm down. :bitchy:

BravestHibs
12-08-2009, 10:06 PM
It's very sad and mostly embarrassing that this animosity still exists in the game. Hibs are guilty of it as are Hearts,Aberdeen,Celtic,Rangers and many English clubs. Most teams with a decent following will have a small percentage of fans acting this way. If this is a sign that the violence will escalate this season then something really needs to be done.

An idea to resolve th problem would be for the club(and all clubs) to appoint a number of loyal fans who have been pre-qalified to be responsible upstanding Hibbys. To have them spread out amongst the crowd during match games and anyone seen initiating trouble will be removed from ground via The "Hibby police" and The police working together. That appointed Hibby(acting like a police fan)has the power(given by the club) to give the police acknowledgement of who the guilty fan is. After a few games or so it would be apparent to "Hibby police" and club who the trouble makers are. Wouldn't be long for the trouble to be stamped out.........
To find volunteers for monitoring trouble would maybe be for the club to offer incentives like half price or free seaon tickets

Paid Police Informants in the crowd. That should give Hibs a good reputation.

hibs0666
12-08-2009, 10:17 PM
So as far as our reputaion is concerned i dont think it will have been deminished, enhanced or affected in the least.
In short i wouldn't waste a moment worrying about it. Nobody else is.

This is not about our reputation, it is about the men, women and children whose day out shopping was ruined as they had to endure the frightening antics of a few no-marks.

Just because our football club happened to be in town.

RigRoars
12-08-2009, 10:22 PM
This is not about our reputation,:confused:


Thread title.

Excellent post sadtom.

CABBAGE & RIBS
13-08-2009, 12:16 AM
It's very sad and mostly embarrassing that this animosity still exists in the game. Hibs are guilty of it as are Hearts,Aberdeen,Celtic,Rangers and many English clubs. Most teams with a decent following will have a small percentage of fans acting this way. If this is a sign that the violence will escalate this season then something really needs to be done.

An idea to resolve th problem would be for the club(and all clubs) to appoint a number of loyal fans who have been pre-qalified to be responsible upstanding Hibbys. To have them spread out amongst the crowd during match games and anyone seen initiating trouble will be removed from ground via The "Hibby police" and The police working together. That appointed Hibby(acting like a police fan)has the power(given by the club) to give the police acknowledgement of who the guilty fan is. After a few games or so it would be apparent to "Hibby police" and club who the trouble makers are. Wouldn't be long for the trouble to be stamped out.........
To find volunteers for monitoring trouble would maybe be for the club to offer incentives like half price or free seaon tickets


Would you do it.

VegasHibby
13-08-2009, 12:56 AM
Would you do it.

No I wouldn't do it. No interest. But I bet out of 13 to 14 thousand Hibees you could find 30 or 40 volunteers. Maybe fans who bring kids along and have a different perspective on safety at matches......

VegasHibby
13-08-2009, 01:09 AM
Paid Police Informants in the crowd. That should give Hibs a good reputation.

As opposed to a bad reputation with hooligans picking on old age pensioners ?

CABBAGE & RIBS
13-08-2009, 01:23 AM
As opposed to a bad reputation with hooligans picking on old age pensioners ?

Tbh i'm sure the plod know who the trouble makers are and don't need "hibby grasses"

Why suggest things like that if you wouldn't do it yourself tho.

Brizo
13-08-2009, 06:27 AM
It's very sad and mostly embarrassing that this animosity still exists in the game. Hibs are guilty of it as are Hearts,Aberdeen,Celtic,Rangers and many English clubs. Most teams with a decent following will have a small percentage of fans acting this way. If this is a sign that the violence will escalate this season then something really needs to be done.

An idea to resolve th problem would be for the club(and all clubs) to appoint a number of loyal fans who have been pre-qalified to be responsible upstanding Hibbys. To have them spread out amongst the crowd during match games and anyone seen initiating trouble will be removed from ground via The "Hibby police" and The police working together. That appointed Hibby(acting like a police fan)has the power(given by the club) to give the police acknowledgement of who the guilty fan is. After a few games or so it would be apparent to "Hibby police" and club who the trouble makers are. Wouldn't be long for the trouble to be stamped out.........
To find volunteers for monitoring trouble would maybe be for the club to offer incentives like half price or free seaon tickets

If anyone thinks im gonna stand in the East whistling message in a bottle while doing some radge hat swapping dance with my mates then theyre having a laugh. I ****** hate that tosspot Sting.

VegasHibby
13-08-2009, 07:13 AM
Tbh i'm sure the plod know who the trouble makers are and don't need "hibby grasses"

Why suggest things like that if you wouldn't do it yourself tho.


Don't quite understand your question. The world is full of people who create or suggest ideas that they don't necessarily carry out themselves. It's called designating. Rather like a C.E.O. would do with his employees or a football manager would do with his players as an example.

bighairyfaeleith
13-08-2009, 07:20 AM
Don't quite understand your question. The world is full of people who create or suggest ideas that they don't necessarily carry out themselves. It's called designating. Rather like a C.E.O. would do with his employees or a football manager would do with his players as an example.

aye but your no oor boss :greengrin

Dashing Bob S
13-08-2009, 07:51 AM
Don't quite understand your question. The world is full of people who create or suggest ideas that they don't necessarily carry out themselves. It's called designating. Rather like a C.E.O. would do with his employees or a football manager would do with his players as an example.

Seems too me it's called encouraging people to grass other's up without being prepared to face the likely consequences yourself.

What about rallying Hibs kids to take a cue from the Hitler youth and inform on their parents?

bighairyfaeleith
13-08-2009, 07:53 AM
Seems too me it's called encouraging people to grass other's up without being prepared to face the likely consequences yourself.

What about rallying Hibs kids to take a cue from the Hitler youth and inform on their parents?

I think hearts have beaten us to that already. FFS Petrie :grr:

Dashing Bob S
13-08-2009, 08:02 AM
I think hearts have beaten us to that already. FFS Petrie :grr:

He'll get up to speed. Knew that tache remind me of someone...

RIP
13-08-2009, 08:04 AM
I know a lot of the old Hibs boys, the vast majority who, thankfully, have grown out of it but a handful who are still dafties. Within their ranks (in a way that probobly mirrors our whole support) there are a number who are absolute Hibs fanatics, to those who dont really care that much.

Of those who are casuals, some do it because they are total Hibs diehards (albeit misguided), some do it for the identity, some cause their mates do it, some for the danger, some purely for the violence just because they are downright evil barstewards, some for the cameraderie, some for the clothes/scene and the overwhelming majority because they are are a mixture of all the aforementioned reasons in varying degrees.


For someone to doubt that there are any 'genuine hibs fans' involved in the trouble clearly doesn't know any of the people involved .

I don't know any of the people involved but some clearly do.

It's laughable that middle aged men can still enjoy being referred to as 'Hibs Boys' :faf:

Some may thaink they are genuine Hibs fans but I don't think there's any doubt they are all pathetic individuals. Locked in their own sad wee world of past 'glories' - Peter Pans who refuse to grow up.

It's 2009 and football is now a family spectator sport. Get these dinosaurs tae **** away from the club!

marinello59
13-08-2009, 08:10 AM
It's 2009 and football is now a family spectator sport.

:agree: And all the better for it.

Dashing Bob S
13-08-2009, 08:22 AM
I don't know any of the people involved but some clearly do.

It's laughable that middle aged men can still enjoy being referred to as 'Hibs Boys' :faf:

Some may thaink they are genuine Hibs fans but I don't think there's any doubt they are all pathetic individuals. Locked in their own sad wee world of past 'glories' - Peter Pans who refuse to grow up.

It's 2009 and football is now a family spectator sport. Get these dinosaurs tae **** away from the club!

Yes. And the ones who would abuse visiting supporters from England who've come up and spent their hard-earned money attending the corresponding fixture a couple of seasons back.

BravestHibs
13-08-2009, 08:26 AM
As opposed to a bad reputation with hooligans picking on old age pensioners ?

I don't follow you? Are you saying that their mission wasn't to fight Bolton fans but rather to trawl the old folk homes of the North West stealing family heirlooms and the like?

Source?

marinello59
13-08-2009, 08:29 AM
I don't follow you? Are you saying that their mission wasn't to fight Bolton fans but rather to trawl the old folk homes of the North West stealing family heirlooms and the like?

Source?

