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Franck is God
25-02-2009, 12:38 PM
I sent this letter this morning. Some of you may agree with the sentiment but not the course of action or you may agree with it all. Just thought I would share it.



FAO Mr Scott Lindsay

23rd February 2009



Dear Sir,

It is with sadness that I actually write this letter to you today but displays by the team I have loved and supported all my life have driven me to this.

I have been a massive supporter of the way the club has been run in recent years, the appointment of Tony Mowbray followed by John Collins were applauded by me and many others. The way the club has been run financially has also been a huge plus for me which has allowed the development of our training centre and ongoing improvements to the ground. Not to mention our youth set up which is still producing excellent young players.

However I feel that the appointment of Mixu Paatelainen was an error in judgment. This is not a recent revelation to me and to be honest I have felt this way since his first match in charge. But as a loyal Hibs fan I looked beyond my own reservations and still renewed my season ticket for 2008-09.

This season has been nothing short of dreadful. His inability to get the players physically fit and capable of passing the ball to each other is worrying enough His insistence to blame everything and everyone other than himself for defeats and poor performances is quite frankly pathetic. Last week when he publicly blamed Paul Hanlon for not winning the game at Kilmarnock was unforgivable and his excuses after Saturday’s defeat at Inverness were laughable. As a member of the board did this not annoy you? Considering the way the club has backed him in the three transfer windows he has managed us through to blame a lack of money for our current plight is surely a sign that he is simply not the man for us.

He has been given ample funds to put a team on the pitch worthy of this club, I am sure that Mowbray or Collins would have loved his budget during their times in charge. I am confident that the wages/signings budget at Hibs is well in excess of those at Falkirk, Kilmarnock, Hamilton, Inverness, St Mirren & Dundee Utd with perhaps Aberdeen on an equal footing. I have seen all those sides outplay us in games this season.

I would also like to point out that my letter is not driven by poor results but the way we are playing. I would accept our league position and points tally if I felt that I was at least watching a team trying to win points by playing football. As a Hibs fan I don’t have delusions of grandeur, I have never expected us to win the league or even a cup, what I do expect is to be able to enjoy my trips to Easter Road, if I’m not enjoying it what reason do I have to come along.

I don’t want this letter to turn into nothing more than a rant at the club so I will make my final point now. I will not attend another Hibs match while Mixu Paatelainen is in charge and enclose my season ticket stub for Saturday’s game against Falkirk. I will post each and every stub individually for the rest of the season as long as he remains in charge.

ancient hibee
25-02-2009, 12:40 PM
Absolutely excellent.

Si_17
25-02-2009, 12:42 PM
Far superior to open letters by our yam counterparts...:devil:

I think it gets the point across and the season ticket stub for every game is a strong message. Doubt the board will listen though...:bitchy:

bingo70
25-02-2009, 12:45 PM
I sent this letter this morning. Some of you may agree with the sentiment but not the course of action or you may agree with it all. Just thought I would share it.



FAO Mr Scott Lindsay

23rd February 2009



Dear Sir,

It is with sadness that I actually write this letter to you today but displays by the team I have loved and supported all my life have driven me to this.

I have been a massive supporter of the way the club has been run in recent years, the appointment of Tony Mowbray followed by John Collins were applauded by me and many others. The way the club has been run financially has also been a huge plus for me which has allowed the development of our training centre and ongoing improvements to the ground. Not to mention our youth set up which is still producing excellent young players.

However I feel that the appointment of Mixu Paatelainen was an error in judgment. This is not a recent revelation to me and to be honest I have felt this way since his first match in charge. But as a loyal Hibs fan I looked beyond my own reservations and still renewed my season ticket for 2008-09.

This season has been nothing short of dreadful. His inability to get the players physically fit and capable of passing the ball to each other is worrying enough His insistence to blame everything and everyone other than himself for defeats and poor performances is quite frankly pathetic. Last week when he publicly blamed Paul Hanlon for not winning the game at Kilmarnock was unforgivable and his excuses after Saturday’s defeat at Inverness were laughable. As a member of the board did this not annoy you? Considering the way the club has backed him in the three transfer windows he has managed us through to blame a lack of money for our current plight is surely a sign that he is simply not the man for us.

He has been given ample funds to put a team on the pitch worthy of this club, I am sure that Mowbray or Collins would have loved his budget during their times in charge. I am confident that the wages/signings budget at Hibs is well in excess of those at Falkirk, Kilmarnock, Hamilton, Inverness, St Mirren & Dundee Utd with perhaps Aberdeen on an equal footing. I have seen all those sides outplay us in games this season.

I would also like to point out that my letter is not driven by poor results but the way we are playing. I would accept our league position and points tally if I felt that I was at least watching a team trying to win points by playing football. As a Hibs fan I don’t have delusions of grandeur, I have never expected us to win the league or even a cup, what I do expect is to be able to enjoy my trips to Easter Road, if I’m not enjoying it what reason do I have to come along.

I don’t want this letter to turn into nothing more than a rant at the club so I will make my final point now. I will not attend another Hibs match while Mixu Paatelainen is in charge and enclose my season ticket stub for Saturday’s game against Falkirk. I will post each and every stub individually for the rest of the season as long as he remains in charge.

there's a thread similiar to this on the PM board and i say well done to anyone who's gone to the effort to let the board know exactly how they're feeling.

Excellent letter and hopefully the club sit up and take notice that the fans aren't happy.

Chuckie
25-02-2009, 12:50 PM
Why do we need to see it ?

:jamboclow

IWasThere2016
25-02-2009, 12:53 PM
Great letter :top marks

scoopyboy
25-02-2009, 12:54 PM
I sent this letter this morning. Some of you may agree with the sentiment but not the course of action or you may agree with it all. Just thought I would share it.



FAO Mr Scott Lindsay

23rd February 2009



Dear Sir,

It is with sadness that I actually write this letter to you today but displays by the team I have loved and supported all my life have driven me to this.

I have been a massive supporter of the way the club has been run in recent years, the appointment of Tony Mowbray followed by John Collins were applauded by me and many others. The way the club has been run financially has also been a huge plus for me which has allowed the development of our training centre and ongoing improvements to the ground. Not to mention our youth set up which is still producing excellent young players.

However I feel that the appointment of Mixu Paatelainen was an error in judgment. This is not a recent revelation to me and to be honest I have felt this way since his first match in charge. But as a loyal Hibs fan I looked beyond my own reservations and still renewed my season ticket for 2008-09.

This season has been nothing short of dreadful. His inability to get the players physically fit and capable of passing the ball to each other is worrying enough His insistence to blame everything and everyone other than himself for defeats and poor performances is quite frankly pathetic. Last week when he publicly blamed Paul Hanlon for not winning the game at Kilmarnock was unforgivable and his excuses after Saturday’s defeat at Inverness were laughable. As a member of the board did this not annoy you? Considering the way the club has backed him in the three transfer windows he has managed us through to blame a lack of money for our current plight is surely a sign that he is simply not the man for us.

He has been given ample funds to put a team on the pitch worthy of this club, I am sure that Mowbray or Collins would have loved his budget during their times in charge. I am confident that the wages/signings budget at Hibs is well in excess of those at Falkirk, Kilmarnock, Hamilton, Inverness, St Mirren & Dundee Utd with perhaps Aberdeen on an equal footing. I have seen all those sides outplay us in games this season.

I would also like to point out that my letter is not driven by poor results but the way we are playing. I would accept our league position and points tally if I felt that I was at least watching a team trying to win points by playing football. As a Hibs fan I don’t have delusions of grandeur, I have never expected us to win the league or even a cup, what I do expect is to be able to enjoy my trips to Easter Road, if I’m not enjoying it what reason do I have to come along.

I don’t want this letter to turn into nothing more than a rant at the club so I will make my final point now. I will not attend another Hibs match while Mixu Paatelainen is in charge and enclose my season ticket stub for Saturday’s game against Falkirk. I will post each and every stub individually for the rest of the season as long as he remains in charge.

An excellent letter and one I agree with 100% up until the last paragraph.

I am not criticising your non-attendance, it's just that I couldn't stay away through choice. Other than that I could have written that letter myself.

Did you consider copying Rod Petrie in?

Let us know what response you get if any.

maturehibby
25-02-2009, 01:02 PM
and if the same style of letter went in at Man united against Fergie had went in where would they be now

MB62
25-02-2009, 01:03 PM
Let us know what response you get if any.

:faf: :faf: :faf:

Don't hold your breath on that happening.

Excellent letter, which will unfortunately fall on deaf ears.

H18sry
25-02-2009, 01:04 PM
Stand by for a standard reply like the one below.



Thank you for your letter dated 25th February 2009. All comments and queries from fans are welcomed by the Club and please be assured that your message has been communicated to the Board.

Everyone associated with Hibernian FC is disappointed with the result against Inverness Caledonian Thistle and recent form.

The Board is fully committed to supporting the Manager in his goal of ensuring that Hibernian FC has a winning team on the park. The Board will also never lose sight of Hibernian’s need to be competing for honours.

The backing of supporters for the team is a vital part of us all working together to achieve our aspirations for Hibernian FC now and in the future.

Thank you for taking the time to write with your views and for continuing to support your Club

Scott Lindsay
The Hibernian Football Club Limited

Just Jimmy
25-02-2009, 01:05 PM
top notch. I disagree to an extent on sending letters basically asking for a man to be sacked from his job, but in the end its the same as complaing if the service from a member of staff in a resturant was rotten.

Mixu Out.

Newhaven
25-02-2009, 01:06 PM
and if the same style of letter went in at Man united against Fergie had went in where would they be now

So your saying that your happy in the direction that HFC are going under Mixu's guidance?

MB62
25-02-2009, 01:07 PM
and if the same style of letter went in at Man united against Fergie had went in where would they be now

Probably still up there fighting for every trophy, just be under a different manager.

Are you suggesting we should be happy to let things plod along under the leadership (or lack of it)?

bingo70
25-02-2009, 01:07 PM
So your saying that your happy in the direction that HFC are going under Mixu's guidance?

IMO the comparison is so ridiculous its not even worth commenting on mate.

Franck is God
25-02-2009, 01:08 PM
An excellent letter and one I agree with 100% up until the last paragraph.

I am not criticising your non-attendance, it's just that I couldn't stay away through choice. Other than that I could have written that letter myself.

Did you consider copying Rod Petrie in?

Let us know what response you get if any.


I will definitely post any response I get.

It was not an easy decision to not go on Saturday.

I can completely understand if anyone disagrees with this, I don't like doing it but I feel that empty seats is what will get the message across.

I'm not withdrawing my support for the club as they already have my money. I feel bad not supporting the team but as I'm in the West Upper I'm generally too busy eating my prawn sandwiches to support the team vocally anyway....:wink:

I could have sent the letter to Rod Petrie but decided that as Scott Lindsay is the Chief Executive it should go to him.

HibbingtonHibs
25-02-2009, 01:09 PM
Can't believe that you've, so far, gotten away with an "open letter" thread. Better watch your back.

Lindsay will be peshing his pants laughing - you don't say anything he won't have heard in the stand.

khib70
25-02-2009, 01:10 PM
I sent this letter this morning. Some of you may agree with the sentiment but not the course of action or you may agree with it all. Just thought I would share it.



FAO Mr Scott Lindsay

23rd February 2009



Dear Sir,

It is with sadness that I actually write this letter to you today but displays by the team I have loved and supported all my life have driven me to this.

I have been a massive supporter of the way the club has been run in recent years, the appointment of Tony Mowbray followed by John Collins were applauded by me and many others. The way the club has been run financially has also been a huge plus for me which has allowed the development of our training centre and ongoing improvements to the ground. Not to mention our youth set up which is still producing excellent young players.

However I feel that the appointment of Mixu Paatelainen was an error in judgment. This is not a recent revelation to me and to be honest I have felt this way since his first match in charge. But as a loyal Hibs fan I looked beyond my own reservations and still renewed my season ticket for 2008-09.

This season has been nothing short of dreadful. His inability to get the players physically fit and capable of passing the ball to each other is worrying enough His insistence to blame everything and everyone other than himself for defeats and poor performances is quite frankly pathetic. Last week when he publicly blamed Paul Hanlon for not winning the game at Kilmarnock was unforgivable and his excuses after Saturday’s defeat at Inverness were laughable. As a member of the board did this not annoy you? Considering the way the club has backed him in the three transfer windows he has managed us through to blame a lack of money for our current plight is surely a sign that he is simply not the man for us.

He has been given ample funds to put a team on the pitch worthy of this club, I am sure that Mowbray or Collins would have loved his budget during their times in charge. I am confident that the wages/signings budget at Hibs is well in excess of those at Falkirk, Kilmarnock, Hamilton, Inverness, St Mirren & Dundee Utd with perhaps Aberdeen on an equal footing. I have seen all those sides outplay us in games this season.

I would also like to point out that my letter is not driven by poor results but the way we are playing. I would accept our league position and points tally if I felt that I was at least watching a team trying to win points by playing football. As a Hibs fan I don’t have delusions of grandeur, I have never expected us to win the league or even a cup, what I do expect is to be able to enjoy my trips to Easter Road, if I’m not enjoying it what reason do I have to come along.

I don’t want this letter to turn into nothing more than a rant at the club so I will make my final point now. I will not attend another Hibs match while Mixu Paatelainen is in charge and enclose my season ticket stub for Saturday’s game against Falkirk. I will post each and every stub individually for the rest of the season as long as he remains in charge.
:top marks Absolutely excellent in both tone and content, and while I will continue to attend home games, I totally understand your decision not to, and I will not be renewing my ST as long as Mixu is still in charge.

I also understand others' cynicism about whether the board will listen, let alone do anything about it, but what you say needs saying regardless.

Coco Bryce
25-02-2009, 01:10 PM
and if the same style of letter went in at Man united against Fergie had went in where would they be now

Who gives a toss about Man U :yawn:

This is a Hibs problem :bitchy:

Killiehibbie
25-02-2009, 01:15 PM
and if the same style of letter went in at Man united against Fergie had went in where would they be now

Fergie had won trophies as a manager. Mixu would take Man U mid table and think he was doing ok.

Speedway
25-02-2009, 01:16 PM
I sent this letter this morning. Some of you may agree with the sentiment but not the course of action or you may agree with it all. Just thought I would share it.



I will not attend another Hibs match while Mixu Paatelainen is in charge and enclose my season ticket stub for Saturday’s game against Falkirk. I will post each and every stub individually for the rest of the season as long as he remains in charge. [/FONT]

So if Mixu WAS to turn it around and get the team playing the way you describe, success or not, you won't be back anyway until he's gone?

HIBERNIAN-0762
25-02-2009, 01:18 PM
Stand by for a standard reply like the one below.



Thank you for your letter dated 25th February 2009. All comments and queries from fans are welcomed by the Club and please be assured that your message has been communicated to the Board.

Everyone associated with Hibernian FC is disappointed with the result against Inverness Caledonian Thistle and recent form.

The Board is fully committed to supporting the Manager in his goal of ensuring that Hibernian FC has a winning team on the park. The Board will also never lose sight of Hibernian’s need to be competing for honours.

The backing of supporters for the team is a vital part of us all working together to achieve our aspirations for Hibernian FC now and in the future.

Thank you for taking the time to write with your views and for continuing to support your Club

Scott Lindsay
The Hibernian Football Club Limited


100% correct :top marks

CB_NO3
25-02-2009, 01:19 PM
:top marks Absolutely excellent in both tone and content, and while I will continue to attend home games, I totally understand your decision not to, and I will not be renewing my ST as long as Mixu is still in charge.

I also understand others' cynicism about whether the board will listen, let alone do anything about it, but what you say needs saying regardless.
Dont bother coming back at all :bye:. What if Mixu signed some quality players pre season and where challenging for Europe next season, would you still not come back?.

I know its highly unlikey but hey.

bingo70
25-02-2009, 01:24 PM
Dont bother coming back at all :bye:. What if Mixu signed some quality players pre season and where challenging for Europe next season, would you still not come back?.

I know its highly unlikey but hey.

its not about the players though, its that he's unable to organise or motivate them.

Btw next season its more than likely we'll have to replace the monk, jones, Fletch, Rosa, as well as sort our full back and midfield problem (still no replacement for Boozy FFS), so if we think we're bad this season i think if Mixu is still with us next season we'll be in for a shock.

Franck is God
25-02-2009, 01:25 PM
So if Mixu WAS to turn it around and get the team playing the way you describe, success or not, you won't be back anyway until he's gone?

I think any improvement would be a temporary situation. I actually think we'll get a win on Saturday. So far he has managed to pick up positive results when it looks like he is about to get the chop and I think Saturday's game will be the same. 2-0 Hibs. An early Riordan free kick and a late goal from Fletcher after Falkirk have dominated the game but not scored is my prediction.

If he remains as manager then I have seen my last game until next season. I won't be renewing my ST but will go week by week.

Joe's ice cream
25-02-2009, 01:25 PM
Dont bother coming back at all :bye:. What if Mixu signed some quality players pre season and where challenging for Europe next season, would you still not come back?.

I know its highly unlikey but hey.

So left to you, no one is allowed an alternative opinion,!!

Don't lets turn this into a i'm a better fan than you thread.

I would have to think long and hard about not atending games, but totaly agree that this guy has the right to make up his own mind and demonstrate how he see's fit.

:agree::agree:

AndyM_1875
25-02-2009, 01:25 PM
Why do we need to see it ?

:jamboclow

I know FIG personally and have been the best of friends with him for many many years. He is no jambo.



The letter is excellent BTW Big Man. I wholeheartedly agree.:thumbsup:

sam armstrong
25-02-2009, 01:25 PM
I sent this letter this morning. Some of you may agree with the sentiment but not the course of action or you may agree with it all. Just thought I would share it.



FAO Mr Scott Lindsay

23rd February 2009



Dear Sir,

It is with sadness that I actually write this letter to you today but displays by the team I have loved and supported all my life have driven me to this.

I have been a massive supporter of the way the club has been run in recent years, the appointment of Tony Mowbray followed by John Collins were applauded by me and many others. The way the club has been run financially has also been a huge plus for me which has allowed the development of our training centre and ongoing improvements to the ground. Not to mention our youth set up which is still producing excellent young players.

