Hsl agm

[RMQ1967]

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The club have put forward their position in the notice to shareholders and they have their own AGM where further detail will be given and there will be an opportunity to ask questions. It is HSLs own governance that has led to a decision on their vote before hearing that detail and being able to discuss and challenge the board direct.

How could HSL attend the HFC AGM and vote on the resolutions on behalf of the HSL membership without first knowing how the membership wanted to vote?

[BoomtownHibees]

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In a meeting that was just short of two hours everything from the technical details the resolutions were presented, along with notes added stating that the investment would not go ahead were discussed. Clarity around the impact of the resolutions, the future 85% shareholding and how that would change the operation of the club as well as details around the board and drag along rights in the articles. If there was any element missing from the meeting it was a voice from the club who are proposing the changes and it is clear that they had no interest in engaging with an organisation incorporating 4000 fans.


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Does the 4000 fans include anyone who has ever made a payment to HSL?

[hibbydad]

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I distinctly remember the treasurer speaking to the note around the investment not proceeding.


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It was the treasurer who suggested that the club would come back at it from a different angle if they failed to get the 75%. My own fear is that BK will just walk away in such a scenario and I would not blame them

[Lago]

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It was the treasurer who suggested that the club would come back at it from a different angle if they failed to get the 75%. My own fear is that BK will just walk away in such a scenario and I would not blame them

Of course he would walk away and I wouldn't bet against his first port of call being Aberdeen, then watch the howls of despair come from the Hibs support.

[Radium]

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Does the 4000 fans include anyone who has ever made a payment to HSL?

It is the number from the HSL website.


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[007 Mickey Weir]

HSL payment stopped today. Rather put money direct into the club. I feel HSL is becoming a load of nonsense.

[Greencore]

Just cancelled my DD with them.

[Radium]

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It was the treasurer who suggested that the club would come back at it from a different angle if they failed to get the 75%. My own fear is that BK will just walk away in such a scenario and I would not blame them

Sorry, I went back to acknowledge that.

If I am honest, I don’t think we are in the current position by accident.

Spending on big screens and hospitality, etc has generated a debt that allows the Gordon’s to secure total control of the club through a debt for equity swap. They have also found a partner that seems to have a better recruitment model than the one that they have implemented since coming in.

I believe that they simply see this as how business is done - their support of good causes in other areas shows a caring side, just not something that translated to the business engagement with HSL.

Having got to this stage they should have planned for all outcomes. The lack of engagement with HSL and the wider Shareholding group suggests that they have the votes but nobody is saying anything.

I do think that there are legitimate concerns across lots of aspects of how the club is being run but by Wednesday morning we are probably going to have moved to one show in town and hopefully they step up on the football front


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[Brightside]

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Sorry, I went back to acknowledge that.

If I am honest, I don’t think we are in the current position by accident.

Spending on big screens and hospitality, etc has generated a debt that allows the Gordon’s to secure total control of the club through a debt for equity swap. They have also found a partner that seems to have a better recruitment model than the one that they have implemented since coming in.

I believe that they simply see this as how business is done - their support of good causes in other areas shows a caring side, just not something that translated to the business engagement with HSL.

Having got to this stage they should have planned for all outcomes. The lack of engagement with HSL and the wider Shareholding group suggests that they have the votes but nobody is saying anything.

I do think that there are legitimate concerns across lots of aspects of how the club is being run but by Wednesday morning we are probably going to have moved to one show in town and hopefully they step up on the football front


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Good post.

[matty_f]

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Sorry, I went back to acknowledge that.

If I am honest, I don’t think we are in the current position by accident.

Spending on big screens and hospitality, etc has generated a debt that allows the Gordon’s to secure total control of the club through a debt for equity swap. They have also found a partner that seems to have a better recruitment model than the one that they have implemented since coming in.

I believe that they simply see this as how business is done - their support of good causes in other areas shows a caring side, just not something that translated to the business engagement with HSL.

Having got to this stage they should have planned for all outcomes. The lack of engagement with HSL and the wider Shareholding group suggests that they have the votes but nobody is saying anything.

I do think that there are legitimate concerns across lots of aspects of how the club is being run but by Wednesday morning we are probably going to have moved to one show in town and hopefully they step up on the football front


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[IberianHibernian]

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Of course he would walk away and I wouldn't bet against his first port of call being Aberdeen, then watch the howls of despair come from the Hibs support.

Possible howls of despair from some of our supporters would depend on lots of factors - press campaign stirring things up , a few good / bad results on field , fans expressing doubts about direction club has taken in recent years etc etc but I`m pretty confident that there are enough of us who would back the club ( Hibernian FC as we`re about to celebrate our 150th anniversary ) sufficiently to make us as competitive as we`ve ever been and probably much more if handled properly .

[Forza Fred]

Got no doubt HSL was formed by people with the noblest of intentions, but their aims were, imho, always going to be a vision rather than be a reality.

These days, even to be successful in the SPFL requires a degree of investment that most supporters, can only picture when buying a lottery ticket.

If Foley gets knocked back, then I reckon he'd be likely to go tap on Hearts door who, despite what they have said previously, would, I think, be delighted to take his money.