Would the first mission be acceptable then?

capitals_finest
13-08-2009, 08:36 AM
I don't know any of the people involved but some clearly do.

It's laughable that middle aged men can still enjoy being referred to as 'Hibs Boys' :faf:

Some may thaink they are genuine Hibs fans but I don't think there's any doubt they are all pathetic individuals. Locked in their own sad wee world of past 'glories' - Peter Pans who refuse to grow up.

It's 2009 and football is now a family spectator sport. Get these dinosaurs tae **** away from the club!

Pathetic individuals maybe but many of the hibs casuals (and by that i include 'ex-casuals') are amongst the most loyal of our support. I know one 'hibs boy'... :wink: that has his whole house green and white, or did have a wee while back anyway.

We are a club that has strong connections to the casual scene and that will be difficult to get rid of whether you like it or not. There will be hundreds and hundreds of supporters that attend matches every week that will have been a casual at some point. I m not saying its a good thing but i d rather be connected with the casuals than with having a sectarian/racist connection associated with rangers, celtic and hearts.

BravestHibs
13-08-2009, 08:44 AM
Would the first mission be acceptable then?

That's not what I'm saying as I'm sure you're aware. My point is that instead of scaremongering and making things up we should at least be sticking to the second, third and fourth hand information we've relying on up til now. There's been countless people saying that this mob have been targetting women and children and now pensioners. The only vulnerable group that hasn't been targetted so far is people with disabilities. My problem is with the word 'targetted', like the entire point of a hooligan element is to go out and batter kids/pensioners/women, when we all know, whatever you may think of hooligans and the trouble that flared at the weekend, that this just isn't true. The only anecdotal evidence I've read involving anyone threatening kids was a bolton fan yet it appears to be Hibs fans alone who were guilty of this. It just seems like people would rather it was Hibs fans who were guilty of this type of thing.

johnrebus
13-08-2009, 08:50 AM
Pathetic individuals maybe but many of the hibs casuals (and by that i include 'ex-casuals') are amongst the most loyal of our support. I know one 'hibs boy'... :wink: that has his whole house green and white, or did have a wee while back anyway.

We are a club that has strong connections to the casual scene and that will be difficult to get rid of whether you like it or not. There will be hundreds and hundreds of supporters that attend matches every week that will have been a casual at some point. I m not saying its a good thing but i d rather be connected with the casuals than with having a sectarian/racist connection associated with rangers, celtic and hearts.


Hundreds and hundreds ?

My own dim memory of the eighties reminds me of a few a dozen half wits who needed ( and obviously still do ) their brains tested.

I find it pretty sad that selected people on here look at the past actions of the casuals with rose tinted nostalgia, and seem to be proud of the fact that Hibernian - or its fans - were looked upon as being something special because of those clowns.

If it was a choice of being a casual or a hun/tim, then I would rather be found in Tesco on a Saturday afterrnoon.


:boo hoo:

marinello59
13-08-2009, 08:54 AM
That's not what I'm saying as I'm sure you're aware. My point is that instead of scaremongering and making things up we should at least be sticking to the second, third and fourth hand information we've relying on up til now. There's been countless people saying that this mob have been targetting women and children and now pensioners. The only vulnerable group that hasn't been targetted so far is people with disabilities. My problem is with the word 'targetted', like the entire point of a hooligan element is to go out and batter kids/pensioners/women, when we all know, whatever you may think of hooligans and the trouble that flared at the weekend, that this just isn't true. The only anecdotal evidence I've read involving anyone threatening kids was a bolton fan yet it appears to be Hibs fans alone who were guilty of this. It just seems like people would rather it was Hibs fans who were guilty of this type of thing.

Thank you for answering several questions that I didn't ask:greengrin
In the interests of brevity could you please answer the simple question that I did ask.

(As an aside you certainly do have a problem with the word 'targeted.' :wink:)

BravestHibs
13-08-2009, 08:59 AM
Thank you for answering several questions that I didn't ask:greengrin
In the interests of brevity could you please answer the simple question that I did ask.

(As an aside you certainly do have a problem with the word 'targeted.' :wink:)

And so it seems, do you, with the word 'BravestHibs':wink:

For what it's worth here have been several oppurtunities for me to pick up on your spelling too. Perhaps thats what we should all be focusing on. A kind of dictionary corner style self policing.

marinello59
13-08-2009, 09:02 AM
And so it seems, do you, with the word 'BravestHibs':wink:

For what it's worth here have been several oppurtunities for me to pick up on your spelling too. Perhaps thats what we should all be focusing on. A kind of dictionary corner style self policing.

My speeling and gramar is appaling. Feel free to atac.:greengrin

And the answer to my question?

--------
13-08-2009, 09:16 AM
I don't follow you? Are you saying that their mission wasn't to fight Bolton fans but rather to trawl the old folk homes of the North West stealing family heirlooms and the like?

Source?

They were on a MISSION?

"Your mission, should you choose to accept it, is to go down to Bolton and make a total idiot of yourself scaring the living daylights out of innocent bystanders out for an afternoon's shopping?"

Brings new meaning to the expression "The A-team"....



Pathetic individuals maybe but many of the hibs casuals (and by that i include 'ex-casuals') are amongst the most loyal of our support. I know one 'hibs boy'... :wink: that has his whole house green and white, or did have a wee while back anyway.

We are a club that has strong connections to the casual scene and that will be difficult to get rid of whether you like it or not. There will be hundreds and hundreds of supporters that attend matches every week that will have been a casual at some point. I m not saying its a good thing but i d rather be connected with the casuals than with having a sectarian/racist connection associated with rangers, celtic and hearts.

Sorry, but anyone who has his whole house painted green-and-white (was that inside and out, or only inside, or was it a white house with green doors and windows and .... never mind) needs to ask a few questions of himself.

We shouldn't be presented with either/or, sectarian/casual associations. Football is a sport (or it was the last time I looked) and does not, should not, define anyone's identity. A match is supposed to be healthy outdoor exercise and entertainment, not some tribal rite of passage where 'our boys' (translation, fat guys with beer guts) prove they're 'harder and tougher' (translation, thicker and nastier) than the other lot, regardless of who else gets hurt or even killed in the process.

I came away from too many games in the 1960's and 70's scared stiff and just glad to still be in one piece (by the '80's I'd learned sense and stayed away from the big games) to want to repeat the experience now.

RIP
13-08-2009, 09:16 AM
Yes. And the ones who would abuse visiting supporters from England who've come up and spent their hard-earned money attending the corresponding fixture a couple of seasons back.

If that's a sideways swipe at me Sir Bob - please consider that I was berating the fat little englunders I encountered in a certain hostelrly on a visit to my old Easter Road stamping ground and not the good people of Bolton nor their loyal football fans. These guys reeked of BNP casual and the couple of songs I heard did nothing to refute that accusation.

They thought they were a real presence at Hibs - must have been pretty sick to see 2,500 of us turning up last weekend.:greengrin

BravestHibs
13-08-2009, 09:33 AM
That's not what I'm saying as I'm sure you're aware. My point is that instead of scaremongering and making things up we should at least be sticking to the second, third and fourth hand information we've relying on up til now. There's been countless people saying that this mob have been targetting women and children and now pensioners. The only vulnerable group that hasn't been targetted so far is people with disabilities. My problem is with the word 'targetted', like the entire point of a hooligan element is to go out and batter kids/pensioners/women, when we all know, whatever you may think of hooligans and the trouble that flared at the weekend, that this just isn't true. The only anecdotal evidence I've read involving anyone threatening kids was a bolton fan yet it appears to be Hibs fans alone who were guilty of this. It just seems like people would rather it was Hibs fans who were guilty of this type of thing.

My answer to your question is clearly highlighted. It was in my post the first time you asked as well. Do you do any more than skim read? The reason I ask is because this isn't the first of my posts on this thread you've misunderstood.

BravestHibs
13-08-2009, 09:40 AM
They were on a MISSION?

"Your mission, should you choose to accept it, is to go down to Bolton and make a total idiot of yourself scaring the living daylights out of innocent bystanders out for an afternoon's shopping?"

Brings new meaning to the expression "The A-team"....

Clever and funny. I bet you're charismatic in person too. The holy trinity of entertainment.

marinello59
13-08-2009, 09:41 AM
My answer to your question is clearly highlighted. It was in my post the first time you asked as well. Do you do any more than skim read? The reason I ask is because this isn't the first of my posts on this thread you've misunderstood.


