hibs.net Messageboard

Page 4 of 10 FirstFirst ... 23456 ... LastLast
Results 91 to 120 of 293
  1. #91
    Davidson does need brought down a peg or 12, the "What am I like?!?!" act that the Scottish media laps up is badly needing a take down.

    Hopefully when she starts the next career move down south she'll get found out, the cuddly act won't get her over with the South of England lot.


  2. Log in to remove the advert

  3. #92
    @hibs.net private member Mibbes Aye's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    11,065
    Quote Originally Posted by SouthsideHarp_Bhoy View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I was told fairly recently by someone who used to work for the SNP that they, and many others within the party, see the National as extreme, and representing the loony wing of the pro-Indy movement too much.

    It's almost as if it has become a mirror image of the very pro-union rags these people railed against, like the Mail.

    It's a shame, because a serious, pro-indy daily would have been no bad thing.


    The pro-indy movement is crying out for someone or something that can make an intellectual argument for its case rather than emotive, inward-looking tirades based on false and contrived differentiation.
    There's only one thing better than a Hibs calendar and that's two Hibs calendars

  4. #93
    @hibs.net private member snooky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Down East
    Posts
    12,130
    Blog Entries
    4
    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote


    The pro-indy movement is crying out for someone or something that can make an intellectual argument for its case rather than emotive, inward-looking tirades based on false and contrived differentiation.
    TBH, I think all parties are lacking a leader with charisma and (perceived) honesty & integrity.
    The first party to find such a person is on a home run.

  5. #94
    @hibs.net private member Mibbes Aye's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    11,065
    Quote Originally Posted by snooky View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    TBH, I think all parties are lacking a leader with charisma and (perceived) honesty & integrity.
    The first party to find such a person is on a home run.
    Yeah, I think there are two arguments here.

    One is about making a plausible case for policy - I don't think anyone is doing that, at the moment. It's a massive failure.

    Second is the charisma point you've highlighted. I can't conceive the circumstances in which I would vote Conservative, but Davidson stands miles higher than any of the other Scottish party leaders and probably the UK leaders.

    Not everyone will agree with that but it doesn't need everyone to agree with it. If she keeps ploughing a furrow of Iain Macleod one-nation Toryism while making it contemporary, then she will hoover up votes.

    There was a time when the Tories would struggle to be more favourable than the NF or BNP in Scotland. She's changed that.
    There's only one thing better than a Hibs calendar and that's two Hibs calendars

  6. #95
    Testimonial Due Glory Lurker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Miles from in the know
    Posts
    2,497
    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

    Not everyone will agree with that but it doesn't need everyone to agree with it. If she keeps ploughing a furrow of Iain Macleod one-nation Toryism while making it contemporary, then she will hoover up votes.

    There was a time when the Tories would struggle to be more favourable than the NF or BNP in Scotland. She's changed that.
    Thankfully there is little evidence that she is hoovering up any more votes than she did last year, indeed there’s a suggestion in polling over the last few months that she’s lost some of that.

    Your second paragraph there is a bit extreme.

  7. #96
    @hibs.net private member snooky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Down East
    Posts
    12,130
    Blog Entries
    4
    Quote Originally Posted by snooky View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Come on Fluffy, let's see those broad shoulders of support we were all promised.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...tland-44316580

    And to follow up my original post above....
    https://wingsoverscotland.com/a-whif...y/#more-103843

    Try fluffing this one off, Mundell.

  8. #97
    @hibs.net private member Mibbes Aye's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    11,065
    Quote Originally Posted by Glory Lurker View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Thankfully there is little evidence that she is hoovering up any more votes than she did last year, indeed there’s a suggestion in polling over the last few months that she’s lost some of that.

    Your second paragraph there is a bit extreme.
    I'm not sure how old you are but there was a period through the late-eighties to the early and mid-nineties where the Tories declined massively in support in Scotland culminating in them having no seats after the 1997 election.

    At that time you could understand that there were people who would back extremist and racist groups like NF or the BNP, there will always be people like that. But understanding why people would vote Conservative was near on impossible. It was a failing administration that had inflicted policies that had no traction whatsoever and encouraged civil protest.

    Tories were toxic for a long, long time. Davidson, and in fairness Goldie, have brought them back into the game. It's foolish not to pretend that isn't so.

    I was going to leave it there but as a further gambit - this isn't a partisan point - I suspect the Scottish electorate is innately 'conservative', note the small 'c'.

    Who has the most appeal?
    There's only one thing better than a Hibs calendar and that's two Hibs calendars

  9. #98
    Testimonial Due Glory Lurker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Miles from in the know
    Posts
    2,497
    Sadly very much old enough to remember the 80s, Mibbes Aye

    Even in 97 the Tory vote iirc was in the low 20s (in fact not much less than Davidson’s “triumphant” high water mark). There is no comparison to BNP and NF.

  10. #99
    @hibs.net private member Mibbes Aye's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    11,065
    Quote Originally Posted by Glory Lurker View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Sadly very much old enough to remember the 80s, Mibbes Aye

    Even in 97 the Tory vote iirc was in the low 20s (in fact not much less than Davidson’s “triumphant” high water mark). There is no comparison to BNP and NF.
    That's not really answering my point.

