Since 1875

[HibeeHibernian4]

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Is this the narrative now? That the current flag wavers invented atmosphere and everyone else is a boring fart?

Really guys, you are just draining support from people who previously backed you.

You must have read a different post to what I wrote, let's try again.

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St Johnstone away was a massive eye-opener for me. I bought me ticket for it very early so was in the back row. As results improved I got more and more excited, thinking we'd take a big crowd through. And we did, but almost nobody sung bar for the lads down at the front.

And, as far as I could tell, they were getting harassed by stewards and police for standing. No wonder nobody wants to sing when the authorities are trying to stop it wherever possible.

Obviously once we scored the winner most of the crowd were singing (or at least clapping) along to the songs, but it really surprised me how little enthusiasm there was for singing before that.

It's a cold Wednesday night in Perth, I'd hate to sit there in silence and freeze. Glad I was back row so I could at least stand up, and occasionally join in with a Hibs song. Felt like even that got me some looks from people sitting nearby, though.

Where on earth did you infer from this post that I said either of the following?

- The current flag wavers invented atmosphere

- Everyone else is a boring fart

And, as I'm not part of Since 1875 and have only been in the Famous Five Upper once, "you are just draining support from people who previously backed you" is also inaccurate, as you're using my post to justify your own why people 'no longer back' the singing section.

Absolute nonsense reply from yourself.

[Carheenlea]

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Agreed I’ve been shocked especially at away games this season, 95% of the hibs crowd happy just to sit down and watch the game without any interest in making an atmosphere. No problem with it as that’s their choice but do find it sad.

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St Johnstone away was a massive eye-opener for me. I bought me ticket for it very early so was in the back row. As results improved I got more and more excited, thinking we'd take a big crowd through. And we did, but almost nobody sung bar for the lads down at the front.

And, as far as I could tell, they were getting harassed by stewards and police for standing. No wonder nobody wants to sing when the authorities are trying to stop it wherever possible.

Obviously once we scored the winner most of the crowd were singing (or at least clapping) along to the songs, but it really surprised me how little enthusiasm there was for singing before that.

It's a cold Wednesday night in Perth, I'd hate to sit there in silence and freeze. Glad I was back row so I could at least stand up, and occasionally join in with a Hibs song. Felt like even that got me some looks from people sitting nearby, though.

I like and enjoy what the singing section/1875 guys bring to our games, particularly away, but I must admit to being a bit annoyed up at St Johnstone with one of the young lads who was shouting to the rest of the support to sing and calling them all boring *******s. What needs to be kept in mind is that most of the guys who are "boring" have been going home and away since long before the guys in their group were even born. When I was their age I was singing the songs and calling everyone else boring *******s as well - we`ve served our time so to speak, and our day out watching Hibs is going to be different and more sedate than the younger generation. Doesn't mean we dont enjoy it, and we join in when it feels right for us to do so.
The displays have been great, the songs and atmosphere at away games excellent - but should you participate or if you don`t, it doesn't make anyone a better fan than anyone else who is there every week. Hopefully common sense can prevail, and the group can continue and fans young and old can enjoy what it brings, and hopefully Leean can take on board the contribution the group has made to the club over the last few seasons. A couple of guys overstepping the mark shouldn't unravel all the good that has went before.

[DaveF]

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A Friday night away game when folk have begun their weekend bevvy is always going to be decent. Been to so many away games this season where the Hibs support has been shocking in terms of vocal support as opposed to a few years ago.

I've no idea how old you are but this isn't new news I'm afraid. Going back in my time (30+ years) of attending games, I stood and sat through plenty of flat games and a fair few where it was jumping.

You guys really should just focus on what it is you do well and spend less time on your ego's.

[hibbysam]

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I agree with what you say its went on for years with them two spiteful clubs and it will continue until someone has the balls to punish them severely starting closing sections of the grounds from the SFA to the police and the rest of Scottish football clubs and the courts but sadly there is no one that has courage to do it and it wont change

But I cant justify anyone that misbehaves in our support

If it was me I would close sections of the ground where it happens for the next home game and if it happens then repeat and hopefully the good fans will sort out the bad ones I would not dock points as it hurts the players

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What I would say is one person throwing a bottle/running on a pitch/throwing a drumstick/lighting a flare should be dealt with as one person. It should be easy to pinpoint and ban one person.