"That's not what I'm saying as I'm sure you're aware."
Sorry, that still doesn't really give a yes or no answer does it? (I need simple answers cos i is fick.:agree:)

BravestHibs
13-08-2009, 09:48 AM
"That's not what I'm saying as I'm sure you're aware."
Sorry, that still doesn't really give a yes or no answer does it? (I need simple answers cos i is fick.:agree:)

Clearly.

Am I not allowed to answer a question without the words yes and no being involved?

J-C
13-08-2009, 09:50 AM
It seems to me that there are certain posters on here who look up to the old "casuals" as some kind of heroes ready and willing to get of their lard asses, wipe down their beer bellies and relive the bad old days of the 80's.

Lets just go the whole hog and invite Milwall, Leeds etc next pre-season and have a jolly good ruck in the middle of Easter Rd, scare the beejesus out of all the locals, cause thousamds of pounds of damage and give the Er at the Royal a lot of work to do, stitching up razor cuts etc.

marinello59
13-08-2009, 09:54 AM
Clearly.

Am I not allowed to answer a question without the words yes and no being involved?

It's a simple question from a simple football fan.:agree:
Would it be acceptable for Hibs fans to travel to an away game with the intention of fighting with rival fans? Surely you can come down to my level just this once and provide an unequivocal answer?

BravestHibs
13-08-2009, 10:01 AM
It's a simple question from a simple football fan.:agree:
Would it be acceptable for Hibs fans to travel to an away game with the intention of fighting with rival fans? Surely you can come down to my level just this once and provide an unequivocal answer?

It just makes me wonder why you're pushing so hard for me to say yes or no when I've already answered in the negative. All it makes me want to do is not give you the satisfaction.

You're also clearly sarcastically insinuating that I feel that I'm above you, if that's the way you feel then that's on you not me. Why not just let it all out and say what you really mean instead of adopting this passive aggressive tone you sem to be so fond of?

marinello59
13-08-2009, 10:06 AM
It just makes me wonder why you're pushing so hard for me to say yes or no when I've already answered in the negative. All it makes me want to do is not give you the satisfaction.
You're also clearly sarcastically insinuating that I feel that I'm above you, if that's the way you feel then that's on you not me. Why not just let it all out and say what you really mean instead of adopting this passive aggressive tone you sem to be so fond of?

:faf:
I give up. You are handing out a masterclass in evasion and distortion. You are not a politician are you?

--------
13-08-2009, 10:23 AM
They were on a MISSION?

"Your mission, should you choose to accept it, is to go down to Bolton and make a total idiot of yourself scaring the living daylights out of innocent bystanders out for an afternoon's shopping?"

Brings new meaning to the expression "The A-team"....

Clever and funny. I bet you're charismatic in person too. The holy trinity of entertainment.


Oh, I am. Folks come from miles around to bask in my charisma. 'Let's go and bask in Doddie's charisma,' they say. :devil:

They weren't on a mission.

They weren't the SAS or the crew of the starship Enterprise.

They were hooligans out to cause trouble. They didn't care who happened to be in their way, they didn't care who else got hurt or scared, so don't dignify what they were doing by calling it a 'mission'.

BravestHibs
13-08-2009, 10:33 AM
They weren't on a mission.

They weren't the SAS or the crew of the starship Enterprise.

They were hooligans out to cause trouble. They didn't care who happened to be in their way, they didn't care who else got hurt or scared, so don't dignify what they were doing by calling it a 'mission'

You seem to be making an awful big deal over one word in a sentence. Taken completely out of context I might add. If you remember, although you seem to enjoy conveniently forgetting things so that they fit in with your pious, morally superior stance on this topic, the context it was used in was written in a very obviously sarcastic tone. I'll refresh your memory:

"Are you saying that their mission wasn't to fight Bolton fans but rather to trawl the old folk homes of the North West stealing family heirlooms and the like?"

I honestly don't know why you're shreeking about the word mission in such a fashion. It appears you may have had trouble understanding my point.

Jones28
13-08-2009, 10:44 AM
Well said, we get invited down to Bolton for a testamonial game and a few with too much bevvy in them think it's a good idea to have a wee go at their supporters. Come on now, we are better than that surely :confused:

The majority of us certainley are better than that but a small percentage of Hibs fans seem to think that it's their job to tarnish the reputation not only of Hibernian but other Scottish clubs who travel down south to play in friendlies etc.

The Huns in Manchester is a different story altogether as it certainly was'nt a small minority of supporters, TV pictures proving this.

It is a disgrace and a wee bit of this reputation seems to have stemmed from the Casual days in the 80's.

--------
13-08-2009, 10:54 AM
They weren't on a mission.

They weren't the SAS or the crew of the starship Enterprise.

They were hooligans out to cause trouble. They didn't care who happened to be in their way, they didn't care who else got hurt or scared, so don't dignify what they were doing by calling it a 'mission'

You seem to be making an awful big deal over one word in a sentence. Taken completely out of context I might add. If you remember, although you seem to enjoy conveniently forgetting things so that they fit in with your pious, morally superior stance on this topic, the context it was used in was written in a very obviously sarcastic tone. I'll refresh your memory:

"Are you saying that their mission wasn't to fight Bolton fans but rather to trawl the old folk homes of the North West stealing family heirlooms and the like?"

I honestly don't know why you're shreeking about the word mission in such a fashion. It appears you may have had trouble understanding my point.


I'm not taking anything out of context. 'Mission' is a word applied to military forces fighting their country's enemies, not to drunken hooligans terrorising women and children.

I haven't forgotten anything - conveniently or inconveniently, to you or to myself, I might add - and if disapproving of violent behaviour at and around football matches is a pious, morally superior stance, then so be it. I plead guilty. I totally disapprove of such behaviour.

I have no trouble understanding that you appear to approve of people wearing Hibs colours going to Hibs matches with the firm intention of getting into fights with opposing supporters. You've been asked repeatedly if that in fact is your position, but you haven't answered the question yet.

Do you approve of people wearing Hibs colours going to Hibs matches with the firm intention of getting into fights with opposing supporters?

Dashing Bob S
13-08-2009, 11:40 AM
If that's a sideways swipe at me Sir Bob - please consider that I was berating the fat little englunders I encountered in a certain hostelrly on a visit to my old Easter Road stamping ground and not the good people of Bolton nor their loyal football fans. These guys reeked of BNP casual and the couple of songs I heard did nothing to refute that accusation.

They thought they were a real presence at Hibs - must have been pretty sick to see 2,500 of us turning up last weekend.:greengrin

Sorry about that, totally understand now that you've put it in context. I was a tad nippy as I met a couple of very nice Boltonians at the 3-0 game who didn't correspond to your description and were a credit to their club.

BravestHibs
13-08-2009, 11:45 AM
I'm not taking anything out of context. 'Mission' is a word applied to military forces fighting their country's enemies, not to drunken hooligans terrorising women and children.

I haven't forgotten anything - conveniently or inconveniently, to you or to myself, I might add - and if disapproving of violent behaviour at and around football matches is a pious, morally superior stance, then so be it. I plead guilty. I totally disapprove of such behaviour.

I have no trouble understanding that you appear to approve of people wearing Hibs colours going to Hibs matches with the firm intention of getting into fights with opposing supporters. You've been asked repeatedly if that in fact is your position, but you haven't answered the question yet.

Do you approve of people wearing Hibs colours going to Hibs matches with the firm intention of getting into fights with opposing supporters?

Are you and Marinello in fact the same person? If I'd wanted to say that I would have said it. The fact that you and Marinello seem to be so keen on making me say it, serves only to makes me think that you two are in fact L&Bs finest both partaking in a clumsy sting operation. The only thing I've said is that I think all this moral posturing is pathetic. Hope this clarifies my position for you.

--------
13-08-2009, 11:50 AM
I'd like to see where I said that I approved of the fighting? Perhaps you could highlight where I've said that? The only thing I've said is that I think all this moral posturing is pathetic. Clear enough for you?

So you DISAPPROVE of people wearing Hibs colours going to Hibs matches with the intention of getting into fights with opposing supporters? :cool2:

Danderhall Hibs
13-08-2009, 11:52 AM
So you DISAPPROVE of people wearing Hibs colours going to Hibs matches with the intention of getting into fights with opposing supporters? :cool2:

FFS! :rolleyes:

BravestHibs
13-08-2009, 11:59 AM
So you DISAPPROVE of people wearing Hibs colours going to Hibs matches with the intention of getting into fights with opposing supporters? :cool2:

Sssshhhh. There, there. Everything's going to be fine.

