Nelson Mandela removed from Terrorism List

[Betty Boop]

Nelson Mandela, Nobel peace prize winner has been removed from America's terrorism watch list, at the ripe old age of 90. You couldn't make it up! :bitchy:

[GreenandGlaikit]

Nelson Mandela, Nobel peace prize winner has been removed from America's terrorism watch list, at the ripe old age of 90. You couldn't make it up! :bitchy:


Prime Minister Thatcher :ill: also called Nelson M. a "terrorist". :rolleyes:

[CropleyWasGod]

If you were on one side of that particular fence, the ANC were indeed terrorists. The Necklace of Death?

:stirrer:

[GreenandGlaikit]

If you were on one side of that particular fence, the ANC were indeed terrorists. The Necklace of Death?

:stirrer:

Indeed, a black, barbaric time. However, did NM authorise such acts? Doubt it.

[CropleyWasGod]

Indeed, a black, barbaric time. However, did NM authorise such acts? Doubt it.

TBH, I have no idea. I don't know enough about his role in the ANC. However, I do feel uncomfortable with the sanctification of a man who was a leading member of a nasty bunch of people.

Cue the "freedom fighter vs. terrorist" debate.

[china hibs]

Indeed, a black, barbaric time. However, did NM authorise such acts? Doubt it.

Well he was the leader of ANC'S military wing....so would imagine he had a fair say

[Betty Boop]

Nelson Mandela is one of the great figures of our time, it is inevitable that living under the disgusting apartheid regime, acts of violence were committed. It doesn't take away the fact that he is a great Statesman and peacemaker!:grr:

[china hibs]

Nelson Mandela is one of the great figures of our time, it is inevitable that living under the disgusting apartheid regime, acts of violence were committed. It doesn't take away the fact that he is a great Statesman and peacemaker!:grr:

Yeah maybe in his 90's , maybe not so when he was 40

[1two]

Nelson Mandela, Nobel peace prize winner has been removed from America's terrorism watch list, at the ripe old age of 90. You couldn't make it up! :bitchy:

Got a link to this?

I like reading and laughing at americans!

[Betty Boop]

Got a link to this?

I like reading and laughing at americans!http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/africa/07/01/mandela.watch/index.html

[Hibrandenburg]

Nelson Mandela is one of the great figures of our time, it is inevitable that living under the disgusting apartheid regime, acts of violence were committed. It doesn't take away the fact that he is a great Statesman and peacemaker!:grr:

That he is a great Statesman and peacemaker doesn't take away the fact that he was a terrorist and he and his organisation violated human rights.

[Betty Boop]

That he is a great Statesman and peacemaker doesn't take away the fact that he was a terrorist and he and his organisation violated human rights.Nah freedom fighter!

[Hibrandenburg]

Nah freedom fighter!

:agree:

But still responsible for the deaths of innocents.

[Pheona]

Nelson Mandela is one of the great figures of our time, it is inevitable that living under the disgusting apartheid regime, acts of violence were committed. It doesn't take away the fact that he is a great Statesman and peacemaker!:grr:

I refuse to get into this debate, but can I ask, have you actually lived in South Africa or had any deep knowledge about the place that you can make comments like that? or as with so many other things in this world are your opinions formed from the press?

and before I am branded a racist or anything else I am not, but I did spend 20 years of my life there and can quite probably give you a counter story for every dreadful story you have heard.

Like I said I spent 20 years in South Africa and I can't even pretend to know it all.

Like someone has already said, one mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter. NM began his "career" as a member of the ANC, a terrorist organisation and was involved in the planning at least, of terrorist acts. Did he spend too long in prison? - probably. Has he done a lot of good work since he was released - definately.

[steakbake]

A bit like Gerry Adams and to lesser extent, Martin McGuinness.

(no - not one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter).

But in the way that they brought things forward and they realised that it was them who had to make the first move on decommissioning, not to play the games of the Ulster Unionists.


And behind the scenes? Mo Mowlem one of the greatest Labour politicians in living memory.

God knows what she'd make of the Labour party today.

[CropleyWasGod]

Nah freedom fighter!

Only because he was on the winning side. History is written by the winners, remember.

[CropleyWasGod]

A bit like Gerry Adams and to lesser extent, Martin McGuinness.

(no - not one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter).

But in the way that they brought things forward and they realised that it was them who had to make the first move on decommissioning, not to play the games of the Ulster Unionists.

And behind the scenes? Mo Mowlem one of the greatest Labour politicians in living memory.

God knows what she'd make of the Labour party today.

.... just like the white Government did in South Africa. They saw the way the wind was blowing, and they unbanned the ANC. I submit, m'lud, that that makes them more responsible for peace in SA than that cowardly jailbird Nellie Mandala.

:devil:

[steakbake]

.... just like the white Government did in South Africa. They saw the way the wind was blowing, and they unbanned the ANC. I submit, m'lud, that that makes them more responsible for peace in SA than that cowardly jailbird Nellie Mandala.

:devil:

Arguably, it possibly does, yes.

Mandela ensured that peace prevailed afterwards.

Or at least relative peace if you discount the oft recited endemic gang culture, muggings, senseless murders, car jackings and rapes which go on.

Interestingly I read an article about the connection between modern day ANC figures and Mugabe. During the bad ole days, Zimbabwe made a for a great safezone for activists and many maintain a sense of gratitude to old Bob to this day.

[CropleyWasGod]

Interestingly I read an article about the connection between modern day ANC figures and Mugabe. During the bad ole days, Zimbabwe made a for a great safezone for activists and many maintain a sense of gratitude to old Bob to this day.

... which possibly explains why Mbeki seems reluctant to tell Bob to sod off. Indeed, did he (or a spokesman) not come out at the weekend and take the "it's all Britain's fault" line?

[GreenandGlaikit]

Only because he was on the winning side. History is written by the winners, remember.

Think Botha, previous Presidents, and millions o' Apartheid supporters still retained the ability and freedom tae write whatever "History" they liked.:rolleyes:

In the light o' Sharpville, Soweto and the legalised torture and murder o' Steve Biko (and hundreds other activists) pray tell what incisive 'peaceful' actions that personally ye would've adopted tae change the situation in which because yer skin is the 'wrong' colour yer immediately a third class citizen , wi nae vote, nae rights, and ye are liable tae be arbitarily evicted and deported tae a remote Bantu Homeland?

Sing "Kumbaya" roond the camp-fire? :rolleyes:

[CropleyWasGod]

Think Botha, previous Presidents, and millions o' Apartheid supporters still retained the ability and freedom tae write whatever "History" they liked.:rolleyes:

In the light o' Sharpville, Soweto and the legalised torture and murder o' Steve Biko (and hundreds other activists) pray tell what incisive 'peaceful' actions that personally ye would've adopted tae change the situation in which because yer skin is the 'wrong' colour yer immediately a third class citizen , wi nae vote, nae rights, and ye are liable tae be arbitarily evicted and deported tae a remote Bantu Homeland?

Sing "Kumbaya" roond the camp-fire? :rolleyes:

My singing would have been enough to topple the strongest of regimes :greengrin

Seriously, though, I would probably have been throwing the petrol bombs too, and setting fire to the necklaces of death. My point in these threads, though, is to play devil's advocate to those who would want Nelson sanctified.

[GreenandGlaikit]

My singing would have been enough to topple the strongest of regimes :greengrin

Seriously, though, I would probably have been throwing the petrol bombs too, and setting fire to the necklaces of death. My point in these threads, though, is to play devil's advocate to those who would want Nelson sanctified.


TBF, he deserves santification. He could've quite easily taken 'revenge' , caused Civil War, bloodshed, and economic chaos in SA. That he and the multi-racial ANC took a peaceful and concillatory path made him the admired Statesman that he still is - despite being retired.

One o' the very, very, few whose passing will be mourned, world-wide.

[Sumner]

Nelson Mandela is a very fine fella