However I feel that the appointment of Mixu Paatelainen was an error in judgment. This is not a recent revelation to me and to be honest I have felt this way since his first match in charge. But as a loyal Hibs fan I looked beyond my own reservations and still renewed my season ticket for 2008-09.

This season has been nothing short of dreadful. His inability to get the players physically fit and capable of passing the ball to each other is worrying enough His insistence to blame everything and everyone other than himself for defeats and poor performances is quite frankly pathetic. Last week when he publicly blamed Paul Hanlon for not winning the game at Kilmarnock was unforgivable and his excuses after Saturday’s defeat at Inverness were laughable. As a member of the board did this not annoy you? Considering the way the club has backed him in the three transfer windows he has managed us through to blame a lack of money for our current plight is surely a sign that he is simply not the man for us.

He has been given ample funds to put a team on the pitch worthy of this club, I am sure that Mowbray or Collins would have loved his budget during their times in charge. I am confident that the wages/signings budget at Hibs is well in excess of those at Falkirk, Kilmarnock, Hamilton, Inverness, St Mirren & Dundee Utd with perhaps Aberdeen on an equal footing. I have seen all those sides outplay us in games this season.

I would also like to point out that my letter is not driven by poor results but the way we are playing. I would accept our league position and points tally if I felt that I was at least watching a team trying to win points by playing football. As a Hibs fan I don’t have delusions of grandeur, I have never expected us to win the league or even a cup, what I do expect is to be able to enjoy my trips to Easter Road, if I’m not enjoying it what reason do I have to come along.

I don’t want this letter to turn into nothing more than a rant at the club so I will make my final point now. I will not attend another Hibs match while Mixu Paatelainen is in charge and enclose my season ticket stub for Saturday’s game against Falkirk. I will post each and every stub individually for the rest of the season as long as he remains in charge.

Good Letter but I am afraid John Collins was a mistake also.

MyJo
25-02-2009, 01:27 PM
excellently constructed and composed letter :agree:

makes the points we are all concerned about while acknowledging that the club has been superbly run until the appointment of Mixu which is the case. I wouldn't hold my breath for the proper response its deserves though unfortunately.

and as far as im aware its been addressed and posted to Scott Lindsay directly rather than just putting it out into a public forum expecting it to reach its target audience somehow so it aint a open letter, the guy is just looking for opinions from his fellow hibs fans to find out if his feelings are represantitive of the others on this board so there is no need to have a go at him.

CB_NO3
25-02-2009, 01:27 PM
So left to you, no one is allowed an alternative opinion,!!

Don't lets turn this into a i'm a better fan than you thread.

I would have to think long and hard about not atending games, but totaly agree that this guy has the right to make up his own mind and demonstrate how he see's fit.

:agree::agree:

This is nothing to do with being a better fan. I am asking a question that if Mixu turned it around would he still not go.:bye:

Jonnyboy
25-02-2009, 01:28 PM
Why do we need to see it ?

:jamboclow

Harsh and uncalled for Chuckie

The OP is clearly hurting and felt strongly enough about it that he decided to share his concerns. He states quite clearly that not everyone will see it his way.

If you disagree, say so but don't insult the guy by calling him a Jambo clown :grr:

bingo70
25-02-2009, 01:30 PM
This is nothing to do with being a better fan. I am asking a question that if Mixu turned it around would he still not go.:bye:

Think its pretty clear that the whole point of the letter is that in the OP's opinion thats not going to happen so its not a consideration he's having to make.

Jonnyboy
25-02-2009, 01:31 PM
Can't believe that you've, so far, gotten away with an "open letter" thread. Better watch your back.

Lindsay will be peshing his pants laughing - you don't say anything he won't have heard in the stand.

It's a good thread and a good topic. If the OP had posted this as his thoughts as opposed to an open letter it would have generated the kind of debate that is worthy of being on this board. No idea why he needs to 'watch his back.'

Peevemor
25-02-2009, 01:34 PM
I know FIG personally and have been the best of friends with him for many many years. He is no jambo.



The letter is excellent BTW Big Man. I wholeheartedly agree.:thumbsup:

Another yam! :rolleyes:

:devil:

CB_NO3
25-02-2009, 01:34 PM
Think its pretty clear that the whole point of the letter is that in the OP's opinion thats not going to happen so its not a consideration he's having to make.

My post is not aimed at the original poster, someone said if Mixu was in charge next season he would not renew his season ticket. I replied saying how would you feel is Mixu was top of the league next season after 10 games ( very highly unlikely I know ) but would you still not go along or would you change your mind.

PS I am all for getting Mixu out aswell.

erskine-hibby
25-02-2009, 01:34 PM
Its a shame you feel that you need to go to this degree to show how you feel, but if this will make you feel any better who am i to argue?.
There are a few points though i would question.
You say that the club has been run well, both on and off the park, but feel that in this case (i.e. the appointment of MP) has been an 'error in judgement'. What about some of the other 'errors' that have been made such as going behind the managers back during the dressing room bust up, or not backing both TM and JC with the funds they wanted to strengthen the team?, indeed it appears the club have made numerous 'errors in judgement' no??
You blame MP for the players, proessional players, inability to pass a ball?. I would expect 'professional players' to be able to do this with little, or no, coaching:dunno: You further state that it is not the poor results, but rather the way we are playing that has driven you to write this letter?. Presumably you would rather see us bottom but playing 'free flowing football'??.
The bit that strikes me most, though, is that you claim to be a 'massive supporter' and a 'loyal Hibs fan', but will not go back until you get what you want. Indeed, you are going to send the club all the ticket stubs, until your demands are met, to reinforce this...sounds more like blackmail to me and not very 'loyal' IMHO.

Joe's ice cream
25-02-2009, 01:35 PM
This is nothing to do with being a better fan. I am asking a question that if Mixu turned it around would he still not go.:bye:

That's only a question he can answer, i guess that he may, but at this time you can't prevent him the right to make a stand now against what he see's wrong with the club.

I for one would't be able to actualy compose a letter like that without it turning into some kind of rant!!!

Oh and :bye: to you as well

Hiber-nation
25-02-2009, 01:35 PM
Stand by for a standard reply like the one below.



Thank you for your letter dated 25th February 2009. All comments and queries from fans are welcomed by the Club and please be assured that your message has been communicated to the Board.

Everyone associated with Hibernian FC is disappointed with the result against Inverness Caledonian Thistle and recent form.

The Board is fully committed to supporting the Manager in his goal of ensuring that Hibernian FC has a winning team on the park. The Board will also never lose sight of Hibernian’s need to be competing for honours.

The backing of supporters for the team is a vital part of us all working together to achieve our aspirations for Hibernian FC now and in the future.

Thank you for taking the time to write with your views and for continuing to support your Club

Scott Lindsay
The Hibernian Football Club Limited

Yep, that's the one I got except from Tim Gardiner.

I suppose all you can expect in reply is a standard letter when the club is being bombarded with correspondence from the fans. I wonder how many e-mails/letters they've received.

JoeT
25-02-2009, 01:35 PM
I think this board should just be closed for a week or 2 to let everyone calm down a bit!

bingo70
25-02-2009, 01:38 PM
I think this board should just be closed for a week or 2 to let everyone calm down a bit!

in 2 weeks time we'll have a run of fixtures that include hearts, dundee utd, aberdeen and rangers so i'd say waiting 2 weeks might not be long enough :wink:

CB_NO3
25-02-2009, 01:38 PM
That's only a question he can answer, i guess that he may, but at this time you can't prevent him the right to make a stand now against what he see's wrong with the club.

I for one would't be able to actualy compose a letter like that without it turning into some kind of rant!!!

Oh and :bye: to you as well
So why are you bringing this better fan thing into it, when I was asking a question, about him renewing his season ticket next season if we became successfull under Mixu. :greengrin

banarc7062
25-02-2009, 01:46 PM
and if the same style of letter went in at Man united against Fergie had went in where would they be now

No comparison. Fergie had already proved his worth with Aberdeen splitting the OF weegies in the process as well as winning trophies.:bitchy:

Peevemor
25-02-2009, 01:48 PM
I think this board should just be closed for a week or 2 to let everyone calm down a bit!

Shut it ya f***** radge! :grr:

:cool2:

Badge
25-02-2009, 01:49 PM
:top marksFIG. Agree 100% with the exception of going to games. I will still be at Easter Road but after Saturday I will think long and hard before attending any more away games.
Very interested to see what kind of response you get from the club.

Beefster
25-02-2009, 02:00 PM
I agree entirely with the sentiment but believe that there are more potent ways for the support to communicate their dissatisfaction to the Board.

However, I feel that the OP's argument has been diminished by the fact that he's admitted thinking Mixu was a mistake from the first game in charge. That's gives the Board the opportunity to say "Mixu was never going to win with this guy".

Just my tuppence.

chorley_fm
25-02-2009, 02:07 PM
So if Mixu WAS to turn it around and get the team playing the way you describe, success or not, you won't be back anyway until he's gone?

thats a bit like saying ' if yer auntie had baws she'd be yer uncle' is it not.

I'm sure the OP wanted Mixu to succeed, by playing entertaining football, unfortunately, he is toiling and the team are suffering.

Thanks for the playing memories Mixu, but its time to call an end to your management reign.

LancashireHibby
25-02-2009, 02:08 PM
Thanks for the playing memories Mixu, but its time to call an end to your management reign.

My sentiments exactly.

steakbake
25-02-2009, 02:14 PM
Good letter.

I emailed some time ago and was fed some guff about how everyone at Hibs would love to see us win every game.

This was despite me saying I do not expect to see us win every game. I expect us only to challenge and for our team to go out with coherent formation, tactics and with a team selection based on good recent form.

We do not get any of this.

Im so sick of Hibs just now, Mixu in particular. I've no doubt under a new manager, the team would play differently.

I seem to spend most of my time on H.Net trawling threads in the hope of seeing breaking news that he's been binned.

I'll be cheering when he finally does go.

stubru59
25-02-2009, 02:22 PM
An excellent letter and yes it will receive the standard reply. But the reply will not be what the board actually think.

Anybody watching us perform over the season will be in little doubt that something is not quite right.

The question is, do the board have an alternative candidate likely to turn things round.

Also, will all the upheaval of bringing a new guy in (at this stage) make much difference to our season?

I would suggest that irrespective of our result against Falkirk we are now entering dangerous territory. Poor performances are now being matched by a lack of effort.

It is in this context that the board need to act.

Winston Ingram
25-02-2009, 02:22 PM
Great letter - Let's all write one:greengrin

MB62
25-02-2009, 02:29 PM
You further state that it is not the poor results, but rather the way we are playing that has driven you to write this letter?. Presumably you would rather see us bottom but playing 'free flowing football'??.


How on earth do you come to this conclusion :confused:

Why would playing free flowing football automatically mean we would be bottom of the league? Could it also not mean that we could be challanging for 3rd or maybe even higher?
Poor attempt at trying to turn the point round IMO.
I have given up watching Hibs because the standard of football was terrible, it had nothing to do with the results. In fact I would probably say the results have been better than what I expected them to be, given the level of poor tactics and ability.
I am very much in the 'won't be back until Mixu goes' camp because I have absolutely no confidence in him turning things around. If he happens to prove me wrong and we start playing decent fitba, I will be delighted, totally amazed, but delighted.
I don't see how a manager can publicly slate his players for not being able to pass the ball 10 yards to a team mate when it appears to me that the style Mixu has us playing, if you are 10 yards away from a Hibs player with the ball, it will go flying over your head for somebody to hopefully chase. Maybe if he is concerned about thier ability to pass a ball, he should get them to practice this in training and try and adjust his tactics to suit this style of play.
THE BALL IS ROUND.

erskine-hibby
25-02-2009, 02:38 PM
How on earth do you come to this conclusion :confused:

Why would playing free flowing football automatically mean we would be bottom of the league? Could it also not mean that we could be challanging for 3rd or maybe even higher?
Poor attempt at trying to turn the point round IMO.
I have given up watching Hibs because the standard of football was terrible, it had nothing to do with the results. In fact I would probably say the results have been better than what I expected them to be, given the level of poor tactics and ability.
I am very much in the 'won't be back until Mixu goes' camp because I have absolutely no confidence in him turning things around. If he happens to prove me wrong and we start playing decent fitba, I will be delighted, totally amazed, but delighted.
I don't see how a manager can publicly slate his players for not being able to pass the ball 10 yards to a team mate when it appears to me that the style Mixu has us playing, if you are 10 yards away from a Hibs player with the ball, it will go flying over your head for somebody to hopefully chase. Maybe if he is concerned about thier ability to pass a ball, he should get them to practice this in training and try and adjust his tactics to suit this style of play.
THE BALL IS ROUND.

It is not me that is twisting things around. If you care to look what i wrote you would see that i was merely pointing to the statement that it was not the results but the way we are playing. So presumably it doesn't matter about the results but rather the style of football on show.

bingo70
25-02-2009, 02:43 PM
It is not me that is twisting things around. If you care to look what i wrote you would see that i was merely pointing to the statement that it was not the results but the way we are playing. So presumably it doesn't matter about the results but rather the style of football on show.

I think its fair to say people would be a lot more patient if we were playing well but just not getting the results, of course though if we were bottom of the league then that would represent a different issue as the club can't afford to even consider relegation.

PeeJay
25-02-2009, 02:47 PM
Amazed at the number of people praising this letter: this is absolutely symptomatic of why our club never wins anything – too many Hibs fans want nothing more than a wee bit of enjoyment of a Saturday afternoon! It seems that there’s no genuine ambition or bite involved, no determination at the club to achieve anything, no intention of going the extra mile: on the one hand, the club sells its best players every so often to polish the finances and on the other hand, fans like this one express a pitiful willingness for nothing more than having a bit of fun at ER every now and then!! Years ago, Alex Cropley summed it all up in the TT video/DVD when he said there was a serious lack of disgust at getting beat in the team, and when he went down to England he entered a different world, where winning was everything! Maybe that is why TT never cashed in on their potential, and although the current team is a long way short of such potential at least they still don’t seem to mind getting beat either: so nothing much seems to have changed!

Sorry, I find it impossible to agree with letters like this, particularly when they are so peppered with a grovelling willingness to accept mediocrity as long as the football on show looks good and the trip down to ER is enjoyable?? Stuff that, I think fans should expect their team to be challenging for the league and the cups and playing in Europe: otherwise there is no point to it at all!

As to the comments on Mixu's incessant complaints about it being the players’ fault, e.g. Hanlon – well Hanlon’s playing with the big boys now and when he make a stupid ‘wee-boy’ mistake like he did he at Killie, it’s perfectly OK for Mixu (or any manager) to complain about it, surely? How is that supposed to be Mixu’s fault? Anyway, managers are always complaining that players/refs/fans/God/whatever didn’t do what they’re supposed to. I don’t recall too many managers saying ‘it was my fault’.

As long as this defeatist spirit rules amongst the hearts and minds of too many Hibs players and – it seems to me - Hibs fans, we will achieve nothing: but never mind as long as we think we’re great then what do statistics, league positions or cups in the cupboard matter?
I don’t think that the letter will make any lasting impression on the board, because I don't think the 'looking for enjoyment' factor carries much weight with it: so why should the Board act on it? I feel more constructive criticism of Hibs players, manager, Board, Club, fans and setup with clear, precise steps geared towards achieving something tangible for the club would be a more rewarding move than simply saying: sack the manager or I'm not coming back!.

hibiedude
25-02-2009, 02:48 PM
I sent this letter this morning. Some of you may agree with the sentiment but not the course of action or you may agree with it all. Just thought I would share it.



FAO Mr Scott Lindsay

23rd February 2009



Dear Sir,

It is with sadness that I actually write this letter to you today but displays by the team I have loved and supported all my life have driven me to this.

I have been a massive supporter of the way the club has been run in recent years, the appointment of Tony Mowbray followed by John Collins were applauded by me and many others. The way the club has been run financially has also been a huge plus for me which has allowed the development of our training centre and ongoing improvements to the ground. Not to mention our youth set up which is still producing excellent young players.

However I feel that the appointment of Mixu Paatelainen was an error in judgment. This is not a recent revelation to me and to be honest I have felt this way since his first match in charge. But as a loyal Hibs fan I looked beyond my own reservations and still renewed my season ticket for 2008-09.

This season has been nothing short of dreadful. His inability to get the players physically fit and capable of passing the ball to each other is worrying enough His insistence to blame everything and everyone other than himself for defeats and poor performances is quite frankly pathetic. Last week when he publicly blamed Paul Hanlon for not winning the game at Kilmarnock was unforgivable and his excuses after Saturday’s defeat at Inverness were laughable. As a member of the board did this not annoy you? Considering the way the club has backed him in the three transfer windows he has managed us through to blame a lack of money for our current plight is surely a sign that he is simply not the man for us.

He has been given ample funds to put a team on the pitch worthy of this club, I am sure that Mowbray or Collins would have loved his budget during their times in charge. I am confident that the wages/signings budget at Hibs is well in excess of those at Falkirk, Kilmarnock, Hamilton, Inverness, St Mirren & Dundee Utd with perhaps Aberdeen on an equal footing. I have seen all those sides outplay us in games this season.

I would also like to point out that my letter is not driven by poor results but the way we are playing. I would accept our league position and points tally if I felt that I was at least watching a team trying to win points by playing football. As a Hibs fan I don’t have delusions of grandeur, I have never expected us to win the league or even a cup, what I do expect is to be able to enjoy my trips to Easter Road, if I’m not enjoying it what reason do I have to come along.

I don’t want this letter to turn into nothing more than a rant at the club so I will make my final point now. I will not attend another Hibs match while Mixu Paatelainen is in charge and enclose my season ticket stub for Saturday’s game against Falkirk. I will post each and every stub individually for the rest of the season as long as he remains in charge.

:top marks

A very good and Sincere and honest post, I take my hat of to you SIR :thumbsup:

Franck is God
25-02-2009, 02:49 PM
It is not me that is twisting things around. If you care to look what i wrote you would see that i was merely pointing to the statement that it was not the results but the way we are playing. So presumably it doesn't matter about the results but rather the style of football on show.

