Indoor pitch v player recruitment

[hibee-boys]

Picked up from the John McGinn thread that some, or all!, of any transfer fee may be used to build an indoor pitch at East Mains. Pretty sure I've read that this does form part of Leanne's plans as well.

Just wondered what the views are on this?

We've done incredibly well to get people back to Easter Road last few years, record season tickets sales. Surely it's time to invest more towards the playing budget. I appreciated the importance of having our own training ground and the investment into East Mains was a good long term move but have we produced any more new talent in comparison to pre East Mains?

[Future17]

I think a full size indoor pitch is a must for the training centre. Happy to see transfer money being used towards something permanent like this.

[calumhibee1]

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I think a full size indoor pitch is a must for the training centre. Happy to see transfer money being used towards something permanent like this.

Agreed. I’m not sure how much the indoor pitch will cost but it’s something we definitely should be going for.

[Mikey]

I think it's a requirement for Project Brave.

[Keith_M]

Anybody know (even roughly) how much the Indoor Pitch is going to cost?

[Eyrie]

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Picked up from the John McGinn thread that some, or all!, of any transfer fee may be used to build an indoor pitch at East Mains. Pretty sure I've read that this does form part of Leanne's plans as well.

Just wondered what the views are on this?

We've done incredibly well to get people back to Easter Road last few years, record season tickets sales. Surely it's time to invest more towards the playing budget. I appreciated the importance of having our own training ground and the investment into East Mains was a good long term move but have we produced any more new talent in comparison to pre East Mains?

The counter argument would be that we'd be able to bring through better youths and improve the senior players if they can train on a full sized indoor pitch rather than outdoors in bad weather. Remember the video a couple of years ago showing the wind at East Mains?

[superfurryhibby]

Investment on the field all the way. If we don’t sustain expectations those 13’000 season tickets will just as quickly fade away. We’ve had a very long spell where investment in infrastructure took precedence, now is the time to build a footballing legacy. If things go well the playing side will generate revenue enough for resources, including an indoor pitch.

[superfurryhibby]

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The counter argument would be that we'd be able to bring through better youths and improve the senior players if they can train on a full sized indoor pitch rather than outdoors in bad weather. Remember the video a couple of years ago showing the wind at East Mains?

Has the youth system provided enough dividend in terms of players making an impact? Strong arguement to say there are no more players making the first team than there was before we went down the whole youth team route.

[hibee-boys]

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The counter argument would be that we'd be able to bring through better youths and improve the senior players if they can train on a full sized indoor pitch rather than outdoors in bad weather. Remember the video a couple of years ago showing the wind at East Mains?

I think the priority at this time, given the number of season tickets and the loss of a number of key players, has to be playing staff. As someone has pointed out already, continued success would hopefully help fund other projects like the indoor pitch.

[Eyrie]

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Has the youth system provided enough dividend in terms of players making an impact? Strong arguement to say there are no more players making the first team than there was before we went down the whole youth team route.

Fair point, and very similar to the question I posed about the youth team in the Hibs Ladies thread.

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I think the priority at this time, given the number of season tickets and the loss of a number of key players, has to be playing staff. As someone has pointed out already, continued success would hopefully help fund other projects like the indoor pitch.

But at what stage would we stop continuing to invest in sustaining current success to enable us invest in the facilities?

I'd say the windfall from McGinn is the time to do that. The first team budget should be largely sustainable from current income with any boost from transfer money regarded as a bonus to be spread over the next 2-3 years.

[NAE NOOKIE]

This is kind of like the old player recruitment v building the East stand discussion. As it turned out in the long run that investment was worthwhile, every bum on a seat we have had since over the old capacity of around 17,500 has been money into the club.

Hibs, Aberdeen and Hearts pretty well operate in the same market for players, with not a huge difference in what they can pay in wages … Hibs currently lag slightly behind the other two because Aberdeen are well funded and Hearts are insane. In those circumstances what you can offer players in side benefits makes a difference …. Aberdeen will eventually have a full size indoor facility and as we all know Hearts have built the magnificent Orium facility.