Do you shut hospitality if one person gets blootered and doesn’t behave?

For me it’s about perspective, ban individuals and if it’s very large groups of disorder then that’s where you deal with it more radically.

[HibeeHibernian4]

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Someone told me they decided to sit where they wanted (not in their allocated seats) and when they were asked to move they refused. Presumably that’s why the stewards were “harrassing“ them.

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They were getting “harassed” by stewards because folk who had tickets elsewhere gathered behind the goal and were standing three / four per seat and spilling out onto the stairway blocking people trying to use the walkway.

I find it amazing that there are fans whose first reaction is to justify the actions of stewards (often notoriously the ********s of Scottish football) rather than considering that their own supporters might have been in the right.

Standing in the back row of the same block behind the goals that the group were in, I could see clear as day that stewards were getting folk to show them their tickets, and backed off once they all did and realised that they were wrong. Also, the ones on the end of the row were stopping more people from trying to cram into the rows as sometimes happens.

Essentially though, we need to get a grip. The current ticket allocation of away ends is a lottery anyway in terms of logging onto the e-ticketing site and being given what you're got once you choose a block. Bring in unreserved seating, allow for fans to stand (particularly up the back of the stand) and just accept that it's what is going to happen.

Instead, you have jobsworth stewards trying to make people sit, all because the Taylor Report decided that all seater stadia was more important than rightly blaming South Yorkshire Police for the deaths of 96 football fans.

[DaveF]

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You must have read a different post to what I wrote, let's try again.



Where on earth did you infer from this post that I said either of the following?

- The current flag wavers invented atmosphere

- Everyone else is a boring fart

And, as I'm not part of Since 1875 and have only been in the Famous Five Upper once, "you are just draining support from people who previously backed you" is also inaccurate, as you're using my post to justify your own why people 'no longer back' the singing section.

Absolute nonsense reply from yourself.

Might be nonsense, might not be. I have been known to post loads of crap on here before

You postings are generally 100% in favour of since 1875 group so it isn't an unrealistic to assume you were part of it - or at the very least supportive of their attempts at generating the atmosphere while everyone sat on heir hands hence my opinion.

If you are not, fine - I'll shuffle on.

[May21/05/16]

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What I would say is one person throwing a bottle/running on a pitch/throwing a drumstick/lighting a flare should be dealt with as one person. It should be easy to pinpoint and ban one person.

Do you shut hospitality if one person gets blootered and doesn’t behave?

For me it’s about perspective, ban individuals and if it’s very large groups of disorder then that’s where you deal with it more radically.

Agree with that start with the individual that misbehaves and that's what happened with the hibs fans that were banned but if it keeps happening at the same section of the ground

Also signed the petition that 1875 guys organised to try and move somewhere else in the ground but after what's happened I don't think they will get there wish to which is a shame it was better when they were at section 43

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[HibeeHibernian4]

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Might be nonsense, might not be. I have been known to post loads of crap on here before

You postings are generally 100% in favour of since 1875 group so it isn't an unrealistic to assume you were part of it - or at the very least supportive of their attempts at generating the atmosphere while everyone sat on heir hands hence my opinion.

If you are not, fine - I'll shuffle on.

I wrote earlier in this thread my connection (or lack of) with Since 1875. I have been in their section for one game (Celtic at home in the Quarter Final) and helped set up one display (Rangers at home in May). I have also been on the marches to Tynecastle, if that counts.

I am supportive of their attempts to generate an atmosphere, my only regret is that more folk don't join in. The bouncing and the hands up clapping stuff isn't for me at all, but I still sing along generally when I'm in the same stand as them at an away game.

I worked down south in London for a couple of years and went along to a few games here and there, and whenever a club like Leeds, Sheffield Wednesday, Forest were visiting any of the London clubs, they would - to a person - be stood and singing. It's long since puzzled me that Scottish fans, who are generally quite good, don't do likewise. It must just be a culture thing, because only Celtic and Rangers (and occasionally Aberdeen) manage it. We've managed it once or twice too, mind. Killie away in the Scottish Cup quarter finals a few seasons back was brilliant.