    The Tories were absolutely toxic for a long, long time in Scotland. Whatever your view of Davidson, she has made them a serious player in the political process.
    There's only one thing better than a Hibs calendar and that's two Hibs calendars

  11. #100
    Testimonial Due Glory Lurker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Miles from in the know
    Posts
    2,497
    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    That's not really answering my point.

    The Tories were absolutely toxic for a long, long time in Scotland. Whatever your view of Davidson, she has made them a serious player in the political process.
    You suggested that the Tories were down there with BNP and NF in acceptability with the Scottish electorate. You and me both know that’s not remotely right.

    Obviously I can’t argue that the Tories have made constituency gains under Davidson. Still less MPs than 1987 with only a few percent more of the vote compared with the 1997 wipeout. Serious player? As much as the leader of an opposition party with no chance of government whatsoever could be, I suppose.
    Last edited by Glory Lurker; 03-06-2018 at 12:22 AM. Reason: Events, dear boy. Events.

  12. #101
    @hibs.net private member snooky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Down East
    Posts
    12,130
    Blog Entries
    4
    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I'm not sure how old you are but there was a period through the late-eighties to the early and mid-nineties where the Tories declined massively in support in Scotland culminating in them having no seats after the 1997 election.

    At that time you could understand that there were people who would back extremist and racist groups like NF or the BNP, there will always be people like that. But understanding why people would vote Conservative was near on impossible. It was a failing administration that had inflicted policies that had no traction whatsoever and encouraged civil protest.

    Tories were toxic for a long, long time. Davidson, and in fairness Goldie, have brought them back into the game. It's foolish not to pretend that isn't so.

    I was going to leave it there but as a further gambit - this isn't a partisan point - I suspect the Scottish electorate is innately 'conservative', note the small 'c'.

    Who has the most appeal?
    Never been a Tory fan however, I have a lot of respect for Annabel Goldie.

  13. #102
    Quote Originally Posted by RyeSloan View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Bloodless ghouls? The article is so full of petty and rather childish descriptions of ‘Tories’ that it’s almost impossible to take any of the rest of it seriously.

    I’m sure there is plenty of examination the National could do on Ruth and the Scottish Conservatives policies but it should really try and do so without littering it’s articles with tawdry insults and name calling...they never know it might help the reader to think that the article was at least half based on an objective view.
    Any opinion on Ruth Davidson then?

  14. #103
    A serious player 😂😂😂

  15. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by SouthsideHarp_Bhoy View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I was told fairly recently by someone who used to work for the SNP that they, and many others within the party, see the National as extreme, and representing the loony wing of the pro-Indy movement too much.

    It's almost as if it has become a mirror image of the very pro-union rags these people railed against, like the Mail.

    It's a shame, because a serious, pro-indy daily would have been no bad thing.
    "These people"?

  16. #105
    Quote Originally Posted by SouthsideHarp_Bhoy View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I was told fairly recently by someone who used to work for the SNP that they, and many others within the party, see the National as extreme, and representing the loony wing of the pro-Indy movement too much.

    It's almost as if it has become a mirror image of the very pro-union rags these people railed against, like the Mail.

    It's a shame, because a serious, pro-indy daily would have been no bad thing.
    "These people"?

  17. #106
    johnbc70
    Left by mutual consent!
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Grieves View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    "These people"?
    The loony lefties?

  18. #107
    @hibs.net private member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Edinburgh
    Posts
    8,863
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Grieves View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Any opinion on Ruth Davidson then?
    Aye, a bit of a blaw bag that’s reasonably good at campaigning, has her party under control and has fashioned a half decent reputation in political circles as well as knowing how to resonate with a good chunk of the electorate.

    As for her policies, they seem a bit of a hotch potch, some I’m mildly supportive of, others not so but then I struggle with all main parties policies so that’s probably my feelings to most of them (apart from Corbyn and McDonald where I’m probably pretty far removed from their main direction of travel)

    What I can do though is look at a parties policies and at least try to make an objective assessment of them without immediately resorting to name calling and desperately trying to paint any member of the party as ‘loonies’ or ‘dinosaurs’ or ‘ghouls’

  19. #108
    Quote Originally Posted by RyeSloan View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Aye, a bit of a blaw bag that’s reasonably good at campaigning, has her party under control and has fashioned a half decent reputation in political circles as well as knowing how to resonate with a good chunk of the electorate.

    As for her policies, they seem a bit of a hotch potch, some I’m mildly supportive of, others not so but then I struggle with all main parties policies so that’s probably my feelings to most of them (apart from Corbyn and McDonald where I’m probably pretty far removed from their main direction of travel)

    What I can do though is look at a parties policies and at least try to make an objective assessment of them without immediately resorting to name calling and desperately trying to paint any member of the party as ‘loonies’ or ‘dinosaurs’ or ‘ghouls’
    Fair play. I don't think the article was over the top with regards to name calling, but I'm not particularly objective when it comes to Ruth Davidson.

  20. #109
    @hibs.net private member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Edinburgh
    Posts
    8,863
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Grieves View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Fair play. I don't think the article was over the top with regards to name calling, but I'm not particularly objective when it comes to Ruth Davidson.
    Ha ha fair enough...the article was probably written for you then! It even calls her a ‘shameless charlatan’ in the headline so starts off by calling her names right at the start, it then continues to be rather derogatory to her and the members of her party throughout.

    As I said such articles are not gonna be taken with any weight by people not already on board with such things, which while probably right up your street, doesn’t to me at least, do much to further the conversation or indeed persuade me that the side calling the other one names is any more likely to be trusted or believed than the target of the article.

  21. #110
    Testimonial Due Stranraer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    1,142
    Blog Entries
    6
    My Dad buys The National and there was a letter in it the last week that said the newspaper was bumming up to the extreme indy supporters. I know a few Scottish nationalists who still buy The Herald, even though it's a Unionist paper.

  22. #111
    Coaching Staff heretoday's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Corstorphine
    Posts
    10,505
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Grieves View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Any opinion on Ruth Davidson then?
    She's taking a lot on herself. When she gets down to Westminster (which she will have to do) she'll get blown out of the water by the mysterious types around there.

  23. #112
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Grieves View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Any opinion on Ruth Davidson then?
    Good at the media/pr bit, as you’d expect from a former news tv person. Has capitalised on the single issue anti-indy platform to make the tories somewhat relevant.

    I’m far from convinced there’s any substance to her beyond that though. Her policy positions have flip flopped all over the place. Starting from the “line in the sand” that got washed over in minutes.

  24. #113
    @hibs.net private member snooky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Down East
    Posts
    12,130
    Blog Entries
    4
    On the subject of Ruth Davidson.
    I see there's a new book out where it is claiming she was "****ing furious" regarding the No campaigners release of "The Vow".
    This screams of the wee boy that shouts "It wisny me, honest. A big boy did it an ran away."
    What a pathetic attempt to wriggle her out of the biggest lie of the whole Indy1 campaign - and there are a load of whoppers to choose from.

  25. #114
    Testimonial Due Colr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    London
    Age
    51
    Posts
    2,785
    Quote Originally Posted by heretoday View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    She's taking a lot on herself. When she gets down to Westminster (which she will have to do) she'll get blown out of the water by the mysterious types around there.
    Neither of the people who look vaguely promising as future leaders are MPs. One is Ruth Davidson the other David Milliband.

    We’re stuck with the current crop of disconnected dotards for a while.

    (i was trying to come up with an alternative LibDem but couldn’t!)

  26. #115
    Coaching Staff heretoday's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Corstorphine
    Posts
    10,505
    Quote Originally Posted by Colr View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Neither of the people who look vaguely promising as future leaders are MPs. One is Ruth Davidson the other David Milliband.

    We’re stuck with the current crop of disconnected dotards for a while.

    (i was trying to come up with an alternative LibDem but couldn’t!)
    I dunno. Willie Rennie's a decent sort.

  27. #116
    @hibs.net private member Bristolhibby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Chippenham/Bath
    Age
    38
    Posts
    4,882
    Quote Originally Posted by snooky View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    And to follow up my original post above....
    https://wingsoverscotland.com/a-whif...y/#more-103843

    Try fluffing this one off, Mundell.
    That’s scandalous. First that it happened, and second that the exact opposite of blame is being apportioned.

    However, what do you expect.

    Wake up Peeps!

    J

  28. #117
    Quote Originally Posted by RyeSloan View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Ha ha fair enough...the article was probably written for you then! It even calls her a ‘shameless charlatan’ in the headline so starts off by calling her names right at the start, it then continues to be rather derogatory to her and the members of her party throughout.

    As I said such articles are not gonna be taken with any weight by people not already on board with such things, which while probably right up your street, doesn’t to me at least, do much to further the conversation or indeed persuade me that the side calling the other one names is any more likely to be trusted or believed than the target of the article.
    Here's one from Mandy Rhodes, the editor of "Holyrood" magazine (which aiui, is a fairly neutral source?)

    http://www.holyrood.com/articles/com...-her-own-party

    Essentially makes much the same points without the vitriol.

  29. #118
    Coaching Staff One Day Soon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    In hope
    Age
    54
    Posts
    7,915
    Quote Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Here's one from Mandy Rhodes, the editor of "Holyrood" magazine (which aiui, is a fairly neutral source?)

    http://www.holyrood.com/articles/com...-her-own-party

    Essentially makes much the same points without the vitriol.

    Mandy Rhodes is very far from being regarded as neutral by most non SNP people.

  30. #119
    Quote Originally Posted by One Day Soon View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Mandy Rhodes is very far from being regarded as neutral by most non SNP people.
    Ah ok, I (genuinely) didn't know that. Maybe just a more polite version of the same article then. It rings pretty true to me but I'm not exactly neutral when it comes to Tories, even opportunistically centrist ones.

  31. #120
    Private Members Prediction League Winner Hibrandenburg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Brandenburg
    Age
    53
    Posts
    10,245
    Tory blocks new bill to counter growing perv problem.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/uk-politics-44496427

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
hibs.net ©2012 All Rights Reserved