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View Poll Results: Brexit voting.

Voters
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  • Voted remain, still remain.

    74 91.36%
  • Voted remain, now leave.

    1 1.23%
  • Voted leave, now remain.

    2 2.47%
  • Voted leave, still leave.

    4 4.94%
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  1. #61
    @hibs.net private member Bristolhibby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by heretoday View Post
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    Spain? I'm just saying. I want a positive outcome just like everyone else.
    If Romania, Hungary, Slovakia, Lithuania, Latvia can join. There is no reason why an Indy Scotland wouldnít be fast tracked back in.

    Itís nonsense to suggest otherwise. Indy Scotland could also give the same commitment that Sweden has given towards the euro (ie a vague commitment that never happens), obviously this would be Scotlandís choice to make.

    J


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  3. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by heretoday View Post
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    Also an independent Scotland will not find it easy to re-enter the EU.
    You could envisage a scenario where the EU27 might fast track Scotlandís entry in order to upset the English Brexiters.


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  4. #63
    @hibs.net private member Hibbyradge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grunt View Post
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    You could envisage a scenario where the EU27 might fast track Scotlandís entry in order to upset the English Brexiters.


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    I doubt that serious politicians and economists would behave that childishly or do things like that out of spite.

    If Scotland ever applies for EU membership, it will be considered on its own merits.
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  5. #64
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    I think Scotland would get in fairly easily, but it would take some time, and probably a formal accession process of a year or two.

    The question would be if we wanted to?

    The big problem woyld be potentially putting up a hard border with by far our biggest trading partner, England.

    If that were to happen though, presumably there would be a demand for a big container port on Scotland's east coast.. could be really good for rosyth and replace the royal navy work?

    We would presumably also require a larger hub airport... bad news for residents of west edinburgh!

  6. #65
    @hibs.net private member Bristolhibby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibbyradge View Post
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    I doubt that serious politicians and economists would behave that childishly or do things like that out of spite.

    If Scotland ever applies for EU membership, it will be considered on its own merits.
    You have seen wars start in the past. Spite and vengeance is quite often at the top of the list. That and money. Think how much trans national investment an Indy Scotland could get. English speaking, open for business.

    J

  7. #66
    @hibs.net private member Bristolhibby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SouthsideHarp_Bhoy View Post
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    I think Scotland would get in fairly easily, but it would take some time, and probably a formal accession process of a year or two.

    The question would be if we wanted to?

    The big problem woyld be potentially putting up a hard border with by far our biggest trading partner, England.

    If that were to happen though, presumably there would be a demand for a big container port on Scotland's east coast.. could be really good for rosyth and replace the royal navy work?

    We would presumably also require a larger hub airport... bad news for residents of west edinburgh!
    Letís see what happens on the Island of Ireland post March next year. Then we will have our blueprint for trading with England and Wales.

    J

  8. #67
    Switzerland seems to manage ok being surrounded by eu members and being a non member themselves. But the eu can't make it work for Ireland?

  9. #68
    @hibs.net private member Bristolhibby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HappyAsHellas View Post
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    Switzerland seems to manage ok being surrounded by eu members and being a non member themselves. But the eu can't make it work for Ireland?
    Correction, the U.K. donít want that model to work for Ireland.

    IMHO the Good Friday Agreement MUST trump all this nonsense. There has been literally 100s of years of strife and death on the Island of Ireland. Peace must not ever be put in jeopardy.

    Itís us thatís leaving, not the EU.

    J
    Last edited by Bristolhibby; 26-10-2018 at 06:55 PM.

  10. #69
    Whilst I agree with your opinion on the peace side of things, I don't think Britain is insisting on a hard border - instead of logical thinking and solutions we have politicians being politicians which I think is where the real problem lies.

  11. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by HappyAsHellas View Post
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    Switzerland seems to manage ok being surrounded by eu members and being a non member themselves. But the eu can't make it work for Ireland?
    The Swiss are in Schengen but they have a customs border. In practice that means there are border posts but cars are rarely stopped.

    Ireland is a very different situation. The nationalist side of the north made peace on the basis that they could self-identify as Irish, have Irish passports, the right to live and work on either side of the border and move across it at will and have guaranteed rights as EU citizens. The last is a non-academic point given the 1921-1972 regime in NI.

  12. #71
    @hibs.net private member Bristolhibby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens View Post
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    The Swiss are in Schengen but they have a customs border. In practice that means there are border posts but cars are rarely stopped.

    Ireland is a very different situation. The nationalist side of the north made peace on the basis that they could self-identify as Irish, have Irish passports, the right to live and work on either side of the border and move across it at will and have guaranteed rights as EU citizens. The last is a non-academic point given the 1921-1972 regime in NI.
    This. Something which was never mentioned by remain prior to the referendum.

    J

  13. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibbyradge View Post
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    I doubt that serious politicians and economists would behave that childishly or do things like that out of spite.

    If Scotland ever applies for EU membership, it will be considered on its own merits.
    I doubt that too although Spain might send a signal to Catalonia by objecting to our entry.

  14. #73
    @hibs.net private member CropleyWasGod's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by heretoday View Post
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    I doubt that too although Spain might send a signal to Catalonia by objecting to our entry.
    This is their latest view on that, albeit 18 months ago.

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.i...531.html%3famp

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  15. #74
    Private Members Prediction League Winner Hibrandenburg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HappyAsHellas View Post
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    Switzerland seems to manage ok being surrounded by eu members and being a non member themselves. But the eu can't make it work for Ireland?
    Switzerland abides by the EU's free movement of people principle, that makes a big difference.

  16. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibrandenburg View Post
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    Switzerland abides by the EU's free movement of people principle, that makes a big difference.
    Sadly, thatís the whole reason for Brexit: no more free movement of people.

    As a recently retired civil servant, Iím hoping that Iím not recalled to man the borders of the ďtaking back controlĒ UK 😉
    Last edited by Saturday Boy; 26-10-2018 at 09:14 PM.

  17. #76
    @hibs.net private member goosano's Avatar
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    The thing that will take time is getting spending in line with convergence criteria for joining the EU..currently a deficit of 3% of GDP. It is currently 8.9% and would require austerity that makes the last 10 years seem a picnic. And that is before you add in the costs of separating from the rest of the UK, the costs of setting up our own institutions and taking into account the freezing of investment that inevitably comes with times like that as is occurring with Brexit now. I'm in favour of independence as long as it can be realistically achieved but I donít see it now.
    Quote Originally Posted by SouthsideHarp_Bhoy View Post
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    I think Scotland would the get in fairly easily, but it would take some time, and probably a formal accession process of a year or two.

    The question would be if we wanted to?

    The big problem woyld be potentially putting up a hard border with by far our biggest trading partner, England.

    If that were to happen though, presumably there would be a demand for a big container port on Scotland's east coast.. could be really good for rosyth and replace the royal navy work?

    We would presumably also require a larger hub airport... bad news for residents of west edinburgh!

  18. #77
    Testimonial Due Colr's Avatar
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    Ordered something from New Zealand recently. Duty, tax and charges at customs added 40% to the cost!

  19. #78
    @hibs.net private member steakbake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibrandenburg View Post
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    Switzerland abides by the EU's free movement of people principle, that makes a big difference.
    It also has a proper customs border with the EU, meaning goods (and if required) people can be checked.

    This does not solve the situation with Ireland as, if the UK is to hold to it's side on the Good Friday Agreement - an international treaty, after all - then such apparatus cannot be set up on the island of Ireland.

    The alternative - a border in the Irish Sea between Great Britain and the North of Ireland is unpalatable to the DUP to whom the UK government tossed £1bn as well as other Unionists like Davidson and Mundell.

    So there we go. We can either renege on an international peace treaty or we can upset a bunch of evolution denying, sash wearing, backwards goons and their allies. At the moment, the Government are expecting to find a way to welch on an international peace treaty because the other crew have them over a barrel following Theresa's 'second vote' in 2017.

  20. #79
    @hibs.net private member Bristolhibby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steakbake View Post
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    It also has a proper customs border with the EU, meaning goods (and if required) people can be checked.

    This does not solve the situation with Ireland as, if the UK is to hold to it's side on the Good Friday Agreement - an international treaty, after all - then such apparatus cannot be set up on the island of Ireland.

    The alternative - a border in the Irish Sea between Great Britain and the North of Ireland is unpalatable to the DUP to whom the UK government tossed £1bn as well as other Unionists like Davidson and Mundell.

    So there we go. We can either renege on an international peace treaty or we can upset a bunch of evolution denying, sash wearing, backwards goons and their allies. At the moment, the Government are expecting to find a way to welch on an international peace treaty because the other crew have them over a barrel following Theresa's 'second vote' in 2017.
    Or the Tories get enough votes from Labour to shaft the DUP (rightly so) and chuck the border up in the Irish Sea.

    J

  21. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by goosano View Post
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    The thing that will take time is getting spending in line with convergence criteria for joining the EU..currently a deficit of 3% of GDP. It is currently 8.9% and would require austerity that makes the last 10 years seem a picnic. And that is before you add in the costs of separating from the rest of the UK, the costs of setting up our own institutions and taking into account the freezing of investment that inevitably comes with times like that as is occurring with Brexit now. I'm in favour of independence as long as it can be realistically achieved but I donít see it now.
    The 3% figure is for joining the eurozone rather than the EU.

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