Official HSL -The Facts About HSL Donations

[Gatecrasher]

At launch I initially saw HSL as a one year contribution to become a member, I'm still making payments to this day. I also make payments on behalf of my Dad who couldnt do this himself ("computer stuff") Keep up the good work guys.

[Oscar T Grouch]

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There's only a finite amount of shares to buy, HSL are buying these new shares from the club and in turn diluting the ownership of STF and Petrie.

The aim of HSL has never been to fully own the club.

I don't really get the apprehension about fan ownership - we'll continue to have a board of directors responsible for the running of the club and all that that entails, it wouldn't be mob rule.

I think this is how a lot of German clubs are set up (maybe all of them?), with fans owning a slight majority of shares and a board of directors running the club with fan representation on that board. It seems to work for them, they keep the price of tickets down and make sure the clubs footballing side is invested in correctly. The BBC done a great article on the set up over there a few years ago, it seemed like the perfect system to me.

[WhileTheChief..]

The German model works because each club gets zillions from their TV deal.

We get peanuts in comparison.

Probably better comparing us to clubs from Albania or Israel, much more our level!!

[brog]

I can't believe some of the negativity & paranoia on here. Here's some of the comments & my (non expert) take on them. FWIW I've been a shareholder since Hands off Hibs days & bought more a couple of years back. I made a one off contribution to HSL when it launched & i recently started monthly payments.
1. I don't want fan ownership. This baffles me, we've always had fan ownership back to the days of the original Hibernians. Tom Hart was very much a fan owner. Hibs moving to a more modern version of fan ownership isn't about 30,000 people making decisions. It's about people having a voice to elect people to run the club in pretty much the same way every social club in Britain works.
2. HSL isn't democratic. See above, it's strange that these comments only seem to come from non HSL members. I can vote for the board at HSL who will then vote for whoever represents HSL on Hibs board. That's pretty much how democracy works, as an example I vote for an MP who then votes for their leaders. Im sure if we reach the magic number where HSL has a rep on the board then they could easily do one member, one vote. Again though, is this really a showstopper preventing people from joining HSL?
3. Hibs withdrew shares because too many fans were buying them. This wins the prize for the most paranoiac & inaccurate comment on here. I know for a fact that when Hibs launched the share issue in, IIRC, 2016, they were disappointed that the uptake wasn't higher. Why on earth would you have a share issue if you dont want people to buy shares?


There's plenty more but that's enough. I fully understand that for many reasons but probably mostly economic, some supporters can not or do not want to join HSL That's their absolute prerogative & no one should be criticised for that. However I do not understand why Hibs supporters come on here & effectively try to persuade other supporters that HSL should not be supported. I greatly admire the dedication & patience of the HSL reps who visit here & other places to explain the model & provide detailed answers to questions repeated ad nauseam. They must feel like lying down in a dark room at times. I wish them success.

[offshorehibby]

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I can't believe some of the negativity & paranoia on here. Here's some of the comments & my (non expert) take on them. FWIW I've been a shareholder since Hands off Hibs days & bought more a couple of years back. I made a one off contribution to HSL when it launched & i recently started monthly payments.
1. I don't want fan ownership. This baffles me, we've always had fan ownership back to the days of the original Hibernians. Tom Hart was very much a fan owner. Hibs moving to a more modern version of fan ownership isn't about 30,000 people making decisions. It's about people having a voice to elect people to run the club in pretty much the same way every social club in Britain works.
2. HSL isn't democratic. See above, it's strange that these comments only seem to come from non HSL members. I can vote for the board at HSL who will then vote for whoever represents HSL on Hibs board. That's pretty much how democracy works, as an example I vote for an MP who then votes for their leaders. Im sure if we reach the magic number where HSL has a rep on the board then they could easily do one member, one vote. Again though, is this really a showstopper preventing people from joining HSL?
3. Hibs withdrew shares because too many fans were buying them. This wins the prize for the most paranoiac & inaccurate comment on here. I know for a fact that when Hibs launched the share issue in, IIRC, 2016, they were disappointed that the uptake wasn't higher. Why on earth would you have a share issue if you dont want people to buy shares?


There's plenty more but that's enough. I fully understand that for many reasons but probably mostly economic, some supporters can not or do not want to join HSL That's their absolute prerogative & no one should be criticised for that. However I do not understand why Hibs supporters come on here & effectively try to persuade other supporters that HSL should not be supported. I greatly admire the dedication & patience of the HSL reps who visit here & other places to explain the model & provide detailed answers to questions repeated ad nauseam. They must feel like lying down in a dark room at times. I wish them success.

[Finbar]

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I recently saw a wee clip about the background work that goes on at ER through people sitting at computers and trying to identify players that the manager would like in his squad. I was mega impressed at the fact this even happens and the technology and time involved in it. Now if this is the sort of thing that the HSL contributions are going towards the 'managers budget' then I am 100% behind it.

I am not in favour of fan ownership, I believe it is a very dangerous path to go down. However, I do feel we need to obtain, between us all, 25.1% of the club as a minimum as I believe this is the figure required to stop our club from ever being sold from under our feet and closed down, or whatever, maybe someone more in the know can confirm this or otherwise.

I have never contributed towards HSL, personally, for whatever reason, I just felt I didn't trust them, and probably still have my doubts.

I am now though, at the stage where, I think I would like to contribute something on a monthly basis, at least until we can reach that 25.1% target, then I will see how things are at that point.

I don't do paypal or whatever that other thing was that was mentioned previously, but I would be happy to set up a direct debit to HSL.
Anyone know how I go about doing this?

I signed up for £10 a month a wee while ago, it was quite straightforward, easier than I expected actually. The most difficult bit was finding the website, if you google HSL you get a sofa company or something, the HSL website is actually called HibernianSupporters.co.uk.

Once you're there you sign up and donate however much you want, as far as I remember it doesn't involve paypal you just put in your bank details.

Good luck!

[green day]

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I greatly admire the dedication & patience of the HSL reps who visit here & other places to explain the model & provide detailed answers to questions repeated ad nauseam. They must feel like lying down in a dark room at times. I wish them success.

We were not on the HSL flights to Norway, but on the Thursday in the Sportspuben I sought out the HSL chap (was a bit pished, cant remember his name, sorry) and told him I was a contributor, that I thought they were doing a great job, and putting on the flight / getting us the cheap beer deal was great work.

This is the thing - they did the groundwork, spoke to the hotel / pub and got a great deal on bevvy, a good food deal on the Thursday, and this was for ALL Hibbys there, not just HSL flight guys.

Norway cost a lot, but it would have been a hell of a lot more if it wasnt for HSL.

He was quite happy to hear that feedback, but wasnt seeking it out - these guys are all volunteers and should be applauded for their efforts.

[matty_f]

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Yeh i get that, but id still like enough scope for a wealthy person/company to invest in the team, similar to STf. Where does the money come from if the club is owned by individual fans through HSL?

Same place as it comes from just now, the club is self sufficient in that it uses revenue to pay the bills. HSL subs mean that less of that revenue gets directed away from the football side of the club (out probably more accurate to say that the impact of the revenue that gets directed away from the football side is reduced thanks to HSL)

[OfficialHSL]

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A knob ... irony must be lost on you. HSL continually confuse where the money goes. I will continually challenge their misrepresentation.

Dancehibs

We are sorry that you feel we are continually misrepresent or confuse where the money goes. Please be assured we do not deliberately do this and have not intention whatsoever of misleading our fellow Hibs supporters.

Please help us avoid doing this again by explaining clearly where you think we can improve ?

You are right that different phrases have been used at different times by different people but as far as we can see they are all intended to convey the same message.

For the avoidance of doubt please allow us to once again clarify. Donations received from our Members are passed on tho the Club. In return the Club give us shares at the rate of 4p per share. These are newly authorised shares.

The Board of the Club from the outset have confirmed that these funds will be used to " fund our sporting ambition" viz

- fund our football ambition
- paid to the football dept
- given to the Manager
- passed to Neil
- spent on football matters
etc etc etc etc

The fans reps on the Board have confirmed that they too are satisfied that this is how our funds are used.

We are happy that our funds are not being used to fund any infrastructure projects, pay dividends, pay any income to non executive Directors etc etc

Finally, our Members are satisfied that the funds are going to where they want it to go and they are telling us that they are using their own eyes to satisfy this test, by this we mean they feel that the product on the park has improved. As you may know Leeann has on more than one occasion stated that there were players in our Scottish Cup winning squad who simply would not have been there without the additional funds donated by HSL.

Please let us know what further clarity we feel we can add. I'm sure you will appreciate that our response is not intended in any way to be critical of any of your or anyone else's comments but we are always conscious that our Members read these Forums so it is important that they know where their hard earned money is going.

HSL

[OfficialHSL]

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A worrying thought if FOH are able to hand their manager a £1.4m transfer kitty per year

Stuart

This is all we are trying to do, make people aware in advance of what is going on around us. We don't want to wake up one morning and find ourselves trailing behind and wonder " how did that happen " ?


HSL

[OfficialHSL]

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I believe that as things stand I pay enough for my football and I am not prepared to pay an additional premium for it. If the club were to raise ST prices by say an equivalent of £10 per month, would they still sell the season tickets - I doubt it

I realise that Hearts fans had to pay extra to keep their club alive and credit to them. It also looks like they will continue to do so once they have hit their targets at which point they will have a financial advantage. If they want to pay more for that then thats their call

I am also not convinced about fan ownership as you could get some real incompetents in charge !

Skol

We do of course fully respect your choice not to want to pay more for your football, none of us want to pay more for anything than we have do.

I think however most would agree that generally speaking there is a correlation between money and quality. In the long term, for most of the time, The Clubs with the most money use the money to bring in better players and thus achieve better results by playing better football.

With this in mind, those fans who want to see a better Hibs and are happy to pay a little more money to help make this happen are choosing voluntarily to do this. That's pretty much all that is going on here.

Please remember that fan ownership is not the same as fan run. When HSL achieve a meaningful stake of 25.1% you can be certain that none of us will be picking the left back or centre forward.

The reality is not a huge amount will change, operating in the Scottish League will continue to be a challenge whether fan owned or privately owned. You still have to operate within you means. We happen to believe it is fairer to share that burden rather than have that burden resting on one individual.

HSL

[OfficialHSL]

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That is incredible. Struggling to believe that’s not been plan all along. There has been a view that HSL is not a fans movement. It’s a board controlled initiative to keep the board in control. Is Dempster and Dunn still on both boards ?

Another HSL board director will become a director of Hibs without a vote.

Individual shareholders were buying more shares. Hibs Board closed that down to give HSL a free run at it.

All sounds fishy.

Dancehibs

I have been involved in HSL right from the outset. We are just ordinary Hibs fans doing our best to help our Club. You don't know me personally but there are many on here that do and know me well enough to know that I would never involve myself in anything unscrupulous. The same can by said about any of my fellow Directors.

I have no issue with you having your own opinion no matter how ill informed it may be. What I would say is that such comments make life even harder for me and all the other people who are working hard to help improve our Club. I can cope with that but by saying things that you do not know to be the truth which results in turning people way from us, simply hurts our Club.

If you don't like me, that's fine. If you don't like any of the Directors, that's also fine. If you don't have the funds to contribute that's understandable. All that we ask is please allow other fans to make their choices to do what they want to help their Club.

Jim Adie
HSL

[ancient hibee]

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Dancehibs

I have been involved in HSL right from the outset. We are just ordinary Hibs fans doing our best to help our Club. You don't know me personally but there are many on here that do and know me well enough to know that I would never involve myself in anything unscrupulous. The same can by said about any of my fellow Directors.

I have no issue with you having your own opinion no matter how ill informed it may be. What I would say is that such comments make life even harder for me and all the other people who are working hard to help improve our Club. I can cope with that but by saying things that you do not know to be the truth which results in turning people way from us, simply hurts our Club.

If you don't like me, that's fine. If you don't like any of the Directors, that's also fine. If you don't have the funds to contribute that's understandable. All that we ask is please allow other fans to make their choices to do what they want to help their Club.

Jim Adie
HSL

I really don't know where you get the patience.

[Ronniekirk]

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I've long been an advocate for HSL, I see the value in having a sizeable chunk of the club safeguarded by fan ownership and I understand that doesn't mean that every decision has to be voted through by the support. For me, it secures the future of the club and makes sure we never find ourselves at the whim of a Mercer or a Romanov type.

I see the benefit of the club getting more money in, it gives us better players, a better manager, better facilities etc than we would otherwise be able to afford. This makes a Saturday afternoon (or whenever else we have to play) much more enjoyable.

It means we can pap Hearts out the cup a few years on the spin (last season excepted), improve our derby record, beat the Old Firm, have a team full of internationalists, have a youth team that wins doubles etc - it's the upward spiral that Mowbray talked about years ago. We're already seeing the benefit of some success in our home crowds rising and staying high. We're at a point where we can cut the Glasgow teams' allocation in the away end without taking a massive hit on the income from the game.

It's not a given that we'll stay competitive with Aberdeen and Hearts if we don't increase the money going into the team. Financially they both have a significant advantage over us at the moment, we are competitive just now because of good management across the club but IMHO that only gets you so far for so long.

The ideal situation for me is that we eventually match the additional income that Aberdeen and Hearts get, and let our good management become our competitive advantage so we can challenge.

The risk in not doing so is that we get left behind over the next few seasons. The strong position we find ourselves in just now is only a bad season away from being lost.

IMHO, there's a decision to be made by everyone with an interest in the club - it's a choice to make and you either see the need to help out or you don't. If we genuinely want to challenge consistently then ultimately it's in our power to make it happen. There isn't a significant difference in fan base between us, Hearts, and Aberdeen. If we engage in the same way that those supporters have with their clubs then we can go toe to toe with them for years to come.

That, as I see it, is the reality of the situation we're in - like it or not, if you want a winning team on the park then you need to support through season ticket sales and HSL etc.

There's more than one way to contribute but HSL is an easy way to do it with the added benefit of getting a say in the future of the club.

Excellent Post Marty , but no doubt the. Non Believers will be along to find fault with such a sensible post

[A Hi-Bee]

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I can't believe some of the negativity & paranoia on here. Here's some of the comments & my (non expert) take on them. FWIW I've been a shareholder since Hands off Hibs days & bought more a couple of years back. I made a one off contribution to HSL when it launched & i recently started monthly payments.
1. I don't want fan ownership. This baffles me, we've always had fan ownership back to the days of the original Hibernians. Tom Hart was very much a fan owner. Hibs moving to a more modern version of fan ownership isn't about 30,000 people making decisions. It's about people having a voice to elect people to run the club in pretty much the same way every social club in Britain works.
2. HSL isn't democratic. See above, it's strange that these comments only seem to come from non HSL members. I can vote for the board at HSL who will then vote for whoever represents HSL on Hibs board. That's pretty much how democracy works, as an example I vote for an MP who then votes for their leaders. Im sure if we reach the magic number where HSL has a rep on the board then they could easily do one member, one vote. Again though, is this really a showstopper preventing people from joining HSL?
3. Hibs withdrew shares because too many fans were buying them. This wins the prize for the most paranoiac & inaccurate comment on here. I know for a fact that when Hibs launched the share issue in, IIRC, 2016, they were disappointed that the uptake wasn't higher. Why on earth would you have a share issue if you dont want people to buy shares?


There's plenty more but that's enough. I fully understand that for many reasons but probably mostly economic, some supporters can not or do not want to join HSL That's their absolute prerogative & no one should be criticised for that. However I do not understand why Hibs supporters come on here & effectively try to persuade other supporters that HSL should not be supported. I greatly admire the dedication & patience of the HSL reps who visit here & other places to explain the model & provide detailed answers to questions repeated ad nauseam. They must feel like lying down in a dark room at times. I wish them success.

Brog,
I don’t see how giving my humble opinion on the fact that rightly or wrongly I believe in one member one vote can be seen as being negative to HSL or trying to stop anyone from joining what is in my humble again a great way of us getting money into the club, I contribute and will continue to do as long as I can afford to.
One of my threads from a while ago resulted in around 25 new members joining up wi HSL Dont see anyone else doing the same outside of official HSL - so please refrain from thinking I am in anyway negative towards what we are trying to achieve my beleifs in the way voting is carried out stay the same.
Perhaps voting for an m.p who then votes for a leader is not the best example to use (after all look at the donkeys we have now, could also say the same about the SFA and so on, but thats just my opinion)


GGTTH

[A Hi-Bee]

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I've long been an advocate for HSL, I see the value in having a sizeable chunk of the club safeguarded by fan ownership and I understand that doesn't mean that every decision has to be voted through by the support. For me, it secures the future of the club and makes sure we never find ourselves at the whim of a Mercer or a Romanov type.

I see the benefit of the club getting more money in, it gives us better players, a better manager, better facilities etc than we would otherwise be able to afford. This makes a Saturday afternoon (or whenever else we have to play) much more enjoyable.

It means we can pap Hearts out the cup a few years on the spin (last season excepted), improve our derby record, beat the Old Firm, have a team full of internationalists, have a youth team that wins doubles etc - it's the upward spiral that Mowbray talked about years ago. We're already seeing the benefit of some success in our home crowds rising and staying high. We're at a point where we can cut the Glasgow teams' allocation in the away end without taking a massive hit on the income from the game.

It's not a given that we'll stay competitive with Aberdeen and Hearts if we don't increase the money going into the team. Financially they both have a significant advantage over us at the moment, we are competitive just now because of good management across the club but IMHO that only gets you so far for so long.

The ideal situation for me is that we eventually match the additional income that Aberdeen and Hearts get, and let our good management become our competitive advantage so we can challenge.

The risk in not doing so is that we get left behind over the next few seasons. The strong position we find ourselves in just now is only a bad season away from being lost.

IMHO, there's a decision to be made by everyone with an interest in the club - it's a choice to make and you either see the need to help out or you don't. If we genuinely want to challenge consistently then ultimately it's in our power to make it happen. There isn't a significant difference in fan base between us, Hearts, and Aberdeen. If we engage in the same way that those supporters have with their clubs then we can go toe to toe with them for years to come.

That, as I see it, is the reality of the situation we're in - like it or not, if you want a winning team on the park then you need to support through season ticket sales and HSL etc.

There's more than one way to contribute but HSL is an easy way to do it with the added benefit of getting a say in the future of the club.

Well said, been saying the same for months now, we are the only people who can effect how much our manager gets to spend on the players he wants to get onto the park, better quality takes more money.

[Dalianwanda]

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Yeah this is where we totally disagree.

It is not uo to the fans to raise enough cash for the club to be competitive, that’s down to the club itself.

You just have to read some of the threads on here complaining about the price of a Pie and Pint, the ticket prices for the derby or , well anything at all really.

Collectively we moan about the price of everything but at the same time some of you want us to donate cash to the same cause!

Why are we holding Hearts up as an example of how to grow financially?! Let them do their thing and we’ll do ours.

We’ll be fine. It’s not tooth fairy stuff at all.

You have lost me here, what do you class as 'the club'? Whats the difference between those who play, those who support & those who provide the structure to support the first two?

How do we compete if we dont have the resources?

[BSEJVT]

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Increase the concession ticket prices.

They are way too cheap for over 65s. Pensioners nowadays are baby boomers, the wealthiest generation ever. It’s not the 70s anymore when pensioners were all skint!

Have a look around you next time you’re at ER. The majority of fans will be a concession of one kind or another.

Hospitality is full of older fans, some of who rock up in Jags and Range Rovers. Why do they get a cheap season ticket?

So bring their prices much closer to the normal ticket price and you’ll see a significant rise in turnover.

Of course that’s not going to be popular if it affects you, but it’s for the bigger cause, brother.

So to paraphrase the above

Its okay if everybody else pitches in money to put a better team on the park that we can all enjoy, as long as it's not you?

Very public spirited

[WhileTheChief..]

Nope, I’m pretty much saying the opposite.

[Bostonhibby]

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2 points?

Is it okay to say plus one cup and a huge points gap since they put themselves into administration? Not to mention our superior derby record since?

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[Bostonhibby]

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Dancehibs

I have been involved in HSL right from the outset. We are just ordinary Hibs fans doing our best to help our Club. You don't know me personally but there are many on here that do and know me well enough to know that I would never involve myself in anything unscrupulous. The same can by said about any of my fellow Directors.

I have no issue with you having your own opinion no matter how ill informed it may be. What I would say is that such comments make life even harder for me and all the other people who are working hard to help improve our Club. I can cope with that but by saying things that you do not know to be the truth which results in turning people way from us, simply hurts our Club.

If you don't like me, that's fine. If you don't like any of the Directors, that's also fine. If you don't have the funds to contribute that's understandable. All that we ask is please allow other fans to make their choices to do what they want to help their Club.

Jim Adie
HSL

Might be easier to say you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink?

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[WhileTheChief..]

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You have lost me here, what do you class as 'the club'? Whats the difference between those who play, those who support & those who provide the structure to support the first two?

How do we compete if we dont have the resources?

Things like improved league finishes, cup runs, trading players for a profit, improved TV and advertising deals, increase commercial turnover etc etc.

I guess my main point through all this, although perhaps poorly made, is that I think fans pay enough as it is through STs, walk ups, merchandise, hospitality and the likes.

We, and i include all of us here, already do our bit.

[Just Alf]

I've worked etc won a wee bet here and there, done a homer and so on and got myself 40 quid to go to the pub, I'm happy, all's good in the world etc... Along comes my wife and says here's an extra £10 off you go and enjoy your self

That extra 10 means I might have a slightly better time.

That's how I think of HSL... Hibs work within their means with all their various revenue streams and then along comes the HSL money that's handed over to the football department over and above what they'd normally get. We all might get a slightly better time!



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[brog]

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Brog,
I don’t see how giving my humble opinion on the fact that rightly or wrongly I believe in one member one vote can be seen as being negative to HSL or trying to stop anyone from joining what is in my humble again a great way of us getting money into the club, I contribute and will continue to do as long as I can afford to.
One of my threads from a while ago resulted in around 25 new members joining up wi HSL Dont see anyone else doing the same outside of official HSL - so please refrain from thinking I am in anyway negative towards what we are trying to achieve my beleifs in the way voting is carried out stay the same.
Perhaps voting for an m.p who then votes for a leader is not the best example to use (after all look at the donkeys we have now, could also say the same about the SFA and so on, but thats just my opinion)


GGTTH

No criticism of you was intended, i was merely pointing out that the present system of electing people to the HSL board is democratic in that it equates to the norm in the UK. I agree with you that the political system is considerably imperfect but then one member one vote resulted in brexit so im not sure any system is perfect.

[Eyrie]

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Things like improved league finishes, cup runs, trading players for a profit, improved TV and advertising deals, increase commercial turnover etc etc.

I guess my main point through all this, although perhaps poorly made, is that I think fans pay enough as it is through STs, walk ups, merchandise, hospitality and the likes.

We, and i include all of us here, already do our bit.

Every club wants improved league finishes, cup runs, trading players for a profit, improved TV and advertising deals, increase commercial turnover etc etc to increase its resources.

But a club that can increase its resources relative to its direct competitors can improve its chances of improved league finishes, cup runs, trading players for a profit, improved TV and advertising deals, increase commercial turnover etc etc.

If Hearts can get another £1.4m per season from FOH compared to us, then they have an advantage over us in seeking those improved league finishes, cup runs, trading players for a profit, improved TV and advertising deals, increase commercial turnover etc etc.

HSL provides us with an opportunity to counter that advantage. If you don't want to contribute, or can't, then that is your decision, but why try to undermine its good work with claims that we don't need to do any more?

If money doesn't ultimately matter, then explain to me why the two wealthiest clubs (Celtc, Huns RIP) in Scotland have by far the most trophies.

[WhileTheChief..]

Look, I’ve never tried to put any off or anything like it.

Apologies if you read that way. I’ll leave you all in peace now!

[BSEJVT]

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Every club wants improved league finishes, cup runs, trading players for a profit, improved TV and advertising deals, increase commercial turnover etc etc to increase its resources.

But a club that can increase its resources relative to its direct competitors can improve its chances of improved league finishes, cup runs, trading players for a profit, improved TV and advertising deals, increase commercial turnover etc etc.

If Hearts can get another £1.4m per season from FOH compared to us, then they have an advantage over us in seeking those improved league finishes, cup runs, trading players for a profit, improved TV and advertising deals, increase commercial turnover etc etc.

HSL provides us with an opportunity to counter that advantage. If you don't want to contribute, or can't, then that is your decision, but why try to undermine its good work with claims that we don't need to do any more?

If money doesn't ultimately matter, then explain to me why the two wealthiest clubs (Celtc, Huns RIP) in Scotland have by far the most trophies.

Nail hit firmly on head

I have no problem with folk not contributing it is a free choice.

Truth be told I think many that don't have a bit of guilt trip over it and then try to justify (NOT THAT THERE IS ANY NEED TO DO SO) that decision by making spurious assertions and claims

If its not for you ignore it but don't criticise others efforts to encourage those that may want do so or invent excuses why extra monies raised from this source are not required, its a patent nonsense to suggest this.

[Hibeewilly]

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Nail hit firmly on head

I have no problem with folk not contributing it is a free choice.

Truth be told I think many that don't have a bit of guilt trip over it and then try to justify (NOT THAT THERE IS ANY NEED TO DO SO) that decision by making spurious assertions and claims

If its not for you ignore it but don't criticise others efforts to encourage those that may want do so or invent excuses why extra monies raised from this source are not required, its a patent nonsense to suggest this.

I think that sums it up BSEJVT. Absolutely every Hibernian supporters own choice. All of us whether we contribute or not are all the same. GGTTH

[RIP]

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Dancehibs

I have been involved in HSL right from the outset. We are just ordinary Hibs fans doing our best to help our Club. You don't know me personally but there are many on here that do and know me well enough to know that I would never involve myself in anything unscrupulous. The same can by said about any of my fellow Directors.

I have no issue with you having your own opinion no matter how ill informed it may be. What I would say is that such comments make life even harder for me and all the other people who are working hard to help improve our Club. I can cope with that but by saying things that you do not know to be the truth which results in turning people way from us, simply hurts our Club.

If you don't like me, that's fine. If you don't like any of the Directors, that's also fine. If you don't have the funds to contribute that's understandable. All that we ask is please allow other fans to make their choices to do what they want to help their Club.

Jim Adie
HSL

Jim well done for your dedication to the club which if not fully appreciated today hopefully will be fully acknowledged in the years to come.

Having met you, Gordon Smith and Peter at a turbulent time post relegation I was struck by your sincerity and love of the Hibs. I was also very impressed by the fact that you had worked for 2 years on your fans community project before presenting it to the Board. As a business consultant and project manager I know that the best schemes are the ones that take time to design and develop.

Being a known and trusted associate of Rod at a difficult period for the chairman would have enabled you and the team to gain the trust of Sir Tom Farmer who after saving our club back in 1991,would need to be sure that trusted people were behind the new venture.

Very well done sir. You have my admiration.

GM

[Ged]

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Dancehibs

We are sorry that you feel we are continually misrepresent or confuse where the money goes. Please be assured we do not deliberately do this and have not intention whatsoever of misleading our fellow Hibs supporters.

Please help us avoid doing this again by explaining clearly where you think we can improve ?

You are right that different phrases have been used at different times by different people but as far as we can see they are all intended to convey the same message.

For the avoidance of doubt please allow us to once again clarify. Donations received from our Members are passed on tho the Club. In return the Club give us shares at the rate of 4p per share. These are newly authorised shares.

The Board of the Club from the outset have confirmed that these funds will be used to " fund our sporting ambition" viz

- fund our football ambition
- paid to the football dept
- given to the Manager
- passed to Neil
- spent on football matters
etc etc etc etc

The fans reps on the Board have confirmed that they too are satisfied that this is how our funds are used.

We are happy that our funds are not being used to fund any infrastructure projects, pay dividends, pay any income to non executive Directors etc etc

Finally, our Members are satisfied that the funds are going to where they want it to go and they are telling us that they are using their own eyes to satisfy this test, by this we mean they feel that the product on the park has improved. As you may know Leeann has on more than one occasion stated that there were players in our Scottish Cup winning squad who simply would not have been there without the additional funds donated by HSL.

Please let us know what further clarity we feel we can add. I'm sure you will appreciate that our response is not intended in any way to be critical of any of your or anyone else's comments but we are always conscious that our Members read these Forums so it is important that they know where their hard earned money is going.

HSL

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Dancehibs

I have been involved in HSL right from the outset. We are just ordinary Hibs fans doing our best to help our Club. You don't know me personally but there are many on here that do and know me well enough to know that I would never involve myself in anything unscrupulous. The same can by said about any of my fellow Directors.

I have no issue with you having your own opinion no matter how ill informed it may be. What I would say is that such comments make life even harder for me and all the other people who are working hard to help improve our Club. I can cope with that but by saying things that you do not know to be the truth which results in turning people way from us, simply hurts our Club.

If you don't like me, that's fine. If you don't like any of the Directors, that's also fine. If you don't have the funds to contribute that's understandable. All that we ask is please allow other fans to make their choices to do what they want to help their Club.

Jim Adie
HSL

Has dance hibs been back to answer either of these posts yet?