You've brought up the stuff about folk sitting on their hands, I listed a bunch of other things that I see folk doing when I'm in the East watching a game at Easter Road. As I say, I don't judge/blame people for not singing if they don't want to, it's their choice. But it's something that I wouldn't be able to do myself, and it is definitely something which is to the detriment of the team.

[Waxy]

Fill that empty corner in with a good safe standing area. The extra revenue will let it pay for itself and the atmosphere will be far better.

[DaveF]

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I wrote earlier in this thread my connection (or lack of) with Since 1875. I have been in their section for one game (Celtic at home in the Quarter Final) and helped set up one display (Rangers at home in May). I have also been on the marches to Tynecastle, if that counts.

I am supportive of their attempts to generate an atmosphere, my only regret is that more folk don't join in. The bouncing and the hands up clapping stuff isn't for me at all, but I still sing along generally when I'm in the same stand as them at an away game.

I worked down south in London for a couple of years and went along to a few games here and there, and whenever a club like Leeds, Sheffield Wednesday, Forest were visiting any of the London clubs, they would - to a person - be stood and singing. It's long since puzzled me that Scottish fans, who are generally quite good, don't do likewise. It must just be a culture thing, because only Celtic and Rangers (and occasionally Aberdeen) manage it. We've managed it once or twice too, mind. Killie away in the Scottish Cup quarter finals a few seasons back was brilliant.

You've brought up the stuff about folk sitting on their hands, I listed a bunch of other things that I see folk doing when I'm in the East watching a game at Easter Road. As I say, I don't judge/blame people for not singing if they don't want to, it's their choice. But it's something that I wouldn't be able to do myself, and it is definitely something which is to the detriment of the team.

Sadly I can't \ won't disagree with any of that. Top post

[HibeeHibernian4]

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I get that they’ve been great for creating atmosphere over the last few years but let’s be honest, they didn’t invent going to the football with your pals and singing.

I must've missed the banner where they proclaimed this to be the case.

They haven't invented it, but they're the only ones nowadays who are carrying on said tradition.

[HibeeHibernian4]

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Sadly I can't \ won't disagree with any of that. Top post

Thanks.

[DetroitHibs]

Do the 1875 group create the banners like the one below. If so, they should be commended and praised by the club. The club should work with the group, rather than against it. Seems these guys put a lot of money and effort in to enhancing the atmosphere.

7BDC51D5-641B-4D06-865A-4EF10AD7B3B8.jpg

[Barney McGrew]

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I must've missed the banner where they proclaimed this to be the case.

They haven't invented it, but they're the only ones nowadays who are carrying on said tradition.

And?

That doesn’t mean they’re any better than any other person that goes to watch Hibs, doesn’t mean they should get any special treatment and certainly doesn’t absolve them from having to play by the same ground rules as everyone else inside the stadium.

[HibeeHibernian4]

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And?

That doesn’t mean they’re any better than any other person that goes to watch Hibs, doesn’t mean they should get any special treatment and certainly doesn’t absolve them from having to play by the same ground rules as everyone else inside the stadium.

If you play by the ground rules, which is to say that nobody in the stadium is allowed to persistently stand, then away atmospheres are done for good. Luckily, most stewards are sensible enough to ignore this rule, and we are all better off for it.

[Barney McGrew]

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If you play by the ground rules, which is to say that nobody in the stadium is allowed to persistently stand, then away atmospheres are done for good. Luckily, most stewards are sensible enough to ignore this rule, and we are all better off for it.

In your opinion.

What about older people who can’t stand for 90 minutes or kids who are to small to see if everyone stands - should they just not bother going?

[snedzuk]

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Maybe it's the duality of meaning in the word 'ban'. But I'm not the wordsmith who coined it.

By that token the Aberdeen forum should be called baadermeinhof.net

[wookie70]

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Hopefully we still have 100 smoke bombs on the way to Tynie in a few weeks, never been an issue til now and the police have never been bothered by it either until now.

