Why wasn't it red?

[Hibbyradge]

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Still a clear goalscoring opportunity.

Only justifiable reason is that the shot wasn't on target.

True. I don't understand the decision at all.

[ian cruise]

I'm glad it wasn't. If we'd won today playing against ten me for 70 mins there would still be a nervousness about our support and more would question if Heckingbottom's Hibs were just flattering to deceive. A comfortable win against good opposition who had there full 11 out for 90 mins was what we needed to give our fan base the belief in the team that we needed. There seems to be a real cloud lifted off the majority of our support tonight.

[Keith_M]

The ball was heading for the net until the Motherwell player handled it. So, the only explanation possible is that the Ref decided it wasn't deliberate.

As an aside, it was a very well taken penalty.

[Monts]

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The ball was heading for the net until the Motherwell player handled it. So, the only explanation possible is that the Ref decided it wasn't deliberate.

As an aside, it was a very well taken penalty.

Shouldn't have given a penalty then

[CMurdoch]

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Said exactly the same. Clear as day. Add to Sean (rightly) getting booked for his first foul, SDG for his second, but Main committing 6+ and getting two ‘no more’ warnings, and their right back getting away with the same as Mackie got booked for on Flo first half.

I understand Clancy trying to give as few as possible today ina a pretty easy game to referee but that requires consistency. Main just goes about barging into folk.

Glad the ref left Main alone. Didn't want him being replaced.
He was completely ineffective and in the pockets of both Hibs central defenders until eventually subbed.

[hibbysam]

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Glad the ref left Main alone. Didn't want him being replaced.
He was completely ineffective and in the pockets of both Hibs central defenders until eventually subbed.

Totally agree but the inconsistencies are poor.

[Richibee]

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Shouldn't have given a penalty then

Can still be a penalty.
For example. Deliberate is a player punching the ball off the goal line - that’s a penalty and a red. Not deliberate is the ball hitting a players outstretched arm as he jumps to head it clear. - that’s just a penalty

[hibbysam]

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Can still be a penalty.
For example. Deliberate is a player punching the ball off the goal line - that’s a penalty and a red. Not deliberate is the ball hitting a players outstretched arm as he jumps to head it clear. - that’s just a penalty

The law literally states a handball must be deliberate to be given. Position of the hand makes no difference to whether a penalty will be awarded or not.

On that point though, you may unintentionally clip a players heels as he runs across you through on goal, but as you’ve fouled him you get sent off, likewise, you’ve stopped a goalscoring opportunity due to being penalised for handball so it should be a red card.

[Keith_M]

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The law literally states a handball must be deliberate to be given. Position of the hand makes no difference to whether a penalty will be awarded or not.

On that point though, you may unintentionally clip a players heels as he runs across you through on goal, but as you’ve fouled him you get sent off, likewise, you’ve stopped a goalscoring opportunity due to being penalised for handball so it should be a red card.

Re: The bit in bold. I think that rule's just been changed.

[hibbysam]

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Re: The bit in bold. I think that rule's just been changed.

For next season it has yeah.

[Keith_M]

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For next season it has yeah.

Ah, OK.




.

[Hibbyradge]

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Can still be a penalty.
For example. Deliberate is a player punching the ball off the goal line - that’s a penalty and a red. Not deliberate is the ball hitting a players outstretched arm as he jumps to head it clear. - that’s just a penalty

Sorry, that's not true.

If a handball is deemed accidental, it's not a foul.

[Booked4Being-Ugly]

From the highlights on YouTube, although they’re not too clear either, it looks like the Motherwell player raises his hand as a natural reaction to the ball about to smack him in the face, rather than to deliberately stop the shot.

[BlackSheep]

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It was indeed a cut back so yellow is correct.

Not sure which game you were watching but it was a shot and the Motherwell player actually dives like a goalie to stole the ball, while he doesn’t extend his arm, he definitely uses it to prevent a goal, no way the keeper was able to see it so unlikely to save it himself.

Should’ve been a red no doubt about it.

I fully expect Heckingbottom to receive his phone call from Clancy by Monday evening 😂

[Hibbyradge]

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From the highlights on YouTube, although they’re not too clear either, it looks like the Motherwell player raises his hand as a natural reaction to the ball about to smack him in the face, rather than to deliberately stop the shot.

So, by definition, he deliberately handled the ball.

That's a red card offence.

[PaulSmith]

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So, by definition, he deliberately handled the ball.

That's a red card offence.

Its a shot on goal blocked by a hand in an unnatural position, yellow card.

For me there’s too many what ifs to make it a red card.

[we are hibs]

I thought if it stopped a possible goal then it was irrelevant if it's deliberate or not?

[wookie70]

Looked at the highlights and the shot was definitely on target. By the letter of the law that should be a red as it was a deliberate act, has to be to be given as handball, that stopped a goal. Harry Maguire got a red yesterday for clipping the heels of the attacker as he ran through on goal 30/35 yards from the posts. There was no intent as it was caused by the attacker running across his path. It was harsh but because it was outside the box he gets red as no double jeopardy.

