Application for leave is, broadly speaking, a guaranteed payday for solicitors...albeit a lot less than it used to be.This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
I wouldn't read too much into the decision to apply.
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26-11-2017 08:49 AM #31This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
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26-11-2017 10:12 AM #32
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26-11-2017 07:40 PM #33This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
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26-11-2017 08:01 PM #34This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
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26-11-2017 08:12 PM #35
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Apologies mate if you were offended, that wasnt my intention. And i agree, that its probably best to leave it there.
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26-11-2017 08:19 PM #36This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
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26-11-2017 09:52 PM #37This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show QuoteThis quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show QuoteHIBERNIAN F.C. - SCOTTISH CUP WINNERS 2016
21.05.2016
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27-11-2017 08:01 AM #38This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
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27-11-2017 10:47 AM #39
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27-11-2017 01:05 PM #40This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
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27-11-2017 02:11 PM #41
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04-12-2017 08:57 PM #42
Shaun Woodburn's mother has just posted on Facebook that they've lost their case to lodge an appeal against the sentence and the four years imprisonment will stand.
Absolute disgrace.HIBERNIAN F.C. - SCOTTISH CUP WINNERS 2016
21.05.2016
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05-12-2017 01:12 AM #43This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
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05-12-2017 01:54 AM #44This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
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05-12-2017 04:20 AM #45This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
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05-12-2017 06:18 AM #46This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
I see this link confirms the Crown can only appeal a sentence if it is viewed as “unduly lenient”. Of course many are saying that this one is, however I imagine the “unduly” means it is a very high bar to get to, and as noted at the link below, such appeals are rare as a result. It can’t really be any other way as I imagine that the vast majority of victims families would view sentences as lenient and we’d have appeals going in every time if it was easy to do.
http://www.gov.scot/Publications/2004/12/20339/47562#13
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05-12-2017 03:34 PM #47
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Thats the nub - there is no sentence that will adeqautely compensate the families of victims of such crimes.
Thr justice system is imperfect, but not as imperfect as trial by social media would be.Last edited by SouthsideHarp_Bhoy; 06-12-2017 at 06:25 AM.
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05-12-2017 03:45 PM #48This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
Totally agree with you, its an absolute disgrace.
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05-12-2017 03:53 PM #49
wow, what a lesson this young thug has learned eh, take someones life and the punishment is basically a 2 year stint behind bars, no doubt the piece of utter s**t will have his name appear in the papers again in a couple of years time
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05-12-2017 04:04 PM #50This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
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05-12-2017 08:31 PM #52This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote"If a player is not interfering with play or seeking to gain
an advantage, then he should be."
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05-12-2017 09:39 PM #53This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
In my mind something like this should carry a sentence of between 8-10 years imprisonment.
Sentencing guidelines or whatever it is really needs to be looked at if it's deemed appropriate for someone to be handed a 4 year prison sentence for attacking someone in an unprovoked attack and then kicking them in the head whilst they are on the ground and they're unconscious.
There's something seriously wrong with a system that allows such a sentence to be handed down.HIBERNIAN F.C. - SCOTTISH CUP WINNERS 2016
21.05.2016
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05-12-2017 10:48 PM #54This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
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05-12-2017 10:54 PM #55This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
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06-12-2017 12:30 AM #56This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
Given all of the assaults occurred in the course of one night, it was never likely to be cumulative in this case.
Also, I haven't been able to find precise details of what happened in this case - did the deceased come out of the pub and fight with the perpetrator?
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06-12-2017 01:06 AM #57This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
The age of the offender I bet will have played a part too. As someone under 18, courts are reluctant to send these people to prison for long stretches, because there is still a chance for them to actually become a useful member of society. Apparently the brain is not fully developed until 25 years old. The longer you send a youth to prison for, the more likely they are to become a hardened criminal and go back to prison time and time again.
I know that some people won't care about that, and of course the victim's family will not, but society in general should prefer a system where someone is actually rehabilitated (at least to an extent) and not costing the taxpayers thousands / millions of pounds by keeping them in prison constantly.
In summary, it appears a light sentence in terms of the consequences of what happened, but I wonder how many people on here have punched someone (under any circumstances)? Imagine that person had, as a result, fallen backwards and hit their head and died? Clearly the intent was not to kill the person. Intent is an important thing in law and when intent cannot be proven (acting like a total fud and starting fights is not the same as intent to kill someone), as it couldn't in this case, then you can't just start dishing out life sentences or the like.
Research also suggests that the deterrent effect of longer sentences is largely mythical too. Given that this guy wasn't out to kill anyone, does anyone believe that the prospect of an 8-10 year sentence for culpable homicide would've deterred him from doing what he actually did that night?
Most actual murders are in the heat of the moment and the resultant sentence of life is clearly no deterrent. People talk about US sentencing being the way to go - even the death penalty doesn't act as a deterrent there. Certainly deters that person from murdering again, but does not deter others from doing exactly the same thing.
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06-12-2017 01:47 PM #58This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
From what I've read on here in posts where people have explained why the feel the sentence was unduly lenient, the actions of the killer in the hours preceding the fatal attack play a big part. I don't disagree that intent is important in law, but even to be convicted of murder, it does not have to be shown that you intended to kill.
Part of me wonders, if the killer's representatives are successful in their appeal and a retrial is ordered, whether COPFS may decide to proceed with the retrial on a charge of murder. It's very unlikely for a variety of reasons, but I wouldn't entirely rule it out.
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06-12-2017 08:14 PM #59This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
I think a 4 year prison sentence is far too lenient in cases like this where someone has lost their life, regardless of any previous cases or whether or not there was an intent to kill.
The part about brains not being fully developed until 25, whilst it may be true, it is not something I buy into at all as being a reason to give him a shorter sentence. Someone at 17 years of age knows the possible consequences of punching someone in the head, another 8 years of cognitive development won't have helped him to become a responsible human being.
My main concern is protecting innocent people from dangerous people like this and the only way that can be guaranteed is by having them locked up for a longer period of time.HIBERNIAN F.C. - SCOTTISH CUP WINNERS 2016
21.05.2016
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07-12-2017 12:29 AM #60This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
For sentences to go upwards, a change in the law would be required. So, if you want that, then you can vote for a party who vows to be "tough on crime" at the next election. However, what usually happens is one or two cases that are heavily publicised for one reason or another come up, and the public perception is still that we are "too soft" while having extremely limited knowledge of the system.
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