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  1. #331
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    Quote Originally Posted by ronaldo7 View Post
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    You need to stay off the wacky gear, it does strange things to the mind, so I'm told,

    I'll get round to it sometime, honest. I've had other things to do recently.

    I'm catching up with the frothing from the uber's from time to time though.

    Anyone seen the recent polls?

    Have a nice day.
    Aha so I was right then


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  3. #332
    @hibs.net private member ronaldo7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RyeSloan View Post
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    Aha so I was right then
    😂😂

    I'd have thought the UK gov, stealing our devolved powers, and leading us into uncharted constitutional territory might have been a game changer for you. 😁
    Last edited by ronaldo7; 08-06-2018 at 12:53 PM.

  4. #333
    ADMIN marinello59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ronaldo7 View Post
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    I've been watching the thread deteriorate from a distance. When I get the opportunity to complete the report, I might be able to respond to it.

    I'm sure the discussions at the National assemblies with take the report apart, and we'll have a final position to put to the people of Scotland, when required.

    Meanwhile, I'm waiting on the UK gov coming up with some sort of plan for our future.

    I'm just loving Mr Davies, ripping the PM a new one.

    Anybody seen the polls this morning? 🌞
    Managed to read this report yet?
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  5. #334
    @hibs.net private member Mibbes Aye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marinello59 View Post
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    Managed to read this report yet?
    The IFS did.

    They published their thoughts on it yesterday and said if what we have been living with in the UK is austerity, then an independent Scotland would experience austerity for a further ten years at least. They also said Scottish public spending would be slower to increase than it currently is in the UK.

    They do however come across as balanced and they acknowledged on a number of occasions that it was commendable to try and actually get under the rhetoric and get some projections that were as objective as possible, within all the usual caveats.
    There's only one thing better than a Hibs calendar and that's two Hibs calendars

  6. #335
    ADMIN marinello59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
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    The IFS did.

    They published their thoughts on it yesterday and said if what we have been living with in the UK is austerity, then an independent Scotland would experience austerity for a further ten years at least. They also said Scottish public spending would be slower to increase than it currently is in the UK.

    They do however come across as balanced and they acknowledged on a number of occasions that it was commendable to try and actually get under the rhetoric and get some projections that were as objective as possible, within all the usual caveats.
    It’s a a shame R7 still doesn’t feel qualified to comment on this as he hasn’t read it yet.
    Every gimmick hungry yob,
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    Grabs the mic to tell us,
    He'll die before he's sold.

  7. #336
    @hibs.net private member ronaldo7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marinello59 View Post
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    It’s a a shame R7 still doesn’t feel qualified to comment on this as he hasn’t read it yet.
    I've not, you're correct(for once), I've had too much on my plate lately, but I'll get round to it.

    As you're now responding to my posts, I take it I'm out of the deep freeze. How exciting.
    Last edited by ronaldo7; 16-06-2018 at 07:16 PM.

  8. #337
    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
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    The IFS did.

    They published their thoughts on it yesterday and said if what we have been living with in the UK is austerity, then an independent Scotland would experience austerity for a further ten years at least. They also said Scottish public spending would be slower to increase than it currently is in the UK.

    They do however come across as balanced and they acknowledged on a number of occasions that it was commendable to try and actually get under the rhetoric and get some projections that were as objective as possible, within all the usual caveats.
    Thanks for flagging this. The headline being attached is slightly misleading in that the IFS comment contends that UK austerity has been relaxed to the point where it no longer is austerity and so the GC plan is fiscal tightness but short of austerity also.


  9. #339
    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
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    The IFS did.

    They published their thoughts on it yesterday and said if what we have been living with in the UK is austerity, then an independent Scotland would experience austerity for a further ten years at least. They also said Scottish public spending would be slower to increase than it currently is in the UK.

    They do however come across as balanced and they acknowledged on a number of occasions that it was commendable to try and actually get under the rhetoric and get some projections that were as objective as possible, within all the usual caveats.
    Speaking of caveats, I think it’s also worth noting that any statement like “public spending would be slower to increase than it currently is in the UK” should be caveated by “as long as rUK puts up with the inequitable and disproportionate funding of Scottish public services” which, if the threat of independence recedes, is very far from a given.

  10. #340
    @hibs.net private member cabbageandribs1875's Avatar
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    SNP Bathgate Branch has welcomed 29 new members in the past week, increasing membership to 260
    Last edited by cabbageandribs1875; 21-06-2018 at 11:01 AM.

