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  1. #481
    Coaching Staff hibsbollah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by makaveli1875 View Post
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    It all seems a bit ridiculous to me , this debate has been going longer than most of us have been alive .
    Surely the sensible solution would be that the israelis and palestinians can share jerusalem as their capital , rather than spend a lifetime fighting over it

    Religion baffles me in these situations
    It's part of the peace accords (1993 but I might be wrong) that they share the capital until a formal solution is found (ideally Israel returning the land it invaded to pre 1967 borders but that's highly unlikely in the current climate). So what Trump has done is shat all over twenty odd years of consensus. Also, the Christians and Armenians also have a quarter each of the city, and they have also been shat on
    and undermined by Trumps announcement.

    Ironic that the president that's been enthusiastically cheered on by the Evangelical Christian Right has done the most to undermine Christian governance of its most holy city


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  3. #482
    @hibs.net proletariat member Pete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by beensaidbefore View Post
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    I see trouble ahead.

    Wonder what Corbin will have to say on the matter, what with him being anti Semitic and all that.😏
    It’s a shame that nobody has been listening to Corbyn on these matters for years because if they did, there probably wouldn’t be as much trouble.

    Maybe if people listened a bit less to the money men and their pals in the press who peddle crap like him being an anti-Semite, terrorist lover etc...🤔

  4. #483
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
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    It’s a shame that nobody has been listening to Corbyn on these matters for years because if they did, there probably wouldn’t be as much trouble.

    Maybe if people listened a bit less to the money men and their pals in the press who peddle crap like him being an anti-Semite, terrorist lover etc...🤔
    Yeah, dont listen to the US, lets listen to Hamas instead. Im sure they woyld be reasonable...

    This is what frustrates me about these situations - people trying to score pathetic and conpletely erroneous points, from a situation that has nothing to do with it.

    Are you seriously saying that you think corbyn could have done a better job at ending a conflict that has been going on for, literally, hundreds of years, because he says some nice things about one of the extremist elements responsible for its very intractability?

    Trump is an ********, and he has poured petrol on the flames, but lets face it, muslims around the world getting enraged, offended and burning thimgs in the street seems to be a weekly event.

    Like it or not, the israelis have as much claim to Jerusalem, and actually probably more of a claim, than anyone else. And until extremists on both sides stop talkinh about eradicating the others, force and might will win, amd that means the Palestinians will be stuck as stone throwing pawns in the great games of greater powers.

  5. #484
    @hibs.net proletariat member Pete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SouthsideHarp_Bhoy View Post
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    Yeah, dont listen to the US, lets listen to Hamas instead. Im sure they woyld be reasonable...

    This is what frustrates me about these situations - people trying to score pathetic and conpletely erroneous points, from a situation that has nothing to do with it.

    Are you seriously saying that you think corbyn could have done a better job at ending a conflict that has been going on for, literally, hundreds of years, because he says some nice things about one of the extremist elements responsible for its very intractability?

    Trump is an ********, and he has poured petrol on the flames, but lets face it, muslims around the world getting enraged, offended and burning thimgs in the street seems to be a weekly event.

    Like it or not, the israelis have as much claim to Jerusalem, and actually probably more of a claim, than anyone else. And until extremists on both sides stop talkinh about eradicating the others, force and might will win, amd that means the Palestinians will be stuck as stone throwing pawns in the great games of greater powers.
    Whoa there! You complain about pathetic point scoring and quote my post instead of the one I was replying to? My post was in the same spirit as yours apparently was, frustration regarding another baseless, irrelevant dig at an individual who has nothing to do with the conversation.

    I would ask you what you thought about his accusations but it appears from your opening sentence, a suggestion of a binary choice between either the US or Hamas, that you're in a similar camp. Jeremy Corbyn has indeed used inclusive language in the past to describe parties with differing views in certain situations. It's called diplomacy, and it's probably the best way to solve conflicts.

    For clarity, when I said "these matters" I wasn't talking specifically talking about Israel/Palestine, it was our general foreign policy. Forgive me if I seem like I'm scoring points but our interventions in places like the Middle East, Iraq, Libya etc...are part of the reason so many "pissed off Muslims" are burning things and committing terrorist acts. Have a think about how the world would be right now if certain Western countries had been slightly less aggressive and money-orientated and instead adopted socialist ideals that cetrain much-maligned politicians have championed.