East Mains being where it is can be pretty prone to disruption from the elements and I'm sure ( in fact positive ) that any prospective signing being shown around would be far more encouraged to put pen to paper if he knows that if it comes to the crunch he will be protected from having to train in a force 9 gale or the pissing rain, or both, and that he wont have to queue behind the Scottish women's under 15s hockey team for the privilege

It makes sense for Hibs to do this, in fact I would imagine that as part of our long term goal to be as attractive as possible to potential recruits and to bring our own players through its absolutely vital. I've said it before … if you want the best kids to sign for you then its the parents you have to impress, not the kids, and from that POV we should do everything possible to make East Mains an attractive place for the parents, friends and relatives who take the kids to training to hang around … we should be building a lounge for them as well as an indoor facility. I used to drive my friends kid from Galashiels to Edinburgh to train with Hibs and if the weather was really bad that meant me sitting in a boozer for two hours with a soft drink or sitting in my car listening to the radio ….. I didn't enjoy either.

This is something we have to do

[GloryGlory]

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I think a full size indoor pitch is a must for the training centre. Happy to see transfer money being used towards something permanent like this.

It's an investment not just in the current players at the club, but in developing future generations of players with the highest possible level of technical skills.

I know we all like to see new players like Kamberi and Mallan coming in, but the bedrock of the club is producing our own players.

[MyJo]

The indoor pitch is a requirement to the top grade our academy has been given. This allows us to attract and accommodate the best youth talent which in turn will generate players who should be better equipped to step up into the first team and benefit the club on the pitch.

It also provides a much needed training facility that the first team currently do not have. Bad weather and snow like we seen this year has an impact on the ability of the team to train and affects match preparations. An indoor full size pitch will prevent this from impacting the squad.

In other words the indoor pitch that we need to pay for will be investing in the squad....long term.

[Pretty Boy]

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Anybody know (even roughly) how much the Indoor Pitch is going to cost?

Circa £1M.

[MyJo]

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Circa £1M.

Quarter a McGinn

[1875STEVE]

This has been in the pipeline for a while.

My nephew is in the youth system, and my brother has heard many conversations about it, told me about it well over a year ago.

Hibs have cash in the bank though, and have done for some time, I heard that's where it was coming from and it was costing just shy of £1m

[Pretty Boy]

If we don't build the pitch we lose our elite academy status which would be hugely damaging, financially and otherwise, long term. Fans can think 'in the moment' but it's important the people in charge have a clear long term strategy.

[Big_Franck]

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Circa £1M.

I had no idea it was costing that kind of money. In my opinion we shouldn't be spending anywhere near that amount on anything other than the first team. We've had little to no return from the youth investment in almost the last decade now. Couldn't care less about project brave as its been created by the SFA so in all probability will amount to nothing.

To put that £1m in perspective that is £6,400 per week towards wages over the next 3 seasons!! That would pay for 2 or 3 new first team signings on 3 year contracts.

I had thought the days of us selling our best players and spending the money on infrastructure to the detriment of the first team were over. Apparently not.

[CropleyWasGod]

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I had no idea it was costing that kind of money. In my opinion we shouldn't be spending anywhere near that amount on anything other than the first team. We've had little to no return from the youth investment in almost the last decade now. Couldn't care less about project brave as its been created by the SFA so in all probability will amount to nothing.

To put that £1m in perspective that is £6,400 per week towards wages over the next 3 seasons!! That would pay for 2 or 3 new first team signings on 3 year contracts.

I had thought the days of us selling our best players and spending the money on infrastructure to the detriment of the first team were over. Apparently not.

Project Brave allows (not enables) us to offer top-class training facilities to young players. Without that status, we would be losing out on them to our competitors.

All we need is 1 (one) such player to be developed and sold on for £1m, and it's paid for itself.

That all said, it's becoming a Hibs.net myth that the SJM money is all going to this facility. The Club have said nothing of the sort.

[Billy Whizz]

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Project Brave allows (not enables) us to offer top-class training facilities to young players. Without that status, we would be losing out on them to our competitors.

All we need is 1 (one) such player to be developed and sold on for £1m, and it's paid for itself.

That all said, it's becoming a Hibs.net myth that the SJM money is all going to this facility. The Club have said nothing of the sort.

I’m not sure that you have to build an indoor facility, to be in the 1st tier of Project Brave anyway
Apart from Oriam, what other teams have indooor full size facilities in Scotland?

[Ozyhibby]

The indoor pitch is a must have in the modern game. Cancelling training due to the weather is ridiculous in this day and age. It will be built, but with a decent transfer fee for McGinn, it won’t come out of the player budget.
The exact same argument could be had about the extra coaches, dietitians, sports scientists, data analysts and sport psychologists who work at East mains these days since George Craig arrived but I think he has earned the right to be trusted that he knows what he’s been doing.
There is nobody at East Mains, including the manager, who does not want the indoor pitch.


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[Ozyhibby]

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I’m not sure that you have to build an indoor facility, to be in the 1st tier of Project Brave anyway
Apart from Oriam, what other teams have indooor full size facilities in Scotland?

Hearts don’t even use the indoor pitch at Oriam. It’s too expensive at about £180 an hour. I don’t think this is a project Brave requirement, it’s just something the management want.


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[Bishop Hibee]

An indoor pitch would be a great step forward. Hibs should be congratulated If/when they start work on this.

[Billy Whizz]

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An indoor pitch would be a great step forward. Hibs should be congratulated If/when they start work on this.

Hope they include a small seating area in it too

[Ozymandias]

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I had no idea it was costing that kind of money. In my opinion we shouldn't be spending anywhere near that amount on anything other than the first team. We've had little to no return from the youth investment in almost the last decade now. Couldn't care less about project brave as its been created by the SFA so in all probability will amount to nothing.

To put that £1m in perspective that is £6,400 per week towards wages over the next 3 seasons!! That would pay for 2 or 3 new first team signings on 3 year contracts.

I had thought the days of us selling our best players and spending the money on infrastructure to the detriment of the first team were over. Apparently not.

I'm guessing but I would imagine the funding model for the building of an indoor pitch would come out of a Capital spend process rather than out of seasonal operating costs, so whilst it does have to be paid for the impact is not equally short term.

There is absolutely no question that an indoor pitch is the way to go. The impact of having a facility that allows training to be independent of the weather will deliver points on the pitch, no question. That is what will carry on the relative success we have now. Equally, having top class facilities is surely more likely to generate top class players? It's not a short term thing. It might not yield players for a few years, but it only needs to make the difference in one instance for it to pay for itself.

[Big_Franck]

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Project Brave allows (not enables) us to offer top-class training facilities to young players. Without that status, we would be losing out on them to our competitors.

All we need is 1 (one) such player to be developed and sold on for £1m, and it's paid for itself.

That all said, it's becoming a Hibs.net myth that the SJM money is all going to this facility. The Club have said nothing of the sort.

When was the last time we sold a product of our youth academy for £1m though? Fletcher in 2009 from what I can remember.

The fact the club might have been keeping money back from the first team to save money for an indoor pitch isn't any better IMO. £1m is a huge amount of money for our club. It would be better spent on the first team over the next few years.

[hibee-boys]

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The indoor pitch is a must have in the modern game. Cancelling training due to the weather is ridiculous in this day and age. It will be built, but with a decent transfer fee for McGinn, it won’t come out of the player budget.
The exact same argument could be had about the extra coaches, dietitians, sports scientists, data analysts and sport psychologists who work at East mains these days since George Craig arrived but I think he has earned the right to be trusted that he knows what he’s been doing.
There is nobody at East Mains, including the manager, who does not want the indoor pitch.


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I think we can take it as a given that any coach or player would prefer to work indoor on a wet, windy day.

[Pretty Boy]

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Hearts don’t even use the indoor pitch at Oriam. It’s too expensive at about £180 an hour. I don’t think this is a project Brave requirement, it’s just something the management want.


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There is a requirement for 'access to full size indoor facilities'. I think that allows a bit wiggle room in that it doesn't stipulate they must be owned by the club.

Hibs feel it's best to have our own facilities for many of the reasons you highlight above. I think Hearts, Rangers and Celtic all currently fulfil that criteria from the elite group and St Mirren and Forth Valley from the prgressive group.

[Pretty Boy]

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When was the last time we sold a product of our youth academy for £1m though? Fletcher in 2009 from what I can remember.

The fact the club might have been keeping money back from the first team to save money for an indoor pitch isn't any better IMO. £1m is a huge amount of money for our club. It would be better spent on the first team over the next few years.

Hibs spend on EM over the last decade has been pretty minimal. It was kitted out to suit John Collins pretty unconventional views on fitness and conditioning and hasn't really been touched since. An ongoing project to modernise the gym and weight racks is being financed in part by one individual and hibs.net.

If Hibs are spending £1M on a facility that will last decades they must feel it is worth it.

[Speedy]

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When was the last time we sold a product of our youth academy for £1m though? Fletcher in 2009 from what I can remember.

The fact the club might have been keeping money back from the first team to save money for an indoor pitch isn't any better IMO. £1m is a huge amount of money for our club. It would be better spent on the first team over the next few years.

We have 7 (out of 21) players in the first team squad who have came through our youth academy. That's not bad going.

In my opinion we're in the fortunate position where we can invest in both players and infrastructure. The squad is pretty good, need another striker in, a left winger and a midfielder (assuming McGinn goes) but other than that we're strong across the team.