I didn't take any offence from it.

Personally I judge us more on performance than on results. It was one of the things that I liked most about Mowbrays management style. Of course results are important but his attitude was that if our performance levels were high every week then results would come naturally.

Is that not why we accepted some pretty silly defeats under his management yet still turned up every week knowing that we had at least been playing in the right way we were just having an off day?

MB62
25-02-2009, 02:52 PM
It is not me that is twisting things around. If you care to look what i wrote you would see that i was merely pointing to the statement that it was not the results but the way we are playing. So presumably it doesn't matter about the results but rather the style of football on show.

It is indeed yourself who turned things around.
You said Presumably you would rather see us bottom but playing 'free flowing football'??.

Nobody except yourself mentioned anything to do with being bottom. You obviously assume that playing free flowing football must automatically result in being bottom, I don't see why that would be the case.

smurf
25-02-2009, 02:56 PM
Good letter.

erskine-hibby
25-02-2009, 02:58 PM
I think its fair to say people would be a lot more patient if we were playing well but just not getting the results, of course though if we were bottom of the league then that would represent a different issue as the club can't afford to even consider relegation.

Ah! Now i think we are getting to the real issue here and that is we played like world beaters under TM but won nothing. We managed a cup under JC, but so far under MP we have appeared to go backwards. I put it to you and everyone else that we were already going backwards near the end of TM's tenure due to the massive clear out of real quality players. Money was not made available to JC to even try to replace those sold. Whats worse is that the board (RP) went behind his back to talk to the players over the dressing room bust up. It has fallen on MP's shoulders to try and pick all the pieces up. Of course, it was always going to be a big ask of any manager, let alone a relatively inexperienced one, to build from the bottom, it was always going to be a painful, and long, process, but it appears few are willing to accept this.

erskine-hibby
25-02-2009, 03:03 PM
I didn't take any offence from it.

Personally I judge us more on performance than on results. It was one of the things that I liked most about Mowbrays management style. Of course results are important but his attitude was that if our performance levels were high every week then results would come naturally.

Is that not why we accepted some pretty silly defeats under his management yet still turned up every week knowing that we had at least been playing in the right way we were just having an off day?

And neither should you take offence as none was intended.
I was merely pointing out, or rather questioning, some of the things you gave as reasons and your subsequent actions.
You do as you see fit, infact i admire your actions (to an extent), i just don't happen to agree with them.

erskine-hibby
25-02-2009, 03:04 PM
It is indeed yourself who turned things around.
You said Presumably you would rather see us bottom but playing 'free flowing football'??.

Nobody except yourself mentioned anything to do with being bottom. You obviously assume that playing free flowing football must automatically result in being bottom, I don't see why that would be the case.

No!!
That is a question.

MB62
25-02-2009, 03:11 PM
No!!
That is a question.

Ok, but why ask that question? I don't understand why you would ask that.

khib70
25-02-2009, 03:21 PM
Amazed at the number of people praising this letter: this is absolutely symptomatic of why our club never wins anything – too many Hibs fans want nothing more than a wee bit of enjoyment of a Saturday afternoon! It seems that there’s no genuine ambition or bite involved, no determination at the club to achieve anything, no intention of going the extra mile: on the one hand, the club sells its best players every so often to polish the finances and on the other hand, fans like this one express a pitiful willingness for nothing more than having a bit of fun at ER every now and then!! Years ago, Alex Cropley summed it all up in the TT video/DVD when he said there was a serious lack of disgust at getting beat in the team, and when he went down to England he entered a different world, where winning was everything! Maybe that is why TT never cashed in on their potential, and although the current team is a long way short of such potential at least they still don’t seem to mind getting beat either: so nothing much seems to have changed!

Sorry, I find it impossible to agree with letters like this, particularly when they are so peppered with a grovelling willingness to accept mediocrity as long as the football on show looks good and the trip down to ER is enjoyable?? Stuff that, I think fans should expect their team to be challenging for the league and the cups and playing in Europe: otherwise there is no point to it at all!

As to the comments on Mixu's incessant complaints about it being the players’ fault, e.g. Hanlon – well Hanlon’s playing with the big boys now and when he make a stupid ‘wee-boy’ mistake like he did he at Killie, it’s perfectly OK for Mixu (or any manager) to complain about it, surely? How is that supposed to be Mixu’s fault? Anyway, managers are always complaining that players/refs/fans/God/whatever didn’t do what they’re supposed to. I don’t recall too many managers saying ‘it was my fault’.

As long as this defeatist spirit rules amongst the hearts and minds of too many Hibs players and – it seems to me - Hibs fans, we will achieve nothing: but never mind as long as we think we’re great then what do statistics, league positions or cups in the cupboard matter?
I don’t think that the letter will make any lasting impression on the board, because I don't think the 'looking for enjoyment' factor carries much weight with it: so why should the Board act on it? I feel more constructive criticism of Hibs players, manager, Board, Club, fans and setup with clear, precise steps geared towards achieving something tangible for the club would be a more rewarding move than simply saying: sack the manager or I'm not coming back!.
Apart from the shouting,which is just irritating, your post misses one important point. So the majority of us according to you and one or two others, are prepared to accept mediocrity as long as we get to watch good football? It's just winning that matters. So where is the winning now - one game since December? That really proves that playing ugly gets results, eh? Just have a quick look at just about any top class team in Europe. How many of them don't play open, attacking football? Would a dose of hoofball make Manure or Barca any better?

The logic of your argument is that playing good football leads to failure. This is numpty logic which bears no relation to the facts

erskine-hibby
25-02-2009, 03:42 PM
Ok, but why ask that question? I don't understand why you would ask that.


To further understand the reasoning behind the OP's actions.

PeeJay
25-02-2009, 04:12 PM
Apart from the shouting,which is just irritating, your post misses one important point. So the majority of us according to you and one or two others, are prepared to accept mediocrity as long as we get to watch good football? It's just winning that matters. So where is the winning now - one game since December? That really proves that playing ugly gets results, eh? Just have a quick look at just about any top class team in Europe. How many of them don't play open, attacking football? Would a dose of hoofball make Manure or Barca any better?

The logic of your argument is that playing good football leads to failure. This is numpty logic which bears no relation to the facts

No – I haven’t missed the point at all. I never said playing good football won’t win anything, I questioned the OP’s claim that our points total and poor performance is acceptable if we (as a team) at least tried and he enjoyed his trip to ER – that’s x@xx**!!! It’s symptomatic for Hibs in particular and Scottish football in general, as long as we all have a good time it doesn’t matter that we never win anything: other teams win things, like the Barcelona you mentioned.
I’m questioning the attitude of many of our fans which seem to be prepared to accept mediocrity, while feigning outrage at lack of success – the OP also stated that he didn’t expect to win anything another miserable trait ... I think Cropley made an extremely valid point all those years ago: the deep-rooted will to win is what has always been missing at ER. Winning is everything, if you ask me: it doesn’t have to be by ugly means, I’m not advocating that at all, and I live in a country where winning and taking part in finals is everything and expected: anything else is not acceptable. It’s the other way round in Scotland and at ER it seems. Our current crisis/problem at ER is the same old one that we’ve always had. Why don’t we ever put up a sustained challenge or win something serious? It’s down to something more fundamental than the current incumbent in the managerial position, surely?

bighairyfaeleith
25-02-2009, 04:14 PM
I sent this letter this morning. Some of you may agree with the sentiment but not the course of action or you may agree with it all. Just thought I would share it.



FAO Mr Scott Lindsay

23rd February 2009



Dear Sir,

It is with sadness that I actually write this letter to you today but displays by the team I have loved and supported all my life have driven me to this.

I have been a massive supporter of the way the club has been run in recent years, the appointment of Tony Mowbray followed by John Collins were applauded by me and many others. The way the club has been run financially has also been a huge plus for me which has allowed the development of our training centre and ongoing improvements to the ground. Not to mention our youth set up which is still producing excellent young players.

However I feel that the appointment of Mixu Paatelainen was an error in judgment. This is not a recent revelation to me and to be honest I have felt this way since his first match in charge. But as a loyal Hibs fan I looked beyond my own reservations and still renewed my season ticket for 2008-09.

This season has been nothing short of dreadful. His inability to get the players physically fit and capable of passing the ball to each other is worrying enough His insistence to blame everything and everyone other than himself for defeats and poor performances is quite frankly pathetic. Last week when he publicly blamed Paul Hanlon for not winning the game at Kilmarnock was unforgivable and his excuses after Saturday’s defeat at Inverness were laughable. As a member of the board did this not annoy you? Considering the way the club has backed him in the three transfer windows he has managed us through to blame a lack of money for our current plight is surely a sign that he is simply not the man for us.

He has been given ample funds to put a team on the pitch worthy of this club, I am sure that Mowbray or Collins would have loved his budget during their times in charge. I am confident that the wages/signings budget at Hibs is well in excess of those at Falkirk, Kilmarnock, Hamilton, Inverness, St Mirren & Dundee Utd with perhaps Aberdeen on an equal footing. I have seen all those sides outplay us in games this season.

I would also like to point out that my letter is not driven by poor results but the way we are playing. I would accept our league position and points tally if I felt that I was at least watching a team trying to win points by playing football. As a Hibs fan I don’t have delusions of grandeur, I have never expected us to win the league or even a cup, what I do expect is to be able to enjoy my trips to Easter Road, if I’m not enjoying it what reason do I have to come along.

I don’t want this letter to turn into nothing more than a rant at the club so I will make my final point now. I will not attend another Hibs match while Mixu Paatelainen is in charge and enclose my season ticket stub for Saturday’s game against Falkirk. I will post each and every stub individually for the rest of the season as long as he remains in charge.

Well done for taking the time to write the letter, and it has some sense in it. I have to say though the final paragrapgh did make me laugh, not sure you intended it that way ofcourse. It kind of ends up as a blackmail letter with you posting your season ticket (which you have already paid for) back week at a time until your demands are met.

Problem is ofcourse, your season ticket is already paid for so it has no value:confused:

anyways I just thought i would put my tuppence worth in, and cheers for at least cheering me up:thumbsup:

ahibby
25-02-2009, 04:15 PM
To further understand the reasoning behind the OP's actions.

The reasons for his actions are pretty obvious to me. Hibs haven't played a good 90 minutes in all the games I have been to since Mixu took over. I can understand why he has said those things in his letter with the exception of the final paragraph. I dont think there is any need to tell them you won't be back this season, they'll get the message soon enough when the season tickets go on sale.

bighairyfaeleith
25-02-2009, 04:19 PM
The reasons for his actions are pretty obvious to me. Hibs haven't played a good 90 minutes in all the games I have been to since Mixu took over. I can understand why he has said those things in his letter with the exception of the final paragraph. I dont think there is any need to tell them you won't be back this season, they'll get the message soon enough when the season tickets go on sale.

Motherwell game at home near the start of the season was no bad..........


nah thats all I've got:greengrin

erskine-hibby
25-02-2009, 04:22 PM
The reasons for his actions are pretty obvious to me. Hibs haven't played a good 90 minutes in all the games I have been to since Mixu took over. I can understand why he has said those things in his letter with the exception of the final paragraph. I dont think there is any need to tell them you won't be back this season, they'll get the message soon enough when the season tickets go on sale.

As i said i can understand why he is upset and wants to let them know, but his actions contradict his claims.
Also i believe most are trying to cover an amputation with a sticking plaster. In other words the root of our problems is not only Mixu, it goes much deeper.

Gregor
25-02-2009, 04:25 PM
I live in a country where winning and taking part in finals is everything and expected: anything else is not acceptable. It’s the other way round in Scotland and at ER it seems.

Interesting point to raise. Is it not also the way in Germany to have basic salaries and massive competition bonuses (a policy I think adopted and used effectively by Jim McLean in his successful time at Dundee Utd).

Might convice the players to cut the booze and the smokes and stop the histrionics when they play a bad pass or don't get a pass, get the bloody heid down and win the ball back.

JC tried to instill some form of accountability in the players and ruffled a few feathers in the same way PLG did at Rangers.

Fergie and McLean instilled the win at all costs attitude in their players. They were not well liked but it paid dividends. A less successful manager tried the same approach and *nearly* won the league and Scottish Cup (guess the year, go on - go on).

Is Player Power now the problem ; in that they've got too much power and control over team and club. I thought the structure they tried to implement at ER whereby the players sign a long term contract, but with the chance to earn a large ear of transfer corn if they are sold (GO'C / SB / SW / DM all got a sizeable percentage of their transfer fees - but not KT since he put in a request) was a great incentive for the players to push themselves.

Could it be the case that the players are still in the huff with Petrie et al and the money they are getting?

If we get into the top half for the split, will we see more of these players being dropped in place of younger lads who are willing to push themselves on for one of Rod's golden envelope contracts?

California-Hibs
25-02-2009, 04:26 PM
I wrote a very similar email to the board earlier this week, and this was the response i got...

Mr Thompson,



Thank you for your email of 19 February 2009. All comments and queries from fans are welcomed by the Club and please be assured that your message has been communicated to the Board.



Everyone associated with Hibernian FC is disappointed with the result against Inverness Caledonian Thistle and recent form.



The Board is fully committed to supporting the Manager in his goal of ensuring that Hibernian FC has a winning team on the park. The Board will also never lose sight of Hibernian’s need to be competing for honours.



The backing of supporters for the team is a vital part of us all working together to achieve our aspirations for Hibernian FC now and in the future.



Thank you for taking the time to write with your views and for continuing to support your Club





Tim C Gardiner

Finance Director

The Hibernian Football Club Limited

lapsedhibee
25-02-2009, 04:28 PM
It is NOT: 'The Ball Has Went In The Net'
It IS: 'The Ball Has Gone In The Net'

It is NOT: 'He's Came Off His Line'
It IS: 'He's Come Off His Line'

So if Mixu WAS to turn it around and get the team playing the way you describe, success or not, you won't be back anyway until he's gone?

A pedant writes
Although some (including me) deem it to be a rather American-English affectation, strictly speaking as you're in subjunctive mood it should be "if Mixu WERE to turn it around". All the usage textbooks :blah: say so.

Gregor
25-02-2009, 04:28 PM
Problem is ofcourse, your season ticket is already paid for so it has no value

On the plus side, if you send the stub back early enough each week, the ticket office can get a ticket printed up for your seat and double their money. Perhaps Rod's onto a winner here. The man's a genius!

bighairyfaeleith
25-02-2009, 04:32 PM
On the plus side, if you send the stub back early enough each week, the ticket office can get a ticket printed up for your seat and double their money. Perhaps Rod's onto a winner here. The man's a genius!

You know I had that thought, trouble is no one wants to buy the ticket so it would be a waste of money printing it, the tache is no daft ah tell ye:wink:

AndyM_1875
25-02-2009, 04:45 PM
Amazed at the number of people praising this letter:

Are you? Jesus Christ I'm not. Hibs have been abysmal all season, from pre-season right up to now.




Sorry, I find it impossible to agree with letters like this, particularly when they are so peppered with a grovelling willingness to accept mediocrity as long as the football on show looks good and the trip down to ER is enjoyable?? Stuff that, I think fans should expect their team to be challenging for the league and the cups and playing in Europe: otherwise there is no point to it at all!

There's accepting mediocrity and accepting the reality of playing in a league dominated by 2 huge clubs who hoover up the lions share of trophies, cash and supporters. Hibs are restricted by money and being one of Scottish Football's second tier clubs along with Aberdeen, Hearts and Dundee United so if we as Hibs fans cannot be entertained by our team then why bother?



As to the comments on Mixu's incessant complaints about it being the players’ fault, e.g. Hanlon – well Hanlon’s playing with the big boys now and when he make a stupid ‘wee-boy’ mistake like he did he at Killie, it’s perfectly OK for Mixu (or any manager) to complain about it, surely? How is that supposed to be Mixu’s fault?

Sorry I'm not having that.
Mixu hung Paul Hanlon out to dry and dropped the entire blame for his side's general uselessness at Rugby Park onto a 18 year old. That was not the actions of a proper manager, that's the actions of a coward and a deluded one at that. Mixu had all game to change his tactics, did he? No.
One of Mixu's signings (Rosa) missed the best chance of the game.
So he blames Paul Hanlon for giving the ball away in a move where the Kilmarnock players still had an awful lot to do before scoring .... sorry but that's just utter bull****.

And he follows it up with that abject display at Inverness where he picked the team and set out the (baffling) formation and he's still blaming the players.

PeeJay
25-02-2009, 05:04 PM
Are you? Jesus Christ I'm not. Hibs have been abysmal all season, from pre-season right up to now.




There's accepting mediocrity and accepting the reality of playing in a league dominated by 2 huge clubs who hoover up the lions share of trophies, cash and supporters. Hibs are restricted by money and being one of Scottish Football's second tier clubs along with Aberdeen, Hearts and Dundee United so if we as Hibs fans cannot be entertained by our team then why bother?



Sorry I'm not having that.
Mixu hung Paul Hanlon out to dry and dropped the entire blame for his side's general uselessness at Rugby Park onto a 18 year old. That was not the actions of a proper manager, that's the actions of a coward and a deluded one at that. Mixu had all game to change his tactics, did he? No.
One of Mixu's signings (Rosa) missed the best chance of the game.
So he blames Paul Hanlon for giving the ball away in a move where the Kilmarnock players still had an awful lot to do before scoring .... sorry but that's just utter bull****.

And he follows it up with that abject display at Inverness where he picked the team and set out the (baffling) formation and he's still blaming the players.

1) I'm amazed at the letter and its content NOT the team's performance!
2) I have no problem with entertainment, I'm all for it: however, the OP suggested, as long as the team tried (and somehow entertained him) he would accept our lack of points and success (paraphrased somewhat!) I don't accept that!
3) You say it's not the actions of a proper manager: I don't believe he just criticised Hanlon, but anyway I believe players who make major mistakes (it cost us a goal and two points) must accept criticism, and the manager is the one to make that criticism, surely?

Brizo
25-02-2009, 05:29 PM
1) I'm amazed at the letter and its content NOT the team's performance!
2) I have no problem with entertainment, I'm all for it: however, the OP suggested, as long as the team tried (and somehow entertained him) he would accept our lack of points and success (paraphrased somewhat!) I don't accept that!
3) You say it's not the actions of a proper manager: I don't believe he just criticised Hanlon, but anyway I believe players who make major mistakes (it cost us a goal and two points) must accept criticism, and the manager is the one to make that criticism, surely?