Coupled with their current 'donations'' they would then leave us lightyears behind in their wake and we would be destined to be a struggling mid table team or even less.

Don't think anyone would want that.

The way I see it, Foley's investment allows us to play 'çatch up' with our rivals.

Without it,.........

Hope those that are considering voting 'No' at the club AGM reflect on that.

[Bostonhibby]

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There's a degree of irony that a few of the people who were against HSL are also against these new proposals.

Had HSL been more successful then this vote could well have been a blocking vote. Thems the breaks I suppose.

It basically all comes down to Leslie Robb now. You will have Bydland in favour, HSL against and his percentage will now almost certainly be crucial. My gut is he will be on board, that 'routine enquiry' into discrepancies on the confirmation statements didn't happen for nothing.

Fwiw I voted for HSL to accept the proposals. There is risk; even though I trust the Gordon family it still leaves us in a risky position over the longer term without any collective fan blocking vote. There is risk to not pushing ahead though. We might be the first to do something like this but we won't be the last, plenty others will have to take comparable risks in the not too distant future.

Same views here.

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[Just_Jimmy]

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I really don't think HSL should be putting money in for nothing. It was different when STF owned Hibs, he never bought us because he wanted a football club, he did it to keep the club in existence and he was clear from the start that the club was to be self-sustaining, and we had years and years of strict budgeting and living within our means. It was a tough slog and the club needed all the help it could get. At that point, I had no problem with the idea of fans contributing towards transfers and getting money into the club.

Ron Gordon bought the club because he wanted a football club. The Gordons are an extremely wealthy family, certainly relative to the vast majority of the supporters. Ron came in with ambitions for the club but those were his ambitions. The Black Knights are now joining in, backed by billionaires.

They do not need to be taking more money out of the pockets of supporters. You need to comprehend how much money a billion pounds (or dollars) is. You could probably pool the collective wealth of the whole Hibs support and not scratch the surface of it.

I know nobody has a gun to their head to say they need to donate to HSL but we shouldn't look at the club as a charity case, and if we as a support are getting hundreds of thousands of pounds together, then that should be a transaction where we get something in return - be that shares or some other agreeable arrangement. There's no way we should be funding a vanity project for multi-millionaires and billionaires, IMHO.

More so, there may come a day, when HSL and the wider Hibs support needs ready access to a large sum of money for Hibernians sake.

I'm not suggesting that's soon or its even this ownership. It might not even ever happen - but I just think we should be positioning ourselves as a support to react to whatever we can if we need to.

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[Just_Jimmy]

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It also ignores the fact that its a loss making business.

And draws a parallel between Man Utd and Salford which are incorrect.

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[chippy]

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I really don't think HSL should be putting money in for nothing. It was different when STF owned Hibs, he never bought us because he wanted a football club, he did it to keep the club in existence and he was clear from the start that the club was to be self-sustaining, and we had years and years of strict budgeting and living within our means. It was a tough slog and the club needed all the help it could get. At that point, I had no problem with the idea of fans contributing towards transfers and getting money into the club.

Ron Gordon bought the club because he wanted a football club. The Gordons are an extremely wealthy family, certainly relative to the vast majority of the supporters. Ron came in with ambitions for the club but those were his ambitions. The Black Knights are now joining in, backed by billionaires.

They do not need to be taking more money out of the pockets of supporters. You need to comprehend how much money a billion pounds (or dollars) is. You could probably pool the collective wealth of the whole Hibs support and not scratch the surface of it.

I know nobody has a gun to their head to say they need to donate to HSL but we shouldn't look at the club as a charity case, and if we as a support are getting hundreds of thousands of pounds together, then that should be a transaction where we get something in return - be that shares or some other agreeable arrangement. There's no way we should be funding a vanity project for multi-millionaires and billionaires, IMHO.

Totally agree Matty, great post

[Since90+2]

Has there even been any indication of what the Gordon family's wealth is? Normally you hear suggestions in the press but I can never remember it ever being mentioned. Are we thinking it runs to the hundreds of millions or more likely tens of millions?

[Pretty Boy]

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Has there even been any indication of what the Gordon family's wealth is? Normally you hear suggestions in the press but I can never remember it ever being mentioned. Are we thinking it runs to the hundreds of millions or more likely tens of millions?

It was never really reported and Ron Gordon himself refused to answer when asked. Forbes reported the sale of the ZGS company was for $75M but I'm not sure that tells us much as they have other business interests.

High tens of millions seems likely but that's just idle speculation really.

[Leithenhibby]

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Got no doubt HSL was formed by people with the noblest of intentions, but their aims were, imho, always going to be a vision rather than be a reality.

These days, even to be successful in the SPFL requires a degree of investment that most supporters, can only picture when buying a lottery ticket.

If Foley gets knocked back, then I reckon he'd be likely to go tap on Hearts door who, despite what they have said previously, would, I think, be delighted to take his money.

Coupled with their current 'donations'' they would then leave us lightyears behind in their wake and we would be destined to be a struggling mid table team or even less.

Don't think anyone would want that.

The way I see it, Foley's investment allows us to play 'çatch up' with our rivals.