    Corbyn has been on the right side of history since he's had a voice and you, or the guy I quoted have no right to speak about him in derogatory terms when it comes to any foreign conflicts, especially ones that we've helped create along with the other policemen of the world. Your last sentence is one I think we can all agree on but let's not go here again as its not a good idea.

    Returning to your original question, I'd probably rather listen to anyone other than the US right now.
    Last edited by Pete; 09-12-2017 at 02:17 AM.

  6. #485
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    God bless Trump, God bless America and God bless the true people of Israel 🇮🇱 🇬🇧🇺🇸

  7. #486
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
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    Whoa there! You complain about pathetic point scoring and quote my post instead of the one I was replying to? My post was in the same spirit as yours apparently was, frustration regarding another baseless, irrelevant dig at an individual who has nothing to do with the conversation.

    I would ask you what you thought about his accusations but it appears from your opening sentence, a suggestion of a binary choice between either the US or Hamas, that you're in a similar camp. Jeremy Corbyn has indeed used inclusive language in the past to describe parties with differing views in certain situations. It's called diplomacy, and it's probably the best way to solve conflicts.

    For clarity, when I said "these matters" I wasn't talking specifically talking about Israel/Palestine, it was our general foreign policy. Forgive me if I seem like I'm scoring points but our interventions in places like the Middle East, Iraq, Libya etc...are part of the reason so many "pissed off Muslims" are burning things and committing terrorist acts. Have a think about how the world would be right now if certain Western countries had been slightly less aggressive and money-orientated and instead adopted socialist ideals that cetrain much-maligned politicians have championed.

    Corbyn has been on the right side of history since he's had a voice and you, or the guy I quoted have no right to speak about him in derogatory terms when it comes to any foreign conflicts, especially ones that we've helped create along with the other policemen of the world. Your last sentence is one I think we can all agree on but let's not go here again as its not a good idea.

    Returning to your original question, I'd probably rather listen to anyone other than the US right now.
    Sorry mate, i didnt read the previous post, so happy to stand corrected.

    But i think if you look at history, socialist regimes tend to be fairly violent and oppressive.

    And foreign policy is always easy when you dont habe to actually make decisions, otherwise its very difficult. Its easy to talk peace, but lets not forget the worst conflixt in human history resulted from appeasement.

    I accept what you say about western foreign policy in recent years, its not been great, but the islamic world habe been in uproar at tge west for as long as i can remember, salman rushdie was long before bush jnr.

    I suppose i just think that because trump is a choob, it doesnt change the fact that those wanting to destroy Israel are just as extreme amd war-mongering, as are the Israeli hawks who keep the Palestinians in chains.

    Apologies for 'having a go' wrongly at your original post though.

  8. #487
    @hibs.net proletariat member Pete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SouthsideHarp_Bhoy View Post
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    Sorry mate, i didnt read the previous post, so happy to stand corrected.

    But i think if you look at history, socialist regimes tend to be fairly violent and oppressive.

    And foreign policy is always easy when you dont habe to actually make decisions, otherwise its very difficult. Its easy to talk peace, but lets not forget the worst conflixt in human history resulted from appeasement.

    I accept what you say about western foreign policy in recent years, its not been great, but the islamic world habe been in uproar at tge west for as long as i can remember, salman rushdie was long before bush jnr.

    I suppose i just think that because trump is a choob, it doesnt change the fact that those wanting to destroy Israel are just as extreme amd war-mongering, as are the Israeli hawks who keep the Palestinians in chains.

    Apologies for 'having a go' wrongly at your original post though.
    No worries, at least we can agree that Trump is a tube.

  9. #488
    @hibs.net proletariat member Pete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheReg! View Post
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    God bless Trump, God bless America and God bless the true people of Israel 🇮🇱 🇬🇧🇺🇸
    Stick to Twitter Donald.

  10. #489
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
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    No worries, at least we can agree that Trump is a tube.
    Definitely.

    I mean its not as if there is even a gain for the US for doing this. You could maybe understand if it was self-interest, but it is absolutely not and will habe pi55sed off all of their middle east allies (except Israel, obviously).