I like the fact they have tried to change the rules on sending offs at pens. They need to keep finessing it though. I don't want to see someone sent off for the handball yesterday. He was getting his body in the way of the shot and his arms are part of that movement. Yes it hit his arm but it isn't the same as someone sticking an arm out goalie style. There was still a fair chance that the goalie will save the ball so a pen gives us the same chance of scoring and the defender is booked.

[calumhibee1]

Straight red all day.

[Danderhall Hibs]

I thought football was supposed to be a simple game?

[Hibbyradge]

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Its a shot on goal blocked by a hand in an unnatural position, yellow card.

For me there’s too many what ifs to make it a red card.

There's no such rule.

I posted this earlier on this thread, but the laws of the game say the following;

SENDING-OFF OFFENCES

A player, substitute or substituted player who commits any of the following offences is sent off:
denying the opposing team a goal or an obvious goal-scoring opportunity by deliberately handling the ball (except a goalkeeper within their penalty area)

DENYING A GOAL OR AN OBVIOUS GOAL-SCORING OPPORTUNITY

Where a player denies the opposing team a goal or an obvious goal-scoring opportunity by a deliberate handball offence the player is sent off wherever the offence occurs.

Where a player commits an offence against an opponent within their own penalty area which denies an opponent an obvious goal-scoring opportunity and the referee awards a penalty kick, the offending player is cautioned if the offence was an attempt to play the ball; in all other circumstances (e.g. holding, pulling, pushing, no possibility to play the ball etc.) the offending player must be sent off.

[PaulSmith]

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There's no such rule.

I posted this earlier on this thread, but the laws of the game say the following;

SENDING-OFF OFFENCES

A player, substitute or substituted player who commits any of the following offences is sent off:
denying the opposing team a goal or an obvious goal-scoring opportunity by deliberately handling the ball (except a goalkeeper within their penalty area)

DENYING A GOAL OR AN OBVIOUS GOAL-SCORING OPPORTUNITY

Where a player denies the opposing team a goal or an obvious goal-scoring opportunity by a deliberate handball offence the player is sent off wherever the offence occurs.

Where a player commits an offence against an opponent within their own penalty area which denies an opponent an obvious goal-scoring opportunity and the referee awards a penalty kick, the offending player is cautioned if the offence was an attempt to play the ball; in all other circumstances (e.g. holding, pulling, pushing, no possibility to play the ball etc.) the offending player must be sent off.

As I said the player stopped a shot at goal, there are too many what if’s to say that it denied a goal and in my humble opinion you are looking at the wrong rule.

[hibbysam]

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As I said the player stopped a shot at goal, there are too many what if’s to say that it denied a goal and in my humble opinion you are looking at the wrong rule.

There wasn’t many if’s, he was 3/4 yards out, ball was heading into the corner away from the goalie and he’s stopped it. Simple and straightforward.

[PaulSmith]

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There wasn’t many if’s, he was 3/4 yards out, ball was heading into the corner away from the goalie and he’s stopped it. Simple and straightforward.

McNulty got the shot away from around 7-8 yards out. You cannot say 100% that the ball was going in.

[Hibbyradge]

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McNulty got the shot away from around 7-8 yards out. You cannot say 100% that the ball was going in.

Wouldn't you agree that it was a goal scoring opportunity?

[Hibbyradge]

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As I said the player stopped a shot at goal, there are too many what if’s to say that it denied a goal and in my humble opinion you are looking at the wrong rule.

Which other rule is there?

[hibbysam]

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McNulty got the shot away from around 7-8 yards out. You cannot say 100% that the ball was going in.

I can 100% say it was on target and the keeper would’ve pulled off a worldie to save it, to me that’s a ‘clear goalscoring opportunity’... just like if you get cleaned out when through one on one, you aren’t guaranteed to score.

[PaulSmith]

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Which other rule is there?

You keep quoting denying an obvious goal by handball, as I’ve said that’s open to debate whether the hand ball stopped a goal.

You’ve failed to comment on the interpretation of handball - suggesting wrongly that accidental handball cannot be penalised - and the fact that a shot at goal blocked by handball is a yellow card offence not red.

in this instance if you think that it clearly stopped a goal then fine, it’s a red card. I think that there’s to many what ifs and it’s a yellow card.

[PaulSmith]

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I can 100% say it was on target and the keeper would’ve pulled off a worldie to save it, to me that’s a ‘clear goalscoring opportunity’... just like if you get cleaned out when through one on one, you aren’t guaranteed to score.

The law is denied a goal by handball.. not an opportunity. By the fact that you say that the GK could’ve saved it you’ve answered your own question that it’s a yellow card.


For the second part you are correct..well kind of unless there was a genuine attempt to play the ball... as you have denied a goal scoring opportunity and that’s a red card.

[hibbysam]

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You keep quoting denying an obvious goal by handball, as I’ve said that’s open to debate whether the hand ball stopped a goal.

You’ve failed to comment on the interpretation of handball - suggesting wrongly that accidental handball cannot be penalised - and the fact that a shot at goal blocked by handball is a yellow card offence not red.

in this instance if you think that it clearly stopped a goal then fine, it’s a red card. I think that there’s to many what ifs and it’s a yellow card.

It doesn’t need to stop a goal. It needs to stop a ‘clear goalscoring opportunity’, it’s not difficult to comprehend. Accidental handball can’t be penalised as that’s not the rule, it has to be an intentional handball.