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  1. #91
    @hibs.net private member Moulin Yarns's Avatar
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    Breaking news. Residents barged into Kensington town hall to get answers. Crowds outside want meetings and justice. Chants of more than 17.

    Authorities need to be prepared to be honest about this. Stop saying 30 dead and be realistic about the numbers.

    Maybe 30 bodies recovered and the search for other victims will be thorough and as quickly as possible.
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  3. #92
    @hibs.net private member Just Alf's Avatar
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    Just reading some of the local news...



    In my terms...

    I live in a council house in Edinburgh and get a bus to work, my flat is destroyed through no fault of mine, the council will give me a house next week... In Glasgow....

    How do I get to my cleaning etc job from there?

    PS I'm not sure it's a "totally" council thing, that's just the basic sentiment of what I've read.

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  4. #93
    I said it earlier in the thread and I'll say it again. Anyone who thinks the death toll is gonna be less than 100 is just kidding themselves.

  5. #94
    Another thing. Seen plenty folk going on about only one stairway in the block to get out. Has anyone been in a multistorey block of flats with more than one stairway? I haven't.

  6. #95
    Quote Originally Posted by Just Alf View Post
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    Just reading some of the local news...



    In my terms...

    I live in a council house in Edinburgh and get a bus to work, my flat is destroyed through no fault of mine, the council will give me a house next week... In Glasgow....

    How do I get to my cleaning etc job from there?

    PS I'm not sure it's a "totally" council thing, that's just the basic sentiment of what I've read.

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    If ther are no houses in the area what do they do? Its not just one or two families affected. There must be thousands looking for a new home over and above those who were already looking for a home. Who should get priority and why?

  7. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by SouthsideHarp_Bhoy View Post
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    I iamgine they dont know yet.

    They habe no idea who was in the building, and i imagine they will need dental records to identify bodies. Thats if they all habe dental records, and of course they need to find all of fhe bodies and inform families. Given the apparently transitory and international make-up of the residents, that will not be an easy task.

    They keep saying they expect the death toll to rise, what else can they say?

    Exactly, its a tricky situation and folk need to have patience to let folk get on with sorting it. Its too early for answers so folk are just filling in the blanks.

  8. #97
    @hibs.net private member Mantis Toboggan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Betty Boop View Post
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    Portillo the compassionate man of the people there.
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  9. #98
    Quote Originally Posted by SouthsideHarp_Bhoy View Post
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    I think you are making some major leaps and assumptions here.

    Because how does a (possibly inaccurate) number help anyone? If im missing someone, and the police say 75 are missing, how does that help me if they can't say if it includes the person im missing or not?

    And what happens if they say 75 are missing, but the numbet of bodies doesnt tally? Id imagine a badly burned dog couls easily be mistaken for a baby or young child, what if there are people who havent beem reported missing, do theu just stop lookkng once they have hit the 75 number?

    They will be methodically and systematically searching and recording what they find - that will be a slow process, amd identifying the bodies will take longer. Its bettwr they are slow amd accurate than they miss something or make a mistake.

    Sensible post in amongst some wild and unhelpful contributions.

  10. #99
    @hibs.net private member Pete's Avatar
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    How many homes in that borough are lying empty because they're somebody's investment?

    Shelter is one of the most basic human needs and this is what happens when there's an unregulated feeding frenzy.

  11. #100
    Quote Originally Posted by ColinNish View Post
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    Has anyone been in a multistorey block of flats with more than one stairway?
    No, nor a tenement.

  12. #101
    @hibs.net private member Mantis Toboggan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ColinNish View Post
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    Another thing. Seen plenty folk going on about only one stairway in the block to get out. Has anyone been in a multistorey block of flats with more than one stairway? I haven't.
    Yeah I lived in one where you could walk round the floor to a other stair. Unusual as you say.

  13. #102
    @hibs.net private member Hibernia&Alba's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
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    How many homes in that borough are lying empty because they're somebody's investment?