You can’t pick and choose when to hand punishments out for the same issue.

Hopefully, you leave them at home and if you take them I hope you are caught before getting in and appropriate action taken in the form of a long ban.My daughter got hit with one from the Hearts end and there is no excuse taking them to football. Someone will get hurt at one point and my daughter was very lucky. The concrete it landed on was scorched and it missed her face by about 6 inches leaving its mark on her scarf just below her chin. Dempster should do everything she can to get rid of the bad element in our support, it is there and needs dealt with. If you are carrying a pyro on the way to the football you must know you are in danger of getting banned if caught so suck it up if you are. You would only have yourself to blame

[HibeeHibernian4]

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In your opinion.

What about older people who can’t stand for 90 minutes or kids who are to small to see if everyone stands - should they just not bother going?

As I've already said in this thread, unreserved seating going forward. People who want to sit do so at the front and middle of the stand, the back for people who want to stand and sing. Seems like a fair compromise for everyone, and keeps the much feared younger supporters away from the players too!

[Saturday Boy]

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By that token the Aberdeen forum should be called baadermeinhof.net

Meh....,,,

[hibbysam]

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Hopefully, you leave them at home and if you take them I hope you are caught before getting in and appropriate action taken in the form of a long ban.My daughter got hit with one from the Hearts end and there is no excuse taking them to football. Someone will get hurt at one point and my daughter was very lucky. The concrete it landed on was scorched and it missed her face by about 6 inches leaving its mark on her scarf just below her chin. Dempster should do everything she can to get rid of the bad element in our support, it is there and needs dealt with. If you are carrying a pyro on the way to the football you must know you are in danger of getting banned if caught so suck it up if you are. You would only have yourself to blame

Again, there is a huge difference between taking them into grounds and throwing them and using them as part of an organised walk to the match, as has been done over and over again without any issue from police until now.

[HibeeHibernian4]

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Hopefully, you leave them at home and if you take them I hope you are caught before getting in and appropriate action taken in the form of a long ban.My daughter got hit with one from the Hearts end and there is no excuse taking them to football. Someone will get hurt at one point and my daughter was very lucky. The concrete it landed on was scorched and it missed her face by about 6 inches leaving its mark on her scarf just below her chin. Dempster should do everything she can to get rid of the bad element in our support, it is there and needs dealt with. If you are carrying a pyro on the way to the football you must know you are in danger of getting banned if caught so suck it up if you are. You would only have yourself to blame

Do you not see how, in a way, the current draconian measures on pyrotechnics in football is exactly what led to that smoke bomb/flare (sorry, you haven't said which so I'll leave it open) being thrown rather than kept in somebody's hand?

People throw them precisely because if they hold them, they are likely to be arrested and banned. Throwing them allows them to avoid detection. And pyro only becomes dangerous once it is thrown, because then it becomes a missile just like anything else.

In Scandinavia and America, where it is legalised and left to people who know what they're doing, they are held aloft and everyone is safer for it. Yes, in an ideal world, nobody would see the point in them and they'd all be left at home. But since it's going to happen and people will continue sneaking them in and throwing them (onto the pitch, into the stand etc), then you'd be better off legalising and making sure they were handled properly and safely instead.

Sorry, would just like to add that I do feel a lot for you and your daughter. Didn't mean the post to come across as dismissive of her experience in any way.

[Hibbyradge]

It really doesn't matter that they're legal in America.

It wouldn't matter if they were given away free with matchday programmes in Sweden, they're banned in Scotland.

If people continue to knowingly break the law, they're risking arrest and a stadium ban.

There's not much to complain about if and when that happens.

[wookie70]

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Do you not see how, in a way, the current draconian measures on pyrotechnics in football is exactly what led to that smoke bomb/flare (sorry, you haven't said which so I'll leave it open) being thrown rather than kept in somebody's hand?

People throw them precisely because if they hold them, they are likely to be arrested and banned. Throwing them allows them to avoid detection. And pyro only becomes dangerous once it is thrown, because then it becomes a missile just like anything else.