--------
13-08-2009, 12:00 PM
Sssshhhh. There, there. Everything's going to be fine.


Still no answer. :bitchy:

BravestHibs
13-08-2009, 12:02 PM
Still no answer. :bitchy:

Read my edited post, this is entrapment officer.

marinello59
13-08-2009, 12:04 PM
Are you and Marinello in fact the same person? If I'd wanted to say that I would have said it. The fact that you and Marinello seem to be so keen on making me say it, serves only to makes me think that you two are in fact L&Bs finest both partaking in a clumsy sting operation. The only thing I've said is that I think all this moral posturing is pathetic. Hope this clarifies my position for you.

:greengrin. Now that IS funny.

sadtom
13-08-2009, 12:08 PM
I don't know any of the people involved but some clearly do.

It's laughable that middle aged men can still enjoy being referred to as 'Hibs Boys' :faf:

Some may thaink they are genuine Hibs fans but I don't think there's any doubt they are all pathetic individuals. Locked in their own sad wee world of past 'glories' - Peter Pans who refuse to grow up.

It's 2009 and football is now a family spectator sport. Get these dinosaurs tae **** away from the club!

You have not got the gist of my last post. However reprehensible you think they are, they ARE genuine fans.

Fistly the term 'boy' is exactly that a term for identification, I cant imagine that any actually believe they are in their teens (come to think of it perhaps 1 or 2...:bitchy:)
In new york a 'wise guy' would probably not be in mensa. Neither would you be expected to be confronted with a bunch of pre-teens in 1960's london, if the kray's said they would 'send the boys round'. Its a moot point.

Lets turn this on its head. In the eyes of a casual, given that the history of the club is one where we've faced down violence, hostility and general opposition in order to be exist. They may perhaps view those who used to hide their colours, when the marauding weedjie hordes took over the place, pi$$ing everywhere and spewing their filth. Or the supporters buses whose conveners instructed 'scarfs off' when passing through a town or approaching an away ground, as cowards and not 'real' Hibs fans.
I think this would be just as big a misnomer as those who infer that those who fight at football are not genuine.
In a support numbering 10's of thousands its going to take all sorts.

Of the original 80's casuals there are probably 3 types
'Casual junkies' the ones who have remained absorbed in the scene for approx 25 years, who seem unable or unwilling to distance themselves from the shenanagins. They appear to number a couple of dozen.
'Cashieholics' who recognised their 'addiction' and choose to completely abstain and as such are no longer involved. Lastly the 'recreational users' who may occasionally 'turn out' for big events (bolton/leeds etc), again for reasons best known to themselves. A bout of nostalgie? A perceived threat? Hoolies re-united???:dunno:
You are wrong to suggest that these guy don't go to ER, its just that most of the time they dont attend anymore in that 'context'.

Having flirted with it as a youth, but who soon decided to follow another path, i agree there is something a bit desperate about seeing middle aged men swaggering about the joint. Its not a good look and i would suggest its time to move on and do something else.
I would also add, that looking at 40,50,60 year old Rick Waller-a-likes being shoe horned into a replica strip is also pretty sad and is equally as bad a look. (This also applies to the TA cliches who wander about looking like shortbread tins.)
I choose to do neither.

Just like our support at large, casuals vary from totally dedicated/passionate to fairweather in their support of the club.
To argue who are real/genuine or not is completely futile. There is no, REPEAT NO direct correlation between casual/non casual fans and their love of Hibs, its absolutely an individual thing.
Lazy generalisations deminish your argument and wont help resolve the problem.
Pro rata, casuals, whether you like it or not, are just as passionate, commited and dedicated as any other fans...thatsasfactjack!

I'd rather it didn't happen, if it has to, i'd rather it happened away from those who dont want to be involved.
Its not my cup of Java, though i would fight my corner if confronted with it.

MUSSI LEE
13-08-2009, 12:13 PM
Are you and Marinello in fact the same person? If I'd wanted to say that I would have said it. The fact that you and Marinello seem to be so keen on making me say it, serves only to makes me think that you two are in fact L&Bs finest both partaking in a clumsy sting operation. The only thing I've said is that I think all this moral posturing is pathetic. Hope this clarifies my position for you.:faf:

bawheid
13-08-2009, 12:21 PM
FFS! :rolleyes:

:agree:

sahib
13-08-2009, 12:29 PM
You have not got the gist of my last post. However reprehensible you think they are, they ARE genuine fans.

Fistly the term 'boy' is exactly that a term for identification, I cant imagine that any actually believe they are in their teens (come to think of it perhaps 1 or 2...:bitchy:)
In new york a 'wise guy' would probably not be in mensa. Neither would you be expected to be confronted with a bunch of pre-teens in 1960's london, if the kray's said they would 'send the boys round'. Its a moot point.

Lets turn this on its head. In the eyes of a casual, given that the history of the club is one where we've faced down violence, hostility and general opposition in order to be exist. They may perhaps view those who used to hide their colours, when the marauding weedjie hordes took over the place, pi$$ing everywhere and spewing their filth. Or the supporters buses whose conveners instructed 'scarfs off' when passing through a town or approaching an away ground, as cowards and not 'real' Hibs fans.
I think this would be just as big a misnomer as those who infer that those who fight at football are not genuine.
In a support numbering 10's of thousands its going to take all sorts.

Of the original 80's casuals there are probably 3 types
'Casual junkies' the ones who have remained absorbed in the scene for approx 25 years, who seem unable or unwilling to distance themselves from the shenanagins. They appear to number a couple of dozen.
'Cashieholics' who recognised their 'addiction' and choose to completely abstain and as such are no longer involved. Lastly the 'recreational users' who may occasionally 'turn out' for big events (bolton/leeds etc), again for reasons best known to themselves. A bout of nostalgie? A perceived threat? Hoolies re-united???:dunno:
You are wrong to suggest that these guy don't go to ER, its just that most of the time they dont attend anymore in that 'context'.

Having flirted with it as a youth, but who soon decided to follow another path, i agree there is something a bit desperate about seeing middle aged men swaggering about the joint. Its not a good look and i would suggest its time to move on and do something else.
I would also add, that looking at 40,50,60 year old Rick Waller-a-likes being shoe horned into a replica strip is also pretty sad and is equally as bad a look. (This also applies to the TA cliches who wander about looking like shortbread tins.)
I choose to do neither.

Just like our support at large, casuals vary from totally dedicated/passionate to fairweather in their support of the club.
To argue who are real/genuine or not is completely futile. There is no, REPEAT NO direct correlation between casual/non casual fans and their love of Hibs, its absolutely an individual thing.
Lazy generalisations deminish your argument and wont help resolve the problem.
Pro rata, casuals, whether you like it or not, are just as passionate, commited and dedicated as any other fans...thatsasfactjack!

I'd rather it didn't happen, if it has to, i'd rather it happened away from those who dont want to be involved.
Its not my cup of Java, though i would fight my corner if confronted with it.

What a lot of ageist nonsense. The criminal behavior (i.e assault, threatening behavior, mobbing and rioting, criminal damage and generally scaring innocent bystanders ) is the issue. Whether they have made an unfortunate fashion decision by wearing replica strips is, surely, neither here nor there.

capitals_finest
13-08-2009, 12:31 PM
They were on a MISSION?

"Your mission, should you choose to accept it, is to go down to Bolton and make a total idiot of yourself scaring the living daylights out of innocent bystanders out for an afternoon's shopping?"

Brings new meaning to the expression "The A-team"....




Sorry, but anyone who has his whole house painted green-and-white (was that inside and out, or only inside, or was it a white house with green doors and windows and .... never mind) needs to ask a few questions of himself.

We shouldn't be presented with either/or, sectarian/casual associations. Football is a sport (or it was the last time I looked) and does not, should not, define anyone's identity. A match is supposed to be healthy outdoor exercise and entertainment, not some tribal rite of passage where 'our boys' (translation, fat guys with beer guts) prove they're 'harder and tougher' (translation, thicker and nastier) than the other lot, regardless of who else gets hurt or even killed in the process.

I came away from too many games in the 1960's and 70's scared stiff and just glad to still be in one piece (by the '80's I'd learned sense and stayed away from the big games) to want to repeat the experience now.

