a new challenger approaches

[jacomo]

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They don't circumvent anything. They pay tax on their profits, like any other business.

People get aerated when they look at Amazon's top line.... tens of billions. But that's not what tax is based on.

They do have cross- border charges against profit, which reduces their tax bill. That's where the Government does have a responsibility. Those are the areas that should be legislated for.

Against that, is the argument that Amazon is a major employer in this country, and contributes hugely to the economy through PAYE, NI and VAT. A more aggressive tax regime might persuade them to move elsewhere.

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Sorry but this is total rubbish.

They (and others) are avoiding paying their dues, by exploiting their global reach to thwart national tax regimes.

[jacomo]

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If the government want to tax online retailers then they can do so. Amazon only pay the taxes the govt set.

And Rangers were only using EBTs to be tax efficient. What’s your problem with it?

[CropleyWasGod]

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Sorry but this is total rubbish.

They (and others) are avoiding paying their dues, by exploiting their global reach to thwart national tax regimes.

Which bits are rubbish?

I put two sides of the argument.

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[One Day Soon]

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They don't circumvent anything. They pay tax on their profits, like any other business.

People get aerated when they look at Amazon's top line.... tens of billions. But that's not what tax is based on.

They do have cross- border charges against profit, which reduces their tax bill. That's where the Government does have a responsibility. Those are the areas that should be legislated for.

Against that, is the argument that Amazon is a major employer in this country, and contributes hugely to the economy through PAYE, NI and VAT. A more aggressive tax regime might persuade them to move elsewhere.

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In fact they are spectacularly complicit in allowing people who trade on their platform to play fast and loose with UK tax laws simply because they don't want to scare those traders off the platform due to the amount of revenue they generate for Amazon.

The most obvious example of this - but far from the only one - is an enormous number of 'companies' trading in the UK who are supposed to register for and pay VAT but who simply don't. There are also a large number of similar outfits trading on Amazon with false VAT registration numbers. The overwhelming majority of both of these are based abroad and mainly in one country - you can take a guess at which.

Amazon could confront this (trust me they are EXTREMELY diligent in many other ways about protecting their own interests) but they largely don't. If someone dodgy is turning over in excess of 100k on your platform and paying you a healthy slice of every sale why should you bother that they are both competing unfairly against others and defrauding the tax man?

There are many criticisms that could be made of Amazon and being a gigantic retail platform that seeks to 'own' retail and related commerce while disdaining any social responsibility for preventing the corrupt tax practices of a significant minority of sellers on the platform is a big one for me.

Having a look at the Amazon seller forums is a real eye opener.

[madhibby]

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They don't circumvent anything. They pay tax on their profits, like any other business.

People get aerated when they look at Amazon's top line.... tens of billions. But that's not what tax is based on.

They do have cross- border charges against profit, which reduces their tax bill. That's where the Government does have a responsibility. Those are the areas that should be legislated for.

Against that, is the argument that Amazon is a major employer in this country, and contributes hugely to the economy through PAYE, NI and VAT. A more aggressive tax regime might persuade them to move elsewhere.

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Typical accountant defending crap employers who are excellent at avoiding tax leading to crap public services for the rest of us.

[CropleyWasGod]

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Typical accountant defending crap employers who are excellent at avoiding tax leading to crap public services for the rest of us.

Who is defending them? As I said before, I have put both sides of the argument.

FTR, I avoid using them whenever possible, for exactly the same reason as has already been said. The monopolisation of everything.

No need for the pigeon-holing, either. I do have other jobs

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[WhileTheChief..]

So I’m guessing you guys buy never buy from Nike, Apple, Samsung, etc etc etc.

All global corporations have practices somewhere in the workplace that leave a bad taste. I’m not about to live my life by it though.

We all want decent service and products. Amazon offer a great way to get both in my experience. Of course i can buy from any other online retailer but I’m not about to research their business model before I do!

It’s easier with Amazon. One login that’s always there, a couple of clicks and job done. Returns or complaints sorted instantly. Maybe if others followed suit they would have survived.

[Ozyhibby]

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And Rangers were only using EBTs to be tax efficient. What’s your problem with it?

My problem is with Rangers using dual contracts that were deliberately concealed from the SFA.
It’s two totally different things. My problem with the Rangers case is the SFA allowing them advantages not open to other clubs.
If the SFA dealt with them as fairly as HMRC dealt with them this whole thing would be over by now.


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[CraigHibee]

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Unless you work for them.

i work for them in my spare time and have no complaints

[Northern Hibby]

Does any of this envolve Scottish football?

[Wilson]

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Does any of this envolve Scottish football?

Not directly. Not at this time.

An evolving market for televised football should be of interest to us all though.

Those in charge of getting the best deal for us are hopefully paying very close attention.

[jacomo]

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Which bits are rubbish?

I put two sides of the argument.

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In general, you are exonerating Amazon from any responsibility - ‘they are not circumventing anything’ - and laying the blame at government’s door for failure to collect enough tax.

Yes, government is failing in its duties (as in some many areas) but there is a big structural problem: tax regimes are national, but these supranational companies can employ an army of tax lawyers and accountants to find loopholes and avoid paying tax.

This is what they are doing.

[jacomo]

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My problem is with Rangers using dual contracts that were deliberately concealed from the SFA.
It’s two totally different things. My problem with the Rangers case is the SFA allowing them advantages not open to other clubs.
If the SFA dealt with them as fairly as HMRC dealt with them this whole thing would be over by now.


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The end result is the same.

Rangers used EBTs to give themselves a sporting advantage over their rivals.

Amazon use their scale and multiple subsidiaries in tax havens to create a competitive advantage not available to rival retailers.

In both cases the authorities are failing in their duties, yet you criticise one company and not the other.

[CropleyWasGod]

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In general, you are exonerating Amazon from any responsibility - ‘they are not circumventing anything’ - and laying the blame at government’s door for failure to collect enough tax.

Yes, government is failing in its duties (as in some many areas) but there is a big structural problem: tax regimes are national, but these supranational companies can employ an army of tax lawyers and accountants to find loopholes and avoid paying tax.

This is what they are doing.

I am certainly not exonerating them. I was merely laying out the various arguments.

Did you read my later post about my own attitude towards them?

As an aside, much of the tax issue would have been attacked by new EU-led legislation which is coming into effect next year. However, as I understand it, the UK will no longer be required to implement it post-Brexit.

[Dr Jimmy]

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I run an Amazon store and they are a bloody nightmare. Others saying they offer a great service, alot of the time it's not really them, it's people like myself and Amazon take up most of the profit in any sales I get.

I used to work for a major publishing company and Amazon are easily the worst company we worked with. Constant demands, increase in charges, regular threats and no respect for their suppliers need to cover costs and make money.
The publishing world must rue the day they got into bed with these guys.
The arrow under their logo is from the A to Z and their objectives are to supply everything. I am all for competition, but these guys are out to rule the world and when they do you will see the prices change!!

[andybev1]

I have had a few free one month trials by using a new bank card each time and applying fir a free trial prime account- don't know if it still works . I also used a couple of my partners cards.

[ancient hibee]

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I have had a few free one month trials by using a new bank card each time and applying fir a free trial prime account- don't know if it still works . I also used a couple of my partners cards.

Do you have a harem by any chance?