Pete Townshend v Gary Glitter

[Phil D. Rolls]

I watched Tommy the other night, and I couldn't help thinking that some of the imagery was lets say close to the knuckle. Add in songs about kiddie fiddlers and the general theme of abuse and you have to say that someone has issues.

I got to thinking, Pete Townshend was found to have downloaded child porn, and pretty much got away with a "don't do it again". News of the World etc, said v. little, and Pete continues to play with his band.

Gary Glitter on the other hand, went to jail for the same offence. So why do we villify one person who does it and let others off? Is it because Townshend has masked his weakness as art? Is there a class issue - Townshend is pretty well in with the establishement in a lot of ways.

Anybody got any thoughts?

[fergal7]

A bit of a dilemma for me that one.

As Pete Townshend was my hero growing up (long time ago!) I was shocked to hear he was arrested for downloading child porn.

As the police said there was no charge to answer to I was happy to forget it happened. Research he called it. :hmmm:

Gary Glitter however is a different kettle of fish altogether as he has molested kids and continues to deny he's a criminal to this day.

However I know what your saying and If it was proved otherwise my Who record collection would have been in the bin a long time ago.

[Hibee-Bongo]

IIRC it was John Entwhistle who came up with the kiddle fiddling theme on Tommy, based on his own childhood I think.

[New Corrie]

I watched Tommy the other night, and I couldn't help thinking that some of the imagery was lets say close to the knuckle. Add in songs about kiddie fiddlers and the general theme of abuse and you have to say that someone has issues.

I got to thinking, Pete Townshend was found to have downloaded child porn, and pretty much got away with a "don't do it again". News of the World etc, said v. little, and Pete continues to play with his band.

Gary Glitter on the other hand, went to jail for the same offence. So why do we villify one person who does it and let others off? Is it because Townshend has masked his weakness as art? Is there a class issue - Townshend is pretty well in with the establishement in a lot of ways.

Anybody got any thoughts?

I watched the documentry on Townsend and he had the best of the best legal team on his side (I don't know if that differs from Glitter) add to that the fact that Townsend was doing it solely for reasearch purposes......AAAAAAYYYYEEEEE RRRRIIIIGGGGHHHHTTT!

[Dashing Bob S]

Have to say that I find the Townsend thing very disturbing. Glitter is an obvious beast; people came forward to testify to his abuse, following the downloading, in a way they didn't seem to do with Townsend. I gave Townsend the benefit of the doubt at the time, but he did download child pornography, and you have to ask, what sort of person does that?

I read Irvine Welsh saying in the Independent that he didn't research the issue of child abuse on the internet as he didn't want to be unintentionally exposed to this sort of material for his new novel. He went to social workers, police and clinical psychologists practising in the field. Surely Townsend would have known to do the same if he was researching a 'book', which, I note, has yet to appear?

I'm afraid that I now look at him in a completely different way, and that is sad, as I am a bit of a Who fan.

[alex plode]

I watched Tommy the other night, and I couldn't help thinking that some of the imagery was lets say close to the knuckle. Add in songs about kiddie fiddlers and the general theme of abuse and you have to say that someone has issues.

I got to thinking, Pete Townshend was found to have downloaded child porn, and pretty much got away with a "don't do it again". News of the World etc, said v. little, and Pete continues to play with his band.

Gary Glitter on the other hand, went to jail for the same offence. So why do we villify one person who does it and let others off? Is it because Townshend has masked his weakness as art? Is there a class issue - Townshend is pretty well in with the establishement in a lot of ways.

Anybody got any thoughts?

Pete Townsend didn't download child porn.

The main difference between the two is Gary Glitter was found guilty of downloading thousands of child porn images and sleeping with under age girls.

Pete Townsend had at least a dozen PCs confiscated by the police, and NO dodgy downloads were found...that's why he wasn't charged.

He admitted subscribing to a website which had dodgy connections - for the purposes of research - and was placed on the sex-offenders registrar. Subsequent to his cautioning however - there's evidence that the whole police operation that snared him - and Rob. del Naja of Massive Attack (wrongly) - was completely flawed.

Still a huge fan and still ok in my book. :agree:

[Greentinted]

Pete Townsend didn't download child porn.

The main difference between the two is Gary Glitter was found guilty of downloading thousands of child porn images and sleeping with under age girls.

Pete Townsend had at least a dozen PCs confiscated by the police, and NO dodgy downloads were found...that's why he wasn't charged.

He admitted subscribing to a website which had dodgy connections - for the purposes of research - and was placed on the sex-offenders registrar. Subsequent to his cautioning however - there's evidence that the whole police operation that snared him - and Rob. del Naja of Massive Attack (wrongly) - was completely flawed.

Still a huge fan and still ok in my book. :agree:

While Operation Ore had its faults to suggest it was completely flawed is to be decidely misinformed and narrowminded. While I am no apologist for the police (or indeed The Who:cool2:) they did ensnare a great many despicable evil minded twisted excuses for human beings. One wonders if Townshend was merely a brickie or office boywould his case been more or less regarded with parity.
Y'see thats the thing with being a "fan" - delusion sets in (and lets face it, any Jambo is well versed in that particular mindset having swallowed so much guff in the name of fanhood). There are still many Michael Jackson fans who believe - remember that word - that he's just a biy misunderstood.
Elvis Presley was another nonce but hey, you can't say that either can you?
Gadd was (and remains) a spent force in terms of artistic muscularity, he had become a parody of himself and so was, quite rightly, expendable (that and the fact he got captured abroad). Had he been credible and less of a caricature, he would perhaps have walked away to destroy more lives.
Any peadophile should be systematically eradicated and anyone who offers mitigation of any sort for these vile creatures should, by association, be dealt with similarly!
Rant over, kill the beast!

[alex plode]

While Operation Ore had its faults to suggest it was completely flawed is to be decidely misinformed and narrowminded. While I am no apologist for the police (or indeed The Who:cool2:) they did ensnare a great many despicable evil minded twisted excuses for human beings. One wonders if Townshend was merely a brickie or office boywould his case been more or less regarded with parity.
Y'see thats the thing with being a "fan" - delusion sets in (and lets face it, any Jambo is well versed in that particular mindset having swallowed so much guff in the name of fanhood). There are still many Michael Jackson fans who believe - remember that word - that he's just a biy misunderstood.
Elvis Presley was another nonce but hey, you can't say that either can you?
Gadd was (and remains) a spent force in terms of artistic muscularity, he had become a parody of himself and so was, quite rightly, expendable (that and the fact he got captured abroad). Had he been credible and less of a caricature, he would perhaps have walked away to destroy more lives.
Any peadophile should be systematically eradicated and anyone who offers mitigation of any sort for these vile creatures should, by association, be dealt with similarly!
Rant over, kill the beast!

Ha ha... I like your ranting style however I never suggested Operation Ore was completely flawed, just flawed - and Townsend has been convicted of nothing (apart from drugs offences) so it's a bit News of the World to label him a paedo....but never let the facts get in th eway of a good story. Believe !

[HarveyDent]

While Operation Ore had its faults to suggest it was completely flawed is to be decidely misinformed and narrowminded. While I am no apologist for the police (or indeed The Who:cool2:) they did ensnare a great many despicable evil minded twisted excuses for human beings. One wonders if Townshend was merely a brickie or office boywould his case been more or less regarded with parity.
Y'see thats the thing with being a "fan" - delusion sets in (and lets face it, any Jambo is well versed in that particular mindset having swallowed so much guff in the name of fanhood). There are still many Michael Jackson fans who believe - remember that word - that he's just a biy misunderstood.
Elvis Presley was another nonce but hey, you can't say that either can you?
Gadd was (and remains) a spent force in terms of artistic muscularity, he had become a parody of himself and so was, quite rightly, expendable (that and the fact he got captured abroad). Had he been credible and less of a caricature, he would perhaps have walked away to destroy more lives.
Any peadophile should be systematically eradicated and anyone who offers mitigation of any sort for these vile creatures should, by association, be dealt with similarly!
Rant over, kill the beast!
Well said. If I remember correctly, the website which was set up by the police in America to snare these people, it could not be stumbled upon by accident, the users had to look for it with intent. Ok its called entrapment, but in that case I think we can all agree it was merited.

Glitter (Gadd) is a slimeball, but I still listen to his music from the 70's and dont have a problem with that, I can seperate the music from the person. I suggest fans of the Who that look differently at Townshend now do the same, they made some great stuff.

If some document came to light exposing Beethoven as a rapist, would his music be any less brilliant than it was before?

[Greentinted]

Ha ha... I like your ranting style however I never suggested Operation Ore was completely flawed, just flawed - and Townsend has been convicted of nothing (apart from drugs offences) so it's a bit News of the World to label him a paedo....but never let the facts get in th eway of a good story. Believe !

Not once did I explicitly say Townshend was a paedophile (or indeed "paedo" as you so eloquently abbreviate it). BUt for an apparently intelligent man (him that is) surely researching kiddy porn online was a dumbass thing to do - assuming of course he is worthy of belief!!!

[alex plode]

Not once did I explicitly say Townshend was a paedophile (or indeed "paedo" as you so eloquently abbreviate it). BUt for an apparently intelligent man (him that is) surely researching kiddy porn online was a dumbass thing to do - assuming of course he is worthy of belief!!!

Fair enough....Townsend would admit researching kiddie porn online was dumbass and if your "kill the beast" rant is directed at Gary Glitter,there's many who'd help you tie the noose.
You asked if Townsend had been a brickie, would his case be heard with parity.
Yes it would , because there was no evidence of wrongdoing, therefore no case to answer.
You also posed the scenario if GG had .."been credible, and less of a caricature, he would perhaps have walked away to destroy more lives".
No he wouldn't.
He displayed typical paedo behaviour in having thousands of dody images, downloaded onto his hard drive. Now if you take your computer to PC World and you've got even one image of the nature that the leader of the gang had - you're nicked ;- whether you're a brickie or a windmill-armed guitarist.
Townsend was thouroughly investigated and found to be innocent, however he's tarnished in many peoples eyes. Guilt by association.
There can be little worse, if you're actually (naively) innocent.