Equally you could say anyone that has posted over 14 000 messages on an internet forum needs to ask themselves a few questions. :tin hat: The point i was making is that many of the hibs casuals are just as fanatical as any scarf wearing fan.

--------
13-08-2009, 12:46 PM
Are you and Marinello in fact the same person? If I'd wanted to say that I would have said it. The fact that you and Marinello seem to be so keen on making me say it, serves only to makes me think that you two are in fact L&Bs finest both partaking in a clumsy sting operation. The only thing I've said is that I think all this moral posturing is pathetic. Hope this clarifies my position for you.



I don't know whether that's an insult to him, an insult to me, an insult to both of us, or an insult to neither. Have to think about it. :devil:


"Equally you could say anyone that has posted over 14 000 messages on an internet forum needs to ask themselves a few questions. :tin hat: The point i was making is that many of the hibs casuals are just as fanatical as any scarf wearing fan.@

Oops. CF, you're absolutely right. Mea culpa. I grovel.

Yup - I guess the only question is whther whatever we're doing, are we doing it in a place and at a time that hurts others, or only ourselves?

Which gets back to my initial point - that people looking for thrills or danger should be free to do so - but not to the endangerment or distress of non-thrill-seeking bystanders.

Fanatical they may be, but the hooligans damage the club they claim to support and endanger the people around them.

But you're right - someone painting his house green-and-white - that's his choice, and nothing to do with me. Apologies.

campberbwfc
13-08-2009, 12:50 PM
i think most people recognise that the vast majority of your support was excellent.

the fact is that the trouble although not 'major' was much more than you get at games these days.

if a club was thinking of inviting Hibs for a testimonial in England they would need to confirm details with local police. As a result of this trouble the police would insisit on more of them being there (on double time !!) and this extra cost would mean another team being invited.

Sad but true. Everyones knows that the incidents by the ground involved small number form both sides, but 'pleasent scottish people having a nice day out and having a civil time with their englsih counterparts' does not make it into the papers.

sadtom
13-08-2009, 01:00 PM
What a lot of ageist nonsense. The criminal behavior (i.e assault, threatening behavior, mobbing and rioting, criminal damage and generally scaring innocent bystanders ) is the issue. Whether they have made an unfortunate fashion decision by wearing replica strips is, surely, neither here nor there.

What are you slavering about. Ageist!!! Its several other posters who mentioned age.
Of course their behaviour is the issue. I'm not comparing violence to fashion choices.
My point is its not helpful to make plain wrong statements about being real or not, it wont resolve the situation.
Regarding the replica strips, my reply was to somone who was made a comment about middle aged men and was playing devils advocate because i know that casuals are, in there own way, 'embarrassed' by fans who are "christmas trees".
The point is that i dont feel the need to look like a diddy and go fighting, nor do i feel the need to look like a diddy and not go fighting, to know that i am a 'genuine' supporter. That there are choices to do neither.

Hibs Giant
13-08-2009, 01:29 PM
I like the sound of the Hibs police. They should have sunglasses, berets, motorbikes and truncheons. Patroling the streets, hassling the jambo underclass. They could escort our bus convoys on away days. Dishing out Hibs justice to opposition fans.

I'd sign up.

Dashing Bob S
13-08-2009, 02:32 PM
You have not got the gist of my last post. However reprehensible you think they are, they ARE genuine fans.

Fistly the term 'boy' is exactly that a term for identification, I cant imagine that any actually believe they are in their teens (come to think of it perhaps 1 or 2...:bitchy:)
In new york a 'wise guy' would probably not be in mensa. Neither would you be expected to be confronted with a bunch of pre-teens in 1960's london, if the kray's said they would 'send the boys round'. Its a moot point.

Lets turn this on its head. In the eyes of a casual, given that the history of the club is one where we've faced down violence, hostility and general opposition in order to be exist. They may perhaps view those who used to hide their colours, when the marauding weedjie hordes took over the place, pi$$ing everywhere and spewing their filth. Or the supporters buses whose conveners instructed 'scarfs off' when passing through a town or approaching an away ground, as cowards and not 'real' Hibs fans.
I think this would be just as big a misnomer as those who infer that those who fight at football are not genuine.
In a support numbering 10's of thousands its going to take all sorts.

Of the original 80's casuals there are probably 3 types
'Casual junkies' the ones who have remained absorbed in the scene for approx 25 years, who seem unable or unwilling to distance themselves from the shenanagins. They appear to number a couple of dozen.
'Cashieholics' who recognised their 'addiction' and choose to completely abstain and as such are no longer involved. Lastly the 'recreational users' who may occasionally 'turn out' for big events (bolton/leeds etc), again for reasons best known to themselves. A bout of nostalgie? A perceived threat? Hoolies re-united???:dunno:
You are wrong to suggest that these guy don't go to ER, its just that most of the time they dont attend anymore in that 'context'.

Having flirted with it as a youth, but who soon decided to follow another path, i agree there is something a bit desperate about seeing middle aged men swaggering about the joint. Its not a good look and i would suggest its time to move on and do something else.
I would also add, that looking at 40,50,60 year old Rick Waller-a-likes being shoe horned into a replica strip is also pretty sad and is equally as bad a look. (This also applies to the TA cliches who wander about looking like shortbread tins.)
I choose to do neither.

Just like our support at large, casuals vary from totally dedicated/passionate to fairweather in their support of the club.
To argue who are real/genuine or not is completely futile. There is no, REPEAT NO direct correlation between casual/non casual fans and their love of Hibs, its absolutely an individual thing.
Lazy generalisations deminish your argument and wont help resolve the problem.
Pro rata, casuals, whether you like it or not, are just as passionate, commited and dedicated as any other fans...thatsasfactjack!

I'd rather it didn't happen, if it has to, i'd rather it happened away from those who dont want to be involved.
Its not my cup of Java, though i would fight my corner if confronted with it.

Yet again, another true and accurate post on this subject. However misguided or plain nasty people feel that others who are violent at football games are, this mindless parrot of 'not true fans' is only media nonsense that has been adopted by sheep.

It's as ludicrous and unscientific as saying people with ginger hair are not true Hibs fans wheras people with black hair are genuine Hibs supporters. A propensity for aggro doesn't determine your level of support or passion for a club any more than your income, sexuality, education level etc etc. To suggest otherwise is clearly arrant nonsense.

RIP
13-08-2009, 03:04 PM
You have not got the gist of my last post. However reprehensible you think they are, they ARE genuine fans.

Fistly the term 'boy' is exactly that a term for identification, I cant imagine that any actually believe they are in their teens (come to think of it perhaps 1 or 2...:bitchy:)
In new york a 'wise guy' would probably not be in mensa. Neither would you be expected to be confronted with a bunch of pre-teens in 1960's london, if the kray's said they would 'send the boys round'. Its a moot point.

Lets turn this on its head. In the eyes of a casual, given that the history of the club is one where we've faced down violence, hostility and general opposition in order to be exist. They may perhaps view those who used to hide their colours, when the marauding weedjie hordes took over the place, pi$$ing everywhere and spewing their filth. Or the supporters buses whose conveners instructed 'scarfs off' when passing through a town or approaching an away ground, as cowards and not 'real' Hibs fans.
I think this would be just as big a misnomer as those who infer that those who fight at football are not genuine.
In a support numbering 10's of thousands its going to take all sorts.

Of the original 80's casuals there are probably 3 types
'Casual junkies' the ones who have remained absorbed in the scene for approx 25 years, who seem unable or unwilling to distance themselves from the shenanagins. They appear to number a couple of dozen.
'Cashieholics' who recognised their 'addiction' and choose to completely abstain and as such are no longer involved. Lastly the 'recreational users' who may occasionally 'turn out' for big events (bolton/leeds etc), again for reasons best known to themselves. A bout of nostalgie? A perceived threat? Hoolies re-united???:dunno:
You are wrong to suggest that these guy don't go to ER, its just that most of the time they dont attend anymore in that 'context'.

Having flirted with it as a youth, but who soon decided to follow another path, i agree there is something a bit desperate about seeing middle aged men swaggering about the joint. Its not a good look and i would suggest its time to move on and do something else.
I would also add, that looking at 40,50,60 year old Rick Waller-a-likes being shoe horned into a replica strip is also pretty sad and is equally as bad a look. (This also applies to the TA cliches who wander about looking like shortbread tins.)
I choose to do neither.