I dont know if Hanlon was individually singled out for public criticism , im on a self imposed media ban. But most successful managers seem to keep any criticism of individual players behind closed doors.If Mixu publically criticised the laddie its a very poor exampe of man management imo.

As for the OP :top marks

scoopyboy
25-02-2009, 06:16 PM
Amazed at the number of people praising this letter: this is absolutely symptomatic of why our club never wins anything – too many Hibs fans want nothing more than a wee bit of enjoyment of a Saturday afternoon! It seems that there’s no genuine ambition or bite involved, no determination at the club to achieve anything, no intention of going the extra mile: on the one hand, the club sells its best players every so often to polish the finances and on the other hand, fans like this one express a pitiful willingness for nothing more than having a bit of fun at ER every now and then!! Years ago, Alex Cropley summed it all up in the TT video/DVD when he said there was a serious lack of disgust at getting beat in the team, and when he went down to England he entered a different world, where winning was everything! Maybe that is why TT never cashed in on their potential, and although the current team is a long way short of such potential at least they still don’t seem to mind getting beat either: so nothing much seems to have changed!







Sorry, I find it impossible to agree with letters like this, particularly when they are so peppered with a grovelling willingness to accept mediocrity as long as the football on show looks good and the trip down to ER is enjoyable?? Stuff that, I think fans should expect their team to be challenging for the league and the cups and playing in Europe: otherwise there is no point to it at all!

As to the comments on Mixu's incessant complaints about it being the players’ fault, e.g. Hanlon – well Hanlon’s playing with the big boys now and when he make a stupid ‘wee-boy’ mistake like he did he at Killie, it’s perfectly OK for Mixu (or any manager) to complain about it, surely? How is that supposed to be Mixu’s fault? Anyway, managers are always complaining that players/refs/fans/God/whatever didn’t do what they’re supposed to. I don’t recall too many managers saying ‘it was my fault’.

As long as this defeatist spirit rules amongst the hearts and minds of too many Hibs players and – it seems to me - Hibs fans, we will achieve nothing: but never mind as long as we think we’re great then what do statistics, league positions or cups in the cupboard matter?
I don’t think that the letter will make any lasting impression on the board, because I don't think the 'looking for enjoyment' factor carries much weight with it: so why should the Board act on it? I feel more constructive criticism of Hibs players, manager, Board, Club, fans and setup with clear, precise steps geared towards achieving something tangible for the club would be a more rewarding move than simply saying: sack the manager or I'm not coming back!. I



My first point in reply to your well constructed post is do you feel you get your point across better if you use larger type size than the rest of us.

I feel you are being harsh on Paul Hanlon, saying he is playing with the big boys and he shouldn't be exempt from criticism from the manager. Fair enough but why didn't he criticise Rob Jones for a fresh air swipe at ICTs second goal or for his pal JJs failure to equalise. Hanlon had his worst game to date in a Hibs jersey at Killie but it was an exceptional strike from Hamill and nine times out of ten or possibly more he would have got away with it. Mixu picked on a laddie who has just turned 19 and this to me stinks of bullying. A good manager is consistent in his behaviour and Mixu is anything but, either single out players every week or don't do it at all.

As a guy who has followed Hibs since the mid sixties I also find it amazing that you blame supporters mind sets for the mess that Hibs are in and its our fault that the club have not won more. I take it this also applies to Dundee, Airdrie, Alloa, East Stirling fans etc.

We all like to win and when I was younger I could toss and turn all night after a bad Hibs result and I would go in huff with the world. However after the Mercer takeover attempt I have learned that Hibs existing is the thing that matters to me most. That doesn't mean I don't want to see Hibs win trophies.

Ed De Gramo
25-02-2009, 06:36 PM
:faf::faf::faf:


However I feel that the appointment of Mixu Paatelainen was an error in judgment. This is not a recent revelation to me and to be honest I have felt this way since his first match in charge. But as a loyal Hibs fan I looked beyond my own reservations and still renewed my season ticket for 2008-09.

:faf::faf::faf:

So even when we beat ICT 3-0 at Easter Road...the supporter wisnae happy :faf::faf::faf:

People know my thoughts on open letters so i'll not spin that yarn again...


I don’t want this letter to turn into nothing more than a rant at the club so I will make my final point now. I will not attend another Hibs match while Mixu Paatelainen is in charge and enclose my season ticket stub for Saturday’s game against Falkirk. I will post each and every stub individually for the rest of the season as long as he remains in charge.

Petrie has yer money so he'll probably shred the stubs and make some ticker tape for the Board's next party :faf:

MSK
25-02-2009, 06:49 PM
:faf::faf::faf:



:faf::faf::faf:

So even when we beat ICT 3-0 at Easter Road...the supporter wisnae happy :faf::faf::faf:

People know my thoughts on open letters so i'll not spin that yarn again...



Petrie has yer money so he'll probably shred the stubs and make some ticker tape for the Board's next party :faf:Gramo is there any need for the use of the smileys ..that appears to me to be rather patronising !!!

The majority of posters on here are actually in agreement with the op..others who are not are at least adding to reasonable debate..why dont you do the same instead of attempting tae rip the pish !!!

PeeJay
25-02-2009, 06:49 PM
I



1) My first point in reply to your well constructed post is do you feel you get your point across better if you use larger type size than the rest of us.


2) I feel you are being harsh on Paul Hanlon, saying he is playing with the big boys and he shouldn't be exempt from criticism from the manager. Fair enough but why didn't he criticise Rob Jones for a fresh air swipe at ICTs second goal or for his pal JJs failure to equalise. Hanlon had his worst game to date in a Hibs jersey at Killie but it was an exceptional strike from Hamill and nine times out of ten or possibly more he would have got away with it. Mixu picked on a laddie who has just turned 19 and this to me stinks of bullying. A good manager is consistent in his behaviour and Mixu is anything but, either single out players every week or don't do it at all.


3) As a guy who has followed Hibs since the mid sixties I also find it amazing that you blame supporters mind sets for the mess that Hibs are in and its our fault that the club have not won more. I take it this also applies to Dundee, Airdrie, Alloa, East Stirling fans etc.

4) We all like to win and when I was younger I could toss and turn all night after a bad Hibs result and I would go in huff with the world. However after the Mercer takeover attempt I have learned that Hibs existing is the thing that matters to me most. That doesn't mean I don't want to see Hibs win trophies.


1) No, not at all - I don't intentionally make my font size larger (someone complained earlier I was 'shouting' maybe that was what he meant - but on my screen the sizes all look identical, it sometimes happens when I reply that my text seems too small ... I guess I must be doing something wrong when I reply -sorry?)
2) I like Hanlon, but he's still raw (not a problem, he's young) - I don't expect him not to make mistakes: I do expect him to take criticism, I don't think Mixu blamed him alone or criticised him alone, I was replying to the OP.
3) Fair point - I wasn't however addressing my ire solely at the fans, but everyone connected with Hibs, players, management and fans (attitudes) - I believe we fans could act more constructively in directing our club to some success, and I firmly believe that getting a grip on reality is a good starting point.
4) I'm sure we all want to see Hibs win trophies, leagues - the question is how can we change things? Maybe we should all be a lot more angry than we are: we have every reason to be, after all?

Ed De Gramo
25-02-2009, 06:53 PM
Gramo is there any need for the use of the smileys ..that appears to me to be rather patronising !!!

The majority of posters on here are actually in agreement with the op..others who are not are at least adding to reasonable debate..why dont you do the same instead of attempting tae rip the pish !!!

I'm not attempting to rip the pash dude....i'm just finding it hilarious how someone can say they didn't rate him since his first game in charge...which we won quite handsomly 3-0...who knows what the OP must have felt when Mowbray's first SPL game ended up 0-1 to Killie....

Maybe over cooked the FAF smilie a bit too much tho....trigger fingers and all that :greengrin

scoopyboy
25-02-2009, 06:57 PM
1) No, not at all - I don't intentionally make my font size larger (someone complained earlier I was 'shouting' maybe that was what he meant - but on my screen the sizes all look identical, it sometimes happens when I reply that my text seems too small ... I guess I must be doing something wrong when I reply -sorry?)
2) I like Hanlon, but he's still raw (not a problem, he's young) - I don't expect him not to make mistakes: I do expect him to take criticism, I don't think Mixu blamed him alone or criticised him alone, I was replying to the OP.
3) Fair point - I wasn't however addressing my ire solely at the fans, but everyone connected with Hibs, players, management and fans (attitudes) - I believe we fans could act more constructively in directing our club to some success, and I firmly believe that getting a grip on reality is a good starting point.
4) I'm sure we all want to see Hibs win trophies, leagues - the question is how can we change things? Maybe we should all be a lot more angry than we are: we have every reason to be, after all?

Fair responses PeeJay.

Franck is God
25-02-2009, 07:32 PM
I'm not attempting to rip the pash dude....i'm just finding it hilarious how someone can say they didn't rate him since his first game in charge...which we won quite handsomly 3-0...who knows what the OP must have felt when Mowbray's first SPL game ended up 0-1 to Killie....

I was at his first match against Caley and your right we did win 3-0 but it wasn't an easy victory and the score line flattered us a lot. Deano took his goals well but I remember Caley having just an many chances to score in that game as we did. We did score 3 though and deserved to win the game. I just saw huge holes in his tactics that day and not only have none of them been filled but more have appeared.

As for Mowbray's first SPL game, I was at that too and I remember us playing pretty well that day and going home pleased with the performance and wondering how we didn't win. I also went home with the thought that once he got all the pieces in a line we were going to be a good side and give a few teams a bit of a roasting.

If you can honestly say that you have felt like that leaving a match while Mixu has been in charge then we have very differing ideas on how football should be played.

erskine-hibby
25-02-2009, 07:39 PM
I was at his first match against Caley and your right we did win 3-0 but it wasn't an easy victory and the score line flattered us a lot. Deano took his goals well but I remember Caley having just an many chances to score in that game as we did. We did score 3 though and deserved to win the game. I just saw huge holes in his tactics that day and not only have none of them been filled but more have appeared.

As for Mowbray's first SPL game, I was at that too and I remember us playing pretty well that day and going home pleased with the performance and wondering how we didn't win. I also went home with the thought that once he got all the pieces in a line we were going to be a good side and give a few teams a bit of a roasting.

If you can honestly say that you have felt like that leaving a match while Mixu has been in charge then we have very differing ideas on how football should be played.

Again i would go back to the fact that TM had about 90% quality players at the club to start with, Mixu....10% at best.
There is simply no comparison with the squad of players both managers had at their disposal. No matter how much Mixu has been given to spend TM had the makings of an excelent team already in place, MP doesn't.

EVENTUALLY
25-02-2009, 07:52 PM
Amazed at the number of people praising this letter: this is absolutely symptomatic of why our club never wins anything – too many Hibs fans want nothing more than a wee bit of enjoyment of a Saturday afternoon! It seems that there’s no genuine ambition or bite involved, no determination at the club to achieve anything, no intention of going the extra mile: on the one hand, the club sells its best players every so often to polish the finances and on the other hand, fans like this one express a pitiful willingness for nothing more than having a bit of fun at ER every now and then!! Years ago, Alex Cropley summed it all up in the TT video/DVD when he said there was a serious lack of disgust at getting beat in the team, and when he went down to England he entered a different world, where winning was everything! Maybe that is why TT never cashed in on their potential, and although the current team is a long way short of such potential at least they still don’t seem to mind getting beat either: so nothing much seems to have changed!

Sorry, I find it impossible to agree with letters like this, particularly when they are so peppered with a grovelling willingness to accept mediocrity as long as the football on show looks good and the trip down to ER is enjoyable?? Stuff that, I think fans should expect their team to be challenging for the league and the cups and playing in Europe: otherwise there is no point to it at all!

As to the comments on Mixu's incessant complaints about it being the players’ fault, e.g. Hanlon – well Hanlon’s playing with the big boys now and when he make a stupid ‘wee-boy’ mistake like he did he at Killie, it’s perfectly OK for Mixu (or any manager) to complain about it, surely? How is that supposed to be Mixu’s fault? Anyway, managers are always complaining that players/refs/fans/God/whatever didn’t do what they’re supposed to. I don’t recall too many managers saying ‘it was my fault’.

As long as this defeatist spirit rules amongst the hearts and minds of too many Hibs players and – it seems to me - Hibs fans, we will achieve nothing: but never mind as long as we think we’re great then what do statistics, league positions or cups in the cupboard matter?
I don’t think that the letter will make any lasting impression on the board, because I don't think the 'looking for enjoyment' factor carries much weight with it: so why should the Board act on it? I feel more constructive criticism of Hibs players, manager, Board, Club, fans and setup with clear, precise steps geared towards achieving something tangible for the club would be a more rewarding move than simply saying: sack the manager or I'm not coming back!.
Cropley won a medal at Hibs. While playing for 2 of the English greats at Arsenal and Aston Villa he won zip ! A great player though.

matty_f
25-02-2009, 07:56 PM
:faf::faf::faf:



:faf::faf::faf:

So even when we beat ICT 3-0 at Easter Road...the supporter wisnae happy :faf::faf::faf:

People know my thoughts on open letters so i'll not spin that yarn again...



Petrie has yer money so he'll probably shred the stubs and make some ticker tape for the Board's next party :faf:

I would think that the Board will treat the prospect of losing any customer with the seriousness that it deserves.

No company on the planet can afford to treat the loss of custom with contempt, especially a football club where the main income on match days comes predominantly from a hard-core fan base.

This is why the board will reply to each letter they get, even if it is simply to acknowledge it.

A business would go under if it didn't listen to it's customers, nor attempt to retain the business.

Surprised you'd think the board would find it anything other than concerning Gramo, and to others that said the OP wouldn't be missed - like any customer not paying into the ground on a matchday, of course they will be missed.

Hibs need the ground as full as possible on a matchday otherwise we're in trouble.

matty_f
25-02-2009, 07:58 PM
Again i would go back to the fact that TM had about 90% quality players at the club to start with, Mixu....10% at best.
There is simply no comparison with the squad of players both managers had at their disposal. No matter how much Mixu has been given to spend TM had the makings of an excelent team already in place, MP doesn't.

I think you do Mowbray a dis-service there, Erskine.

I would think that had Blobby had those very same players another season they would not have turned out to be anywhere near as good footballers as they have done.

lEXO
25-02-2009, 08:07 PM
Read all the posts on this thread and my take is it is good letter written from the heart.Forget Mowbray and Collins, they are gone.Cannae remember the last decent game at, ER and if the manager has signed 15 players in just over a year cant get players to pass 10 yards(his own words) how can he stay in his job.He,s running out of time and has already ran out of ideas.
As for one poster saying that the root of it is Hibs supporters and the club over the years have settled for mediocrity, i think that is bollocks.Over the years our support has voted with our feet, both positively and negatively.I can,t get excited about our team at the moment,and will still go on Saturday,but dont blame those that dont.
:rolleyes:

scoopyboy
25-02-2009, 08:14 PM
Cropley won a medal at Hibs. While playing for 2 of the English greats at Arsenal and Aston Villa he won zip ! A great player though.

I beg to differ.

He won the League Cup with Villa. They beat Everton in a replay at Old Trafford.

I've got a souvenier brochure with pictures of all the players with a space for their signatures. All the spaces have been signed on my copy by the appropriate players, courtesy of one Alex. Cropley.

Jaz
25-02-2009, 08:37 PM
I sent this letter this morning. Some of you may agree with the sentiment but not the course of action or you may agree with it all. Just thought I would share it.



FAO Mr Scott Lindsay

23rd February 2009



Dear Sir,

It is with sadness that I actually write this letter to you today but displays by the team I have loved and supported all my life have driven me to this.

I have been a massive supporter of the way the club has been run in recent years, the appointment of Tony Mowbray followed by John Collins were applauded by me and many others. The way the club has been run financially has also been a huge plus for me which has allowed the development of our training centre and ongoing improvements to the ground. Not to mention our youth set up which is still producing excellent young players.

However I feel that the appointment of Mixu Paatelainen was an error in judgment. This is not a recent revelation to me and to be honest I have felt this way since his first match in charge. But as a loyal Hibs fan I looked beyond my own reservations and still renewed my season ticket for 2008-09.

This season has been nothing short of dreadful. His inability to get the players physically fit and capable of passing the ball to each other is worrying enough His insistence to blame everything and everyone other than himself for defeats and poor performances is quite frankly pathetic. Last week when he publicly blamed Paul Hanlon for not winning the game at Kilmarnock was unforgivable and his excuses after Saturday’s defeat at Inverness were laughable. As a member of the board did this not annoy you? Considering the way the club has backed him in the three transfer windows he has managed us through to blame a lack of money for our current plight is surely a sign that he is simply not the man for us.

He has been given ample funds to put a team on the pitch worthy of this club, I am sure that Mowbray or Collins would have loved his budget during their times in charge. I am confident that the wages/signings budget at Hibs is well in excess of those at Falkirk, Kilmarnock, Hamilton, Inverness, St Mirren & Dundee Utd with perhaps Aberdeen on an equal footing. I have seen all those sides outplay us in games this season.

I would also like to point out that my letter is not driven by poor results but the way we are playing. I would accept our league position and points tally if I felt that I was at least watching a team trying to win points by playing football. As a Hibs fan I don’t have delusions of grandeur, I have never expected us to win the league or even a cup, what I do expect is to be able to enjoy my trips to Easter Road, if I’m not enjoying it what reason do I have to come along.

I don’t want this letter to turn into nothing more than a rant at the club so I will make my final point now. I will not attend another Hibs match while Mixu Paatelainen is in charge and enclose my season ticket stub for Saturday’s game against Falkirk. I will post each and every stub individually for the rest of the season as long as he remains in charge.

Cannot understand this mentality.

If I'd protested against crap Hibs sides and rubbish performances by not going to games I'd have been lucky to see 50 matches in the past 25 years.

I go to watch and support Hibs. I'd rather it was good but I want to support Hibernian FC, so I go regardless.

