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Thread: Strachan away..

  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Victor Park View Post
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    Well ultimately he has failed however he has the best win rate of any manager (other than McLeish's 10 games in charge) since Tommy Docherty in the early 70s:

    http://scotlandfootballstats.co.uk/managers

    I think you are forgetting how bad Burley and Levein actually were.
    I drifted away from watching Scotland at that time so I was probably spared the worst of it to some extent, but I think you have to equate success as Scotland boss with qualifying for major tournaments. Their win rate isn't really relevant if they still fail to qualify. By that token there's no way you could argue Strachan has done better than, say, Brown or Roxburgh.

    When I was a lot younger, the frustration was that Scotland never managed to get beyond the group stage at major tournaments. Perhaps we've now come to such a sorry pass that we're starting to equate success with which manager achieved the 'least poor' qualifying campaign!


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  3. #62
    Testimonial Due SeanWilson's Avatar
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    I've said it before and I'll continue to say it - not picking LG is a sackable offence. Had he started the campaign I'm certain we'd have picked up more points.

  4. #63
    Really doesn't seem to matter who the boss is. I'd have liked to see Berti get a bit more time as he at least introduced new players.

    Seems we have a desperation to qualify for these things which in our current state seems pointless. Berra, Mulgrew, Fletcher(s) etc sum it up for me. Desperate to qualify so call up has-beens.

    Found it hilarious Strachan talked of trying to compete physically with them while playing Bannan in midfield 3 with Fletcher (good servant but done) and McArthur. 2 fairly short players with not a great deal of strength and an OAP in terms of a footballer.

    He should go and as a nation we need to take a look at ourselves if we are blaming genetics. Introduce players at a younger age and write off 5-6 years.

  5. #64
    The genetics statement from Strachan was embarrassing. I've been fairly supportive of him but that sounded like someone who's lost the plot.

  6. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by G B Young View Post
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    I drifted away from watching Scotland at that time so I was probably spared the worst of it to some extent, but I think you have to equate success as Scotland boss with qualifying for major tournaments. Their win rate isn't really relevant if they still fail to qualify. By that token there's no way you could argue Strachan has done better than, say, Brown or Roxburgh.

    When I was a lot younger, the frustration was that Scotland never managed to get beyond the group stage at major tournaments. Perhaps we've now come to such a sorry pass that we're starting to equate success with which manager achieved the 'least poor' qualifying campaign!
    Yes.Actually getting to finals is unlikely to improve your win ratio.

  7. #66
    @hibs.net private member Thecat23's Avatar
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    Imagine blaming genetics 😂

    Thatís a shocker of a statement!

  8. #67
    Testimonial Due Victor Park's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by G B Young View Post
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    I drifted away from watching Scotland at that time so I was probably spared the worst of it to some extent, but I think you have to equate success as Scotland boss with qualifying for major tournaments. Their win rate isn't really relevant if they still fail to qualify. By that token there's no way you could argue Strachan has done better than, say, Brown or Roxburgh.

    When I was a lot younger, the frustration was that Scotland never managed to get beyond the group stage at major tournaments. Perhaps we've now come to such a sorry pass that we're starting to equate success with which manager achieved the 'least poor' qualifying campaign!
    Agreed!


    Also re Bert Vogts point though - he gets too much credit for getting us to the Euro 2004 play off. He was manager at a time when previous successes meant we were 2nd seeds in a group. In that group our rivals to finish behind Germany were Faroes, Lithuania and a poor Iceland side. And we scraped in by a point after losing to Lithuania and drawing in Faroes!

    Strachan has failed yes, but we were 4th seeds when he started, meaning much tougher draws.

  9. #68
    Testimonial Due Baader's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingDomofFife84 View Post
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    The genetics statement from Strachan was embarrassing. I've been fairly supportive of him but that sounded like someone who's lost the plot.
    Totally agree. Was embarrassing hearing that and does our reputation no favours.

  10. #69
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    Like he's done/doing his best to get the bullet, time for him to go, we need a fresh approach

  11. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firestarter View Post
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    Do you have belief he will give new players a chance or stick to players who done him amazing in his words this term? To be a good International you need to change, he can't seem to do that. Not picking Griffiths was criminal as was his selections yesterday.
    Yeah hindsight and all that..