Just like our support at large, casuals vary from totally dedicated/passionate to fairweather in their support of the club.
To argue who are real/genuine or not is completely futile. There is no, REPEAT NO direct correlation between casual/non casual fans and their love of Hibs, its absolutely an individual thing.
Lazy generalisations deminish your argument and wont help resolve the problem.
Pro rata, casuals, whether you like it or not, are just as passionate, commited and dedicated as any other fans...thatsasfactjack!

I'd rather it didn't happen, if it has to, i'd rather it happened away from those who dont want to be involved.
Its not my cup of Java, though i would fight my corner if confronted with it.

Noble rhetoric my friend but I am going to let this posturing dissertation on the psyche of the casual in today's society fly straight past my head and back up your own backside - no offence intended.:wink:

I am simply saying that anyone who takes an interest in off-field violence at the expense of the game being played on the park is not in my view a Hibs fan. I happen to believe that the Hibs board and majority of fans would support the view that such dinosaurs are not welcome at Easter Road.

sadtom
13-08-2009, 04:34 PM
Noble rhetoric my friend but I am going to let this posturing dissertation on the psyche of the casual in today's society fly straight past my head and back up your own backside - no offence intended.:wink:

I am simply saying that anyone who takes an interest in off-field violence at the expense of the game being played on the park is not in my view a Hibs fan. I happen to believe that the Hibs board and majority of fans would support the view that such dinosaurs are not welcome at Easter Road.

Because i told the truth, or because it doesn't agree with your view?
I'm not to take offence when you tell me to stick my opinions up my backside. So what excuses you for being as smart ass and throwing insults my way? It seems at odds with your self righteous, pillar of the community facade.
There has been nothing insulting or offensive in any of my posts, all i've done is point out that you are wrong. You dont seem to have an answer to that so you've resorted to a cheap dig.

If you think thats a dissertation you cant have read many.
Its nothing to do with the 'psyche of the casual' and everything to do with debunking a myth, however unpopular, that casuals aren't 'real' fans and they are not all exactly the same.

Offence is taken and if you want to trade insults i'm quite happy to oblige.
n.b. I think 'simply' was most definately the correct word to use.

I too would like to go to games with no threat of violence. however i am aware that its far more complex than the knee jerk, simplistic guff that you and many others spout.
Do you have life long friends that you have met through the football?
Do you have a pre/post match pub?
Do you have a football routine?
Did you play football and do you think watching football is more important than playing it?
Is it your main interest/hobby?
Do you read lots about it?
Do you watch other teams/games?
You obviously come on the messageboards to debate Hibs.
Are you a Hibs fan becasue of locale, religion, class, family, or mix of one or all these?
What percentage of income/time does football in general/Hibs in particular take up?
How long do you 'hurt' after a bad defeat, is it quantifiable?
If any of the above applies or is familiar to you then you will be aware that there is so much more to being a 'real' football fan than merely attending the games.
I'm certainly not condoning violence at the football but neither am i going to suggest the a propensity for a punch up negates all the other aspects that do mark out people as 'genuine' Hibs fans.

As for mentioning our board and chairman, not that i am decrying them for it, but neither of them are football fans. TF is begining to take an interest and RP is a dons fan if anything. So while you, I and the board/club would all be in agreement that we would like to see the club be violence free.
TF and RP are perfectly within their rights to decide who they want to let into the ground or how they want to police it and thats fine by me. Allowing them to arbitrate as to who is or isn't a 'real' Hibs fan - I think not.

p.s. Can i ask if you think the father and son Norwich fans who invaded pitch (highly illegal, trespass and could also be seen as affray and incitement to riot) then threw their season tickets at B Gunn (assault and attempted assault) were 'real' fans, given that they have acted in such an openly aggressive and violent fashion. While they certainly are not going to be watching many Norwich games for some time.
Or do you think it was because they were such 'genuine' fans who were hurting, that prompted the violent act?
On a similar subject, do you think those who threated the FTB' s life during the takeover were 'real' fans or not? (i certainly think they were).

RIP
13-08-2009, 05:00 PM
Because i told the truth, or because it doesn't agree with your view?
I'm not to take offence when you tell me to stick my opinions up my backside. So what excuses you for being as smart ass and throwing insults my way? It seems at odds with your self righteous, pillar of the community facade.
There has been nothing insulting or offensive in any of my posts, all i've done is point out that you are wrong. You dont seem to have an answer to that so you've resorted to a cheap dig.

If you think thats a dissertation you cant have read many.
Its nothing to do with the 'psyche of the casual' and everything to do with debunking a myth, however unpopular, that casuals aren't 'real' fans and they are not all exactly the same.

Offence is taken and if you want to trade insults i'm quite happy to oblige.
n.b. I think 'simply' was most definately the correct word to use.

I too would like to go to games with no threat of violence. however i am aware that its far more complex than the knee jerk, simplistic guff that you and many others spout.
Do you have life long friends that you have met through the football?
Do you have a pre/post match pub?
Do you have a football routine?
Did you play football and do you think watching football is more important than playing it?
Is it your main interest/hobby?
Do you read lots about it?
Do you watch other teams/games?
You obviously come on the messageboards to debate Hibs.
Are you a Hibs fan becasue of locale, religion, class, family, or mix of one or all these?
What percentage of income/time does football in general/Hibs in particular take up?
How long do you 'hurt' after a bad defeat, is it quantifiable?
If any of the above applies or is familiar to you then you will be aware that there is so much more to being a 'real' football fan than merely attending the games.
I'm certainly not condoning violence at the football but neither am i going to suggest the a propensity for a punch up negates all the other aspects that do mark out people as 'genuine' Hibs fans.

As for mentioning our board and chairman, not that i am decrying them for it, but neither of them are football fans. TF is begining to take an interest and RP is a dons fan if anything. So while you, I and the board/club would all be in agreement that we would like to see the club be violence free.
TF and RP are perfectly within their rights to decide who they want to let into the ground or how they want to police it and thats fine by me. Allowing them to arbitrate as to who is or isn't a 'real' Hibs fan - I think not.

p.s. Can i ask if you think the father and son Norwich fans who invaded pitch (highly illegal, trespass and could also be seen as affray and incitement to riot) then threw their season tickets at B Gunn (assault and attempted assault) were 'real' fans, given that they have acted in such an openly aggressive and violent fashion. While they certainly are not going to be watching many Norwich games for some time.
Or do you think it was because they were such 'genuine' fans who were hurting, that prompted the violent act?
On a similar subject, do you think those who threated the FTB' s life during the takeover were 'real' fans or not? (i certainly think they were).

Please accept my apologies mate.

I was suggesting you are anally retentive just because I can't be ar sed reading your massive posts. It's clear that some of our fellow DotNetters have a greater appetite for your essays than I do. So I guess it's me that's out of line and I'm genuinely sorry for any offence caused.

Clearly you could write a book on this and indeed other topics. I accept I am not in your league when it comes to an intellectual argument.

But hold on a minute. What need is there to intellectualise about criminals who spoil an otherwise enjoyable family occasion for the majority? We shouldn't be giving them the time of day. It's exactly the sort of reaction and publicity they are looking for.

No-one other than you would call me a pillar of the community :faf: just for wanting to watch football with my family without any threat of violence or criminal behaviour.

VegasHibby
13-08-2009, 05:02 PM
I don't follow you? Are you saying that their mission wasn't to fight Bolton fans but rather to trawl the old folk homes of the North West stealing family heirlooms and the like?

Source?


"They were literally just going for anyone. It was very scary" I'm presuming the "anyone" wasn't just Bolton fans.........

http://scotzine.com/2009/08/10/weekend-of-shame-for-scottish-football-fans-celtic-rangers-and-hibs/

marinello59
13-08-2009, 05:11 PM
Of course their behaviour is the issue.

Exactly. :thumbsup:
Whether people are genuine fans or not is a total irrelevance. I have to put my hands up and admit I have never really understood what defined a genuine or true fan nor would I attempt to make that judgement.

VegasHibby
13-08-2009, 05:24 PM
Seems too me it's called encouraging people to grass other's up without being prepared to face the likely consequences yourself.

What about rallying Hibs kids to take a cue from the Hitler youth and inform on their parents?


Oh now all of a sudden it's "encouraging people to grass other's up" nothing to do with turning in hooligan **** bags who threaten the safety of family''s and kids not to mention the game of football itself.
And to use the Hitler referenece is pityful. You don't happen to be a hooligan do you Dashing Bob ?