Rory89
25-02-2009, 09:17 PM
Haha, I bet when that letter came in Scott Lindsey must have been terrified. "There's only one thing left to do, it's either Mixu or Franck is God from hibs.net, I'm going to sack Mixu because this guy is more important", he must have said.

Listen, I'm as desperate for Mixu to leave and stop *****ing up our club as much as anyone, but what is the point in these letters? All that's going to happen is some admin guy will open it and either throw it away or tell someone about it, who'll make the admin guy send a reply on behalf of Scott Lindsey.

I hope the OP felt all good about himself when he sent the letter, because that's the only good that will come from this.

Hiber-nation
25-02-2009, 09:59 PM
Haha, I bet when that letter came in Scott Lindsey must have been terrified. "There's only one thing left to do, it's either Mixu or Franck is God from hibs.net, I'm going to sack Mixu because this guy is more important", he must have said.

Listen, I'm as desperate for Mixu to leave and stop *****ing up our club as much as anyone, but what is the point in these letters? All that's going to happen is some admin guy will open it and either throw it away or tell someone about it, who'll make the admin guy send a reply on behalf of Scott Lindsey.

I hope the OP felt all good about himself when he sent the letter, because that's the only good that will come from this.

And your solution to the problem is what exactly?

paul_hfc3
25-02-2009, 10:20 PM
Haha, I bet when that letter came in Scott Lindsey must have been terrified. "There's only one thing left to do, it's either Mixu or Franck is God from hibs.net, I'm going to sack Mixu because this guy is more important", he must have said.

Listen, I'm as desperate for Mixu to leave and stop *****ing up our club as much as anyone, but what is the point in these letters? All that's going to happen is some meh admin guy will open it and either throw it away or tell someone about it, who'll make the admin guy send a reply on behalf of Scott Lindsey.

I hope the OP felt all good about himself when he sent the letter, because that's the only good that will come from this.

You've obviously never heard of a protest before have you?

One person standing up against someone or something isn't going to get you anywhere but a collection of people voicing their opinions is going to get actions. We live in a democracy and this is a form of it by protesting in something this guy believes is a problem and should be resolved, if everyone sat there and scratched their balls looking at the sun and waiting for things to happen then the world would be a lot worse of place. Your one of the many ignorant people who canny be arsed someone else will do it.

Ed De Gramo
25-02-2009, 10:25 PM
Rod Petries reponse to the open letters....

What P-Rod done next (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZmUaFBCoa0)

:wink::cool2:

AL-Qaholik
25-02-2009, 10:35 PM
Gramer polisA pedant writes
Although some (including me) deem it to be a rather American-English affectation, strictly speaking as you're in subjunctive mood it should be "if Mixu WERE to turn it around". All the usage textbooks :blah: say so.

I can never resist the urge to point out such outstanding hypocrisy from one so patronising...

I assume u were being colloquial with the use of the word 'polis', but no colloquialism can disguise the fact that you cant even spell the word GRAMMER!!:blah:

Peevemor
25-02-2009, 10:46 PM
I can never resist the urge to point out such outstanding hypocrisy from one so patronising...

I assume u were being colloquial with the use of the word 'polis', but no colloquialism can disguise the fact that you cant even spell the word GRAMMER!!:blah:

Grammar even? :cool2:

hibee_nation
25-02-2009, 10:56 PM
I remember the good old days when filled rolls used to rip the pash out of the yams and their open letters, sad that we have fallen to their standards. These letters however well constructed and valid say more to me about the person who wrote it than anything else eg look at me and how clever i am. I have no problem with the person holding the views he does but just wish they would come on here and tell us they have wrote to the board and are not going back. All this melodrama about sending stubs back well whoopee do, give yer ticket to some poor sod who can't afford to go if you must give it away and for god sake don't throw your empty ST book on the pitch at the end of the season. :wink:

GGTTH :flag:

happy harry
25-02-2009, 10:56 PM
I sent this letter this morning. Some of you may agree with the sentiment but not the course of action or you may agree with it all. Just thought I would share it.



FAO Mr Scott Lindsay

23rd February 2009



Dear Sir,

It is with sadness that I actually write this letter to you today but displays by the team I have loved and supported all my life have driven me to this.

I have been a massive supporter of the way the club has been run in recent years, the appointment of Tony Mowbray followed by John Collins were applauded by me and many others. The way the club has been run financially has also been a huge plus for me which has allowed the development of our training centre and ongoing improvements to the ground. Not to mention our youth set up which is still producing excellent young players.

However I feel that the appointment of Mixu Paatelainen was an error in judgment. This is not a recent revelation to me and to be honest I have felt this way since his first match in charge. But as a loyal Hibs fan I looked beyond my own reservations and still renewed my season ticket for 2008-09.

This season has been nothing short of dreadful. His inability to get the players physically fit and capable of passing the ball to each other is worrying enough His insistence to blame everything and everyone other than himself for defeats and poor performances is quite frankly pathetic. Last week when he publicly blamed Paul Hanlon for not winning the game at Kilmarnock was unforgivable and his excuses after Saturday’s defeat at Inverness were laughable. As a member of the board did this not annoy you? Considering the way the club has backed him in the three transfer windows he has managed us through to blame a lack of money for our current plight is surely a sign that he is simply not the man for us.

He has been given ample funds to put a team on the pitch worthy of this club, I am sure that Mowbray or Collins would have loved his budget during their times in charge. I am confident that the wages/signings budget at Hibs is well in excess of those at Falkirk, Kilmarnock, Hamilton, Inverness, St Mirren & Dundee Utd with perhaps Aberdeen on an equal footing. I have seen all those sides outplay us in games this season.

I would also like to point out that my letter is not driven by poor results but the way we are playing. I would accept our league position and points tally if I felt that I was at least watching a team trying to win points by playing football. As a Hibs fan I don’t have delusions of grandeur, I have never expected us to win the league or even a cup, what I do expect is to be able to enjoy my trips to Easter Road, if I’m not enjoying it what reason do I have to come along.

I don’t want this letter to turn into nothing more than a rant at the club so I will make my final point now. I will not attend another Hibs match while Mixu Paatelainen is in charge and enclose my season ticket stub for Saturday’s game against Falkirk. I will post each and every stub individually for the rest of the season as long as he remains in charge. Don't know what you do for a living but how would you feel if someone sent a letter to your employer with negative comments and threats about not purchasing your companies product whilst you remained in that companies employment? What is wrong with you man? get a life and support the team and accept that there will be rough with smooth, who are you to judge how someone in a professional capacity should do his job. Get a grip and start to support the team whether you agree with selections or tactics, if you are a true supporter you should stick with the team through thick and thin, not jump ship every time things go bad.Take a leaf out of Derby county supporters or Man City supporters books, look at what they have had to endure and then take a look at their attendances. Loyal supporters dont send in season ticket stubs or better still publish their letter to message boards. WHY?

brianmc
25-02-2009, 10:57 PM
Read all the posts on this thread and my take is it is good letter written from the heart.Forget Mowbray and Collins, they are gone.Cannae remember the last decent game at, ER and if the manager has signed 15 players in just over a year cant get players to pass 10 yards(his own words) how can he stay in his job.He,s running out of time and has already ran out of ideas.
As for one poster saying that the root of it is Hibs supporters and the club over the years have settled for mediocrity, i think that is bollocks.Over the years our support has voted with our feet, both positively and negatively.I can,t get excited about our team at the moment,and will still go on Saturday,but dont blame those that dont.
:rolleyes:

Absolutely spot on.
When was the last 'decent' game at E.R. ?? I really can't recall one this season.
The only display of good football we've put on this season was at Fir Park months ago.
One game in seven months is simply not good enough-something MUST change.GGTTH

HibeeMG
25-02-2009, 11:09 PM
To everyone who disagrees with the OP statement about not going back:

I'm a manager in the restaurant business. If a customer has a bad experience it is likely they won't be back. We'd lose their custom and likely that of others through word of mouth. This is what makes us strive to make every customers' experience the best it could possibly be.

Now, I do understand that the business of being a fan of HFC is not entirely the same as being a disgruntled customer at some restaurant as, obviously, there is only one Hibernian and one cannot simpy go to then next Hibernian up the road.

However, the fact is that the club IS run by exactly the same people who pay my wages. They are businessmen. They understand that each customer/fan is important as not only do they bring income through gate receipts/ST sales there is the added sales through catering and possibly club shop that would be missed. The loss of these add-ons are what will hurt the club.

Okay the club already has the OP money for his ST but what happens next season if his concerns are not at least addressed? Is it likely that he is going to renew?

So it is not merely a symbolic gesture to the gents that run the club. It is something that strikes fear into the heart of any businessmen.

Newhaven
25-02-2009, 11:10 PM
I remember the good old days when filled rolls used to rip the pash out of the yams and their open letters, sad that we have fallen to their standards. These letters however well constructed and valid say more to me about the person who wrote it than anything else eg look at me and how clever i am. I have no problem with the person holding the views he does but just wish they would come on here and tell us they have wrote to the board and are not going back. All this melodrama about sending stubs back well whoopee do, give yer ticket to some poor sod who can't afford to go if you must give it away and for god sake don't throw your empty ST book on the pitch at the end of the season. :wink:

GGTTH :flag:

Complete and utter garbage.

Ed De Gramo
25-02-2009, 11:12 PM
I remember the good old days when filled rolls used to rip the pash out of the yams and their open letters, sad that we have fallen to their standards. These letters however well constructed and valid say more to me about the person who wrote it than anything else eg look at me and how clever i am. I have no problem with the person holding the views he does but just wish they would come on here and tell us they have wrote to the board and are not going back. All this melodrama about sending stubs back well whoopee do, give yer ticket to some poor sod who can't afford to go if you must give it away and for god sake don't throw your empty ST book on the pitch at the end of the season. :wink:

GGTTH :flag:

:top marks:top marks

Newhaven
25-02-2009, 11:12 PM
Don't know what you do for a living but how would you feel if someone sent a letter to your employer with negative comments and threats about not purchasing your companies product whilst you remained in that companies employment? What is wrong with you man? get a life and support the team and accept that there will be rough with smooth, who are you to judge how someone in a professional capacity should do his job. Get a grip and start to support the team whether you agree with selections or tactics, if you are a true supporter you should stick with the team through thick and thin, not jump ship every time things go bad.Take a leaf out of Derby county supporters or Man City supporters books, look at what they have had to endure and then take a look at their attendances. Loyal supporters dont send in season ticket stubs or better still publish their letter to message boards. WHY?

Can you show me this rule in the supporters handbook you have sitting by your pc please

fishybeaver
25-02-2009, 11:17 PM
very very pathetic, almost yam like!!!:grr::bitchy:

Support the team, shirts and club for 90mins plus extract time.


Poor poor show in my book

Jonnyboy
25-02-2009, 11:19 PM
Rod Petries reponse to the open letters....

What P-Rod done next (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZmUaFBCoa0)

:wink::cool2:

Grow up man :grr:

Ed De Gramo
25-02-2009, 11:21 PM
Grow up man :grr:

It's banter Jonny :agree:

A bit of light-hearted banter :thumbsup:

Newhaven
25-02-2009, 11:22 PM
very very pathetic, almost yam like!!!:grr::bitchy:

Support the team, shirts and club for 90mins plus extract time.


Poor poor show in my book

Given the choice, some fans would prefer a trip to the dentist rather than watch the team at the moment :greengrin

Jonnyboy
25-02-2009, 11:25 PM
Can I just offer my tuppenceworth here?

To those of you referring to this as an open letter - it's not. It was a personal letter from the OP to a member of the Hibs Board which he decided he would share amongst his fellow fans on here.

Now some of you may not approve of his actions and indeed some are even laughing at the guy but you must surely see this is not some wee boy who's upset cos his team got beat. This is a long standing supporter genuinely concerned and pouring his heart out. Do some people enjoy ridiculing such actions?

It seems to me that an attempt to generate a debate has drawn a huge amount of unfair criticism and not a little unhelpful and sarcastic comments, none of which are in any way fair. If you disagree with the OP's intentions then by all means say so but think about the fact that he's just the same as you and I - a very worried Hibs fan

BroxburnHibee
25-02-2009, 11:27 PM
Can I just offer my tuppenceworth here?

To those of you referring to this as an open letter - it's not. It was a personal letter from the OP to a member of the Hibs Board which he decided he would share amongst his fellow fans on here.

Now some of you may not approve of his actions and indeed some are even laughing at the guy but you must surely see this is not some wee boy who's upset cos his team got beat. This is a long standing supporter genuinely concerned and pouring his heart out. Do some people enjoy ridiculing such actions?

It seems to me that an attempt to generate a debate has drawn a huge amount of unfair criticism and not a little unhelpful and sarcastic comments, none of which are in any way fair. If you disagree with the OP's intentions then by all means say so but think about the fact that he's just the same as you and I - a very worried Hibs fan

Naw ye cannae - thought you wisnae well :greengrin

Jonnyboy
25-02-2009, 11:29 PM
Naw ye cannae - thought you wisnae well :greengrin

I'm not. Imagine what I might have typed had I been 100% fit :greengrin

Newhaven
25-02-2009, 11:29 PM
Can I just offer my tuppenceworth here?

To those of you referring to this as an open letter - it's not. It was a personal letter from the OP to a member of the Hibs Board which he decided he would share amongst his fellow fans on here.

Now some of you may not approve of his actions and indeed some are even laughing at the guy but you must surely see this is not some wee boy who's upset cos his team got beat. This is a long standing supporter genuinely concerned and pouring his heart out. Do some people enjoy ridiculing such actions?

It seems to me that an attempt to generate a debate has drawn a huge amount of unfair criticism and not a little unhelpful and sarcastic comments, none of which are in any way fair. If you disagree with the OP's intentions then by all means say so but think about the fact that he's just the same as you and I - a very worried Hibs fan

:applause:

Well said JB

BroxburnHibee
25-02-2009, 11:32 PM
:applause:

Well said JB

:agree::top marks

Ed De Gramo
25-02-2009, 11:32 PM
Can I just offer my tuppenceworth here?

To those of you referring to this as an open letter - it's not. It was a personal letter from the OP to a member of the Hibs Board which he decided he would share amongst his fellow fans on here.

Now some of you may not approve of his actions and indeed some are even laughing at the guy but you must surely see this is not some wee boy who's upset cos his team got beat. This is a long standing supporter genuinely concerned and pouring his heart out. Do some people enjoy ridiculing such actions?

It seems to me that an attempt to generate a debate has drawn a huge amount of unfair criticism and not a little unhelpful and sarcastic comments, none of which are in any way fair. If you disagree with the OP's intentions then by all means say so but think about the fact that he's just the same as you and I - a very worried Hibs fan

Which is all very well....but does it need to be pasted across a messageboard?

If the OP had told us that he'd contacted Hibs with his concerns and given us the jist of his correspondence he'd have got a better response.

Newhaven done the right thing by saying he'd contacted the board and kept it at that :agree:

matty_f
25-02-2009, 11:35 PM
Which is all very well....but does it need to be pasted across a messageboard?

If the OP had told us that he'd contacted Hibs with his concerns and given us the jist of his correspondence he'd have got a better response.

Newhaven done the right thing by saying he'd contacted the board and kept it at that :agree:

Nah, someone would have asked him to post the letter.

Ask Newhaven how many people asked to see the letter he wrote.

I don't see what the big deal is here at all, see some of the pish that folk start threads about, this one is relevant, topical and opened up some debate - what's the problem?

Jonnyboy
25-02-2009, 11:36 PM
Which is all very well....but does it need to be pasted across a messageboard?

If the OP had told us that he'd contacted Hibs with his concerns and given us the jist of his correspondence he'd have got a better response.

Newhaven done the right thing by saying he'd contacted the board and kept it at that :agree:

So now you're telling me there are right ways and wrong ways to express your concerns over Hibs? Jeezo, you take the biscuit sometimes. It seems to me that if people want the club to know their feelings they have a whole host of ways of doing that and a letter might be one just way. The OP took that course, maybe wondered if fellow Hibbies felt the same and so shared it with us. What exactly is wrong with that?

Earlier in this thread you ridiculed parts of the OP's letter in a totally infantile way because it doesn't fit with your absurd obsession with Mixu Paatelainen. Had I been the OP I'd have wondered just what the hell I'd done to deserve that.

sleeping giant
25-02-2009, 11:40 PM
Rod Petries reponse to the open letters....

What P-Rod done next (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZmUaFBCoa0)

:wink::cool2:
Canny believe the car swerved when the plane landed:greengrin

Ed De Gramo
25-02-2009, 11:42 PM
So now you're telling me there are right ways and wrong ways to express your concerns over Hibs? Jeezo, you take the biscuit sometimes. It seems to me that if people want the club to know their feelings they have a whole host of ways of doing that and a letter might be one just way. The OP took that course, maybe wondered if fellow Hibbies felt the same and so shared it with us. What exactly is wrong with that?

Earlier in this thread you ridiculed parts of the OP's letter in a totally infantile way because it doesn't fit with your absurd obsession with Mixu Paatelainen. Had I been the OP I'd have wondered just what the hell I'd done to deserve that.

Come on JC...that's harsh...

I was laughing at the fact he hated Mixu being the manager from the off, never giving MP the chance to make his mark...that had nowt to do with my "Absurd Obsession" as you put it....

There's quite a number of people who jumped on the yams for publishing letters on open messageboards....and now some think it's alright that we do it...

BroxburnHibee
25-02-2009, 11:43 PM
Which is all very well....but does it need to be pasted across a messageboard?

Why not?

If the OP had told us that he'd contacted Hibs with his concerns and given us the jist of his correspondence he'd have got a better response.

Newhaven done the right thing by saying he'd contacted the board and kept it at that :agree:

In your opinion Gramo and maybe a few others but here's the thing - this is a fans messageboard where we post our feelings on what is happening at the club (good or bad).

The OP has shared his thoughts on the situation which he is perfectly entitled to do and as such he is obviously willing to take opinions from everyone on this.

You seem to be under the impression that if you disagree then he's in the wrong for doing it.

Disagree if you want but it doesn't mean your right :wink:

Jonnyboy
25-02-2009, 11:52 PM
Come on JC...that's harsh...