    Shelter is one of the most basic human needs and this is what happens when there's an unregulated feeding frenzy.
    Good point. The housing bubble, particularly in London, is a huge problem for residents and the wider economy. Working people and the poor find themselves priced out of huge areas and have to live in low quality ghettos. All the social housing has been sold off, so there's no affordable rents.
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  14. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba View Post
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    Good point. The housing bubble, particularly in London, is a huge problem for residents and the wider economy. Working people and the poor find themselves priced out of huge areas and have to live in low quality ghettos. All the social housing has been sold off, so there's no affordable rents.
    Yet this was largely social housing was it not? Which had just had millions spent on it.

    I'm not getting the connection I'm afraid.

  15. #104
    @hibs.net private member Pete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RyeSloan View Post
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    Yet this was largely social housing was it not? Which had just had millions spent on it.

    I'm not getting the connection I'm afraid.
    It's more about people not being rehoused in the same Borough.

    His points about the housing market and inequality are valid though.
    Last edited by Pete; 16-06-2017 at 05:34 PM.

  16. #105
    @hibs.net private member Hibernia&Alba's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RyeSloan View Post
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    Yet this was largely social housing was it not? Which had just had millions spent on it.

    I'm not getting the connection I'm afraid.
    Is this particular block council? I don't know, I was making a wider point in relation to Pete's post. There are over a million people waiting for social housing in the UK. So much of it has been sold off, they have no chance of getting one at the moment. We have families in hotels and bed and breakfasts. The housing market is broken. Buy to let is becoming increasingly frequent, which mean housing stock is being bought up by those who already have a home and merely see it as an opportunity to make money from money. Whole areas of London are totally out of the reach of working people, and in effect there is social cleansing on an increasing scale.
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  17. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba View Post
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    Is this particular block council? I don't know, I was making a wider point in relation to Pete's post. There are over a million people waiting for social housing in the UK. So much of it has been sold off, they have no chance of getting one at the moment. We have families in hotels and bed and breakfasts. The housing market is broken. Buy to let is becoming increasingly frequent, which mean housing stock is being bought up by those who already have a home and merely see it as an opportunity to make money from money.
    Maybe so but in what way is that connected to this tragedy?

  18. #107
    @hibs.net private member Just Alf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by beensaidbefore View Post
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    If ther are no houses in the area what do they do? Its not just one or two families affected. There must be thousands looking for a new home over and above those who were already looking for a home. Who should get priority and why?
    I know what you're saying, and, basically agree, I was just trying to get over what's happening locally and how folks are feeling... Don't have the detail but apparently they have as much empty housing as we do in Edinburgh

    Edit... Reading further on this tread I see it's already being discussed... Apologies


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    Last edited by Just Alf; 16-06-2017 at 05:58 PM.
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  19. #108
    @hibs.net private member Hibernia&Alba's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RyeSloan View Post
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    Maybe so but in what way is that connected to this tragedy?
    It depends what the investigation reveals. The fact the fire spread so quickly is a major concern. Were corners cut during the refurbishment, for example? Time will tell, but that building went up like a pair of nylon pyjamas. Are poor people increasingly being forced into unsafe, low quality housing, due to lack of affordable alternatives?
    Last edited by Hibernia&Alba; 16-06-2017 at 06:07 PM.
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  20. #109
    @hibs.net private member Pete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RyeSloan View Post
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    Maybe so but in what way is that connected to this tragedy?
    It's more to do with the protests that are happening now. The inequality is being brought into focus.

  21. #110
    Quote Originally Posted by Just Alf View Post
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    I know what you're saying, and, basically agree, I was just trying to get over what's happening locally and how folks are feeling... Don't have the detail but apparently they have as much empty housing as we do in Edinburgh

    Edit... Reading further on this tread I see it's already being discussed... Apologies


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  22. #111
    @hibs.net private member Just Alf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by beensaidbefore View Post
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    Its a nightmare whatever way you think about it. The more you hear the more you realise the enormity of the challenge.
    agreed its just horrible... I can't help relating it to my own family who are of similar ages.