Brizo
13-08-2009, 05:25 PM
Noble rhetoric my friend but I am going to let this posturing dissertation on the psyche of the casual in today's society fly straight past my head and back up your own backside - no offence intended.:wink:

I am simply saying that anyone who takes an interest in off-field violence at the expense of the game being played on the park is not in my view a Hibs fan. I happen to believe that the Hibs board and majority of fans would support the view that such dinosaurs are not welcome at Easter Road.

I think the "is not in my view" is the moot point here. If the definition of being a fan is going home and away in good times and bad then like it or not a number of the casuals are some of Hibs biggest fans. If your personal definition of a Hibs fan is primarily based on that individuals behaviour you can whitewash the casuals out of your picture of what constitutes a Hibs fan. However yours is the kind of idealistic definition which imho allowed the sticky buns management and media friends at Manchester to disown their own hooligan element ie the troublemakers werent real Rangers fans mantra.

Because our hooligan element dont fulfill peoples expectations of how Hibs fans should conduct themselves it doesnt mean theyre not Hibs fans.... imho.

J-C
13-08-2009, 05:27 PM
Exactly. :thumbsup:
Whether people are genuine fans or not is a total irrelevance. I have to put my hands up and admit I have never really understood what defined a genuine or true fan nor would I attempt to make that judgement.


I agree, I had a season ticket up till last year and because of monies and other circumstances I've had to give it up until these circumstances change, does that make me any less of a fan because at this moment I can't get to see my team as much as I'd like. My two stepsons still have theirs and sit in the east, so are they better fans than me, no!

Being a Hibs fan comes from the heart, it's the first result you look for every week, it hurts when we lose and hate it when our near neighbours slag you off when they beat you. As said there is no definition to a true fan, there are varied levels of support you can give to your club but a fan is always a fan.

Dashing Bob S
13-08-2009, 05:33 PM
Oh now all of a sudden it's "encouraging people to grass other's up" nothing to do with turning in hooligan **** bags who threaten the safety of family''s and kids not to mention the game of football itself.
And to use the Hitler referenece is pityful. You don't happen to be a hooligan do you Dashing Bob ?

Now you are being ridiculous. I was on my way to getting a pedicure in a Cheshire Spa when it all 'kicked off'. My main concern was for the Merc and that the rampaging denizens of the underclass would see it as a legitimate target to be trashed should the rammy spread. Most unseemly.

MUSSI LEE
13-08-2009, 05:35 PM
I think the "is not in my view" is the moot point here. If the definition of being a fan is going home and away in good times and bad then like it or not a number of the casuals are some of Hibs biggest fans. If your personal definition of a Hibs fan is primarily based on that individuals behaviour you can whitewash the casuals out of your picture of what constitutes a Hibs fan. However yours is the kind of idealistic definition which imho allowed the sticky buns management and media friends at Manchester to disown their own hooligan element ie the troublemakers werent real Rangers fans mantra.

Because our hooligan element dont fulfill peoples expectations of how Hibs fans should conduct themselves it doesnt mean theyre not Hibs fans.... imho.:agree:

Darth Hibbie
13-08-2009, 05:36 PM
It's a simple question from a simple football fan.:agree:
Would it be acceptable for Hibs fans to travel to an away game with the intention of fighting with rival fans? Surely you can come down to my level just this once and provide an unequivocal answer?


Still no answer. :bitchy:


This may provide the answers you seek........

http://www.hibs.net/message/showthread.php?t=149750&highlight=groundsman

sadtom
13-08-2009, 05:42 PM
Please accept my apologies mate.

I was suggesting you are anally retentive just because I can't be ar sed reading your massive posts. It's clear that some of our fellow DotNetters have a greater appetite for your essays than I do. So I guess it's me that's out of line and I'm genuinely sorry for any offence caused.

Nae bother.

Clearly you could write a book on this and indeed other topics. I accept I am not in your league when it comes to an intellectual argument.

Dont let it worry you, you're not alone.

But hold on a minute. What need is there to intellectualise about criminals who spoil an otherwise enjoyable family occasion for the majority? We shouldn't be giving them the time of day. It's exactly the sort of reaction and publicity they are looking for.

Because if we dont apply thought/intellegent reasoning to problems (and it is a problem) then the response is nothing but reaction. I've never found reactionary soloutions to be any solution at all, in any circumstance.
Its also a fairly recent thing to describe football as a 'family occasion'.

No-one other than you would call me a pillar of the community :faf: just for wanting to watch football with my family without any threat of violence or criminal behaviour.

Sounds good to me. But how do we achieve it. Certainly not by burying our heads in the sand kidding on that the people involved aren't real or genuine fans, thats a cop out.



No thoughts on the question about the norwich fans?

Chuckie
13-08-2009, 05:46 PM
Now you are being ridiculous. I was on my way to getting a pedicure in a Cheshire Spa when it all 'kicked off'. My main concern was for the Merc and that the rampaging denizens of the underclass would see it as a legitimate target to be trashed should the rammy spread. Most unseemly.


Dashing - Spirited, audacious and full of high spirits.

Dashing - Chic, fashionable.

Dashing - The act of fighting with fat, bald men, punching pregnant ladies in retail parks and throwing grown men through windows.

We need to be told which it is ?

:cool2:

Dashing Bob S
13-08-2009, 05:51 PM
Dashing - Spirited, audacious and full of high spirits.

Dashing - Chic, fashionable.

Dashing - The act of fighting with fat, bald men, punching pregnant ladies in retail parks and throwing grown men through windows.

We need to be told which it is ?

:cool2:

Two out of three isn't bad going, Chuckie.

sauzee
13-08-2009, 05:52 PM
jesus! let this subject go ffs! if you've got anything further to ask or say on the matter,pop into the albion bar before any home game and put your point across,there'll be a number of people in that will debate the subject with you.

Darth Hibbie
13-08-2009, 05:52 PM
No thoughts on the question about the norwich fans?

I think you have made some valid points however what defines a real fan has never been established even after hundreds of urber fan debates on here. I think though if a am reading it correctly you do not want these people at ER, fans or not?

As for the Norwich fans whilst I disagree with what they done it is not really a fair comparison. They have let their emotion take over and vented their anger at the club. The idiots involved in the stuff at Bolton and elsewhere have just gone out to cause as much bother as possible.

J-C
13-08-2009, 06:09 PM
This may provide the answers you seek........

http://www.hibs.net/message/showthread.php?t=149750&highlight=groundsman


Thanks for that link, I thought I knew the name Bravesthibs from another thread but couldn't quite place it. Answers a lot of questions that, ta.

Dashing Bob S
13-08-2009, 06:27 PM
This may provide the answers you seek........

http://www.hibs.net/message/showthread.php?t=149750&highlight=groundsman

Are you attempting to tarnish someone's reputation?

Darth Hibbie
13-08-2009, 06:33 PM
Are you attempting to tarnish someone's reputation?

Not at all. :devil:

sadtom
13-08-2009, 06:39 PM
I think you have made some valid points however what defines a real fan has never been established even after hundreds of urber fan debates on here. I think though if a am reading it correctly you do not want these people at ER, fans or not?

As for the Norwich fans whilst I disagree with what they done it is not really a fair comparison. They have let their emotion take over and vented their anger at the club. The idiots involved in the stuff at Bolton and elsewhere have just gone out to cause as much bother as possible.

I agree that qualifying what constitutes a real fan is almost imposible to define, though fighting at matches does not necessarily rule you out.
Many of the most active casuals have now changed their lives and are most welcome at ER. As for the ones that haven't changed then, while it would be better for the majority that they didn't attend, it would be far better if they followed their contemporaries lead and left all the daftie stuff in the past.

As for the Norwich fans, i would think its possible that spontaneous actions likes theirs would be more lilkely to see innocent fans caught up it the ensuing trouble than the actions of those who 'plan' trouble.
Is being so enraged by your team getting beat that you commit a hooligan act more or less justifiable than those whose actions are based on previous violent encounters with 'enemies'. I could be argued that there is more justification/honour (in a warped way) in wanting to avenge a friend who had been severely battered/stabbed etc in a previous clash. Than merely being so p'eed of with your teams poor performance (christ its no wonder the bother was so bad at ER in the 80's) that you commit or incite a violent act.
Its a difficult one.:agree:

jakki
13-08-2009, 06:58 PM
When at 13 when I first followed Hibs, my dad made me promise that I wouldn't attend any Celtic or Rangers game as there was always trouble
. My first OF game was the 3-0 game in the cup against Rangers.
I stopped going to games after I came back from Germany and the casual scene was top news in the sports page.