I was laughing at the fact he hated Mixu being the manager from the off, never giving MP the chance to make his mark...that had nowt to do with my "Absurd Obsession" as you put it....

There's quite a number of people who jumped on the yams for publishing letters on open messageboards....and now some think it's alright that we do it...

See BroxburnHibees response

:top marks

Captain Trips
26-02-2009, 12:31 AM
Come on JC...that's harsh...

I was laughing at the fact he hated Mixu being the manager from the off, never giving MP the chance to make his mark...that had nowt to do with my "Absurd Obsession" as you put it....

There's quite a number of people who jumped on the yams for publishing letters on open messageboards....and now some think it's alright that we do it...

Just because some on here jumped on the Yams for this doesnt mean they are right, I think its fine to do it, what does it matter if Hearts do it. Why was it deemed not the done thing?

lapsedhibee
26-02-2009, 12:36 AM
I can never resist the urge to point out such outstanding hypocrisy from one so patronising...

I assume u were being colloquial with the use of the word 'polis', but no colloquialism can disguise the fact that you cant even spell the word GRAMMER!!:blah:

Knot hipocrisy at all. Speedway's got a English lesson as his singature, so I was just giving him a doze off his own medicin. I asume you were being ironic with you're speling off the word 'gramar'.

Newhaven
26-02-2009, 12:37 AM
Ask Newhaven how many people asked to see the letter he wrote

At last count 55.

I was actually quite shocked how many people PM'd me.

Speedy
26-02-2009, 01:08 AM
:blah:

Rory89
26-02-2009, 01:26 AM
And your solution to the problem is what exactly?

Change the manager would be my solution to the problem, just as well it's me who is in charge of making this decision. Oh no wait, it's not. It's also not the decision of the guy who made that stupid letter, and decided he was so clever that everyone on hibs.net should read it.


You've obviously never heard of a protest before have you?

One person standing up against someone or something isn't going to get you anywhere but a collection of people voicing their opinions is going to get actions. We live in a democracy and this is a form of it by protesting in something this guy believes is a problem and should be resolved, if everyone sat there and scratched their balls looking at the sun and waiting for things to happen then the world would be a lot worse of place. Your one of the many ignorant people who canny be arsed someone else will do it.

We're talking about a clubs management team here, not world hunger. I agree with the guy Mixu is a **** manager and he needs to go, but clearly a letter like this won't make any difference, and the guy who wrote is probably knows deep down that it won't. I'll be "protesting" by showing my disaproval at the games as long as we play like we are. You see when a crowd of people are at a game they can show how unhappy they are by being vocal about it, not all sitting down after the game and all writing a letter.

Clearly sending something like this to Hibs then telling everyone on here is only done so all his internet chums can pat him on the back and massage his ego, because it's a useless gesture. If you think the club are going to sack a member of staff because of a letter you are the ignorant one.

IWasThere2016
26-02-2009, 08:20 AM
At last count 55.

I was actually quite shocked how many people PM'd me.

I'm not .. such is the despair of those with their eyes open! :grr:

bawheid
26-02-2009, 08:42 AM
This is a message from Scott Lindsay:

If you could forward all ticket stubs to c/o bawheid at Hibs.net that would be much appreciated. Thank you for your comments.

erskine-hibby
26-02-2009, 09:27 AM
I think you do Mowbray a dis-service there, Erskine.

I would think that had Blobby had those very same players another season they would not have turned out to be anywhere near as good footballers as they have done.

And how am i doing TM any dis-service??
I have not put him down in any way, i merely pointed out a fact that the pool of players that TM had to start with was far superior than what was available to MP.
It's impossible to tell what MP would have done if those type of players were already in place when he took over. You can, of course, have your points of view on that. Mine is that,TM, given the poor quality of players we had then would not have made such an impact as he did.
Some seem to forget we were in decline before TM left, with the selling of those players. That continued through JC's tenure and none were suitably replaced. That brings us on to MP who, like it or not, has brought in better quality players, on the whole, while trying his hardest to rid the club of those not up to standard, not an easy task taking into account the contracts they were given. Even those most ardent anti Mixu must see that we were in dire straights long before he took over.
Don't get me wrong, i'm not saying that Mixu is the man for the job, but rather a hell of a lot of what we are reaping now was sewn long before he got here.

Onceinawhile
26-02-2009, 09:57 AM
What is your occupation?

How would you feel if one of your customers who you have never met and are unlikely to, started sending you letters telling you how to do your job?

Then started sending you bits of a product they had bought screw by screw on a weekly basis?

You would laugh at them think they were sad and probably tell them to get out more.

Seriously: get a life

blackpoolhibs
26-02-2009, 10:39 AM
What is your occupation?

How would you feel if one of your customers who you have never met and are unlikely to, started sending you letters telling you how to do your job?

Then started sending you bits of a product they had bought screw by screw on a weekly basis?

You would laugh at them think they were sad and probably tell them to get out more.

Seriously: get a life

I am sure the original poster has a life. :confused: How would you register your protest to the board?

khib70
26-02-2009, 10:43 AM
What is your occupation?

How would you feel if one of your customers who you have never met and are unlikely to, started sending you letters telling you how to do your job?

Then started sending you bits of a product they had bought screw by screw on a weekly basis?

You would laugh at them think they were sad and probably tell them to get out more.

Seriously: get a life
Consumers expressing an opinion about a product they perceive to be inferior. Tsk Tsk! Sharing that opinion with fellow consumers. Naughty naughty! Having a different opinion from you. How very dare they!:rolleyes::yawn:

itsmeuk
26-02-2009, 10:49 AM
what is your occupation?

How would you feel if one of your customers who you have never met and are unlikely to, started sending you letters telling you how to do your job?

Then started sending you bits of a product they had bought screw by screw on a weekly basis?

You would laugh at them think they were sad and probably tell them to get out more.

Seriously: Get a life

get a grip mate

Just Jimmy
26-02-2009, 11:03 AM
:faf::faf::faf:



:faf::faf::faf:

So even when we beat ICT 3-0 at Easter Road...the supporter wisnae happy :faf::faf::faf:

People know my thoughts on open letters so i'll not spin that yarn again...



Petrie has yer money so he'll probably shred the stubs and make some ticker tape for the Board's next party :faf:

Gramo, I've avoided replying to your posts on Mixu as much as poss since it's clear you have your view and tbh it's not worth getting in a fight over since I want him to succeed, I've just accepted it's unlikely to happen at hibs.

However, that said, your reply to this post is pathetic, its patronising head in the sand stuff. Mixu is finished at Hibs, it will take major major action to save his job. He's lost the dressing room and the stands, only a matter of time before he looses the boardroom also.

Theres no way back for him, I just wish either he or the board would get it over with. You are the only real prominent hibs.net member still in support of him to my knowledge, however, at times its clutching at straws. I respect the fact you want him to do well, however, i think its more a lack of accepting its went tits up than a real belief that hes the man for the job. I think if you REALLY thought it through you'd see what everyone else sees.

Without using the "everyone calls him nasty names" or that "hatrick" (or smilies) arguement, can you construct any form of arguement which counters;

1) Blaming players (19 years olds with about 10 games under their belt) in public.
2) his post match interviews.
3) his embarrassing pitch side behaviour
4) his lack of subs
5) his signing of 15 players, none of which it appears he knows where to deploy them (except mibbie the keeper).
6) his failure to find a system since he got here
7) his failure to fix the fact we surrender the MF after 10 mins every week
8) hoofball
9) the fact he listed his targets when he got the job and has met....none?
10) the fact we are as close to the relegation spot, as third. Despite mixu having the best budget and argueably the best hibs team outwith Mowbray's in a decade or so.

I'll conceed most of his signings have been good. but see point 5.

and most worrying

11) lthe lack of fitness and fight in the team.

surely you must see this, can you honestly say you can give me as many reasons to justify giving him more time, or money?

Brooster
26-02-2009, 11:08 AM
What is your occupation?

How would you feel if one of your customers who you have never met and are unlikely to, started sending you letters telling you how to do your job?

Then started sending you bits of a product they had bought screw by screw on a weekly basis?

You would laugh at them think they were sad and probably tell them to get out more.

Seriously: get a life

Out of order mate.

Danderhall Hibs
26-02-2009, 11:22 AM
Grammar even? :cool2:

:hilarious What's the 1st rule when correcting someone on their grammar? Don’t make a mistake in your post!


Can I just offer my tuppenceworth here?

To those of you referring to this as an open letter - it's not. It was a personal letter from the OP to a member of the Hibs Board which he decided he would share amongst his fellow fans on here.

Now some of you may not approve of his actions and indeed some are even laughing at the guy but you must surely see this is not some wee boy who's upset cos his team got beat. This is a long standing supporter genuinely concerned and pouring his heart out. Do some people enjoy ridiculing such actions?

It seems to me that an attempt to generate a debate has drawn a huge amount of unfair criticism and not a little unhelpful and sarcastic comments, none of which are in any way fair. If you disagree with the OP's intentions then by all means say so but think about the fact that he's just the same as you and I - a very worried Hibs fan


:top marks

It's incredible the amount of people who are willing to sit by and not Complain.

I’d like to finish by saying IT’S NOT AN OPEN LETTER!!

ahibby
26-02-2009, 11:58 AM
Everyone deals with grief in their own way.

Tomsk
26-02-2009, 12:01 PM
What is your occupation?

How would you feel if one of your customers who you have never met and are unlikely to, started sending you letters telling you how to do your job?

Then started sending you bits of a product they had bought screw by screw on a weekly basis?

You would laugh at them think they were sad and probably tell them to get out more.

Seriously: get a life

The business I work for does not go out to fail and let its customers down, but on occasion we do. When it happens we want to know all about it. We don't want our customers walking away in silence resolving never to trade with us again and using someone else. We want to hear their complaints no matter how extreme they seem or how idiosynchratically presented they are. It gives us the opportunity to make amends and to apologise as necessary and more importantly to fix the problem for the future. That way we can minimise the damage and all being well retain our customer's confidence to use us again.

Any business that refuses to embrace customer feedback is either too good at what they do or not going to be in business very long.

I am sure Hibs welcome every complaint they get. Petrie and Lyndsey will not want to be throwing open the ticket office doors during the summer to face empty streets and then wondering where the heck everyone is.

Just Jimmy
26-02-2009, 12:08 PM
The business I work for does not go out to fail and let its customers down, but on occasion we do. When it happens we want to know all about it. We don't want our customers walking away in silence resolving never to trade with us again and using someone else. We want to hear their complaints no matter how extreme they seem or how idiosynchratically presented they are. It gives us the opportunity to make amends and to apologise as necessary and more importantly to fix the problem for the future. That way we can minimise the damage and all being well retain our customer's confidence to use us again.

Any business that refuses to embrace customer feedback is either too good at what they do or not going to be in business very long.

I am sure Hibs welcome every complaint they get. Petrie and Lyndsey will not want to be throwing open the ticket office doors during the summer to face empty streets and then wondering where the heck everyone is.


Excellent post, without making this into a pub/resturant thread, customers who claim are argueably more important than customers who have enjoyed the experience.

No one likes complainers but the key is to utilise them for the best of the business. i'm sure hibs do.

lapsedhibee
26-02-2009, 12:15 PM
The business I work for does not go out to fail and let its customers down, but on occasion we do. When it happens we want to know all about it. We don't want our customers walking away in silence resolving never to trade with us again and using someone else. We want to hear their complaints no matter how extreme they seem or how idiosynchratically presented they are. It gives us the opportunity to make amends and to apologise as necessary and more importantly to fix the problem for the future. That way we can minimise the damage and all being well retain our customer's confidence to use us again.

Any business that refuses to embrace customer feedback is either too good at what they do or not going to be in business very long.

I am sure Hibs welcome every complaint they get. Petrie and Lyndsey will not want to be throwing open the ticket office doors during the summer to face empty streets and then wondering where the heck everyone is.
Can you expand what you mean by the bit in bold?

Franck is God
26-02-2009, 12:40 PM
I am amazed at the response this thread has gotten. I've obviously posted before on others but never actually started one myself.

Just to make a few things clear.

I actually did send that letter in the mail yesterday morning, I posted it on here because I thought people might have been interested at what I wrote.

I knew that not everyone would agree with my actions. I wasn't looking for a pat on the back or criticism, it was just my own way of protesting to the club. I'm interested in other peoples opinions but I'm not going to let them affect me if they differ from my own. Some like to shout and scream at the players at the game, I personally don't agree with that but it's not my place to moan at those who do.

A quick look at my avatar will show you that I was a big fan of Mixu the player. Yes I did have reservations about Mixu when he was appointed but I decided he wasn't for us after his first match in charge. That didn't mean I wanted him to fail, I wanted him to be a great manager just like every other Hibs fan. I gave him the benefit of the doubt last season and still renewed my ST regardless of my reservations in the hope that he would prove me a bad judge.

I did see that somebody posted that this was a vanity trip for me looking for plaudits by my internet chums. I have had a log on for this board for years and the fact that I am only a few posts over 200 hardly qualifies me for that kind of jibe.

Anyway, I've enjoyed reading everyones opinion.

Tomsk
26-02-2009, 12:48 PM
Can you expand what you mean by the bit in bold?

Such a business would be a source of envy for all the rest of us poor burgers who are trying to make a buck. In other words, it probably doesn't exist.

scoopyboy
26-02-2009, 12:53 PM
What is your occupation?

How would you feel if one of your customers who you have never met and are unlikely to, started sending you letters telling you how to do your job?

Then started sending you bits of a product they had bought screw by screw on a weekly basis?

You would laugh at them think they were sad and probably tell them to get out more.

Seriously: get a life


What is your occupation more like?

Customer complaints are a large part of the business world and in my opinion absolutely necessary.

In my line of work we supply materials that could cause life to be lost (worst case scenario). If we make a slip up it is essential that the customer complains so that initially we can rectify the mistake and secondly put actions into place to ensure that it doesn't recur.

Are you trying to say that if we supply to a customer in Africa then he shouldn't complain because he doesn't know our manager personally?

If you are then you are far removed from the reality of the business world.

Woody1985
26-02-2009, 12:53 PM
I can never resist the urge to point out such outstanding hypocrisy from one so patronising...

I assume u were being colloquial with the use of the word 'polis', but no colloquialism can disguise the fact that you cant even spell the word GRAMMER!!:blah:


Grammar even? :cool2:

:faf:

It's really **** when you try to act like a smart arse and then turn out looking like the ****!

:faf:

Beefster
26-02-2009, 01:02 PM
Come on JC...that's harsh...

I was laughing at the fact he hated Mixu being the manager from the off, never giving MP the chance to make his mark...that had nowt to do with my "Absurd Obsession" as you put it....

There's quite a number of people who jumped on the yams for publishing letters on open messageboards....and now some think it's alright that we do it...

You don't really understand what an open letter is, do you?

JC wasn't particularly harsh because you've not been coming across particularly great lately. By all means, defend Mixu, his tactics and his record but you seem to be unable to come up with a sound argument to do so. Instead, you've been resorting to taking the piss from fellow Hibees, if they hold a different opinion to you.

Still, if only the admins would listen to me and ban smilies....

Danderhall Hibs
26-02-2009, 01:04 PM
Still, if only the admins would listen to me and ban smilies....

:agree::agree::agree::agree::agree::agree::agree:

Danderhall Hibs
26-02-2009, 01:05 PM
Still, if only the admins would listen to me and ban Gramo....

That's better.

matty_f
26-02-2009, 01:11 PM
:agree::agree::agree::agree::agree::agree::agree:


That's better.

:faf:

Moulin Yarns
26-02-2009, 01:30 PM
I have followed this and many threads about fans wish to get rid of Mixu and have kept fairly quiet on the subject, but I now want to add my tuppenceworth. I am as unhappy as the next supporter/seaon ticket holder/uberfan at the poor results and the lack of cohesive play, fight, passion shown on the field, and I am not denying that perhaps it is time to have a change of manager, but, like others have said, how would you feel if you were being hounded out of your job, even though you were doing it to the best of your ability.

Before anybody thinks I'm defending Mixu, I'm not, but I wonder, in all the threads, protestations, and letters to the board, has anybody thought who could come in and do better with the squad we have at present? And I don't mean some pie in the sky 'big name' manager, I mean, realistically who would be wanting to come to easter Road, knowing that, if results, and the manner in which they are achieved don't improve the same thing would happen to them?

I want the football to improve, and I think we have the talented players to do that, and I want the results to imrove, but I don't think writing letters or protesting outside the stand (which hasn't happened, yet) will necessarily influence the board. I will be at Easter Road on saturday giving my support to the team for 90 minutes, I will not be shouting abuse at any player, manager or bard member and I will hope we win, by playing good, attractive football, reagrdless of who is in charge in the dugout. I have no favourites to take over as manager, and therefore I will (have to) put up with our present manager because he is as much a part of Hibs as the players.

OK I don't expect everybody to agree with me, but I wouldn't expect to be abused or hounded out by others on the message boards.

Thank you for listening.

bighairyfaeleith
26-02-2009, 01:42 PM
so whats the difference between an open letter and what the op posted??

Dr Jimmy
26-02-2009, 01:43 PM
I have followed this and many threads about fans wish to get rid of Mixu and have kept fairly quiet on the subject, but I now want to add my tuppenceworth. I am as unhappy as the next supporter/seaon ticket holder/uberfan at the poor results and the lack of cohesive play, fight, passion shown on the field, and I am not denying that perhaps it is time to have a change of manager, but, like others have said, how would you feel if you were being hounded out of your job, even though you were doing it to the best of your ability.

Before anybody thinks I'm defending Mixu, I'm not, but I wonder, in all the threads, protestations, and letters to the board, has anybody thought who could come in and do better with the squad we have at present? And I don't mean some pie in the sky 'big name' manager, I mean, realistically who would be wanting to come to easter Road, knowing that, if results, and the manner in which they are achieved don't improve the same thing would happen to them?