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  23. #112
    Coaching Staff Betty Boop's Avatar
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    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...mnis-exteriors




    Surprise surprise, the cladding used was the cheap option.

  24. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba View Post
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    It depends what the investigation reveals. The fact the fire spread so quickly is a major concern. Were corners cut during the refurbishment, for example? Time will tell, but that building went up like a pair of nylon pyjamas. Are poor people increasingly being forced into unsafe, low quality housing, due to lack of affordable alternatives?
    I agree 100% but the key point is that the investigation has not even started yet. The building also just had millions spent on it yet clearly something has gone horribly wrong. Is that connected to decades of shan housing policy or just bungled work or can we trace it to the Bank of England falsely holding down interest rates or rich folk buying posh houses down the road I have no idea and either does anybody else I would imagine. That doesn't seem to be stopping people using the tragedy to make political points based on little or no information though.

    Let's see the facts then make the judgment...it seems to me that already in some quarters the people that have been horrendously impacted by this are second to the point scoring. It sickens me a bit to be honest.

  25. #114
    @hibs.net private member Hibernia&Alba's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RyeSloan View Post
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    I agree 100% but the key point is that the investigation has not even started yet. The building also just had millions spent on it yet clearly something has gone horribly wrong. Is that connected to decades of shan housing policy or just bungled work or can we trace it to the Bank of England falsely holding down interest rates or rich folk buying posh houses down the road I have no idea and either does anybody else I would imagine. That doesn't seem to be stopping people using the tragedy to make political points based on little or no information though.

    Let's see the facts then make the judgment...it seems to me that already in some quarters the people that have been horrendously impacted by this are second to the point scoring. It sickens me a bit to be honest.
    I get where you're coming from, though I haven't heard anyone trying to score political points before considering the experience of the residents. It's the residents themselves who are very angry, and understandably so. There are protests growing in the area right now. It's being reported that some residents of Greenfell did indeed raise their concerns about safety in the block. There are genuine questions regarding the lack of quality housing across the country for those on low incomes; a debate that goes back many years. The inquiry will no doubt address those questions and look at systemic housing shortages and its quality, especially in London.
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  26. #115
    Testimonial Due Colr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Golden Fleece View Post
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    Breaking news. Residents barged into Kensington town hall to get answers. Crowds outside want meetings and justice. Chants of more than 17.

    Authorities need to be prepared to be honest about this. Stop saying 30 dead and be realistic about the numbers.

    Maybe 30 bodies recovered and the search for other victims will be thorough and as quickly as possible.
    Were they residents? Strikes me this is turning into a bit of a circus!

  27. #116
    Quote Originally Posted by Colr View Post
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    Were they residents? Strikes me this is turning into a bit of a circus!
    Not arf. I'm no fan of Theresa May but screaming "murderer" at her? FFS.

  28. #117
    @hibs.net private member Pete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Colr View Post
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    Were they residents? Strikes me this is turning into a bit of a circus!
    There's a mob outside BBC HQ as well. Looks peaceful enough but why are they there?

  29. #118
    @hibs.net private member Hibernia&Alba's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Colr View Post
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    Were they residents? Strikes me this is turning into a bit of a circus!
    There are a number of blocks identical to Grenfell in the area. I would imagine residents of those, and of similar estates, are participating. It's understandable they are concerned about the safety of their families. Of course there will also be people who merely are hangers who just want to be part of an event.
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  30. #119
    ADMIN marinello59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Colr View Post
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    Were they residents? Strikes me this is turning into a bit of a circus!
    It's ordinary people uniting to say enough is enough. Good on them.
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  31. #120
    Coaching Staff bawheid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marinello59 View Post
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    It's ordinary people uniting to say enough is enough. Good on them.
    Absolutely.

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