Black tennis players

[poolman]

Just a wee discussion in the pub last night

Why do you think that there is not very many black tennis players on the pro circuit (Williams sisters apart) or, come to think of it black swimmers.

General consensus last night it might be something to do with their physiology :dunno:

[Godsahibby]

Could say the same about back golfers.

[H18sry]

Just a wee discussion in the pub last night

Why do you think that there is not very many black tennis players on the pro circuit (Williams sisters apart) or, come to think of it black swimmers.

General consensus last night it might be something to do with their physiology :dunno:
May not be many but they 2 have proved that with commitment and dedication your skin colour does not have to be a burden :agree:

Could say the same about black golfers.

Yet again as I stated above with Tiger and Vijay Singh:wink:

But black swimmers I think I read somewhere a few years ago it has something to do with the body mass as Black peoples body mass is a different density to white peoples body masses [ may be wrong or incorrect so I stand to be corrected] :greengrin

[rabcp1]

Just a wee discussion in the pub last night

Why do you think that there is not very many black tennis players on the pro circuit (Williams sisters apart) or, come to think of it black swimmers.

General consensus last night it might be something to do with their physiology :dunno:

It's do with muscle structure, white people generally have a higher fat % in there muscles, this makes them more buoyant resulting in water sports being dominated by white athletes, as black athletes have a lower fat % they tend to be more powerful and excel in events which require power such as sprinting

[da-robster]

Just a wee discussion in the pub last night

Why do you think that there is not very many black tennis players on the pro circuit (Williams sisters apart) or, come to think of it black swimmers.

General consensus last night it might be something to do with their physiology :dunno:

They probally just don't get the same chances to play tennis generallly speaking.Come to think of it how many african tennis players can you name. Now I bet you can name more americans.

And it's definately that whites are superior players of either tennis or golf look at the williams or Tiger woods.

It's probally because white majority countries are generally richer than black majority countries and so can afford to play tennis.

[Godsahibby]

May noy be many but they 2 have proved that with comitment and dedication your skin colour does not have to be a burden :agree:


Yet again as I stated above with Tiger and Vijay Singh:wink:


Well no **** there sherlock, apart from the obvious ones there are not many of the tour.

Mind you could probably say the same thing about white rappers, Vanilla Ice the exception!

[H18sry]

Well no **** there sherlock, apart from the obvious ones there are not many of the tour.

Mind you could probably say the same thing about white rappers, Vanilla Ice the exception!

go **** yourself :asshole: :greengrin

[hibsbollah]

Cultural and economic reasons. Same reason why there arent many tennis players that grew up on council estates.

[H18sry]

I think a lot of it is down to integration, and racism, where as white people do not have a problem joining a tennis club or golf club both club having membership which are pre-dominantly white middle/upper class, blacks do not join such clubs because of that reason or feel uneasy in that surroundings, [IMO]

[Hibbyradge]

Golf and Tennis are predominantly played by the wealthy middle classes.

[Wembley67]

It's do with muscle structure, white people generally have a higher fat % in there muscles, this makes them more buoyant resulting in water sports being dominated by white athletes, as black athletes have a lower fat % they tend to be more powerful and excel in events which require power such as sprinting

Is that true?

[Betty Boop]

Golf and Tennis are predominantly played by the wealthy middle classes.
:agree:

[poolman]

Is that true?


Yes


http://selfconfessions.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/boomer.jpg

[poolman]

Golf and Tennis are predominantly played by the wealthy middle classes.


what about swimmers tho

[(((Fergus)))]

Don't see many black fellas at the rugby, plenty at the football though. With the exception of swimming (where it seems they can't float very well :confused:) looks to be a culture/class thing. Athletics is a relatively working class sport too.

[Sir David Gray]

Tennis, certainly in terms of the UK, is predominantly played by the upper middle class and I think that applies to a lot of other countries too, although I could be wrong.

Obviously here in the UK, most people who fit the description of being upper middle class, are white.

When I was down at Wimbledon last week for a couple of days, there were thousands of people in the grounds and I hardly saw a non-white face, which is incredible when you consider just how many non-white people live in and around the London area.

[Andy.1875]

what about swimmers tho

Too many crocodiles.