  11. #341
    Coaching Staff One Day Soon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cabbageandribs1875 View Post
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    SNP Bathgate Branch has welcomed 29 new members in the past week, increasing membership to 260
    Does the SNP still send new members to Branches decided centrally or is it now the case that you're a member of the area you live in?

  12. #342
    @hibs.net private member weecounty hibby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Day Soon View Post
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    Does the SNP still send new members to Branches decided centrally or is it now the case that you're a member of the area you live in?
    Maybe I'm being thick but I don't understand the question. I am certainly a member of my nearest branch. There are another couple close at hand as well though

  13. #343
    Coaching Staff One Day Soon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by weecounty hibby View Post
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    Maybe I'm being thick but I don't understand the question. I am certainly a member of my nearest branch. There are another couple close at hand as well though
    It used to be the case - quite a long time ago - that when you joined the SNP you would fill in your form, pay your membership and once accepted the party would contact you to tell you where you were a member. So if you joined in Edinburgh they could tell you to be a member in, say, Leith or Liberton if those were areas where the local branch needed to build up its membership base and activities on the ground.

    Quite an odd way to do things but also with a fair bit of common sense about it organisationally for campaigning purposes. This was a LONG time ago and I just wondered whether it was still the case, though in the current days of mass membership it really wouldn't make sense any more.

  14. #344
    @hibs.net private member weecounty hibby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Day Soon View Post
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    It used to be the case - quite a long time ago - that when you joined the SNP you would fill in your form, pay your membership and once accepted the party would contact you to tell you where you were a member. So if you joined in Edinburgh they could tell you to be a member in, say, Leith or Liberton if those were areas where the local branch needed to build up its membership base and activities on the ground.

    Quite an odd way to do things but also with a fair bit of common sense about it organisationally for campaigning purposes. This was a LONG time ago and I just wondered whether it was still the case, though in the current days of mass membership it really wouldn't make sense any more.
    Ok, I get you now. Clever strategy to be honest. Really don't know if it still happens but I am definitely in my nearest branch and there is a couple nearby as well that I could have been put if it was still the same. I think that with the number of members and also the number of real activists now I'm not sure the SNP needs to do that anymore

  15. #345
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    Quote Originally Posted by weecounty hibby View Post
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    Ok, I get you now. Clever strategy to be honest. Really don't know if it still happens but I am definitely in my nearest branch and there is a couple nearby as well that I could have been put if it was still the same. I think that with the number of members and also the number of real activists now I'm not sure the SNP needs to do that anymore
    I think they stooped doing it long before the current post- 2014 surge.

  16. #346
    Wouldn't any report regarding separation from the nats be better named the - 'Inevitable Chaos, Division and Meltdown of the Economy with State Bankruptcy'?

    Labour are the re-emerging party that are fighting for social justice, protecting jobs and wages, increasing and assuring benefits across the board in stark contrast to the Snp who will lead us into chaos, division, bankruptcy and poverty never seen before.

    Mon Scottish Labour!

    Last edited by lgnsh70; 22-06-2018 at 10:14 PM.

  17. #347
    @hibs.net private member Moulin Yarns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lgnsh70 View Post
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    Wouldn't any report regarding separation from the nats be better named the - 'Inevitable Chaos, Division and Meltdown of the Economy with State Bankruptcy'?

    Labour are the re-emerging party that are fighting for social justice, protecting jobs and wages, increasing and assuring benefits across the board in stark contrast to the Snp who will lead us into chaos, division, bankruptcy and poverty never seen before.

    Mon Scottish Labour!



    https://yougov.co.uk/news/2017/06/06...26-lab-25-1-5/

    http://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net..._2_website.pdf
    #Persevered
    Scotland can be a beacon, within these islands and beyond, for a socially just and sustainable society. Whilst there are many priorities which will require independence, there is also much that can and must be done now by the Scottish Parliament and the Scottish Government.

  18. #348
    @hibs.net private member Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lgnsh70 View Post
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    Wouldn't any report regarding separation from the nats be better named the - 'Inevitable Chaos, Division and Meltdown of the Economy with State Bankruptcy'?

    Labour are the re-emerging party that are fighting for social justice, protecting jobs and wages, increasing and assuring benefits across the board in stark contrast to the Snp who will lead us into chaos, division, bankruptcy and poverty never seen before.

