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  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
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    Boycott is way over the top so far - it's interesting when they switch to the Comm Cam - Vaughan's facial expressions when Boycott is talking can be priceless.

    I liked Swann on TMS but I haven't taken to him so much on Sky, he's maybe trying a bit too hard. Ponting and Fleming have been fine though, and as stated earlier I think Gilchrist is great. Not given ABC a shot yet though, Jim Maxwell is back having recovered from a stroke, so I might tune into them for Adelaide.

    I think one or two of them need to calm down and remember that silence is a good thing at times at a cricket match. (These are Test matches, not a T20 Blast, after all.)

    But oh my, do I miss Bumble ....

    And after yesterday's press releases, maybe it would be good if Strauss and Bayliss shut up about Bairstow? the more excuses they make the stupider he appears - "something he does with his rugby mates". Yeah - Jonny Neanderthal?

    Mind you, when I was living in the Highlands, there were a lot of young males banging their heads together in October-November time.

    There was a lot of roaring went on as well, and it was called "the rut", and had a lot to do with testosterone and the presence of nubile young females ....

    Maybe that was what it was all about?
    Last edited by --------; 28-11-2017 at 08:19 PM.


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  3. #92
    @hibs.net private member Mibbes Aye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doddie View Post
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    I think one or two of them need to calm down and remember that silence is a good thing at times at a cricket match. (These are Test matches, not a T20 Blast, after all.)

    But oh my, do I miss Bumble ....

    And after yesterday's press releases, maybe it would be good if Strauss and Bayliss shut up about Bairstow? the more excuses they make the stupider he appears - "something he does with his rugby mates". Yeah - Jonny Neanderthal?

    Mind you, when I was living in the Highlands, there were a lot of young males banging their heads together in October-November time.

    There was a lot of roaring went on as well, and it was called "the rut", and had a lot to do with testosterone and the presence of nubile young females ....

    Maybe that was what it was all about?
    Deer, oh deer.......

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  4. #93
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    Would be good if Stokes was in this team. Just kind of feel cheated watching it knowing it would be a better game if he were playing eh

  5. #94
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    Would be good if Stokes was in this team. Just kind of feel cheated watching it knowing it would be a better game if he were playing eh

  6. #95
    @hibs.net private member Mibbes Aye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hiberniankb View Post
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    Would be good if Stokes was in this team. Just kind of feel cheated watching it knowing it would be a better game if he were playing eh
    It would liven things up, that's for sure.

    By the same token, the Aussies lost James Pattinson to injury which would have had an impact on their decision-making. I think he and Cummins would compete for the third seamer spot as I'm not sure there's any chance they would have gone with four, plus Lyon (although maybe in days gone by, four at the WACA with no spinner, but Perth isn't the track it used to be).

    Outside chance of Chadd Sayers coming in, if Cummins isn't 100% fit.
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  7. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
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    The lack of subtlety by England is, well.......it's just unsubtle

    I guess if he is in NZ then there must be some indication that the CPS will make its decision before Melbourne, and more likely before Perth, and that it will be not to prosecute

    The rights and wrongs aside, England desperately need him but if he comes he will face the finest sledgers of all the Test nations - should prove interesting!!

    EDIT: rolled eyes about not prosecuting aren't directed at the decision, more that the ECB might appear to have advance info
    Itís all starting to look very premeditated.

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  8. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
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    The lack of subtlety by England is, well.......it's just unsubtle

    I guess if he is in NZ then there must be some indication that the CPS will make its decision before Melbourne, and more likely before Perth, and that it will be not to prosecute

    The rights and wrongs aside, England desperately need him but if he comes he will face the finest sledgers of all the Test nations - should prove interesting!!