[H18sry]

I think a lot of it is down to integration, and racism, where as white people do not have a problem joining a tennis club or golf club both club having membership which are pre-dominantly white middle/upper class, blacks do not join such clubs because of that reason or feel uneasy in that surroundings[IMO]


Golf and Tennis are predominantly played by the wealthy middle classes.

Is that not what I said :wink:

[Steve-O]

Don't see many black fellas at the rugby, plenty at the football though. With the exception of swimming (where it seems they can't float very well :confused:) looks to be a culture/class thing. Athletics is a relatively working class sport too.

All Blacks? :greengrin Sorry, that was a hilarious joke, BUT a fair portion of the All Blacks are actually of Polynesian descent...

I did a bit of study at uni into this type of subject - institutional racism is a factor in this, i.e. black people will often automatically be pushed towards sports such as sprinting, boxing etc :agree:

It is true that there are physiological differences though.

[Hibbyradge]

Is that not what I said :wink:

Similar, but my post was succinct and to the point.

:greengrin

I hadn't read your post when i wrote mine.

[Danderhall Hibs]

Was Muhammad Ali being ironic then when he said "float like a butterfly, sting like a bee"?

[iwasthere1972]

Horse racing, showjumping etc are for the rich and as far as I am aware these sports are mainly "white" participated.

[--------]

Just a wee discussion in the pub last night

Why do you think that there is not very many black tennis players on the pro circuit (Williams sisters apart) or, come to think of it black swimmers.

General consensus last night it might be something to do with their physiology :dunno:



Racial prejudice, I'd say.

Until a very few years ago there were NO black tennis players.

Althea Gibson won Wimbledon in 1957, but she was never treated as an equal by the other players, by the All-England Club, or by the US tennis authorities.

http://www.wehaitians.com/black_tennis.jpg

Arthur Ashe was the first black man to win Wimbledon - in 1975. He had to put up with a lot of abuse and obstruction in his time.

This is from The Washington Post in 1988.

http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1P2-1256698.html

Althea Gibson, the Australian Yvonne Goolagong, Zina Garrison, the Williams sisters; Tsonga, Noah, Ashe...

There aren't that many more black tennis players, but I'd suggest that there are enough who have reached the absolute top of the game to give the lie to any idea that there's something about "black physiology" that prevents black players from excelling at the game.

For that matter, is there any genetic reason why British tennis players are almost universally rubbish? Roger Taylor, Virginia Wade, Sue Barker, Tim Henman and Andy Murray excepted, of course?

[Tomsk]

It's obvious, isn't it! It's because their crap at sport ... em!

[Onceinawhile]

Cultural and economic reasons. Same reason why there arent many tennis players that grew up on council estates.


Golf and Tennis are predominantly played by the wealthy middle classes.

:agree::agree:

[Danderhall Hibs]

What's the reason for their being very few black goalkeepers?

[khib70]

Horse racing, showjumping etc are for the rich and as far as I am aware these sports are mainly "white" participated.
Yeah, but you probably think that about cricket too, and you can hardly accuse that game of being "white dominated", can you?

[iwasthere1972]

Yeah, but you probably think that about cricket too, and you can hardly accuse that game of being "white dominated", can you?

Difference is horses are fairly expensive and cricket bats aren't. You can buy a cricket bat and join a Sunday league wheras horse riding lessons and upkeep cost a fortune. I should know. :agree:

[iwasthere1972]

What's the reason for their being very few black goalkeepers?


Think the reason behind this is that black people see themselves as flair players hoping to replicate your Pele and Ronaldo etc. They probably see goalkeeping as being a bit boring and prefer the outfield role.

There is another theory that black players don't like all this diving stuff and chewing freshly laid grass.

[Hibbyradge]

Think the reason behind this is that black people see themselves as flair players hoping to replicate your Pele and Ronaldo etc. They probably see goalkeeping as being a bit boring and prefer the outfield role.

There is another theory that black players don't like all this diving stuff and chewing freshly laid grass.

Kidding, right?

[Hibbyradge]

Yeah, but you probably think that about cricket too, and you can hardly accuse that game of being "white dominated", can you?

Cricket isn't a middle class sport.

[iwasthere1972]

Kidding, right?

Well maybe the second paragraph because I forgot about Nade.

It's the best reason I can come up with but who knows.