I want the football to improve, and I think we have the talented players to do that, and I want the results to imrove, but I don't think writing letters or protesting outside the stand (which hasn't happened, yet) will necessarily influence the board. I will be at Easter Road on saturday giving my support to the team for 90 minutes, I will not be shouting abuse at any player, manager or bard member and I will hope we win, by playing good, attractive football, reagrdless of who is in charge in the dugout. I have no favourites to take over as manager, and therefore I will (have to) put up with our present manager because he is as much a part of Hibs as the players.

OK I don't expect everybody to agree with me, but I wouldn't expect to be abused or hounded out by others on the message boards.

Thank you for listening.

I think you will find fans venting their frustration directly at the board does influence them and is often the catalyst for change.

Danderhall Hibs
26-02-2009, 01:47 PM
so whats the difference between an open letter and what the op posted??

I suppose there’s not much difference – what I’d say is that an open letter is posted on an open forum for everyone to see but not actually sent directly whereas FIG has actually sent his letter to an individual and then just told everyone what he said.

Petrie's Tache
26-02-2009, 01:48 PM
I have followed this and many threads about fans wish to get rid of Mixu and have kept fairly quiet on the subject, but I now want to add my tuppenceworth. I am as unhappy as the next supporter/seaon ticket holder/uberfan at the poor results and the lack of cohesive play, fight, passion shown on the field, and I am not denying that perhaps it is time to have a change of manager, but, like others have said, how would you feel if you were being hounded out of your job, even though you were doing it to the best of your ability.

Before anybody thinks I'm defending Mixu, I'm not, but I wonder, in all the threads, protestations, and letters to the board, has anybody thought who could come in and do better with the squad we have at present? And I don't mean some pie in the sky 'big name' manager, I mean, realistically who would be wanting to come to easter Road, knowing that, if results, and the manner in which they are achieved don't improve the same thing would happen to them?

I want the football to improve, and I think we have the talented players to do that, and I want the results to imrove, but I don't think writing letters or protesting outside the stand (which hasn't happened, yet) will necessarily influence the board. I will be at Easter Road on saturday giving my support to the team for 90 minutes, I will not be shouting abuse at any player, manager or bard member and I will hope we win, by playing good, attractive football, reagrdless of who is in charge in the dugout. I have no favourites to take over as manager, and therefore I will (have to) put up with our present manager because he is as much a part of Hibs as the players.

OK I don't expect everybody to agree with me, but I wouldn't expect to be abused or hounded out by others on the message boards.

Thank you for listening.






Admins LTYF............................................:g reengrin:devil:

bighairyfaeleith
26-02-2009, 01:49 PM
I think you will find fans venting their frustration directly at the board does influence them and is often the catalyst for change.

Not sure that's entirely true, my memory is a little vague so please correct me but blobby was hardly popular with the fans but the board stuck with him????

Over the years the board have stuck by various managers despite us not liking them, Alex Miller, Williamson spring to mind. Different boards but the managers have normally quit rather than be sacked have they not :confused:

bighairyfaeleith
26-02-2009, 01:51 PM
I suppose there’s not much difference – what I’d say is that an open letter is posted on an open forum for everyone to see but not actually sent directly whereas FIG has actually sent his letter to an individual and then just told everyone what he said.

Kind of thought that, but just wasn't sure. I think the main reason the op has had some flack is that it all does seem a bit yammish. Can't quite quantify why, it just does.

Illogical I know but hey we're hibs fans and that has to be one of the most illogical things to be all things considered

lapsedhibee
26-02-2009, 01:52 PM
so whats the difference between an open letter and what the op posted??

The op posted a copy of a letter he actually, er, posted to someone. An open letter tends to be published somewhere without necessarily being actually sent to the individual/body it is intended to influence.

Is that the difference? :dunno:

jacomo
26-02-2009, 01:56 PM
who could come in and do better with the squad we have at present?

It's a valid question.

Surely the summer is a better time to make a new appointment than mid season - there's bound to be more candidates available.

I'm in favour of giving Mixu til the end of the season and then reviewing things then. This gives him a little more time to turn things round - although I'm not sure it will happen.

Franck is God
26-02-2009, 02:03 PM
It's a very valid question.

My reasoning for wanting the change now rather than at the end of the season is to try and have a positive affect on next seasons season ticket sales and attendances up to the end of the season.

My gut feeling is that if Mixu is gone the majority will renew to give the new guy (whoever he is) a chance in the same way they did last year with Mixu. I know that I will.

10k season ticket sales mean we don't have to sell anyone and still add to the squad. 5k ticket sales means that Fletcher, Rosa & the Monk are definitely gone and doesn't leave much money for replacements.

H1bs6H3arts2 FC
26-02-2009, 02:29 PM
:top marks

IWasThere2016
26-02-2009, 02:32 PM
It's a very valid question.

My reasoning for wanting the change now rather than at the end of the season is to try and have a positive affect on next seasons season ticket sales and attendances up to the end of the season.

My gut feeling is that if Mixu is gone the majority will renew to give the new guy (whoever he is) a chance in the same way they did last year with Mixu. I know that I will.

10k season ticket sales mean we don't have to sell anyone and still add to the squad. 5k ticket sales means that Fletcher, Rosa & the Monk are definitely gone and doesn't leave much money for replacements.

:agree: My take also. Gives new guy a chance to change things/assess squad/build rapport/improve morale etc etc

Things MP wont be able to do now.

Jonnyboy
26-02-2009, 02:57 PM
Someone said in my hearing today "If we keep Mixu until the end of the season and we keep playing the way we are we will be relegated because every other SPL team knows how to beat us."

Hard to argue with that IMO :boo hoo:

Tomsk
26-02-2009, 03:02 PM
The op posted a copy of a letter he actually, er, posted to someone. An open letter tends to be published somewhere without necessarily being actually sent to the individual/body it is intended to influence.

Is that the difference? :dunno:

It is an open letter by definition. The correspondent has addressed it to a single person and simultaneously published it in an open forum, in this case Hibs Net Messageboard. That is an open letter.

The Chambers Dictionary. open letter n a letter addressed to one person but intended for public reading

I am not sure why people are getting aggravated about it except pehaps because Filled Rolls used to have such fun at the expense of the numerous open letters from Yams back in the day when Vlad's revolution went awry.

MB62
26-02-2009, 03:45 PM
It's a valid question.

Surely the summer is a better time to make a new appointment than mid season - there's bound to be more candidates available.

I'm in favour of giving Mixu til the end of the season and then reviewing things then. This gives him a little more time to turn things round - although I'm not sure it will happen.

One recent example against this theory - INVERNESS.
I reckon if they had not replaced their manager when they did, they were certs for relegation. A new manager has come in, gave everybody a boost, I think they are possibly unbeaten under their new manager and they could well now avoid the drop.

We however, have been on a downward spiral for a very long time. Players admit confidence is low, our managers admits his players are not good enough and I believe we are one defeat on Saturday from being involved in the relegation battle.

My opinion? Replace the manager NOW and give the whole club a boost.

lapsedhibee
26-02-2009, 04:33 PM
I am not sure why people are getting aggravated about it except pehaps because Filled Rolls used to have such fun at the expense of the numerous open letters from Yams back in the day when Vlad's revolution went awry.

LTYF. You will be having us doing twirlies in rreversible satin jackets next. :agree:

Tomsk
26-02-2009, 04:41 PM
LTYF. You will be having us doing twirlies in rreversible satin jackets next. :agree:

Was this intended for me?

BT58
26-02-2009, 04:43 PM
One recent example against this theory - INVERNESS.
I reckon if they had not replaced their manager when they did, they were certs for relegation. A new manager has come in, gave everybody a boost, I think they are possibly unbeaten under their new manager and they could well now avoid the drop.

We however, have been on a downward spiral for a very long time. Players admit confidence is low, our managers admits his players are not good enough and I believe we are one defeat on Saturday from being involved in the relegation battle.

My opinion? Replace the manager NOW and give the whole club a boost.

:top marks:top marks
well said that man,,,,,,,,even if we where to beat the bairns on saturday
[which i doubt btw] we would be just glossing over the cracks
its obvious to all [bar rp] that mixu has lost the dressing room
i think if mp is still in charge by next term, we could see season tickets down to 5/7 k :grr::grr::grr:
MIXU OUT NOW!!!!!!!!
hb

lapsedhibee
26-02-2009, 04:46 PM
Was this intended for me?

Apologies, I thought for a minute there that you were suggesting that it might sometimes be ok to do things that yams did.

Tomsk
26-02-2009, 04:47 PM
Apologies, I thought for a minute there that you were suggesting that it might sometimes be ok to do things that yams did.

No problem.

lEXO
26-02-2009, 05:13 PM
Can I just offer my tuppenceworth here?

To those of you referring to this as an open letter - it's not. It was a personal letter from the OP to a member of the Hibs Board which he decided he would share amongst his fellow fans on here.

Now some of you may not approve of his actions and indeed some are even laughing at the guy but you must surely see this is not some wee boy who's upset cos his team got beat. This is a long standing supporter genuinely concerned and pouring his heart out. Do some people enjoy ridiculing such actions?

It seems to me that an attempt to generate a debate has drawn a huge amount of unfair criticism and not a little unhelpful and sarcastic comments, none of which are in any way fair. If you disagree with the OP's intentions then by all means say so but think about the fact that he's just the same as you and I - a very worried Hibs fan

:top marks

Brando7
26-02-2009, 05:20 PM
:faf: :faf: :faf:

Don't hold your breath on that happening.

Excellent letter, which will unfortunately fall on deaf ears.

Agreed on both there

Got a feeling it be scrunched up after reading the 1st paragraph n in the bin

frazeHFC
26-02-2009, 05:24 PM
Great letter

weecounty hibby
26-02-2009, 05:48 PM
I think after reading all of the posts on the thread that the op and Peejay have both got it right. The op has expressed his feelings and the feelings of many others in a way he feels is right.
Peejay is right because we DO accept mediocrity and it shouldn't be like that at Hibs. I was speaking today to someone at work and I found myself saying that when I was younger I thought we would win the league. Now I find myself at ER for the craic with my old pals rather than any expectation of winning anything.
We should be demanding that wee bit more than the likes of Motherwell, Killie, ICT etc and even to do better than the Jambos Dons, Utd more often but for some reason we don't .

hibs0666
26-02-2009, 06:28 PM
Should I send this one?

---------------------

Dear Scott,

I am sure that you, like me, are finding watching the Hibees a bit sair these days. In your role as the Big Chief, you are no doubt feeling frustrated at the lack of consistent performance on the park this season, and the consequent impact on cash coming into the club.

With this in mind, you may well be faced with difficult decisions in days to come that will have a significant impact on the club in the short and medium term.

In making those decisions there will be many 'experts' offering you opinons on 'the solution' in letters, newspaper articles and the Internet. However, you are clearly in a unique position of access within the club and, in these difficult days, you will see with your own eyes those that are giving their all for the club and those that do not have the effort and application needed.

May I therefore request that, when making the hard decisions facing you, that you use the evidence of your own eyes and do not jeopardise the long-term future of the club simply to placate those that are currently shouting long and loud both within and outside the club.

Golden Bear
26-02-2009, 06:34 PM
Should I send this one?

---------------------

Dear Scott,

I am sure that you, like me, are finding watching the Hibees a bit sair these days. In your role as the Big Chief, you are no doubt feeling frustrated at the lack of consistent performance on the park this season, and the consequent impact on cash coming into the club.

With this in mind, you may well be faced with difficult decisions in days to come that will have a significant impact on the club in the short and medium term.

In making those decisions there will be many 'experts' offering you opinons on 'the solution' in letters, newspaper articles and the Internet. However, you are clearly in a unique position of access within the club and, in these difficult days, you will see with your own eyes those that are giving their all for the club and those that do not have the effort and application needed.

May I therefore request that, when making the hard decisions facing you, that you use the evidence of your own eyes and do not jeopardise the long-term future of the club simply to placate those that are currently shouting long and loud both within and outside the club.

Nope

Badge
26-02-2009, 06:40 PM
Should I send this one?

---------------------

Dear Scott,

I am sure that you, like me, are finding watching the Hibees a bit sair these days. In your role as the Big Chief, you are no doubt feeling frustrated at the lack of consistent performance on the park this season, and the consequent impact on cash coming into the club.

With this in mind, you may well be faced with difficult decisions in days to come that will have a significant impact on the club in the short and medium term.

In making those decisions there will be many 'experts' offering you opinons on 'the solution' in letters, newspaper articles and the Internet. However, you are clearly in a unique position of access within the club and, in these difficult days, you will see with your own eyes those that are giving their all for the club and those that do not have the effort and application needed.

May I therefore request that, when making the hard decisions facing you, that you use the evidence of your own eyes and do not jeopardise the long-term future of the club simply to placate those that are currently shouting long and loud both within and outside the club.

Why not?
If that's how you feel and these are your thoughts/views on the current situation, then go for it.

lEXO
26-02-2009, 07:23 PM
I think after reading all of the posts on the thread that the op and Peejay have both got it right. The op has expressed his feelings and the feelings of many others in a way he feels is right.
Peejay is right because we DO accept mediocrity and it shouldn't be like that at Hibs. I was speaking today to someone at work and I found myself saying that when I was younger I thought we would win the league. Now I find myself at ER for the craic with my old pals rather than any expectation of winning anything.
We should be demanding that wee bit more than the likes of Motherwell, Killie, ICT etc and even to do better than the Jambos Dons, Utd more often but for some reason we don't .
I DONT accept mediocrity and most Hibbies i know dont either. We are either being told that we expect to much,or we accept mediocrity. We should be doing better than all the teams you list,hence the unrest amongst the support.Poor performances and results week in and week out are the reason the OP sent his letter to the club,and people are talking about not renewing their ST. I would,nt say that was acceptance.

Spike Mandela
26-02-2009, 07:41 PM
I was wondering how many of you avid letter writers have sent a letter to the club congratulating them when the team are doing well. very few I would imagine.

We're having a bad season, not our first and won't be our last so get over it.

The club will act, if necessary, when the time is right as they have in the past so let's stop the mutual backslapping letters club and get behind the team 100%on Saturday.

Allant1981
26-02-2009, 07:51 PM
I was wondering how many of you avid letter writers have sent a letter to the club congratulating them when the team are doing well. very few I would imagine.

We're having a bad season, not our first and won't be our last so get over it.

The club will act, if necessary, when the time is right as they have in the past so let's stop the mutual backslapping letters club and get behind the team 100%on Saturday.

We congratulate them buy buying season tickets and club merchandise, the club is clearly going in the wrong direction and have not acted so its clear they do not act when necessary.Why should we get over it because the team are having a bad season. Should we not want the best for the club that we support

sahib
26-02-2009, 07:56 PM
"I have never expected us to win the league or even a cup"

It is all bit futile really.
Perhaps Scottish football deserves to die.

new malkyhib
26-02-2009, 08:14 PM
The club will act, if necessary, when the time is right as they have in the past so let's stop the mutual backslapping letters club and get behind the team 100%on Saturday.

Will they Spike? If Petrie sacks Paatelainen, then he himself is admitting he's made a mistake - which he doesn't like doing...and Petrie's only ever "sacked" one manager to my knowledge, and that was Franck Sauzee.

The rest, from McLeish through to Williamson, Collins, Mowbray all made it easy for him by either leaviing of their own accord, or going to other clubs.

So he (RP) doesn't have a track record of acting decisively when he has to...

To come back on topic, I think the OP's letter was very well put, and argued out rationally - however, I think he's gubbed his chance of getting a response to it by putting it up on a fans' message board; as by the same rationale, Petrie and Lindsay might be fearful of any personal reply to his letter being posted straight away on here again for everybody to dissect and fling their tuppence worth's in...

That said, I've e-mailed them 3 times in the last 10 days, the contents of which i've no intention of airing on here, but all i've received back is the same bland stock reply that everyone else seems to have had, so maybe the much derided "open letter" is the only way to get a reaction from them!

In closing, I think it's been a good thread as the debate has widened once again to embrace the varying levels of expectation levels amongst the Hibs fans, and I have to agree that some on here are now conditioned to accept mediocrity - and for a club of our heritage and standing in the game, that's rather sad.

It does however,appear to be where our Board of risk-averse, non-idealist Chartered Accountants seem to want to position the club - hence the appointment of (largely) untried rookies over the last wee while - so in closing, if they do move Mixu on before/after Saturday's game, then old Rodney should stand down as well, and close the door quietly behind himself...

Newhaven
26-02-2009, 08:21 PM
I have followed this and many threads about fans wish to get rid of Mixu and have kept fairly quiet on the subject, but I now want to add my tuppenceworth. I am as unhappy as the next supporter/seaon ticket holder/uberfan at the poor results and the lack of cohesive play, fight, passion shown on the field, and I am not denying that perhaps it is time to have a change of manager, but, like others have said, how would you feel if you were being hounded out of your job, even though you were doing it to the best of your ability.

Before anybody thinks I'm defending Mixu, I'm not, but I wonder, in all the threads, protestations, and letters to the board, has anybody thought who could come in and do better with the squad we have at present? And I don't mean some pie in the sky 'big name' manager, I mean, realistically who would be wanting to come to easter Road, knowing that, if results, and the manner in which they are achieved don't improve the same thing would happen to them?

I want the football to improve, and I think we have the talented players to do that, and I want the results to imrove, but I don't think writing letters or protesting outside the stand (which hasn't happened, yet) will necessarily influence the board. I will be at Easter Road on saturday giving my support to the team for 90 minutes, I will not be shouting abuse at any player, manager or bard member and I will hope we win, by playing good, attractive football, reagrdless of who is in charge in the dugout. I have no favourites to take over as manager, and therefore I will (have to) put up with our present manager because he is as much a part of Hibs as the players.

OK I don't expect everybody to agree with me, but I wouldn't expect to be abused or hounded out by others on the message boards.

Thank you for listening.

Did Hibs fans want Mixu to succeed? Of course they did. No one wanted to see him fail. However, it's as clear as day that it isn't working out on the park - results prove that.

These things happen in everyday life around the world Im afraid. People want to make a go of a challenge but they fall short.

If Mixu were to hold up his hands and say enough is enough and quit fair play to the guy. As it is (even with a win on Saturday) he is clearly not up to the job with the players at his disposal. I mean this week saying that the board haven't backed him with funds was downright tragic :bitchy:

Don Giovanni
26-02-2009, 08:25 PM
I was wondering how many of you avid letter writers have sent a letter to the club congratulating them when the team are doing well. very few I would imagine.