    EDIT: rolled eyes about not prosecuting aren't directed at the decision, more that the ECB might appear to have advance info

    It's not a very edifying picture tbh.

    https://www.theguardian.com/sport/20...et-new-zealand

    A hostile onlooker (and there are plenty of those!) might suggest that the ECB and the CPS have decided to 'expedite' the legal business to allow him to play. Apparently a 'new witness' has come forward (a cynic might suggest, very conveniently) and now BS is in New Zealand and raring to go for Canterbury - or maybe even England on Sunday if the Aussies allow him in?

    All depending on a retrospective suspension in the event the CPS decide not to prosecute - he gets off with time served and no one will actually be told exactly what it was he did that night?

    This smells bad - it gets more and more like the sort of dodgy stuff old WG used to get up to Down Under. Imagine English media reaction if Australia or Pakistan had something like this going on during a series here?

    Oh, and might I be the first to observe that in the past we at least took the trouble to convict our criminals before we sent them out to Australia?
    Last edited by --------; 29-11-2017 at 10:29 AM.

  9. #98
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  10. #99
    @hibs.net private member lord bunberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doddie View Post
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    If you look at the cctv footage itís hard to see how he canít be charged. He must have a really good lawyer.

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  11. #100
    @hibs.net private member Mibbes Aye's Avatar
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    Slight tangent from the Ashes, I'm just a little bit too young to remember Kerry Packer's World Series Cricket.

    This is a good article by the very, very good Australian cricket writer, Gideon Haigh, about WSC.

    Any of our more veteran posters watch it at the time?
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  12. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by lord bunberry View Post
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    If you look at the cctv footage itís hard to see how he canít be charged. He must have a really good lawyer.

    A cynic might say that the most telling factor in his defence may yet turn out to be the fragility of the England batting and the lack of penetration of the England bowling beyond Anderson and Broad ....

    What's a fractured eye-socket in the dark when England expects? Nay, desperately NEEDS?

  13. #102
    @hibs.net private member Mibbes Aye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doddie View Post
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    A cynic might say that the most telling factor in his defence may yet turn out to be the fragility of the England batting and the lack of penetration of the England bowling beyond Anderson and Broad ....

    What's a fractured eye-socket in the dark when England expects? Nay, desperately NEEDS?
    What's fascinating is that Stokes is seen, rightly or wrongly, as the answer to both.

    The newbie batters have experience of playing in Australia at grade or Shield level, but when it comes down to Test match pressure, it's all on Cook, Root and Stokes. Cook has been caught twice when he shouldn't have and Root was lbw twice - Hazlewood got him the second time and could yet make Root his bunny.

    Stokes has had one big score in Australia but in seven other Test innings, he averages 24. None of which were at Brisbane, so that's not a contributing factor

    Bowling-wise, he averages in the low thirties, which is decent but not great stuff. The only place he has had a major haul is in Sydney, where he took a five-for in the first innings in a Test that they ultimately lost by 280-odd runs.

    My guess is he is an improved player from his previous tour, but his history is he goes for nearly four an over in the grounds he might bowl at, and he averages at bat in the mid-twenties unless he can up his game in an individual match.

    I don't doubt he can be a talisman - I've seen him play, in the flesh, for England and he genuinely enlivens the team when he has the ball or bat. His record down under doesn't match the hope however.

    I think the point about bowling depth is spot on - Anderson and Broad can restrict teams through their ability and experience, and can win matches if there is swing and decent seam. Beyond that, England are weak. Moeen is a decent spinner but freely admits he sees himself as a batsman first, and a bowler second.

    That works when you have a Stokes as a fourth seamer. Otherwise you need to bring in a proper spinner and I don't think England can manage with only three quicks on most grounds in Australia.

    If I was in charge of England I would be making sure Stokes was straight back in at six, as soon as possible. I feel sorry for Ball and Overton.
    Last edited by Mibbes Aye; 30-11-2017 at 02:39 AM.
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  14. #103
    @hibs.net private member lord bunberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doddie View Post
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    A cynic might say that the most telling factor in his defence may yet turn out to be the fragility of the England batting and the lack of penetration of the England bowling beyond Anderson and Broad ....