[J-C]

In most countries golf and tennis are played by the wealthy. Just look at this country, both of these sports cost a good few hundred pounds a year to play, then hundreds of pounds for equipment and lessons. Unfortunately in this day and age black people in certain countries are still in the lower classes so the more physical sports are done e.g. football, American football, basketball and athletics etc.

[Allant1981]

In most countries golf and tennis are played by the wealthy. Just look at this country, both of these sports cost a good few hundred pounds a year to play, then hundreds of pounds for equipment and lessons. Unfortunately in this day and age black people in certain countries are still in the lower classes so the more physical sports are done e.g. football, American football, basketball and athletics etc.


Believe me athletics isnt cheap if you are going all round the uk. Ask my mum and dad and they will tell you. Dread to think of the thousands the spent on me when i was younger. Hotels, Petrol etc. It all adds up. If your lucky enough to get sponsorship or a grant then it certainly helps out

[J-C]

Believe me athletics isnt cheap if you are going all round the uk. Ask my mum and dad and they will tell you. Dread to think of the thousands the spent on me when i was younger. Hotels, Petrol etc. It all adds up. If your lucky enough to get sponsorship or a grant then it certainly helps out


Was thinking more about the American side of that, colleges who give the scholarships to the more athletic students.

[New Corrie]

Black people participating in sports for years faced obstacles that have now thankfully been removed. I am surprised nobody has mentioned a certain Buster Mottram whilst discussing black tennis players. I mean, how do you think Arthur Ashe felt turning up at Wimbledon knowing that Mottram, the repellent NF member and one time 14th best player in the World would be competing?

My vote for a Black sportsman overcoming Racist obstacles does not go to Ali (as his treatment of Frazier was unforgivable) but to a little known Nascar driver called Wendell Scott http://www.legendsofnascar.com/Wendell_Scott.htm

I hope the link works (it's worth a read), might also be of interest to LiviHibee as I know he is also a Motorsport buff.

How would you feel winning a race, but they award it to someone else because they don't want a Black man to be kissed by a White girl at the presentation......Wendell, you were the MAN, and my little known Motor racing Hero!

[--------]

Yeah, but you probably think that about cricket too, and you can hardly accuse that game of being "white dominated", can you?



Racism was endemic in cricket until the 1970's.

Then the West Indies became dominant thanks to a number of rather good players all coming along together, and it became slighly impossible to maintain the idea that white players were somehow intrinsically superior to the non-whites.

Batsmen like Gordon Greenidge, Desmond Haynes, Viv Richards, Alvin Kallicharran, Clive Lloyd, and Larry Gomes; bowlers like Malcolm Marshall, Colin Croft, Joel Garner, Michael Holding....

World-class players like Gary Sobers, Deryck Murray, and Lance Gibbs....

Then India and Pakistan began to flex their muscles, Sri Lanka became a Test side.

Cricket today is a universe away from the game it was when I was a boy.

And ten of the eleven best cricketers I've seen in my time are ALL non-whites.

Greenidge, Gavaskar, Richards, Lara, Lloyd, Sobers, Marshall, Garner, Holding, and Muralitharan. The exception's the wicket-keeper, Adam Gilchrist.

[J-C]

Racism was endemic in cricket until the 1970's.

Then the West Indies became dominant thanks to a number of rather good players all coming along together, and it became slighly impossible to maintain the idea that white players were somehow intrinsically superior to the non-whites.

Batsmen like Gordon Greenidge, Desmond Haynes, Viv Richards, Alvin Kallicharran, Clive Lloyd, and Larry Gomes; bowlers like Malcolm Marshall, Colin Croft, Joel Garner, Michael Holding....

World-class players like Gary Sobers, Deryck Murray, and Lance Gibbs....

Then India and Pakistan began to flex their muscles, Sri Lanka became a Test side.

Cricket today is a universe away from the game it was when I was a boy.

And ten of the eleven best cricketers I've seen in my time are ALL non-whites.

Greenidge, Gavaskar, Richards, Lara, Lloyd, Sobers, Marshall, Garner, Holding, and Muralitharan. The exception's the wicket-keeper, Adam Gilchrist.


I remeber when Basil D'Oliveira(spelling) got his game for England as that was a land mark cause he was I think the first coloured player to play for England.