    I think the players let the nation down last night and his team selection to me was fine. The one that got away for me is Scott Arfield. I don't think changing Strachan is a wise move.

  12. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by Stokesy's on fire View Post
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    Yeah hindsight and all that..

    I think the players let the nation down last night and his team selection to me was fine. The one that got away for me is Scott Arfield. I don't think changing Strachan is a wise move.
    His selection was shocking last night, over ran all night.

    Arfield chose to go represent Canada, why? Because he never got a look in from yes, Strachan.

  13. #72
    If he thinks it's genetics- then the Dane's should the World cup winners.. What a truly stupid thing to say😲😲
    I'll be shocked if he still has that job next week.

  14. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by KingDomofFife84 View Post
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    The genetics statement from Strachan was embarrassing. I've been fairly supportive of him but that sounded like someone who's lost the plot.
    Agree what an embarrassing statement to make, smallest nation bar Spain, its really held them back!

  15. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by Victor Park View Post
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    Agreed!


    Also re Bert Vogts point though - he gets too much credit for getting us to the Euro 2004 play off. He was manager at a time when previous successes meant we were 2nd seeds in a group. In that group our rivals to finish behind Germany were Faroes, Lithuania and a poor Iceland side. And we scraped in by a point after losing to Lithuania and drawing in Faroes!

    Strachan has failed yes, but we were 4th seeds when he started, meaning much tougher draws.
    That's a fair point. Mind you, from what I've read England have been dismal throughout this qualifying campaign yet still won the group by a mile - so you might conclude that the rest of the group must have dross.

    I guess our latest failure means we're going to be stuck in the fourth pot of seeds for a good while to come, although it does rile me when fans complain about Scotland getting 'another tough group'. It's not down to the luck of the draw, it's down our own ineptitude down the years.

  16. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by G B Young View Post
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    That's a fair point. Mind you, from what I've read England have been dismal throughout this qualifying campaign yet still won the group by a mile - so you might conclude that the rest of the group must have dross.

    I guess our latest failure means we're going to be stuck in the fourth pot of seeds for a good while to come, although it does rile me when fans complain about Scotland getting 'another tough group'. It's not down to the luck of the draw, it's down our own ineptitude down the years.
    We do also have to accept that it there are far teams to conpete against now.

    All of the USSR, many of whom have populations elthe equal or greater than scotlands, croatia, slovenia, Slovakia, serbia, macedonia et al, all of whom have more natural talent than sxotland, or at least as much.

    Yes standards need to rise, but expectations have nevet beem adjusted appropriately either imo.

  17. #76
    @hibs.net private member J-C's Avatar
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    There was no genetic problems back in the day when we qualified on a regular basis, wee Archie Gemmill didn't have genetic problems when he scored the best goal in the 78 World cup, nor did Billy Bremner or Jimmy Johnstone, ridiculous statement by Strachan.

  18. #77
    @hibs.net private member greenlex's Avatar
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    We will qualify for theEuros and the new manager will be hailed a genius. The reality is with 24 teams qualifying out a much smaller pool than the WC that I could manage Scotland to the next qualification.

  19. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by greenlex View Post
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    We will qualify for theEuros and the new manager will be hailed a genius. The reality is with 24 teams qualifying out a much smaller pool than the WC that I could manage Scotland to the next qualification.
    Strachan couldn't though.

  20. #79
    Coaching Staff heretoday's Avatar
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    Strachan's statement was just his way of working out his disappointment over the result. He knows perfectly well Scotland's football problems go much deeper than the size of the players!

    Only he could get away with such guff unchallenged. I suppose to raise objection could invite a violent reaction so the press just let him witter on.

  21. #80
    Testimonial Due GreenOnions's Avatar
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    I'd be amazed if he stays on. We have been seeded lower under the last few managers and I accept that makes it harder. However - our last few groups have not actually been as hard as we used to get. For WC2014 the top two teams qualified from our group with third place getting to the playoffs and we came 4th. The current group was certainly not the hardest and we failed to get into the playoffs due to draws against Lithuania and Slovenia - hardly world-beaters.

    If we compare ourselves against other teams of similar standing (including home nations) we have not done well under Strachan IMHO - even though I'd accept we have improved somewhat in the last 12 months. Using that yardstick I think he needs to be replaced.