    What's a fractured eye-socket in the dark when England expects? Nay, desperately NEEDS?
    The police are probably under more pressure to drop the charges after the first test.

    United we stand here....

  15. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
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    What's fascinating is that Stokes is seen, rightly or wrongly, as the answer to both.

    The newbie batters have experience of playing in Australia at grade or Shield level, but when it comes down to Test match pressure, it's all on Cook, Root and Stokes. Cook has been caught twice when he shouldn't have and Root was lbw twice - Hazlewood got him the second time and could yet make Root his bunny.

    Stokes has had one big score in Australia but in seven other Test innings, he averages 24. None of which were at Brisbane, so that's not a contributing factor

    Bowling-wise, he averages in the low thirties, which is decent but not great stuff. The only place he has had a major haul is in Sydney, where he took a five-for in the first innings in a Test that they ultimately lost by 280-odd runs.

    My guess is he is an improved player from his previous tour, but his history is he goes for nearly four an over in the grounds he might bowl at, and he averages at bat in the mid-twenties unless he can up his game in an individual match.

    I don't doubt he can be a talisman - I've seen him play, in the flesh, for England and he genuinely enlivens the team when he has the ball or bat. His record down under doesn't match the hope however.

    I think the point about bowling depth is spot on - Anderson and Broad can restrict teams through their ability and experience, and can win matches if there is swing and decent seam. Beyond that, England are weak. Moeen is a decent spinner but freely admits he sees himself as a batsman first, and a bowler second.

    That works when you have a Stokes as a fourth seamer. Otherwise you need to bring in a proper spinner and I don't think England can manage with only three quicks on most grounds in Australia.

    If I was in charge of England I would be making sure Stokes was straight back in at six, as soon as possible. I feel sorry for Ball and Overton.

    Apparently the police are 'weeks' away from charging/not charging Stokes, so do England decide to go back on their original decision not to pick him until the legal position has become clear? Don't see how they can do that. And even supposing Stokes is given a full discharge - no case to answer - which may well not be possible, the pressure on him coming into the side as the answer to both the bowling problem (an effective back-up to Broad and Anderson) and the batting problem (a source of middle-order/lower order runs) would be immense.

    Bad enough if he were just coming back from injury, but after a drawn-out period waiting to hear whether he's being charged with a fairly serious offence?

    It's all very well for Strauss and Bayliss (do I not like that man!) to keep saying that there's no booze-culture in the England cricket team, and that they're all a thoroughly grand set of chaps really (needlepoint, cribbage, and a nice mug of cocoa, listen to the Epilogue and off to Blanket Bay?), but Bairstow is now established in the press and media as the sort of bamstick who greets his friends by bashing skulls with them - a quaint Yorkshire custom apparently. (Could 70-odd years of ritual Yorkshire head-butting be The Reason Geoffrey Boycott Is The Way He Is?)

    And the player England needs urgently and immediately to bolster their batting/bowling order may be sewing mailbags by Easter.

    How exactly are Bayliss (ewwww!) and Strauss managing this team? Not terribly effectively, in my humble estimation.

  16. #105
    @hibs.net private member Mibbes Aye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doddie View Post
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    Apparently the police are 'weeks' away from charging/not charging Stokes, so do England decide to go back on their original decision not to pick him until the legal position has become clear? Don't see how they can do that. And even supposing Stokes is given a full discharge - no case to answer - which may well not be possible, the pressure on him coming into the side as the answer to both the bowling problem (an effective back-up to Broad and Anderson) and the batting problem (a source of middle-order/lower order runs) would be immense.

    Bad enough if he were just coming back from injury, but after a drawn-out period waiting to hear whether he's being charged with a fairly serious offence?

    It's all very well for Strauss and Bayliss (do I not like that man!) to keep saying that there's no booze-culture in the England cricket team, and that they're all a thoroughly grand set of chaps really (needlepoint, cribbage, and a nice mug of cocoa, listen to the Epilogue and off to Blanket Bay?), but Bairstow is now established in the press and media as the sort of bamstick who greets his friends by bashing skulls with them - a quaint Yorkshire custom apparently. (Could 70-odd years of ritual Yorkshire head-butting be The Reason Geoffrey Boycott Is The Way He Is?)