  11. #490
    Private Members Prediction League Winner Hibrandenburg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SouthsideHarp_Bhoy View Post
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    Definitely.

    I mean its not as if there is even a gain for the US for doing this. You could maybe understand if it was self-interest, but it is absolutely not and will habe pi55sed off all of their middle east allies (except Israel, obviously).
    The only gain is for Trump in that it deflects away from his other problems.

  12. #491
    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
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    Whoa there! You complain about pathetic point scoring and quote my post instead of the one I was replying to? My post was in the same spirit as yours apparently was, frustration regarding another baseless, irrelevant dig at an individual who has nothing to do with the conversation.

    I would ask you what you thought about his accusations but it appears from your opening sentence, a suggestion of a binary choice between either the US or Hamas, that you're in a similar camp. Jeremy Corbyn has indeed used inclusive language in the past to describe parties with differing views in certain situations. It's called diplomacy, and it's probably the best way to solve conflicts.

    For clarity, when I said "these matters" I wasn't talking specifically talking about Israel/Palestine, it was our general foreign policy. Forgive me if I seem like I'm scoring points but our interventions in places like the Middle East, Iraq, Libya etc...are part of the reason so many "pissed off Muslims" are burning things and committing terrorist acts. Have a think about how the world would be right now if certain Western countries had been slightly less aggressive and money-orientated and instead adopted socialist ideals that cetrain much-maligned politicians have championed.

    Corbyn has been on the right side of history since he's had a voice and you, or the guy I quoted have no right to speak about him in derogatory terms when it comes to any foreign conflicts, especially ones that we've helped create along with the other policemen of the world. Your last sentence is one I think we can all agree on but let's not go here again as its not a good idea.

    Returning to your original question, I'd probably rather listen to anyone other than the US right now.
    Whoa there yourself! I wasn't slagging Corbyn off. I was highlighting that he had been accused of being antisemitic in the past.

  13. #492
    @hibs.net private member Just Alf's Avatar
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    Just listened to a bit on the radio regarding Trump justifying his Jerusalem decision and the fact way back in history Jewish people can be identified as the original inhabitants so deserve to have "their" capital.

    Im wondering how that fits in with him deregistering vast tracks of native Indian land from being ring-fenced as national monuments and are now opened up for mining etc totally against the wishes of the current native Indian inhabitants?


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  14. #493
    Quote Originally Posted by Just Alf View Post
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    Just listened to a bit on the radio regarding Trump justifying his Jerusalem decision and the fact way back in history Jewish people can be identified as the original inhabitants so deserve to have "their" capital.

    Im wondering how that fits in with him deregistering vast tracks of native Indian land from being ring-fenced as national monuments and are now opened up for mining etc totally against the wishes of the current native Indian inhabitants?
    I don't think coherence of any sort plays a part in his outlook at all. That'd shirley be a notion for despicable elite types.

  15. #494
    @hibs.net private member Golden Fleece's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibrandenburg View Post
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    The only gain is for Trump in that it deflects away from his other problems.
    The only other gain for the USA is the arms they can sell to bolster the middle east conflict.

    And, Jerusalem was under Egyptian rule prior to being raised to the ground by King David, first king of the Jews 3000 years ago. So the question is, who has a greater claim on Jerusalem, Israel or Egypt?
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  16. #495
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibrandenburg View Post
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    The only gain is for Trump in that it deflects away from his other problems.
    ...... talking of which. http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/...probe-51718770

  17. #496
    Quote Originally Posted by Golden Fleece View Post
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    The only other gain for the USA is the arms they can sell to bolster the middle east conflict.
    And, Jerusalem was under Egyptian rule prior to being raised to the ground by King David, first king of the Jews 3000 years ago. So the question is, who has a greater claim on Jerusalem, Israel or Egypt?
    Great idea , flatten the temple mount and build a giant pyramid there and a nice big statue of horus . Forget about all this abrahamic nonsense and go back to following the religions of our ancestors .

  18. #497
    @hibs.net private member wpj's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by makaveli1875 View Post
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    Great idea , flatten the temple mount and build a giant pyramid there and a nice big statue of horus . Forget about all this abrahamic nonsense and go back to following the religions of our ancestors .
    He'll probably build a golf resort with a Trump tower and stick the golden dome on top

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