  22. #81
    Quote Originally Posted by greenlex View Post
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    We will qualify for theEuros and the new manager will be hailed a genius. The reality is with 24 teams qualifying out a much smaller pool than the WC that I could manage Scotland to the next qualification.
    I'm sure we'll find a way not too.

  23. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by greenlex View Post
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    We will qualify for theEuros and the new manager will be hailed a genius. The reality is with 24 teams qualifying out a much smaller pool than the WC that I could manage Scotland to the next qualification.
    Pity the current incumbent isn't as talented as you then
    I fell in love with football as I was later to fall in love with women,. Suddenly, uncritically giving no thought to the pain it could bring. - Nick Hornby

  24. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by Swedish hibee View Post
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    If he thinks it's genetics- then the Dane's should the World cup winners.. What a truly stupid thing to say😲😲
    I'll be shocked if he still has that job next week.
    Hell, he'll probably have a brand new spanking five year deal by then!

  25. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by GreenOnions View Post
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    I'd be amazed if he stays on. We have been seeded lower under the last few managers and I accept that makes it harder. However - our last few groups have not actually been as hard as we used to get. For WC2014 the top two teams qualified from our group with third place getting to the playoffs and we came 4th. The current group was certainly not the hardest and we failed to get into the playoffs due to draws against Lithuania and Slovenia - hardly world-beaters.

    If we compare ourselves against other teams of similar standing (including home nations) we have not done well under Strachan IMHO - even though I'd accept we have improved somewhat in the last 12 months. Using that yardstick I think he needs to be replaced.
    Yep, that's what I think as well. Slight improvement but still nowhere near good enough in groups that were, on the face of it, easier than a lot of the ones we had before. Interesting that a lot of the criticism, on the radio anyway, was that he didn't pick enough Celtic players for a lot of these games. I remember when Brown was manager and didn't rate him at all even though he took us to major tournaments. I always thought he picked old firm players instead of players with better ability from outside the old firm. The obvious one for me was when he picked Mark Burchill ahead of Kenny Miller, who at the time was at Hibs. On saying that, I always got the impression Brown didn't like Hibs and always seems to find it hard to compliment us at any time.
    Last edited by ekhibee; 09-10-2017 at 05:19 PM.

  26. #85
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    If he does go .... anyone think Cathro could be the man?

  27. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by KSA Hibee View Post
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    If he does go .... anyone think Cathro could be the man?

  28. #87
    @hibs.net private member NORTHERNHIBBY's Avatar
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    Did we pick big players in the games that we won?

  29. #88
    @hibs.net private member Jim44's Avatar
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    I thought the hoo ha about his genetics comment was misquoting or tongue in cheek but Iíve just heard him on the news. Unbelievable and a dickhead. I was just about ready to give him another chance as heíd made a little progress but Iím afraid his stupidity cancels out any future in the job as far as Iím concerned.

  30. #89
    Coaching Staff Smartie's Avatar
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    I think he's stumbled across a decent formula, the team has done well of late and he deserves to keep going.

    He drives me mad at times and I often disagree with his selections, but tbh on a few occasions he's been proven correct and I've been wide of the mark (selection of Berra, Bannon, perseverance with Chris Martin etc).

    The talk of genetics is drivel and he needs to forget that crap fast.

    I don't like the obsession amongst failed managers with experience and "tried and tested" as I'm much more of a "if you're good enough you're old enough" type. The second half yesterday was crying out for a bit of energy and our midfield were always going to tire after Thursday. His game management was poor, but tbf to him, it has been excellent of late.

    The argument about who else you might get is valid. I don't know who out there is better, and there are plenty of people who would be worse. I honestly do think the players like him and believe in him, and in International football that is half the battle.

  31. #90
    The key thing to him remining.in the job is that he has tohave learned from mistakes, to stop being so loyal and pigheaded and to be actively seen to be introducing new young blood to the team and not just the squad.
    In saying this we do lack ability in some areas, particularly central defence and get the midfield shape/style.right and upfront. Lets.get some.frienies played try out the younger players, say thanks to those that have passed.their best at this level and build for next euros if we can, if not for the following tournaments start developing players to be more capable in the international stage ....

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