    And the player England needs urgently and immediately to bolster their batting/bowling order may be sewing mailbags by Easter.

    How exactly are Bayliss (ewwww!) and Strauss managing this team? Not terribly effectively, in my humble estimation.


    It's been a car crash, from a management point of view, for England.

    If Stokes does come back in, then there's disruption to the line-up, Ball gets dropped and Overton hasn't an earthly of being picked - squad morale can't be positive. Plus the Australians will relish it in the field - I'm convinced the word 'sardonic' was coined by some literary type who had the pleasure of listening to an Aussie slip cordon.

    And if he doesn't come back, England will constantly be held up against what they might have done, had he been there.

    They've got themselves into a situation where they can't win, metaphorically and probably literally.

    Having said all that, Anderson and Broad could find joy in Adelaide and Perth, and Root and Cook know how to make a big score. They are still one of the best teams in the world, though miles behind India and without the potential that this Australian side has, with a few tweaks.

    If Australia win in Adelaide, and I think they will edge it, then it's 5-0 for me.
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  17. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
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    It's been a car crash, from a management point of view, for England.

    If Stokes does come back in, then there's disruption to the line-up, Ball gets dropped and Overton hasn't an earthly of being picked - squad morale can't be positive. Plus the Australians will relish it in the field - I'm convinced the word 'sardonic' was coined by some literary type who had the pleasure of listening to an Aussie slip cordon.

    And if he doesn't come back, England will constantly be held up against what they might have done, had he been there.

    They've got themselves into a situation where they can't win, metaphorically and probably literally.

    Having said all that, Anderson and Broad could find joy in Adelaide and Perth, and Root and Cook know how to make a big score. They are still one of the best teams in the world, though miles behind India and without the potential that this Australian side has, with a few tweaks.

    If Australia win in Adelaide, and I think they will edge it, then it's 5-0 for me.

    More or less my thoughts. It comes down to the usual suspects again; Cook, Root, Bairstow, Moeen, and Broad and Anderson. Woakes might find the Adelaide wicket more to his liking, but they're stuck for an effective spinner if Moeen's finger hasn't healed properly. There are too many potential weak links for my liking.

    And how Ball and Overton feel with the talk about calling up Wood? Nothing like showing a bit of faith in your players ....

    But no doubt Bayliss will be out there an hour before start of play, telling us everything's fine, the players are in great shape, and the team's just raring to go ....
    Last edited by --------; 01-12-2017 at 05:12 PM.

  18. #107
    @hibs.net private member lord bunberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doddie View Post
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    More or less my thoughts. It comes down to the usual suspects again; Cook, Root, Bairstow, Moeen, and Broad and Anderson. Woakes might find the Adelaide wicket more to his liking, but they're stuck for an effective spinner if Moeen's finger hasn't healed properly. There are too many potential weak links for my liking.

    And how Ball and Overton feel with the talk about calling up Wood? Nothing like showing a bit of faith in your players ....

    But no doubt Bayliss will be out there an hour before start of play, telling us everything's fine, the players are in great shape, and the team's just raring to go ....
    Iím sensing the beginnings of a vendetta doddie

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  19. #108
    @hibs.net private member Mibbes Aye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lord bunberry View Post
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    Iím sensing the beginnings of a vendetta doddie
    Trevor Bayliss is related to Joe Harper, or at least besties. Fact
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  20. #109
    @hibs.net private member lord bunberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
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    Trevor Bayliss is related to Joe Harper, or at least besties. Fact
    Thatís what Iíve heard as well

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  21. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
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    Trevor Bayliss is related to Joe Harper, or at least besties. Fact
    Quote Originally Posted by lord bunberry View Post
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    That’s what I’ve heard as well

    Don't be ridiculous. My vendettas aren't genetically conditioned; I have a perfectly rational reason for disliking the guy.

    Before he took the England job he was working as an estate agent. The only people worse than estate agents are lawyers.



    And Joe Harper .....


    But I do wonder at an Australian managing an England team playing against Australia in an Ashes series.

    It puts me in mind of one Bobby Brown and a certain Cup Final.

  22. #112
    @hibs.net private member Mibbes Aye's Avatar
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    Hard to see anything other than England going to Perth 0-2 down. Steady and patient partnership from Marsh and Paine that really helped Australia pull away, building on respectable batting further up the order . Given both players raised some eyebrows when picked, the selectors will be feeling vindicated.
    Credit again to Cummins - I read somewhere that calling him a number 9 surely constituted fraud .

    Got to imagine Lyon is looking forward to bowling, there was a fair bit of turn on day two.
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  23. #113
    Testimonial Due Finn2015's Avatar
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    Tbh, the ashes could be going stale. The English canít cope with Australian pace and bounce down under and the Aussies struggle against swing in England. Can see Australia winning this series comfortably and then England regaining them back in England

  24. #114
    @hibs.net private member Mibbes Aye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Finn2015 View Post
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    Tbh, the ashes could be going stale. The English canít cope with Australian pace and bounce down under and the Aussies struggle against swing in England. Can see Australia winning this series comfortably and then England regaining them back in England
    I think England have benefitted in recent years from having extremely good swing bowlers, Anderson in particular, but the likes of Hoggard as well, combined with Australia not being able to replace the sheer talent they had throughout the team under the latter stages of Allan Border, then Mark Taylor, Steve Waugh and the early part of Ricky Ponting's captaincies.

    Anderson won't be around in 2019 one would imagine. In some ways what you describe makes it sound more interesting. The dominance Australia had under the skippers I've just mentioned was monumental and they had it in England as well as at home - the Second Test of the 1993 Ashes was probably the epitome - six players batted, Taylor, Slater and Boon all got centuries, big centuries for the latter two, Mark Waugh was bowled for 99, Border bowled for 77 and Steve Waugh was unbeaten on 13 alongside Boon.

    Australia then bowled England out twice, with the spinners taking fourteen of the twenty wickets enroute to an innings victory - this was just before the days of McGrath, Gillespie and Lee, with McDermott and Hughes coming towards the end of their international careers. This was during a period when Australia simply came to England and turned them over - four consecutive series victories, fifteen wins and four defeats and the defeats were often when the series was decided and the victories were regularly by an innings or by nine or ten wickets.

    I remember that Test vividly and while I enjoyed it immensely, there is an extra edge since 2005, when England started being able to win again. I think it is a bit easier for Australia to win in England than it is for England to win in Australia, but there isn't a valid reason why England can't produce genuine quickies and similarly, the climate for swing does exist in Australia. In addition, Aussie spinners probably gain more going to England than the other way round.
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  25. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
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    I think England have benefitted in recent years from having extremely good swing bowlers, Anderson in particular, but the likes of Hoggard as well, combined with Australia not being able to replace the sheer talent they had throughout the team under the latter stages of Allan Border, then Mark Taylor, Steve Waugh and the early part of Ricky Ponting's captaincies.

    Anderson won't be around in 2019 one would imagine. In some ways what you describe makes it sound more interesting. The dominance Australia had under the skippers I've just mentioned was monumental and they had it in England as well as at home - the Second Test of the 1993 Ashes was probably the epitome - six players batted, Taylor, Slater and Boon all got centuries, big centuries for the latter two, Mark Waugh was bowled for 99, Border bowled for 77 and Steve Waugh was unbeaten on 13 alongside Boon.

    Australia then bowled England out twice, with the spinners taking fourteen of the twenty wickets enroute to an innings victory - this was just before the days of McGrath, Gillespie and Lee, with McDermott and Hughes coming towards the end of their international careers. This was during a period when Australia simply came to England and turned them over - four consecutive series victories, fifteen wins and four defeats and the defeats were often when the series was decided and the victories were regularly by an innings or by nine or ten wickets.

    I remember that Test vividly and while I enjoyed it immensely, there is an extra edge since 2005, when England started being able to win again. I think it is a bit easier for Australia to win in England than it is for England to win in Australia, but there isn't a valid reason why England can't produce genuine quickies and similarly, the climate for swing does exist in Australia. In addition, Aussie spinners probably gain more going to England than the other way round.

    Im old enough remember that to 😭. I think Iím right in saying that the Aussies havenít won an ashes series since 2001 and nowadays, they seem to find it very difficult to cope with the swing and English conditions and indeed, the duke ball. Will be interesting to see how they fare the next ashes trip if as expected, they win this ashes series comfortably.

  26. #116
    @hibs.net private member Mibbes Aye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Finn2015 View Post
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    Im old enough remember that to 😭. I think Iím right in saying that the Aussies havenít won an ashes series since 2001 and nowadays, they seem to find it very difficult to cope with the swing and English conditions and indeed, the duke ball. Will be interesting to see how they fare the next ashes trip if as expected, they win this ashes series comfortably.
    They havenít won in England since 2001, but I think three out of the four series since then have been won by one Test which I guess makes it pretty competitive. Itís interesting times for both sides looking ahead - neither has a settled line-up now or a predictable line-up for next series, which is unusual.
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  27. #117
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    Great bowling from England in the final session today. I still canít see them winning, but theyíve given themselves some hope.

    United we stand here....

  28. #118
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    268 behind already, Australia with 6 wickets standing?

    Pretty dire situation, tbh. Highest successful run-chase in Adelaide is 315-6 by Australia v England in 1902. Next highest is 239-5 by the West Indies in 1982. It doesn't appear to be a good wicket on which to be batting fourth.


    I notice Alex Hales isn't being prosecuted and is now available to play ....
    Last edited by --------; 04-12-2017 at 01:44 PM.

  29. #119
    @hibs.net private member Mibbes Aye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doddie View Post
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    268 behind already, Australia with 6 wickets standing?

    Pretty dire situation, tbh. Highest successful run-chase in Adelaide is 315-6 by Australia v England in 1902. Next highest is 239-5 by the West Indies in 1982. It doesn't appear to be a good wicket on which to be batting fourth.


    I notice Alex Hales isn't being prosecuted and is now available to play ....
    I'm always wary of predicting but it's done and dusted IMO.

    England will bat at some point during day four, chasing a target that they couldn't reach in their first innings. I would expect the middle to tail to manage at least another fifty, meaning England are chasing well in excess of 300 and that's game over, though if Australia declared at the start of play my money would still be on them.

    I didn't see England's wickets today, will catch them on the highlights but the stats read two lbws and two close-in catches, one to the wicket keeper and one to Root at second slip. In those conditions I expect the Australian quicks to have a field day. They've likely got two shots at England under the lights, with Lyon also bowling well - if they can't wrap up England in those circumstances then they have serious problems. Sounds like credit is due to Overton and Woakes, for some resolute batting though.

    Still, going to Perth 0-2 down shouldn't be too much of a worry. Unless you take into account that England have only beaten Australia once at the WACA and that was in 1978, plus I think this is the last time the WACA will be used for an Ashes Test, so there's the small matter of Australian pride.......
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  30. #120
    @hibs.net private member Mibbes Aye's Avatar
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    As an aside, watching Vince give away his wicket cheaply reminded me that I still think it's bad tactics by England to allow Root to play at four. He's the best player and he's the captain and he should take responsibility and slot in at three, even if it means his average suffers.

    To an extent, Steve Smith isn't immune from the same criticism, for the same reasons. His saving grace is that Khawaja averages well enough at first man in, and averages especially well on home soil. I'm not a fan of Khuwaja though - almost half his dismissals have been to spin and at his age he should have sorted his technique out.
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