We're having a bad season, not our first and won't be our last so get over it.

The club will act, if necessary, when the time is right as they have in the past so let's stop the mutual backslapping letters club and get behind the team 100%on Saturday.

I agree with most of what you're saying there, Spike.

Although I do have more respect for the OP for actually taking action, making his feelings known to the club and trying to make a difference than all the do-nothing moaners, who believe posting negative comments on a message board and not going to support their team/club on a Saturday is an effective form of "protest".

The "stay away protesters" would be serving the club better by getting behind the team on a Saturday, first and foremost.
If we come away with another poor result and shocking performance they could then make their feelings known, in person, at the stadium.
Given the sheer weight of numbers (most posters on this board?) the club is bound to sit up and take notice, right?
If you feel strongly enough about something you have the right to protest.
Afterall we're quick enough to have a pop at the Yams for being "spineless" and not taking any action against Vlad (other than open letters, of course)

But then again maybe it's just easier to slope away into Saturday night and vent frustrations on an unofficial site than to stand and be counted...

Newhaven
26-02-2009, 08:29 PM
I was wondering how many of you avid letter writers have sent a letter to the club congratulating them when the team are doing well. very few I would imagine.

We're having a bad season, not our first and won't be our last so get over it.

The club will act, if necessary, when the time is right as they have in the past so let's stop the mutual backslapping letters club and get behind the team 100%on Saturday.

On the contray - Im in a position to speak to the board and Rod Petrie (who I may say comes across very well) on a fairly regular basis and have congratulated them on many a success (Europe 3 years ago, CIS cup and the handling of the Thomson/Brown saga)

Rather than typing for 8 hours plus on an internet message board some fans wanted to convey directly to the board how they felt about the situation our club is in.

In the current financial climate is Hibernian FC an attractive proposition for a season ticket (whatever type single, family etc.) for 09/10? In my eyes no so I thought I would highlight this to the board. In the eyes of some if that makes me stupid/less of a supporter/etc. than someone else then so be it

GREEN BRAZIL
26-02-2009, 08:30 PM
Ah! Now i think we are getting to the real issue here and that is we played like world beaters under TM but won nothing. We managed a cup under JC, but so far under MP we have appeared to go backwards. I put it to you and everyone else that we were already going backwards near the end of TM's tenure due to the massive clear out of real quality players. Money was not made available to JC to even try to replace those sold. Whats worse is that the board (RP) went behind his back to talk to the players over the dressing room bust up. It has fallen on MP's shoulders to try and pick all the pieces up. Of course, it was always going to be a big ask of any manager, let alone a relatively inexperienced one, to build from the bottom, it was always going to be a painful, and long, process, but it appears few are willing to accept this.

Thats exactly how i see things :top marks


I was one of the more vocal opponents of the sale of our golden generation, only to be replaced by players of a far less quality. I was told on countless occasions that it was all important to the long term financial security of our club "debt reduction, ground reconstruction and training facility", so that future generations of supporters could watch this great club play at easter road. I eventually got my head around this concept, so i strapped myself in the rollercoaret ready for a good few seasons of mediocre football, strong in the knowledge that the majority of hibs fans had agreed with this long term plan. :flag:


How wrong could one man be :grr:.
Low and behold 5 minutes into the revolution and people have found out they don't have the stomach for it


KEEP THE FAITH

Mibbes Aye
26-02-2009, 08:43 PM
This is a message from Scott Lindsay:

If you could forward all ticket stubs to c/o bawheid at Hibs.net that would be much appreciated. Thank you for your comments.

This is a message from Rod Petrie FAO Scott Lindsay:

Scott, tell bawheid to go halfers with Mibbes on any tickets he gets. Your comments are appreciated.

Captain Pugwash
26-02-2009, 08:45 PM
Thats exactly how i see things :top marks


I was one of the more vocal opponents of the sale of our golden generation, only to be replaced by players of a far less quality. I was told on countless occasions that it was all important to the long term financial security of our club "debt reduction, ground reconstruction and training facility", so that future generations of supporters could watch this great club play at easter road. I eventually got my head around this concept, so i strapped myself in the rollercoaret ready for a good few seasons of mediocre football, strong in the knowledge that the majority of hibs fans had agreed with this long term plan. :flag:


How wrong could one man be :grr:.
Low and behold 5 minutes into the revolution and people have found out they don't have the stomach for it


KEEP THE FAITH

Firstly, the board couldn't hold on to the "Golden Generation" any longer than they did, IMHO. If we hadn't agreed to sell at a price that was right for the club then these players wouldn't have signed contract extensions and would therefore have left for nothing. Fletcher signed his contract extension on the understanding that he could go if the right offer came in.

That he is still at the club is down to Celtc not bidding an acceptable amount, and that Hibs were able to turn down the bid they did put in was solely because of the way they (the board) handled the sales of the "Golden Generation".

For not having the stomach for the fight, that's baws. We put up with these player sales because it would, eventually, allow us to increase the player budget and give better facilities for the players that were here.

That has happened - however there is no way that you could say that MP has in any way come close to realising the potential of the squad that he has been allowed to assemble.

The board have kept their side of the bargain by coming through with increased spending as promised. It is the manager who is failing by being unable to set a team out to perform in anything like an acceptable manner.

People should be making their feelings known if they are disgruntled with Mixu - it is he that is hindering the club's progress at the moment, it's nothing to do with Hibs' short, medium, or long term strategies. This team should be hitting far higher heights with the players at the manager's disposal than it's doing.

matty_f
26-02-2009, 08:46 PM
This is a message from Rod Petrie FAO Scott Lindsay:

Scott, tell bawheid to go halfers with Mibbes on any tickets he gets. Your comments are appreciated.

p.s. add the fairnie in too.

chorley_fm
26-02-2009, 09:13 PM
The business I work for does not go out to fail and let its customers down, but on occasion we do. When it happens we want to know all about it. We don't want our customers walking away in silence resolving never to trade with us again and using someone else. We want to hear their complaints no matter how extreme they seem or how idiosynchratically presented they are. It gives us the opportunity to make amends and to apologise as necessary and more importantly to fix the problem for the future. That way we can minimise the damage and all being well retain our customer's confidence to use us again.

Any business that refuses to embrace customer feedback is either too good at what they do or not going to be in business very long.

I am sure Hibs welcome every complaint they get. Petrie and Lyndsey will not want to be throwing open the ticket office doors during the summer to face empty streets and then wondering where the heck everyone is.


Excellent post, without making this into a pub/resturant thread, customers who claim are argueably more important than customers who have enjoyed the experience.

No one likes complainers but the key is to utilise them for the best of the business. i'm sure hibs do.


Being in the trade so to speak, a customer who has a good experience will tell 5 people, a customer who had a bad experience will tell 20 people.

Petrie and Lindsey should be giving each and every letter (open or not) full consideration and understand the impact not acting can and will bring.

Big Frank
26-02-2009, 09:17 PM
Firstly, the board couldn't hold on to the "Golden Generation" any longer than they did, IMHO. If we hadn't agreed to sell at a price that was right for the club then these players wouldn't have signed contract extensions and would therefore have left for nothing. Fletcher signed his contract extension on the understanding that he could go if the right offer came in.

That he is still at the club is down to Celtc not bidding an acceptable amount, and that Hibs were able to turn down the bid they did put in was solely because of the way they (the board) handled the sales of the "Golden Generation".

For not having the stomach for the fight, that's baws. We put up with these player sales because it would, eventually, allow us to increase the player budget and give better facilities for the players that were here.

That has happened - however there is no way that you could say that MP has in any way come close to realising the potential of the squad that he has been allowed to assemble.

The board have kept their side of the bargain by coming through with increased spending as promised. It is the manager who is failing by being unable to set a team out to perform in anything like an acceptable manner.

People should be making their feelings known if they are disgruntled with Mixu - it is he that is hindering the club's progress at the moment, it's nothing to do with Hibs' short, medium, or long term strategies. This team should be hitting far higher heights with the players at the manager's disposal than it's doing.


Welcome back puggers :cool2: Where you been :confused:

Anyhoo good post :agree:

GREEN BRAZIL
26-02-2009, 09:18 PM
The ultimate measure of a man "fan" is not where he stands in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy

flash
26-02-2009, 09:22 PM
Send a letter to the players and ask to have it pinned on the dressing room wall asking them why they are cheating us week in week out.

Mibbes Aye
26-02-2009, 09:29 PM
We seem to live in a complaint culture nowadays and to an extent it's no bad thing that people are more prepared to voice their opinion when they're unhappy about something.

My only criticism of the OP is that the bit at the end promising to send ticket stubs back individually does make it sound a wee bit like a kidnapper sending the victim's fingers through the post, one at a time, or something.

Was that bit of the letter written using cut-out words from newspaper headlines? :greengrin

And has anyone else started a thread by quoting a complaint to the club?

Captain Trips
26-02-2009, 09:52 PM
Send a letter to the players and ask to have it pinned on the dressing room wall asking them why they are cheating us week in week out.

:agree:

Joe's ice cream
26-02-2009, 09:53 PM
The ultimate measure of a man "fan" is not where he stands in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy

And at the this time of Challenge the OP has chosen to air his feelings to the source!!!!! we all take our actions as we see fit

bighairyfaeleith
27-02-2009, 05:54 AM
Will they Spike? If Petrie sacks Paatelainen, then he himself is admitting he's made a mistake - which he doesn't like doing...and Petrie's only ever "sacked" one manager to my knowledge, and that was Franck Sauzee.

The rest, from McLeish through to Williamson, Collins, Mowbray all made it easy for him by either leaviing of their own accord, or going to other clubs.

So he (RP) doesn't have a track record of acting decisively when he has to...

To come back on topic, I think the OP's letter was very well put, and argued out rationally - however, I think he's gubbed his chance of getting a response to it by putting it up on a fans' message board; as by the same rationale, Petrie and Lindsay might be fearful of any personal reply to his letter being posted straight away on here again for everybody to dissect and fling their tuppence worth's in...

That said, I've e-mailed them 3 times in the last 10 days, the contents of which i've no intention of airing on here, but all i've received back is the same bland stock reply that everyone else seems to have had, so maybe the much derided "open letter" is the only way to get a reaction from them!

In closing, I think it's been a good thread as the debate has widened once again to embrace the varying levels of expectation levels amongst the Hibs fans, and I have to agree that some on here are now conditioned to accept mediocrity - and for a club of our heritage and standing in the game, that's rather sad.

It does however,appear to be where our Board of risk-averse, non-idealist Chartered Accountants seem to want to position the club - hence the appointment of (largely) untried rookies over the last wee while - so in closing, if they do move Mixu on before/after Saturday's game, then old Rodney should stand down as well, and close the door quietly behind himself...

:asshole::bye:

Dr Jimmy
27-02-2009, 09:45 AM
Will they Spike? If Petrie sacks Paatelainen, then he himself is admitting he's made a mistake - which he doesn't like doing...and Petrie's only ever "sacked" one manager to my knowledge, and that was Franck Sauzee.

The rest, from McLeish through to Williamson, Collins, Mowbray all made it easy for him by either leaviing of their own accord, or going to other clubs.

So he (RP) doesn't have a track record of acting decisively when he has to...

To come back on topic, I think the OP's letter was very well put, and argued out rationally - however, I think he's gubbed his chance of getting a response to it by putting it up on a fans' message board; as by the same rationale, Petrie and Lindsay might be fearful of any personal reply to his letter being posted straight away on here again for everybody to dissect and fling their tuppence worth's in...

That said, I've e-mailed them 3 times in the last 10 days, the contents of which i've no intention of airing on here, but all i've received back is the same bland stock reply that everyone else seems to have had, so maybe the much derided "open letter" is the only way to get a reaction from them!

In closing, I think it's been a good thread as the debate has widened once again to embrace the varying levels of expectation levels amongst the Hibs fans, and I have to agree that some on here are now conditioned to accept mediocrity - and for a club of our heritage and standing in the game, that's rather sad.

It does however,appear to be where our Board of risk-averse, non-idealist Chartered Accountants seem to want to position the club - hence the appointment of (largely) untried rookies over the last wee while - so in closing, if they do move Mixu on before/after Saturday's game, then old Rodney should stand down as well, and close the door quietly behind himself...


:top marks
Unfortunately the happy clappers will bounce back with the balance sheet defence!

Judas Iscariot
27-02-2009, 09:52 AM
Gramo, I've avoided replying to your posts on Mixu as much as poss since it's clear you have your view and tbh it's not worth getting in a fight over since I want him to succeed, I've just accepted it's unlikely to happen at hibs.

However, that said, your reply to this post is pathetic, its patronising head in the sand stuff. Mixu is finished at Hibs, it will take major major action to save his job. He's lost the dressing room and the stands, only a matter of time before he looses the boardroom also.

Theres no way back for him, I just wish either he or the board would get it over with. You are the only real prominent hibs.net member still in support of him to my knowledge, however, at times its clutching at straws. I respect the fact you want him to do well, however, i think its more a lack of accepting its went tits up than a real belief that hes the man for the job. I think if you REALLY thought it through you'd see what everyone else sees.

Without using the "everyone calls him nasty names" or that "hatrick" (or smilies) arguement, can you construct any form of arguement which counters;

1) Blaming players (19 years olds with about 10 games under their belt) in public.
2) his post match interviews.
3) his embarrassing pitch side behaviour
4) his lack of subs
5) his signing of 15 players, none of which it appears he knows where to deploy them (except mibbie the keeper).
6) his failure to find a system since he got here
7) his failure to fix the fact we surrender the MF after 10 mins every week
8) hoofball
9) the fact he listed his targets when he got the job and has met....none?
10) the fact we are as close to the relegation spot, as third. Despite mixu having the best budget and argueably the best hibs team outwith Mowbray's in a decade or so.

I'll conceed most of his signings have been good. but see point 5.

and most worrying

11) lthe lack of fitness and fight in the team.

surely you must see this, can you honestly say you can give me as many reasons to justify giving him more time, or money?

You didn't actually expect him to answer did you?

jacomo
27-02-2009, 04:47 PM
Where is Filled Rolls these days?

This board is a worse place without him.

(((Fergus)))
27-02-2009, 05:29 PM
Thats exactly how i see things :top marks


I was one of the more vocal opponents of the sale of our golden generation, only to be replaced by players of a far less quality. I was told on countless occasions that it was all important to the long term financial security of our club "debt reduction, ground reconstruction and training facility", so that future generations of supporters could watch this great club play at easter road. I eventually got my head around this concept, so i strapped myself in the rollercoaret ready for a good few seasons of mediocre football, strong in the knowledge that the majority of hibs fans had agreed with this long term plan. :flag:


How wrong could one man be :grr:.
Low and behold 5 minutes into the revolution and people have found out they don't have the stomach for it


KEEP THE FAITH

Like Mixu, you're just a bit slow on the uptake. :wink:

You'll get there eventually this time as well. :thumbsup:

erskine-hibby
27-02-2009, 09:10 PM
Will they Spike? If Petrie sacks Paatelainen, then he himself is admitting he's made a mistake - which he doesn't like doing...and Petrie's only ever "sacked" one manager to my knowledge, and that was Franck Sauzee.

The rest, from McLeish through to Williamson, Collins, Mowbray all made it easy for him by either leaviing of their own accord, or going to other clubs.

So he (RP) doesn't have a track record of acting decisively when he has to...

To come back on topic, I think the OP's letter was very well put, and argued out rationally - however, I think he's gubbed his chance of getting a response to it by putting it up on a fans' message board; as by the same rationale, Petrie and Lindsay might be fearful of any personal reply to his letter being posted straight away on here again for everybody to dissect and fling their tuppence worth's in...

That said, I've e-mailed them 3 times in the last 10 days, the contents of which i've no intention of airing on here, but all i've received back is the same bland stock reply that everyone else seems to have had, so maybe the much derided "open letter" is the only way to get a reaction from them!

In closing, I think it's been a good thread as the debate has widened once again to embrace the varying levels of expectation levels amongst the Hibs fans, and I have to agree that some on here are now conditioned to accept mediocrity - and for a club of our heritage and standing in the game, that's rather sad.

It does however,appear to be where our Board of risk-averse, non-idealist Chartered Accountants seem to want to position the club - hence the appointment of (largely) untried rookies over the last wee while - so in closing, if they do move Mixu on before/after Saturday's game, then old Rodney should stand down as well, and close the door quietly behind himself...

:agree:

As he should have done a while back IMHO.

sesoim
27-02-2009, 11:25 PM
I will not attend another Hibs match while Mixu Paatelainen is in charge and enclose my season ticket stub for Saturday’s game against Falkirk. I will post each and every stub individually for the rest of the season as long as he remains in charge. [/FONT]


I agree with your sentiments but can't you sell the stub instead? The ticket prices are ridioculous now and I'm sure there's a few fans who would happilly pay you a few quid for your tickets.

Personally, I wont be going back till they reduce the ticket prices back to what they should be based on inflation from the first ticket price I paid in 1986, value for money and the current climate. I'm hoping to get into a few £5 games in the near future.:wink:

Woody1985
08-12-2009, 08:24 PM
Probably still up there fighting for every trophy, just be under a different manager.

Are you suggesting we should be happy to let things plod along under the leadership (or lack of it)?

This thread just got a mention elsewhere and I was reading through the comments.

Can I just say, 10 months later, that this post is aload of pish. :greengrin

therealgavmac
08-12-2009, 09:12 PM
This thread just got a mention elsewhere and I was reading through the comments.

Can I just say, 10 months later, that this post is aload of pish. :greengrin

:hilarious

Phil D. Rolls
08-12-2009, 09:36 PM
Where is Filled Rolls these days?

This board is a worse place without him.

How did I miss this thread - oh yeah, they didn't let us use computers in "the hospital".

Cracking letter, good to see the craze didn't catch on though. Us wee teamers can't be getting above ourselves, expecting our betters not only to read letters but actually act on them.

If only we had the same influence our Yammish cousins do, maybe we could order up some blazers and give ourselves a name like the Hobo Defenders. :dunno: