Who wants Monty to stay? And why?

[Keepthefaith]

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St Johnstone and Livi have smaller budgets and possibly others, it was a while ago I looked it up. Yes the playoff spot isn't relegation and it isn't safety either. A Hibs fan should know that better than anyone. You claimed they finished 9 points clear of relegation which isn't strictly true is it? They finished 9 points clear of automatic relegation and avoided the playoff spot on the last day of the season.

I couldn't really care less whether or not you care where they got their points. The point still stands, they get a big advantage from their plastic pitch and could easily have been relegated without such an advantage. Yes they were 6 points ahead of Ross County, thanks to a win against them on the last day on said plastic, advantageous pitch. A loss would have had them in the playoffs as their goal difference was -27 compared to Ross County's -21 before the match.

careful with using facts instead of biased opinion, that'll never go down well on here! good points well made.

[Stubbsy90+2]

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Going into the split that year I think both Killie and Dundee Utd were on something like 31 points each with Ross County on 27 points .

Dundee Utd went down having the same points going into the split as Killie so I think it's fair to say going into the last 5 games there was 3 clubs endanger of automatic relegation and the other two of a play off spot that could also lead to relegation too .

Again though the Kilmarnock board deserve enormous credit for sticking with McInnes that year considering how bad it was . Not many clubs nowadays stick with a manager that loses 6 out of his first 8 games in fairness. We sacked one for losing his first 3 ! .

As to your earlier questions of which is it ? Our situation going into the split is very much different to the one Killie had . Killie had also lost 20 games that season which is just about our combined wins and draws .

Really can't see Ross county winning 4 or 5 and us losing 4 or 5 in truth .

So now that it’s been established that he kept them up by a significant amount of points, the argument has now changed to him having not kept them up by a significant amount of points quick enough. He didn’t just need to keep them up, he also now should have done it with how many games to spare exactly? Seeing as DU had 30 points at the split, safety from relegation would have had to have had to have had Kilmarnock in the top 6. Expecting that sort of season from a newly promoted side is just daft really.

And again, it was 9 points. We’re 9 points clear and you’re claiming we should be a million to 1 to end up in the playoff. It can’t be a million to one for us and battling relegation for someone else. I can’t see Ross County winning 4 or 5 either. Considering they’re better than the DU side that went down last season, that shows how far ahead Kilmarnock were of DU.

I would also point out again, whilst you continue to claim ‘how bad it was’, that McInnes confirmed in that article you posted that he met his targets. So it’s safe to say Kilmarnock weren’t looking at it and thinking how bad it was. That’s just you because you’re determined to try and draw comparisons between a guy who has hit, and is now exceeding, every target given to him with a manager who has taken us to bottom 6 and has missed out on our main target spectacularly.

For someone you’re at pains to claim how he’s not really all that good a manager, you seem to have expected a hell of a lot more from him than anybody else did.

[Springbank]

He needs to learn how to deploy his players if he's to stay.

Saturday, 1 up, with Emiliano struggling, and maolida effective out wide, it seemed so obvious to Sub on Alf for emiliano, as he's a proper niggler to play against in any conditions.

It strengthens us

But instead we get the Levitt show

Fxxxing Levitt

[Stubbsy90+2]

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St Johnstone and Livi have smaller budgets and possibly others, it was a while ago I looked it up. Yes the playoff spot isn't relegation and it isn't safety either. A Hibs fan should know that better than anyone. You claimed they finished 9 points clear of relegation which isn't strictly true is it? They finished 9 points clear of automatic relegation and avoided the playoff spot on the last day of the season.

I couldn't really care less whether or not you care where they got their points. The point still stands, they get a big advantage from their plastic pitch and could easily have been relegated without such an advantage. Yes they were 6 points ahead of Ross County, thanks to a win against them on the last day on said plastic, advantageous pitch. A loss would have had them in the playoffs as their goal difference was -27 compared to Ross County's -21 before the match.

So behind 2 teams with smaller budgets and ahead of 1.

They have a plastic pitch, you’re right. Would it be fair to say that gives them a huge disadvantage for the away games you’re so critical of?

A loss would have had them in the playoff. They didn’t lose though, much like they did have their pitch, so criticising him for results that didn’t even happen or how things may have gone had they not had a certain type of pitch shows how much you’re reaching. And the playoff isn’t relegation, so 9 points clear of relegation is absolutely strictly true.

[007]

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Going into the split that year I think both Killie and Dundee Utd were on something like 31 points each with Ross County on 27 points .

Dundee Utd went down having the same points going into the split as Killie so I think it's fair to say going into the last 5 games there was 3 clubs endanger of automatic relegation and the other two of a play off spot that could also lead to relegation too .

Again though the Kilmarnock board deserve enormous credit for sticking with McInnes that year considering how bad it was . Not many clubs nowadays stick with a manager that loses 6 out of his first 8 games in fairness. We sacked one for losing his first 3 ! .

As to your earlier questions of which is it ? Our situation going into the split is very much different to the one Killie had . Killie had also lost 20 games that season which is just about our combined wins and draws .

Really can't see Ross county winning 4 or 5 and us losing 4 or 5 in truth .

It had looked even worse a game before the split but they managed to get a win on grass, having picked up only 2 points away from home in the previous 16 attempts.

[007]

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So behind 2 teams with smaller budgets and ahead of 1.

They have a plastic pitch, you’re right. Would it be fair to say that gives them a huge disadvantage for the away games you’re so critical of?

A loss would have had them in the playoff. They didn’t lose though, so criticising him for results that didn’t even happen shows how much you’re reaching. And the playoff isn’t relegation. In fact the vast majority of the time, it doesn’t result in relegation.

At least 2 teams with a smaller budget. No it wouldn't be fair to say that playing at home on a plastic pitch gives them a huge disadvantage away. They played 21 games on plastic and 17 on grass.

I know the playoff spot isn't relegation, I didn't say it was. You did however claim he kept them up by 9 points which isn't true. You are trying to deny the playoff spot (which he avoided on the last day) isn't safety which shows how much you are reaching.

[Stubbsy90+2]

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At least 2 teams with a smaller budget. No it wouldn't be fair to say that playing at home on a plastic pitch gives them a huge disadvantage away. They played 21 games on plastic and 17 on grass.

I know the playoff spot isn't relegation, I didn't say it was. You did however claim he kept them up by 9 points which isn't true. You are trying to deny the playoff spot (which he avoided on the last day) isn't safety which shows how much you are reaching.

And all the other teams play at least 34 on grass, double what Kilmarnock do. So they’re at a disadvantage.

But yes, you’re probably right. If they didn’t win games they won, like the game against Ross County, and they didn’t play on the pitch they play on, then they MAY have got relegated. They may have also won the league. Who knows. Kind of irrelevant really though.

[flash]

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And all the other teams play at least 34 on grass, double what Kilmarnock do. So they’re at a disadvantage.

But yes, you’re probably right. If they didn’t win games they won, like the game against Ross County, and they didn’t play on the pitch they play on, then they MAY have got relegated. They may have also won the league. Who knows. Kind of irrelevant really though.

Why are you so bothered? This is utterly bizarre.

[Donegal Hibby]

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It had looked even worse a game before the split but they managed to get a win on grass, having picked up only 2 points away from home in the previous 16 attempts.

That does look worse . The goal difference they had is really bad in all . Seem to remember they took a few hidings that year too .

[Donegal Hibby]

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So now that it’s been established that he kept them up by a significant amount of points, the argument has now changed to him having not kept them up by a significant amount of points quick enough. He didn’t just need to keep them up, he also now should have done it with how many games to spare exactly? Seeing as DU had 30 points at the split, safety from relegation would have had to have had to have had Kilmarnock in the top 6. Expecting that sort of season from a newly promoted side is just daft really.

And again, it was 9 points. We’re 9 points clear and you’re claiming we should be a million to 1 to end up in the playoff. It can’t be a million to one for us and battling relegation for someone else. I can’t see Ross County winning 4 or 5 either. Considering they’re better than the DU side that went down last season, that shows how far ahead Kilmarnock were of DU.

I would also point out again, whilst you continue to claim ‘how bad it was’, that McInnes confirmed in that article you posted that he met his targets. So it’s safe to say Kilmarnock weren’t looking at it and thinking how bad it was. That’s just you because you’re determined to try and draw comparisons between a guy who has hit, and is now exceeding, every target given to him with a manager who has taken us to bottom 6 and has missed out on our main target spectacularly.

For someone you’re at pains to claim how he’s not really all that good a manager, you seem to have expected a hell of a lot more from him than anybody else did.

I hope it's not an argument but more a discussion of different views.

What we have established about significant amount of points they had is they were in a relegation battle and it took up until the final game for them to escape the play-offs. You have described it as being fairly stable and that it wasn't really a difficult season which I don't think it was in any shape nor form for Killie.

Again your comparing Killies 9 point gap over our current situation which isn't accurate imo , going into the game before the split Killie were 2nd bottom only a point of bottom with the worst goal difference too .In our situation going into the game before the split we were 21 points clear of bottom and 11 clear of the playoff position with us in 7th position. Surely you can see the difference in the two scenarios? .

He did say in the article that he met his targets though he also said after promotion ...... WE DON'T WANT TO GET TOO FAR AHEAD OF OURSELVES BUT WHAT WE DO WANT TO DO IS MAKE SURE WE ARE NOT IN A POSITION NEXT SEASON WHERE WE ARE FIGHTING RELEGATION AGAIN. Which is exactly what happened to them that year ! .

After the club stuck by him and give him more time in another Summer window he improved Kilmarnock , he says it in the article too!. I don't think Derek McInnes is bad manager , his record is good tbh though my own opinion which many will disagree with is his teams don't play particularly good football.

Though for me it's a good example of a club sticking with their manager in this case with losing 6 out of your first 8 games , losing 20 games out of 38 . Only scoring 37 , conceding 62. A few bad beatings from Dundee Utd, Ross county Livvy etc .

Fair dues to Killie in fairness for sticking with him though , now their reaping the rewards from it . Hopefully we can next year too under Monty if he's given more time like McInnes too 🤞👍