In the 70's my son got an invite to the first Hibs Kids game at ER.Dave took wee David to it but left before half time as the wee laddy standing in front of wee Dave in the enclosure got his head split open from a bottle thrown from the Hibs support in the main stand.

Not one of my kids went to ER after that.

Then things seemed to improve and violence seemed to have vanished. I took my grandson to many Livi matches when he got tickets free from the school and then I took him to Hampden for semifinals and even Finals with no trouble.

I took my daughter and 5 kids between 6 and 14 to the match at Bolton. We had a wondeful day out until after the game, a bolton fan about 6' and weighing well over 25 stone who had had his nose bloodied by a "Hibs" fan wanted to take on the nearest Hibs fan, my 13 year old grandson about 5'3 and weiging 8 stone..

Thanks to all you "Hibs " fans that had the agro on Saturday, I will never subject my grandkids to your aftermath. Hope you think you're all BIG men subjecting kids to the aftermath. You F""""in Ar"""oles

Dashing Bob S
13-08-2009, 07:56 PM
Had a damn fine time at Bolton and Blackburn (and the spa at the Cheshire Hotel). Returned refreshed and ready for the new season. Don't think the minor aggro will dampen anyone's enthusiasm.

Can't wait to ambush those Paisley *ankers on Saturday. (Joking!!!)

The only ambush will be a style one. I'll be clad in a Prada light blue striped shirt, black leather Gucci shoes, Hugo Boss charcoal trews and a lightweight black leather bomber jacket by Armani, all purchased from Harvey Nicks in Manchester last week. A better selection than it's Edinburgh counterpart, it rather pains one to note.

jakki
13-08-2009, 08:39 PM
Had a damn fine time at Bolton and Blackburn (and the spa at the Cheshire Hotel). Returned refreshed and ready for the new season. Don't think the minor aggro will dampen anyone's enthusiasm.

Can't wait to ambush those Paisley *ankers on Saturday. (Joking!!!)

The only ambush will be a style one. I'll be clad in a Prada light blue striped shirt, black leather Gucci shoes, Hugo Boss charcoal trews and a lightweight black leather bomber jacket by Armani, all purchased from Harvey Nicks in Manchester last week. A better selection than it's Edinburgh counterpart, it rather pains one to note.
I am Taylor , marydolls grandson and I was really concerned
with my wee sister. She is only 6 and doesn't need this agro to her big brother from an adult. We went to the game and enjoyed all the prematch entertainment but because of one hibs fan blooging his nose, he picked on me and my wee sister was haeing heart attcks as her big brother was being picked on

jabis
13-08-2009, 08:54 PM
Sooooo,what this thread is REALLY about,is that some sad tossers like to act hard in the name of Hibernian F.C.

Now there taking the huff about not being applauded by the other 99.9% of us.?

Remember guy's to renew you BNP membership........and stay away from ER.

kev1875
13-08-2009, 09:08 PM
Dunno about our reputation, but the people involved will have a tarnished criminal record. Police will be going through the CCTV and pictures will be appearing soon in a newspaper. The people involved should be ****ing themselves.

blackpoolhibs
13-08-2009, 09:11 PM
Dunno about our reputation, but the people involved will have a tarnished criminal record. Police will be going through the CCTV and pictures will be appearing soon in a newspaper. The people involved should be ****ing themselves.

At least in jail, they cook the pizza right.:wink:

kev1875
13-08-2009, 09:16 PM
At least in jail, they cook the pizza right.:wink:

That pizza was fine, any longer and it was a manhole cover.

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13-08-2009, 09:44 PM
Sooooo,what this thread is REALLY about,is that some sad tossers like to act hard in the name of Hibernian F.C.

Now there taking the huff about not being applauded by the other 99.9% of us.?

Remember guy's to renew you BNP membership........and stay away from ER.

:top marks

jabis
13-08-2009, 10:02 PM
:top marks

shhhhh !

:fishin:

VegasHibby
14-08-2009, 07:12 AM
Now you are being ridiculous. I was on my way to getting a pedicure in a Cheshire Spa when it all 'kicked off'. My main concern was for the Merc and that the rampaging denizens of the underclass would see it as a legitimate target to be trashed should the rammy spread. Most unseemly.

A pedicure ? hmmm did you get a Brazilian wax aswell ?.............

Dashing Bob S
14-08-2009, 07:19 AM
A pedicure ? hmmm did you get a Brazilian wax aswell ?.............

I left that one to the wife.

Incidentally, I seriously recommend pedicures. It showed me how much I neglect my feet, as I'm sure many of us do. They now look like the feet of much younger chap and make me yearn for a hot day so that I can wear sandals to show them off. Yes, I'm even prepared to endure the style debit points that would ensue from such action.

Dashing Bob S
14-08-2009, 07:27 AM
I am Taylor , marydolls grandson and I was really concerned
with my wee sister. She is only 6 and doesn't need this agro to her big brother from an adult. We went to the game and enjoyed all the prematch entertainment but because of one hibs fan blooging his nose, he picked on me and my wee sister was haeing heart attcks as her big brother was being picked on

Yes Taylor, I can imagine how distressing this must have been to your sister and yourself. When I was perhaps the same age as you, this was a very regular happening at the football, and I recall being very scared in such circumstances. (I was 10 when I was punched and spat on by two 40 year olds for wearing a different coloured scarf, it was only my third of forth Hibs game.) Thankfully this is very rare nowadays, but it does make me worry about talking my own children to the football.

I hope your sister isn't too distressed now and I'm sure you looked after her and took good care of her.

Yours in Hibs

Bob

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14-08-2009, 08:59 AM
When at 13 when I first followed Hibs, my dad made me promise that I wouldn't attend any Celtic or Rangers game as there was always trouble
. My first OF game was the 3-0 game in the cup against Rangers.
I stopped going to games after I came back from Germany and the casual scene was top news in the sports page.

In the 70's my son got an invite to the first Hibs Kids game at ER.Dave took wee David to it but left before half time as the wee laddy standing in front of wee Dave in the enclosure got his head split open from a bottle thrown from the Hibs support in the main stand.

Not one of my kids went to ER after that.

Then things seemed to improve and violence seemed to have vanished. I took my grandson to many Livi matches when he got tickets free from the school and then I took him to Hampden for semifinals and even Finals with no trouble.

I took my daughter and 5 kids between 6 and 14 to the match at Bolton. We had a wondeful day out until after the game, a bolton fan about 6' and weighing well over 25 stone who had had his nose bloodied by a "Hibs" fan wanted to take on the nearest Hibs fan, my 13 year old grandson about 5'3 and weiging 8 stone..

Thanks to all you "Hibs " fans that had the agro on Saturday, I will never subject my grandkids to your aftermath. Hope you think you're all BIG men subjecting kids to the aftermath. You F""""in Ar"""oles


I am Taylor , marydolls grandson and I was really concerned
with my wee sister. She is only 6 and doesn't need this agro to her big brother from an adult. We went to the game and enjoyed all the prematch entertainment but because of one hibs fan blooging his nose, he picked on me and my wee sister was haeing heart attcks as her big brother was being picked on


This is why I'm so angry about this. Your big day out shouldn't have been spoiled by these morons. Like you, Marydoll, I thought we were getting past this, yet we seem to have the same sort of people causing the same sort of trouble still. We have the club trying to attract families to the games, we have older fans trying to take their children and grandchildren to something that should be happy and friendly and enjoyable, and the aggro starts and a 13-year-old is threatened with violence. Utterly unacceptable.

Taylor, I'm sorry you had that happen to you. I hope you're OK, and I hope your sister is OK too. Most of us aren't like that, and I hope you and she come to see Hibs this season at Easter Road and have some really good days out.

dangermouse
14-08-2009, 01:35 PM
No I wouldn't do it. No interest. But I bet out of 13 to 14 thousand Hibees you could find 30 or 40 volunteers. Maybe fans who bring kids along and have a different perspective on safety at matches......

I take my son to the game and was in Bolton (avoided all of the trouble). I go to watch the match not get a half price season ticket to look for potential trouble makers.

The Police and Stewards with their CCTV are paid to do this.