Without it,.........

Hope those that are considering voting 'No' at the club AGM reflect on that.

Just to clarify and to be clear, it was Hibernian FC that formed HSL...

[MWHIBBIES]

Foley's investment sounds great. It would've been nicer in 2015/16 when we had competent people running the football side. Now we have idiots and it will probably get pissed away.

I don't think it's realistic to think is going to overnight change everything. We spend plenty money right now to be crap.

January brought some decent players but zero signs of a proper plan being in place.

And with how things have been run since the Gordon's arrived, I understand the hesitation from HSL members.

[Pagan Hibernia]

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Foley's investment sounds great. It would've been nicer in 2015/16 when we had competent people running the football side. Now we have idiots and it will probably get pissed away.

I don't think it's realistic to think is going to overnight change everything. We spend plenty money right now to be crap.

January brought some decent players but zero signs of a proper plan being in place.

And with how things have been run since the Gordon's arrived, I understand the hesitation from HSL members.

My thoughts too. I'm cautiously optimistic but unless there's better decision making then getting handed x number of millions means absolutely nothing.

[Brightside]

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Foley's investment sounds great. It would've been nicer in 2015/16 when we had competent people running the football side. Now we have idiots and it will probably get pissed away.

I don't think it's realistic to think is going to overnight change everything. We spend plenty money right now to be crap.

January brought some decent players but zero signs of a proper plan being in place.

And with how things have been run since the Gordon's arrived, I understand the hesitation from HSL members.

Idiots? A bit extreme surely.

[CapitalGreen]

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Just to clarify and to be clear, it was Hibernian FC that formed HSL...

The same people who formed HSL were the same people who pulled the carpet from under its feet by selling all outstanding shares to RG. The club even had someone on the board of HSL at the time who knew the deal being negotiated would significantly dilute HSLs holding.

[JohnM1875]

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Foley's investment sounds great. It would've been nicer in 2015/16 when we had competent people running the football side. Now we have idiots and it will probably get pissed away.

I don't think it's realistic to think is going to overnight change everything. We spend plenty money right now to be crap.

January brought some decent players but zero signs of a proper plan being in place.

And with how things have been run since the Gordon's arrived, I understand the hesitation from HSL members.

Aye, total idiots. A third place finish, two European runs, numerous enhancements to the stadium and record income forecasted for next years annual report. Total morons.

We wouldn’t have had this investment without the improvements made by the Gordon family.

[Chipper1875]

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Aye, total idiots. A third place finish, two European runs, numerous enhancements to the stadium and record income forecasted for next years annual report. Total morons.

We wouldn’t have had this investment without the improvements made by the Gordon family.

You don’t know we wouldn’t have had this investment. Also , loss making business they are running. Terrible on the pitch . High turnover doesn’t mean a lot If loosing millions.

He’s spot on they made an total balls up on the park

[truehibernian]

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How could HSL attend the HFC AGM and vote on the resolutions on behalf of the HSL membership without first knowing how the membership wanted to vote?

Just a quick question - were HSL shown the investment plans for the football club (first team, womens team and academy financial investment) , the redevelopment and improvements of HTC, and the wider community programme ?

Or was this just a ‘blind vote’ as such for/against outside investment?

Has HSL been shown or had dialogue with the Club and BK as to the investment strategy?

[bingo70]

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Idiots? A bit extreme surely.

Course it is.

It’s also not likely Foley is going to give us millions and just allow ‘idiots’ to squander it away. There’ll be pressure on people to perform immediately and if they don’t, less idiotic people will be brought in to spend the money wiser.

[Stairway 2 7]

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Course it is.

It’s also not likely Foley is going to give us millions and just allow ‘idiots’ to squander it away. There’ll be pressure on people to perform immediately and if they don’t, less idiotic people will be brought in to spend the money wiser.

Baffling that people think Foley will put in 6 million and not seek improvement in the footballing operations. He's ran a team that won the Stanley Cup in NHL and has a football team competing well in the EPL. The technical expertise at our disposal should be lightyears ahead of what we can afford. I think it shows the Gordons understand we need a better sporting set up. He might be a billionaire but he's not going to throw money without seeing footballing improvement.

Although voting against keeps us with what we have just now so..

[TrinityHFC]

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How could HSL attend the HFC AGM and vote on the resolutions on behalf of the HSL membership without first knowing how the membership wanted to vote?

Well that’s a big issue with these collectives, unless you have a leadership mandated to take certain decisions. Voting in advance is fine but it does mean you do it without the opportunity to learn more and to ask questions.

As I’ve said this is just a protest vote against HSL being diluted.

If you take the resolutions as they lie then the investment has already been agreed, as has the issue of new shares. Resolution 5 was about not having to offer those shares to current shareholders first. When you don’t have that ability I think it is a bit naughty voting that way.

[Brightside]

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Course it is.

It’s also not likely Foley is going to give us millions and just allow ‘idiots’ to squander it away. There’ll be pressure on people to perform immediately and if they don’t, less idiotic people will be brought in to spend the money wiser.

Some of the extreme views on here are just plain weird. If people really have this level of disdain go find another hobby. It’s just really unhealthy.