[Storar]

Same could be said for black football managers. I was told that after signing for MK Dons that Paul Ince is the only black manager in britian. Now that's not going to have anything to do with being upper/middle class or body mass

[BEEJ]

But black swimmers I think I read somewhere a few years ago it has something to do with the body mass as Black peoples body mass is a different density to white peoples body masses [ may be wrong or incorrect so I stand to be corrected] :greengrin
:agree: Whilst their minority representation in golf and tennis is down to economic factors and prejudice, in swimming it's down to their physiology.

As you say, greater body density causes them to lie lower in the water therefore it's more difficult for them to generate speed. By the same token, that same physical characteristic is what helps them to completely dominate sprint events on track and field.

[(((Fergus)))]

All Blacks? :greengrin Sorry, that was a hilarious joke, BUT a fair portion of the All Blacks are actually of Polynesian descent...

I did a bit of study at uni into this type of subject - institutional racism is a factor in this, i.e. black people will often automatically be pushed towards sports such as sprinting, boxing etc :agree:

It is true that there are physiological differences though.

Are Polynesians of African descent? I thought they were more connected with Asia.

[J-C]

Are Polynesians of African descent? I thought they were more connected with Asia.


Just googled, Taiwan aparently http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polynesian_culture

[--------]

I remeber when Basil D'Oliveira(spelling) got his game for England as that was a land mark cause he was I think the first coloured player to play for England.



And D'Oliveira was dropped by the MCC when the South Africans refused to allow him to play against them in 1968...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/cricket/3818857.stm

Tennis, golf and (in this country) cricket all tend to be run by members of the same social class. Tennis and golf in the States are the same.

Things are changing (perhaps) slowly, but there's still a lot of snobbery and racism in the strata of society the run the MCC, the R & A, and the All-England Club.

Someone mentioned Buster Mottram and his membership of the National Front. IIRC no one in British tennis thought anything of it when the story came out.

But then Max Mosley of Formula One and Nazi Floggers fame (still a fully-accredited member of the British Establishment last time I looked) is the offspring of Sir Oswald Mosley, founder and Fuhrer of the British Union of Fascists....

[Dashing Bob S]

And D'Oliveira was dropped by the MCC when the South Africans refused to allow him to play against them in 1968...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/cricket/3818857.stm

Tennis, golf and (in this country) cricket all tend to be run by members of the same social class. Tennis and golf in the States are the same.

Things are changing (perhaps) slowly, but there's still a lot of snobbery and racism in the strata of society the run the MCC, the R & A, and the All-England Club.

Someone mentioned Buster Mottram and his membership of the National Front. IIRC no one in British tennis thought anything of it when the story came out.

But then Max Mosley of Formula One and Nazi Floggers fame (still a fully-accredited member of the British Establishment last time I looked) is the offspring of Sir Oswald Mosley, founder and Fuhrer of the British Union of Fascists....

Bizarrely, Mottram tried to change his image by forming a song-writing partnership with black 'entertainer' Kenny Lynch, the butt of 'Tarby's' sixties racist jokes.

[--------]

Bizarrely, Mottram tried to change his image by forming a song-writing partnership with black 'entertainer' Kenny Lynch, the butt of 'Tarby's' sixties racist jokes.

:agree:

These are the sort of memories that convince me that in certain ways this country HAS after all changed for the better, Bob.

Tarbuck, Lynch, and Buster Mottram. :rolleyes:

[GhostofBolivar]

:agree:

These are the sort of memories that convince me that in certain ways this country HAS after all changed for the better, Bob.

Tarbuck, Lynch, and Buster Mottram. :rolleyes:

Carol Thatcher was fired by the BBC after she described the French player Jo-Wilfired Tsonga as "looking like a golliwog". When it was pointed out one of his parents is white, she replied that "oh, in that case, he's only part-golliwog" (or words to that effect).

Then Jo Brand complained about her.

[--------]

Carol Thatcher was fired by the BBC after she described the French player Jo-Wilfired Tsonga as "looking like a golliwog". When it was pointed out one of his parents is white, she replied that "oh, in that case, he's only part-golliwog" (or words to that effect).

Then Jo Brand complained about her.



So going by Carol Thatcher's parents, which particular species is SHE? :cool2: