Death - celebrate life or mourn the loss

[Toaods]

Everyone to their own of course, but I happened to be browsing the death notices in tonight's Ev News and saw this one:

"At Albert's specific request , there was no service, no flowers and no one present at his cremation"


Whilst not one for religion or going OTT on such occassions, it struck me as being somewhat sad that a person should perhaps feel that attitude , generally under the guise of "I dinnae want a fuss made about me".

My old man always says....."a black bin bag and a skip will do for me."

Thoughts...:dunno:

[s.a.m]

I suppose it depends on the situation. Maybe Albert felt that his remaining family would just have been going through the motions, maybe he hated their guts, or maybe he felt that, nice as they were, they just didn't need the hassle.

However, if he had loved ones, the funeral is surely as much about them - and helping them cope with their loss - as it is about Albert having his last hurrah.

Personally, I find funerals more traumatic than helpful. I would have preferred to have missed my Dad's. My Mum found it very comforting, though, and all the ritual was important to her.

[GlesgaeHibby]

I suppose it depends on the situation. Maybe Albert felt that his remaining family would just have been going through the motions, maybe he hated their guts, or maybe he felt that, nice as they were, they just didn't need the hassle.

However, if he had loved ones, the funeral is surely as much about them - and helping them cope with their loss - as it is about Albert having his last hurrah.

Personally, I find funerals more traumatic than helpful. I would have preferred to have missed my Dad's. My Mum found it very comforting, though, and all the ritual was important to her.

Funeral's are horrible though, I personally feel that you need to have them to say a final goodbye

[s.a.m]

On a similar subject, I once worked in an office where there was an Evening News Death Notice Sweepstake.

"And todays winner is Robert with 5 Peacefullys. Steve was runner up with 4 After A Long Illnesses. Gav 3rd with 2 Suddenlys"

You get the picture.










Disclaimer: I am ABSOLUTELY NOT suggesting that it is acceptable to mock the recently bereaved.:bitchy::greengrin

[Jay]

I was always a 'mourner' until recently. I felt we should be sad at the passing of someone we knew and be respectful enough to wear black etc.

in June I was at the funeral of a 16 year old girl who had been killed in a car crash and it was all about celebrating her life - it totally changed my outlook. her coffin was brought in to her favourite song - dolly partons 9 to 5!! It was very surreal but made me smile. Everbody was wearing bright colours at her parents request and a lot of the teenagers were in Hibs strips. There were speeches about the funny things that happened in her life and how full of life she was.

its a strange thing to say but I felt very uplifted after the service and decided that thats how funerals should be.

it's certainly how I want mine to be.

[stu in nottingham]

I think its very hard to know how you're going to react at a funeral. Difficult to predict.

I've been to one or two more than normally tragic ones and held it together and even enjoyed the company and talking with family and friends afterwards. On the other hand I went to a very senior (94 years old) family member's funeral expecting it to be 'a celebration of life' but found myself almost uncontrollably distraught.

[GlesgaeHibby]

I think its very hard to know how you're going to react at a funeral. Difficult to predict.

I've been to one or two more than normally tragic ones and held it together and even enjoyed the company and talking with family and friends afterwards. On the other hand I went to a very senior (94 years old) family member's funeral expecting it to be 'a celebration of life' but found myself almost uncontrollable distraught.

I was the same as you, my great grandad died aged 95 last summer and while I was upset at his death, I was glad he died at a ripe old age and still with his marbles intact and living in his own house but at the funeral I was really upset and couldn't hold back the emotions. Was at a funeral for an old school friend last year who died aged 20 and I managed to hold it back much better, although it was helped by seeing photos of his trip round the world and his happiness( he knew he was dying and made the most of it)

[steakbake]

each to their own.

i dont like the mawkish expectation placed on people by bereavement.

i'd rather be celebrated than mourned, remembered than missed.

i think it can also depend how you go when the time comes.

if you've had a long illness and/or plenty of time to think about it all, then you'd probably opt for the celebration of life.

if you've been stolen in your prime, then the event will probably reflect more how the people who have organised it will feel.

death happens as a natural consequence of being born! just one of them things.

its the circumstances which dictate how people will feel. and everyone will feel differently.

i'll take the celebration, please.

[Ants]

Fact is, they can do what they want, you aint gonna be able to do a thing about it.
You might not even turn up (in soul), but you will be there in body provided the undertakers get you in the right box.

Any horror tales people would like to tell?

Luckily, Ive none.

Celebration for me with plenty of Hibs related songs.

[SlickShoes]

Ive been to three funerals, all have been horrible and all have been great in different ways. Id be amazed if anyone knows how to deal with death. At my Nanas funeral i cried, and my papas i didnt and i loved them both equally so dont know why i held it together better at one than the other.

One of my best mates died at 23 after a long illness and i was a bit of a wreck at the funeral, just couldnt get over it and still cant really accept hes gone. The funeral itself was with some good music he chose and being around his family my other mates and there families as well as mine at the time made the day much easier afterwards.

Difficult to say though different people react in many different ways and its not predictable or rational you just dont know until it happens.

[gringojoe]

Lots of food, lots of drink and you dont have to dance with your mad old aunt what is not to like about that.

[Greentinted]

I have always held the belief that a funeral is a coming together of people who wish to display their grief and loss. It can be an event which incorporates celebration of the life just past but it is really just a means for the living who attend for their own reasons.
The last funeral I attended was a that of a friend of mine who died at aged 48 and he would not have believed the turnout - the chapel at Mortonhall was packed - that for me is a sad irony and perhaps we would do better to express how we feel about someone when they are alive instead of turning up in the mandatory black apparel on a cold, wet afternoon in a sombre setting.
As for me, when my times up, do what you like with my remains. It's not as if I'll know anything about it!

[ArabHibee]

I went to a funeral a long time ago of a close work colleague's father. Although I had met him on a number of occassions, I only really went to show support for my friend. It was a humanist service and I know this sounds really silly, but it was one of the best funeral services I have ever been to.
Probably because I'm not religious in the slightest, they talked about her father's life and what he had done and I found it very interesting, instead of all the God mumbo jumbo, hymns and prayers.
I found it very enlightening and when my time comes, I'll be making sure everyone knows its a humanist funeral that I would like.

[PiemanP]

iv been to a few funerals now,
but i think the tone in which its held in depends on how the person actually died...(IMO)

what im trying to say is that if its your gran, and say she was 83 odd and had a good life and passes away, yes very sad and a loss, but she had a good life and know one lives forever, so should be celebrated at the funeral and celebrate her life.

but on the other hand a 30 year old dies from cancer, id find it near impossible to be nothin but sad and emotional.

all depends on the circumstances, although at my funeral plenty green and proclaimers please :greengrin

[matty_f]

I've been to a few funerals, all cremations, and once the actual service has been over (where at each of them I've been in bits) when it came to the wake and seeing everyone, having a drink, and remembering who we've lost; it's actually turned in to a cracking day.

Certainly, when I go I want an upbeat service and for folk to go out and have a skinful afterwards.:agree:

[lyonhibs]

Lots of food, lots of drink and you dont have to dance with your mad old aunt what is not to like about that.

I assume you're on the wind-up. If so, you are 1 crass, ill mannered ********.

If you're not, your a unspeakably insensitive half baked ****wit.

Back on topic. My Dad's burial was much harder for me because as I am not in the slightest way religious each time I let the rope slip through my hands (I was one of the guys that lowers the ropes as you bury the coffin) it was literally my Dad inching away from me forever. No comfort in any "see you again in the afterlife" pish.

The memorial service, whilst undeniably ghastly (I dare anyone to say the sight of your mum and younger sister in tears isn't tough to bear) it was much more a celebration of his life with a fantastic eulogy etc which is much more up my street (in terms of the "mourn death vs celebrate life" argument) as my Dad was a absolute legend and that's how I'll remember him.

You still never get over it though.

My best friend died in a coach crash a few years back, a coach on which I was present. It was back in 2000, if anyone remembers the coach carrying the 41st Edinburgh BB Company crashing, so he was only 15 at the time and I'd known him since nursery. Absolute tragedy, and for me I couldn't get over the injustice of it all, so the funeral itself redeemed absolutely nothing, although I'm sure it was good for some people as a chance to say a final goodbye.

Celebrate life over mourn death everytime for me.

[gringojoe]

I assume you're on the wind-up. If so, you are 1 crass, ill mannered ********.

If you're not, your a unspeakably insensitive half baked ****wit.

Back on topic. My Dad's burial was much harder for me because as I am not in the slightest way religious each time I let the rope slip through my hands (I was one of the guys that lowers the ropes as you bury the coffin) it was literally my Dad inching away from me forever. No comfort in any "see you again in the afterlife" pish.

The memorial service, whilst undeniably ghastly (I dare anyone to say the sight of your mum and younger sister in tears isn't tough to bear) it was much more a celebration of his life with a fantastic eulogy etc which is much more up my street (in terms of the "mourn death vs celebrate life" argument) as my Dad was a absolute legend and that's how I'll remember him.

You still never get over it though.

My best friend died in a coach crash a few years back, a coach on which I was present. It was back in 2000, if anyone remembers the coach carrying the 41st Edinburgh BB Company crashing, so he was only 15 at the time and I'd known him since nursery. Absolute tragedy, and for me I couldn't get over the injustice of it all, so the funeral itself redeemed absolutely nothing, although I'm sure it was good for some people as a chance to say a final goodbye.

Celebrate life over mourn death everytime for me.

Thanks love you to.

[joe breezy]

Thanks love you to.

Deary me, that retort doesn't really deserve a response. The poor guy has lost his dad and best friend and you come back with such a silly quip. Try and think before you post.

Anyway, one of my good friends died when he was 21 - he worked in the docks. His funeral service mentioned his work but didn't mention his pals from the football etc. It didn't feel like the minister knew much about my pal at all and I felt alienated by the whole thing.

I hope that my funeral is a celebration of my life but there will always be sadness for the people that are left so it's not necessarily easy. Whatever

Interesting that there are more celebratory tones around funerals of younger people when arguably there is more reason for a very sad, mournful approach there. I think as time goes on we will see more funerals that are a celebration of the persons life. Whatever gives most comfort for those that are left is what I think is best but the service / music etc should be as unique as the person who has gone.

[Greentinted]

Anyway, one of my good friends died when he was 21 - he worked in the docks. His funeral service mentioned his work but didn't mention his pals from the football etc. It didn't feel like the minister knew much about my pal at all and I felt alienated by the whole thing.

I hope that my funeral is a celebration of my life but there will always be sadness for the people that are left so it's not necessarily easy. Whatever

Interesting that there are more celebratory tones around funerals of younger people when arguably there is more reason for a very sad, mournful approach there. I think as time goes on we will see more funerals that are a celebration of the persons life. Whatever gives most comfort for those that are left is what I think is best but the service / music etc should be as unique as the person who has gone.

Well said that man :applause:

[NaeTechnoHibby]

Having had the recent sad experience of my mum's death, in July, the organising of a funeral is pretty traumatic.

To get the right balance of celebration of life and yet mourn a much loved person is hard, beyond belief.

There was much debate about songs/hymns/cars/flowers and the service itself.

The minister appeared on the afternoon before the funeral, and thankfully I had written down somethings, the night she died, and my sis typed them up, and we passed them to him, he used them verbatim.


My mother was not a religious person, however, we still had what can be described as a 'traditional' service, as that is what she would have expected :agree:

[Steve-O]

Don't really like the idea of someone having to fork out a small fortune to bury / cremate me to be honest. I don't really know how I want it to go really?? I'll never actually know so what's the point!

[gringojoe]

[QUOTE=joe breezy;1765046]Deary me, that retort doesn't really deserve a response. The poor guy has lost his dad and best friend and you come back with such a silly quip. Try and think before you post.

Both my parents are dead, not lost but DEAD, I was called

'1 crass, ill mannered ********.

If you're not, your a unspeakably insensitive half baked ****wit.'

everybody needs to grieve but you also need to get over it so eat, drink and be merry for tomorrow you may die.

[RIP]

When my dad Hughie Mackay died in 1997 me and my brother decided not to have a funeral

We put an extra big piece in the News about his life in London in the twenties and thirties, the war, The Flying Scotsman, the bar trade (Rutherfords), The Rubber Mill (Fountainbridge and Newbridge), Easter Road (Hibs) and Powderhall (Dogs and Speedway) - big cheerie Hughie

We scattered his ashes over the then defunct dog track where he had spent three evenings a week. He usually managed a winner or two and then lost it all on the gee gees.

An Evening News reporter contacted us wanting to do a big piece on him - we told them tae bolt!

One or two relatives were a bit narked that we hadn't had a service but oor attitude wis - "ye should have visited him when he wis alive - no waited till he wis deid!!"

[jakki]

At my age, I've been to more than a few funeral services and it is good to hear the minister talking about the deceased having known them and also listening to the family doing their speeches about the antedotes about them however it becomes less comforting when the speeches do not co-incide with the person you knew.

I was at an humanist funeral when it was stated that the deceased came back from the US to get his young family away from the terrible drug scene over there.

He was buried under the Stars and Stripes flag as the US anthem was played whilst his coffin was lowered.

Unfortunately, I knew that he had been deported in handcuffs and deposited cashless at Turnhouse Airport from the USA for drug dealing.

Too often lives are elaborated, but if it is to make the mourners feel better, who are we to deprive them off that?

My funeral:- I want everyone to reflect on my happy life,wear the Hibs tops and sing loudly with the Proclaimers and hopefully celebrate that I DID see Hibs winning the SC.

[hibeeleicester]

On a similar subject, I once worked in an office where there was an Evening News Death Notice Sweepstake.

"And todays winner is Robert with 5 Peacefullys. Steve was runner up with 4 After A Long Illnesses. Gav 3rd with 2 Suddenlys"

You get the picture.










Disclaimer: I am ABSOLUTELY NOT suggesting that it is acceptable to mock the recently bereaved.:bitchy::greengrin

horrible :bitchy:

[davym7062]

iv been to a few funerals now,
but i think the tone in which its held in depends on how the person actually died...(IMO)

what im trying to say is that if its your gran, and say she was 83 odd and had a good life and passes away, yes very sad and a loss, but she had a good life and know one lives forever, so should be celebrated at the funeral and celebrate her life.

but on the other hand a 30 year old dies from cancer, id find it near impossible to be nothin but sad and emotional.
all depends on the circumstances, although at my funeral plenty green and proclaimers please :greengrin

i understand what you mean but i lost my 13 year old son in june to cancer and while his funeral was the worst day of my life i have nothing but fond memories of the service. the church was packed to the rafters and everybody i spoke to said how uplifting it was

[Greentinted]

When my dad Hughie Mackay died in 1997 me and my brother decided not to have a funeral

We put an extra big piece in the News about his life in London in the twenties and thirties, the war, The Flying Scotsman, the bar trade (Rutherfords), The Rubber Mill (Fountainbridge and Newbridge), Easter Road (Hibs) and Powderhall (Dogs and Speedway) - big cheerie Hughie

We scattered his ashes over the then defunct dog track where he had spent three evenings a week. He usually managed a winner or two and then lost it all on the gee gees.

An Evening News reporter contacted us wanting to do a big piece on him - we told them tae bolt!

One or two relatives were a bit narked that we hadn't had a service but oor attitude wis - "ye should have visited him when he wis alive - no waited till he wis deid!!"

I hope this is not amiss but what a touching story and a fine way to celebrate a life.
The part which I have emboldened is particularly poignant. Quite right; break through the sanctimonious hypocrisy. Good for you.

[s.a.m]

i understand what you mean but i lost my 13 year old son in june to cancer and while his funeral was the worst day of my life i have nothing but fond memories of the service. the church was packed to the rafters and everybody i spoke to said how uplifting it was


I'm terribly sad to read about your son. I can't really think of anything appropriate to say, other than that you and your family have my deepest sympathy.

[Dashing Bob S]

I think it's clear you need to do both. The most satisfying funerals i've been at have been where the close friends and relatives of the deceased have taken some kind of ownership of the event and tried to provide something that the departed person would have wanted.

Most of us on our death beds wouldn't want to see the people we were close to distraught, but we would recognise that loved ones must have the space to grieve and mourn their loss. Not to do so would seem to to trivialise the life of the deceased. However, we should be able to acknowledge their essential life force and the joy they brought to us.

The best funerals I've been at are where saddness at the departure and joyous rememberance of their life can both be adequately expressed. The most problematic area is the transitioning between the two and that's where most conflicts occur.