    Mon Scottish Labour!

    Labour has had many opportunities to do the things you mention in the time they've been in power both in the UK and Scotland.

    They got their ***** kicked in Scotland for not doing anything very much and treating the electorate with contempt. Not to mention the dictatorial attitude they had towards those on the ground delivering their English policies.

    Which was a shame as the SNP has shown that Scotland can be a showcase for alternative ways of doing the same thing.

  19. #349
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    Quote Originally Posted by Golden Fleece View Post
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    That's a year old? We've had a general election since then ...

  20. #350
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    Quote Originally Posted by lgnsh70 View Post
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    Wouldn't any report regarding separation from the nats be better named the - 'Inevitable Chaos, Division and Meltdown of the Economy with State Bankruptcy'?

    Labour are the re-emerging party that are fighting for social justice, protecting jobs and wages, increasing and assuring benefits across the board in stark contrast to the Snp who will lead us into chaos, division, bankruptcy and poverty never seen before.

    Mon Scottish Labour!
    Why do you keep posting these empty sloganizing posts, which contain nothing other than vague unsubstantiated rhetoric? You never answer any questions. Are you trying to bore us into voting Labour? It's not working. (Where have I heard that before?)

  21. #351
    @hibs.net private member The Modfather's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lgnsh70 View Post
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    Wouldn't any report regarding separation from the nats be better named the - 'Inevitable Chaos, Division and Meltdown of the Economy with State Bankruptcy'?

    Labour are the re-emerging party that are fighting for social justice, protecting jobs and wages, increasing and assuring benefits across the board in stark contrast to the Snp who will lead us into chaos, division, bankruptcy and poverty never seen before.

    Mon Scottish Labour!

    As someone without any political allegiances and long disengaged from politics given each party, and the politicians within, are interchangeable as they are all in it for themselves. Your posting style only further re-iterates my disdain for the political landscape that it makes no material difference who is in power.

    I enjoy reading informative and constructive debates from all sides on here as I’d genuinely like to not feel apolitical, but you don’t debate. You just drone on with sound bites and repeat the same things over and over. You aren’t alone in this of course, but your posting style, rather than get me on board for Labour further re-inforces my apolitical view.

    SNP/Labour/Tories etc meh, what difference does it make. The only time I felt engaged was the Indipendebce referendum as that is something that means something to me, even if it is on an emotional level as much as anything else. The SNP might be my best avenue for independence but doesn’t change the fact they are still as interchangeable as all the other self serving parties IMO.

  22. #352
    ADMIN marinello59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
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    Labour has had many opportunities to do the things you mention in the time they've been in power both in the UK and Scotland.

    They got their ***** kicked in Scotland for not doing anything very much and treating the electorate with contempt. Not to mention the dictatorial attitude they had towards those on the ground delivering their English policies.

    Which was a shame as the SNP has shown that Scotland can be a showcase for alternative ways of doing the same thing.
    All of the devolved Goverments since devolution began, no matter which party or grouping that was, have done a decent job. Up until Sturgeon’s SNP that is who are failing on several levels. What radically different way of doing things are they showcasing? Try and do that without listing the ‘free’ stuff.
    They have been in power for ten years now. Labour fell because they took it for granted that the electorate would continue to back them in droves no matter what they did. Much like the SNP and some of their more triumphalist supporters are doing now. Take the independence issue away and the SNP are exposed as a centre right party who are really not much different from any of the others.
    Every gimmick hungry yob,
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  23. #353
    @hibs.net private member Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marinello59 View Post
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    All of the devolved Goverments since devolution began, no matter which party or grouping that was, have done a decent job. Up until Sturgeon’s SNP that is who are failing on several levels. What radically different way of doing things are they showcasing? Try and do that without listing the ‘free’ stuff.
    They have been in power for ten years now. Labour fell because they took it for granted that the electorate would continue to back them in droves no matter what they did. Much like the SNP and some of their more triumphalist supporters are doing now. Take the independence issue away and the SNP are exposed as a centre right party who are really not much different from any of the others.
    Without using free stuff as an example, although it's free, if give you the NHS in Scotland. The policy behind it is quite different from England now and I'd suggest working better for patients.

    When I worked in health, albeit I retired 5 years ago I was having a discussion with a senior medical chap from England. During that discussion he agreed if he was to become ill anywhere in the UK Scotland would be his choice.

    While different parts of the NHS in England compete with each other and the private sector Scotland had a much more collaborative approach. It's not perfect by any means but it is a substantial divergence from the English.
    Space to let

  24. #354
    @hibs.net private member Moulin Yarns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grunt View Post
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    That's a year old? We've had a general election since then ...
    Oops. That's Google for you. :-)
    #Persevered
    Scotland can be a beacon, within these islands and beyond, for a socially just and sustainable society. Whilst there are many priorities which will require independence, there is also much that can and must be done now by the Scottish Parliament and the Scottish Government.

  25. #355
    Quote Originally Posted by marinello59 View Post
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    All of the devolved Goverments since devolution began, no matter which party or grouping that was, have done a decent job. Up until Sturgeon’s SNP that is who are failing on several levels. What radically different way of doing things are they showcasing? Try and do that without listing the ‘free’ stuff.
    They have been in power for ten years now. Labour fell because they took it for granted that the electorate would continue to back them in droves no matter what they did. Much like the SNP and some of their more triumphalist supporters are doing now. Take the independence issue away and the SNP are exposed as a centre right party who are really not much different from any of the others.
    Excellent post.

    The Snp are of course centered around their pivotal issue of separating Scotland from the rest of the UK and are also in my opinion when absent of it are much more in tune with the Tories than they are with either Labour or the Liberal Democrats.

    They really couldn't care less about the poorest in society and the truly disenfranchised.

    Both UK Labour and Scottish Labour now have leaders who do not take the electorate for granted in any shape or form and are working very hard behind the scenes to ensure our fight for jobs and wages, protecting the NHS, growing the economy, increasing benefits and living standards, eradicating homelessness and fighting for social justice across the board among many other very worthwhile causes continues.

    To some Snp leaning separatchiks they may well sound like throwaway slogans, however, to me personally and very probably to millions of other Labour supporters they are Red Flag Labour Party ideals and principles that are well worth fighting for and are always worth reminding folk exactly what we stand and fight for.

    On the other hand the Snp are failing the Scottish electorate and if they ever did get their wish of separation then prepare for abject misery and poverty as the Scottish economy nosedives into chaos and Greek style meltdown among countless other extreme volatile reactions.

    The Snp have lost their mainstream popularity and are on course for their share of the vote to reduce with their number of seats decreasing at future elections while in stark contrast Scottish Labour will be increasing their share of the votes and adding to their number of seats.

    Richard Leonard's Scottish Labour are the party that cares about Scotland and all of its folk within.

    Mon Scottish Labour!


  26. #356
    @hibs.net private member Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lgnsh70 View Post
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    Excellent post.

    The Snp are of course centered around their pivotal issue of separating Scotland from the rest of the UK and are also in my opinion when absent of it are much more in tune with the Tories than they are with either Labour or the Liberal Democrats.

    They really couldn't care less about the poorest in society and the truly disenfranchised.

    Both UK Labour and Scottish Labour now have leaders who do not take the electorate for granted in any shape or form and are working very hard behind the scenes to ensure our fight for jobs and wages, protecting the NHS, growing the economy, increasing benefits and living standards, eradicating homelessness and fighting for social justice across the board among many other very worthwhile causes continues.

    To some Snp leaning separatchiks they may well sound like throwaway slogans, however, to me personally and very probably to millions of other Labour supporters they are Red Flag Labour Party ideals and principles that are well worth fighting for and are always worth reminding folk exactly what we stand and fight for.

    On the other hand the Snp are failing the Scottish electorate and if they ever did get their wish of separation then prepare for abject misery and poverty as the Scottish economy nosedives into chaos and Greek style meltdown among countless other extreme volatile reactions.

    The Snp have lost their mainstream popularity and are on course for their share of the vote to reduce with their number of seats decreasing at future elections while in stark contrast Scottish Labour will be increasing their share of the votes and adding to their number of seats.

    Richard Leonard's Scottish Labour are the party that cares about Scotland and all of its folk within.

    Mon Scottish Labour!

    If you are are what Labour has become then there's no hope. Then again you could be from another political party doing your best to put people off Labour. You're doing a great job!

    Yours sincerely

    Floating socialist.
    Space to let

  27. #357
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
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    If you are are what Labour has become then there's no hope. Then again you could be from another political party doing your best to put people off Labour. You're doing a great job!

    Yours sincerely

    Floating socialist.
    A 'floating socialist' who doesn't recognise or resonate with the core socialist ideals as the ones I referred to - fighting against poverty and inequality, working with trade unions to protect jobs and wages, eradicating homelessness, fighting for social justice, safeguard the NHS, increasing benefits for those out of work and who cannot work etc etc?

    Labour have always been the party of socialism and have two true champions of it in the form of Jeremy Corbyn and Richard Leonard.

    You sound much aligned with the Snp separatchiks who champion austerity and cuts among other capitalist ideals than a real 'floating socialist'.

    If you want to argue or vote for the in my opinion puritan tories in disguise Snp please make your case for them and refrain from snidely pretending your'e a 'floating socialist'.

    Mon Richard Leonard's Scottish Labour!


  28. #358
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
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    Without using free stuff as an example, although it's free, if give you the NHS in Scotland. The policy behind it is quite different from England now and I'd suggest working better for patients.

    When I worked in health, albeit I retired 5 years ago I was having a discussion with a senior medical chap from England. During that discussion he agreed if he was to become ill anywhere in the UK Scotland would be his choice.

    While different parts of the NHS in England compete with each other and the private sector Scotland had a much more collaborative approach. It's not perfect by any means but it is a substantial divergence from the English.
    Let's just hope he never needed any sterilised equipment.

    https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/our-region/edinburgh/eri-cancels-ops-due-to-lack-of-sterilised-equipment-1-4758990/amp?

  29. #359
    @hibs.net private member Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lgnsh70 View Post
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    A 'floating socialist' who doesn't recognise or resonate with the core socialist ideals as the ones I referred to - fighting against poverty and inequality, working with trade unions to protect jobs and wages, eradicating homelessness, fighting for social justice, safeguard the NHS, increasing benefits for those out of work and who cannot work etc etc?

    Labour have always been the party of socialism and have two true champions of it in the form of Jeremy Corbyn and Richard Leonard.

    You sound much aligned with the Snp separatchiks who champion austerity and cuts among other capitalist ideals than a real 'floating socialist'.

    If you want to argue or vote for the in my opinion puritan tories in disguise Snp please make your case for them and refrain from snidely pretending your'e a 'floating socialist'.

    Mon Richard Leonard's Scottish Labour!

    It's a shame Labour in Westminster gave up the fight and side more with Tory policies than they champion the traditional values you speak of. Your list doesn't reflect Labour MPs voting record.

    Has Richard Leonard been properly briefed as to what has been devolved to the Scottish Parliament yet?

    Sort that out and maybe there would be fewer floating socialists wondering what had happened to the party they once followed.
    Space to let

  30. #360
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
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    It's a shame Labour in Westminster gave up the fight and side more with Tory policies than they champion the traditional values you speak of. Your list doesn't reflect Labour MPs voting record.

    Has Richard Leonard been properly briefed as to what has been devolved to the Scottish Parliament yet?

    Sort that out and maybe there would be fewer floating socialists wondering what had happened to the party they once followed.
    Yet again as is the normal for the Snp separatchiks they simply won't be drawn into attempting to defend their party.

    The Snp are a party of failure and will destroy the Scottish economy and lots more if they ever get their wish that is to break up the UK.

    I doubt they ever will due to their being an inward looking, secretive and regressive party that is sending the message out to its supporters to say as little as possible and put the boot into any other party and its supporters in the hope that'll be enough to drag separation over the line while at the same time deceiving the Scottish folk.

    The Snp separatists would deceive the Scottish folk into separation while in the knowledge it would undoubtedly mean severe austerity and cuts while increasing poverty and much anxiety among the poorest in Scotland for generations to come.

    We in Labour on the other hand have no problem in voicing our strongest objections to tory like Snp austerity and cuts and Greek style meltdown and chaos of the Scottish economy if the separatchiks ever got their separatist wishes.

    We believe in our core socialist ideals and principle of fighting austerity and inequality, eradicating homelessness, protecting the NHS and working with the Trade Unions to fight for jobs and wages while actively seeking to increase benefits for those who're not in work and cannot work while being part of the shared risk UK.

    In stark contrast the Snp are growing ever more secretively unresponsive to making a case for their singular chaos theory of separatism and getting busy putting the boot into those other honest party supporters who feel able to make a case for their own socialist party credentials who continue to fight for the oppressed and against austerity, cuts and chaos in general.

    Mon Scottish Labour!


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