Hibernian FC's response to SFA rejection of an Independent Review....HSA meeting...

[Ozyhibby]

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As summed up on this thread in general, most folks seem to not be happy unless they have something to whinge about

You would think the club was in a bloody mess with an awful team playing eye bleeding football with a disastrous stadium redevelopment on their hands the way some folks moan....

I think the word supporter needs to be banished and something more accurate used...

I’ve been vocal on this subject since 2012 and since then Hibs have been in all sorts of trouble and the club has been disgracefully run and been relegated. During those times it was always ‘we should concentrate on making Hibs better’ or ‘this is a time for Hibs fans to be coming together’ rather than asking that the game as a whole be cleaned up. For some people it’s just never the right time.
This is a live issue right now. We are trying our hardest to gain a euro spot for next season and one of our biggest competitors for a spot is buying in players using offshore funds. This is focusing on Hibs.
If the club, as has been reported, are trying to build consensus for FFP then it’s time they came out publicly and said so. If it’s about moving on and focusing on the future then let’s hear what Hibs want that future to be.


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[Baldy Foghorn]

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From their latest update -

Good statement

[Nakedmanoncrack]

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As said above, the clubs are the governing body. And our chairman is one of its key henchmen.

And his fingerprints are all over this, yet people want to protect him from proper scrutiny.

[Ozyhibby]

Question for Traceyhibs.
What are the clubs views on introducing Financial FairPlay Rules to Scottish Football?


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[GordonHFC]

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My opinion
They are our reps first and foremost and their only role is to represent the supporters views/feelings to the board and on a divided topic then the majority should win the day and the reps have to put that forward and should also vote that way when required. They are not there to go against the wishes of the majority of supporters regardless of whatever "secret information"they may be privy to. This correct action would not have changed the outcome of the vote but the vote would not then have been unanimous. They are not elected members of Parliament who get manipulated by their party machine, they have one mandate only which is to represent the views of the supporters and as I said earlier if there is dissension among the support on any subject matter then a vote/poll must take place and the majority would prevail.
If, as you think, they are morally/legally bound to support the board if they personally feel it is for the good of the club then they simply become traditional board members and could then no longer be described as representing the supporters. There will be much more posted on this topic come election time!

[givescotlandfreedom]

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Our group of four, who have twice now missed out on Tynie tickets through not being able to queue or hog computers while working, are pretty angry at the loyalty points fiasco. There's plenty like us I'm sure.

Yes there are. Four of us missed out then pit of desperation to get were fleeced in the 'corporate' offer for it. The bus didn't even take you back to ER.

[mcohibs]

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Hibs club holds a couple of hundred, we have 13000 STs - although I appreciate all would not want to attend, it couldn't possibly be a free for all.

Why would a free for all be the only alternative? They could have had a limited number of spaces available that could be assigned on a first come first served basis to ST holders. Say your name and show your card on the door. IMO selling out the Hibs club would have strengthened the argument and possibly added to the level of questioning directed at the board.

[green day]

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If, as you think, they are morally/legally bound to support the board if they personally feel it is for the good of the club then they simply become traditional board members and could then no longer be described as representing the supporters. There will be much more posted on this topic come election time!

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However, they are also board members and as such will be party to decisions which cant be run by the entire support. So then their role is to do what they think is best with the information available to them - they cant run the club by referendum.

Have a look at mine again - I didnt say they were morally or legally bound to support the board - I said they were part of the board, and that at times they need to do what they think is best.

I say again, if you or any of the others with strong views dont like what they are doing, its simply resolved - stand yourself using this issue, and if there is the right level of support then you will be elected.

Its piss easy to snipe from the woods.

[green day]

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Why would a free for all be the only alternative? They could have had a limited number of spaces available that could be assigned on a first come first served basis to ST holders. Say your name and show your card on the door. IMO selling out the Hibs club would have strengthened the argument and possibly added to the level of questioning directed at the board.

I didnt say it was the only alternative, I was responding to someone who asked why HSA made it members only.

[WhileTheChief..]

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Absolutely. We have one of our own in the upper echelons at the SFA, with all of the supposed benefits that brings us. At a time when the recent poll shows the vast majority have no faith in those running the game or their governance. This whole sorry affair does nothing to change that perception IMO.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.bbc...tball/41904600

“Both organisations also rated poorly for levels of "openness, honesty and trust" and "good governance and transparency". That sums up my feelings on all of this, of which Hibs appear to be as complicit as everyone else. Lots of good work done by Hibs recently, but a definite sour taste left on this front.

That survey could have been done at any time in the last 100 years and the response would be the same.

When does anybody ever praise a governing body of anything?!

[mcohibs]

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I didnt say it was the only alternative, I was responding to someone who asked why HSA made it members only.

Yes I asked why it was members only - your response to which was that due to the size of the HIbs club and the number of ST holders, they couldn't possibly have made it a free for all. They could however have allocated slots to a certain number of ST holders

[hibbymac]

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Question for Traceyhibs.
What are the clubs views on introducing Financial FairPlay Rules to Scottish Football?


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"Our club is pushing for consensus in the Scottish game to get financial fair play in Scotland" .... Don't know if that answers your question but it is in post 104 on this thread.

[Spike Mandela]

So did anyone at the meeting give a good reason why they rejected an independent review other than the mantra “ feeling it was time to move on”?

I see no good reason why anybody would reject this other than covering up misdeeds they know about or protecting other peoples action which may be uncomfortable viewing for some or because of some pressure from others.

As for Hibs pushing for FFP in Scotland I was astonished that this wasn’t already in place.

In a few years when perhaps Hibs fortunes are on the downturn again but Rangers have been restored to their happy duopoly in cahoots with the corrupt SFA riding roughshod over the rest of the league I doubt so many of our Hibs family will be happy we just ‘moved on’.

All that is required for evil to flourish is for good men to do nothing.

[marinello59]

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So did anyone at the meeting give a good reason why they rejected an independent review other than the mantra “ feeling it was time to move on”?

I see no good reason why anybody would reject this other than covering up misdeeds they know about or protecting other peoples action which may be uncomfortable viewing for some or because of some pressure from others.

As for Hibs pushing for FFP in Scotland I was astonished that this wasn’t already in place.

In a few years when perhaps Hibs fortunes are on the downturn again but Rangers have been restored to their happy duopoly in cahoots with the corrupt SFA riding roughshod over the rest of the league I doubt so many of our Hibs family will be happy we just ‘moved on’.

All that is required for evil to flourish is for good men to do nothing.

Legal advice?
If people are serious about taking this forward then thats where the starting point is, a group of fans of all clubs getting together and obtaining their own legal counsel. It's much easier to moan at our own club though rather than actually do something.

[CockneyRebel]

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I don't disagree, but could they possibly know what the majority of fans think?

If you read all of my post you will see that a poll/vote would be needed for contentious issues to determine the majority view. Maybe longwinded but democratic. If we don't do these things properly then there is no point to the position of supporters rep.

[Ozyhibby]

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"Our club is pushing for consensus in the Scottish game to get financial fair play in Scotland" .... Don't know if that answers your question but it is in post 104 on this thread.

I had read that, which is why I asked. I’d like the club to put a bit more meat on the bones of that by saying what it is we are striving for and also I’d like us to say publicly what it is we want. That way we can see which clubs want to stand against Financial FairPlay.
I can get behind ‘moving on’ if I can see that it’s unlikely to happen again but the sad fact is that it is happening right now. There needs to be change and it needs to come from the clubs. I’d like to know what we are doing about it.


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[CockneyRebel]

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Have a look at mine again - I didnt say they were morally or legally bound to support the board - I said they were part of the board, and that at times they need to do what they think is best.

I say again, if you or any of the others with strong views dont like what they are doing, its simply resolved - stand yourself using this issue, and if there is the right level of support then you will be elected.

Its piss easy to snipe from the woods.

That first bit is just so wrong. Their mandate is to offer our views to the board for the board's consideration. If there is a vote they vote for our view - simples. It may not make any difference to many votes as they are outnumbered, but they will have shown the board what the supporters think/want. In this instanceI feel the board were manipulative, stressing "it's best for the good of the club" angle which perhaps clouded the reps' judgement.


I'm 71 now and don't get about as well as I used to. No need for the second bit.

[Spike Mandela]

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Legal advice?
If people are serious about taking this forward then thats where the starting point is, a group of fans of all clubs getting together and obtaining their own legal counsel. It's much easier to moan at our own club though rather than actually do something.

Legal advice is merely an opinion which is financially rewarded by one side.

Another lawyer, judge or jury may of course have a different opinion.

[green day]

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[/B]


That first bit is just so wrong. Their mandate is to offer our views to the board for the board's consideration. If there is a vote they vote for our view - simples. It may not make any difference to many votes as they are outnumbered, but they will have shown the board what the supporters think/want. In this instanceI feel the board were manipulative, stressing "it's best for the good of the club" angle which perhaps clouded their judgement.


I'm 71 now and don't get about as well as I used to. No need for the second bit.

I think some people on here don't quite understand what it means for the fans reps to be part of the board.

The second part was a general observation that it's easy to criticise, more difficult to put your own head on the block.

Perhaps the fans rep experiment has run its course, you'd be mental to want this grief.

[CockneyRebel]

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I think some people on here don't quite understand what it means for the fans reps to be part of the board.

The second part was a general observation that it's easy to criticise, more difficult to put your own head on the block.

Perhaps the fans rep experiment has run its course, you'd be mental to want this grief.

Your'e right there pal.

[marinello59]

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I had read that, which is why I asked. I’d like the club to put a bit more meat on the bones of that by saying what it is we are striving for and also I’d like us to say publicly what it is we want. That way we can see which clubs want to stand against Financial FairPlay.
I can get behind ‘moving on’ if I can see that it’s unlikely to happen again but the sad fact is that it is happening right now. There needs to be change and it needs to come from the clubs. I’d like to know what we are doing about it.


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What are you doing about it? If you think the club is part of the problem then it makes no sense to look to them for the solution.

[CockneyRebel]

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So did anyone at the meeting give a good reason why they rejected an independent review other than the mantra “ feeling it was time to move on”?

I see no good reason why anybody would reject this other than covering up misdeeds they know about or protecting other peoples action which may be uncomfortable viewing for some or because of some pressure from others.

As for Hibs pushing for FFP in Scotland I was astonished that this wasn’t already in place.

In a few years when perhaps Hibs fortunes are on the downturn again but Rangers have been restored to their happy duopoly in cahoots with the corrupt SFA riding roughshod over the rest of the league I doubt so many of our Hibs family will be happy we just ‘moved on’.


All that is required for evil to flourish is for good men to do nothing.

Or stick their heads in the sand or pull political strokes or manipulate fans' reps.

[worcesterhibby]

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Absolutely. We have one of our own in the upper echelons at the SFA, with all of the supposed benefits that brings us. At a time when the recent poll shows the vast majority have no faith in those running the game or their governance. This whole sorry affair does nothing to change that perception IMO.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.bbc...tball/41904600

“Both organisations also rated poorly for levels of "openness, honesty and trust" and "good governance and transparency". That sums up my feelings on all of this, of which Hibs appear to be as complicit as everyone else. Lots of good work done by Hibs recently, but a definite sour taste left on this front.

I don't necessarily disagree that Scottish Football Governance is in need of reform. However I would ask one question..can you find me anywhere on the web where a widely distributed poll has been conducted into the governing body for a sport and the result has been that the majority think they are doing a great job ?

In my working life, I work for a sporting Governing Body in England by the way, so maybe that's why I tend to look at things from the other direction.

[Hibs90]

So the fans reps spoke to some fans, read some views on forums/social media and made their conclusions from that. I'm not having a go at the reps but that is just poor. They should have went about it much more thoroughly than they did. Polls, E-mails, Letters to those who can't access other things etc. I'm pretty sure everybody does want to move on from this saga but this just reeks of 'brushing it under the carpet' moving on instead of getting answers and then moving on.

[JoeB]

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Frank can't stand again anyway, so that will keep you happy I assume.....

Best news of the week.Waste of space.

[Baldy Foghorn]

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Best news of the week.Waste of space.

Constructive first post. Well done.....

[Mikey]

Are we going to get a run down of what happened last night then or not

[Golden Bear]

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Are we going to get a run down of what happened last night then or not

Facebook is the place apparently. Maybe some kind soul will copy and paste it.

[Firestarter]

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So the fans reps spoke to some fans, read some views on forums/social media and made their conclusions from that. I'm not having a go at the reps but that is just poor. They should have went about it much more thoroughly than they did. Polls, E-mails, Letters to those who can't access other things etc. I'm pretty sure everybody does want to move on from this saga but this just reeks of 'brushing it under the carpet' moving on instead of getting answers and then moving on.

You are having a go and where do you suggest all the time and money is coming from? The club?

[ronaldo7]

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Are we going to get a run down of what happened last night then or not

Prior to opening the meeting, the chair informed everyone, that anyone using phones or any other recordings devices should be switched off, and if anyone was found to be recording the event, they'd be asked to leave. An hour was not enough time to get through all the questions people wanted to ask. As has been said, dempster, and Petrie handled it well. It's well seen the club wish to move on with this.