In Scandinavia and America, where it is legalised and left to people who know what they're doing, they are held aloft and everyone is safer for it. Yes, in an ideal world, nobody would see the point in them and they'd all be left at home. But since it's going to happen and people will continue sneaking them in and throwing them (onto the pitch, into the stand etc), then you'd be better off legalising and making sure they were handled properly and safely instead.

Sorry, would just like to add that I do feel a lot for you and your daughter. Didn't mean the post to come across as dismissive of her experience in any way.

I don't see being banned for having them in or around the ground as draconian and I don't really get your point. There are good reasons for them not being in grounds. I can't know who I will sit next to away from home and as I'm asthmatic the last thing I need is fumes and smoke right next to me. They are a fairly new thing and the sooner they go out of fashion the better. Just stop taking them sing and shout and create the atmosphere. we can all appreciate that.

[Alex Trager]

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A Friday night away game when folk have begun their weekend bevvy is always going to be decent. Been to so many away games this season where the Hibs support has been shocking in terms of vocal support as opposed to a few years ago.

The teams been poor which reflects into the stands imo

[tamig]

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I don't see being banned for having them in or around the ground as draconian and I don't really get your point. There are good reasons for them not being in grounds. I can't know who I will sit next to away from home and as I'm asthmatic the last thing I need is fumes and smoke right next to me. They are a fairly new thing and the sooner they go out of fashion the better. Just stop taking them sing and shout and create the atmosphere. we can all appreciate that.

Exactly. A bit naive suggesting that approved pyro handlers will make it all ok. Also opens the door for wee nyaffs sneaking them in. Unless the approved handlers need to show their approved pyro permits at the turnstiles. Maybe we should just go the whole hog and get the SFA to hold pyro courses at Largs.

[HibeeHibernian4]

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Exactly. A bit naive suggesting that approved pyro handlers will make it all ok. Also opens the door for wee nyaffs sneaking them in. Unless the approved handlers need to show their approved pyro permits at the turnstiles. Maybe we should just go the whole hog and get the SFA to hold pyro courses at Largs.

Newsflash, they already sneak them in.

[hibbyfraelibby]

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I agree with the first part however, when was the last time you saw a flare coming from the FFU???

1. There was pyro/white smoke in the FFU duri g game v The The Rangers. Was it just low cloud?
2. By all accounts the drumstick got launched during same game. Perhaps the drummer may care to comment on how it slipped from his/her hand due to sweaty palms?

So can I ask has Since 1875 rendered up the culprits or are they "protecting" them. I smell a heavy whiff of ****** coming from some prominent egotists diguised as righteous indignation.

If you dont self police we all get indiscriminately policed.

[silverhibee]

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There seems to be some sort of misunderstanding here, closing the thread was nowt to do with us as has been said. At least two Admin team members contributed to that thread. It’s may be too late now as the discussion has moved here but would the OP of the original thread be OK opening it again? Moulin?
The support needs to stick together on this surely.
I made a suggestion on the previous thread, happy to help that get done if you do go down that route. As long as banners / displays aren’t offensive then there is no way the club should be banning them. It’s our club to support as we see fit, not some temporary custodian to tell us what to do.

Did LD not ban two females for displaying a " Petrie Out " banner when she first took over.

[Forever_Green93]

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1. There was pyro/white smoke in the FFU duri g game v The The Rangers. Was it just low cloud?
2. By all accounts the drumstick got launched during same game. Perhaps the drummer may care to comment on how it slipped from his/her hand due to sweaty palms?

So can I ask has Since 1875 rendered up the culprits or are they "protecting" them. I smell a heavy whiff of ****** coming from some prominent egotists diguised as righteous indignation.

If you dont self police we all get indiscriminately policed.

1. There was someone who did let off a flare, no idea who set it off tho since it was further up the section. The person who set it off put it on the ground within a few seconds of setting it off and then someone else picked it up and placed it on the stairs next to the section and that was the end of that.

2. The drummer never threw the drumstick. When i seen the drumstick hit the grass, i looked towards the drummer and he still had 2 drumsticks (1 in each hand). Those of us near the drummer were looking around bemused as to where the drumstick came from.